PDA

View Full Version : Realistic middle ground needs to be established


Coach
02-03-2006, 04:47 PM
Realistic middle ground needs to be established

DETROIT -- Commissioner Paul Tagliabue delivered what has come to be known as his "State of the NFL" address Friday morning and, in the hour-long session, there was plenty of emphasis on the "L" part of things.

Labor strife. Los Angeles. Lack of minority hiring. Louisiana. Las Vegas.

Those issues, somewhat predictably, dominated Tagliabue's remarks, as well as the annual question-and-answer period that followed. Perhaps the commissioner's most sobering message was his reiteration that progress has barely been even incremental on a proposed extension to the collective bargaining agreement, a negotiating stalemate that could propel the league into an "uncapped" year for the 2007 season.

Tagliabue's assessment of the discussions was more measured than the borderline vitriol of NFL Players Association executive director Gene Upshaw, who Thursday suggested the union is prepared to decertify, as it did in 1987, and to litigate the matter. Even if Tagliabue's words weren't as inflammatory, his conclusion was the same: The lack of progress is troubling.

"There needs to be an additional dose of reality from both sides," said Tagliabue, who stressed the importance of maintaining competitive balance while still rewarding players fairly. "No, there has not been as much progress as I had hoped. We need more reality as to where the middle [ground] is ... and that isn't there right now."

The commissioner, who sounded anything but optimistic about movement in the talks, said he does not agree with Upshaw's stance that the NFLPA is headed to decertification and the league destined for another contentious round of courtroom battles like the ones that marked much of the 1980s. Sources said that the two men met Thursday after Upshaw's remarks but that considerable hurdles remain in bargaining the latest addendum to the labor peace that has helped fuel the NFL's success.

We need a deal, it's as simple as that," said New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft after the commissioner's address.

Only a few weeks ago, the NFLPA rejected a new league proposal, and Tagliabue all but conceded there is little hope of being able to present owners with the framework for an extension at the annual league meeting in March in Orlando, Fla. Upshaw suggested that if the two sides get past March 3 -- when free agency begins -- without an accord, then the 2007 campaign likely will be played as an "uncapped" year. And Upshaw has maintained throughout the discussions that, if the cap disappears, the players will never permit him to negotiate another spending limit.

Other matters touched on by Tagliabue:

• Although the "Rooney Rule" served to promote more interviews of minority candidates for head coaching vacancies, the NFL might need to approach the problem "in different ways," the commissioner conceded. None of the new head coaches is a minority and, although Tagliabue said the league isn't "back to the old process," he was disappointed with the results during the recent hiring cycle.

• The league continues to move forward with two sites in Southern California, the Los Angeles Coliseum and Anaheim, as possibilities for returning to the market. But the lack of a collective bargaining extension, Tagliabue allowed, could slow the process. The commissioner said the failed labor talks could be "a considerable complication" to the plans to place a team in the Los Angeles market.

• League officials continue to work with New Orleans Saints owner Tom Benson toward resuscitating the franchise in the hurricane-ravaged city. League officials still hope the Saints will be able to play their entire home schedule in a refurbished Louisiana Superdome, but Tagliabue conceded that time is of the essence. Said the commissioner: "We need to get moving and get moving quickly."

• Hardly naive about the role gambling has played in the popularity of the Super Bowl and the league in general, Tagliabue essentially said there is little the NFL can do to curb wagering on its games. "It's not my job," Tagliabue said, "to establish the mores of America."

• Recent contracts to which the Washington Redskins have signed assistant coaches -- notably coordinators Gregg Williams and Al Saunders, each of whom received deals that average more than $2 million per year -- could force the league to examine coaching payrolls more closely. Tagliabue did note that there is no perceived correlation between the coaching salaries and a team's success. "The jury's still out," he said.

• A proposal by the Kansas City Chiefs to expand the current 12-team playoff field by two entries will be examined, but there seems to be little support for it. "I'd have to say I'm skeptical," Tagliabue said.

Len Pasquarelli is a senior NFL writer for ESPN.com.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2317906

Simplex3
02-03-2006, 04:53 PM
Upshaw suggested that if the two sides get past March 3 -- when free agency begins -- without an accord, then the 2007 campaign likely will be played as an "uncapped" year. And Upshaw has maintained throughout the discussions that, if the cap disappears, the players will never permit him to negotiate another spending limit.

Upshaw better watch his f**king mouth because if this prediction comes true he will forever be the man that destroyed the biggest sport in the US.

Bob Dole
02-03-2006, 04:57 PM
Bob Dole hasn't followed all the rhetoric closely, but Upshaw appears to be one of those "hard line" guys who isn't at all interested in compromise.

Nzoner
02-03-2006, 04:58 PM
I listened to a portion of this on Sirius today and a reporter asked Tags if he thought the $600 SB ticket price was too high and would it eventually cap out.Tags commented on how people were paying $3000 via the internet for tickets and that no the price was not too high as it was basically a four day weekend, :spock: and that based on other entertainment values it was fairly priced.

Coach
02-03-2006, 04:59 PM
Bob Dole hasn't followed all the rhetoric closely, but Upshaw appears to be one of those "hard line" guys who isn't at all interested in compromise.

That's the impression I get when I read this article.

Simplex3
02-03-2006, 05:10 PM
Bob Dole hasn't followed all the rhetoric closely, but Upshaw appears to be one of those "hard line" guys who isn't at all interested in compromise.
It's pretty typical of unions. Drive the wages & benefits up higher and higher until the company folds, then villianize the company mgmt.

The thing that drives me nuts about union "negotiators" is the "Take this turd sandwich and eat it or else I'm going to take away everything". What the NFL needs to do is kick these endzone prancing, camera loving sissies they call players out and bring up the NFLE and AFL players. Those guys would bust their ass on every play *cough*Randy Moss*cough*. My guess is they wouldn't be getting arrested non-stop, either. Send these current players home for a year and 98% of them will be back the next season, crying to get their game checks again so their last leased Lexus isn't repo'd.

cdcox
02-03-2006, 05:12 PM
Its clear that the owners will have to take the first step toward a labor settlment, and that step is coming to a resolution on the disposition of local money.

Reality 1. The players are going to demand that the total league revenue, including local money, be the basis of the salary cap.

Reality 2. If the cap is based on local money and local money remains unequitably distributed, you will end up with a situation where most of the small-market teams are considerabley under the cap and large-market teams enjoy a substantial competitive advantage.

Given these two realities, the owners need to work out a plan where at least half of the local money is shared and worked into the base from which the cap is determined.

Any other course of action is going to screw things up royally.

cdcox
02-03-2006, 05:14 PM
It's pretty typical of unions. Drive the wages & benefits up higher and higher until the company folds, then villianize the company mgmt.

The thing that drives me nuts about union "negotiators" is the "Take this turd sandwich and eat it or else I'm going to take away everything". What the NFL needs to do is kick these endzone prancing, camera loving sissies they call players out and bring up the NFLE and AFL players. Those guys would bust their ass on every play *cough*Randy Moss*cough*. My guess is they wouldn't be getting arrested non-stop, either. Send these current players home for a year and 98% of them will be back the next season, crying to get their game checks again so their last leased Lexus isn't repo'd.

Yeah, the last time they used replacement players was awesome.

Simplex3
02-03-2006, 05:14 PM
Its clear that the owners will have to take the first step toward a labor settlment, and that step is coming to a resolution on the disposition of local money.

Reality 1. The players are going to demand that the total league revenue, including local money, be the basis of the salary cap.

Reality 2. If the cap is based on local money and local money remains unequitably distributed, you will end up with a situation where most of the small-market teams are considerabley under the cap and large-market teams enjoy a substantial competitive advantage.

Given these two realities, the owners need to work out a plan where at least half of the local money is shared and worked into the base from which the cap is determined.

Any other course of action is going to screw things up royally.
S**t canning the current players who won't play a game for a few $Mil a year and replacing them with people who will doesn't mess up anything.

Simplex3
02-03-2006, 05:15 PM
Yeah, the last time they used replacement players was awesome.
Last time they didn't have as much of a heads up.

FAX
02-03-2006, 05:18 PM
Huge drop off in talent from NFL to NFLE/CFL, Mr. Symplex3. I like games with more incompletions than rushing yards as much as the next guy, but, we would be better served starting the Lingerie Football League. I'll take the Nashville Nudes.

FAX

Simplex3
02-03-2006, 05:21 PM
Huge drop off in talent from NFL to NFLE/CFL, Mr. Symplex3. We would be better served starting the Lingerie Football League. I'll take the Nashville Nudes.

FAX
I'm not saying there wouldn't be a talent dropoff in an all NFLE league, but let's be serious. If you tell the current players to f**k off and stand your ground by and far the majority of these guys will be back begging for their jobs within a year. They don't manage their money well enough to just walk away.

Second, you're just about to draft a new bunch of studs from college. Open up the draft to all players who have at least one year of college ball just for this draft. That will also help teams stock up.

It can be done if the owners have the testicular fortitude.

cdcox
02-03-2006, 05:22 PM
I'm no expert on labor law, but I have a feeling that if it ends up in litigation (which Simplex's solution is almost sure to precipitate), it won't end pretty for the owners.

Bugeater
02-03-2006, 05:22 PM
Huge drop off in talent from NFL to NFLE/CFL, Mr. Symplex3. We would be better served starting the Lingerie Football League. I'll take the Nashville Nudes.

FAX

I would find your proposed league just as compelling as an uncapped NFL.

cdcox
02-03-2006, 05:27 PM
Second, you're just about to draft a new bunch of studs from college. Open up the draft to all players who have at least one year of college ball just for this draft. That will also help teams stock up.



The NCAA and the NFL try to maintain good relations. I doubt the NCAA would look favorably on this plan.

And without a CBA, there is no draft and you'd have a situation of pure free agency for signing players to contracts. The current players would be fine with that.

FAX
02-03-2006, 05:29 PM
Many of these owners have lost their testicular fortitude already, Mr. Simplex3. In fact, many of them have lost testicles in their entirety (prostate problems, attorneys, blood sucking third wives, etc.).

I do not disagree with your strategy in dealing with the union. I am no Upshaw fan, in part due to how he has allowed many of the old NFL vets to suffer without proper medical assistance. So, if we're going to punish these worthless, no-good, cry-baby, professional athletes, let's do it right. They can watch our new LFL on their second-hand tvs. I'll take the Sacramento Strippers.

FAX

mike_b_284
02-03-2006, 05:41 PM
why do sports figures feel they are entitled to such an ungodly amount of money? If the best made 750,000 per year and the worst made 75.000 a year would they be that bad off? I bust my ass all year to scrape in my measely figure (which to embarrasing to mention) and don't bitch about it.

Ultra Peanut
02-03-2006, 06:40 PM
why do sports figures feel they are entitled to such an ungodly amount of money?Because they make ungodly amounts of money for their respective leagues and owners.

Capitalism.

DaKCMan AP
02-03-2006, 06:58 PM
why do sports figures feel they are entitled to such an ungodly amount of money? If the best made 750,000 per year and the worst made 75.000 a year would they be that bad off? I bust my ass all year to scrape in my measely figure (which to embarrasing to mention) and don't bitch about it.

Not saying they deserve the ungodly amount of monies, but most NFL careers last 3-4 years and most of them will have arthritis and other conditions and injuries the rest of their lives.

wolfpack0735
02-03-2006, 09:29 PM
big vs small markets and greedy players, this is why baseball sucks so much. the nfl needs cap so everyone is fairly equal.

Chiefs Express
02-03-2006, 09:33 PM
It's pretty typical of unions. Drive the wages & benefits up higher and higher until the company folds, then villianize the company mgmt.

The thing that drives me nuts about union "negotiators" is the "Take this turd sandwich and eat it or else I'm going to take away everything". What the NFL needs to do is kick these endzone prancing, camera loving sissies they call players out and bring up the NFLE and AFL players. Those guys would bust their ass on every play *cough*Randy Moss*cough*. My guess is they wouldn't be getting arrested non-stop, either. Send these current players home for a year and 98% of them will be back the next season, crying to get their game checks again so their last leased Lexus isn't repo'd.

Do you think we can get enough interest up to restart the USFL after the NFL folds? When that league was in business it was more about the game than the money.

Chiefs Express
02-03-2006, 09:37 PM
big vs small markets and greedy players, this is why baseball sucks so much. the nfl needs cap so everyone is fairly equal.

For starters, the NFL needs to cap the salary that a rookie can get. Or put a salary level on every rookie drafted based on when they were drafted. I don't know what that value might be, but there is alot of draftees that tend to think they are the best thing since sliced bread.

The bad thing about the current situation is, IMO, that you make a millionaire out of someone that has the capacity of a high school sophmore and that person thinks because of his stature in the NFL that he is immune to the law. It isn't just the NFL, the rest of the leagues have the same problem. It isn't all of them, but enough to make the rest look bad.

But as I said, JMO.

Ultra Peanut
02-03-2006, 09:43 PM
Do you think we can get enough interest up to restart the USFL after the NFL folds? When that league was in business it was more about the game than the money.$1

tk13
02-03-2006, 09:52 PM
Do you think we can get enough interest up to restart the USFL after the NFL folds? When that league was in business it was more about the game than the money.
The NFL is just a victim of its own success... that's how it goes. Just like how baseball and hockey have been horrible for a long time and are now moving back in the right direction, football is in such good shape they're going to try and pick each other apart for the riches. It all balances out in the end.

I don't think we're doomed yet, but I've said all along that if guys like Snyder and Jones are going to break away, now's the time, because they've started to separate themselves a bit and can blow that door wide open. I even read a quote from Jerry Jones today saying he didn't think a salary cap was absolutely necessary. Easy for him to say.

Chiefs Express
02-03-2006, 09:57 PM
The NFL is just a victim of its own success... that's how it goes. Just like how baseball and hockey have been horrible for a long time and are now moving back in the right direction, football is in such good shape they're going to try and pick each other apart for the riches. It all balances out in the end.

I don't think we're doomed yet, but I've said all along that if guys like Snyder and Jones are going to break away, now's the time, because they've started to separate themselves a bit and can blow that door wide open. I even read a quote from Jerry Jones today saying he didn't think a salary cap was absolutely necessary. Easy for him to say.

Jerry Jones would be the equivalent of George Steinbrenner if the cap was removed.