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Saulbadguy
09-23-2005, 09:22 AM
http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/sports/12717968.htm

Posted on Fri, Sep. 23, 2005

Sweet deals

K-State was once widely criticized for its soft nonconference schedule. Now, everyone wants to take a bite out of a cupcake.

By HOWARD RICHMAN

The Kansas City Star

Anybody who has been critical of Kansas State football coach Bill Snyder’s nonconference scheduling methods — and there probably are a few out there who despise them — might find this hard to believe.

The marquee: Kansas State. Notre Dame. Arrowhead Stadium.

“Notre Dame is looking for a home-and-home series down the road and wants to play in a big stadium. Bill said to pursue it,” K-State senior associate athletic director Jim Epps recently said.

No lie.

“It’s absolutely still on the table,” said David Gardiner, president of Blue Ridge Sports & Entertainment of Winchester, Va., the promoter who handled the Wildcats’ 2003 game against California at Arrowhead Stadium. Gardiner has been in contact with several schools for future games, and K-State and Notre Dame, which have never met on the gridiron, are in the mix.

Sound strange? Probably so to some college football fans who found it difficult to find the Wildcats the cute-and-cuddly, up-and-coming program they wanted to love. That’s because K-State seemed to pick on the Akrons and Ball States more often than not.

But based on how other programs are now scheduling, it appears Snyder has won the argument for doing things his way. K-State, 2-0, which finishes its nonconference schedule at 1:10 p.m. Saturday against North Texas, 1-1, at KSU Stadium, wasn’t the first to soften the slate. But it benefited as much as anyone.

Now, almost everybody does it.

Look no further than Nebraska. The Cornhuskers played Maine in their opener.

Minnesota coach Glen Mason buys into Snyder’s nonconference scheduling concept. Mason, who went 4-5 against K-State when he coached at Kansas during 1988-96, said Snyder’s blueprint for success should never be second-guessed.

“The media picked on Bill. But Bill won that battle a long, long time ago,” Mason said. “What is he now, he’s got to be in his 17th year I would guess at Kansas State. Most guys were fired after three years and they didn’t win any games. Everybody used to call it (K-State) the worst program in the country, so how could anybody be critical of the approach Bill Snyder took?”

Snyder says he doesn’t necessarily feel vindicated after being vilified for years.

“I’m not arguing with anybody about it because everybody has their opinion,” Snyder said. “And I’m not saying that that’s the best way for anybody else. I’m just saying what we do in the way of scheduling, by and large, is what’s in the best interest of our football program. I’ve never varied from that, and that’s the way it is.”

“It’s going to be interesting to see how the strength of schedule affects Kansas State, which this season tiptoes through three nonconference tulips.”

— Los Angeles Times, 1998

Move over, K-State. Here comes Texas Tech.

Now that the Wildcats have moved past the scheduling argument and don’t seem to be the target they once were for their schedule, Texas Tech has moved in line for ridicule for scheduling nonconference weaklings.

The Red Raiders already have annihilated Florida International and Sam Houston State by a combined 136-24, and Saturday will, in all likelihood, toy with Indiana State — unless the Sycamores have several Larry Birds in pads.

According to the Sagarin Ratings, that’s the 168th-best schedule in the nation. Considering there are only 119 teams in Division I-A (Sagarin includes I-AA teams for a total of 239), that’s not exactly a murderer’s row of opponents.

“That’s the kind of stuff we got roundly criticized for,” Epps said.

Taking on the huge underdog, though, isn’t a guarantee for success. Ask Stanford, a 20-17 loser this season to California-Davis.

ESPN analyst Lee Corso defends schools that downsize their schedules to rebuild. Like Kansas, which brought in Appalachian State. Or Baylor, which knocked off Samford.

That’s why Corso has no issue with Snyder. In fact, Corso wishes he would have have been more Snyderesque when he coached at Indiana. Instead, he took on too many teams such as LSU and eventually got fired.

“If I was coaching again, I’d go to the nearest bakery and play three cupcakes,” Corso said. “He (Snyder) was way ahead of his time. He did it the right way.”

“It is unclear if a diet of cupcakes can effectively train a team for the likes of Nebraska”

— Houston Chronicle, 1998

The art of scheduling at K-State emphasizes home games.

Football creates the lion’s share of revenue for the school. But, on occasion, the Wildcats have taken on challenges. Like Southern California, Marshall and Fresno State.

That doesn’t mean Snyder really wanted to do it.

“If I made some mistakes, it might have been USC. It didn’t turn out that way (K-State beat the Trojans in 2001 and 2002), but nevertheless … or traveling to Marshall. It didn’t turn out that way (K-State won 21-19 there two weeks ago). But that might’ve been one I’d take back.”

Epps said scheduling nonconference games, no matter how big or small or how good or bad the opposition, has grown more difficult.

“I called a school recently in the WAC and offered $600,000, and the A.D. promptly told me he signed a deal for $750,000 with a Pac-10 school,” Epps said. “I remember a $100,000 contract we had with New Mexico State. I thought that was all the money in the world. Now, it’s chicken feed.”

Penn State coach Joe Paterno has no qualms with how Snyder’s team fed off some pushovers along the way to build his program.

“Unfortunately, a lot of people have been very critical of our nonconference schedule (South Florida, Cincinnati and Central Michigan in 2005), but we’ve got to have seven home games,” Paterno said. “I think Bill’s done what’s best for Kansas State, and I’m trying to do what’s best for Penn State.”

As for Snyder, Epps is convinced the criticism he took over the nonconference schedule never affected him.

“I don’t think it bothers him in the least,” Epps said. “He charts a course, and he doesn’t stray from it. I feel vindicated. I really do. But I don’t think it made any difference to coach Snyder one way or the other.”

Florida State coach Bobby Bowden figures Snyder most definitely is the one who got the last laugh in all of this nonconference rhetoric.

“I think Bill’s probably been smarter than most of us,” Bowden said.

Saulbadguy
09-23-2005, 09:27 AM
I wouldn't mind a meeting at Arrowhead. Most likely we'd have to go to South Bend to play them for the return trip. KSU Stadium wouldn't cater to too many Domers, but Arrowhead would bring alot of them in.

Raiderhater
09-23-2005, 09:58 AM
I wouldn't mind a meeting at Arrowhead. Most likely we'd have to go to South Bend to play them for the return trip. KSU Stadium wouldn't cater to too many Domers, but Arrowhead would bring alot of them in.


I hope this comes to pass.

dirk digler
09-23-2005, 10:18 AM
I am not a fan of either team but I would love to go to this game.

Mi_chief_fan
09-23-2005, 10:26 AM
Yeah, I guess Marshall was just too tough for K-state. :shake:

ct
09-23-2005, 10:27 AM
Wow, I'd pay some serious coin to see that!!

ChiTown
09-23-2005, 10:39 AM
Yeah, I guess Marshall was just too tough for K-state. :shake:

Congrats on failing to get it. Geezus.

He's talking about money, dingdng. Not about how TOUGH the Marshall game, in and of itself, really is.

Mi_chief_fan
09-23-2005, 11:17 AM
Most of the article seemed to be talking about K-State's scheduling choices of Akron, Ball St. and North Texas, and only mentions money, in passing, at the end. Then, it talks about how Texas Tech is taking the K-State approach in scheduling "nonconference weaklings."

I know what the article was about; perhaps you should take a closer look.

KevB
09-23-2005, 11:24 AM
Most of the article seemed to be talking about K-State's scheduling choices of Akron, Ball St. and North Texas, and only mentions money, in passing, at the end. Then, it talks about how Texas Tech is taking the K-State approach in scheduling "nonconference weaklings."

I know what the article was about; perhaps you should take a closer look.

The article is about both money and strength of schedule. However, as it relates to KSU, it's all about the money and getting home games. Why else would Snyder say he somewhat regrets road games against USC and Marshall despite getting Ws?

Mi_chief_fan
09-23-2005, 11:47 AM
The article is about both money and strength of schedule. However, as it relates to KSU, it's all about the money and getting home games. Why else would Snyder say he somewhat regrets road games against USC and Marshall despite getting Ws?

I'll admit that it mentions money, and that it's part of the point; to me, though, the point of the article was the whole approach of scheduling easier non-conference games while trying to build a program.

FWIW, I don't criticize him, he's certainly not the only coach to do so, nor is the Big 12 the only conference that does; matter of fact, Snyder found out, after losing to Marshall, what a lot of Bg 10 teams found out over the last decade: that the MAC isn't as bad as people make it out to be.

ChiTown
09-23-2005, 11:57 AM
Most of the article seemed to be talking about K-State's scheduling choices of Akron, Ball St. and North Texas, and only mentions money, in passing, at the end. Then, it talks about how Texas Tech is taking the K-State approach in scheduling "nonconference weaklings."

I know what the article was about; perhaps you should take a closer look.

No, you still don't get it.

They schedule the weaklings to get home games - revenue. I'm fairly close to the situation at KSU, so I know what I'm talking about.

Mi_chief_fan
09-23-2005, 12:03 PM
No, you still don't get it.

They schedule the weaklings to get home games - revenue. I'm fairly close to the situation at KSU, so I know what I'm talking about.

Good.....I don't know how i'd go on living if I didn't have someone so close to the situation at KSU. I didn't realize that home games meant revenue for the home team. I suppose now you'll tell me that the home team keeps all the revenue from concessions and parking?

What next?

I'm sure Notre Dame won't get any piece of the pie at Arrowhead, either. Economics, you know. They just feel more at home at Arrowhead than they would in Dodge City or Wichita or wherever the hell Kansas State plays.

jspchief
09-23-2005, 12:16 PM
There's a switch.

Instead of an article about K State scheduling a cupcake, it's an article about Notre Dame scheduling a cupcake.

Saulbadguy
09-23-2005, 12:21 PM
laugh@hawkeyes

jspchief
09-23-2005, 12:33 PM
Laugh while you can. Good luck with North Texas, because it could be followed by an 8 game losing streak.

ChiTown
09-23-2005, 12:33 PM
Good.....I don't know how i'd go on living if I didn't have someone so close to the situation at KSU. I didn't realize that home games meant revenue for the home team. I suppose now you'll tell me that the home team keeps all the revenue from concessions and parking?

What next?

I'm sure Notre Dame won't get any piece of the pie at Arrowhead, either. Economics, you know. They just feel more at home at Arrowhead than they would in Dodge City or Wichita or wherever the hell Kansas State plays.

Well, at least you're an informed poster on this subject :rolleyes:

ChiTown
09-23-2005, 12:34 PM
Laugh while you can. Good luck with North Texas, because it could be followed by an 8 game losing streak.

No, we have another cupcake after that - OU.

Saulbadguy
09-23-2005, 12:34 PM
Good luck at Ohio State. You'll need it.

jspchief
09-23-2005, 12:50 PM
Good luck at Ohio State. You'll need it.Want to wager on who finishes with the better record?

Saulbadguy
09-23-2005, 12:52 PM
Want to wager on who finishes with the better record?
Sure. $25 to 37 forever sound good? After 11 games?

jspchief
09-23-2005, 01:02 PM
Sure. $25 to 37 forever sound good? After 11 games?I was thinking something like sig lines, but a charitable donation is fine by me. That way you can write it off. You're on.

Saulbadguy
09-23-2005, 01:06 PM
I was thinking something like sig lines, but a charitable donation is fine by me. That way you can write it off. You're on.
QFT

If its a tie, i'll donate $25 to 37 forever. You are welcome to as well. :)

I'm thinking around 7-8 wins for both teams. Maybe they will end up in the Alamo bowl together. :shrug: