ADAM TEICHER-Passing now passé [Archive]

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C-Mac

11-25-2006, 11:47 AM

Passing now passé
Chiefs content to stick with the running game, a plan of attack that has proved to be successful.

By ADAM TEICHER
The Kansas City Star

Trent Green in the last two weeks has thrown a total of 38 passes, which in the old days wouldn’t have been worth getting out of bed for. That used to represent one good day of work.

It’s becoming the way of life for Chiefs quarterbacks. The Chiefs tried 22 or fewer passes in three of the last four games.

Green will get used to it because coach Herm Edwards indicated the offense is operating exactly as he desires. If fans want to see passes, he has some advice: Watch when the opponent has the ball.

“People just like to see passes,” Edwards said Friday. “People like to see the quarterback drop back and throw passes. Well, they did (against Denver). They saw Jake (Plummer) go back and throw 39 times. They got their passes.

“We’re going to try to run the football. I believe in running, and I believe when you say you’re a physical team, you have to run the ball. Two things always come to mind: You throw passes to score, and you run to win. That’s always been my mind-set.”

The bigger issue for the Chiefs is that fewer passes apparently mean fewer points. They were on a run of three straight 30-point games until they went to Miami three weeks ago.

The Chiefs haven’t scored more than 20 points since, including Thursday night’s 19-10 win against Denver at Arrowhead Stadium. They still won two of the three, but they’ve been playing against offensively challenged teams.

The Dolphins and Raiders are among the NFL’s lowest-scoring teams, and the Broncos aren’t much better.

The Chiefs face yet another offensive patsy a week from Sunday when they play the Browns in Cleveland. But they figure to need some points in the subsequent games against the Ravens and Chargers. San Diego leads the league in scoring, and the Ravens are 12th.

The Chiefs kicked four field goals against the Broncos. All happened after the Chiefs ventured inside the Denver 20.

“We were in the red zone five times, and we only scored one touchdown,” Edwards said. “If we score three touchdowns in the red zone instead of kicking, you’re not even asking these questions. It’s the same amount of passes, but we’re just not scoring touchdowns.

“We left some points on the field.”

Edwards’ point, that the number of passes doesn’t always equate to scoring, is a good one. The Chiefs threw just 15 passes in an early November game against St. Louis but still won 31-17.

But they also forced three early turnovers that day, something they won’t always be able to count on.

Green had his share of big statistical games the last few seasons, so the new style of play is an adjustment.

“If we can win games and the defense plays better and we run the ball and throw for 100 yards a game, I’m fine with that,” Green said. “That’s one of the things I’ve been up front about.”

Another issue for the Chiefs is the stamina of Larry Johnson. He has yet to show any signs of strain under his tremendous workload, but that figures to come sometime.

Johnson, the NFL’s leading rusher, has played one more game than most of the other top runners. With 282 carries, he has 60 more than the second-busiest runner, Arizona’s Edgerrin James.

Johnson is on pace for 410 carries, which would tie the NFL record set by Atlanta’s Jamal Anderson in 1998.

“I’m not going to wear him out,” Edwards said. “That’s what good runners want. They want the ball. Larry Johnson is not hurting. Larry Johnson is going to carry the football. We’re just playing the game. If you’re getting 5 yards a run, why wouldn’t you continue to run? Why would I sit there and say, ‘I’ve got to throw passes’? I’ll throw passes when it’s time to throw passes.

“It’s not like he’s walking around here saying he’s carrying the ball too much. He’s carrying the ball 30 times a game. Big deal.”

The Chiefs have tried to use Johnson’s backup, Michael Bennett, more recently. Bennett has played better of late, but the Chiefs are still addicted to Johnson, particularly in close games.

“He’s allowed himself to really show people he’s not just a power runner,” Edwards said. “He does have cutback ability, and he can make you miss in (the open field). He’s more than a power runner. He’s an all-round runner.

“He needs to be able to do that for his own sake because you can’t just run over everybody. As runners get older and run the ball more, they understand that. He’s using the arsenal even more.

“There are plays that are designed where he’s going to have to make a guy miss because you can’t always block them all all the time. He can do that. He doesn’t have to run over everybody like people think. He has a choice. At times he can get the tough yardage. At times he can jump cut and stop and make the guy miss and make a big play that way.”

htismaqe

11-25-2006, 12:54 PM

It’s the same amount of passes, but we’re just not scoring touchdowns.

Good to see that Coach knows what the real problem is. Hopefully they can address it.

KCJohnny

11-25-2006, 01:08 PM

The bigger issue for the Chiefs is that fewer passes apparently mean fewer points. They were on a run of three straight 30-point games until they went to Miami three weeks ago.

The Chiefs haven’t scored more than 20 points since, including Thursday night’s 19-10 win against Denver at Arrowhead Stadium. They still won two of the three, but they’ve been playing against offensively challenged teams.

The Dolphins and Raiders are among the NFL’s lowest-scoring teams, and the Broncos aren’t much better.
Let's not pat ourselves on the back too much. We haven't exactly faced offensive juggernauts the past 3 games, and we were lucky to esape 1-1 after playing a 2-6 and a 2-7 team. Its only a matter of time before we will need points. We all went through this in the 1990s, and some people really blew their cool over it...

Marty'sManWhore

11-25-2006, 01:31 PM

Let's not pat ourselves on the back too much. We haven't exactly faced offensive juggernauts the past 3 games, and we were lucky to esape 1-1 after playing a 2-6 and a 2-7 team. Its only a matter of time before we will need points. We all went through this in the 1990s, and some people really blew their cool over it...Herm's no Marty. And Larry Johnson's no Donnell Bennett. We'd be 11-0 if Marty was here. He was a genious.

Cute, too.

[/sigh]

cdcox

11-25-2006, 01:38 PM

It's amazing that we were able to score lots of points when we were going against good offenses and didn't score as many when we were facing low-scoring teams with strong, opportunistic defenses. It's almost like we GAME PLANNED IT THAT WAY.

milkman

11-25-2006, 02:19 PM

As far as I'm concerned, the only real difference between this team, and the '05 edition is the changeover in personell due to retirement and injury.

The Cheifs were running the ball alot in '05, and still scoring alot of points.

As Parker has tried to point out, execution has been the issue, and that is the result of the personnell changes.

Hammock Parties

11-25-2006, 02:27 PM

I also think we've only thrown it 38 times the last two weeks because we're slowly working Trent back into the swing of things. I bet we see close to 30 passes against the Browns.

dirk digler

11-25-2006, 02:38 PM

I also think we've only thrown it 38 times the last two weeks because we're slowly working Trent back into the swing of things. I bet we see close to 30 passes against the Browns.

I agree about working Trent back into the game I just think we need to be a little more creative offensively. I would love to see on the first play of the game a play action pass for 50-60 yds because almost every damn game we run LJ up the middle.

Hammock Parties

11-25-2006, 02:39 PM

I agree about working Trent back into the game I just think we need to be a little more creative offensively. I would love to see on the first play of the game a play action pass for 50-60 yds because almost every damn game we run LJ up the middle.

We actually threw it on Thursday, which was refreshing to see, but overall I am still pissed about the lack of play action.

dirk digler

11-25-2006, 02:42 PM

We actually threw it on Thursday, which was refreshing to see, but overall I am still pissed about the lack of play action.

Yep I was happy to see that they threw on first down and IMO we need to do that more often. Getting 4+ yards on first down is huge.

htismaqe

11-25-2006, 03:46 PM

Yep I was happy to see that they threw on first down and IMO we need to do that more often. Getting 4+ yards on first down is huge.

Getting 4+ yards on first down is huge. And if you can get it running the ball, there's no reason to pass. 2nd down is the playaction down.

They did it once on 2nd and 1 Thursday night, I'd like to see it more -- going for 6 on one play.

htismaqe

11-25-2006, 03:47 PM

We actually threw it on Thursday, which was refreshing to see, but overall I am still pissed about the lack of play action.

We'll see more playaction. Playaction passes take longer to develop than normal pass plays and we're working in a guy that almost had his career ended...

Reerun_KC

11-25-2006, 04:08 PM

We'll see more playaction. Playaction passes take longer to develop than normal pass plays and we're working in a guy that almost had his career ended...

But when you are averaging 5.4 ypc.. Herm will not put the ball in the air. He even said that on the post game interview.

I think the Chiefs need to get Bennett more involved...

4 touches 96 yards....

FloridaMan88

11-25-2006, 04:51 PM

Good to see that Coach knows what the real problem is. Hopefully they can address it.

Herm says that you pass to score then laments that the Chiefs aren't converting those red-zone trips into TDs.

Maybe if the Chiefs mixed up their playcalling more in the red-zone and utilized some playaction passes on first and second down they wouldn't be so predictable and stagnant inside the 20.

Deberg_1990

11-25-2006, 05:16 PM

Reerun_KC

11-25-2006, 05:33 PM

This is the exact same formula that was successful for Marty and been pretty good to a guy named Bill Cowher as well. Sure, its not flashy, at times can be boring, but its a proven formula that will win you alot of games:

Control the clock with power running

Play strong defense and give your D a rest with long clock eating drives.

Play the field position game with strong special teams

Dont kill yourself with dumb penalties.

You will never be out of any game if you play that game.

I loved the DV/Saunders offense as much as anyone, but truth is, it just wasnt very successful here.

I agree with everything you said, but if you are considering Post season victories and championships... Well that formula hasnt worked well in KC or anywhere else Marty has coached.

I think Cowher caught lightening in a bottle.. Martyball wont win you alot of championships. Its Sad to say. But you have to take chances and risks along the way. Think outside the box to win it all, Probably the reason Cowher finally won one..

Easy 6

11-25-2006, 05:36 PM

This is the exact same formula that was successful for Marty and been pretty good to a guy named Bill Cowher as well. Sure, its not flashy, at times can be boring, but its a proven formula that will win you alot of games:

Control the clock with power running

Play strong defense and give your D a rest with long clock eating drives.

Play the field position game with strong special teams

Dont kill yourself with dumb penalties.

You will never be out of any game if you play that game.

I loved the DV/Saunders offense as much as anyone, but truth is, it just wasnt very successful here.

I hate nailbiters but i hate losses even more, this style is working.

I disagree with DV/S assessment though, i thought it was prolific?

CoMoChief

11-25-2006, 06:05 PM

I also think we've only thrown it 38 times the last two weeks because we're slowly working Trent back into the swing of things. I bet we see close to 30 passes against the Browns.

We dont need to slowly work him back. He's been healthy for numerous weeks now. Trent can run this offense in his sleep and probably knows it better than Solari.

Deberg_1990

11-25-2006, 06:35 PM

Martyball wont win you alot of championships. Its Sad to say. But you have to take chances and risks along the way. Think outside the box to win it all, Probably the reason Cowher finally won one..

I agree. You can play Martyball to get to the playoffs, but you have to take a few chances once it gets to crunch time. I think Cowher as a few more balls than Marty. Thats probably why hes been to 2 Super Bowls and Marty is still waiting on his chance.

keg in kc

11-25-2006, 06:52 PM

We dont need to slowly work him back. He's been healthy for numerous weeks now. Trent can run this offense in his sleep and probably knows it better than Solari.It's not about being cleared to play or how well he knows the playbook. It's about being mechanically (and mentally) sound, which he clearly was not against Jokeland and Dungver, missing open receivers, throwing gopherballs, etc. Although I think it's as much execution and map of the game, rather than playcalling, it does seem to me the plan might have been to start out slowly against what amounts to a series of teams without potent offenses, and then gradually amp things up in time to play San Diego in three weeks, when we may have to score points.

In fact, looking at the schedule, I wouldn't be shocked to see the reigns in for 4 of the last 5 games, then come out firing should we make the playoffs. Because we don't really play anyone potent other than the Bolts. Baltimore and Jax are 10th/11th in scoring, but they only score 21-22 ppg, and then Cleveland and Oakland are 25 and last.

Not that this is necessarily what I'd do. Since we play three road teams, I'd like to see us coming out hot and scoring early, taking the crowd out of that.

'course, if we're averaging 5 yards a carry, we could do it that way, too, and go the route of long, demoralizing drives, rather than quick scores and a shootout.

Whatever wins works for me.

Calcountry

11-25-2006, 07:06 PM

Getting 4+ yards on first down is huge. And if you can get it running the ball, there's no reason to pass. 2nd down is the playaction down.

They did it once on 2nd and 1 Thursday night, I'd like to see it more -- going for 6 on one play.I would like to see more first down strikes into the end zone, once we have established a first down inside the 15 yard line.

Hammock Parties

11-25-2006, 07:14 PM

I would like to see more first down strikes into the end zone, once we have established a first down inside the 15 yard line.

That's EXACTLY what I want to see. Go PA and try to hit Gonzo down the seam in the end zone.

C-Mac

11-25-2006, 07:31 PM

Herm says that you pass to score then laments that the Chiefs aren't converting those red-zone trips into TDs.

Maybe if the Chiefs mixed up their playcalling more in the red-zone and utilized some playaction passes on first and second down they wouldn't be so predictable and stagnant inside the 20.

They tried that in Miami, first and goal and threw 3 straight times because the first 2 passes were incomplete, came out with a FG. The next time they were first and goal they kept running LJ up the gut and finally scored at TD. IMO the passing in the redzone against that D, cost them the game.

htismaqe

11-25-2006, 07:48 PM

htismaqe

11-25-2006, 07:48 PM

I agree with everything you said, but if you are considering Post season victories and championships... Well that formula hasnt worked well in KC or anywhere else Marty has coached.

I think Cowher caught lightening in a bottle.. Martyball wont win you alot of championships. Its Sad to say. But you have to take chances and risks along the way. Think outside the box to win it all, Probably the reason Cowher finally won one..

Well, it's a good thing we're not playing MartyBall.

Smashmouth footbal <> Martyball

htismaqe

11-25-2006, 07:49 PM

That's EXACTLY what I want to see. Go PA and try to hit Gonzo down the seam in the end zone.

We ran that EXACT play to Jason Dunn against Denver. And Green hit the defenseman in the BACK.

htismaqe

11-25-2006, 07:50 PM

They tried that in Miami, first and goal and threw 3 straight times because the first 2 passes were incomplete, came out with a FG. The next time they were first and goal they kept running LJ up the gut and finally scored at TD. IMO the passing in the redzone against that D, cost them the game.

Same thing happened against Denver.

The one possession where we passed on first and 2nd down we had a sack and a QB scramble because we almost gave up a 2nd sack.

The only possession (besides the last one) where we ran 5 times and passed only once we scored our one TD of the night.

Hammock Parties

11-25-2006, 07:51 PM

We ran that EXACT play to Jason Dunn against Denver. And Green hit the defenseman in the BACK.

Good point! Dammit Green!

htismaqe

11-25-2006, 07:52 PM

Good point! Dammit Green!

I'm gonna keep saying it until people wake up.

The playcalling, while it could improve slightly, is not the problem.

Execution is.

C-Mac

11-25-2006, 08:10 PM

Need to keep in mind that the last 3 weeks have been against very stout top 10 defenses.

Reerun_KC

11-25-2006, 08:20 PM

I'm gonna keep saying it until people wake up.

The playcalling, while it could improve slightly, is not the problem.

Execution is.

Hey Homegrown, I think I will reserve judgement on the playcalling until the playoffs, if we get to the playoffs.

Execution is bad at times true, but there are times you can see that they are trying to NOT commit an error and take the 3 points....

But hey they are winning, how can you bitch?

FAX

11-25-2006, 08:23 PM

What the heck is wrong with going deep once in a while?

That's what I want to know.

FAX

RealSNR

11-25-2006, 08:27 PM

We ran that EXACT play to Jason Dunn against Denver. And Green hit the defenseman in the BACK.Jason Dunn has iffy hands. I don't even know if he would have caught it if the ball were thrown perfectly.

RealSNR

11-25-2006, 08:31 PM

Hey Homegrown, I think I will reserve judgement on the playcalling until the playoffs, if we get to the playoffs.

Execution is bad at times true, but there are times you can see that they are trying to NOT commit an error and take the 3 points....

But hey they are winning, how can you bitch?Your and idiot.

ChiefsLV

11-25-2006, 08:31 PM

It's all fun and good now, but when we need to score points in the playoffs, we better be able to score them. Yes I said playoffs.

Playcalling around the goal-line isn't creative enough. 1st down, run up the gut, second down up the gut, third down, swing pass to the RB.

Crush

11-25-2006, 08:34 PM

Yes, the offense is more conservative. So what? We're keeping our defense off the field and fresh. I would rather score 19 a game and only allow 7 than score 38 and give up 42.

Reerun_KC

11-25-2006, 08:47 PM

Your and idiot.

Thanks dude....

Reerun_KC

11-25-2006, 08:48 PM

Yes, the offense is more conservative. So what? We're keeping our defense off the field and fresh. I would rather score 19 a game and only allow 7 than score 38 and give up 42.

Good Point...

But it would be nice to maybe win one here soon by 14 points or more. I dont think my Grandpa's heart can take much more of this 13-10 stuff...

milkman

11-25-2006, 11:52 PM

Well, it's a good thing we're not playing MartyBall.

Smashmouth footbal <> Martyball

What exactly does <> mean?

milkman

11-25-2006, 11:57 PM

I'm gonna keep saying it until people wake up.

The playcalling, while it could improve slightly, is not the problem.

Execution is.

I agree.
As I said in another thread, this offense looks very almost exactly like the offense we ran over the last 9 games of last season.

The difference is personnel turnover as the resultof retirement and injury.

There isn't any reason this offense, as is, when healthy and in sync, can't put up 30 points in a game, and control TOP.

dirk digler

11-26-2006, 12:07 AM

Getting 4+ yards on first down is huge. And if you can get it running the ball, there's no reason to pass. 2nd down is the playaction down.

They did it once on 2nd and 1 Thursday night, I'd like to see it more -- going for 6 on one play.

Actually if you listen to Len Dawson he will say during the broadcast that 1st down is the easiest down to pass the ball because the D is usually focused on you running and that 1st down is play action down.

I went back and looked so far this season we have only passed twice on our 1st play during the 1st series. So defenses are keying on our running game which in theory should open up our passing game.

cdcox

11-26-2006, 12:08 AM

What exactly does <> mean?

computer geek for "not equal to"

milkman

11-26-2006, 12:11 AM

computer geek for "not equal to"

In that case, I agree with Parker 100%.

mississippichiefan

11-26-2006, 12:52 AM

Halfcan

11-26-2006, 02:30 AM

I say let LJ run and quit crying that he is getting too many carries. LJ would love to break Andersons record.

Mecca

11-26-2006, 02:33 AM

I say let LJ run and quit crying that he is getting too many carries. LJ would love to break Andersons record.

Yea but what if his career is over the next year.......like Andersons, would you love that?

Halfcan

11-26-2006, 02:44 AM

If an injury is going to happen, it will regaurdless if you try to play it safe. This might be the last year for several Chiefs-I doubt they want to save it. We have been saving it up for a long time-the Playoff drought will end this year-rideing LJ all the way.

luv

11-26-2006, 02:46 AM

Bennett really showed some game Thursday. I think he's a great compliment to LJ. Either way, if rushing works, if rushing wins, then rush.