I Hate Cops!!!!

[Skip Towne]

Shortly before noon I was driving in downtown Claremore, Ok when the flashing lights come on behind me. The first thing the cop asks is if I knew why he stopped me. I said no. He said defective exhaust system. (My van doesn't smoke at all and isn't at all loud.) In the squad car he runs my tag and finds nothing amiss. He gives me a warning ticket for defective exhaust and never says a word about my exhaust. He says I am free to go but he wants to ask me another question. Do I have any drugs, alcohol, guns, knives or bombs in the van. I say no. He says do I mind if he checks. I say he has no reason to search my van so he calls for a drug dog crew. He says my eyes are bloodshot so I must be doing drugs. Now I not free to go all of a sudden. The drug dog doesn't hit on the van so the dickhead finally lets me go. This is outrageous bullshit. From a bogus defective exhaust warning to searches and drug dogs because he doesn't like the looks of my eyes. Where is this shit going to end?

[|Zach|]

Have you smoked lately?

[Skip Towne]

Have you smoked lately?
Define lately.

[CosmicPal]

You know, there is a thing called Visine. I hear it's quite popular with the potheads.

[|Zach|]

Define lately.
Heh, when is the last time you lit up?

[badgirl]

That is ridiculous skip, some cops are truely assholes, if he had asked you about the drugs first and then ended up getting a dog crew out, I'm sure you would have gotten a ticket. :shake: pricks

[Skip Towne]

Oh, yeah, after the dog cleared me the dickwad asked if he could pat me down. There were 3 cop cars there by this time so I let him and he found nothing. I think my out of state tag attracted him as there isn't much suspicious about a 59 year old man driving an Astro van with ladders on top. Obviously a work vehicle. He sure was disappointed he didn't get anything but a no revenue warning ticket out of the deal.

[Fairplay]

Check out your van....Man.

[badgirl]

Oh, yeah, after the dog cleared me the dickwad asked if he could pat me down. There were 3 cop cars there by this time so I let him and he found nothing. I think my out of state tag attracted him as there isn't much suspicious about a 59 year old man driving an Astro van with ladders on top. Obviously a work vehicle. He sure was disappointed he didn't get anything but a no revenue warning ticket out of the deal.
yep, I bet he was, what the hell could he have been thinking to go all out on a search :( I have always said if a cops want to search me or my vehicle, without probable cause, and I wouldn't think red eyes is a cause, hell the sun or allergies could cause that, I would make them get a search warrent just to be a big bitch. :p

[chiefs4me]

So 2 weeks ago I let Justin the 14 year old have 2 friends over on fri nite after the game. No big deal, their friends stay all the time. But this time this boy named Clint stayed, he is new this last school year. So I go to bed about midnight and give them the same ole lecture...do not drink our booze, do not steal my truck, and do not tepee anyone in my neighborhood...and if you do...you better not get caught.

So at 1:30 the doorbell rings and it's my neighbor down the street who is a constable......I go out side and there are 4.....FOUR cop cars with lights flashing with my son and his 2 friends. Unbelievable....in my neighborhood.

As it turns out they were going to tepee houses but my constable neighbor saw them out walking past curfew, so he called backup because they all ran in different directions. Nothing happened to the boys as far as the cops go...I made them call their moms and tell and go home right then and there.

So anyway what gets me is 4 cop cars with lights flashing for 14 year olds...and yes my son was wrong, but 4 cars.

[chiefs4me]

You know, there is a thing called Visine. I hear it's quite popular with the potheads.





yea but if you have smoked for years...it no longer works.:thumb:

[|Zach|]

So anyway what gets me is 4 cop cars with lights flashing for 14 year olds...and yes my son was wrong, but 4 cars.
That kind of thing happens when kids run in different directions instead of stopping for the police.

[BigMeatballDave]

He musta been a DISH customer...

[Skip Towne]

Heh, when is the last time you lit up?
Why do you ask? You got a warrant?

[tk13]

So 2 weeks ago I let Justin the 14 year old have 2 friends over on fri nite after the game. No big deal, their friends stay all the time. But this time this boy named Clint stayed, he is new this last school year. So I go to bed about midnight and give them the same ole lecture...do not drink our booze, do not steal my truck, and do not tepee anyone in my neighborhood...and if you do...you better not get caught.

So at 1:30 the doorbell rings and it's my neighbor down the street who is a constable......I go out side and there are 4.....FOUR cop cars with lights flashing with my son and his 2 friends. Unbelievable....in my neighborhood.

As it turns out they were going to tepee houses but my constable neighbor saw them out walking past curfew, so he called backup because they all ran in different directions. Nothing happened to the boys as far as the cops go...I made them call their moms and tell and go home right then and there.

So anyway what gets me is 4 cop cars with lights flashing for 14 year olds...and yes my son was wrong, but 4 cars.
ROFL Because it's hard to be in 3 or 4 different places at once I imagine...

[|Zach|]

Why do you ask? You got a warrant?
Just curious.

[CoMoChief]

Cops ****ing suck, thats all im gonna say about that

[|Zach|]

Cops ****ing suck, thats all im gonna say about that
They didn't suck when they busted Liz Cox at Mizzou and you got to see it through the window and mock her. ROFL

[Mr. Kotter]

I know it doesn't seem fair, and not knowing the specifics (from the cops point of view)....he was over-zealous to be sure, but probably within rights....

First, if he pulls you over....and you are in anyway acting suspicious, that may have caused him to inquire further. Second, the red eyes alone wouldn't have done it; IF he asked to search your van, he had something else he was going on....your driving, the smell of your clothes or van, possible other "profiling" observations he didn't mention to you. Once you refused permission for the search, in some states.....that constitutes "reasonable suspicion" and, in an automobile, they don't NEED a search warrant.

The standard for most of society, in most circumstances is "probable cause" which would be used to obtain a search warrant. However, automobile incidents are legally considered "exigent circumstance" which means, basically....because you could flee to Mexico before he could obtain a search warrant, that the standard for a search is lowered to "reasonable suspicion."

Basically, it becomes your word against his (and his video-cameras.) If he claims, credibibly to have had "reasonable suspicion"....if you were to push this as a violation of your rights or whatever, he would merely have to convince a jury that his suspicion was reasonable. Not a difficult task really. Although, I do realize some cops use this fact to be even more over-zealous than their colleagues.

It kinda sucks, but that's the way it goes...

[Skip Towne]

I know it doesn't seem fair, and not knowing the specifics (from the cops point of view)....he was over-zealous to be sure, but probably within rights....

First, if he pulls you over....and you are in anyway acting suspicious, that may have caused him to inquire further. Second, the red eyes alone wouldn't have done it; IF he asked to search your van, he had something else he was going on....your driving, the smell of your clothes or van, possible other "profiling" observations he didn't mention to you. Once you refused permission for the search, in some states.....that constitutes "reasonable suspicion" and, in an automobile, they don't NEED a search warrant.

The standard for most of society, in most circumstances is "probable cause" which would be used to obtain a search warrant. However, automobile incidents are legally considered "exigent circumstance" which means, basically....because you could flee to Mexico before he could obtain a search warrant, that the standard for a search is lowered to "reasonable suspicion."

Basically, it becomes your word against his (and his video-cameras.) If he claims, credibibly to have had "reasonable suspicion"....if you were to push this as a violation of your rights or whatever, he would merely have to convince a jury that his suspicion was reasonable. Not a difficult task really. Although, I do realize some cops use this fact to be even more over-zealous than their colleagues.

It kinda sucks, but that's the way it goes...
YES they DO need a search warrant to search a vehicle. Why would the cop ask me for permission if they didn't? And why did I drive away after denying permission if they didn't need a warrant?

[Mr. Kotter]

YES they DO need a search warrant to search a vehicle. Why would the cop ask me for permission if they didn't? And why did I drive away after denying permission if they didn't need a warrant?

I'm not trying to get in a pissin' match with you Skip....no, they DON'T need a search warrant to search your vehicle IF he has reasonable suspicion; when the dog didn't hit on your van though....I suspect he felt less sure of his "reasonable suspicion." He asked for permission, as a courtesy....and you'd be surprised at the number of folks who say, yes, hoping that gets the cop off their back.

He brought the dog, to verify his "suspicion".....had he not had access to a dog, and he felt his suspicion to be reasonable....he could have searched the van without a warrant. I'm not kidding.

[Rausch]

Why do you ask? You got a warrant?

Funny how people always state that they have a right to refuse to be searched but assume the cop doesn't have a right to ask to do so.

I also find it funny that most cops I know (and I know plenty) are former drunks and potheads. They're not always right (or intelligent) but they're not complete idiots either.

Plus, I've read your posts for a good while now and know you deserve to be given as much $#it as possible... :)

[Miles]

I'm not trying to get in a pissin' match with you Skip....no, they DON'T need a search warrant to search your vehicle IF he has reasonable suspicion; when the dog didn't hit on your van though....I suspect he felt less sure of his "reasonable suspicion." He asked for permission, as a courtesy....and you'd be surprised at the number of folks who say, yes, hoping that gets the cop off their back.

He brought the dog, to verify his "suspicion".....had he not had access to a dog, and he felt his suspicion to be reasonable....he could have searched the van without a warrant. I'm not kidding.

Yeah your definitly right. They do not need a warrant at all.

[Skip Towne]

Yeah your definitly right. They do not need a warrant at all.
So do you think he let me drive away without a search (when he obviously wanted one) as a courtesy? You're incorrect or I would have been searched.

[Mr. Kotter]

Yeah your definitly right. They do not need a warrant at all.

Skip will have to hear it from 10 other people before he believes somethin' I said.... :p

[Mr. Kotter]

So do you think he let me drive away without a search (when he obviously wanted one) as a courtesy? You're incorrect or I would have been searched.

No, he had the dog on standby. Had he NOT had the dog, and had he felt he had "reasonable suspicion" he'd have searched your van...check with any lawyer.

[Miles]

So do you think he let me drive away without a search (when he obviously wanted one) as a courtesy? You're incorrect or I would have been searched.

Pretty much dependss on whether they meet the burden of resonable suspicion (pretty sure SDChiefs is right on the term). Its pretty easy for a cop to meet that standard if he really wants to search your van. From what i can recall just saying your eyes look bloodshot so he thinks you may be holdin is enough.

Also my response may be oversimplified because i cant remember it all that well.

[Skip Towne]

No, he had the dog on standby. Had he NOT had the dog, and had he felt he had "reasonable suspicion" he'd have searched your van...check with any lawyer.
That's all just doubletalk, typical of you. That dog wasn't on any sort of standby, he circled the vehicle three times while sniffing. YOU need to check with a lawyer. I drove away from a cop who was bent on searching my van today. That proves they need a warrant. I've seen cases where the cops have detained a vehicle while they went to a judge and got one.

[RNR]

Cops like every other group of people have their share of jerks. Sometimes you will bump into the picked on in school guys out to be the tough guy. That said most I have known or been around are good people with a shit job for shit pay. I am glad there are people willing to do the job. The problem is when a person is a jerk in that job they have alot of power. It sucks you got the raw deal Skip. My oldest brother is a former detective and my niece is PD, over the years I have seen both sides.

[Mr. Kotter]

That's all just doubletalk, typical of you. That dog wasn't on any sort of standby, he circled the vehicle three times while sniffing. YOU need to check with a lawyer. I drove away from a cop who was bent on searching my van today. That proves they need a warrant. I've seen cases where the cops have detained a vehicle while they went to a judge and got one.

Go read a law book, or government book....your driving away simply proves he was less sure of his reasonable suspicion once the dog didn't hit on your van--that's all. He decided he bigger fish to fry, and didn't want to deal with the messy "his word vs. my word" thing that would have taken place in court. FTR, your van was "searched"---by the dog.

Bottom-line: If they have reasonable suspicion, they don't need a warrant. If you wanna believe they don't need a warrant, keep thinking that....but you better not run across an even more over-zealous cop, because he won't get a dog or a warrant. And for you to have the search declared invalid, you'll be going to court in a case you'll probably lose.

[Skip Towne]

Go read a law book, or government book....your driving away simply proves he was less sure of his reasonable suspicion once the dog didn't hit on your van--that's all. He decided he bigger fish to fry, and didn't want to deal with the messy "his word vs. my word" thing that would have taken place in court. FTR, your van was "searched"---by the dog.

Bottom-line: If they have reasonable suspicion, they don't need a warrant. If you wanna believe they don't need a warrant, keep thinking that....but you better not run across an even more over-zealous cop, because he won't get a dog or a warrant. And for you to have the search declared invalid, you'll be going to court in a case you'll probably lose.
Ramble on but you are full of shit as usual. If that cop COULD have searched me he WOULD have. That's all the proof I need. He didn't because he couldn't.

[Rausch]

Ramble on but you are full of shit as usual. If that cop COULD have searched me he WOULD have. That's all the proof I need. He didn't because he couldn't.

Or he knew he had no reason to.

[|Zach|]

My understansding of the situation from cops I have talked with sides with Kotter. Let me write that again.

I agree with Kotter.

Heh.

From the way the situation panned out the only thing he would have needed a warrant for is if you had a locked glove box.

[Mr. Kotter]

Ramble on but you are full of shit as usual. If that cop COULD have searched me he WOULD have. That's all the proof I need. He didn't because he couldn't.

Ayaiittt.....Whatever ya say. You iz always right. what 'chew thinking man? Long live the chronic an' chit, you dig?

[Mr. Kotter]

My understansding of the situation from cops I have talked with sides with Kotter. Let me write that again.

I agree with Kotter.

Heh.


Holy shit, Hell just froze over.... :p

[|Zach|]

Holy shit, Hell just froze over.... :p
Indeed. ROFL

[Skip Towne]

Or he knew he had no reason to.
According to Kotter he doesn't need a reason or a warrant. I say he needs a reason to get a warrant. Or I drive away untouched which is what happened.

[|Zach|]

According to Kotter he doesn't need a reason
That couldn't be anymore wrong. He did not say that.

[Mr. Kotter]

According to Kotter he doesn't need a reason or a warrant. I say he needs a reason to get a warrant. Or I drive away untouched which is what happened.

I said he DOES need "reasonable suspicion." When the dog failed to hit on your vehicle, given the entire situation he determined he didn't need to search your van any further than he already had....with the dog (that WAS a search.)

[Mr. Kotter]

That couldn't be anymore wrong. He did not say that.

Wow. Gettin' my back too.....surely the Armageddon is nye! :)

[|Zach|]

Wow. Gettin' my back too.....surely the Armageddon is nye! :)
It was such a blantant mischaracterization of what you posted.

[Skip Towne]

I said he DOES need "reasonable suspicion." When the dog failed to hit on your vehicle, given the entire situation he determined he didn't need to search your van any further than he already had....with the dog (that WAS a search.)
You are an idiot. The cop wanted to "pat me down" after the dog failed to hit on the van. The dude just wouldn't give up. He wanted a bust but bad. And he was denied a search of my van because he didn't have probable cause to search it, so he had no grounds for a warrant. I'll tell you once more then I'm done arguing with your ignorance. The cop REALLY wanted to search my vehicle. I said NO. He got the dog trying for probable cause and didn't get it. He then asked to frisk me and I should have said NO but I let him since there were 6 of his buddies there by now. He was very embarrassed for all the show and go from a "defective exhaust systems" warning to a full blown drug bust extravaganza.

[Rausch]

You are an idiot. The cop wanted to "pat me down" after the dog failed to hit on the van. The dude just wouldn't give up. He wanted a bust but bad. And he was denied a search of my van because he didn't have probable cause to search it, so he had no grounds for a warrant. I'll tell you once more then I'm done arguing with your ignorance. The cop REALLY wanted to search my vehicle. I said NO. He got the dog trying for probable cause and didn't get it. He then asked to frisk me and I should have said NO but I let him since there were 6 of his buddies there by now. He was very embarrassed for all the show and go from a "defective exhaust systems" warning to a full blown drug bust extravaganza.

I'm going to to fall back on the "somehow you still deserved it" defense...

[Mr. Kotter]

You are an idiot. The cop wanted to "pat me down" after the dog failed to hit on the van. The dude just wouldn't give up. He wanted a bust but bad. And he was denied a search of my van because he didn't have probable cause to search it, so he had no grounds for a warrant. I'll tell you once more then I'm done arguing with your ignorance. The cop REALLY wanted to search my vehicle. I said NO. He got the dog trying for probable cause and didn't get it. He then asked to frisk me and I should have said NO but I let him since there were 6 of his buddies there by now. He was very embarrassed for all the show and go from a "defective exhaust systems" warning to a full blown drug bust extravaganza.

Do you realize how often anyone disagrees with you, you very quickly resort to the "you are an idiot" or some similar insult....even when you are wrong (as you are in this case), it's the other guy who's an idiot.... :rolleyes:

:shake:

[Skip Towne]

That couldn't be anymore wrong. He did not say that.
Your posts have always entertained me. Especially your spelling and syntax. Is anymore all one word? Seriously, how did you make it out of high school with your lack of command of the English language? That you are in college speaks a lot about the college you attend.

[Mr. Kotter]

I'm going to to fall back on the "somehow you still deserved it" defense...

I'd LOVE to hear the cop's version of this... :hmmm:

[chiefs4me]

The cop ran his name and plates and looked and came up with nothing.......so asking to search was because he was pissed that skip was clean..that's my take on the situation...

[keg in kc]

So the dog didn't hit?

You must've had your shit hidden real good, mang.

[Mr. Kotter]

Your posts have always entertained me. Especially your spelling and syntax. Is anymore all one word? Seriously, how did you make it out of high school with your lack of command of the English language? That you are in college speaks a lot about the college you attend.

Dude, you are old. The English language evolves.....anymore didn't USE to be a word back in the 1800s, but today it's accepted a "sub-standard" or "slang" check most any dictionary....that and he's not typin' his disertation.

Times have moved past you, old man. :)

[|Zach|]

Your posts have always entertained me. Especially your spelling and syntax. Is anymore all one word? Seriously, how did you make it out of high school with your lack of command of the English language? That you are in college speaks a lot about the college you attend.
The fact that you go so far out of your way to insult other people's intelligence on such a consistant basis has always shown how insecure you are about your own intelligence and your education. You have always been so curious why I say that yet you show it to be true time after time.

This is a message board, I am not interested in taking time to worry about syntax and spelling. I am a great student and do fine in writing intensive courses.

But, maybe you are on to something. Maybe if I work harder I can become a grouchy old man that sits around and smokes pot; bitter and alone.

[Mr. Kotter]

So the dog didn't hit?

You must've had your shit hidden real good, mang.

ROFL ROFL ROFL

Exactly.

[Mr. Kotter]

The cop ran his name and plates and looked and came up with nothing.......so asking to search was because he was pissed that skip was clean..that's my take on the situation...

Clean, as in smart; the cop was checkin' him out for some other reason than his red eyes though....perhaps just because of his demeanor and "attitude"--I could see that.

[keg in kc]

Maybe if I work harder I can become a grouchy old man that sits around and smokes pot; bitter and alone.I don't think working harder will get you to that point. At least that's not what got me there.

[jspchief]

A 59 year old pothead telling someone else they aren't intelligent....

[|Zach|]

I don't think working harder will get you to that point. At least that's not what got me there.
ROFL PM me the Cliff's notes or something.

[Rausch]

I'd LOVE to hear the cop's version of this... :hmmm:

I really don't care. He's right, he's wrong, I really don't give a fat frog's azz.

The important thing is someone flipped Skip some $#it and got under his skin. I'm sadistic, I know... :)

[Mr. Kotter]

Shit hits the fan in.....3, 2, 1.....

[Rausch]

Shit hits the fan in.....3, 2, 1.....

[Mr. Kotter]

Unless the "munchies" have hit.....heh.

[keg in kc]

That pile of shit doesn't look much like a pile of shit. It looks like the top of a butterscotch or caramel sundae, maybe a pile o' pudding. Come on, man, get your shit straight.

[|Zach|]

ROFL ROFL

[Rausch]

That pile of shit doesn't look much like a pile of shit. It looks like the top of a butterscotch or caramel sundae, maybe a pile o' pudding. Come on, man, get your shit straight.

I'm not going to comment on the fact you think a pile of $#it looks like a caramel sundae...

[|Zach|]

http://www.waycoolcafe.com/_borders/Sundae.gif

[NJ Chief Fan]

yea but if you have smoked for years...it no longer works.:thumb:


been a smoker for years..visine has never worked...may i request bauch n lomb...its a little more pricier then visine but gets the red out
its in a white and green or a white and red box...works great :thumb:

[Skip Towne]

Wow. Gettin' my back too.....surely the Armageddon is nye! :)
That's because you two are one as dumb as the other. Zach is young. What's your excuse Kotter? I'm trying to work you in as the 4th stooge. Haven't found a fit yet. But Kotter, I'm quite sure you are drinking this evening. I can tell because on a topic like this during the day you hem and haw like a little girl. But at night when you are liquored up you get all brave and mouthy. I'll get back to you in the morning big shot!!!!

[Mr. Kotter]

That's because you two are one as dumb as the other. Zach is young. What's your excuse Kotter? I'm trying to work you in as the 4th stooge. Haven't found a fit yet. But Kotter, I'm quite sure you are drinking this evening. I can tell because on a topic like this during the day you hem and haw like a little girl. But at night when you are liquored up you get all brave and mouthy. I'll get back to you in the morning big shot!!!!

And they say weed doesn't make you belligerent. :rolleyes:

[Phobia]

My understanding of the law is the po-po has the right to search everything in plain sight with reasonable suspicion. Trunks and glove boxes are off limits without a warrant or permission. If they ask to search your vehicle, that includes trunk and glove box - which explains why he may have asked permission. He was wanting in the glove box.

I'm no lawyer. I've been drinking. I misspell things. I'm not very intelligent.

So, you may wish to disregard all the above.

[keg in kc]

I'm not going to comment on the fact you think a pile of $#it looks like a caramel sundae...I think the fact is that you think a caramel sundae looks like a pile of shit. Maybe I have DQ on the brain tonight, but who swirls their shit like that, man. I mean, really.

[Skip Towne]

And they say weed doesn't make you belligerent. :rolleyes:
You are really reaching now. You are saying I am belligerent(your word) because I have smoked weed? You have absolutely no evidence that I ever have let alone recently. But since you are all loose and want to talk, let's discuss you. I think you footballed your way through school. Then you spent an inordiante amount of time as an Army officer for one that didn't intend it for a career. You were Riffed weren't you? (In case you don't know, RIF stands for reduction in force). In other words, you were dumped by the Army because they had smarter people they would rather keep. So you took a teaching job out in East Jesus where they would take anybody due to lack of candidates. Rob, you made me do it, but I dislike you for one whole hell of a lot of reasons. As Frazod so aptly put it "I didn't like you when I met you in person, and I don't like you on the board." Enough said.

[Rausch]

Maybe I have DQ on the brain tonight, but who swirls their shit like that, man. I mean, really.

No comment...

[Darkwolfe]

Shortly before noon I was driving in downtown Claremore, Ok when the flashing lights come on behind me. The first thing the cop asks is if I knew why he stopped me. I said no. He said defective exhaust system. (My van doesn't smoke at all and isn't at all loud.) In the squad car he runs my tag and finds nothing amiss. He gives me a warning ticket for defective exhaust and never says a word about my exhaust. He says I am free to go but he wants to ask me another question. Do I have any drugs, alcohol, guns, knives or bombs in the van. I say no. He says do I mind if he checks. I say he has no reason to search my van so he calls for a drug dog crew. He says my eyes are bloodshot so I must be doing drugs. Now I not free to go all of a sudden. The drug dog doesn't hit on the van so the dickhead finally lets me go. This is outrageous bullshit. From a bogus defective exhaust warning to searches and drug dogs because he doesn't like the looks of my eyes. Where is this shit going to end?

You can file a complaint on the guy for harassment at this point. He's clearly out of line.

[Mr. Kotter]

You are really reaching now. You are saying I am belligerent(your word) because I have smoked weed? You have absolutely no evidence that I ever have let alone recently. But since you are all loose and want to talk, let's discuss you. I think you footballed your way through school. Then you spent an inordiante amount of time as an Army officer for one that didn't intend it for a career. You were Riffed weren't you? (In case you don't know, RIF stands for reduction in force). In other words, you were dumped by the Army because they had smarter people they would rather keep. So you took a teaching job out in East Jesus where they would take anybody due to lack of candidates. Rob, you made me do it, but I dislike you for one whole hell of a lot of reasons. As Frazod so aptly put it "I didn't like you when I met you in person, and I don't like you on the board." Enough said.

You've admitted smoking; are you a liar then?

I quit FB my JR year....to make money for our family. Four years in the Army is "inordinate?" I OWED them exactly four years because of the scholarship they gave me for my academic performance and "leadership" (6 yrs was as a weekend warrior) RIF'ed? No.

You are wrong on all counts. I'm dead serious. Who's reaching now...

You wanna try again...? Or better yet, tell me what you want to know and I'll give you the straight dope....guaranteed--warts and all. :rolleyes:

[Hammock Parties]

I shit my pants once when a cop asked me what a ladies handbag was doing in the back of my car.

[Skip Towne]

So the dog didn't hit?

You must've had your shit hidden real good, mang.
You know, you're the first one that caught on to that. You're very perceptive. Let's say those sniffing dogs noses aren't all they are cracked up to be.

[Hammock Parties]

Oh and I'm going to have to ask some of you to leave. There's not enough room in Skip's ass for all of us.

[Mr. Kotter]

I shit my pants once when a cop asked me what a ladies handbag was doing in the back of my car.

Well? What WAS it doing there?

[Hammock Parties]

Well? What WAS it doing there?

It was empty. I think it fell out of a box or something.

He stopped me for a busted tail light.

[Phobia]

He stopped me for a busted tail light.

So, was there room in your back seat for both of you?

[Hammock Parties]

So, was there room in your back seat for both of you?

Um...are you suggesting the cop stopped me for a booty call? ROFL

[Skip Towne]

My understanding of the law is the po-po has the right to search everything in plain sight with reasonable suspicion. Trunks and glove boxes are off limits without a warrant or permission. If they ask to search your vehicle, that includes trunk and glove box - which explains why he may have asked permission. He was wanting in the glove box.

I'm no lawyer. I've been drinking. I misspell things. I'm not very intelligent.

So, you may wish to disregard all the above.
Consider all of the above disregarded. You're right, you're no lawyer. I'm not either but I drove away from a rookie cop that was crushed when he couldn't search my van. You should have seen the look on his face when the dog acquitted me. I'd have killed that dog right then if I could have. I was sitting in the squad car sweating bullets waiting to see if I was going to be convicted by a dog.

[Mr. Kotter]

It was empty. I think it fell out of a box or something.

He stopped me for a busted tail light.

Sure. Admit it, it stole it from some little old lady on a walk in the park....and used the money to buy Star Wars paraphenalia....

[Hammock Parties]

Sure. Admit it, it stole it from some little old lady on a walk in the park....and used the money to buy Star Wars paraphenalia....


Nah...I was helping someone move a bunch of shit or something. The handbag was empty.

[Logical]

Skip will have to hear it from 10 other people before he believes somethin' I said.... :p

Well the fact that it depends on the state, might be the reason.


When the officer handed your boyfriend the warning ticket for swerving, your legal encounter was over. Your boyfriend had the right to ask the officer at that point "Am I free to go?" The answer should have been yes.

The officer had no probable cause to bring a canine to search your car. You were stopped for a traffic violation and the officer had no reasonable grounds for being suspicious. The problem is that cops are allowed to lie while conducting an investigation. He lied that he had the right to bring the dog to your car.

When your boyfriend provided the evidence, the pipe, he in effect, confessed and waived his rights. For that reason he wouldn't have a defense in court. Had he refused to cooperate, the cop would have eventually given up or brought in a dog. If he had brought the dog without reasonable suspicion, any evidence found would have been thrown out because of illegal search. There is a caveat here. Cops lie all the time in court, so the cop might tailor the story to fit the judge's expectations.

Here are some model scripts for any further encounters with law enforcement:

Cop: You don't mind if I search your car, do you?
You: Yes I do, officer.
Cop: Why? Are you hiding something?
You: I feel strongly that I should protect the Constitution and want to protect my rights.
You: Am I free to go now, officer?
Cop: Where are you going?
You: Why do you ask?
Cop: Are you on anything, any drugs?
You: Officer, was I violating a traffic law?
Cop: Can I look in your trunk?
You: Officer, are you going to ticket me for a violation or may I leave now?

If the officer refuses to answer whether you are free to go, say to him, "Officer, am I being detained?" If he doesn't tell you yes, slowly walk away, get in the car and drive away.

If he says yes, ask for what reason (it may be important later in court). Refuse to speak with him about anything except your name and address and the fact that you don't wish to speak without a lawyer present. Never give consent to a search because you waive all your rights.

(Thanks to California attorney William Logan for his help with this question.)

[go bo]

No, he had the dog on standby. Had he NOT had the dog, and had he felt he had "reasonable suspicion" he'd have searched your van...check with any lawyer.even one of those judicial activist lawyers? :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Skip Towne]

You can file a complaint on the guy for harassment at this point. He's clearly out of line.
Thank you, I'm going to email a copy of this thread to his boss: the Chief of Police of Claremore, Ok after it runs its course.

[Mr. Kotter]

Well the fact that it depends on the state, might be the reason.

And I stated that very early in this thread, but in most states....the determining factor of whether a search warrant is required is: does the officer have sufficient grounds for a declaration of "reasonable suspicion." If so, he doesn't need a search warrant in most states.

The anecdote you cite, clearly illustrates a person who knows the precise "process" and plays their hand accordingly. A cop who isn't very confident in their "reasonable suspicion" with such a person, will know he needs to call of the dogs. With a less sophisticated, knowledgable, or experinced person, he can be more aggressive....which will often lead to discovery of something illegal, which validates his "reasonable suspicion." There are few cases where citizens are actually willing to go to court to have a cop proven "wrong" in a case like this....it just isn't worth it.

Unless you are an ardent member of the ACLU, or have something to hide. :shrug:

[Phobia]

Consider all of the above disregarded. You're right, you're no lawyer. I'm not either but I drove away from a rookie cop that was crushed when he couldn't search my van. You should have seen the look on his face when the dog acquitted me. I'd have killed that dog right then if I could have. I was sitting in the squad car sweating bullets waiting to see if I was going to be convicted by a dog.

You may wish to disregard my information, but I know it was correct 15 years ago. I don't know if it is pertinent in your state nor if it is any longer in Iowa, but that's what the law was when I was learning and evading the po-po.

[go bo]

Ayaiittt.....Whatever ya say. You iz always right. what 'chew thinking man? Long live the chronic an' chit, you dig?hey...

take it easy on the chronic, will ya?

oh wait, that didn't sound right somehow... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Hammock Parties]

You may wish to disregard my information, but I know it was correct 15 years ago. I don't know if it is pertinent in your state nor if it is any longer in Iowa, but that's what the law was when I was learning and evading the po-po.

WTF? Evading? Were you a gun runner or something?

[Mr. Kotter]

even one of those judicial activist lawyers? :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

If you would, please....counselor? Advise Mr. Skippy of his "rights" under these circumstances. I may not be 100% correct....but I think I'm close.

[Logical]

And I stated that very early in this thread, but in most states....the determining factor of whether a search warrant is required is does the officer have sufficient grounds for a declaration of "reasonable suspicion." If so, he doesn't need a search warrant in most states.

The anecdote you cite, clearly illustrates a person who knows the precise "process" and plays their hand accordingly. A cop who isn't very confident in their "reasonable suspicion" with such a person, will know he needs to call of the dogs. With a less sophisticated, knowledgable, or experinced person, he can be more aggressive....which will often lead to discovery of something illegal, which validates his "reasonable suspicion." There are few cases where citizens are actually willing to go to court to have a cop proven "wrong" in a case like this....it just isn't worth it.

Unless you are an ardent member of the ACLU, or have something to hide. :shrug:


I guess I missed your caveat, sorry.

[go bo]

Do you realize how often anyone disagrees with you, you very quickly resort to the "you are an idiot" or some similar insult....even when you are wrong (as you are in this case), it's the other guy who's an idiot.... :rolleyes:

:shake:sheeeshhhh, kotter...

that's how we feel about you... :p :p :p

[|Zach|]

You may wish to disregard my information, but I know it was correct 15 years ago. I don't know if it is pertinent in your state nor if it is any longer in Iowa, but that's what the law was when I was learning and evading the po-po.
Dude, you spell words wrong on a message board. I can't believe you are even smart enough to dress yourself in the mornings.

[Skip Towne]

Well the fact that it depends on the state, might be the reason.
Hey, Jim, I really appreciate this. That cop told me I was free to go and then quickly said he wanted to ask me another question. Very tricky, now I know just to get out of the car and go when he says that. He was clearly trying to trick me into staying. I won't stay again.

[Mr. Kotter]

sheeeshhhh, kotter...

that's how we feel about you... :p :p :p

No, no...I'm more selective and indirect with my pejoratives: I usually go with extremist, radical, elitist, arrogant, liberal, or condescending...those aren't as distasteful as a direct insult.

[go bo]

Dude, you are old. The English language evolves.....anymore didn't USE to be a word back in the 1800s, but today it's accepted a "sub-standard" or "slang" check most any dictionary....that and he's not typin' his disertation.

Times have moved past you, old man. :)oh, wait a minute there sonny...

anymore is not a word...






is it? :shrug: *feeling passed by* :(

[go bo]

The fact that you go so far out of your way to insult other people's intelligence on such a consistant basis has always shown how insecure you are about your own intelligence and your education. You have always been so curious why I say that yet you show it to be true time after time.

This is a message board, I am not interested in taking time to worry about syntax and spelling. I am a great student and do fine in writing intensive courses.

But, maybe you are on to something. Maybe if I work harder I can become a grouchy old man that sits around and smokes pot; bitter and alone.wait a minute...

speaking on behalf of grouchy old men everywhere and anymore, smoking pot does not make you sit around...

well, maby a little... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Mr. Kotter]

oh, wait a minute there sonny...

anymore is not a word...


is it? :shrug: *feeling passed by* :(

http://www.merriamwebster.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=anymore

At least you are trying to keep up, and you think "young"....heh.

One entry found for anymore.


Main Entry: any·more
Pronunciation: "e-nE-'mOr, -'mor
Function: adverb
1 : any longer <I was not moving anymore with my feet -- Anaïs Nin>
2 : at the present time : NOW <hardly a day passes without rain anymore>

usage Although both anymore and any more are found in written use, in the 20th century anymore is the more common styling. Anymore is regularly used in negative <no one can be natural anymore -- May Sarton>, interrogative <do you read much anymore?>, and conditional <if you do that anymore, I'll leave> contexts and in certain positive constructions <the Washingtonian is too sophisticated to believe anymore in solutions -- Russell Baker>. In many regions of the U.S. the use of anymore in sense 2 is quite common in positive constructions, especially in speech <everybody's cool anymore -- Bill White> <every time we leave the house anymore, I play a game called "Stump the Housebreaker" -- Erma Bombeck>. The positive use appears to have been of Midland origin, but it is now reported to be widespread in all speech areas of the U.S. except New England

[Phobia]

Skip - isn't 9:30 your normal bedtime? You need to get some rest - especially after the heart attack you experienced today.

[Skip Towne]

You may wish to disregard my information, but I know it was correct 15 years ago. I don't know if it is pertinent in your state nor if it is any longer in Iowa, but that's what the law was when I was learning and evading the po-po.
After reading this post very carefully, I have concluded that you don't know jack shit. Who fuc*ing cares what was pertinent 15 years ago? And who cares anything about Iowa? Consider your opinion disregarded.

[Brock]

They're cracking down on meth runners. You must look like a ne'er do well.

[PastorMikH]

I think my out of state tag attracted him



DING! DING! DING!


Skip, if I were you, I'd get the tag replaced. I've heard by numerous people that OK law enforcement keys on out of state tags and that they tend to be a bit more lenient on OK tags. Several of the guys in the church told me to keep the speedometer at or below the limit until I got my tags changed out. Now, don't expect that OK tag to get you out of trouble, but it might help a bit.

[Phobia]

Dude, you spell words wrong on a message board. I can't believe you are even smart enough to dress yourself in the mornings.

I have a lot of help with that. She also makes sure my penis tastes nice before I leave for a long day on the job.

[|Zach|]

I have a lot of help with that. She also makes sure my penis tastes nice before I leave for a long day on the job.
Nobody notices your penis smells like morning breath?

[Logical]

I have a lot of help with that. She also makes sure my penis tastes nice before I leave for a long day on the job.

This can be read two ways, one is funnier than the other. Leaving it up to the imagination.

[Phobia]

After reading this post very carefully, I have concluded that you don't know jack shit. Who fuc*ing cares what was pertinent 15 years ago? And who cares anything about Iowa? Consider your opinion disregarded.

I have concluded that the shield on coaxial cable shields the copper core, not the installation tech.

[Mr. Kotter]

This can be read two ways, one is funnier than the other. Leaving it up to the imagination.

Who'd have thunk it.... Phil in the penis tasting business?
ROFL

[PastorMikH]

You can file a complaint on the guy for harassment at this point. He's clearly out of line.



How is he out of line? He's being cantankerous to Skip, and it irritated Skip, but from what I read of Skip's post and a few of his replies, the cop didn't do anything outside of his authority to do.

[keg in kc]

She also makes sure my penis tastes nice before I leave for a long day on the job.I keep meaning to ask, Phil, how's that new gig as a transvite/transexual prostitute working? Denise's list of alternative bars help you at all?

[Rausch]

After reading this post very carefully, I have concluded that you don't know jack shit.

Most of us have known that for years...

[Mr. Kotter]

How is he out of line? He's being cantankerous to Skip, and it irritated Skip, but from what I read of Skip's post and a few of his replies, the cop didn't do anything outside of his authority to do.

Exactly.

[Phobia]

This can be read two ways, one is funnier than the other. Leaving it up to the imagination.

True - the straight dudes will read it one way and the homos will read it another. I'm just flushing them out.

Yeah - I know that can be read two ways, too. It's a two part quiz.

[Skip Towne]

Skip - isn't 9:30 your normal bedtime? You need to get some rest - especially after the heart attack you experienced today.
Hey, big boy, I've been waiting up for you. I'm glad you acknowledge my bedtime, now get in here. I've got it ready for you.

[keg in kc]

Hey, big boy, I've been waiting up for you. I'm glad you acknowledge my bedtime, now get in here. I've got it ready for you.Yikes.

[Phobia]

Hey, big boy, I've been waiting up for you. I'm glad you acknowledge my bedtime, now get in here. I've got it ready for you.

I'm sorry, you have reached a number that is no longer in service.

If you feel you have reached this recording in error, please hang up and try again, homo.

[keg in kc]

I'm sorry, you have reached a number that is no longer in service.No longer in service? So, uh, that means it was in service at one time? I never knew you and Skippy were involved in a tryst.

[Logical]

True - the straight dudes will read it one way and the homos will read it another. I'm just flushing them out.

Yeah - I know that can be read two ways, too. It's a two part quiz.

Probably more effective than this
http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0000530AZ.01._SCMZZZZZZZ_.jpg

[Hammock Parties]

Imagine if a mod banned Skip at this point. Imagine him sitting in his recliner in front of his webTV wildly thrashing the air with his arms. Perhaps a line of spittle furiously explodes from a corner of his mouth.

[Mr. Kotter]

Imagine if a mod banned Skip at this point. Imagine him sitting in his recliner in front of his webTV wildly thrashing the air with his arms. Perhaps a line of spittle furiously explodes from a corner of his mouth.

Phil? :hmmm:

ROFL

[go bo]

No, no...I'm more selective and indirect with my pejoratives: I usually go with extremist, radical, elitist, arrogant, liberal, or condescending...those aren't as distasteful as a direct insult.heh, unless you're the one being called elitist, arrogant, liberal or activist (judicial and/or gay)... :( :( :(

[Logical]

Imagine if a mod banned Skip at this point. Imagine him sitting in his recliner in front of his webTV wildly thrashing the air with his arms. Perhaps a line of spittle furiously explodes from a corner of his mouth.

You only imagine this, because this was you over and over and over only a short while ago. OK maybe we have to substitute computer for WebTV.

[Hammock Parties]

I think I'll hijack this thread:

1. pour alcohol into shot glass.
2. ignite.
3. extinguish with your palm.
4. down in one.

http://members.lycos.co.uk/thelizzrdking/ouch.gif

[go bo]

A 59 year old pothead telling someone else they aren't intelligent....hey, watch it...

in two more years, i'll be a 59 year old pothead...

anymore...

[go bo]

And they say weed doesn't make you belligerent. :rolleyes:it doesn't, try to keep up...

[go bo]

You've admitted smoking; are you a liar then?

I quit FB my JR year....to make money for our family. Four years in the Army is "inordinate?" I OWED them exactly four years because of the scholarship they gave me for my academic performance and "leadership" (6 yrs was as a weekend warrior) RIF'ed? No.

You are wrong on all counts. I'm dead serious. Who's reaching now...

You wanna try again...? Or better yet, tell me what you want to know and I'll give you the straight dope....guaranteed--warts and all. :rolleyes:omg...

you have warts? :eek: :eek: :eek:

[go bo]

If you would, please....counselor? Advise Mr. Skippy of his "rights" under these circumstances. I may not be 100% correct....but I think I'm close.oh no you don't...

you're not gonna get me into the middle of this...

but if i'm not mistaken, car searches have been the subject of some supreme's decisions in the not too distant past...

and i think the supremes came down on letting police seach cars for pretty much no reason at all, but i could be wrong about that...

and i'm too loaded to look it up (haven't done criminal law in a million years)...

my general, if somewhat inebriated impression is that as a practical matter, cops can pretty much search cars with or without persmission and/or a warrant as long as they had a legitimate reason to make the stop in the first place (which doesn't take much, faulty tail light, faulty exhaust, too stinky farts... you get the picture...) or some reason to suspect a crime has been or is being committed (and lying about it is not unheard of)...

[Ultra Peanut]

Shortly before noon I was driving in downtown Claremore, Ok when the flashing lights come on behind me. The first thing the cop asks is if I knew why he stopped me. I said no. He said defective exhaust system. (My van doesn't smoke at all and isn't at all loud.) In the squad car he runs my tag and finds nothing amiss. He gives me a warning ticket for defective exhaust and never says a word about my exhaust. He says I am free to go but he wants to ask me another question. Do I have any drugs, alcohol, guns, knives or bombs in the van. I say no. He says do I mind if he checks. I say he has no reason to search my van so he calls for a drug dog crew. He says my eyes are bloodshot so I must be doing drugs. Now I not free to go all of a sudden. The drug dog doesn't hit on the van so the dickhead finally lets me go. This is outrageous bullshit. From a bogus defective exhaust warning to searches and drug dogs because he doesn't like the looks of my eyes. Where is this shit going to end?At least you're not black, too, or you'd be typing that from a hospital bed.

[Ultra Peanut]

I'm not going to comment on the fact you think a pile of $#it looks like a caramel sundae...Mmm, tasty dookie!

[Miles]

oh no you don't...

you're not gonna get me into the middle of this...

but if i'm not mistaken, car searches have been the subject of some supreme's decisions in the not too distant past...

and i think the supremes came down on letting police seach cars for pretty much no reason at all, but i could be wrong about that...

and i'm too loaded to look it up (haven't done criminal law in a million years)...

my general, if somewhat inebriated impression is that as a practical matter, cops can pretty much search cars with or without persmission and/or a warrant as long as they had a legitimate reason to make the stop in the first place (which doesn't take much, faulty tail light, faulty exhaust, too stinky farts... you get the picture...) or some reason to suspect a crime has been or is being committed (and lying about it is not unheard of)...

Yeah thats pretty much how i recall it from my first year crim procedure class. While i have forgotten most of it, my impression of the overall practical application of it is pretty much exacly the same as you stated it.

[Baby Lee]

Thank you, I'm going to email a copy of this thread to his boss: the Chief of Police of Claremore, Ok after it runs its course.
Leave it to a stoner to forget that he admitted that the dog wasn't good enough to sniff out the ganj he had hidden in his van, then mail the thread to the police chief.

[dtebbe]

You may want to try paiting over the big peace symbol and pastel flowers :Peace:. I think those are the same as a bullseye for cops.. but I could be wrong ROFL

DT

[chiefs4me]

The fact that you go so far out of your way to insult other people's intelligence on such a consistant basis has always shown how insecure you are about your own intelligence and your education. You have always been so curious why I say that yet you show it to be true time after time.

This is a message board, I am not interested in taking time to worry about syntax and spelling. I am a great student and do fine in writing intensive courses.

But, maybe you are on to something. Maybe if I work harder I can become a grouchy old man that sits around and smokes pot; bitter and alone.




Maybe you should take your own advice little boy.....you telling skip you don't care about spelling.....please. Anytime someone spells a word wrong you are right there to point it out. Why do you go out of your way to insult people's intelligence on a constant basis. It's alright for zach but no one else can do it.....ROFL

pot calling the kettle black if you ask me.....:rolleyes:


and I would sooner have a grouchy ole man that sits around and smokes pot anyday over some young punk like you.:harumph:

[LiL stumppy]

Maybe you should take your own advice little boy.....you telling skip you don't care about spelling.....please. Anytime someone spells a word wrong you are right there to point it out. Why do you go out of your way to insult people's intelligence on a constant basis. It's alright for zach but no one else can do it.....ROFL

pot calling the kettle black if you ask me.....:rolleyes:


and I would sooner have a grouchy ole man that sits around and smokes pot anyday over some young punk like you.:harumph:

You are right about a few things.

[chiefs4me]

You are right about a few things.





A few......well your young so I will let you slide...but you will learn soon enough women are right about everything...ROFL

[ChiefsFanatic]

I'm not trying to get in a pissin' match with you Skip....no, they DON'T need a search warrant to search your vehicle IF he has reasonable suspicion; when the dog didn't hit on your van though....I suspect he felt less sure of his "reasonable suspicion." He asked for permission, as a courtesy....and you'd be surprised at the number of folks who say, yes, hoping that gets the cop off their back.

He brought the dog, to verify his "suspicion".....had he not had access to a dog, and he felt his suspicion to be reasonable....he could have searched the van without a warrant. I'm not kidding.

B.S. And if there had drugs in the van, the officer would have had to prove that there was a problem with the exhaust significant enough to warrant being pulled over, if not, then the drugs would have never been found. Any lawyer with a brain could have gotten the arrest thrown out.

Provided there was really no problem with the exhaust. I have read many cases [if I had my notes I could give you the exact citations] concerning subsequent arrests from bogus pull-overs. They have to have a legitimate reason for pulling someone over, and they have to be able to prove and sustain that reason in court.

[Mr. Kotter]

B.S. And if there had drugs in the van, the officer would have had to prove that there was a problem with the exhaust significant enough to warrant being pulled over, if not, then the drugs would have never been found. Any lawyer with a brain could have gotten the arrest thrown out.

Provided there was really no problem with the exhaust. I have read many cases [if I had my notes I could give you the exact citations] concerning subsequent arrests from bogus pull-overs. They have to have a legitimate reason for pulling someone over, and they have to be able to prove and sustain that reason in court.

I never said otherwise; defective exhaust (loud muffler?) will get you pulled over in my town. I assumed the defective exhaust concern to be legit; if it were not...your rant could be justified. I'd agree with you.

[jettio]

I think it is reasonable suspicion for the stop, and probable cause or consent for the search of the vehicle. If the arrest you for some other reason like warrants, and have to tow the car, they could search the car as some kind of pre-impoundment inventory.

A drug dog alerting is found to be probable cause, if the initial stop is not founded on reasonable suspicion that might make the probable cause from the dog unconstitutional, not sure.

Many cops approach BS like that from a "is evidence going to be suppressed" point a view and not from a threat of a 1983 civil rights action.

Seems that if you can prove that the exhaust system had no flaws and that the stop was clearly pretextual, you would be able to show that he intentionally violated clearly established law, which is the threshold for a 1983 claim. Might not have much in the way of damages since he did you the favor of temporarily relieving you of your haunting visions of Roy Williams making it with your girl in a Bucknell jersey.

I am filing a couple of 1983 cases this year, one for a friend that I grew up with who was the victim of a BS traffic stop, that one should be a lot of fun.

[Bwana]

Leave it to a stoner to forget that he admitted that the dog wasn't good enough to sniff out the ganj he had hidden in his van, then mail the thread to the police chief.

Golden! ROFL

[alanm]

oh no you don't...

you're not gonna get me into the middle of this...

but if i'm not mistaken, car searches have been the subject of some supreme's decisions in the not too distant past...

and i think the supremes came down on letting police seach cars for pretty much no reason at all, but i could be wrong about that...

and i'm too loaded to look it up (haven't done criminal law in a million years)...

my general, if somewhat inebriated impression is that as a practical matter, cops can pretty much search cars with or without persmission and/or a warrant as long as they had a legitimate reason to make the stop in the first place (which doesn't take much, faulty tail light, faulty exhaust, too stinky farts... you get the picture...) or some reason to suspect a crime has been or is being committed (and lying about it is not unheard of)...
Being retired law enforcement it's called "Reasonable Cause" course its been over a year now. My memory is getting fuzzy. Skip must of exhibited something in his demeanor and body language to give the Cop reasonable cause to ask to search. My next question is what the f*ck were you doing in Claremore, Ok. :hmmm:

[alanm]

Maybe you should take your own advice little boy.....you telling skip you don't care about spelling.....please. Anytime someone spells a word wrong you are right there to point it out. Why do you go out of your way to insult people's intelligence on a constant basis. It's alright for zach but no one else can do it.....ROFL

pot calling the kettle black if you ask me.....:rolleyes:


and I would sooner have a grouchy ole man that sits around and smokes pot anyday over some young punk like you.:harumph:
Now go to your room Zach. :harumph:

[|Zach|]

Now go to your room Zach. :harumph:
:)

[go bo]

Maybe you should take your own advice little boy.....you telling skip you don't care about spelling.....please. Anytime someone spells a word wrong you are right there to point it out. Why do you go out of your way to insult people's intelligence on a constant basis. It's alright for zach but no one else can do it.....ROFL

pot calling the kettle black if you ask me.....:rolleyes:


and I would sooner have a grouchy ole man that sits around and smokes pot anyday over some young punk like you.:harumph:omg...

did you just call skip a "black kettle"? :eek: :eek: :eek:

[|Zach|]

omg...

did you just call skip a "black kettle"? :eek: :eek: :eek:
I think she is still trying to figure out why on earth a cop would call for backup after her kid and 3 others ran away after a cop saw them.

[Mr. Kotter]

..... Skip must of exhibited something in his demeanor and body language to give the Cop reasonable cause to ask to search. ..... .

Skip? A chip on his shoulder? An attitude? A "Fugg Authority" demeanor?

:eek:

That couldn't be. No way. You must be confusing him with someone else... ;)

ROFL

[go bo]

Skip? A chip on his shoulder? An attitude? A "Fugg Authority" demeanor?

:eek:

That couldn't be. No way. You must be confusing him with someone else... ;)

ROFLomg...

did you just call skip a chip? :eek: :eek: :eek:

[go bo]

next you'll be calling skip a schip or a skit or a sh... er... something... :(

[Baby Lee]

omg...

did you just call skip a chip? :eek: :eek: :eek:
omg...

did you just call skip a "black kettle"? :eek: :eek: :eek:
You're HIGH RIGHT NOW!!! Aren't you??

[go bo]

You're HIGH RIGHT NOW!!! Aren't you??no more than any other sunday afternoon... :D :D :D

[Baby Lee]

no more than any other sunday afternoon... :D :D :D
omg...

did you just call skip a sunday afternoon? :eek::eek::eek:

[alanm]

no more than any other sunday afternoon... :D :D :D
Sunday is the best day to get stoned. :thumb:

[go bo]

omg...

did you just call skip a sunday afternoon? :eek::eek::eek:ROFL ROFL ROFL

oh crap...

now i'm in for it... :( :( :(

[Baby Lee]

ROFL ROFL ROFL

oh crap...

now i'm in for it... :( :( :(
Nah. Judging from his posting patterns thus far, he's ALREADY forgotten about it.

[go bo]

Sunday is the best day to get stoned. :thumb:especially this sunday in independence...

sunny and 78...

i go outside and enjoy it all for awhile, but i can't stay out in the sun very long... :( :( :(

oh, well, maybe (i mean maby) there's a good movie on... :) :) :)

[Mr. Kotter]

ROFL ROFL ROFL

oh crap...

now i'm in for it... :( :( :(

Oh, sh*t; now you gone went and did it...the fundies, holy rollers, and Bible thumpers will be along shortly to admonish and rebuke you.... :shake:

Oh wait.... :eek:

Thats me, or so you say.... ;)

[Mr. Kotter]

Nah. Judging from his posting patterns thus far, he's ALREADY forgotten about it.

Short-term memory loss becomes long-term now....not possible. :shake:

It's a witchhunt, I tell you; it's natural....a gift, an herb from Mother Nature. Quit dissin' da chronic BL... :p

[KCWolfman]

I am filing a couple of 1983 cases this year, one for a friend that I grew up with who was the victim of a BS traffic stop, that one should be a lot of fun.

Gee, nothing more fun than dredging up stuff more than 20 years old to attempt to do nothing but garner a profit at the expense of a city that probably no longer employs the supposed offending employee.

Woohooo for you. I am sure the residents of the city will be happy lining your pockets instead of getting repairs and upkeep they pay for through their taxes.

[DanT]

Gee, nothing more fun than dredging up stuff more than 20 years old to attempt to do nothing but garner a profit at the expense of a city that probably no longer employs the supposed offending employee.

Woohooo for you. I am sure the residents of the city will be happy lining your pockets instead of getting repairs and upkeep they pay for through their taxes.

What stuff more than 20 years old are you supposing jettio is dredging up, other than established law?

[KCWolfman]

What stuff more than 20 years old are you supposing jettio is dredging up, other than established law?
I guess I misunderstood when he stated "1983 cases" as I assumed the case occured then and didn't realize he was referring to a case based upon a 1983 ruling.

That said, if the offending officer did actually break the law and is still employed, he doesn't deserve the job.

[Baby Lee]

I guess I misunderstood when he stated "1983 cases" as I assumed the case occured then and didn't realize he was referring to a case based upon a 1983 ruling.

That said, if the offending officer did actually break the law and is still employed, he doesn't deserve the job.
It's actually referring to 42 USC [United States Code, ie, Federal Statute] 1983

Every person who, under color of any statute, ordinance, regulation, custom, or usage, of any State or Territory or the District of Columbia, subjects, or causes to be subjected, any citizen of the United States or other person within the jurisdiction thereof to the deprivation of any rights, privileges, or immunities secured by the Constitution and laws, shall be liable to the party injured in an action at law, suit in equity, or other proper proceeding for redress, except that in any action brought against a judicial officer for an act or omission taken in such officer's judicial capacity, injunctive relief shall not be granted unless a declaratory decree was violated or declaratory relief was unavailable. For the purposes of this section, any Act of Congress applicable exclusively to the District of Columbia shall be considered to be a statute of the District of Columbia.

[go bo]

Oh, sh*t; now you gone went and did it...the fundies, holy rollers, and Bible thumpers will be along shortly to admonish and rebuke you.... :shake:

Oh wait.... :eek:

Thats me, or so you say.... ;)i dunno, i think more of you as a rolling thumper...

and i think you have me confused with someone else...

when have i ever called you a fundamentalist, holy roller, bible thumper, etc.?

full of shit does not = funny wholly thumber...

cabbage? er, cabush, er... capishio? :shrug: :shrug: :shrug:

[KCWolfman]

It's actually referring to 42 USC [United States Code, ie, Federal Statute] 1983
Thanks

I am sure there are a great many dickholes who are cops, as in any profession. And I have no reason to doubt Skip. But I just don't see being a police officer and thinking to myself "Damn, I am bored, I think I will screw up someone's life for no reason."

[go bo]

Short-term memory loss becomes long-term now....not possible. :shake:

It's a witchhunt, I tell you; it's natural....a gift, an herb from Mother Nature. Quit dissin' da chronic BL... :pit's not true...

not true i tell you...

why my memory is as good as the day i was born...

who am i, again? :harumph: :harumph: :harumph:

[go bo]

Thanks

I am sure there are a great many dickholes who are cops, as in any profession. And I have no reason to doubt Skip. But I just don't see being a police officer and thinking to myself "Damn, I am bored, I think I will screw up someone's life for no reason."i dunno..

back when i was an mp at fort leavenworth for a few months, we'd go on pussy patrol down along the levee when we got bored on the night shift... :p :p :p

[Saulbadguy]

You should have called him an unintelligent piece of shit, and then told him how much better you are than him because you own a million dollar company, and have a Masters Degree from KU.

[chiefs4me]

omg...

did you just call skip a "black kettle"? :eek: :eek: :eek:




What are YOU smoking ole man........;)

[KCWolfman]

i dunno..

back when i was an mp at fort leavenworth for a few months, we'd go on pussy patrol down along the levee when we got bored on the night shift... :p :p :p
There was a positive end result to your actions that you achieved instantly.

I guess this guy could have simply could have been bored and likes paperwork, but more than likely was hoping it was a decent bust to make him look good.

Personally, I wouldn't waste my time.

[stevieray]

I think the issue is a cop hiding behind a bogus excuse for folowing a profile or instinct....or even a hunch.

The bogus excuse part is what is scary. once he pulled him over, his reason was moot.

i'd go to an inspection shop tomorrow and get documentation stating the exhaust is in proper working order, and then send a copy with a letter stating the events that had transpired to his Commander.

Protect and Serve

Not hassle and assume..

[jettio]

I guess I misunderstood when he stated "1983 cases" as I assumed the case occured then and didn't realize he was referring to a case based upon a 1983 ruling.

That said, if the offending officer did actually break the law and is still employed, he doesn't deserve the job.

:)

I thought you figured since I said the guy has been my friend since we were kids that I was suing for something over 20 year ago.

You must be psychic, it so turns out that the officer had decided to resign soon thereafter.

Sad thing was, he had a rookie with him and he was teaching him the wrong way to do things.

[chiefs4me]

I think the issue is a cop hiding behind a bogus excuse for folowing a profile or instinct....or even a hunch.

The bogus excuse part is what is scary. once he pulled him over, his reason was moot.

i'd go to an inspection shop tomorrow and get documentation stating the exhaust is in proper working order, and then send a copy with a letter stating the events that had transpired to his Commander.

Protect and Serve

Not hassle and assume..



That's pretty cute......;)


protect and serve.........not hassle and assume





I like that....:thumb:

[jettio]

Being retired law enforcement it's called "Reasonable Cause" course its been over a year now. My memory is getting fuzzy. Skip must of exhibited something in his demeanor and body language to give the Cop reasonable cause to ask to search. My next question is what the f*ck were you doing in Claremore, Ok. :hmmm:

Bill Callahan loving cops have a flow chart in which they figure that out of state license tagged cars are supposed to be pulled over to warn about exhaust systems, and that it was the motorist's fault, that the cop ended up trying to search the vehicle.

[Dartgod]

Does your van look like this?

http://www.cheechandchong.com/images/newsimages/greenvan_big.jpg

[jettio]

Gee, nothing more fun than dredging up stuff more than 20 years old to attempt to do nothing but garner a profit at the expense of a city that probably no longer employs the supposed offending employee.

Woohooo for you. I am sure the residents of the city will be happy lining your pockets instead of getting repairs and upkeep they pay for through their taxes.

I am going to need you to repeat paragraph 2 for me when the city tries to claim that it is a state agency and therefore has sovreign immunity.

Knowing your track record to never retract a position your conclusion that the city is a city and not an agent of the state is bedrock stare decisis.

[DenverChief]

I'm sorry to hear that skip...


WASHINGTON, April 4 - The Supreme Court in recent years has drawn constitutional rules for the use of newly popular law enforcement techniques. The police need a warrant before aiming a heat-detecting device at a private home in an effort to find out whether marijuana is growing inside under high-intensity lights. The police do not need a warrant before permitting a trained dog to sniff a car, or a piece of luggage at an airport, in order to detect drugs.

Those precedents converged in a case from Texas that posed this question: Can the police bring a trained dog to stand outside a private home and sniff for drugs?

The lower courts have disagreed, and the Supreme Court decided on Monday to let the confusion linger. The justices did not take the case.

The court offered no explanation for declining to hear an appeal from a Houston man, David G. Smith, whose supply of methamphetamine in his garage was detected by a trained dog.

[KCWolfman]

:)

I thought you figured since I said the guy has been my friend since we were kids that I was suing for something over 20 year ago.

You must be psychic, it so turns out that the officer had decided to resign soon thereafter.

Sad thing was, he had a rookie with him and he was teaching him the wrong way to do things.
That is too bad indeed.

Was your friend breaking the law or carrying illegal substances or are you just drawing a lawsuit for harassment as in Skip's case?

[KCWolfman]

I am going to need you to repeat paragraph 2 for me when the city tries to claim that it is a state agency and therefore has sovreign immunity.

Knowing your track record to never retract a position your conclusion that the city is a city and not an agent of the state is bedrock stare decisis.
I am not sure what you meant in your second paragraph. I believe I did tell Dan I made an error regarding your statement (proving you wrong once again).

[alanm]

Bill Callahan loving cops have a flow chart in which they figure that out of state license tagged cars are supposed to be pulled over to warn about exhaust systems, and that it was the motorist's fault, that the cop ended up trying to search the vehicle.
Ooh.. Being properly chastised and insulting Husker football and cops. I think I may have to log off and go in my room and cry. :( :deevee:
Thank you Jettio.. You've ruined my evening. :)

[jettio]

That is too bad indeed.

Was your friend breaking the law or carrying illegal substances or are you just drawing a lawsuit for harassment as in Skip's case?

Just because a dude is breaking the law and carrying illegal substances does not give the officer the right to ask for ID without first saying pretty please.

Vaseline is an illegal substance if you are pitching in the World Series, remember that.

[jettio]

Ooh.. Being properly chastised and insulting Husker football and cops. I think I may have to log off and go in my room and cry. :( :deevee:
Thank you Jettio.. You've ruined my evening. :)

It is on the alanm flow chart to post like a yeasty c*nt before Bill Callahan leads the team to near victory in the intrasquad.

[KCWolfman]

Just because a dude is breaking the law and carrying illegal substances does not give the officer the right to ask for ID without first saying pretty please.

Vaseline is an illegal substance if you are pitching in the World Series, remember that.
I agree with the first paragraph, but you still didn't answer my question, did you? Was your friend carrying illegal substances or driving an illegal car or are you suing the officer for harrasment?

As far as the second paragraph goes, for someone arguing against extremists and their supposed use of "agent of the state", you sure don't mind making your own extremist conclusions, do you? When someone is tried and convicted for illegal substances in the World Series, you would have a point. Until then, you are simply attempting to distract from my original question, aren't you?

[jettio]

I am not sure what you meant in your second paragraph. I believe I did tell Dan I made an error regarding your statement (proving you wrong once again).

I was not criticizing you, I was referring to something that I did not explain very well.

I did try to make a funny about your "stubborness" but that was not too clear either.

[Rain Man]

All I have to say is that the drug-sniffing dog ought to be fired.

[Mr. Kotter]

You should have called him an unintelligent piece of shit, and then told him how much better you are than him because you own a million dollar company, and have a Masters Degree from KU.

ROFL ROFL ROFL

[DenverChief]

All I have to say is that the drug-sniffing dog ought to be fired.

ROFL

[alanm]

It is on the alanm flow chart to post like a yeasty c*nt before Bill Callahan leads the team to near victory in the intrasquad.
Just because your life sucks Jettio is no reason to insult me, My Huskers and Bill Calahan. And not necessarily in that order. I would suggest drinking heavily young man. :thumb:

[Skip Towne]

I haven't read the entire thread and probably won't. I originally started the thread to liven up a weekend when the front page was very boring. And to find out the mood of the masses in regard to our eroding freedoms. I have watched the cops go from helpful in the '50's and 60's to an absolute instrument of terror today. At least it is to me. If a cop gets behind me in traffic, I turn off immediately. I hope you young guys don't continue to allow the cops these exotic powers like my generation has. I won't worry about it as I'll be lucky to live another 20 years. At the current rate we are going, cops will be completely out of control by the time I'm gone. Just remember, you let them do it my not being a cranky old man who challenges their authority.

[alanm]

I haven't read the entire thread and probably won't. I originally started the thread to liven up a weekend when the front page was very boring. And to find out the mood of the masses in regard to our eroding freedoms. I have watched the cops go from helpful in the '50's and 60's to an absolute instrument of terror today. At least it is to me. If a cop gets behind me in traffic, I turn off immediately. I hope you young guys don't continue to allow the cops these exotic powers like my generation has. I won't worry about it as I'll be lucky to live another 20 years. At the current rate we are going, cops will be completely out of control by the time I'm gone. Just remember, you let them do it my not being a cranky old man who challenges their authority.
Jettio insulted Coach Bill and my Huskers. I thought you'd be all over that. Oh... and me. That's right up your alley. :thumb: ROFL

[Skip Towne]

All I have to say is that the drug-sniffing dog ought to be fired.
At first, the dog walked right past my van and went to a flowerbed and started sniffing the flowers. I was hoping a bee would come out of one of the flowers and sting him on the nose. But, yeah, that dog should be fired.

[chiefs4me]

At first, the dog walked right past my van and went to a flowerbed and started sniffing the flowers. I was hoping a bee would come out of one of the flowers and sting him on the nose. But, yeah, that dog should be fired.



aw skip...you should send the doggy a box of doggy bones.:thumb:

[jettio]

I agree with the first paragraph, but you still didn't answer my question, did you? Was your friend carrying illegal substances or driving an illegal car or are you suing the officer for harrasment?

As far as the second paragraph goes, for someone arguing against extremists and their supposed use of "agent of the state", you sure don't mind making your own extremist conclusions, do you? When someone is tried and convicted for illegal substances in the World Series, you would have a point. Until then, you are simply attempting to distract from my original question, aren't you?

My guy was driving his own car and did not have anything illegal.

Charges wil be fourth amendment search and seizure for a pretextual traffic stop, illegal search, false arrest, and malicious prosecution.

Cop made up a charge of careless driving, but when I showed up at Court, the officer crapped his pants and told the judge he needed a continuance because his kid was at home sick.

It was pretty funny. He thought it was going to be his word against my guy's in front of a judge that he knew, but that judge had taken the day off, and the case was assigned to another judge who has a rep for being fair. He had shown up to get his OT pay and to prosecute a false charge against an unrepresented person and then he starting crying about having a sick kid at home when he realized that it would not be so easy.

[jettio]

Just because your life sucks Jettio is no reason to insult me, My Huskers and Bill Calahan. And not necessarily in that order. I would suggest drinking heavily young man. :thumb:

It is in the alanm flow chart to get all out of sorts over the west coast offense.

[Skip Towne]

My guy was driving his own car and did not have anything illegal.

Charges wil be fourth amendment search and seizure for a pretextual traffic stop, illegal search, false arrest, and malicious prosecution.

Cop made up a charge of careless driving, but when I showed up at Court, the officer crapped his pants and told the judge he needed a continuance because his kid was at home sick.

It was pretty funny. He thought it was going to be his word against my guy's in front of a judge that he knew, but that judge had taken the day off, and the case was assigned to another judge who has a rep for being fair. He had shown up to get his OT pay and to prosecute a false charge against an unrepresented person and then he starting crying about having a sick kid at home when he realized that it would not be so easy.
Hey, I'm really starting to like you. In the past I've noticed quite a few members of this board that don't like the ACLU. I've protested that the ACLU is all that stands between the citizen and the gubment. I really appreciate your attitude regarding the cops. Thank God there are guys like you to keep the cops off of us. My "Ace" lawyer died about 20 years ago of cancer. I wasn't afraid of anybody while Charlie was around. Now I cower in fear of any rookie with an agenda. Bless you, brother.

[KCWolfman]

My guy was driving his own car and did not have anything illegal.

Charges wil be fourth amendment search and seizure for a pretextual traffic stop, illegal search, false arrest, and malicious prosecution.

Cop made up a charge of careless driving, but when I showed up at Court, the officer crapped his pants and told the judge he needed a continuance because his kid was at home sick.

It was pretty funny. He thought it was going to be his word against my guy's in front of a judge that he knew, but that judge had taken the day off, and the case was assigned to another judge who has a rep for being fair. He had shown up to get his OT pay and to prosecute a false charge against an unrepresented person and then he starting crying about having a sick kid at home when he realized that it would not be so easy.
So he wasn't charged with any illegal substances?

[KCWolfman]

At first, the dog walked right past my van and went to a flowerbed and started sniffing the flowers. I was hoping a bee would come out of one of the flowers and sting him on the nose. But, yeah, that dog should be fired.
LOL

[jettio]

So he wasn't charged with any illegal substances?

Nope.

He did have his black skin on that night, but he did not get charged for that.

[Skip Towne]

Nope.

He did have his black skin on that night, but he did not get charged for that.
Well he should have been. That's at least as bad as defective exhaust.

[jettio]

Hey, I'm really starting to like you. In the past I've noticed quite a few members of this board that don't like the ACLU. I've protested that the ACLU is all that stands between the citizen and the gubment. I really appreciate your attitude regarding the cops. Thank God there are guys like you to keep the cops off of us. My "Ace" lawyer died about 20 years ago of cancer. I wasn't afraid of anybody while Charlie was around. Now I cower in fear of any rookie with an agenda. Bless you, brother.

Thank you.

:thumb:

[KCWolfman]

Nope.

He did have his black skin on that night, but he did not get charged for that.
I don't know what his color has to do with it, unless you are attempting to garner a higher return from the city in which the offense occurred.

If you can prove a pattern of blacks being pulled over and harassed, you would have a point - until then it is merely wild speculation.

That said, if your friend is being honest, the cop should have stepped down. He should also have to compensate your friend for the harrassment.

[jettio]

I don't know what his color has to do with it, unless you are attempting to garner a higher return from the city in which the offense occurred.

If you can prove a pattern of blacks being pulled over and harassed, you would have a point - until then it is merely wild speculation.

That said, if your friend is being honest, the cop should have stepped down. He should also have to compensate your friend for the harrassment.

The cop did not resign because of this incident, but the way he handled it showed that he did not have any business being a cop.

I think he resigned because he realized that himself.

[KCWolfman]

The cop did not resign because of this incident, but the way he handled it showed that he did not have any business being a cop.



Again, if your friend is accurate, I agree.

[Dartgod]

A cop gave me a good laugh yesterday... and, I'm guessing, gave another person an angry rant like Skip's.

I was sitting at an intersection, light turns green, I start to go, and the car immediately to my left slams on their brakes and their horn starts blaring. A blazer decided to run the red light and make a left turn in front of me and this other car. I remember commenting on what an asshole the driver was... but, I felt that a sufficient job of honking had been done by the guy to my left.

I had my window down, and I could hear the engine revving on the car to my left. I figured the guy was pissed and was gonna speed up to the asshole to give him the finger or something. Hell, maybe I'd even see a fistfight. At that point I glanced out my window at the car to my left... and saw the light bar in the back windshield. The dipshit ran a red light and cut off a cop in an unmarked car.

I slowed down to let the cop in front of me so he could pull over the asshole, then proceded to laugh my ass off. Man, talk about a bonehead move.
Hehe. Many years ago, I was leaving the parts store I worked at and as I turned onto the street, I absolutely lit up the tires on my El Camino. Just as tires are really beginning to boil, I look to my left and there's a cop sitting in the parking lot across the street. I just went ahead and pulled into the next lot and waited for him to come over. :banghead: :banghead:

He was real cool about it, though, and only gave me a warning. :thumb:

Then another time, a Lee's Summit cop wrote me an Exhibition of Speed ticket for BARELY chirping my tires after turning onto the road. Karma's a bitch, I guess.

[BIG_DADDY]

Shortly before noon I was driving in downtown Claremore, Ok when the flashing lights come on behind me. The first thing the cop asks is if I knew why he stopped me. I said no. He said defective exhaust system. (My van doesn't smoke at all and isn't at all loud.) In the squad car he runs my tag and finds nothing amiss. He gives me a warning ticket for defective exhaust and never says a word about my exhaust. He says I am free to go but he wants to ask me another question. Do I have any drugs, alcohol, guns, knives or bombs in the van. I say no. He says do I mind if he checks. I say he has no reason to search my van so he calls for a drug dog crew. He says my eyes are bloodshot so I must be doing drugs. Now I not free to go all of a sudden. The drug dog doesn't hit on the van so the dickhead finally lets me go. This is outrageous bullshit. From a bogus defective exhaust warning to searches and drug dogs because he doesn't like the looks of my eyes. Where is this shit going to end?

Welcome to the new America Skip.

[Skip Towne]

Welcome to the new America Skip.
Yeah, ain't it great? The really disturbing part is that it keeps getting worse and nobody seems to care. I can't imagine what it will be like 50 years from now.

[BIG_DADDY]

Yeah, ain't it great? The really disturbing part is that it keeps getting worse and nobody seems to care. I can't imagine what it will be like 50 years from now.

You're singing to the choir man. The number of banned substances goes up every year. The amount of laws we have goes up every year, nothing ever comes off the books. Almost everything is a felony now, remember when you used to have to do something really bad to get one of those? The incarceration rate of this county went up 10 fold in 20 years. We are now producing more career criminals than ever before with no end in sight. All of this is going on and most people even here at the Planet could give a sh!t as long as there is still steak on the table.

[Spott]

Then another time, a Lee's Summit cop wrote me an Exhibition of Speed ticket for BARELY chirping my tires after turning onto the road. Karma's a bitch, I guess.


Lee's Summit cops have always sucked. The last ticket I got in Missouri was a ticket for warning of radar by a Lee's Summit cop. I was doing the customary flashing of my brights to warn oncoming traffic of a speed trap and another L.S. copy gave me a ticket for it.

About 2 years before that I got arrested and charged with disturbing the peace for flipping off a cop.

[Saulbadguy]

All of this is going on and most people even here at the Planet could give a sh!t as long as there is still steak on the table.
Most of the people who could give a shit less are the people who aren't engaged in illegal activities in the first place.

Now, i'm not saying I agree with the alot of the laws, especially those of which are contradictory, but i'm not going to break them just because I don't like them. I keep hearing about how things are changing, and our rights are being infringed upon...


..but mine have yet to be. I suppose i'll develop a different attitude when they are.

[Swanman]

About 2 years before that I got arrested and charged with disturbing the peace for flipping off a cop.

Disturbing the peace for flipping off a cop? Good thing you used the sign language version instead of yelling F-You at the cop, you may have been charged with aggravated assault.

[munkey]

Yeah, ain't it great? The really disturbing part is that it keeps getting worse and nobody seems to care. I can't imagine what it will be like 50 years from now.

Marshall Law. :shake: