MP3 question

[007]

I am needing fast answers so please hold off on moving this to the media forum at least for an hour or two.

I am looking at an IRiver H10 that is on clearance at Office Depot for only $134.

It is a 20gb microdrive that will store pictures and music but not video. it has a non removable battery that averages about 14 hours. It also has FM with 20 presets.

The extended warranty would cost $45 for 2 years.

Is this worth it?

I really only needed a 2GB flash Mp3 player for workouts but this would be about the same price.

Opinions please.

Thanks

[Demonpenz]

you could get an ipod

[007]

you could get an ipod


Sure, I have $350 somewhere in the seatcushions here for a completly overpriced brand name.


Some real help please.

[Demonpenz]

I pod shuffle is like 99 dollars

[Simplex3]

How long do you work out? I've been staring at the iPod Shuffle, you can get one from Apple refurbed with a one year warranty for $50.

http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore.woa/wo/0.RSLID?mco=E60A57E5&nclm=SpecialDeals

While people are in the "advice giving" mood, I'd like some recommendations as well. I need something that will hold about 2 hours of music, has ~3 hours of battery life, and decent sound quality. I'm only going to use it when I work out, so small and light are key. I don't need a screen, I won't be watching it while working out anyway. Inexpensive is big, but sound quality is bigger.

[007]

I pod shuffle is like 99 dollars

Point taken. I should probably say that Apple won't get my money until they allow you to play all forms of music and not just theirs.

I also want an FM receiver. no IPOD has that.

[007]

How long do you work out? I've been staring at the iPod Shuffle, you can get one from Apple refurbed with a one year warranty for $50.


Around 90 minutes give or take.

That is not bad for a refurb. Does it have 1Gb or just 512.

Guess it really doesn't matter since there is still no FM option there.

[hypersensitiveZO6]

Not worth it IMO.


My buddy has an IRiver and it's pretty solid.

[Simplex3]

Around 90 minutes give or take.

That is not bad for a refurb. Does it have 1Gb or just 512.

Guess it really doesn't matter since there is still no FM option there.
I haven't listened to FM radio in probably 5 years, so that's not a huge need for me. :)

I just saw the iRiver Clix at Worst Buy, that's bad as hell. Of course the don't have headphones out, so I didn't listen to it.

[007]

Not worth it IMO.


My buddy has an IRiver and it's pretty solid.


I assume you mean the Ipod is not worth it and the Iriver is?

[Simplex3]

One thing to make sure of before you buy:

Can you get a sweat-proof case for it? Preferably neoprene or some other smell-resistant fabric. Also, does it have a belt clip, arm strap, or other thing that you're comfortable wearing.

[hypersensitiveZO6]

I assume you mean the Ipod is not worth it and the Iriver is?

I don't like Ipod, or apple. So yeah.

[007]

One thing to make sure of before you buy:

Can you get a sweat-proof case for it? Preferably neoprene or some other smell-resistant fabric. Also, does it have a belt clip, arm strap, or other thing that you're comfortable wearing.


The Iriver does have a rubberish case with belt loop for it. it is a real nice looking unit. Cnet gave it a 7.0 of 10 which is on the lower end of the good products. They like it but it had quirks that they didn't like too.

[Demonpenz]

I still use these ungodly huge fm headphones with a huge anntanne on it. I think i like it because it is so old school

[007]

I don't like Ipod, or apple. So yeah.


Ah, someone in my boat. Of course, Simplex has me looking at that damn apply refurb page.

Damn you simplex. :cuss: :cuss: :cuss: ROFL

[Simplex3]

Ah, someone in my boat. Of course, Simplex has me looking at that damn apply refurb page.

Damn you simplex. :cuss: :cuss: :cuss: ROFL
If you get the Shuffle don't bother with the arm band. Seems they break easy, sometimes break the player when they do, and it's freaking white leather. Duh.

[Simplex3]

http://www.officedepot.com/ddSKU.do?level=SK&id=544514&Ns=p_Price_2|0&Nr=200000&N=248831&An=browse

There you go. There is a 1G version.

I would avoid a player with a hard disk like the plague, I had one years ago and the battery life was s**t.

[Demonpenz]

There are some good deals on this one

http://www.apple.com/ipod/

[hypersensitiveZO6]

Ah, someone in my boat.
I bought bought a sony mp3 player just for the purpose you have. It's actually cooler because unlike the Ipod, no one has seen it before, and it seems a lot more interesting. My friend is 18; a swimmer and he has the iRiver at his swim meets. I seem to remember he has a little plastic case, but I'm not sure.

[JBucc]

I have a 4GB RCA Lyra. I put the 2GB version on layaway as a christmas present to myself and when I went to pick it up they lost it so they gave me the 4GB version for the price of the 2GB one so that was cool. Anyway it's ok at playing the music but the volume dial thing sucks, half the time when you turn it the volume goes the wrong direction. I wouldn't recomend it but I'm too cheap to get another one.

[Demonpenz]

That would be nice if they made one for swimming

[007]

http://www.officedepot.com/ddSKU.do?level=SK&id=544514&Ns=p_Price_2|0&Nr=200000&N=248831&An=browse

There you go. There is a 1G version.

I would avoid a player with a hard disk like the plague, I had one years ago and the battery life was s**t.


That is what I was eyeing before I ran across this IRiver 20gb deal. It seems too good to pass up but at the same time it IS more than what I really need too. I hate decisions like these. I overthink everything. LOL

[noa]

That is what I was eyeing before I ran across this IRiver 20gb deal. It seems too good to pass up but at the same time it IS more than what I really need too. I hate decisions like these. I overthink everything. LOL


Sounds to me like you should just get this IRiver 20 gig player. Even if it seems like more than you need right now, it might be helpful to have the extra space in the future, and if its a good price now, why not?

[Simplex3]

That would be nice if they made one for swimming
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16881100004 (Waterproof MP3 Player)

[007]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16881100004 (Waterproof MP3 Player)

Features
Dare to take your music anywhere! Compact, waterproof casing and headphones allow musical enjoyment while swimming, kayaking, jogging in the rain, skiing, surfing …
Holds data, video and music
DRM Coding

Video? It is 512mb.

[007]

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/customer-reviews/B00083XXTY/ref=cm_rev_sort/103-9969057-4939006?customer-reviews.sort_by=%2BSubmissionDate&x=5&y=13&s=electronics

[JBucc]

Features
Dare to take your music anywhere! Compact, waterproof casing and headphones allow musical enjoyment while swimming, kayaking, jogging in the rain, skiing, surfing …
Holds data, video and music
DRM Coding

Video? It is 512mb.newegg's descriptions aren't always the best...

[ChiefaRoo]

I bought my IPOD nano for less than $150

[headsnap]

Point taken. I should probably say that Apple won't get my money until they allow you to play all forms of music and not just theirs.

:shake:


just continue to wallow in your ignorance...

[007]

HOly crap!!!

2BG player with 153 hours of battery life. Cnet even proved it pulls at least 145 hours on a single charge. Podcast ready too.

[007]

:shake:


just continue to wallow in your ignorance...


Well, if ignorance is being frugal and not buying more than I need and not paying for a damn name then yes.... I am ignorant. :rolleyes:

[headsnap]

Well, if ignorance is being frugal and not buying more than I need and not paying for a damn name then yes.... I am ignorant. :rolleyes:

I quoted your ignorance in the previous post...

[KCFalcon59]

HOly crap!!!

2BG player with 153 hours of battery life. Cnet even proved it pulls at least 145 hours on a single charge. Podcast ready too.

Which one is this?

[Simplex3]

Which one is this?
Yeah, I'd like to know too.

[Bugeater]

Point taken. I should probably say that Apple won't get my money until they allow you to play all forms of music and not just theirs.
I also want an FM receiver. no IPOD has that.
What are you talking about? I haven't ran across anything that my iPod won't play.

[Simplex3]

What are you talking about? I haven't ran across anything that my iPod won't play.
OGG, FLAC, and Monkey's come to mind...

[Bugeater]

OGG, FLAC, and Monkey's come to mind...
:hmmm: Mmmkay. I must not have any of those.

[Simplex3]

:hmmm: Mmmkay. I must not have any of those.
Most people don't. OGG is a better-than-mp3 style of compression, FLAC and Monkey's are both lossless audio compression.

[007]

Which one is this?
Damn, thought I posted the link.

http://reviews.cnet.com/MobiBlu_B153_2GB_black/4505-6490_7-31870947-2.html?tag=nav

[ChiefFan31]

I have not read all the posts, but one thing to think about.

You say the main reason to purchase this item is for working out correct? Just keep in mind the player you wanted has flash memory and not a spinning hard drive like the 20 gig unit you want.

Just something to think about. I really think you cant go wrong with either choice you asked about. They are all pretty good units and getting cheaper by the day...

Im personally about to get a 60gb iPod, but I have shitloads of music and want to be able to listen to it in my car. That is my main desire.

[007]

I have not read all the posts, but one thing to think about.

You say the main reason to purchase this item is for working out correct? Just keep in mind the player you wanted has flash memory and not a spinning hard drive like the 20 gig unit you want.

Just something to think about. I really think you cant go wrong with either choice you asked about. They are all pretty good units and getting cheaper by the day...

Im personally about to get a 60gb iPod, but I have shitloads of music and want to be able to listen to it in my car. That is my main desire.


In the car is the other use I have for it. I only have about 5.7gb of music so I am having a hard time jumping on the 20g player anyway.

That Mobiblu 153 sure has my eye though. Battery life has been my biggest complaint of my current 256mb player. usually about 4-5 hours. Drives me nuts.

[ChiefFan31]

In the car is the other use I have for it. I only have about 5.7gb of music so I am having a hard time jumping on the 20g player anyway.

That Mobiblu 153 sure has my eye though. Battery life has been my biggest complaint of my current 256mb player. usually about 4-5 hours. Drives me nuts.

That does look nice. Good rating on Cnet. and Dayum, that unit does sport one hell of a long battery life. with 2gb of space on that and 5.7gb of music, you can swap out no problem.

I have a little 256mb rio sport player that I have had for a couple of years, that is great for the gym. fits about 3 full cds.

[007]

That does look nice. Good rating on Cnet. and Dayum, that unit does sport one hell of a long battery life. with 2gb of space on that and 5.7gb of music, you can swap out no problem.

I have a little 256mb rio sport player that I have had for a couple of years, that is great for the gym. fits about 3 full cds.

here is another link.

http://mobibluamerica.com/dah1900.html

[ChiefFan31]

here is another link.

http://mobibluamerica.com/dah1900.html

Sounds like you know what you want. The 45 hit on the extended warranty, man I hate those.....But they are pretty fragile. If they have a decent factory warranty, I wouldnt get it

I cant believe how cheap those are. 2 gigs of flash memory for a buck thirty is a sweet deal IMO

[beavis]

I quoted your ignorance in the previous post...
Haven't you heard? Mp3 is now exclusively Apple's domain.

[007]

Sounds like you know what you want. The 45 hit on the extended warranty, man I hate those.....But they are pretty fragile. If they have a decent factory warranty, I wouldnt get it

I cant believe how cheap those are. 2 gigs of flash memory for a buck thirty is a sweet deal IMO


The 45 hit? Where did you see that. I couldn't even find that during the ordering process. No I haven't bought it yet, just wanted to see where that showed up though.

[ChiefFan31]

The 45 hit? Where did you see that. I couldn't even find that during the ordering process. No I haven't bought it yet, just wanted to see where that showed up though.

You posted this

The extended warranty would cost $45 for 2 years

I was talking about the extended warranty. I normally think those suck, but sometimes they can be worth it, say like a fragile MP3 player.

Edit, my bad. that was for the iRiver.

[007]

You posted this

The extended warranty would cost $45 for 2 years

I was talking about the extended warranty. I normally think those suck, but sometimes they can be worth it, say like a fragile MP3 player.

Edit, my bad. that was for the iRiver.


ROFL That clears that up. I hate extended warranties anyway. I can't imagine needing one for a flash based player. I would definitley want one if I got that Iriver though.

[ZootedGranny]

The H10 is a very nice player.

I know more than a few online acquaintances that have the H10, and have never had any problems, other than some bass distortion that has been fixed by a firmware update. If you buy new, it would probably already have the firmware flashed.

It's a steal at $134.

[007]

The H10 is a very nice player.

I know more than a few online acquaintances that have the H10, and have never had any problems, other than some bass distortion that has been fixed by a firmware update. If you buy new, it would probably already have the firmware flashed.

It's a steal at $134.


Wow, I waited all night for someone that knew something about the H10. Cnet was kind of hard on it.

[greg63]

Wow, I waited all night for someone that knew something about the H10. Cnet was kind of hard on it.


I could make a comment here, but I won't in light of the situation. :D

[007]

I could make a comment here, but I won't in light of the situation. :D


Does it have anything to do with an old joke about Leave it to Beaver? ROFL

[Moooo]

I thought you said you had a 20gb Microwave... lol

Moooo

[007]

I thought you said you had a 20gb Microwave... lol

Moooo


With Gremlins. :)

[greg63]

Does it have anything to do with an old joke about Leave it to Beaver? ROFL
ROFL :shrug: ROFL

[007]

ROFL :shrug: ROFL

"Ward, weren't you a little hard on the beaver last night?" ROFL

Dirtiest phrase ever said on network television at the time.

[Lzen]

While people are in the "advice giving" mood, I'd like some recommendations as well. I need something that will hold about 2 hours of music, has ~3 hours of battery life, and decent sound quality. I'm only going to use it when I work out, so small and light are key. I don't need a screen, I won't be watching it while working out anyway. Inexpensive is big, but sound quality is bigger.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2248752&CatId=0

[Lzen]

I am needing fast answers so please hold off on moving this to the media forum at least for an hour or two.

I am looking at an IRiver H10 that is on clearance at Office Depot for only $134.

It is a 20gb microdrive that will store pictures and music but not video. it has a non removable battery that averages about 14 hours. It also has FM with 20 presets.

The extended warranty would cost $45 for 2 years.

Is this worth it?

I really only needed a 2GB flash Mp3 player for workouts but this would be about the same price.

Opinions please.

Thanks

I wouldn't bother with the extended warranty if I were in your shoes. I'm of the opinion that most extended warranties are unnecessary and are just to bleed more $$$ out of you. There are times when they are wise to purchase, but not for something like this. JMO

BTW, here are some customer reviews of that iRiver H10 20GB player.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1894257&Tab=11&NoMapp=0

Looks like that price at Office Depot is pretty darn good.

[Lzen]

Features
Dare to take your music anywhere! Compact, waterproof casing and headphones allow musical enjoyment while swimming, kayaking, jogging in the rain, skiing, surfing …
Holds data, video and music
DRM Coding

Video? It is 512mb.

It can't play video. It only plays MP3s and WMAs. That part just means that you can transfer video and other data type files with this unit, like using a jump drive or flash drive (same thing).

[jspchief]

I pod shuffle is like 99 dollars

How long do you work out? I've been staring at the iPod Shuffle, you can get one from Apple refurbed with a one year warranty for $50.

http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore.woa/wo/0.RSLID?mco=E60A57E5&nclm=SpecialDeals

While people are in the "advice giving" mood, I'd like some recommendations as well. I need something that will hold about 2 hours of music, has ~3 hours of battery life, and decent sound quality. I'm only going to use it when I work out, so small and light are key. I don't need a screen, I won't be watching it while working out anyway. Inexpensive is big, but sound quality is bigger.

I would not recommend the Shuffle. Functionality is lacking, and there have been a lot of problems with them. You basically either listen to your single playlist in order, or you shuffle it. If you want to skip to the 30th song on your Shuffle, you have to actually hit FF 30 times. Plus, noscreen so you have to memorize your playlist.

I'm a fan of the Apple mp3 players, but the Shuffle is like an attempt from Mercedes to make an economy car... you lose all the great features of the Mercedes, and it's still over-priced for what you get.

[007]

I wouldn't bother with the extended warranty if I were in your shoes. I'm of the opinion that most extended warranties are unnecessary and are just to bleed more $$$ out of you. There are times when they are wise to purchase, but not for something like this. JMO

BTW, here are some customer reviews of that iRiver H10 20GB player.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1894257&Tab=11&NoMapp=0

Looks like that price at Office Depot is pretty darn good.


I am not big on extended warranties either but since it is a microdrive, not flash, and the battery is not removeable, it seems that the warranty would be necessary.

I think I am leaning toward this Mobiblu b153 now anyway. I hate to pass up a great price but since I only have 5.7 gb of music anyway, 20gb would just be extreme overkill for me.

[007]

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2248752&CatId=0


That is just the Mobiblue 1500dah with another name on it. Surprised that Tigerdirect would sell the exact same product on their site.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1870128&CatId=1698
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1784094&CatId=1698

[Dave Lane]

I just bought a Nano for $129 pretty sweet.

Dave

[JBucc]

I just bought a Nano for $129 pretty sweet.

DaveNanos are the only ipod I would consider buying

[DJJasonp]

For what it's worth.....I-River machines arent always supported by some of the online download sites (such as Yahoo or Napster).

I have a creative labs Zen Micro and it works fine (with both of those services)...plus, I dont have to worry about certain formats or unlicensed files not playing.

I, like others who posted before me, will not succumb to the apple dynasty....for the simple fact that I want to be able to load my player up with as many tunes as I want - and not have to go through I-Tunes at a buck a download....Yahoo music online allows you to download to your player unlimited tunes for around 12-14 bucks a month. (To burn is extra) But not a bad deal...and their selection is pretty extensive....

Just my 2 cents...

[|Zach|]

I am not big on extended warranties either but since it is a microdrive, not flash, and the battery is not removeable, it seems that the warranty would be necessary.

I think I am leaning toward this Mobiblu b153 now anyway. I hate to pass up a great price but since I only have 5.7 gb of music anyway, 20gb would just be extreme overkill for me.
As a former employee at OD I will say that the protection plans are pretty good...if you have a problem with it...any problem and you have a plan you can take it in and either get a new one or get a gift card for the amount you paid for it to get other things...

[007]

As a former employee at OD I will say that the protection plans are pretty good...if you have a problem with it...any problem and you have a plan you can take it in and either get a new one or get a gift card for the amount you paid for it to get other things...


I have heard good things about OD and their EW policies.

I just don't know if any MP3 player is worth the extra $45 investment.

[|Zach|]

I have heard good things about OD and their EW policies.

I just don't know if any MP3 player is worth the extra $45 investment.
I can understand that...I just wanted to throw out that it is a good policy...

Esp with the way manufactuers warrenties are...

[jspchief]

For what it's worth.....I-River machines arent always supported by some of the online download sites (such as Yahoo or Napster).

I have a creative labs Zen Micro and it works fine (with both of those services)...plus, I dont have to worry about certain formats or unlicensed files not playing.

I, like others who posted before me, will not succumb to the apple dynasty....for the simple fact that I want to be able to load my player up with as many tunes as I want - and not have to go through I-Tunes at a buck a download....Yahoo music online allows you to download to your player unlimited tunes for around 12-14 bucks a month. (To burn is extra) But not a bad deal...and their selection is pretty extensive....

Just my 2 cents...Sounds to me like you have no clue how Itunes and Ipods operate.

[007]

Sounds to me like you have no clue how Itunes and Ipods operate.
Please enlighten us. I just want to hear something about Ipods that is impressive other than "It's an Ipod."

I have yet to have anyone explain to me what an Ipod does that other mp3 players cannot. Nothing irks me more than someone taking another product and saying "It ain't an Ipod" Not saying that is what you are doing. Just saying that is what I tend to hear.

Keep in mind, the things I care about most are battery life and good sound quality.

[greg63]

I wonder if SLAG02 could help ya out here?

[jspchief]

Please enlighten us. I just want to hear something about Ipods that is impressive other than "It's an Ipod."

I have yet to have anyone explain to me what an Ipod does that other mp3 players cannot. Nothing irks me more than someone taking another product and saying "It ain't an Ipod" Not saying that is what you are doing. Just saying that is what I tend to hear.

Keep in mind, the things I care about most are battery life and good sound quality.I've said it in just about every MP3 player thread has has come through Chiefsplanet. I consider two things when recommending an Ipod:

1. User functions
2. Aftermarket accessories

In regards to user functions, I don't doubt that there are other players now that are comparable. But in my experience, the Ipod has led the pack, with others trying to keep up. Just make sure you are aware of what your MP3 player can do, in comparison to it's peers. Things like UI and the ability to build playlists on the fly are what I refer to.

As for aftermarket acessories, for some people it may be of no consequence. But the fact is, probably 75% of MP3 player accessories made are designed specifically for the Ipod products, or at least with the Ipod design in mind. It's nice to have that large selection.

Now as for Itunes, the claim that you have to buy from Itunes to put it on your Ipod is simply false. I have over 1k songs on my Ipod, and probably less than 25 of them came from Itunes. I can't say with any certainty which sites do or don't work with Ipods, but I do know that the Ipod isn't Itunes exclusive in regards to the files you can use. You have to use the Itunes software to install the files onto your player, but you don't have to purchase the files from them.

[007]

I've said it in just about every MP3 player thread has has come through Chiefsplanet. I consider two things when recommending an Ipod:

1. User functions
2. Aftermarket accessories

In regards to user functions, I don't doubt that there are other players now that are comparable. But in my experience, the Ipod has led the pack, with others trying to keep up. Just make sure you are aware of what your MP3 player can do, in comparison to it's peers. Things like UI and the ability to build playlists on the fly are what I refer to.

As for aftermarket acessories, for some people it may be of no consequence. But the fact is, probably 75% of MP3 player accessories made are designed specifically for the Ipod products, or at least with the Ipod design in mind. It's nice to have that large selection.

Now as for Itunes, the claim that you have to buy from Itunes to put it on your Ipod is simply false. I have over 1k songs on my Ipod, and probably less than 25 of them came from Itunes. I can't say with any certainty which sites do or don't work with Ipods, but I do know that the Ipod isn't Itunes exclusive in regards to the files you can use. You have to use the Itunes software to install the files onto your player, but you don't have to purchase the files from them.


OK, that was my misconception then. I knew you needed to use Itunes to put music on the player so I took that to mean it had to be the AAC codecs that apple uses too.

Don't really care about aftermarket accessories. The fact that they make most accessories for the Ipod only annoys me and that is not Apple's fault.

What is UI and by saying "on the fly" you mean you can build your playlist from the ipod itself? I thought most of the expensive players did that anyway. Am I wrong?

[jspchief]

What is UI and by saying "on the fly" you mean you can build your playlist from the ipod itself? I thought most of the expensive players did that anyway. Am I wrong?UI is "user-interface". I'm referring to the controls on the unit. Out of the players I own, the Ipod is the most user friendly.

And like I said, it's possible that a lot of current players do have the same functions now. I would just recommend comparing in depth, because my other big MP3 player didn't. If you use your player a lot, you'll quickly find that it's about more than battery life and storage space. Look at teh functions, and learn what they are.

I'm not some Apple fanboy, but I have noticed a lot of the anti-Ipod people aren't really very informed. It's popularity is not just a product of a large marketing budget, it's a great unit, and most other manufacturers have used it as the benchmark to aspire to.

I'm not going to claim Ipod is the greatest. But I'll say I doubt you'll find a better player in any area but price point. At this stage, I'm sure there are comparable ones, but I doubt they are better... just cheaper.

And in case you missed it, stay away from the Shuffle, it's a waste.

[007]

UI is "user-interface". I'm referring to the controls on the unit. Out of the players I own, the Ipod is the most user friendly.

And like I said, it's possible that a lot of current players do have the same functions now. I would just recommend comparing in depth, because my other big MP3 player didn't. If you use your player a lot, you'll quickly find that it's about more than battery life and storage space. Look at teh functions, and learn what they are.

I'm not some Apple fanboy, but I have noticed a lot of the anti-Ipod people aren't really very informed. It's popularity is not just a product of a large marketing budget, it's a great unit, and most other manufacturers have used it as the benchmark to aspire to.

I'm not going to claim Ipod is the greatest. But I'll say I doubt you'll find a better player in any area but price point. At this stage, I'm sure there are comparable ones, but I doubt they are better... just cheaper.

And in case you missed it, stay away from the Shuffle, it's a waste.

yeah, I saw your point on the shuffle. I think it is ugly and looks really cheap too.

Battery life is a big one for me. First and foremost, if the battery must be rechargeable, then I want it to be something I can have a spare of that I can put in on my own rather than needing to send it in for service.

Do any of the Ipods do this with the battery? Seems like the Ipods I have seen are all aroung 14 hours and built in hence non-removable.

[007]

Now this was an impressive site for MP3 player reviews.

http://www.dapreview.net/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.269

Highly recommend it if you are in the market.