The Quintuplets...

[Buck]

...Not to be a troll or anything, but I just can't get into the conversations here tonight. I just feel like stirring things up a bit. That being said....

1. Philip Rivers
2. LaDainian Tomlinson
3. Lorenzo Neal
4. Antonio Gates
5. Vincent Jackson

Some of you may have heard me talk about the Quintuplets before, but probably not all of you. The Quintuplets are a better version of the Triplets (Aikman, Emmitt Smith, Michael Irvin). There may not be a better player on the Quintuplets, but the versatility of the group, for a lack of better words, is just stupid.

There is no damn way that Norv Turner is going to ruin this, and by that I mean, miss the playoffs/not win the division. I can't really say for sure, but that lineup looks prime and ready for a run to a super bowl.

Thoughts everybody?

[Demonpenz]

vincent jackson is good as spiking the ball for no reason

[Buck]

Do you guys still have Ty Law?

http://www.nctimes.com/content/articles/2005/11/06/sports/professional/chargers/21_15_5910_27_05.jpg

[big nasty kcnut]

Philip Rivers is not a mobile qb.

[Hammock Parties]

You are overrating Rivers and Jackson. Neither are as good as Aikman and Irvin and never will be.

[noa]

No doubt they'll make the playoffs this year. Not even Norv Turner could screw that up. I would take out Jackson from any list about the Chargers elite players, though.

[Buck]

You are overrating Rivers and Jackson. Neither are as good as Aikman and Irvin and never will be.

Jackson will never be as good as Irvin, I will give you that.

You are overrating Aikman.

[Buck]

No doubt they'll make the playoffs this year. Not even Norv Turner could screw that up. I would take out Jackson from any list about the Chargers elite players, though.

IMO, the Quintuplets sounds better than the Quadruplets.

[keg in kc]

The idea of the "triplets" is a misnomer, and always has been. Aikman, Irvin and Smith may have garnered all the press, but Jay Novacek, Moose Johnston and Alvin Harper (although he did leave in, IIRC, '95) were all integral to the success of that team. I think that unit stacks up pretty well with any in the history of the NFL.

[Pitt Gorilla]

You include Neal, but Johnston was at least as good, if not better.

[Hammock Parties]

Jackson will never be as good as Irvin, I will give you that.

You are overrating Aikman.

Not really. The dude was a phenomenal quarterback who put up average numbers because the Cowboys preferred to run the ball. He could have had 300 touchdown passes easily, but the Cowboys didn't play offense that way.

He also had an incredible arm. Something Rivers will NEVER have.

[milkman]

You are overrating Rivers and Jackson. Neither are as good as Aikman and Irvin and never will be.

You actually have a good point here.

Aikman
Smith
Irvin
Daryl Johnston
Jay Novacek

were better as a group.

[Buck]

Not really. The dude was a phenomenal quarterback who put up average numbers because the Cowboys preferred to run the ball. He could have had 300 touchdown passes easily, but the Cowboys didn't play offense that way.

He also had an incredible arm. Something Rivers will NEVER have.

Right.....I guess you didn't watch any Chargers games last year.

[noa]

I would just say instead of Aikman, Smith and Irvin, you have Rivers, LT and Gates.
Still a set of Triplets.

[keg in kc]

There is no damn way that Norv Turner is going to ruin thisThe term "famous last words" comes to mind.

[Buck]

Aikman* ------------------Rivers
Smith --------------------Tomlinson*
Irvin* --------------------Jackson
Daryl Johnston--------------Neal*
Jay Novacek-----------------Gates*

* Indicates better player

[Hammock Parties]

Right.....I guess you didn't watch any Chargers games last year.

I watched plenty. His arm isn't that great. It looked downright weak at times.

[Ebolapox]

:spock:

once again, a chargers fan showing the lack of overall knowledge of nfl history (it's understandable, as 99.9% of chargers fans are wearing BRAND NEW jerseys they just bought at the game)

[Buck]

I watched plenty. His arm isn't that great. It looked downright weak at times.

You must have only been watching the Defense, Rivers threw and connected perfectly on plenty of bombs last year.

[Ebolapox]

Aikman* ------------------Rivers
Smith --------------------Tomlinson*
Irvin* --------------------Jackson
Daryl Johnston--------------Neal*
Jay Novacek-----------------Gates*

* Indicates better player

:spock:

call me at the end of tomlinson's career--until it's over, smith was better (and I hated emmitt smith)

johnston was better than neal. he was a multiple threat--neal is a blocker, nothing more.

novacek was better than gates.

care to try again with this whole 'football knowledge' thing?

[Demonpenz]

I would take emmit smith over Tomlinson anyday

[Hammock Parties]

NEGATIVES: Pushes the ball or whips it from the side and falls out of his throws....Looks like he's throwing a heavy ball....Cannot drive the deep pass.

[SPchief]

How the hell do you think that Neal is better than Johnston?

[Buck]

:spock:

once again, a chargers fan showing the lack of overall knowledge of nfl history (it's understandable, as 99.9% of chargers fans are wearing BRAND NEW jerseys they just bought at the game)

I am in the 0.1%

Hopefully the Fact that I have a Seau, Carney, Means, Humphries, Flutie, Tomlinson, Edwards, Marcellus Wiley, Tim Dwight, Brees jerseys, shows you that I have been a fan for a while.

[milkman]

Aikman* ------------------Rivers
Smith --------------------Tomlinson*
Irvin* --------------------Jackson
Daryl Johnston--------------Neal*
Jay Novacek-----------------Gates*

* Indicates better player

I agree with all but Johnston-Neal.

Johnston was nearly as good a bocker, and a far better receiver, and overall more versatile.

And you failed to metion Aikman-Rivers, where the edge clearly goes to Aikman.

[noa]

Wow, you got a Tim Dwight jersey?

[Buck]

How the hell do you think that Neal is better than Johnston?

Duh, I am a stupid Chargers fan.

[Hammock Parties]

You must have only been watching the Defense, Rivers threw and connected perfectly on plenty of bombs last year.

Throwing a bomb is not indicative of arm strength.

[Buck]

Wow, you got a Tim Dwight jersey?

Hell yeah. Same day I bought a Marcellus Wiley Jersey.

[Demonpenz]

With I think of emmit smith I think of tough, plays hurt, comes up huge in big games. When I think of thomlinson I think of a little bitch crying at belicheck after another playoff choke

[Buck]

:spock:

call me at the end of tomlinson's career--until it's over, smith was better (and I hated emmitt smith)

johnston was better than neal. he was a multiple threat--neal is a blocker, nothing more.

novacek was better than gates.

care to try again with this whole 'football knowledge' thing?

No doubt that Emmitt Smith is greater than Tomlinson. However, if I were to choose between Smith and Tomlinson to be my RB for one season, I would easily choose Tomlinson.

[Ebolapox]

I am in the 0.1%

Hopefully the Fact that I have a Seau, Carney, Means, Humphries, Flutie, Tomlinson, Edwards, Marcellus Wiley, Tim Dwight, Brees jerseys, shows you that I have been a fan for a while.

hmmm... so you're telling me you've been a fan since their last super bowl (as means and humphries would imply)--that's respectable, I guess

I've been an overall football fan (we're about the same age, fwiw) since guys like jayice pearson, deron cherry, jack del rio, and lloyd burress were turning stalwart performances on D while our offenses were...offensive (guys like mark vlassic and steve pelleur were obviously not the answer)

[keg in kc]

call me at the end of tomlinson's career--until it's over, smith was better (and I hated emmitt smith)

johnston was better than neal. he was a multiple threat--neal is a blocker, nothing more.

novacek was better than gates.

care to try again with this whole 'football knowledge' thing?I'm okay with all of that except I'd call Smith and Tomlinson a push, and I'd have to argue against novacek being better than gates. That's not to say he wasn't very good. A lot of people overlook just how key he was. But Gates is a step above.

[Ebolapox]

No doubt that Emmitt Smith is greater than Tomlinson. However, if I were to choose between Smith and Tomlinson to be my RB for one season, I would easily choose Tomlinson.

eh, I take barry sanders (that way you don't have to build up the offensive line to make guys like tomlinson and smith look good, and can invest that money on a defense and QB)

[Buck]

hmmm... so you're telling me you've been a fan since their last super bowl (as means and humphries would imply)--that's respectable, I guess

I've been an overall football fan (we're about the same age, fwiw) since guys like jayice pearson, deron cherry, jack del rio, and lloyd burress were turning stalwart performances on D while our offenses were...offensive (guys like mark vlassic and steve pelleur were obviously not the answer)

Well, I am 21, I started following the Chargers in about '92 (at least thats the earliest I can remember). That made me 6 at the time. I dont see anything wrong with that. I dont see how you are a better fan than me if you started paying attention when you were 4 or 5...

[milkman]

No doubt that Emmitt Smith is greater than Tomlinson. However, if I were to choose between Smith and Tomlinson to be my RB for one season, I would easily choose Tomlinson.

Smith put up huge numbers, but that has as much to do with the fact that he played behind one of the best ever O-Lines.

I'd take Tomlinson any day over Smith.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

With I think of emmit smith I think of tough, plays hurt, comes up huge in big games. When I think of thomlinson I think of a little bitch crying at belicheck after another playoff choke



LMAO he'll never escape that. I think it's great.

[MVChiefFan]

How about these quintuplets:

Sims
Hicks
Black
Mitchell
Knight

They are no longer here to make us look bad. LOOK OUT!!!

[Ebolapox]

I'm okay with all of that except I'd call Smith and Tomlinson a push, and I'd have to argue against novacek being better than gates. That's not to say he wasn't very good. A lot of people overlook just how key he was. But Gates is a step above.

I think novacek was a bit more versatile in that system... if you don't have irvin and harper in that offense, you see numbers comparable to gates' numbers.

[Buck]

eh, I take barry sanders (that way you don't have to build up the offensive line to make guys like tomlinson and smith look good, and can invest that money on a defense and QB)

Barry Sanders > Tomlinson and Smith.

However, Sanders isnt in this arguement because I think we are arguing about offensive threats from the same team in the same year...

[Buck]

LMAO he'll never escape that. I think it's great.

Thats truly a tragedy. If that is Tomlinson career defining moment, it would be a shame. I may be blinded by being a Chargers fan, but I'm pretty sure that he is one of the most stand-up guys in the entire league.

[milkman]

eh, I take barry sanders (that way you don't have to build up the offensive line to make guys like tomlinson and smith look good, and can invest that money on a defense and QB)

Tomlinson played behind a terrible offensive line in his first two seasons and put up good numbers on the ground, and was huge as a receiver out of the backfiled.

I'd take Tomlinson.

[Ebolapox]

the sad part about this is that we'd all be making the same boasts if we were in their shoes.

at the end of the day, an opinion is just like an asshole. we all have one, and they all stink except for our own.

[Ebolapox]

Tomlinson played behind a terrible offensive line in his first two seasons and put up good numbers on the ground, and was huge as a receiver out of the backfiled.

I'd take Tomlinson.

barry sanders (outstanding numbers)> tomlinson (good numbers)

you're nuts

[keg in kc]

I think novacek was a bit more versatile in that system... if you don't have irvin and harper in that offense, you see numbers comparable to gates' numbers.I think Gates' all-around game is underrated; he's really worked, much like Gonzalez did. It's blasphemy to say it here, but I think he's the best TE in the game right now, and I don't just mean as a pass catcher.

Novacek was steady, and he'd come up with key plays, but (as I recall, this was more than a decade ago) he didn't have Gates' athleticism or big play ability.

[Buck]

Getting back to the comparison between Neal and Johnston...

IMO, Neal does exactly what he is asked to do on every play. He never gives less than 100% and is perhaps, the greatest blocking FB of all time.

I honestly dont know that much about Johnston, except I do remember he had his own Beanie Baby and his nickname was Moose.

You have to remember how great that Dallas O-Line was too; I really believe that they were a great key to his success.

I'm not saying that the Chargers O-Line is anywhere near bad, just not as good as the Dallas O-Line of the Mid 90's.

[Valiant]

I would just say instead of Aikman, Smith and Irvin, you have Rivers, LT and Gates.
Still a set of Triplets.


I'm sorry you have LT and Gates, any average QB will look good behind that line because everybody focuses on LT.. Rivers has shown nothing yet, how many playoff wins did you get with those three last year.. You downgraded at all your coaching positions and believe your squad is going to be somehow super bowl bound???

Maybe you should go make a little rap video..

noa that was not towards you, just quoted the triplets aspect of your post...

[Ebolapox]

I think Gates' all-around game is underrated; he's really worked, much like Gonzalez did. It's blasphemy to say it here, but I think he's the best TE in the game right now, and I don't just mean as a pass catcher.

Novacek was steady, and he'd come up with key plays, but (as I recall, this was more than a decade ago) he didn't have Gates' athleticism or big play ability.

I'll cop to gates being the best TE in football. and I'd say gates probably DID have more ability/athleticism... however, those were the days before basketball players began playing TE... one expected something different from a TE back then... hell, mike f*cking ditka is a hall of fame TE, but nobody would say he was in the same league athletically as gates or even novacek.

[Buck]

Sextuplets???

http://photos.signonsandiego.com/gallery1.5/albums/060911raiders/KC_1QTR107.jpg

[keg in kc]

Johnston was every bit the blocker that Neal is, and was much more of a threat out of the backfield.

[Buck]

I'm sorry you have LT and Gates, any average QB will look good behind that line because everybody focuses on LT.. Rivers has shown nothing yet, how many playoff wins did you get with those three last year.. You downgraded at all your coaching positions and believe your squad is going to be somehow super bowl bound???

Maybe you should go make a little rap video..

So lets see...If we have All 3 of those players for the next 10 years, Rivers should look pretty good for his career then right?

[milkman]

barry sanders (outstanding numbers)> tomlinson (good numbers)

you're nuts

I'll take the guy with the versatility every time over a guy who really only does one thing well, except for perhaps Jim Brown.

Tomlinson adds far more to an offense than a Barry Sanders.

Sanders was taken out in the red zone because his propensity for losing yardage hurt his team.

But he also hurt his team because he he had to be taken out.

Sanders lacked that instinct that tells you when you absolutely have to just take what is there.

I'd take a lot of RBs over Sanders.

He might well have been the most talented, with the exception of Gale Sayers, of any back that I've ever seen.

But he also was one of the dumbest.

[Ebolapox]

Getting back to the comparison between Neal and Johnston...

IMO, Neal does exactly what he is asked to do on every play. He never gives less than 100% and is perhaps, the greatest blocking FB of all time.

I honestly dont know that much about Johnston, except I do remember he had his own Beanie Baby and his nickname was Moose.

You have to remember how great that Dallas O-Line was too; I really believe that they were a great key to his success.

I'm not saying that the Chargers O-Line is anywhere near bad, just not as good as the Dallas O-Line of the Mid 90's.

johnston was one of the most versatile players on the field. he blocked, was a receiving 'threat' out of the backfield, ran the ball occaisonally (though not much, as they had smith), (and if memory served, didn't he even hold on kicks?), etc... he was really the glue that held that offense together, much like tony richardson was for us for years (DAMMIT, CARL!111)

and those cowboys lines weren't particularly that 'GOOD' per se--they just outweighed everyone they played 320 to 250 and mauled everyone.

[Hammock Parties]

and those cowboys lines weren't particularly that 'GOOD' per se--they just outweighed everyone they played 320 to 250 and mauled everyone.

This is very uneducated.

[Ebolapox]

This is very uneducated.

I'm not saying they didn't get the job done. they were good. however, everyone talks like they were world beaters... they were good, but they had a huge size advantage over everyone they ever played--which really comes in handy in the run game (coincidence: they were a run-oriented team!)

[Buck]

I'm not saying they didn't get the job done. they were good. however, everyone talks like they were world beaters... they were good, but they had a huge size advantage over everyone they ever played--which really comes in handy in the run game (coincidence: they were a run-oriented team!)

Well, do what it takes to win right?

If being heavier means being better, then why not?

I think that definitely helped change the game of football.

Can you find a single team today that doesn't have more than 3, 300 pounders on the O-Line?

[Valiant]

So lets see...If we have All 3 of those players for the next 10 years, Rivers should look pretty good for his career then right?


If in ten years we have this conversation then yes, but you are trying to justify Rivers as being a HOF status after one year in which no defense gives a rats ass about him.. I like how you totally ignored the statement and just threw out what you did though, its your way of saying I am just a homer and making up shit left and right to justify myself...

Teams only worry about LT and Gates, you could have Gochiefs back their and he would put up similar numbers as Rivers... Be ready for Rivers to regress like Rothlesburger (sp?) as teams focus on him in his second year...

[Ebolapox]

Well, do what it takes to win right?

If being heavier means being better, then why not?

I think that definitely helped change the game of football.

Can you find a single team today that doesn't have more than 3, 300 pounders on the O-Line?

I agree they helped change the game of football--before them, having more than one borderline 300 lb lineman was uncommon (iirc)... as any football fan can attest to, football is a copycat game. whoever succeeds gets emulated (duh)

[milkman]

I'm not saying they didn't get the job done. they were good. however, everyone talks like they were world beaters... they were good, but they had a huge size advantage over everyone they ever played--which really comes in handy in the run game (coincidence: they were a run-oriented team!)

Yet when they pass blocked, Aikman had all kinds of time, even on obvious passing downs.

Those guys were good.

[Hammock Parties]

I'm not saying they didn't get the job done. they were good. however, everyone talks like they were world beaters... they were good, but they had a huge size advantage over everyone they ever played--which really comes in handy in the run game (coincidence: they were a run-oriented team!)

They didn't have a HUGE size advantage. Larry Allen was enormous, yes. But the rest of these guys weren't all that enormous.

Mark Stepnoski was a very undersized center. Tony Casillas and John Gesek were both under 300 pounds. Kevin Gogan and Nate Newton were in the 320's however, but that wasn't THAT uncommon in the early 90's.

It was more than just size. The Cowboys ran the Coryell offense. Those guys had to get out in space and move, and they did. Dominant bunch of offensive linemen in every way.

[Buck]

If in ten years we have this conversation then yes, but you are trying to justify Rivers as being a HOF status after one year in which no defense gives a rats ass about him.. I like how you totally ignored the statement and just threw out what you did though, its your way of saying I am just a homer and making up shit left and right to justify myself...

Teams only worry about LT and Gates, you could have Gochiefs back their and he would put up similar numbers as Rivers... Be ready for Rivers to regress like Rothlesburger (sp?) as teams focus on him in his second year...

Well of course I am a homer...

Rivers has only played 1 full year of football, therefore I have no right in claiming him as great, just as you have no right as claiming him a bust.

Its almost automatic that teams w/ this kind of talent at other positions make the QB look good.

I don't think that its possible for Rivers to regress with all of the talent that the Chargers have.

[Valiant]

Well, do what it takes to win right?

If being heavier means being better, then why not?

I think that definitely helped change the game of football.

Can you find a single team today that doesn't have more than 3, 300 pounders on the O-Line?


I am sure Denver and maybe Atlanta's starters are for the most part under 300...

[Buck]

I am sure Denver and maybe Atlanta's starters are for the most part under 300...

I can explain that.

The Broncos are a bunch of ****ing Cheaters who grease up and Chop Block on Spiked Ball Plays...

And the Falcons suck.

[keg in kc]

It was more than just size. The Cowboys ran the Coryell offense. Those guys had to get out in space and move, and they did. Dominant bunch of offensive linemen in every way.You are correct, sir.

[Valiant]

Well of course I am a homer...

Rivers has only played 1 full year of football, therefore I have no right in claiming him as great, just as you have no right as claiming him a bust.

Its almost automatic that teams w/ this kind of talent at other positions make the QB look good.

I don't think that its possible for Rivers to regress with all of the talent that the Chargers have.


Well at least your honest about being a homer and claiming that you think he is great when he has not shown it yet when compared to actually great QB's..

And I agree teams with talent make QB's look better then they are, check Trent Green and Daunte Culpepper..

As for him not regressing during his sophomore slump good luck, but odds are against it...

[Buck]

Well at least that sparked up some conversation for about an hour or so.

[Dunit35]

I watch Gochiefs' defensive highlight real all the time and does anybody remember when Neal caught that ball and DJ ran him over?

That was awesome. I bet that was a first for Neal.

[88TG88]

I can explain that.

The Broncos are a bunch of ****ing Cheaters who grease up and Chop Block on Spiked Ball Plays...

And the Falcons suck.
Your smartest post in this thread.

[Buck]

I watch Gochiefs' defensive highlight real all the time and does anybody remember when Neal caught that ball and DJ ran him over?

That was awesome. I bet that was a first for Neal.

I'm pretty sure he was off balance before he got hit.

[Direckshun]

...Not to be a troll or anything, but I just can't get into the conversations here tonight. I just feel like stirring things up a bit. That being said....

1. Philip Rivers
2. LaDainian Tomlinson
3. Lorenzo Neal
4. Antonio Gates
5. Vincent Jackson

Some of you may have heard me talk about the Quintuplets before, but probably not all of you. The Quintuplets are a better version of the Triplets (Aikman, Emmitt Smith, Michael Irvin).
Well I think you can assemble a "Quintuplets" from the Chargers, but you only got it mostly right.

1. LaDainian Tomlinson
2. Antonio Gates
3. Jamal Williams
4. Shawn Merrian
5. Lorenzo Neal

And you can probably include a couple of your OL along with them.

[Direckshun]

Johnston was every bit the blocker that Neal is, and was much more of a threat out of the backfield.
Bah... T-Rich puts 'em both to shame.