Time to remove 'Mid-Major' from College BBall [Archive]

View Full Version : Time to remove 'Mid-Major' from College BBall

StcChief

03-23-2007, 11:11 AM

I think the time has come.

http://kansas-basketball.aolsportsblog.com/2007/03/22/i-move-to-strike-mid-major-from-b-ball-lexicon/

I Move to Strike 'Mid-Major' from B-Ball Lexicon

Posted Mar 22nd 2007 9:57PM by Ryan Ferguson
Filed under: Kansas Basketball, Texas A&M Basketball, Memphis Basketball, Big 12 Basketball, Mid-Majors Basketball, March Madness, NCAA Basketball Fans
It's 9:20PM ET on Thursday. I just watched Southern Illinois give 1-seed Kansas every last ounce they could handle. The Salukis traded leads with Kansas throughout, controlling the pace and slowing the game down to a speed of their liking. Neither team had a significant edge over the other until the final seconds, when Kansas made a big play and Southern Illinois didn't. It was a decidedly partisan Kansas crowd -- Jayhawk fans travel well -- so it'd be a stretch to say the HP Pavilion in San Jose was a neutral court. In the end, that could've been the difference. It's always harder to win in a hostile environment, right? These teams scratched and clawed at each other until one finally squeaked out a win.

Talent? Athleticism? Grit? Hustle? I fail to see the difference between these two teams. They're equals. Early in the season, during our weekly AOL FanHouse Blogpoll, I openly questioned the inclusion of Butler and Southern Illinois in the Power 16. Sure, they beat a few good teams, but look at who they play in their respective conferences! "This will get sorted out early in the tournament," I thought.

I was wrong. In fact, I'd go so far as to say I was an idiot for thinking that. Look who made the Sweet 16: UNLV, Southern Illinois, Butler and Memphis. 4 teams... more than any single 'power conference' managed to get in there.

It's time for the college basketball establishment to accept the fact that the so-called 'parity' of modern college basketball is here to stay. Where once the gap was huge, it is now tiny. Miniscule. Almost nonexistent. Kansas is a big money program with a multi-million dollar man running the show. Their home arena, Allen Fieldhouse, is a college basketball shrine. Rock, Chalk, Jayhawk, KU.

Guess what the Salukis, the Bulldogs, and the Runnin' Rebels with their coupla-hundred grand coaches think of their "big brothers'" fancypants tradition and history? Maybe they don't have a cool Gregorian-style chant, but they can sure ball.

And now that I'm finishing up, Conference USA rep Memphis just dispatched one of the Big XII's best teams, Texas A&M, in San Antonio.

It's definitely time to strike the term 'mid-major' from the college basketball lexicon for good.

Saulbadguy

03-23-2007, 11:12 AM

Naw.

Dr. Johnny Fever

03-23-2007, 11:17 AM

Am I wrong that mid-major just refers to the size of the schools in the conference?

Saulbadguy

03-23-2007, 11:21 AM

Am I wrong that mid-major just refers to the size of the schools in the conference?
yes

WilliamTheIrish

03-23-2007, 11:21 AM

Isn't this the KU AOL blogger that claimed Bill Walker (allegedly) 'raped a chick on campus'?

WilliamTheIrish

03-23-2007, 11:22 AM

Am I wrong that mid-major just refers to the size of the schools in the conference?

Incorrect. Remember George Mason U from last year? Has 35k enrolled.

Eleazar

03-23-2007, 11:23 AM

I wonder if we'd be reading this article had SIU won the game.

Saulbadguy

03-23-2007, 11:24 AM

Isn't this the KU AOL blogger that claimed Bill Walker (allegedly) 'raped a chick on campus'?
no

Dr. Johnny Fever

03-23-2007, 11:24 AM

Incorrect. Remember George Mason U from last year? Has 35k enrolled.
Ah... ok. Then maybe the guy has a bit of a point. Thanks.

Saulbadguy

03-23-2007, 11:24 AM

I wonder if we'd be reading this article had SIU won the game.
no

Bearcat

03-23-2007, 11:30 AM

Talent? Athleticism? Grit? Hustle? I fail to see the difference between these two teams.

There's still a difference... if the little guy is good enough defensively, he has a chance to keep it close and win, whether it's a goalie, pitcher, or a bunch of thugs (j/k). I'd still put the talent and athleticism on KU's part and the grit and hustle for SIU.

4 teams... more than any single 'power conference' managed to get in there.

Uh, yeah... :spock:

It's time for the college basketball establishment to accept the fact that the so-called 'parity' of modern college basketball is here to stay. Where once the gap was huge, it is now tiny. Miniscule. Almost nonexistent.

I don't know if it's almost nonexistent.. it's still only 4 teams out of all those others that "deserved" to be there, and 3 of them have been known mid-majors for a while (and I didn't know UNLV was considered one?).

Until they start consistently winning Sweet Sixteen/Elite Eight games with the big boys, they are still mid-majors.

Bearcat

03-23-2007, 11:30 AM

Am I wrong that mid-major just refers to the size of the schools in the conference?

Enrollment challenged?

StcChief

03-23-2007, 11:34 AM

Incorrect. Remember George Mason U from last year? Has 35k enrolled.

So if school size is the issue...

SIU Carbondale has ~19K. with SIU-E ~9K

If your a division I school. let's just leave it at that.

BigCatDaddy

03-23-2007, 11:37 AM

Sounds like this guy is trying to cover KU's butt when they get beat by Winnetonka State, or whoever in the tournament, such as in years past.

sedated

03-23-2007, 11:47 AM

4 teams... more than any single 'power conference' managed to get in there.

here's the stupid stat of the day.

hmm, lets compare 6 conferences individually to all other conferences combined.

teedubya

03-23-2007, 11:49 AM

its time to get rid of stcchief and other bitter idiot losers from the message board.

Eleazar

03-23-2007, 11:50 AM

no

I didn't think so either.

alnorth

03-23-2007, 12:07 PM

This article was pretty useless. I want the last minute of my life back.

teedubya

03-23-2007, 12:09 PM

looked like a blog entry to me.

Saulbadguy

03-23-2007, 12:11 PM

looked like a blog entry to me.
An AOL users blog, at that.

We all know how bright AOL users are.

StcChief

03-23-2007, 12:14 PM

its time to get rid of stcchief and other bitter idiot losers from the message board.
What grounds/I've broken what rules here.

I've seen worse after the Chiefs get a screw job....

WilliamTheIrish

03-23-2007, 12:19 PM

What grounds/I've broken what rules here.

I've seen worse after the Chiefs get a screw job....

Ari is just being a pest.

Garcia Bronco

03-23-2007, 12:47 PM

How many times could SI beat Kan in 10 games? 2? 3?

mikeyis4dcats.

03-23-2007, 01:40 PM

How many times could SI beat Kan in 10 games? 2? 3?

I would think the record would be closer to even. They are a scrappy, physical team, and that bothers KU.

Silock

03-23-2007, 01:42 PM

here's the stupid stat of the day.

hmm, lets compare 6 conferences individually to all other conferences combined.

No kidding.

StcChief

03-23-2007, 01:42 PM

How many times could SI beat Kan in 10 games? 2? 3?
Is this a best of 3/7 I didn't realize that. how many days off between games?

The picture posting in the other thread.... you would think KU lost? :)
whining over NON Calls...

I'm not sure these "first rounder NBA" players on KU will make it there.

Lzen

03-23-2007, 01:51 PM

Is this a best of 3/7 I didn't realize that. how many days off between games?

The picture posting in the other thread.... you would think KU lost? :)
whining over NON Calls...

I'm not sure these "first rounder NBA" players on KU will make it there.

Ha ha ha. KU fans were merely pointing out idiocy of the claim that the officials gave the game to KU. We gave evidence of all of SIU's overly physical (that's about as nicely as I can put it) play.

Lzen

03-23-2007, 01:52 PM

Sounds like this guy is trying to cover KU's butt when they get beat by Winnetonka State, or whoever in the tournament, such as in years past.

Wow, you're still hanging onto that nonsense, eh? Congrats on your purple kitties NIT wi.......errrrrr......nevermind.

Baby Lee

03-23-2007, 01:57 PM

I'm not sure these "first rounder NBA" players on KU will make it there.
We get it, the Salukis suck, and if KU can only beat them by 3, they don't deserve to be in the tourney.

teedubya

03-23-2007, 02:07 PM

Hi, Im nf_ndmdmm/siucbagrad/StcChief

http://www.sallyminker.com/art/2-d/images/grapes-print.jpg

Baby Lee

03-23-2007, 02:18 PM

I'm amazed at the effort last night and all season. This team will be remembered as one of the greats in Saluki history.
That lost to a suckass underachieving, disappointing KU team. Kind of puts it in perspective.

ChiefaRoo

03-23-2007, 02:29 PM

its time to get rid of stcchief and other bitter idiot losers from the message board.

What the fook are you babbling about? You win the game and now want to ban people for expressing their opposing opinion about it how it all went down? Why don't you go blow the moderators on Phog.net and never come back. That way you can live in your KU bubble 24/7/365. Pussy.

StcChief

03-23-2007, 02:46 PM

What the fook are you babbling about? You win the game and now want to ban people for expressing their opposing opinion about it how it all went down? Why don't you go blow the moderators on Phog.net and never come back. That way you can live in your KU bubble 24/7/365. Pussy. :clap: :clap:

Opinions are like a$$h0les everyone has one, they all stink.
I'm just pissed at how we lost. :banghead:

VAChief

03-23-2007, 03:20 PM

One of the last place teams in the Valley (Indiana State) beat Purdue and Butler...two tournament teams...whether BCS backers want to admit it or not, the truth is there is a shrinking difference between the competition level of the good "mid majors" MVC, CAA, MWC, etc...

The Big Ten sent 12 teams to the dance the last two years...one to the Sweet 16... the Valley sent 6 teams to the dance...3 made it to the Sweet 16...I would argue one of the reasons that we are seeing fewer upsets this year is that fewer of the at larges came from non-BCS conferences...the 6th and 7th place teams rarely fare very well...

I'm not saying there isn't still a difference, just that it isn't what it was 20 years ago...the days of a Ewing staying for four years (or even attending college) are in the past...the remaining pool of players for all of D1 is much more even

Dr. Johnny Fever

03-23-2007, 03:26 PM

Is this a best of 3/7 I didn't realize that. how many days off between games?

The picture posting in the other thread.... you would think KU lost? :)
whining over NON Calls...

I'm not sure these "first rounder NBA" players on KU will make it there.
Surely you're bright enough to know that people provided those pictures as evidence that KU wasn't the only team to benefit from bad/no calls like the hater crowd seemed to think.

Dr. Johnny Fever

03-23-2007, 03:28 PM

That lost to a suckass underachieving, disappointing KU team. Kind of puts it in perspective.
How exactly is KU a suckass, underachieving, dissapointing team?

Baby Lee

03-23-2007, 03:32 PM

How exactly is KU a suckass, underachieving, dissapointing team?
I was channeling StcChief.

It appears that he's simultaneously arguing;
KU was unimpressive,
The SIU team that played last night was one of the best in it's history, and
'all those' KU fans thinking KU is a superior organization is ill-founded hubris.

And I'm trying to reconcile these arguments with the score last night.

kstater

03-23-2007, 03:33 PM

Could the 4th or 5th best team in these "mid-majors" compete with the top team in power conferences or even the 4th or 5th best team in the power conferences? If not then they are "mid-majors." Just cause a conference has one decent school doesn't hold water with the rest of the conference.
Just my 2 cents.

Mr. Laz

03-23-2007, 03:55 PM

thread started by a fan of a mid-major

ROFL

StcChief

03-23-2007, 04:07 PM

I was channeling StcChief.

It appears that he's simultaneously arguing;
KU was unimpressive,
The SIU team that played last night was one of the best in it's history, and
'all those' KU fans thinking KU is a superior organization is ill-founded hubris.

And I'm trying to reconcile these arguments with the score last night. Very well put counselor. :clap:

Teams in D1 are getting closer...in skill level.

This blog (whatever anyone thinks of those) article caught my eye and
re-enforced what I have been thinking for a while. D1 is D1 and skill level
is getting comparable. More talent.

The different 'mid-major' programs are trying to level the field and the
yearly almight teams USC,NC,UCLA,KU,OU, Michigan,MSU may not wan t to admit the upstart D1 teams are getting better programs.

The REAL problem is stopping the 'minor-leaguing' to the NBA and get the player to graduate with some kinda degree better than basket weaving.

If the NBA doesn't pan out, Europe doesn't pan out. Get hurt the have something to fall back on.

A discussion for anther day.

Pitt Gorilla

03-23-2007, 04:12 PM

Could the 4th or 5th best team in these "mid-majors" compete with the top team in power conferences or even the 4th or 5th best team in the power conferences? IYes, they can and have.

StcChief

03-23-2007, 04:18 PM

thread started by a fan of a mid-major

ROFL
Yeah. SIU has built a good program. and your point.
This article re-enforces my point.
NCAA needs to look into this.

I guess you missed the game last nite or had KU homer glasses on. :p

Baby Lee

03-23-2007, 04:48 PM

Very well put counselor. :clap:
Wasn't sure how to read this, but with the accompanying rep, I think you are misreading me.

I'm saying I can't get my head around the competing concepts of 'KU at it's least impressive still beats SIUC at it's best ever,' AND 'KU fans are wrong if they think their team is better than anyone else.'

To put it another way, you seem to think that it's amazing that SIUC was even close to beating KU, even though they weren't playing all that good.

I posit, both were well tested last night, but I guess I hold SIUC in greater esteem than you.

Pitt Gorilla

03-23-2007, 04:51 PM

Baby Lee

03-23-2007, 04:52 PM

That wasn't SIU at it's best.
From the Saluki BB

I'm amazed at the effort last night and all season. This team will be remembered as one of the greats in Saluki history.

Pitt Gorilla

03-23-2007, 05:05 PM

From the Saluki BBThey may have made it further in the tourney and will be "remembered as ONE of the greats", but that wasn't SIU at their best.

Ceej

03-23-2007, 05:06 PM

That wasn't SIU at it's best.

And last night wasn't KU at it's best. Your point being?!

Dr. Johnny Fever

03-23-2007, 05:29 PM

StcChief

03-23-2007, 06:16 PM

Wasn't sure how to read this, but with the accompanying rep, I think you are misreading me.

I'm saying I can't get my head around the competing concepts of 'KU at it's least impressive still beats SIUC at it's best ever,' AND 'KU fans are wrong if they think their team is better than anyone else.'

To put it another way, you seem to think that it's amazing that SIUC was even close to beating KU, even though they weren't playing all that good.

I posit, both were well tested last night, but I guess I hold SIUC in greater esteem than you.

I hold my DAWGS in high esteem for all the have accomplished and to be ranked Nationally the highest ever being 'Mid Major and all' .....though last nite with the some KU 'Beekers' ROFL they said "+10"... that was worth beer.

I never would have figured last minute to win vs. KU.
Watching them sweat at the end was Priceless as well.

but realistically thought KU would be the better. Maybe it's a wakeup call for KU.???

When I was at SIUC in mid 70s saw Mike Glenn with good teams....never close to a Elite 8. and they the lost to UCONN...last attempt at Elite8.

The program is strong and getting better.

Oh well as the Cubs say "Wait until next year".

El Jefe

03-23-2007, 06:51 PM

No you are and still should be mid-major.

teedubya

03-23-2007, 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by ChiefaRoo quoted by StcChief so Ali Chi3fs could see his dumbassery

What the fook are you babbling about? You win the game and now want to ban people for expressing their opposing opinion about it how it all went down? Why don't you go blow the moderators on Phog.net and never come back. That way you can live in your KU bubble 24/7/365. Pussy.

funny, you would be one of the bitter pussies to go, also. In fact, you would be the first to go, due to your lack of sarcasmometer.

Mr. Laz

03-23-2007, 08:03 PM

or had KU homer glasses on. :p

my KU homer glasses are firmly attached and i see no reason to apologize for that fact. :harumph:

Bearcat

03-23-2007, 08:27 PM

Pitt Gorilla

03-23-2007, 08:28 PM

And last night wasn't KU at it's best. Your point being?!
I was responding to BL. Perhaps you can deduce the context through our exchange.

listopencil

03-23-2007, 09:43 PM

So what the hell does "rock, chalk, Jayhawk" mean?

StcChief

03-24-2007, 12:34 AM

No you are and still should be mid-major.
This elitist attitude about D1 college sports needs to go by the wayside.

Pants

03-24-2007, 01:47 AM

So what the hell does "rock, chalk, Jayhawk" mean?

Have you ever heard of the magic that is internet? It even has these things called sites and some of them can even answer a lot of your questions, sites like wikipedia.org and google.com.

Answering the same question a 1000 times gets really old, really ****ing fast. Just saying...

SPchief

03-24-2007, 01:50 AM

Have you ever heard of the magic that is internet? It even has these things called sites and some of them can even answer a lot of your questions, sites like wikipedia.org and google.com.

Answering the same question a 1000 times gets really old, really ****ing fast. Just saying...

As a KU fan, could you tell me what a jayhawk is?

Pants

03-24-2007, 01:52 AM

As a KU fan, could you tell me what a jayhawk is?

The bird or the historical name for a certain group of people? I'm not a Jayhawk fan just because I like them, I go to ****ing KU.

SPchief

03-24-2007, 01:59 AM

The bird or the historical name for a certain group of people? I'm not a Jayhawk fan just because I like them, I go to ****ing KU.

Good for you :shrug:

So tell me, how many people from your high school are there?

Pants

03-24-2007, 02:04 AM

Good for you :shrug:

So tell me, how many people from your high school are there?

Why is it good for me? And what the hell do people from my high school have to do with anything?

SPchief

03-24-2007, 02:09 AM

Why is it good for me? And what the hell do people from my high school have to do with anything?

Just a simple question, how many people from your high school is currently enrolled at KU? Give me a rough estimate.

Pants

03-24-2007, 02:17 AM

Just a simple question, how many people from your high school is currently enrolled at KU? Give me a rough estimate.

I have no idea. I live with 3 guys who I met in a dorm my freshman year and none of them went to the same highschool. What does this have to do with anything?

Where did you graduate from, Mr. "How many people...is enrolled...?" lol

Ultra Peanut

03-24-2007, 03:36 AM

And now that I'm finishing up, Conference USA rep Memphis just dispatched one of the Big XII's best teams, Texas A&M, in San Antonio.
What, exactly, does this have to do with mid-majors?

Fairplay

03-24-2007, 09:19 AM

Just a simple question, how many people from your high school is currently enrolled at KU? Give me a rough estimate.

18 percent

chiefbowe82

03-24-2007, 12:43 PM

Pitt Gorilla

03-24-2007, 02:51 PM

So what the hell does "rock, chalk, Jayhawk" mean?I heard it started when the guys in Hashinger first used it as some sort of homosexual mating call. Who knew that "rock cock Gayhawk" would catch on at a place like KU?
:shrug: :thailor:

Pants

03-24-2007, 03:43 PM

I heard it started when the guys in Hashinger first used it as some sort of homosexual mating call. Who knew that "rock cock Gayhawk" would catch on at a place like KU?
:shrug: :thailor:

Yeah, Hash was a pretty gay place before they remodeled it. It's where all the artsy emo kids went to live, lol.

Mr. Kotter

03-24-2007, 05:54 PM

I'd agree with this idea.

listopencil

03-24-2007, 07:53 PM

StcChief

03-24-2007, 08:08 PM

I'd agree with this idea.

maybe tonite will lead more credence to the leveling of the D1 is D1 now.

Saulbadguy

03-24-2007, 08:29 PM

Would a Mid-Major conference be a conference that only has one national title in the past 50 years?

StcChief

03-24-2007, 08:43 PM

Would a Mid-Major conference be a conference that only has one national title in the past 50 years?
This sums up the current definition and challenges of 'Mid major' conf
in NCAA....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid-major

I would like it leveled for a lot of reason dealing with Athlete education, etc. I feel players are getting used by schools, they use them back and leave.

Program competition should be more than TV ad revenue for school.
and not a Pro minor league system in Football/Basketball.

Since baseball has a real minor league system. for post college or non college athletes.