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tk13
11-23-2006, 02:39 AM
http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_4708796

NFL Network hit with access issue
By Patrick Saunders
Denver Post Staff Writer
Article Last Updated:11/23/2006 12:19:35 AM MST

Like a 325-pound defensive tackle, the omnipotent NFL knows how to throw its weight around.

Nothing illustrates that better than tonight's game between the Broncos and Kansas City Chiefs at Arrowhead Stadium.

When football fans sit in front of the television and gobble down their pumpkin pie, they will be watching a game on the NFL's infant network. It is the first of eight Thursday-Saturday games this season produced, directed and televised exclusively by the NFL Network.

But the game behind the games has been as rough as a blindside sack.

The 3-year-old network has been criticized for trying to strong-arm cable TV companies into carrying its product at an exorbitant rate. It's been scolded for blacking out loyal fans who can't get the proper cable connections. It's even been called in front of a U.S. Senate committee to explain its future intentions and answer questions about antitrust laws.

But like a defensive tackle bull-rushing the quarterback, the NFL Network plows ahead, supremely confident in its product and the public's desire for it. Indeed, NFL Network president and CEO Steve Bornstein has called the pro football league "the most popular programming on the planet."

Bornstein said adding prime-time, late-season games to the NFL Network's all-football menu of highlights, pregame shows, analysis and fabled NFL Films productions was the next logical step.

"Football is the perfect 24/7 sport because of its importance to the country," said Bornstein, the former head of ESPN. "And we're excited about presenting everything we do, not just these eight games."

In the Denver area, as well as Colorado Springs and Pueblo, the NFL Network is available on Comcast cable, but only on its digital tier. It's also carried by major satellite providers DirecTV and the Dish Network. And because NFL rules stipulate that over- the-air stations in the home cities can broadcast games,

Cable TV wars

As of Sept. 1, the NFL Network claimed about 41 million subscribers, very good for a relatively young network but far short of its goal of being in 65 million homes by the time the Broncos and Chiefs hooked up tonight.

As the network attempts to plug into mainstream cable television, there have been plenty of blown fuses. The basic dispute pits the network against some of the nation's biggest cable companies, chief among them No. 2 operator Time Warner Cable, Cablevision Systems Corp. (a New York-area provider) and Charter Communications, who aren't carrying the NFL Network. The root of the feud, of course, is money. Caught in the middle are the fans.

"The NFL Network keeps the pressure on because it believes we will ultimately end up charging all our customers to satisfy the few who want these games," Fred Dressler, executive vice president of Time Warner Cable, told Sports Business News.

Time Warner said it would have to pay $140 million a year to provide the channel to all 13.5 million of its subscribers in 33 states. The cable giant's stance is that the NFL Network belongs on a sports tier, where true NFL fans will pay for it.

The NFL Network used to charge cable companies 20 cents per subscriber per month. After the addition of the eight-game package, it reportedly began charging 70 cents, more than cable staples such as CNN, Discovery Channel and Nickelodeon. However, The Wall Street Journal reported in April that ESPN charges cable companies more than $2.50 per customer per month.

That's why Broncos owner Pat Bowlen, chairman of the NFL's broadcast committee, disagrees with those blaming the NFL Network for the stalemate.

"What we are asking of the cable companies is not an inflated price," he said. "We are not asking like $2.50 per game. We are right there with everybody else."

The NFL, already set to make $3.7 billion this year from television deals alone, has been aggressively publicizing its position. Seth Palansky, the NFL Network's spokesman, has been quoted extensively. He recently said the network "is the most valuable programming a cable company can offer, and a cable company not carrying live NFL games is like a grocery store not carrying milk."

One NFL newspaper advertisement aimed at Time Warner read: "Don't let Time Warner ruin your football season. You'll miss NFL games if you don't call and demand NFL Network now."

Dressler fired back, telling The New York Times: "To suggest that anybody's season will be ruined for missing eight games is ludicrous."

There had been hopes that the dispute would be settled before the NFL Network televised its first game, today, but there is no end in sight.

What's next?

Last week, at a hearing of the Senate Judiciary Committee, Sen. Arlen Specter, R-Pa., wanted to know more about the NFL Network's future.

"We're intrigued, to put it mildly, with what the NFL has in mind," he said during a 90-minute session featuring NFL executive vice president and general counsel Jeffrey Pash.

Pash answered questions not only about how the NFL Network's plans could affect cable and satellite rates, but also whether the NFL televising its own games raises antitrust issues in connection with the Sports Broadcasting Act. Pash said the NFL Network's programming does not conflict with antitrust laws because it's "pro-competitive" and "expands choices for consumers."

Pash, citing the NFL's lucrative relationships with other networks, said it would be years before there would be any other major changes in how games are televised.

Lucrative indeed. Last year, the NFL completed deals with NBC Sports on a six-year, $3.6 billion deal to carry Sunday night games and with ESPN on an eight-year, $8.8 billion contract to televise "Monday Night Football." Two years ago, CBS and Fox extended their Sunday deals for six years, with CBS paying $622 million annually and Fox paying $712 million. DirecTV extended its contract for $3.5 billion over five years.

Bowlen likes the progress the upstart network has shown.

"I'm not at all unhappy with where the NFL Network is at right now," Bowlen said. "I am unhappy that some people won't get to see the game, but I don't think that's our fault."

007
11-23-2006, 02:45 AM
Bowlen sucks.

Bugeater
11-23-2006, 02:48 AM
"The NFL Network keeps the pressure on because it believes we will ultimately end up charging all our customers to satisfy the few who want these games," Fred Dressler, executive vice president of Time Warner Cable, told Sports Business News.
Well gee, you charge all your customers for Lifetime Television for Women to satisfy a few hens who want that crap too. What's the difference? I hate everybody involved in this bullshit.

Dammit Carl! :cuss:

007
11-23-2006, 02:50 AM
Well gee, you charge all your customers for Lifetime Television for Women to satisfy a few hens who want that crap too. What's the difference? I hate everybody involved in this bullshit.

Dammit Carl! :cuss:

don't forget Bravo and all those shopping channels too.

greg63
11-23-2006, 02:53 AM
Bowlen sucks.
Yup! He must subscribe to King Carl's ideology of what a "true fan" is.:banghead::mad::cuss:

tk13
11-23-2006, 02:57 AM
I think both sides have their points. And the NFL is so popular that you probably could compare it to something like Lifetime. The only thing I don't understand, is why the NFL network allows itself to be on a sports tier for some cable companies and not others. There's another Denver Post article on their website today about this, and it mentions how there was a Colorado cable company that reached an agreement with the NFL just in the last week or two so people could see the games. But it's on a different "tier" and you have to have digital cable to get it. I'm sure there's something I'm missing maybe, but why is the NFL allowing that then trying to stick it on basic with these other companies.

HemiEd
11-23-2006, 03:06 AM
This is gong to get interesting, I think the NFL may be getting a little too greedy.

That being said, they sure gave the Chiefs a lot of pub during primetime last night. It was a pleasure to watch but it had to make the Bronco fans sick.

Bugeater
11-23-2006, 03:18 AM
I think both sides have their points. And the NFL is so popular that you probably could compare it to something like Lifetime. The only thing I don't understand, is why the NFL network allows itself to be on a sports tier for some cable companies and not others. There's another Denver Post article on their website today about this, and it mentions how there was a Colorado cable company that reached an agreement with the NFL just in the last week or two so people could see the games. But it's on a different "tier" and you have to have digital cable to get it. I'm sure there's something I'm missing maybe, but why is the NFL allowing that then trying to stick it on basic with these other companies.
I don't know if any cable company carries it on basic cable. Only one of the two cable providers here has it, but only with the digital package. The other one doesn't offer it at all.

the Talking Can
11-23-2006, 05:19 AM
all i know is that one of the best games of the year won't be seen by most of the country....so **** all of them...none of them give a shit about the customer...

JBucc
11-23-2006, 05:20 AM
all i know is that one of the best games of the year won't be seen by most of the country....so **** all of them...none of them give a shit about the customer...Me too. I mean yeah.

Bob Dole
11-23-2006, 05:30 AM
"The NFL Network keeps the pressure on because it believes we will ultimately end up charging all our customers to satisfy the few who want these games," Fred Dressler, executive vice president of Time Warner Cable, told Sports Business News.

Bob Dole wonders where they get their "few" estimates.

And seriously... If it's really only 70 cents per subscriber per month, raise the damned rates for basic cable a dollar and pocket 30 cents per subscriber. Bob Dole doesn't think a whole lot of people are going to go to the hassle and expense of switching to satellite over a freaking dollar increase in their cable bill. Lord knows they've raised it more than a dollar while adding absolutely no value at points in the past.

JBucc
11-23-2006, 05:31 AM
Cable raises the shit every month anyway according to those DTV ads. What's another little raise in price so JBucc can see his NFL network?

the Talking Can
11-23-2006, 05:31 AM
Bob Dole wonders where they get their "few" estimates.

And seriously... If it's really only 70 cents per subscriber per month, raise the damned rates for basic cable a dollar and pocket 30 cents per subscriber. Bob Dole doesn't think a whole lot of people are going to go to the hassle and expense of switching to satellite over a freaking dollar increase in their cable bill. Lord knows they've raised it more than a dollar while adding absolutely no value at points in the past.

or just cut 70 cents worth of channels that no one watches....will they really miss the casserole channel?

JBucc
11-23-2006, 05:33 AM
They should just go PBS and have it paid for by public donations. There's be plenty of losers like us that would be willing to donate to the NFL do see Total Acces 10 times a day. Plus we'd get that cool "Paid for by viewers like you" message.

Crush
11-23-2006, 07:10 AM
They should just go PBS and have it paid for by public donations. There's be plenty of losers like us that would be willing to donate to the NFL do see Total Acces 10 times a day. Plus we'd get that cool "Paid for by viewers like you" message.

Rich Eisen: I wouldn't have a job if it wasn't for viewers like you.

Otter
11-23-2006, 08:14 AM
The NFL Network can shove it up their ass, they're not getting any more of my paycheck.

I've about had it with the ****ing Chiefs too. The weekend to go to the Steelers Game cost me about $500 only to watch them get the shit kicked out of them to the point where I couldn't even get into a good natured smack contest because the Steeler Fans felt sorry me.

And this will be what, the 16th ****ing year they can't compete with the rest of the NFL for a post-season appearence while the rest of the AFC West has seen Super Bowls recently and has a good chance represeting the AFC again this year.

**** it, between not being able to watch this game on Thanksgiving and the flacid penis organization at Arrowhead I'm about ****ing sick and tired of the NFL and the derlict, impotent team in Kansas City and the NFL trying to gouge me to watch them stomp on my hopes for aother decade.

**** 'em both.

:cuss: rant :cuss:

stevieray
11-23-2006, 08:41 AM
The NFL Network can shove it up their ass, they're not getting any more of my paycheck.

I've about had it with the ****ing Chiefs too. The weekend to go to the Steelers Game cost me about $500 only to watch them get the shit kicked out of them to the point where I couldn't even get into a good natured smack contest because the Steeler Fans felt sorry me.

And this will be what, the 16th ****ing year they can't compete with the rest of the NFL for a post-season appearence while the rest of the AFC West has seen Super Bowls recently and has a good chance represeting the AFC again this year.

**** it, between not being able to watch this game on Thanksgiving and the flacid penis organization at Arrowhead I'm about ****ing sick and tired of the NFL and the derlict, impotent team in Kansas City and the NFL trying to gouge me to watch them stomp on my hopes for aother decade.

**** 'em both.

:cuss: rant :cuss:

Happy Thanksgiving!

Simplex3
11-23-2006, 08:51 AM
What I want to know is what the f**k business is this of the govts? The free market will sort this out in it's own time. Either Time Warner will see an erosion its customer base or the NFL Network will find out they really aren't worth what they're asking. Hell, maybe we'll all find out that nobody gives a f**k about the NFL. Any way you slice it watching football games is hardly a necessity, meaning the feds should STFD and STFU. All they're going to do is pass more f**ked up laws which will only serve to f**k the only people without lobbiests in Washington DC: Us.

siberian khatru
11-23-2006, 08:57 AM
What I want to know is what the f**k business is this of the govts? The free market will sort this out in it's own time. Either Time Warner will see an erosion its customer base or the NFL Network will find out they really aren't worth what they're asking. Hell, maybe we'll all find out that nobody gives a f**k about the NFL. Any way you slice it watching football games is hardly a necessity, meaning the feds should STFD and STFU. All they're going to do is pass more f**ked up laws which will only serve to f**k the only people without lobbiests in Washington DC: Us.

Civics 101.

:thumb:

Simplex3
11-23-2006, 09:08 AM
Civics 101.

:thumb:
You'd think so, but we both know that 65% of the people in this country see the govt. solving the problem as a good thing.

htismaqe
11-23-2006, 10:12 AM
The NFL Network can shove it up their ass, they're not getting any more of my paycheck.

I've about had it with the ****ing Chiefs too. The weekend to go to the Steelers Game cost me about $500 only to watch them get the shit kicked out of them to the point where I couldn't even get into a good natured smack contest because the Steeler Fans felt sorry me.

And this will be what, the 16th ****ing year they can't compete with the rest of the NFL for a post-season appearence while the rest of the AFC West has seen Super Bowls recently and has a good chance represeting the AFC again this year.

**** it, between not being able to watch this game on Thanksgiving and the flacid penis organization at Arrowhead I'm about ****ing sick and tired of the NFL and the derlict, impotent team in Kansas City and the NFL trying to gouge me to watch them stomp on my hopes for aother decade.

**** 'em both.

:cuss: rant :cuss:

Can't compete? They're gonna make the playoffs.

AustinChief
11-23-2006, 11:05 AM
The NFL Network can shove it up their ass, they're not getting any more of my paycheck.

I've about had it with the ****ing Chiefs too. The weekend to go to the Steelers Game cost me about $500 only to watch them get the shit kicked out of them to the point where I couldn't even get into a good natured smack contest because the Steeler Fans felt sorry me.

And this will be what, the 16th ****ing year they can't compete with the rest of the NFL for a post-season appearence while the rest of the AFC West has seen Super Bowls recently and has a good chance represeting the AFC again this year.

**** it, between not being able to watch this game on Thanksgiving and the flacid penis organization at Arrowhead I'm about ****ing sick and tired of the NFL and the derlict, impotent team in Kansas City and the NFL trying to gouge me to watch them stomp on my hopes for aother decade.

**** 'em both.

:cuss: rant :cuss:

Lighten up, Francis

milkman
11-23-2006, 11:14 AM
You'd think so, but we both know that 65% of the people in this country see the govt. solving the problem as a good thing.

Wait.

Are you telling me the politicians that said they could solve my problems were lying to me? :cuss:

Bob Dole
11-23-2006, 11:19 AM
What I want to know is what the f**k business is this of the govts? The free market will sort this out in it's own time. Either Time Warner will see an erosion its customer base or the NFL Network will find out they really aren't worth what they're asking. Hell, maybe we'll all find out that nobody gives a f**k about the NFL. Any way you slice it watching football games is hardly a necessity, meaning the feds should STFD and STFU. All they're going to do is pass more f**ked up laws which will only serve to f**k the only people without lobbiests in Washington DC: Us.

The issue was whether there was some sort of violation of anti-trust laws and the NFL's exemption.

Transcripts of all the testimony is available on one of the .gov sites. Bob Dole read the NFL statement and part of the cable counterpoint before he fell asleep and his head smashing onto the laptop crashed the PC.

elvomito
11-23-2006, 11:56 AM
Buck Fat Powlen!
No wonder they're having problems with this deal... Anything the donks touch seems to be embroiled in some form of unethical behaviour
I wonder how much he will personally make off the deals he completes for the NFL

Lzen
11-23-2006, 12:19 PM
Well gee, you charge all your customers for Lifetime Television for Women to satisfy a few hens who want that crap too. What's the difference? I hate everybody involved in this bullshit.

Dammit Carl! :cuss:

No doubt. Or all those stupid shopping channels. Or Spanish network. I could go on and on about this. Good reason for a la carte programming. I'm just glad I don't have cable.

Anyong Bluth
11-23-2006, 12:46 PM
I'm pretty sure the reason they are holding ground on the basic cable channel with Time Warner and Comcast is b/c they each hold right around 30% of the total cable subscribers in the US. That would make for roughly 60% of the total cable subscribers, and 100% of the satellite subscribers. Ideal coverage for the NFL and puts even more pressure on the smaller cable providers to follow suit of what everyone else is doing.

I think roughly 90% of American homes subscribe to either cable or satellite. There are roughly (I think I just read it somewhere), 151 million total TV homes in America.

If you throw in the other smaller cable companies they have agreed to a deal with, you get probably somewhere around 80-85% of cable + 100% of satellite in 90% of American homes. That would be the sort of penetration the NFL is hoping for and given its short lifespan, pretty amazing.

Sorry, but the same reason you love the NFL, and the reason it has the best product of any sport is b/c they have people that know what the f*ck they are doing.

You can be angry at the NFL for forcing cable companies hand, but cable is really looking to use this as a way of getting that extra $ so people can pay for a sports tier that many won't pay for otherwise.

BTW, DirecTV’s sports package is amazing though. I had DTV for 3 years and when I moved in Aug, I ended up with Comcast. Its not that great, Time Warner has a much better product I feel. I miss Tivo on DTV the most, b/c its DVR service is leaps and bounds better than anything else. Too bad DTV and Tivo parted ways. I wonder how long Tivo holds out before it’s not acquired by someone?

BWillie
11-23-2006, 02:29 PM
I don't see why satellite, cable, and TV providers don't come up with more customized packing. For me, I have dish network, and I have a bunch of channels I don't want but have to pay for. When I had cable, the same deal, it's either basic cable which was cheap but had no ESPN or it was the complex full cable package which was 6x as much.

How about this. Local channels, ESPN, ESPN2, ESPNNEWS, NFL NETWORK, CNN.

That is all I need, thats it. Make it happen

Demonpenz
11-23-2006, 03:07 PM
I am pretty sure I will take it up the ass until there is another entertainment solution that gets my blood flowing, gets me daydreaming, gets my adreniline flowing like hearing back and black as the sea of red erupts during the start of the game. People stomping banging anything even their dad's bald head just to see the chiefs come out and stomp a mudhole in some mother ****in ass. It's what I think about all day as a diversion to war, bitches, snitches, and idiot mother ****ers. GO CHIEFS

Mecca
11-23-2006, 03:31 PM
I don't see why satellite, cable, and TV providers don't come up with more customized packing. For me, I have dish network, and I have a bunch of channels I don't want but have to pay for. When I had cable, the same deal, it's either basic cable which was cheap but had no ESPN or it was the complex full cable package which was 6x as much.

How about this. Local channels, ESPN, ESPN2, ESPNNEWS, NFL NETWORK, CNN.

That is all I need, thats it. Make it happen

Because it the end you'd get ****ed over that's why.......for a cable company to show say ESPN, ABC will make them take all their other stations like say ABC family, that's just how it works all TV networks do this.

FringeNC
11-23-2006, 03:42 PM
It's tough to side with the NFL. The cable companies are willing to pay the 70 cents per subscriber per month if it's on the sports packages, but the NFL wants it on basic cable. To all those that say the cable companies can just pass costs on, why don't they just jack their prices up every month? There is some max. amount they can charge that max. profits, and presumably, they are already charging that price.

Obviously, all of us we be willing to pay 70 cents per month for the NFL Network, but many non-sports fans would not. Many on here would be pissed if they had to pay extra money per month for gay porn or arts and crafts channels they never watched.

Simply, the cable companies don't think they can pass that 70 cents on, or they'd do it.

KChiefs1
11-23-2006, 05:46 PM
I'd love a satellite or cable systems that charges you for the channels you only use....there are about 200 channels I don't even look at but I'm paying for....

2bikemike
11-23-2006, 06:43 PM
It's tough to side with the NFL. The cable companies are willing to pay the 70 cents per subscriber per month if it's on the sports packages, but the NFL wants it on basic cable. To all those that say the cable companies can just pass costs on, why don't they just jack their prices up every month? There is some max. amount they can charge that max. profits, and presumably, they are already charging that price.

Obviously, all of us we be willing to pay 70 cents per month for the NFL Network, but many non-sports fans would not. Many on here would be pissed if they had to pay extra money per month for gay porn or arts and crafts channels they never watched.

Simply, the cable companies don't think they can pass that 70 cents on, or they'd do it.

If I understand it correctly the cable companies want to charge more than the 70 cents. By putting it on a sports tier cafeteria style programming. Meaning you would get several channels including NFLN but then the price would be like 10 bucks or something. NFLN does not approve of this formatting. The fans end up paying more.