Herm on Hannon and Webb...

[Coogs]

Saw a bit on the 38 Sports Spot tonight. I know we have already discussed the part where Herm said the offense was too complicated, and has to be simplified so we can get players on the field. He said we are going to find out if they can play, 'cause I know one thing, we could not cover them in practice.

That is not word for word, but it is pretty darn close. And I am just assuming here, but I would think since they were running on the practice squad, they were probably going up against Law and Surtain pretty much everyday.

I checked on Hannon's 40 time from the Tennesse pro day last year, and his time was 4.37. Not bad for 6-3 and 205.

Jeff Webb was 6-2, 211, and ran a 4.44.

[Deberg_1990]

He said we are going to find out if they can play, 'cause I know one thing, we could not cover them in practice.



Well that settles it then..Print those Super Bowl Tickets for the Chiefs!

[FloridaMan88]

So by Herm's logic because Croyle, Hannon and Webb all look good in practice they are going to be good in game situations??

Someone shoot me please

[Chiefnj2]

Corcoran column last week at cjonline.com



KANSAS CITY, Mo. — Sylvester Morris, Snoop Minnis, Lake Dawson, Craphonso Thorpe — this is the partial list of wide receivers the Chiefs have drafted in recent years who wound up on the scrap heap.

Make no room on that pile for Jeff Webb or Chris Hannon. Not yet anyway. Chiefs coach Herm Edwards thinks he might have found on his own practice field the answers to the Chiefs' receiving problems.

"I know one thing," Edwards said. "We don't cover 'em very well in practice."

The "we" in that sentence is mainly Ty Law and Patrick Surtain, Kansas City's two Pro Bowl-experienced starting cornerbacks, who had their difficulties handling the Chiefs' rookies — Webb, a sixth-round choice, and the undrafted Hannon, a 6-foot-3, 205 pounder from Tennessee who spent most of last season on the practice squad, never registering any game action.

Despite a thin and unproductive receiving corps, Webb (6-2, 211) caught just three passes during his rookie season, recording most of his action as a special teams player in 10 games.

Edwards on Tuesday blamed a complicated offensive system for keeping Webb and other young talents off the field.

"We've got to make sure our players can play," Edwards said. "And if you're not letting them play because it's too difficult, then shame on us. Shame on me for allowing it to happen. I won't allow it to happen again."

Simplifying the offense has been a goal of Edwards' since he arrived in Kansas City and he didn't back away from that intent Tuesday during a roundtable discussion with local reporters, again turning to his often-used analogy that the Chiefs' offense has been a circus.

"I always tell (the assistant coaches), 'Make it simple, 'cause I'm stupid,'" Edwards said. "This ain't computer football."

Physically, both Webb and Hannon fit the profile of receivers suited for a more straightforward, play-action passing game — big, rangy and, thus, good down the field and on the sidelines — as opposed to the shiftier types suited for the classic Don Coryell offense the Chiefs have operated since Dick Vermeil took over in 2001.

This is not suggesting the Chiefs won't be looking for help at receiver. Eddie Kennison is 34 years old, Dante Hall has recently struggled to remain healthy and Samie Parker's production has disappointed.

But the Chiefs may not be looking far.

"You can always get another one," Edwards said. "We've got two young guys that I want to see if they can play or not."

[Coogs]

So by Herm's logic because Croyle, Hannon and Webb all look good in practice they are going to be good in game situations??

You know, this sort of makes sense to me. He said they looked good in practice, so they are going to find out if they can play or not.

You know, this is the thing about draft choices and young FA players. Most everyone, including many people on here, say they need time to develope as players. They have had a year to practice. Time to find out, especially if they are looking good in practice.

Otherwise, why even bother to have a draft after the first round.

[Coogs]

Chiefnj2,

Nice article.

BTW, are you related to Chiefnj?

[FloridaMan88]

You know, this sort of makes sense to me. He said they looked good in practice, so they are going to find out if they can play or not.

You know, this is the thing about draft choices and young FA players. Most everyone, including many people on here, say they need time to develope as players. They have had a year to practice. Time to find out, especially if they are looking good in practice.

Otherwise, why even bother to have a draft after the first round.


That is fine and well, but you can't simply hope that guys like Webb and Hannon who were non-factors last year are going to make that huge leap towards major contributors to the NFL's worst WR corp.

The Chiefs need surefire help at the WR position.

And I still can't get over Herm's claims that the offense was too complicated last season. I'd like someone to ask him what is so complicated about the Chiefs "hand-off to LJ, hand-off to LJ, throw a 2 yard pass" offense.

[The Bad Guy]

So by Herm's logic because Croyle, Hannon and Webb all look good in practice they are going to be good in game situations??

Someone shoot me please

I don't think please was necessary.

[Coach]

So by using his logic, meaning that the CB's can't cover them during practices, then doesn't that necessarly mean that our CB's really suck?

[louie aguiar]

If they're so good, why didn't they play last year?

[Iowanian]

So....when they get open in the new HS offense, can they catch the ball in traffic?

It sounds like Herm really wants to bring back the West Coast O.....maybe Jimmy Ray or Paul Hackett, lawd knows they made it simple enough for Defenses to figure out....maybe young WRs can too.

[Coogs]

That is fine and well, but you can't simply hope that guys like Webb and Hannon who were non-factors last year are going to make that huge leap towards major contributors to the NFL's worst WR corp.

The Chiefs need surefire help at the WR position.

And I still can't get over Herm's claims that the offense was too complicated last season. I'd like someone to ask him what is so complicated about the Chiefs "hand-off to LJ, hand-off to LJ, throw a 2 yard pass" offense.

I think we kept a lot of the AS playbook. Probably all the multiple shifts and whatnot that was too difficult for a rookie to learn.

And for a trip down memory lane, go back to the 80's and look up the stats for Carlos Carson and Stephone Paige. One was a 5th round pick, the other a FA. Both did next to nothing thier first year. Wound up as two of the best receivers in Chiefs history.

Could it happen again?

[milkman]

So by Herm's logic because Croyle, Hannon and Webb all look good in practice they are going to be good in game situations??

Someone shoot me please

So, by your logic, they can't possibly be good in games if they're good in practice?

While I have no expectation of either, I also know with absolute certainty that I know absolutely nothing about their game day ability.

Until they actually get on the field, none of us do.

If, however, they are good in practice, then perhaps they should actually get an opportunity to show what kind of game player they are.

[Coogs]

The Colts offense looks pretty darn simple to me. Harrison on the right, Wayne on the left. Manning counts the players in the box and calls run or pass and off they go. On a run they probably know who to block right away, and on the pass it is probably easier to figure out their route. Just my .02.

[Coogs]

If, however, they are good in practice, then perhaps they should actually get an opportunity to show what kind of game player they are.

Exactly!

And from what I have seen, we are not one WR away from the Super Bowl. If Herm is seeing enough from these two in practice, we have tons of other holes to fill in the draft anyway. May take a couple of more drafts past this year to fill all of the spots.

[Iowanian]

Some of the most successful WRs in the league last year were street FAs or Low round draft picks.

[milkman]

Some of the most successful WRs in the league last year were street FAs or Low round draft picks.

I bet they sucked up the practice field.

[Iowanian]

Someone should remind him that ALOT of WRs routinely SMOKE the Chiefs secondary.

[Toad]

Sounds like Herm is trying hard to over-sell our WR's as justification to pick another postition in the 1st round.

[Chiefnj2]

Chiefnj2,

Nice article.

BTW, are you related to Chiefnj?

Same. Lost my password and I changed my email address years ago. I was too stupid to figure out how to redo it, so I signed in as chiefnj2.

[Chiefnj2]

Best part of the article -

Simplifying the offense has been a goal of Edwards' since he arrived in Kansas City and he didn't back away from that intent Tuesday during a roundtable discussion with local reporters, again turning to his often-used analogy that the Chiefs' offense has been a circus.

"I always tell (the assistant coaches), 'Make it simple, 'cause I'm stupid,'" Edwards said. "This ain't computer football."


Herm says he didn't change anything, yet in this article the author is saying that simplifying the O has been the goal from the start.

[keg in kc]

So, by your logic, they can't possibly be good in games if they're good in practice?He's starting the new "we only play guys who suck in practice" movement. It'll be the "it" thing in the NFL someday.

[chuxtrux]

At least Herm is admitting he doesn't like our old offense because he is to stupid to understand it, thats a start

[keg in kc]

Best part of the article -

Simplifying the offense has been a goal of Edwards' since he arrived in Kansas City and he didn't back away from that intent Tuesday during a roundtable discussion with local reporters, again turning to his often-used analogy that the Chiefs' offense has been a circus.

"I always tell (the assistant coaches), 'Make it simple, 'cause I'm stupid,'" Edwards said. "This ain't computer football."


Herm says he didn't change anything, yet in this article the author is saying that simplifying the O has been the goal from the start.This has been up for debate for more than a year now. You can simplify an offense without changing the overall scheme. Fewer plays in the playbook is one obvious way.

Beyond that, changes in personnel will always dictate a change in approach as well, like it or not.

I'm at the "I don't care what they run as long as they find something that works" point, personally. Al Saunders is not the only coordinator in NFL history who's had a productive unit, and, frankly, what worked when Roaf, Waters, Wiegmann and Shields were anchoring the line 5 years ago won't necessarily work quite as well now with other guys playing those roles. So...find what does, with who we have.

[Mecca]

That's fine they just better not have this notion that we don't need to draft a WR because these guys might be ok.

[splatbass]

This has been up for debate for more than a year now. You can simplify an offense without changing the overall scheme. Fewer plays in the playbook is one obvious way.

Beyond that, changes in personnel will always dictate a change in approach as well, like it or not.

I'm at the "I don't care what they run as long as they find something that works" point, personally. Al Saunders is not the only coordinator in NFL history who's had a productive unit, and, frankly, what worked when Roaf, Waters, Wiegmann and Shields were anchoring the line 5 years ago won't necessarily work quite as well now with other guys playing those roles. So...find what does, with who we have.

Well said.

[Sam Hall]

Until these guys show us something...

[RealSNR]

Same. Lost my password and I changed my email address years ago. I was too stupid to figure out how to redo it, so I signed in as chiefnj2.But... but... what about your post count?

[Miles]

That's fine they just better not have this notion that we don't need to draft a WR because these guys might be ok.

With that line of thinking they are starting to turn into Richard Smith and Chris Horn v. 2.0.

[Mecca]

With that line of thinking they are starting to turn into Richard Smith and Chris Horn v. 2.0.

Don't forget Marc Boerigter who some people thought was the savior to the position.

[HMc]

don't doubt this has been said but our secondary aint exactly watertight

[Rausch]

"I always tell (the assistant coaches), 'Make it simple, 'cause I'm stupid,'" Edwards said.

[King_Chief_Fan]

Beating the Chiefs secondary is hardly a measure of how good the no names who are listed as WR's for the Chiefs.

My guess is several of the young fast guys on this board might be able to beat the Chiefs secondary. And if you aren't real fast, just juke Law and he falls down.

[rad]

C'mon guys, we're talking about practice here. Practice. It's just practice......(/Iverson)

[kepp]

'cause I know one thing, we could not cover them in practice.
Could be that Law keeps falling down too.

[Pneuma]

Herm has not shown any reason for me to doubt his abilty to scout talent. If Herm feels Hannon and Webb are good enough, I trust his judgement. IMO nothing can be worse the Sammie. I see no reason to pick a 1st round WR if Hannon and Webb can be productive. We just need a couple WR's that can streach the D so we can pound Larry.

[StcChief]

I think we kept a lot of the AS playbook. Probably all the multiple shifts and whatnot that was too difficult for a rookie to learn.

And for a trip down memory lane, go back to the 80's and look up the stats for Carlos Carson and Stephone Paige. One was a 5th round pick, the other a FA. Both did next to nothing thier first year. Wound up as two of the best receivers in Chiefs history.

Could it happen again?I was thinking that as well....

Maybe for once we got some diamonds in the rough at WR.

I'm all for simplifying the plays. Will help Croyle/Huard too.

[JakeT]

And remember how effective Kendrell Bell was rushing the passer in practice, and please don't forget the diamond in the ruff that was Jessie Haynes. The names go on and on.

I hope these guys pan out but I don't buy anyone of training camp hype until I see it on the field. At this point its just positioning for a defensive first round pick and attempting to get us excited about a simple boring offense.

Yeah!

[Mr. Laz]

If they're so good, why didn't they play last year?
exactly

[Coogs]

If they're so good, why didn't they play last year?


Maybe part of it was the 45 man roster limit. You had Kennison, Hall, and Parker that were givens on each Sunday. And maybe it was also the downfield blocking instead of the pass routes that were the problem. Because of all our offensive shifting, the defense also has a lot of shifting. Tougher for the O-line and WR's maybe to pick out who they are supposed to block on the play.

[Valiant]

Saw a bit on the 38 Sports Spot tonight. I know we have already discussed the part where Herm said the offense was too complicated, and has to be simplified so we can get players on the field. He said we are going to find out if they can play, 'cause I know one thing, we could not cover them in practice.

That is not word for word, but it is pretty darn close. And I am just assuming here, but I would think since they were running on the practice squad, they were probably going up against Law and Surtain pretty much everyday.

I checked on Hannon's 40 time from the Tennesse pro day last year, and his time was 4.37. Not bad for 6-3 and 205.

Jeff Webb was 6-2, 211, and ran a 4.44.


All we did was telegraph our runs, how ****ing hard is that to learn??

[GoHuge]

Listening to Herm make those comments all I could take away was "our young guys are too stupid to understand the offense." It didn't look too complex on the field. Line up on this side (block for LJ), this play your on the line (block for LJ), this play your off the line (block for LJ), on third down run a quick route and look for the ball because the QB is only going to have enough time for a three step drop. What's so hard about that? Not being sarcastic....just watch the game film. Most Planeteers could handle the 1st and 2nd down assignments.....especially for half a mill per season.