Just for grins....lets review the Chiefs 2004 draft

[Deberg_1990]

I cant resist....

1. Siavii : Looking like a 1st class BUST! should have picked: Bob Sanders, looking like a beast at Safety for Indy.

2. Wilson....errrr..dont even get me started. All hype and no stats so far. I dont understand why we got so enamoured with this turd?? We should have taken Kerry Kolbert.

3. Key Fox: Decent pick. may yet develop into a player.

4. Sammie Parker: Still developing....had a decent game last night. should never have fumbled in that situation though. Good pick

5. Jared Allen: Im not sure he will ever be a superstar, but he looks like he will be a decent situational player. good pick

6. Jeris Mcintyre: has potential from his pre-season action. right now just a practice player scrub. Jury is still out....

7. Kevin Sampson: Lets hope this guy develops into something. I think he will considering the Chiefs success is recent years with O-Linemen.

Grade C: Would have been much higher, but the Siavii and Wilson picks are too hard for me to overlook. How good would this team look right now with Sanders and Kerry Kolbert starting???

[HolmeZz]

Like most of our drafts, we pick better later.

[tk13]

You can't resist... looking for a reason to bitch. We know. It's still too early to tell after one full season, and two more regular season games, the value of any of these guys. Way too early. Siavii could find himself like Sims did after a few years, and Allen could flame out for all we know.

[KcMizzou]

You can't resist... looking for a reason to bitch. We know. ROFL

:clap:

[Deberg_1990]

You can't resist... looking for a reason to bitch. We know. It's still too early to tell after one full season, and two more regular season games, the value of any of these guys. Way too early. Siavii could find himself like Sims did after a few years, and Allen could flame out for all we know.


Honestly....I have no hope for Siavii anymore..he has not shown me even one small glimmer of hope that he might be a player someday. At least Sims has shown flashes at times.....Saivii hasnt even shown one little spark yet.

[Messier]

What's your deal?

Hey! In 1995 we should have drafted Curtis Martin instead of Trezell Jenkins! He was there at that spot!

[HolmeZz]

What's your deal?

Hey! In 1995 we should have drafted Curtis Martin instead of Trezell Jenkins! He was there at that spot!

DAMNIT CARL. :cuss:

[tk13]

What's your deal?

Hey! In 1995 we should have drafted Curtis Martin instead of Trezell Jenkins! He was there at that spot!
If we wouldn't have traded down instead of drafting Derrick Johnson, we could've drafted Derrick Johnson!

[RealSNR]

If we wouldn't have traded down instead of drafting Derrick Johnson, we could've drafted Derrick Johnson!Waaait a minute...

[beavis]

If we wouldn't have traded down instead of drafting Derrick Johnson, we could've drafted Derrick Johnson!
Errrrr.... huh?

[RealSNR]

How about this? Why not look at POSITIVE results? Like the 2003 draft.

1. Larry Johnson- The future of the offense. Great pick

2. Kawika Mitchell- Slow start. Now a solid starter. For a 2nd rounder, good pick

3. Julian Battle- Was supposedly doing very well before injury in mini-camp. Still unknown what he'll do with this team

4. Brett Williams- POS. Bad pick.

5. Jordan Black- Solid all-purpose lineman who is at his best when he's rotated in and out of the lineup. Good pick for 5th round

6. Jimmy Wilkerson- High expectations for a 6th rounder. Isn't playing like a potential 1st rounder, but has definitely been a great value find in the 6th round. Good pick.

7. Willie Pile- I really liked this kid. I'm pissed he got cut. I'm still going to rate this a good pick

Five good picks, one bad pick, one unknown. Very solid draft.

[Kylo Ren]

I cant resist....

1. Siavii : Looking like a 1st class BUST! should have picked: Bob Sanders, looking like a beast at Safety for Indy.

2. Wilson....errrr..dont even get me started. All hype and no stats so far. I dont understand why we got so enamoured with this turd?? We should have taken Kerry Kolbert.

3. Key Fox: Decent pick. may yet develop into a player.

4. Sammie Parker: Still developing....had a decent game last night. should never have fumbled in that situation though. Good pick

5. Jared Allen: Im not sure he will ever be a superstar, but he looks like he will be a decent situational player. good pick

6. Jeris Mcintyre: has potential from his pre-season action. right now just a practice player scrub. Jury is still out....

7. Kevin Sampson: Lets hope this guy develops into something. I think he will considering the Chiefs success is recent years with O-Linemen.

Grade C: Would have been much higher, but the Siavii and Wilson picks are too hard for me to overlook. How good would this team look right now with Sanders and Kerry Kolbert starting??? I mostly agree except for your comments on Kris Wilson. He's still developing like Sammie Parker. He had a broken leg and missed the entire season last year. He's the 3rd TE, so he only gets a few plays per game. Sammie Parker is on the field for most offensive plays. Wilson isn't going to set the world on fire. He just needs more time to develop. This season is really his rookie season.

[Deberg_1990]

I mostly agree except for your comments on Kris Wilson. He's still developing like Sammie Parker. He had a broken leg and missed the entire season last year. He's the 3rd TE, so he only gets a few plays per game. Sammie Parker is on the field for most offensive plays. Wilson isn't going to set the world on fire. He just needs more time to develop. This season is really his rookie season.


One of my main problems with the Wilson pick is that it just was not a "need" pick. We had so many needs on defense and they essentially drafted a backup TE project. Makes no sense to me????

[Mecca]

I personally am not a big fan of the "drafting for need" philosphy. I think saying "we need this position" is how you end up reaching to high for a player. If you look at the more successful teams at drafting, the Ravens being a good example. They take best player available, over positional need 95% of the time. The 2 times they've taken positional need they blew their pick Travis Taylor and Kyle Boller.

I think the odds are much better that you'll get a good player instead a bust player. By taking the best player available instead of trying to fill a position and reaching for a guy.

[Big Slick]

One of my main problems with the Wilson pick is that it just was not a "need" pick. We had so many needs on defense and they essentially drafted a backup TE project. Makes no sense to me????
I don't disagree, but that's basically the same thing everybody was saying about the LJ pick, and that's looking freaking brilliant now!

Wilson's playing behind Gonzo and coming off injury, kind of tough to show his stuff. We don't know what he has to offer at this point. Maybe 5 years from now, LJ and Wilson are for us what Priest and Tony are today.

[ChiTown]

I don't disagree, but that's basically the same thing everybody was saying about the LJ pick, and that's looking freaking brilliant now!

Wilson's playing behind Gonzo and coming off injury, kind of tough to show his stuff. We don't know what he has to offer at this point. Maybe 5 years from now, LJ and Wilson are for us what Priest and Tony are today.

EGGGGGZACTLY!

Does Siavii look like a load of Monkey crap? Yes. But, I'm not bailing on this kid or that draft as of now. It's way to early to tell what we have.

[donkhater]

Man, remind me to never go in on a stock tip with you guys. No patience whatsoever. It's either boom or bust. No adjustment period given at all.

When a guy has been here a while like Bartee and has had opportunities as a starter, has been burned repeatedly and NEVER recorded 1 INT with all that playing time--he is a bust. But players that have had some injury problems, low on the depth chart (i.e. no playing time) do get chances to show themselves.

Three year contracts for rookies are usually that long for multiple reasons. One being that sometimes it takes a while for a guy to adjust and start playing well. It's no different than a freshman struggling. But once he becomes a junior or senior the light goes on.


Terrell Owens was a VERY average WR until his third season and I'm sure I could find many examples like that in the league. I can't count how many here declared LJ a bust before he ever got on the field. Ridiculous.

[jynni]

So can we review this years draft? I mean it has bust written all over it. :p

[Eleazar]

This is pathetic, the owners are just lining their pockets and don't want to win, I'm done with this team.

ERRRR wrong sports team bitching thread :doh!:

[Eleazar]

One of my main problems with the Wilson pick is that it just was not a "need" pick. We had so many needs on defense and they essentially drafted a backup TE project. Makes no sense to me????

So are you pissed that we have Larry Johnson?

[DaWolf]

Remember that at one point Dante Hall was considered a wasted pick and people were wondering what the heck his use was and were rooting for JJ Moses to take his spot.

Patience, especially when talking about players like Kris Wilson, is a virtue. He may not have been a "need" pick but neither was Larry Johnson. You can never have too many weapons, and that's how Al Saunders operates, the more pieces he has, the more formations, shifts, and plays he can run. And like Larry Johnson has proven he can step in for an injured Priest Holmes, Kris Wilson becomes a big part of things if Tony Gonzalez ever goes down (and let us pray that NEVER happens)...

[bsp4444]

I disagree a little that LJ was not a need pick. That kind of talent (while not immediately recognized by Vermeil) is always needed for depth. However, the LJ pick should have dictated even MORE that we go defensive with the second pick that was Kris Wilson. I don't recall who was available at that time that is now doing a nice job, but I think the two picks as a whole were a bad idea.

[DaWolf]

I disagree a little that LJ was not a need pick. That kind of talent (while not immediately recognized by Vermeil) is always needed for depth. However, the LJ pick should have dictated even MORE that we go defensive with the second pick that was Kris Wilson. I don't recall who was available at that time that is now doing a nice job, but I think the two picks as a whole were a bad idea.

Wasn't that the year everyone wanted us to get EJ Henderson or Boss Bailey (Vermeil wanted Tyler Brayton) and Terry Pierce in round 2?

[jidar]

I personally am not a big fan of the "drafting for need" philosphy. I think saying "we need this position" is how you end up reaching to high for a player. If you look at the more successful teams at drafting, the Ravens being a good example. They take best player available, over positional need 95% of the time. The 2 times they've taken positional need they blew their pick Travis Taylor and Kyle Boller.

I think the odds are much better that you'll get a good player instead a bust player. By taking the best player available instead of trying to fill a position and reaching for a guy.

I strongly agree. This is what the teams who have been most successful in the modern era have done.
You draft the best player first, and if it's a tie you go for need. You then fill needs in FA. The game changes so much season to season that you don't know what needs you're going to have 2 or 3 years down the line when the guy is finally producing.

[ck_IN]

Just another in the long line of DV's magical mystery drafts.

If our player eval genious (CPS) had a clue come draft day this team would be a legit Super Bowl contender.

Give him his due though, Parker seems to be a good pick. Even though Junior was picked too high he apeared to fill a need at the time. Wilson has potential but I still can't make sense of drafting him. It simply wasn't and isn't a need.

[InChiefsHeaven]

Ummm...seems to me that LJ was a "Total Bust" until 5 games before the end of the season last year...:shrug:

[penchief]

Not to be a contrarian but I think that draft has the potential to be an impact draft.

I'm not ready to give up any of those players, including Siavii.

Even if Siavii turns out to be a bust I'm fairly confident that Kris Wilson will prove his worth.

Fox, Parker, Allen, and Sampson are already making starter noise. And the only guy not on the roster is on the practice squad with a legitimate shot of developing into a roster spot.

On top of that 2004 brought us undrafted FA's Benny Sapp and Rich Scanlon.

Throw in Dalton, Welourne, and the return of Tynes and the class of 2004 may turn out to be one of our best.

JMHO.

[Archie F. Swin]

I cant resist....

4. Sammie Parker: Still developing....had a decent game last night. should never have fumbled in that situation though. Good pick



That was a steller defensive play by Chuck Woodson, many receivers would have lost that ball.

[Swanman]

2. Wilson....errrr..dont even get me started. All hype and no stats so far. I dont understand why we got so enamoured with this turd?? We should have taken Kerry Kolbert.


Keary Colbert would have been a decent pick also. :p

[go bo]

i dunno...

i think siavii has improved in some aspects of his game...

i thought he did an adequate job as the nose tackle when we went to a 3-4...

looked like he was commanding double teams and holding his own, part of the time anyway...

and he's improved his attitude a lot...

like people have said in this thread, give some of these guys another season (or two in the case of siavii), and they're gonna be good players for us for a long time...

[Calcountry]

How about this? Why not look at POSITIVE results? Like the 2003 draft.

1. Larry Johnson- The future of the offense. Great pick

2. Kawika Mitchell- Slow start. Now a solid starter. For a 2nd rounder, good pick

3. Julian Battle- Was supposedly doing very well before injury in mini-camp. Still unknown what he'll do with this team

4. Brett Williams- POS. Bad pick.

5. Jordan Black- Solid all-purpose lineman who is at his best when he's rotated in and out of the lineup. Good pick for 5th round

6. Jimmy Wilkerson- High expectations for a 6th rounder. Isn't playing like a potential 1st rounder, but has definitely been a great value find in the 6th round. Good pick.

7. Willie Pile- I really liked this kid. I'm pissed he got cut. I'm still going to rate this a good pick

Five good picks, one bad pick, one unknown. Very solid draft.What round did we get Parker in? That seems to have been a good pick so far.

[Simplex3]

Nobody can deny that Carl does a great job in the third round and beyond. Maybe the best in the league.

With that said, he has in inordinately bad track record with first and second round picks. Occasionaly a no-brainer will fall in his lap that even he can't screw up (Derrick Johnson) and sometimes he makes the right decision for the wrong reasons (Larry Johnson).

I understand everyone's desire to be patient with the young guys but in today's NFL your first round pick better damn well be a good starter by the end of his rookie season and your round two pick better be starting by the start of his first season. The salary cap and the amount these guys are making demand it.

[Frankie]

I cant resist....

1. Siavii : Looking like a 1st class BUST! should have picked: Bob Sanders, looking like a beast at Safety for Indy.

2. Wilson....errrr..dont even get me started. All hype and no stats so far. I dont understand why we got so enamoured with this turd?? We should have taken Kerry Kolbert.

3. Key Fox: Decent pick. may yet develop into a player.

4. Sammie Parker: Still developing....had a decent game last night. should never have fumbled in that situation though. Good pick

5. Jared Allen: Im not sure he will ever be a superstar, but he looks like he will be a decent situational player. good pick

6. Jeris Mcintyre: has potential from his pre-season action. right now just a practice player scrub. Jury is still out....

7. Kevin Sampson: Lets hope this guy develops into something. I think he will considering the Chiefs success is recent years with O-Linemen.

Grade C: Would have been much higher, but the Siavii and Wilson picks are too hard for me to overlook. How good would this team look right now with Sanders and Kerry Kolbert starting???
With your benefit of hindsight you are down on this draft. I say the cup is more than half full. Jury still out on 1 & 2 (actually 2 & 3). Pleasantly hopeful on the rest. As for your "should have"s, we had no reason to draft a safety in 04.

[whoman69]

My problem with the Chiefs drafts is they consistently go for projects the first day. They place too much weight on athleticism and not enough on talent. For this reason, our project usually don't live up to expectations. I think their 2nd round draft history proves my point.

[go bo]

athlleticism and "potential"...

[carlos3652]

My problem with the Chiefs drafts is they consistently go for projects the first day. They place too much weight on athleticism and not enough on talent. For this reason, our project usually don't live up to expectations. I think their 2nd round draft history proves my point.

How many 2nd round picks have we had in the last 5 years and who are they?

[Frankie]

Not to be a contrarian but I think that draft has the potential to be an impact draft.

I'm not ready to give up any of those players, including Siavii.

Even if Siavii turns out to be a bust I'm fairly confident that Kris Wilson will prove his worth.

Fox, Parker, Allen, and Sampson are already making starter noise. And the only guy not on the roster is on the practice squad with a legitimate shot of developing into a roster spot.

On top of that 2004 brought us undrafted FA's Benny Sapp and Rich Scanlon.

Throw in Dalton, Welourne, and the return of Tynes and the class of 2004 may turn out to be one of our best.

JMHO.
Good post. I might add that if Siavii turns out to be a bust it's most likely due to his lack of dedication, not lack of talent.

[Frankie]

Ummm...seems to me that LJ was a "Total Bust" until 5 games before the end of the season last year...:shrug:
Exactly.

[Frankie]

That was a steller defensive play by Chuck Woodson, many receivers would have lost that ball.
Exactly.

[Mecca]

How many 2nd round picks have we had in the last 5 years and who are they?

2000=#52. William Bartee
2001=none
2002=#43. Eddie Freeman
2003=#47 Kawika Mitchell
2004=#36 Junior Siavii,#61 Kris Wilson
2005=none

[KChiefs1]

THREE YEARS PEOPLE!!!!!!

It takes that long to evaluate a draft!

[KCChiefsMan]

ya hindsight is definitely 20/20 on that one. But we haven't had a good draft pick in round #2 since Tim Grunhard and he is long since retired

[KCChiefsMan]

I actually have to correct my last post, Kawika Mitchell is looking really good,

[Traveller]

2000=#52. William Bartee
2001=none (Dick Vermeil)
2002=#43. Eddie Freeman
2003=#47 Kawika Mitchell
2004=#36 Junior Siavii,#61 Kris Wilson
2005=none (Patrick Surtain)

We may have not drafted in 2001 and 2005 in the second round, but we got good value.