Dealing with kids and a death in family

[KevB]

I have three kids (8,5 and 3) who will lose their great grandpa (my wife's grandfather) soon. He's in the hospital, and my wife and I are trying to decide if we should take the kids up to see him one last time or not. Anyone else ever deal with this decision and how did you handle it?

[ChiefsFan4Life]

I'll preface my comments by saying that I don't have kids and haven't gone through this situation, but my personal belief is that you take the kids, for two main reasons:

1) To keep you great grandpa from seeing his great grandkids before he dies is a selfish act

2) Your kids are going to have to deal with death and the understanding that people die when they get older, so what is the harm in letting them in on this now as opposed to later?

[KevB]

I'll preface my comments by saying that I don't have kids and haven't gone through this situation, but my personal belief is that you take the kids, for two main reasons:

1) To keep you great grandpa from seeing his great grandkids before he dies is a selfish act

2) Your kids are going to have to deal with death and the understanding that people die when they get older, so what is the harm in letting them in on this now as opposed to later?

1) He's already pretty deep into the pain meds, so it's questionable he'd necessarily realize they were there.

2) Hard to know when is the "right time" to share the news.

Both points we are considering. A few more issues we're mulling:

1) Do we want them to remember him in a hospital bed, or as the vibrant, happy guy they've spent a lot of time with (as recent as a couple of weeks ago).

2) Would seeing him in this condition help them reconcile what is to come? In other words, his death won't be a surprise when they see him in the hospital.

Thanks for your response.

[memyselfI]

I'll preface my comments by saying that I don't have kids and haven't gone through this situation, but my personal belief is that you take the kids, for two main reasons:

1) To keep you great grandpa from seeing his great grandkids before he dies is a selfish act

2) Your kids are going to have to deal with death and the understanding that people die when they get older, so what is the harm in letting them in on this now as opposed to later?

I agree with your first point. The second one I think is rather over generalized especially since you don't have kids. It truly depends on the age and maturity level of the child and each child is different therefore there is no one solution you can apply to the situation. I do think the older one should see their grandfather both in the hospital and at a wake or other type of ceremony IF they are properly advised about what they are seeing. If Grandpa is too medicated or ill and doesn't know what he's seeing and the kids would be too upset to see him then what's the point?

The two younger ones are a different story. They don't know what they are seeing and can become quite spooked about seeing someone very ill in the hospital or lying in an open casket. I think the parent of those younger children needs to approach the situation with much consideration because of the age and maturity level of the younger ones.

It's not a cop out but the fact of the matter is only the parent of these kids knows what is best for them in this situation. Advise can be offered but ultimately none of us knows the personality or maturity level of the kids so our advise really is being offered in a vaccum.

[CoMoChief]

1) He's already pretty deep into the pain meds, so it's questionable he'd necessarily realize they were there.

2) Hard to know when is the "right time" to share the news.

Both points we are considering. A few more issues we're mulling:

1) Do we want them to remember him in a hospital bed, or as the vibrant, happy guy they've spent a lot of time with (as recent as a couple of weeks ago).

2) Would seeing him in this condition help them reconcile what is to come? In other words, his death won't be a surprise when they see him in the hospital.

Thanks for your response.
I would take them to see him. The first funeral I went to was when I was 7 yrs old. Grandmother died of breast cancer. It was hard on me but then the 2nd one after that wasn't as bad and I don't wanna say I got used to it because I don't think you can get used to it, but I adapted to the situation better and understood things more.

A lot of times believe it or not, if old people are on their death bed, it's almost as if they wait to die until they see everyone in the family one last time. I had it happen to my grandfather one time, (different side of family). He was in the hospital and the Dr said he only had a couple days to live. Well, 4 days went by and everyone in the family came up to see him one last time. After family members left, he fell asleep and never woke up again.

[Phobia]

The only way I wouldn't let a child see a dying or dead member of family is if they're horribly mutilated.

Death is part of life. If we sugar-coat it or shield our children from it, it's really going to hurt when their first experience with death is as an adult.

Take your kids. Act natural. The only way they're going to be scarred is if mom & dad wail and weep.

[pikesome]

I have three kids (8,5 and 3) who will lose their great grandpa (my wife's grandfather) soon. He's in the hospital, and my wife and I are trying to decide if we should take the kids up to see him one last time or not. Anyone else ever deal with this decision and how did you handle it?

I've got kids (12 & 3) and lost my father suddenly this summer before last. I also lost my grandmother after a week long stay in hospice on heavy sedation about 7 years ago. I say take them, any time is "good" time. My father died suddenly so there wasn't the option to visit him but my oldest (11 at the time) wanted to, and still wishes he did, see him. Kids will remember the good more easily than the bad as time goes on, just like most people do. My grandmother was pumped full of morphine but she forced herself to be aware till the end. I wouldn't trade that time for anything.

[KevB]

The only way I wouldn't let a child see a dying or dead member of family is if they're horribly mutilated.

Death is part of life. If we sugar-coat it or shield our children from it, it's really going to hurt when their first experience with death is as an adult.

Take your kids. Act natural. The only way they're going to be scarred is if mom & dad wail and weep.

Devil's advocate view however: what do they get out of seeing him withered in bed, muttering due to the pain meds. They'll have to deal with the death part with the funeral,etc. We'll obviously explain death as a natural thing, and help them remember him with pictures and memories. We've been fortunate to live nearby and spend lots of quality time with him, so I'm a little concerned about having this be their last memory.

[Iowanian]

we're in a similar position right now, only with a 2yr old. we're taking her to the hopsital today for a short bit.

I was at a funeral this week where the 2 year old son of the mother was there. he didn't understand.

I remember being at my great grandmother's funeral when I was 3. I remember being confused and wondering why they cut her legs off and where they were more than being disturbed by seeing her dead. (casket half open of course)

We had alot of cancer and death in the family as I grew up...by 8, I understood it more than I'd like to admit.

the 3 year old won't understand at all...the 5 year old will likely kind of understand, and the 8 year old is old enough to learn about this tough, but necessary life lesson.

Tell them Grandpa's going to live with God and they'll see him again someday.

[pikesome]

Devil's advocate view however: what do they get out of seeing him withered in bed, muttering due to the pain meds. They'll have to deal with the death part with the funeral,etc. We'll obviously explain death as a natural thing, and help them remember him with pictures and memories. We've been fortunate to live nearby and spend lots of quality time with him, so I'm a little concerned about having this be their last memory.

It won't be though. Kids should be able to handle it, especially after some time passes and smooths out the rough edges.

[tiptap]

My mother in law died at home. My wife, my sister in law and my son all were there at the end. He was 8.

[blueballs]

Kids need to spend a summer or 2 on a farm
raising their own food -learn about life-death
and the consequences of sex -watch birth

[morphius]

My 6 year old son was crushed earlier this week because he couldn't see his Great Grandma in the hospital because he had the flu and we didn't want to risk getting her sick to go along with the stroke. She ended up having a second stroke the next day and died, so he wasn't able to see her. He had wanted to draw her picture to make her feel better right after the first stroke and we were going to take her it the next day, now there is a drawing from him in her casket.

The 3 year old might be too young, but the others are probably old enough

[SLAG]

My kids were / are 3 and 4 when my grandmother died last march, she was withering away from Multiple Myeloma and Gangrene of the Feet

They were not scared and every now and again they say that they Miss her

The only thing is after the burial every cemetary we pass they think she is buried there and they want to go see her

Take your kids let them hug him there can never be too much love

[Groves]

I think wailing and weeping are just as much a part of life as dying is.

If this is your first move to talk to them about death, you've got bigger fish to fry than visiting the relative.

If it isn't your first move, why not take them? The trend towards removing our kids from suffering, both in their lives and others, is a real damaging way to go, in my opinion.

The great news is that you're the parent, so you get to decide. Keep us posted.

[PinkFloyd]

A lot of times believe it or not, if old people are on their death bed, it's almost as if they wait to die until they see everyone in the family one last time.

I totally agree with this statement... Two of my grandparents were in the hospital, and as soon as everyone seen them, they passed on...

As far as the children, I believe I would talk to them first, tell them of the situation, then let them decide if they want to go see him... You need to tell them that he's very sick, don't lie about the situation either...

At the same time, you need to think about what the grandfather is thinking... He might be medicated, but at the same time he may be wishing in his mind that they would come see him...

I'm not sure if my grandfather knew who I was while seeing him on the day he died, but you could see the smile and twinkle in his eye of just seeing a young child there seeing him... Deep down, I'm sure he knew it was me...

[ChiefaRoo]

One thing I remember from my Grandmas funeral was this. All of the Grandkids, of which I'm the oldest were all sitting together. The little ones, 12 and under, cried the whole time. After the service we all got together at my uncles. An hour later they were all laughing and playing football outside on the lawn while the grownups including me were still sad. My point, kids are more resiliant than adults. I don't think it would hurt the kids to see their grandparent one last time even if they were scared a little bit.

[KevB]

Well, we took the kids to the hospital with the intention of seeing him. My wife went up first to see how he, and everyone else, was doing. We decided against it. He's got maybe another hour, and it just wasn't something they needed to see. Struggling for breath, sunken features, etc. They know he's sick, and the oldest certainly senses what's going on. When we get the call, we'll have the sit down to discuss and answer questions from them. We've know this was coming for six months, so the kids have had ample opportunity to spend time with him fortunately.

For those that read this, please keep our family in your thoughts. He really was a great man, and will be missed deeply.

[Oz_Chief]

The only way I wouldn't let a child see a dying or dead member of family is if they're horribly mutilated.

Death is part of life. If we sugar-coat it or shield our children from it, it's really going to hurt when their first experience with death is as an adult.

Take your kids. Act natural. The only way they're going to be scarred is if mom & dad wail and weep.

I could not agree more.

[KevB]

I think wailing and weeping are just as much a part of life as dying is.

If this is your first move to talk to them about death, you've got bigger fish to fry than visiting the relative.

If it isn't your first move, why not take them? The trend towards removing our kids from suffering, both in their lives and others, is a real damaging way to go, in my opinion.

The great news is that you're the parent, so you get to decide. Keep us posted.

It's not "our first move", but this will be the first close family member that they've have a real connection to. We decided not to take them to the room....he simply wasn't the same man who they knew. It was late enough in the process that it would serve no purpose. Also, I don't think it's a "trend" when it comes to shielding your children from suffering. I'd say that's a fairly consistent characteristic in most parents. They'll be exposed to it certainly, but no point in rubbing it in.

[stevieray]

please let them see him..life is such an incredible gift...we so need others ..especially in situations like these...grandpa being in an incapacitaed state doen't diminish his life or his impact...not only will he get the joy of seeing his grandkids, you can let them know that as long as they are alive, so is their grandpa...

prayers and thoughts to you and your family.

[Hammock Parties]

Your kids are lucky, in a way. I've never experienced death and don't know how I'll handle it. I'm trying to get my grandmother to Arrowhead but she's stubborn. I want her to experience it before she goes.

[KCFalcon59]

My father was diagnosed with lung cancer early June 06. He died August 28th of 06. My kids were 10 and 8 at the time. We had planned to see him the weekend before he died but my sons football team scheduled a game late and we had to stay home to do that. He died the Monday following. It was difficult for the kids and I because we weren't able to say goodbye. We had hoped he could withstand treatment and when he went to the hospital we thought he would be home in a day or so. He just kind of crashed while at the hospital. His body couldn't take it anymore.

It has been a year and the kids still wish they had the chance to see him before he passed. I say take the kids to see him. But be truthful about his situation. Kids are stronger than we think and need the closure that being with our loved one when they pass provides.

JMO

[dtebbe]

We've had two pets pass in this past year (had to put one down this AM) and we found the best thing to do is just tell them about it, and answer all the questions they have. Being upfront on the first one has made the 2nd one much easier to deal with. Our poor ol scottie pete was going to be 14 on the 27th of this month, but his heart just gave out on him. I'm not sure if it's a scottie specific poem, but most scottie owners talk about the rainbow bridge:

Just this side of heaven is a place called Rainbow Bridge.

When an animal dies that has been especially close to someone here, that pet goes to Rainbow Bridge. There are meadows and hills for all of our special friends so they can run and play together. There is plenty of food, water and sunshine, and our friends are warm and comfortable.
All the animals who had been ill and old are restored to health and vigor. Those who were hurt or maimed are made whole and strong again, just as we remember them in our dreams of days and times gone by. The animals are happy and content, except for one small thing; they each miss someone very special to them, who had to be left behind.

They all run and play together, but the day comes when one suddenly stops and looks into the distance. His bright eyes are intent. His eager body quivers. Suddenly he begins to run from the group, flying over the green grass, his legs carrying him faster and faster.

You have been spotted, and when you and your special friend finally meet, you cling together in joyous reunion, never to be parted again. The happy kisses rain upon your face; your hands again caress the beloved head, and you look once more into the trusting eyes of your pet, so long gone from your life but never absent from your heart.

Then you cross Rainbow Bridge together....

Here's a pic I took a few weeks ago of my ol' buddy:
http://a679.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/97/l_ccfb43b76c8b9a1069b932b0b7bd70be.jpg

[Jilly]

From a children's pastoral care perspective:

You should definitely take your 8 year old...sitting him/her down, letting him/her know the situation, what he/she will expect, let her know you're right there with her, and that grandpa just needs the love of his family around him in this important transition in his life...
Your three year old won't know the difference, so it's up to you...she probably will be scared or will not be affected at all, depending on the personality.
Taking your five year old would be really really tricky. A mature five year old will be okay from the standpoint of, we're just going to let him know we love him, etc... but an immature five year old will be more apt to be scarred by it. I would err on the side of not taking her/him.

That's just my thoughts, take it or leave it.

[Jilly]

one more thing... be sure to let your children know that death is not a bad thing... It makes us sad and yes, we will miss our loved one, but it is actually something very peaceful and if you are of faith, something very sacred. If you don't take your kids, make sure you celebrate grandpa's life with them... maybe make a scrapbook of pictures of them and grandpa and talk about things like, "One time your grandpa...." etc etc... Just don't ignore them as if they aren't a part of mourning his death.

[Groves]

It's not "our first move", but this will be the first close family member that they've have a real connection to. We decided not to take them to the room....he simply wasn't the same man who they knew. It was late enough in the process that it would serve no purpose. Also, I don't think it's a "trend" when it comes to shielding your children from suffering. I'd say that's a fairly consistent characteristic in most parents. They'll be exposed to it certainly, but no point in rubbing it in.


Hey Man, I'm sorry about your relative (your wife's). That's tough, and I hope you'll get through it. Seems like you made a call, and it's working out. That's great.

You're right, parents shouldn't introduce extra suffering into their kids lives (except making them watch the chiefs when they're bad). I think I should have said *over* shielding their kids (child proofing the world, etc) That's more what I meant.

[KevB]

Hey Man, I'm sorry about your relative (your wife's). That's tough, and I hope you'll get through it. Seems like you made a call, and it's working out. That's great.

You're right, parents shouldn't introduce extra suffering into their kids lives (except making them watch the chiefs when they're bad). I think I should have said *over* shielding their kids (child proofing the world, etc) That's more what I meant.

Agree with you on the "over" comment. It's a fine line, but part of being a parent is introducing the bad with the good as they grow up. The key is to be there to help them understand the bad and how it's balanced with the good. Appreciate your comments.

[Mr. Kotter]

Take the 8 yr old, if she remembers/knows him well.

The others are just too young, IMO....to really benefit/need such a visit.

JMHO.


Best wishes, friend.

[cdcox]

Agree with you on the "over" comment. It's a fine line, but part of being a parent is introducing the bad with the good as they grow up. The key is to be there to help them understand the bad and how it's balanced with the good. Appreciate your comments.

Sorry for your loss, Kev. Sounds like you are handling the situation in a good way. Your kids will get the death experience at the funeral. I saw three of my grandparents fade away over the years in nursing homes, but I was over 40 before I went to the hospital room of a dying person.

[Iowanian]

we made the trip and the visit with the child.

The family member was awake from her coma, and actually able to carry brief conversations, and specifically said our names and asked abotu our daughter as we walked in.....and sparkled a little when she did waddle in behind us.

I think the child was a little uncomfortable at first, as she didn't look the same...the machines, no teeth, swollen face, no glasses. She eventually warmed up, held her hand, and gave her a kiss just before we left.

I didn't seem harmful whatsoever to the child, and I can tell you that seeing our daughter made a big difference for this family member, who knows she is short for this earth.

I am glad our decision on this turned out so well.

[Simplex3]

When my mother in law died of cancer and when my maternal grandmother died (of what they don't know) we took both of the kids (~2 and 5) to see them. We explained that they were very sick and that sometimes people get very sick. When they both passed we just sat them down and told them that they had died and that they weren't with us any more. Both funerals were out of town, so the kids didn't go. They will go to my paternal grandmother's funeral here just any day now, though it won't be your standard-issue church funeral.

As a society we have a great fear of death, and it's really too bad. Without death what's the point of life?

[FRCDFED]

My ex-wifes aunt recently died of cancer. As you can imagine, at the time of her death her appearance was very different than what my daughter was used to. However, she was a very special person to my daughter and was one of the nicest persons I've ever met. She had spent occasions with my daughter and one of her cousins as a "girls night out" where she pretty much spoiled them both.

My daughters reaction to her pending death was more of curiosity and sadness (my daughter is 9). My ex and I discussed whether or not my daughter should see the effects of cancer at such a young age.

I decided to allow it and I had a long conversation with my daughter about religion and explaining that there is more to a person than their looks. We discussed how special her aunt is and how her time had come to take her place in heaven. These were all concepts easily understood by my daughter. We also discussed how her aunt probably wouldn't recognize her or even remember her name but that those were side effects of the drugs she was on.

We placed heavy emphasis on my daughter getting one last opportunity to tell her aunt how special of a person she was and what she meant.

My daughter took that opportunity and didn't see her as a scary person suffering from cancer. She saw her as the wonderful person she was who was once so full of life. She somehow gained closure for someone of such a young age. She remembers the good times they spent together and discusses it sometimes with me when she comes across a picture of her aunt or has a dream about her. We still take the time to talk about it every now and then and thank God that we were blessed to have been able to meet and spend time with such a wonderful person. We make sure that we give thanks for that blessing.

While I don't usually share such intimate details on here regarding my personal life. I wanted to share this because of the decision you are facing regarding your own children.

God bless your family as well as your wifes in getting through the tough times.

[KevB]

My ex-wifes aunt recently died of cancer. As you can imagine, at the time of her death her appearance was very different than what my daughter was used to. However, she was a very special person to my daughter and was one of the nicest persons I've ever met. She had spent occasions with my daughter and one of her cousins as a "girls night out" where she pretty much spoiled them both.

My daughters reaction to her pending death was more of curiosity and sadness (my daughter is 9). My ex and I discussed whether or not my daughter should see the effects of cancer at such a young age.

I decided to allow it and I had a long conversation with my daughter about religion and explaining that there is more to a person than their looks. We discussed how special her aunt is and how her time had come to take her place in heaven. These were all concepts easily understood by my daughter. We also discussed how her aunt probably wouldn't recognize her or even remember her name but that those were side effects of the drugs she was on.

We placed heavy emphasis on my daughter getting one last opportunity to tell her aunt how special of a person she was and what she meant.

My daughter took that opportunity and didn't see her as a scary person suffering from cancer. She saw her as the wonderful person she was who was once so full of life. She somehow gained closure for someone of such a young age. She remembers the good times they spent together and discusses it sometimes with me when she comes across a picture of her aunt or has a dream about her. We still take the time to talk about it every now and then and thank God that we were blessed to have been able to meet and spend time with such a wonderful person. We make sure that we give thanks for that blessing.

While I don't usually share such intimate details on here regarding my personal life. I wanted to share this because of the decision you are facing regarding your own children.

God bless your family as well as your wifes in getting through the tough times.

Thanks for sharing. We took the kids over yesterday with the intention of visiting "grandpa" one last time. However, once he was unresponsive, we didn't think it would serve a purpose. It's such an individual choice, with no "right" answer. Had we not had lots of time to spend with him leading up to this, I'd probably be more adament that my kids see him one last time. Such a difficult decision....