Keitzman going off on Carl

[BigChiefFan]

On sports radio 810 Kevein Keitzman is going off on Carl. I love it. He's actually saying some good things. Great rant.

[Mr. Laz]

he's right .... irritating, but right.

[BigChiefFan]

This is great radio. At least KK is passionate about this.

[chrisdel]

he's right .... irritating, but right.

I agree with him that someone should start a petition / protest / walkout. Something to show that we've had enough.

[Mr. Laz]

"i need some meds, man ..... i need some meds...."

ROFL

[FAX]

"buffoonish" "pathetic" and "stupid"

FAX

[BigChiefFan]

I hope some of the fans take the blinders off.

[Planetman]

Keitzman going off on Carl
Water is wet.

[Mr. Laz]

"the next great general manager is out there and available right now ............ now maybe Clark Hunt is too busy in Fiji or with soccer to find him, i don't know"


LMAO

[Micjones]

Carl can write his own ticket.
And it's unfortunate.

We've put up with mediocre product for too long.

[DenverChief]

can a brother get a rundown?

[Carlota69]

Besdies thwe Fiji/Soccer comment--what else is he saying?

[Mr. Laz]

Besdies thwe Fiji/Soccer comment--what else is he saying?
he went off for like 20 minutes ...... don't know where to start. :)

[Fish]

can a brother get a rundown?

Carl sucks. The apocalypse is upon us.

[BigChiefFan]

He said Carl is like a Supreme Court justice-he has a lifetime appointment who can throw out mediocre teams every year without having to fear for his job as long as the money rolls in, ownership could care less.

[Chiefnj2]

He said Carl is like a Supreme Court justice-he has a lifetime appointment who can throw out mediocre teams every year without having to fear for his job as long as the money rolls in, ownership could care less.

So he stole Kornheiser's routine from preseason? That's sad.

[siberian khatru]

"the next great general manager is out there and available right now ............ now maybe Clark Hunt is too busy in Fiji or with soccer to find him, i don't know"


LMAO

That IS funny. ROFL

And probably true. :deevee:

[BigChiefFan]

So he stole Kornheiser's routine from preseason? That's sad. As long as it brings heat on Carl I could careless if it's somebody else's schtick. Carl needs to go.

[Chief Henry]

Carl is unaccountable to anyone.

Carl has not given us a superbowl winner

Carl has not given us a superbowl

Carl has not even given us a play off win since 1993

Carl has not even given us a decent complete team
on offense-defense and special teams at the SAME TIME.


Hey Carl, STFU and GTFO

[Mr. Laz]

So he stole Kornheiser's routine from preseason? That's sad.
he gave credit to kornehieser for it

[KCCHIEFS27]

Yeah..he said every other team in the league has improved attendance records and that's what Carl supporters hang there hats on. He is the only GM with a 19 year tenure who hasn't won a superbowl. Hired his good buddy as VP of Personnel, I forget his name, but as the head guy of the saints he went 3-13, 6-10, 6-10, 3-13. Keitzman said Herm should quit in the middle of the season because Carl is making him look like a guy that can't coach when all he did last year was take a team just as bad as this one into the playoffs through the back door. People have been going off for years about Carl, yet a smart guy like Clark can't figure it out? Oh one more thing, Glass (royals owner) was told Baird was the man to get so he got him and didn't work out so he got rid of him and then picked up Dayton Moore down the road. Atleast show the fans you WANT to progress and make some changes. HAHA, do they deliver the USA Today to the Fiji islands so Hunt can see it?

[BigChiefFan]

Yeah..he said every other team in the league has improved attendance records and that's what Carl supporters hang there hats on. He is the only GM with a 19 year tenure who hasn't won a superbowl. Hired his good buddy as VP of Personnel, I forget his name, but as the head guy of the saints he went 3-13, 6-10, 6-10, 3-13. Keitzman said Herm should quit in the middle of the season because Carl is making him look like a guy that can't coach when all he did last year was take a team just as bad as this one into the playoffs through the back door. People have been going off for years about Carl, yet a smart guy like Clark can't figure it out? Oh one more thing, Glass (royals owner) was told Baird was the man to get so he got him and didn't work out so he got rid of him and then picked up Dayton Moore down the road. Atleast show the fans you WANT to progress and make some changes. HAHA, do they deliver the USA Today to the Fiji islands so Hunt can see it?

Pretty good run-down of what he's stating.

[el borracho]

Carl and Herm would get a lot more slack if they would put Croyle in. Either rebuild or don't- you can't do both.

[Fish]

Carl and Herm would get a lot more slack if they would put Croyle in. Either rebuild or don't- you can't do both.

No they wouldn't. There are plenty of other topics they can parrot on about instead. Some would find a way to criticize if we went 19-0.

Some people here want to rebuild, but don't want to lose any games. They want a QBOTF, but not one who will throw an INT. They want balance, but we should throw the ball more.

They demand change, but they don't want change.

[DeezNutz]

I'm not a Carl fan. He did some good things, but his time has run its course in KC.

This said, the logic behind Kietzman's rant was asinine. For example: He compared Carl (and by extension the Hunt family) to David Glass and claimed that what Carl's done is far worse than Glass. Kietz's logic was that Glass hired Baird, then considered the next great thing. When this failed, Glass went with Moore, the next, next great thing, so at least he's trying.

No mention of what happened during Baird's regime. Two World Series champs not retained (one the MVP). Three-hole hitter on one of the best teams in MLB, gone. For lots of years = Glass wasn't trying to win but was trying to restructure the economics of the game. Carl = trying to win but not competent (or perhaps gutsy) enough to pull it off.

[gblowfish]

Dear Greatest Fans in the NFL:

In 19 years I have made millions, bordering on billions of dollars for the Hunt family.

I have helped pass a multi-million dollar stadium improvement package.

I've helped get the Chiefs exposure in Europe and Asia for the coming globalization of the NFL.

I've brought you hall of fame players like Joe Montana and Marcus Allen.

I've made sure our Arrowhead Nachos are the cheeziest in the NFL.

I've built a beautiful tent pavilion for our VIP fans...the Red Coaters.

I've had my own personal radio show to make myself available to my adoring public.

I am, in short, the longest tenured General Manager in Professional Sports.

And my parachute is Golden, baby. Swim in my wake.

Don't forget to buy your tickets for the November MU-KU Border Showdown at Arrowhead Stadium.

You're Welcome.

Your Pal,
Carl "Delano" Peterson
LTGMIPS

[tomahawk kid]

No they wouldn't. There are plenty of other topics they can parrot on about instead. Some would find a way to criticize if we went 19-0.

Some people here want to rebuild, but don't want to lose any games. They want a QBOTF, but not one who will through an INT. They want balance, but we should throw the ball more.

They demand change, but they don't want change.

Ding, Ding Ding.

And it people like those who keep 810 in business.

KK is doing nothing more than stirring the pot today and he knows it. He could give a f#ck less about the fans, unless they call his show and regurgitate his schtick right back at him.

I'm not saying some of the points brought up aren't valid, but let's not take Mr Kietzman for more than he is.

He could give a two sh!ts about the team or it's fans. He wants ratings, pure and simple........

[OnTheWarpath15]

No they wouldn't. There are plenty of other topics they can parrot on about instead. Some would find a way to criticize if we went 19-0.

Some people here want to rebuild, but don't want to lose any games. They want a QBOTF, but not one who will through an INT. They want balance, but we should throw the ball more.

They demand change, but they don't want change.


:clap: :clap: :clap:

[kcchiefsus]

He said he did a half hour of research and found some young personnel men in the NFL who could replace Carl. Named guys like Chris Polian (son of Bill Polian), Randy Mueller (second in command in New Orleans), and the second in command in New England who's name I can't remember.

[kcchiefsus]

Ding, Ding Ding.

And it people like those who keep 810 in business.

KK is doing nothing more than stirring the pot today and he knows it. He could give a f#ck less about the fans, unless they call his show and regurgitate his schtick right back at him.

I'm not saying some of the points brought up aren't valid, but let's not take Mr Kietzman for more than he is.

He could give a two sh!ts about the team or it's fans. He wants ratings, pure and simple........

Who cares WHO said it. The fact of the matter is that most of WHAT he said was true. That is a fallacy to discredit an argument simply because of who is making the argument.

[DeezNutz]

He said he did a half hour of research and found some young personnel men in the NFL who could replace Carl. Named guys like Chris Polian (son of Bill Polian), Randy Mueller (second in command in New Orleans), and the second in command in New England who's name I can't remember.

That's all it really takes. What's wrong with you, Clark?!?

[OnTheWarpath15]

He said he did a half hour of research and found some young personnel men in the NFL who could replace Carl. Named guys like Chris Polian (son of Bill Polian), Randy Mueller (second in command in New Orleans), and the second in command in New England who's name I can't remember.

A ****ing bum off the street COULD replace Carl.

Doesn't mean they are going to do a good job.

But to KK, anyone not named Carl Peterson is the best option available.

[tomahawk kid]

I'm not a Carl fan. He did some good things, but his time has run its course in KC.

This said, the logic behind Kietzman's rant was asinine. For example: He compared Carl (and by extension the Hunt family) to David Glass and claimed that what Carl's done is far worse than Glass. Kietz's logic was that Glass hired Baird, then considered the next great thing. When this failed, Glass went with Moore, the next, next great thing, so at least he's trying.

No mention of what happened during Baird's regime. Two World Series champs not retained (one the MVP). Three-hole hitter on one of the best teams in MLB, gone. For lots of years = Glass wasn't trying to win but was trying to restructure the economics of the game. Carl = trying to win but not competent (or perhaps gutsy) enough to pull it off.

Welcome to Sports Radio 810.

Widdle the facts down to only those that support this weeks rant, then sling sh!t for an hour and watch the cattle role in.

The sooner people wake up to the snake oil KK sells, the better

[tomahawk kid]

Who cares WHO said it. The fact of the matter is that most of WHAT he said was true. That is a fallacy to discredit an argument simply because of who is making the argument.


Bullsh!t.

Credibility is everything in a arguement.

[DeezNutz]

My favorite Kietzmanism: Carl can't draft!!! He's terrible at it!!! No success!!!

pauses for air and hopes listeners forget what was just said

He lets great draft picks leave!!! Tait!!!

:hmmm:

[chrisdel]

No they wouldn't. There are plenty of other topics they can parrot on about instead. Some would find a way to criticize if we went 19-0.

Some people here want to rebuild, but don't want to lose any games. They want a QBOTF, but not one who will throw an INT. They want balance, but we should throw the ball more.

They demand change, but they don't want change.

I disagree. I'm ready to rebuild, and I think fans are ready for it. What they don't want is Carl doing the rebuilding. He's had enough chances. It's time for a change.

Are the Chiefs doing any rebuilding this year? Just look at the roster. There is no direction right now.

And as far as Croyle being the QBOTF, that is a joke. The guy will be nothing in this league. He was injury prone in college; it will be worse in the NFL. He couldn't beat out Damon friggin Huard this year even though the coaching staff did everything to help him out.

[Rausch]

If you're going to bash Carl this might be the worst year in years to do it.

We finally drafted a QBOTF. He might take longer than we thought, but we've got one.

The defense looks good enough right now to win a playoff game and most of it is young.

We finally drafted a WR with some talent.

I don't think talent is the problem. We're a more talented team this year than we were last year.

But then, it's only week one. It's time to overexaggerate and dare to be stupid...

[DeezNutz]

Welcome to Sports Radio 810.

When KK is concerned, this is true. I give Petro a pass, though. He's usually pretty good.

[tomahawk kid]

When KK is concerned, this is true. I give Petro a pass, though. He's usually pretty good.

Agreed.

[hawkchief]

Welcome to Sports Radio 810.

Widdle the facts down to only those that support this weeks rant, then sling sh!t for an hour and watch the cattle role in.

The sooner people wake up to the snake oil KK sells, the better

Keitaman is a king-sized douche. However, there is no legitimate argument against what he is saying regrading Carl. My fuggin dog could get the same results he's getting with the Chiefs' franchise and he wouldn't be an arrogant, grredy jerk while he was doing it.

Carl's days are way behind him, and he should have been replaced long ago. Just because Keitzman says it doesn't mean it's wrong. Wake up and look at reality.

[tomahawk kid]

Keitaman is a king-sized douche. However, there is no legitimate argument against what he is saying regrading Carl. My fuggin dog could get the same results he's getting with the Chiefs' franchise and he wouldn't be an arrogant, grredy jerk while he was doing it.

Carl's days are way behind him, and he should have been replaced long ago. Just because Keitzman says it doesn't mean it's wrong. Wake up and look at reality.

I'm quite aware of reality Bob and I'm not a Carl apologist. Check out post #27.

I'm not saying his points are invalid. My point is that Kietzman, by his past actions has ZERO credibility and is only slinging sh!t to generate calls.

He doesn't give a rat's ass about the fans as his tries to portray everyday.

[Coogs]

If you're going to bash Carl this might be the worst year in years to do it.

We finally drafted a QBOTF. He might take longer than we thought, but we've got one.

The defense looks good enough right now to win a playoff game and most of it is young.

We finally drafted a WR with some talent.

I don't think talent is the problem. We're a more talented team this year than we were last year.

But then, it's only week one. It's time to overexaggerate and dare to be stupid...

I take it you did not have a chance to see any of the Chiefs four preseason games nor the game at Houston Sunday?

[DeezNutz]

I'm quite aware of reality Bob and I'm not a Carl apologist. Check out post #27.

I'm not saying his points are invalid. My point is that Kietzman, by his past actions has ZERO credibility and is only slinging sh!t to generate calls.

He doesn't give a rat's ass about the fans as his tries to portray everyday.

To further this point. Not too long ago, Kietzman acknowledged his personal bias toward Carl because apparently he tried to get KK fired when he was working for Fox 4. Kietzman: "He tried to take my livelihood away from me!!!" :deevee:

Thus his hatred for all things Carl, no matter what the man does.

[BigChiefFan]

Who cares WHO said it. The fact of the matter is that most of WHAT he said was true. That is a fallacy to discredit an argument simply because of who is making the argument.Great point. KK nailed it today. Carl deserves the heat. 19 years is enough.

[KCCHIEFS27]

Carl had a show years ago when he was trying to get attendance UP. After he did that, he crawled back into his hole. He only makes enough "reasonable" decisions to make a lot of you think he's going something good. Forget KK's BS, when are you going to smell Carl's? And quit sticking up for this guy. And to the person who was questioning KK's comparison between Glass and it was the Hunts, not Carl, you made his point for him. They FIRED Baird for doing horrible. Made a change.

[Fish]

I disagree. I'm ready to rebuild, and I think fans are ready for it. What they don't want is Carl doing the rebuilding. He's had enough chances. It's time for a change.

Are the Chiefs doing any rebuilding this year? Just look at the roster. There is no direction right now.

And as far as Croyle being the QBOTF, that is a joke. The guy will be nothing in this league. He was injury prone in college; it will be worse in the NFL. He couldn't beat out Damon friggin Huard this year even though the coaching staff did everything to help him out.

Great example of sloppily regurgitating what the media is shoveling you....

We want to rebuild... but not with that guy. Look at how terrible we've drafted the last few years.... Colquitt, Hali, Page, Pollard, Tyler. And our latest FA pickups.... Law, Surtain, Bennett, Boone..... all trash. He's not even trying...

We want a QBOTF, but not Croyle. I mean, he struggled and threw some INTs in preseason. Bust Bust Bust. No way could he improve..... Cut him now!

[BigChiefFan]

To further this point. Not too long ago, Kietzman acknowledged his personal bias toward Carl because apparently he tried to get KK fired when he was working for Fox 4. Kietzman: "He tried to take my livelihood away from me!!!" :deevee:

Thus his hatred for all things Carl, no matter what the man does.
That just shows how ruthless Carl really is. Why would he **** with another man's livelihood, especially when your some fat cat, who gets a free pass in this town. **** Carl.

[Extra Point]

And to the person who was questioning KK's comparison between Glass and it was the Hunts, not Carl, you made his point for him. They FIRED Baird for doing horrible. Made a change.
Yeah, 5 years too late!

[Mecca]

I don't like Keitzman but to act like because it's the general coming from him means you ignore it isn't right either...

The Chiefs deserve to be raked over the coals, this might be the first year a lot of the blind homer fans actually listen to it. There's no hiding what's going on right now.

[Rausch]

I take it you did not have a chance to see any of the Chiefs four preseason games nor the game at Houston Sunday?

I couldn't care less about the preseason.

And one bad game is one bad game. We played like poo 1st game last year as well and still made the playoffs. I'm just not ready to throw this season in the trash after less than 72 hours. Honestly.

I think not signing a vet QB to take the 3 spot was a mistake. We needed some kind of vet to help with croyle and even a guy like Printers has something to contribute. Canadian FB or not.

There are still a number of areas where we need talent but when one compares what we've added and what we've needed...hot Carl hasn't done too bad the last two years.

[Mecca]

Great example of sloppily regurgitating what the media is shoveling you....

We want to rebuild... but not with that guy. Look at how terrible we've drafted the last few years.... Colquitt, Hali, Page, Pollard, Tyler. And our latest FA pickups.... Law, Surtain, Bennett, Boone..... all trash. He's not even trying...

We want a QBOTF, but not Croyle. I mean, he struggled and threw some INTs in preseason. Bust Bust Bust. No way could he improve..... Cut him now!

No offense or anything put a first day punter better be really damn good, drafting a punter is questionable to begin with. You can't even list guys like Pollard or Tyler they are unproven we don't know.

Bennett has been trash so far you touch him he gets hurt....this roster is not overly talented compared to other teams, let's not act like it is.

[OnTheWarpath15]

To further this point. Not too long ago, Kietzman acknowledged his personal bias toward Carl because apparently he tried to get KK fired when he was working for Fox 4. Kietzman: "He tried to take my livelihood away from me!!!" :deevee:

Thus his hatred for all things Carl, no matter what the man does.

Yet KK defends the team that revoked the press passes of Bob Fescoe and Rhonda Moss because they were doing their job....

What about their livelihood?

[DeezNutz]

Carl had a show years ago when he was trying to get attendance UP. After he did that, he crawled back into his hole. He only makes enough "reasonable" decisions to make a lot of you think he's going something good. Forget KK's BS, when are you going to smell Carl's? And quit sticking up for this guy. And to the person who was questioning KK's comparison between Glass and it was the Hunts, not Carl, you made his point for him. They FIRED Baird for doing horrible. Made a change.

No one is sticking up for Carl. I said this in my first post: the guy needs to be replaced.

Kietzman's line of argumentation was embarrassingly flawed. He touched a hot-button issue: Fire Carl! Now the masses mindlessly nod yes, yes, yes...

KK is just a guy who happens to have a radio show. He can be difficult to listen to because he doesn't research his takes. Oops, sorry, more than 30 minutes. This is what separates KK from Petro.

[Mecca]

I couldn't care less about the preseason.

And one bad game is one bad game. We played like poo 1st game last year as well and still made the playoffs. I'm just not ready to throw this season in the trash after less than 72 hours. Honestly.

I think not signing a vet QB to take the 3 spot was a mistake. We needed some kind of vet to help with croyle and even a guy like Printers has something to contribute. Canadian FB or not.

There are still a number of areas where we need talent but when one compares what we've added and what we've needed...hot Carl hasn't done too bad the last two years.

Cincy is a hell of a lot better than Houston....

Honestly where are the Chiefs talented where are they above the NFL average? There's only a couple of positions, at some we are far below.

[hawkchief]

That just shows how ruthless Carl really is. Why would he **** with another man's livelihood, especially when your some fat cat, who gets a free pass in this town. **** Carl.


Carl's "ruthlessness" is simply his bully-like reactions due to his personal insecurities about his ability to capably perform his duties. He's used his bully pulpit for 19 years to attempt to intimidate the local media (not just Kietzman) becuase he doesn't like it when someone calls inot question his personnel record and management abilities.

IMO his insecurities are quite transparent, and his childish bullying tactics are one of the primary reasons I want to see his ass canned.

[Radar Chief]

That just shows how ruthless Carl really is. Why would he **** with another man's livelihood, especially when your some fat cat, who gets a free pass in this town. **** Carl.

That’s only if you believe KK, and he’s done nothing to warrant credibility here.

[DeezNutz]

That just shows how ruthless Carl really is. Why would he **** with another man's livelihood, especially when your some fat cat, who gets a free pass in this town. **** Carl.

Because he sucks at his job? Why should KK mess with Carl's livelihood? The rent's expensive for the penthouse.

[tomahawk kid]

No one is sticking up for Carl. I said this in my first post: the guy needs to be replaced.

Kietzman's line of argumentation was embarrassingly flawed. He touched a hot-button issue: Fire Carl! Now the masses mindlessly nod yes, yes, yes...

KK is just a guy who happens to have a radio show. He can be difficult to listen to because he doesn't research his takes. Oops, sorry, more than 30 minutes. This is what separates KK from Petro.

Again - totally agreed.

My point exactly.

[Mecca]

I don't think there's any question that Carl tries to bully the local media into reporting what he wants....

[Fish]

I don't like Keitzman but to act like because it's the general coming from him means you ignore it isn't right either...

The Chiefs deserve to be raked over the coals, this might be the first year a lot of the blind homer fans actually listen to it. There's no hiding what's going on right now.

The Chiefs do deserve to be raked over the coals. Carl's motives should be questioned. But this offseason everyone was excited about getting rid of so much of the old weight and getting youth on the team. There were numerous call for a 2 or 3 win season. We wanted a change.

Well.... change is here, and now people are bitching about what they were begging for last year.

[chrisdel]

Great example of sloppily regurgitating what the media is shoveling you....

We want to rebuild... but not with that guy. Look at how terrible we've drafted the last few years.... Colquitt, Hali, Page, Pollard, Tyler. And our latest FA pickups.... Law, Surtain, Bennett, Boone..... all trash. He's not even trying...

We want a QBOTF, but not Croyle. I mean, he struggled and threw some INTs in preseason. Bust Bust Bust. No way could he improve..... Cut him now!

The media is not shoveling anything to me. It's friggin obvious dude. 0 playoff victories in 14 years (assuming we don't make it this year, which I am). That should be enough to get him fired.

He's had good pickups, good drafts. I'm not saying he's not trying. I'm saying that he's had his chances and it's time for a change. He's made far too many mistakes in the last few years, and I don't have time to list them because I should be working right now.

And I'm sorry, but I just don't have faith in Croyle. We'll see more of him this year when the season is lost, and maybe I'll be wrong. We'll see.

[Mecca]

The Chiefs do deserve to be raked over the coals. Carl's motives should be questioned. But this offseason everyone was excited about getting rid of so much of the old weight and getting youth on the team. There were numerous call for a 2 or 3 win season. We wanted a change.

Well.... change is here, and now people are bitching about what they were begging for last year.

But the problem is for the change, the same shit is going on. Half the starting lineup is over 30. They are not playing Croyle...it looks like another bandaid it up to win 7 games effort as usual.

I also think a lot of us that called for change and a bad year were hoping this would happen and we could get rid of Carl. And Herm too, I was ok with Herm at first now I seriously hate the guy and wish he'd go away and never come back.

[chrisdel]

The Chiefs do deserve to be raked over the coals. Carl's motives should be questioned. But this offseason everyone was excited about getting rid of so much of the old weight and getting youth on the team. There were numerous call for a 2 or 3 win season. We wanted a change.

Well.... change is here, and now people are bitching about what they were begging for last year.

How is our team really younger? D-line and safeties. One receiver. That's it. They claim it's a youth movement, but I don't see it. I could be wrong, but 17 of the 22 starting positions on this team are older than last year.

[Direckshun]

Even a stopped clock is right two times a day.

KK's got it straight at this time. The last three personnel moves the Chiefs have made (Huard > Croyle, Drummond > Phinisee, cutting Medlock) were poor, short-sighted moves and have partially spoiled what should be handled as a rebuilding year.

[Chiefnj2]

The Chiefs do deserve to be raked over the coals. Carl's motives should be questioned. But this offseason everyone was excited about getting rid of so much of the old weight and getting youth on the team. There were numerous call for a 2 or 3 win season. We wanted a change.

Well.... change is here, and now people are bitching about what they were begging for last year.

The change is half-assed. You build an offense through the OL and QB.

[Rausch]

Cincy is a hell of a lot better than Houston....

Honestly where are the Chiefs talented where are they above the NFL average? There's only a couple of positions, at some we are far below.

We have a young safety tandem that's talented but still learning. Year 2, it's not like they'll be lockdown coverage guys in that span.

Add turk and Tank. Again, talented and looking good.

We have no idea what we have at WR yet 'cause he's a rook.

DJ and even Nappy are fairly young. Our LB's are set.

Hali and Allen are a sweet bookend combo.

And while it's not an impact position (for us it is) our Punter deserves a probowl.

And who could forget LJ?..

[Fish]

No offense or anything put a first day punter better be really damn good, drafting a punter is questionable to begin with. You can't even list guys like Pollard or Tyler they are unproven we don't know.

Bennett has been trash so far you touch him he gets hurt....this roster is not overly talented compared to other teams, let's not act like it is.

Are you saying Colquitt isn't a 1st day value to this team right now?

And yes, I think I can list guys like Pollard or Tyler. If you don't think they have more ability than Sims and Bartee, then I question your sanity. They will continue to show their abilities.

And Bennett is still a better backup than we've had for a long time.

[htismaqe]

I'm not a Carl fan. He did some good things, but his time has run its course in KC.

This said, the logic behind Kietzman's rant was asinine. For example: He compared Carl (and by extension the Hunt family) to David Glass and claimed that what Carl's done is far worse than Glass. Kietz's logic was that Glass hired Baird, then considered the next great thing. When this failed, Glass went with Moore, the next, next great thing, so at least he's trying.

No mention of what happened during Baird's regime. Two World Series champs not retained (one the MVP). Three-hole hitter on one of the best teams in MLB, gone. For lots of years = Glass wasn't trying to win but was trying to restructure the economics of the game. Carl = trying to win but not competent (or perhaps gutsy) enough to pull it off.

Actually, Carl has been trying for the last 10 years to restructure the economics of the game in the form of adding additional playoff participants...

[Mr. Laz]

No they wouldn't. There are plenty of other topics they can parrot on about instead. Some would find a way to criticize if we went 19-0.

Some people here want to rebuild, but don't want to lose any games. They want a QBOTF, but not one who will throw an INT. They want balance, but we should throw the ball more.

They demand change, but they don't want change.

and there some people who have NEVER found anything they couldn't blame on the media or other fans.

[BigChiefFan]

Carl's "ruthlessness" is simply his bully-like reactions due to his personal insecurities about his ability to capably perform his duties. He's used his bully pulpit for 19 years to attempt to intimidate the local media (not just Kietzman) becuase he doesn't like it when someone calls inot question his personnel record and management abilities.

IMO his insecurities are quite transparent, and his childish bullying tactics are one of the primary reasons I want to see his ass canned. Great post. I agree completely.

[DeezNutz]

Even a stopped clock is right two times a day.

KK's got it straight at this time. The last three personnel moves the Chiefs have made (Huard > Croyle, Drummond > Phinisee, cutting Medlock) were poor, short-sighted moves and have partially spoiled what should be handled as a rebuilding year.

Did you actually hear KK today? You just made a more compelling point than he made in his entire 20-minute rant. If by "got it straight" you mean Carl should go, ok, but how much thought does that take? Quick, ill-conceived, emotionally-charged crap is a KK specialty.

[Mecca]

We have a young safety tandem that's talented but still learning. Year 2, it's not like they'll be lockdown coverage guys in that span.

Add turk and Tank. Again, talented and looking good.

We have no idea what we have at WR yet 'cause he's a rook.

DJ and even Nappy are fairly young. Our LB's are set.

Hali and Allen are a sweet bookend combo.

And while it's not an impact position (for us it is) our Punter deserves a probowl.

And who could forget LJ?..

Ok I haven't seen 1 good thing from Turk McBride but I'll say this, until they become good players they are unknowns. At best you can say league average players.....

At the WR position even if Bowe becomes good we are still one of the absolute worst teams in the league at that position.

DJ so far in his career is a league average LB, Nap Harris has basically sucked and been injury prone...

The ends are a good pairing and together are better than what a lot of teams will pair up.

Our punter is never going to make a pro bowl because that guy up in Buffalo that was undrafted, Brian Moorman is better than he is.

And LJ has all history pointing to him becoming a declining player with a short career....right now I'd take at least 3 RB's before him.

[bobbything]

I want to hear someone actually refute what Kietzman was saying. Love him or hate him, he was saying the same things that all of "us" have been saying for some time.

[DeezNutz]

Actually, Carl has been trying for the last 10 years to restructure the economics of the game in the form of adding additional playoff participants...

Point taken. But no one can seriously argue that Glass has been trying and Carl (or Hunt) hasn't. When the Royals' payroll is consistently at or above the money they receive in revenue sharing, then let's talk. I think the whole "Carl just wants to fill the seats" argument is bull. Does he want to do that? Yes. Does he want to win, too? Yes. For years, winning wasn't Glass's first priority. I hope this has changed.

[htismaqe]

The change is half-assed. You build an offense through the OL and QB.

It's not half-assed at all.

They're deliberately doing it this way because they don't WANT change, but they want to give the fans the impression that things are changing...

[hawkchief]

The Chiefs do deserve to be raked over the coals. Carl's motives should be questioned. But this offseason everyone was excited about getting rid of so much of the old weight and getting youth on the team. There were numerous call for a 2 or 3 win season. We wanted a change.

Well.... change is here, and now people are bitching about what they were begging for last year.

No, we're NOT getting what we've been beggin for. Where have we gotten younger? QB - no, see Huard instead of Croyle. Kicker - no, he got two FG chances and then was cut. LB - no, see Donnie Edwards. CB - no, see Pat Surtain and Ty Law. We got younger on the OL because guys like Shields and Roaf retired because they got tired of waitng for Carl to put a defense on the field to support them.

Carl Peterson has had 19 years to build something in KC. 5+ of those years had 8 fuggin PRO BOWLERS on offense, and he still couldn't win an AFC Championship game. Now, the chickens have come home to roost, and all of his pathetic drafts and FA acquisitions have put this team in a terrible position, stocked with very little young talent - and dismal prospects for the future, period.

He's created a situation that won't be fixed in one or two seasons, yet he continues to try and win 7-9 games, at the expense of possibly building a winner for the future, which is what most of us want. He does it to persuade the "real fans"/lemmings, foolish enough and unable to see through his ruse, to continue to buy his shitty product so he can keep his job for another year or two.

That's not what I want, and Clark needs to wake up before he runs his dad's franchise right over the cliff.

[bobbything]

Carl Peterson has had 19 years to build something in KC. 5+ of those years had 8 fuggin PRO BOWLERS on offense, and he still couldn't win an playoff game.
FYP.

[bobbything]

Carl Peterson has had 19 years to build something in KC. 5+ of those years had 8 fuggin PRO BOWLERS on offense, and he still couldn't win a playoff game.
FYP.

[Mecca]

It's not half-assed at all.

They're deliberately doing it this way because they don't WANT change, but they want to give the fans the impression that things are changing...

That's exactly what I think, and it's working there are tons of people buying in that it is changing when it's really not.

[tk13]

Point taken. But no one can seriously argue that Glass has been trying and Carl (or Hunt) hasn't. When the Royals' payroll is consistently at or above the money they receive in revenue sharing, then let's talk. I think the whole "Carl just wants to fill the seats" argument is bull. Does he want to do that? Yes. Does he want to win, too? Yes. For years, winning wasn't Glass's first priority. I hope this has changed.
I think Glass has made some massive mistakes over the years, but it's obvious he's trying to correct him and do this right. He hired the best GM prospect in the game of baseball, upped the payroll to $67 million, which is more than winning teams like the Twins, Indians, A's, etc spend... and way more than the D-Rays/Pirates/Marlins group we always get compared to spend. They actually had a list on an ESPN game a couple weeks ago with the 8 lowest payrolls in baseball, and for the first time I can remember the Royals weren't on it. We're gonna be top 10 in Latin American spending, we're spending more money on draft picks. We added a 7th minor league affiliate. We made one of the best free agent signings of last offseason in Gil Meche. I realize baseball isn't quite as level as football and it's a whole different discussion, but it's not nearly as dire as it was even 3-4 years ago.

[BigChiefFan]

No, we're NOT getting what we've been beggin for. Where have we gotten younger? QB - no, see Huard instead of Croyle. Kicker - no, he got two FG chances and then was cut. LB - no, see Donnie Edwards. CB - no, see Pat Surtain and Ty Law. We got younger on the OL because guys like Shields and Roaf retired because they got tired of waitng for Carl to put a defense on the field to support them.

Carl Peterson has had 19 years to build something in KC. 5+ of those years had 8 fuggin PRO BOWLERS on offense, and he still couldn't win an AFC Championship game. Now, the chickens have come home to roost, and all of his pathetic drafts and FA acquisitions have put this team in a terrible position, stocked with very little young talent - and dismal prospects for the future, period.

He's created a situation that won't be fixed in one or two seasons, yet he continues to try and win 7-9 games, at the expense of possibly building a winner for the future, which is what most of us want. He does it to persuade the "real fans"/lemmings, foolish enough and unable to see through his ruse, to continue to buy his shitty product so he can keep his job for another year or two.

That's not what I want, and Clark needs to wake up before he runs his dad's franchise right over the cliff.
Great post. You absolutely right about it being a ruse, that some have bought, hook, line, and sinker. This isn't a youth movement. This a patchwork, half-assed attempt of keeping the status quo.

[hawkchief]

Point taken. But no one can seriously argue that Glass has been trying and Carl (or Hunt) hasn't. When the Royals' payroll is consistently at or above the money they receive in revenue sharing, then let's talk. I think the whole "Carl just wants to fill the seats" argument is bull. Does he want to do that? Yes. Does he want to win, too? Yes. For years, winning wasn't Glass's first priority. I hope this has changed.

For many of us, wheter Carl really wants to win or not, is irrelevant. The fact that he's proven for 19 years now that he can't, makes it obvious that Clark Hunt (and evidently Carl's) first and primary concern is fleecing the fans out of big $$$, not winning a championship.

[DeezNutz]

If you don't think Glass is trying to win, you're not paying attention. He hired the best GM prospect in the game of baseball, upped the payroll to $67 million, which is more than winning teams like the Twins, Indians, A's, etc spend... and way more than the D-Rays/Pirates/Marlins group we always get compared to spend. They actually had a list on an ESPN game a couple weeks ago with the 8 lowest payrolls in baseball, and for the first time I can remember the Royals weren't on it. We're gonna be top 10 in Latin American spending, we're spending more money on draft picks. We made one of the best free agent signings of last offseason in Gil Meche.

I think I said that "for years winning wasn't Glass's first priority." Currently, it seems like things are changing for the better. It's going to take more than one off-season signing and one year of increased spending to convince me.

Next year, the Royals are expected to receive $70 mil. in revenue sharing. Let's see us continue to increase the payroll. Let's see us continue to be players for premier free-agent talent. We signed one expensive player. Great. Let's get another good one. Let's see us re-sign a stud player. If Gordon and Butler develop, are you absolutely sure Glass will pony up? Not me. He has a proven track record of not trying to win, and I'm going to have to see more evidence to the contrary before I can get really excited about this team.

Tired of being a glorified farm team...I don't want to spend money for spending's sake, but I want to see the positive trend we've seen this year continue.

[Fish]

No, we're NOT getting what we've been beggin for. Where have we gotten younger? QB - no, see Huard instead of Croyle. Kicker - no, he got two FG chances and then was cut. LB - no, see Donnie Edwards. CB - no, see Pat Surtain and Ty Law. We got younger on the OL because guys like Shields and Roaf retired because they got tired of waitng for Carl to put a defense on the field to support them.

Carl Peterson has had 19 years to build something in KC. 5+ of those years had 8 fuggin PRO BOWLERS on offense, and he still couldn't win an AFC Championship game. Now, the chickens have come home to roost, and all of his pathetic drafts and FA acquisitions have put this team in a terrible position, stocked with very little young talent - and dismal prospects for the future, period.

He's created a situation that won't be fixed in one or two seasons, yet he continues to try and win 7-9 games at the expense of possibly building a winner for the future, which is what most of us want. He does it to persuade the lemming foolish enough and unable to see through his ruse, to continue to buy his shitty product so he can keep his job for another year or two.

That's not what I want, and Clark needs to wake up before he runs his dad's franchise right over the cliff.

I agree. But his ruse is still working... making threads like this pointless. Which is the point I was trying to make. Some people don't even know what they want...

We got to see our QBOTF all preseason... and with that came countless threads about what a bust Croyle was. People were piling on about Croyle sucks, when it should have been clear that he's going to struggle some his first year of starting. Obviously, Carl was listening, and needed to placate those fans... so Huard is named starter, to the delight of many. Now we see Huard for what he is in the first game...

Same situation with the kicker. Bust bust bust was all you heard. But instead of giving him time to develop, he's a scapegoat the first game.

The same people bitching were more than likely the ones that were perfectly content when we were losing 38-31. At least that was exciting right?

Bitch about Carl, but he still manipulates his fans as easily as ever... and through the Hunt's eyes, the seats are still full. Why change?

[Mr. Laz]

almost all the youth are guys that will only see the field on special teams.

the starters are just as old as other teams in the league if not older.

[Mecca]

It's like I said a long time ago there are a lot of fans of this team that don't care about winning a Bowl or doing what it takes to get there.

They love the status quo of the Chiefs, they compete, win most of their home games. So they can go out there get drunk, tailgate and use it an excuse to have a good time party every Sunday and enjoy the games because the Chiefs usually win at home.

You do what it takes to win a Bowl you may kill those peoples good time party for a couple years and they will be totally pissed, that is why they don't want to see the kicker or a guy like Croyle.

[DeezNutz]

I think Glass has made some massive mistakes over the years, but it's obvious he's trying to correct him and do this right. He hired the best GM prospect in the game of baseball, upped the payroll to $67 million, which is more than winning teams like the Twins, Indians, A's, etc spend... and way more than the D-Rays/Pirates/Marlins group we always get compared to spend. They actually had a list on an ESPN game a couple weeks ago with the 8 lowest payrolls in baseball, and for the first time I can remember the Royals weren't on it. We're gonna be top 10 in Latin American spending, we're spending more money on draft picks. We added a 7th minor league affiliate. We made one of the best free agent signings of last offseason in Gil Meche. I realize baseball isn't quite as level as football and it's a whole different discussion, but it's not nearly as dire as it was even 3-4 years ago.

I appreciate the fact that you qualified your post. But I disagree that anything is obvious...yet. Let's see a trend. My previous post states more specifics.

[htismaqe]

Bitch about Carl, but he still manipulates his fans as easily as ever... and through the Hunt's eyes, the seats are still full. Why change?

And that's the bottom line...

[Paul Palmer]

I'm not a Carl fan. He did some good things, but his time has run its course in KC.

This said, the logic behind Kietzman's rant was asinine. For example: He compared Carl (and by extension the Hunt family) to David Glass and claimed that what Carl's done is far worse than Glass. Kietz's logic was that Glass hired Baird, then considered the next great thing. When this failed, Glass went with Moore, the next, next great thing, so at least he's trying.

No mention of what happened during Baird's regime. Two World Series champs not retained (one the MVP). Three-hole hitter on one of the best teams in MLB, gone. For lots of years = Glass wasn't trying to win but was trying to restructure the economics of the game. Carl = trying to win but not competent (or perhaps gutsy) enough to pull it off.

I love the bitter Royal fan in you DN...That's true blue KC...This team is simply missing pieces to be a competitive team...and that's got to rest with Carl...

[BigChiefFan]

It's all economics. An average team puts asses in the seats, a shitty team doesn't. Carl's main priority is money. Winning is secondary. That's why he shouldn't be the GM and CEO-it's a CONFLICT OF INTEREST.

[htismaqe]

almost all the youth are guys that will only see the field on special teams.

the starters are just as old as other teams in the league if not older.

Yep.

They have no problem plugging in youth at positions with relatively low risk.

[hawkchief]

I think I said that "for years winning wasn't Glass's first priority." Currently, it seems like things are changing for the better. It's going to take more than one off-season signing and one year of increased spending to convince me.

Next year, the Royals are expected to receive $70 mil. in revenue sharing. Let's see us continue to increase the payroll. Let's see us continue to be players for premier free-agent talent. We signed one expensive player. Great. Let's get another good one. Let's see us re-sign a stud player. If Gordon and Butler develop, are you absolutely sure Glass will pony up? Not me. He has a proven track record of not trying to win, and I'm going to have to see more evidence to the contrary before I can get really excited about this team.

Tired of being a glorified farm team...

David Glass backed up his wagon of $$$ and hired Dayton Moore, considered by most as the brightest young GM candidate in baseball. OTOH, The Hunt family continues sto pay one of professional sports biggest hucksters, Carl Peterson, millions of $$ to line their pockets for almost 20 years.

Given how unfair the economics of baseball are for a small market like KC, vis a vis those of NFL football and its revenue sharing, it's easy to argue that Glass is showing a lot more commitment to the fans of KC than the Hunts, at this point.

It's much more fair to criticize the Chiefs for sucking than the Royals. At least the Royals are paying the best guy available, in charge of making personnel decisions on behalf of the franchise.

[tk13]

I think I said that "for years winning wasn't Glass's first priority." Currently, it seems like things are changing for the better. It's going to take more than one off-season signing and one year of increased spending to convince me.

Next year, the Royals are expected to receive $70 mil. in revenue sharing. Let's see us continue to increase the payroll. Let's see us continue to be players for premier free-agent talent. We signed one expensive player. Great. Let's get another good one. Let's see us re-sign a stud player. If Gordon and Butler develop, are you absolutely sure Glass will pony up? Not me. He has a proven track record of not trying to win, and I'm going to have to see more evidence to the contrary before I can get really excited about this team.

Tired of being a glorified farm team...I don't want to spend money for spending's sake, but I want to see the positive trend we've seen this year continue.
I think we'll re-sign guys. We re-signed Sweeney. Beltran wasn't re-signing here, that's a pipe dream and it's embarrassing we still have to hear this crap 4 years down the road. He refused to stay in Houston, and that's the team that payed Roger Clemens a bazillion dollars every year to play half a season. He was going to New York, even if we offered him 200 million dollars.

The only other thing to hang off of was the Dye and Damon stuff, and that was nearly 7-8 years ago now... I think he's changed a lot and understands his role a lot better, and Dayton's probably helped him with that. I don't think Baird really knew how to do that. The problem is we really haven't developed a superstar player in the last 5 years to test that theory. We aren't gonna be able to re-sign every single stud player, hopefully. As Dayton says even the Braves had to let people go. But they always had somebody else to replace them, and that's what you're supposed to do.

Really, that shouldn't be a problem... we'll have the money to resign a few guys, and keep the farm system pumping. People act like that's a bad thing, but that's the same thing the Colts, Bears, Eagles, etc do in football, re-sign their 4-5 key guys and keep pumping the system with new young guys. It keeps things fresh and keeps you from getting straddled with too many bad bloated contracts... like Mike Sweeney.

[DeezNutz]

I think we'll re-sign guys. We re-signed Sweeney. Beltran wasn't re-signing here, that's a pipe dream and it's embarrassing we still have to hear this crap 4 years down the road. He refused to stay in Houston, and that's the team that payed Roger Clemens a bazillion dollars every year to play half a season. He was going to New York, even if we offered him 200 million dollars.

The only other thing to hang off of was the Dye and Damon stuff, and that was nearly 7-8 years ago now... I think he's changed a lot and understands his role a lot better, and Dayton's probably helped him with that. I don't think Baird really knew how to do that. The problem is we really haven't developed a superstar player in the last 5 years to test that theory. We aren't gonna be able to re-sign every single stud player, hopefully. As Dayton says even the Braves had to let people go. But they always had somebody else to replace them, and that's what you're supposed to do.

Really, that shouldn't be a problem... we'll have the money to resign a few guys, and keep the farm system pumping. People act like that's a bad thing, but that's the same thing the Colts, Bears, Eagles, etc do in football, re-sign their 4-5 key guys and keep pumping the system with new young guys. It keeps things fresh and keeps you from getting straddled with too many bad bloated contracts... like Mike Sweeney.

Why do you think he's changed? You have a one-year sample. That's great. I'm happy about what we've seen recently. But I know his track record. Please, please, David Glass, prove me wrong.

Yeah, you're right. A team can't and shouldn't re-sign everyone. But you have to have more than one high-quality player on a team, and this one can't be the DH. Ken freakin Harvey can't be your All-Star. There are no more excuses for the Royals. The small market stuff doesn't hold water anymore.

You're also right that we'll have the money to re-sign some guys. But the problem is that this has always been the case. Glass hasn't done it. KC sports: Where dreams go to die.

One last thing, and then I'm going to stop talking Royals: Do we even need to bring up the topic of the draft? Signability, signability, signability. Even this year. Best HS prospect, everyone's #2 player on the board, not drafted. In this regard, same old Royals. No, we probably can't afford A-Rod, but I think we could have paid Porcello (sp?) the $7 mil it would have taken to ink him. This is how "small-market" teams have to compete.

[tk13]

I think the Chiefs are a bit younger... you can't have 25 year old guys all over the field. That's just hard to do. The areas where we're really lacking is the O-line and CB probably. But even at CB we have a couple young undrafted guys Herm likes. We have Allen, Wilkerson, Hali, Turk, Tank, DJ, Harris, Pollard, Page, other than Kennison our other WR's aren't that old. Even have a young TE who could be a project in Allan. Have several RB's that aren't 30 yet. A couple young QB's. I think there's young talent almost every spot on the field.

Now, the flipside to that, when you have that many young guys, some people are gonna think some of them aren't good prospects. That's just natural. We'll just have to wait and see. I'm sure there will be some guys who will totally flop, some that will reach their potential, and some guys nobody thinks anything of who turn into quality players.

[tk13]

Why do you think he's changed? You have a one-year sample. That's great. I'm happy about what we've seen recently. But I know his track record. Please, please, David Glass, prove me wrong.

Yeah, you're right. A team can't and shouldn't re-sign everyone. But you have to have more than one high-quality player on a team, and this one can't be the DH. Ken freakin Harvey can't be your All-Star. There are no more excuses for the Royals. The small market stuff doesn't hold water anymore.

You're also right that we'll have the money to re-sign some guys. But the problem is that this has always been the case. Glass hasn't done it. KC sports: Where dreams go to die.

One last thing, and then I'm going to stop talking Royals: Do we even need to bring up the topic of the draft? Signability, signability, signability. Even this year. Best HS prospect, everyone's #2 player on the board, not drafted. In this regard, same old Royals. No, we probably can't afford A-Rod, but I think we could have paid Porcello (sp?) the $7 mil it would have taken to ink him. This is how "small-market" teams have to compete.
What's he gonna do? Fire Dayton? Pull the draft and Latin American money out from under everybody? I think Dayton will quit if anything too obstructive happens. He can have a GM job almost anywhere he wants.

[DeezNutz]

What's he gonna do? Fire Dayton? Pull the draft and Latin American money out from under everybody? I think Dayton will quit if anything too obstructive happens. He can have a GM job almost anywhere he wants.

I'm not sure of your point here. What's Glass going to do? Continue to be the same cheap-ass owner that he's consistently proven himself to be. The draft doesn't do anything to help your argument. Check my last amended post. Latin America is the most important change and could make all the difference. As I've repeatedly said, I hope this all changed with the hire of Dayton Moore. Based on our most recent draft, though, this still might not be the case.

[lancer348]

I'm not sure of your point here. What's Glass going to do? Continue to be the same cheap-ass owner that he's consistently proven himself to be. As I've repeatedly said, I hope this all changed with the hire of Dayton Moore. Based on our most recent draft, though, this still might not be the case.



I think you're wrong. DM could have ponied up for Porcello, but most teams have draft budgets and get Porcello, would have meant that there were other high upside guys that we could not take later in the draft.

Also, Look at our Latin American Spending where we are in the top portion of the league.

It's a bad idea to put all your eggs in one basket or prospect, especially with a high school kid in baseball who was not even the top prospect in the draft.

Diversify your Portfolio to minimize risk, this translates well over from finance into a number of areas.

Also, Let's not act like it was just the royals. Over 20 teams, all with money passed. I don't think it was because they are all idiots...

[DeezNutz]

I think you're wrong. DM could have ponied up for Porcello, but most teams have draft budgets and get Porcello, would have meant that there were other high upside guys that we could not take later in the draft.

Also, Look at our Latin American Spending where we are in the top portion of the league.

It's a bad idea to put all your eggs in one basket or prospect, especially with a high school kid in baseball who was not even the top prospect in the draft.

Diversify your Portfolio to minimize risk, this translates well over from finance into a number of areas.

Also, Let's not act like it was just the royals. Over 20 teams, all with money passed. I don't think it was because they are all idiots...

According to most analysts, if Price was #1, Porcello was #1(a). But this is beside the point. I agree with much of what you're saying. My point is that teams that can't sign the A-Rods have to maximize the value in other areas. Spend more on the draft. Always pick best player available. Spend more in Latin America, which it appears we're doing.

[tk13]

I'm not sure of your point here. What's Glass going to do? Continue to be the same cheap-ass owner that he's consistently proven himself to be. The draft doesn't do anything to help your argument. Check my last amended post. Latin America is the most important change and could make all the difference. As I've repeatedly said, I hope this all changed with the hire of Dayton Moore. Based on our most recent draft, though, this still might not be the case.
I'd disagree with that, the draft is the perfect example. We took a Scott Boras client who nobody thought we were gonna sign, and Dayton stood toe-to-toe with Boras and not only got who they thought was the best hitter in the draft, but made the mighty Boras blink first.

[DeezNutz]

I'd disagree with that, the draft is the perfect example. We took a Scott Boras client who nobody thought we were gonna sign, and Dayton stood toe-to-toe with Boras and not only got who they thought was the best hitter in the draft, but made the mighty Boras blink first.

If Dayton and co. really believed that Moose was the best player to select, then you're right. But Moore's position has been that pitching is the most important commodity in baseball, and all analysts said that Porcello was the best player available, maybe even the best player in the entire draft. Posnanski had an article the week before the Moose signing and quoted Dayton as saying that Porcello wasn't even an option for the Royals. I find this troubling and suggestive of typical Glass positions over the last 10 years or so.

[Mecca]

This thread was fun until it turned into a Royals thread...

[BigChiefFan]

I don't like the baseball to football comparasion. It's apples and orages, other than it shows the Royals are moving in the right direction and The Chiefs are going nowhere for 19 years in a row. Obviously the Royals have shown more in recent years. Hence actually making Baird accountable for his actions. Carl is on cruise-control.

[ChiefsCountry]

How is our team really younger? D-line and safeties. One receiver. That's it. They claim it's a youth movement, but I don't see it. I could be wrong, but 17 of the 22 starting positions on this team are older than last year.

And if alot of those guys got a year older where here last year. That has to be a dumb ass stat.

[Mecca]

Aren't the Chiefs still one of the oldest teams in the league?

[Stewie]

I hope when CP is leaving town KK is riding shotgun.

[Mecca]

It would be pretty hard to run out a guy who is part owner of the station he is on.

[Stewie]

It would be pretty hard to run out a guy who is part owner of the station he is on.

Thanks for the insight, but anyone in KC knows that. I was dreaming. I don't listen to that dickthrob and apparently 810 is losing listeners according to the latest data.

[Mecca]

That's probably in part because no one is excited about any KC sports now......

810 will probably always be ahead of 610 though.

[Stewie]

I listen to St. John and Petro when I can. When KK is on air I switch to 610. I can't stand his phoney-baloney points of view, fake guffaws at something that isn't remotely funny, and licking Jack Harry's ass.

[Mecca]

Neal Jones and that other guy aren't any better they're just really boring.

[Adept Havelock]

Thanks for the insight, but anyone in KC knows that. I was dreaming. I don't listen to that dickthrob and apparently 810 is losing listeners according to the latest data.

I wish you were right, I'd love to see KK run out of town. Oh well...

I'll listen to 810 when Petro's on, right up until he inevitably says something so ignorant I have to change the station.

[KcMizzou]

Neal Jones and that other guy aren't any better they're just really boring.Yeah, Keg calls them bland and blander. Pretty fitting.

[RoyalsRule]

last year we lost our home opener along with our starting qb and made the playoffs. these people crying are pathetic!!!

[htismaqe]

last year we lost our home opener along with our starting qb and made the playoffs. these people crying are pathetic!!!

How did that trip to the playoffs turn out?

14 years, no playoff wins.

Kinda speaks for itself...

[Mecca]

At least Cincy is good.....that is why I hate that comparison. There is a huge difference in losing to Cincy and losing to Houston.

[GarySpFc]

he went off for like 20 minutes ...... don't know where to start. :)

You should have heard KK 5 hour rant against Brodie Croyle. He stated, "The passes Croyle threw for interceptions were the two worst passes in NFL history." He had Trent Green on the phone, and tried to get him to agree. TG said, "I am going to have to disagree on this point."

[TEX]

last year we lost our home opener along with our starting qb and made the playoffs. these people crying are pathetic!!!

And didn't get one stinking 1st down until midway through the 3rd quarter. :hmmm:

Last year we lost to Cincinnatti and Denver. NOT Houston, who has never even had a .500 season :shake:

[WilliamTheIrish]

You should have heard KK 5 hour rant against Brodie Croyle. He stated, "The passes Croyle threw for interceptions were the two worst passes in NFL history." He had Trent Green on the phone, and tried to get him to agree. TG said, "I am going to have to disagree on this point."

Of course he's going to disagree. Jake Plummer owns probably the 5 worst passes in recent league history. The lefty throw out of the end zone stands alone like a "My Name Is Earl" moment.

[RoyalsRule]

maybe the texans are good? they have a teamful of high draft picks. on the road loss, we have always been a great road team right? I knw this would be abad year but some of u act like we were gonna make a run or something. stop whining!!!

[htismaqe]

maybe the texans are good? they have a teamful of high draft picks. on the road loss, we have always been a great road team right? I knw this would be abad year but some of u act like we were gonna make a run or something. stop whining!!!

I don't think ANYBODY here thought we were going to "make a run".

In fact, I think alot of people were full-prepared to suck and were OK with it because it was an opportunity for the team to make a clean break from the failed philosophy of adding over-the-hill free agents in an effort to "win now".

Instead, the Chiefs have done what they always do, as if they have a realistic shot at winning it all.

We're still gonna suck, but at the end of the day, we'll have NOTHING to show for it instead of taking our lumps and growing a team...

[Messier]

I don't think ANYBODY here thought we were going to "make a run".

In fact, I think alot of people were full-prepared to suck and were OK with it because it was an opportunity for the team to make a clean break from the failed philosophy of adding over-the-hill free agents in an effort to "win now".

Instead, the Chiefs have done what they always do, as if they have a realistic shot at winning it all.

We're still gonna suck, but at the end of the day, we'll have NOTHING to show for it instead of taking our lumps and growing a team...


You mean starting Croyle, right?

[htismaqe]

You mean starting Croyle, right?

That's one thing...

[Dartgod]

It's like I said a long time ago there are a lot of fans of this team that don't care about winning a Bowl or doing what it takes to get there.

They love the status quo of the Chiefs, they compete, win most of their home games. So they can go out there get drunk, tailgate and use it an excuse to have a good time party every Sunday and enjoy the games because the Chiefs usually win at home.

You do what it takes to win a Bowl you may kill those peoples good time party for a couple years and they will be totally pissed, that is why they don't want to see the kicker or a guy like Croyle.
You couldn't be more wrong.

[Messier]

That's one thing...


Alright. What else should we do? I mean, who else should be starting that will help the team grow?

[el borracho]

Alright. What else should we do? I mean, who else should be starting that will help the team grow?
QB, WR, TE and K are all positions that are/ were mishandled, IMO.

What I would have preferred:
start Croyle
cut Parker
keep Allan on the roster
keep Tynes and draft an Olineman or give Medlock more than one game to settle down

[el borracho]

Some smaller complaints:
I would have liked to see Niswanger get a chance at starting
I would have liked to see a younger guy at right tackle
Probably would have kept a different DB instead of Sapp

[beavis]

If Dayton and co. really believed that Moose was the best player to select, then you're right. But Moore's position has been that pitching is the most important commodity in baseball, and all analysts said that Porcello was the best player available, maybe even the best player in the entire draft. Posnanski had an article the week before the Moose signing and quoted Dayton as saying that Porcello wasn't even an option for the Royals. I find this troubling and suggestive of typical Glass positions over the last 10 years or so.
He wasn't an option for 25 other teams either, so if you're going to call out Glass on this one, you'd better put 75% of the owners on the same list.

I get really sick of hearing people Glass all the time. All the guy did was step in when the club was in total disarray after Mr. K and basically ensure that we have a team here for the forseeable future. Everyone knows how f*cked up the economics of baseball are. I just don't get the whole "he doesn't want to spend money to win" bandwagon. Especially for a lot of the reasons tk13 suggests in his previous post.

[pikesome]

Probably would have kept a different DB instead of Sapp

Gun likes what Sapp brings for blitzes. Before we found some promising (and that's all they are ATM) CBs I would have agreed.

[morphius]

Gun likes what Sapp brings for blitzes. Before we found some promising (and that's all they are ATM) CBs I would have agreed.
You mean Gun like him for his ability to bounce off the QB, instead of blitzing. Right?

[CoMoChief]

I remember getting some neg rep for pointing out the fact that it's been Lamar's fault that this organization hasn't won a championship since late 60's. His completely blind loyalty to Carl has hurt this team in so many ways that it's gonna take years for this team to be any good to actually make a real push.

Lamar is an oil tycoon. He's a business man. Always has been. He runs the Chiefs organization as if it were a business. Things got so bad in the 70's nad 80's that he had to clean house or he knew he wouldn't have his business for much longer. So he went and hired one of the best coaches in the game at that time in Marty Schottenheimer and brought in a promising GM in Carl. What those 2 did in the short span of just a few years is something that not many other NFL franchises have done. I mean there was an instant turnaround of how the Chiefs were being ran. We had some good drafts back then that produced many impact players for this team and it set up a good foundation for years to come. The NFL draft is the life blood of the league. You build championship teams through the draft. Carl knows this as does Herm.

If Lamar REALLY cared about winning a SB he would have let Carl go when Marty left. That season was in such disarray and there were signs that this organization needed another cleaned house. Lamar didn't do that (meaning Carl still stayed around). Lamar has been about money. We all know this and some refuse to believe that. If Carl didn't fill the seats at Arrowhead year after year, do you really think Carl would have stayed here all this time without really winning anything more than a couple of division championships? Hell No!!! That is the ONLY thing keeping Carl in his job.

Everyone bitches about Carl, myself included. But the ONLY and ONLY way we are ever gonna see him leave is to just simply not re-new your season tickets and simply don't show up to the games. Don't support the team in any way financially and that will more than damn sure get Carl's ass fired. That's the only way we are going to show the owners of this team that we are tired of the same ****ing shit season after season.

[pikesome]

You mean Gun like him for his ability to bounce off the QB, instead of blitzing. Right?

Sapp's not that bad, he plays hard. That alone gives him a leg up.

[CoMoChief]

He wasn't an option for 25 other teams either, so if you're going to call out Glass on this one, you'd better put 75% of the owners on the same list.

I get really sick of hearing people Glass all the time. All the guy did was step in when the club was in total disarray after Mr. K and basically ensure that we have a team here for the forseeable future. Everyone knows how f*cked up the economics of baseball are. I just don't get the whole "he doesn't want to spend money to win" bandwagon. Especially for a lot of the reasons tk13 suggests in his previous post.

He's been running this team like he did Walmart. If you really can't see that then you are so insanely blind. I remember him saying after one season in the KC star and that one of the first things he said about the previous season (a season in which we lost a shit ton of games, yeah I know that narrows it down alot huh?) is that the Royals made a profit. REALLY DAVE?!?!? Who really in this town ****in gives two shits whether or not you ****in made a profit on your baseball team!?!? I sure as **** don't. After he said that I haven't been to Kauffman Stadium since.

He's probably one of the richest owners in baseball. He sure as hell doesn't act like it. You keep your prized players you developed in the farm system. When Glass didn't do that, it sent a message to other players on the team that this team wasn't about winning, and they eventually left as well.

Yes the economics in baseball are ****ed up. But having that said you have to adapt to the economic changes that have been made ever since the strike. Now for the most part you have to pay to play. Sure there are exceptions to the rule, but those are exceptions that have kept their own farm players that have blossomed, Royals haven't done that and until this past season haven't done anything about it.

[ChiefsCountry]

I remember getting some neg rep for pointing out the fact that it's been Lamar's fault that this organization hasn't won a championship since late 60's. His completely blind loyalty to Carl has hurt this team in so many ways that it's gonna take years for this team to be any good to actually make a real push.

Lamar is an oil tycoon. He's a business man. Always has been. He runs the Chiefs organization as if it were a business. Things got so bad in the 70's nad 80's that he had to clean house or he knew he wouldn't have his business for much longer. So he went and hired one of the best coaches in the game at that time in Marty Schottenheimer and brought in a promising GM in Carl. What those 2 did in the short span of just a few years is something that not many other NFL franchises have done. I mean there was an instant turnaround of how the Chiefs were being ran. We had some good drafts back then that produced many impact players for this team and it set up a good foundation for years to come. The NFL draft is the life blood of the league. You build championship teams through the draft. Carl knows this as does Herm.

If Lamar REALLY cared about winning a SB he would have let Carl go when Marty left. That season was in such disarray and there were signs that this organization needed another cleaned house. Lamar didn't do that (meaning Carl still stayed around). Lamar has been about money. We all know this and some refuse to believe that. If Carl didn't fill the seats at Arrowhead year after year, do you really think Carl would have stayed here all this time without really winning anything more than a couple of division championships? Hell No!!! That is the ONLY thing keeping Carl in his job.

Everyone bitches about Carl, myself included. But the ONLY and ONLY way we are ever gonna see him leave is to just simply not re-new your season tickets and simply don't show up to the games. Don't support the team in any way financially and that will more than damn sure get Carl's ass fired. That's the only way we are going to show the owners of this team that we are tired of the same ****ing shit season after season.

I disagree with this so much. It aint about filling Arrowhead, it was Lamar didnt want the franchise to go back to being the laughing stock of the NFL. I think the Chiefs believe if you get into the playoffs anything can happen so the best chance is just to ge there.

[ChiefsCountry]

He's probably one of the richest owners in baseball.

No he is not, not even close. Most of his wealth is the Royals themselves.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Everyone bitches about Carl, myself included. But the ONLY and ONLY way we are ever gonna see him leave is to just simply not re-new your season tickets and simply don't show up to the games. Don't support the team in any way financially and that will more than damn sure get Carl's ass fired. That's the only way we are going to show the owners of this team that we are tired of the same ****ing shit season after season.

In theory, that's an easy solution.

IMO, it's not a realistic one...at least not yet.

If people like me, BRC, dartgod, etc give up our seats, there will be people right behind us to pick them up.

It doesn't send a message unless the ENTIRE fan base is on board.

So I'm supposed to give up my seats to stick it to the man, then be screwed when the team is good again in a year or two? Then instead of having good/decent seats, I have to sit in row 40 of the upper corners.

I enjoy going to the games win or lose. Of course I'd rather see us win, but I think it's shortsighted to think that if I gave up my tickets, Carl would get fired.

Hell, he'll be gone in 3 years max as it is. I've waited this long, I can wait a few more......

[CoMoChief]

I disagree with this so much. It aint about filling Arrowhead, it was Lamar didnt want the franchise to go back to being the laughing stock of the NFL. I think the Chiefs believe if you get into the playoffs anything can happen so the best chance is just to ge there.
Of course it's about filling up Arrowhead. How can it not be? Carl hasn't done anything while he's been here as far as winning. What else could it be? Why do you think Carl has a job still after almost 20 years? He's still making Lamar money. He's still filling up Arrowhead. Before Carl got here Arrowhead was a ghost town. No one went to the games. Lamar was losing money at the time, a lot of money. A change needed to be made.

As a business man, which Lamar is, why would you change anything if you are profiting over $40-$50M a year?!?! Arrowhead is a great atmosphere that keeps people coming back for more and more. If that changes, especially with Clark as the head guy with his father no longer looking over his shoulder, you can bet your ass Carl would be canned.

[dirk digler]

Just think about this for a second. In almost 40 years the Chiefs have basically had 2 men run the organization, Jack Steadman and Carl Peterson.

The Hunts are loyal to fault and for some reason it takes them forever to make a decision to let somebody go.

[CoMoChief]

In theory, that's an easy solution.

IMO, it's not a realistic one...at least not yet.

If people like me, BRC, dartgod, etc give up our seats, there will be people right behind us to pick them up.

It doesn't send a message unless the ENTIRE fan base is on board.

So I'm supposed to give up my seats to stick it to the man, then be screwed when the team is good again in a year or two? Then instead of having good/decent seats, I have to sit in row 40 of the upper corners.

I enjoy going to the games win or lose. Of course I'd rather see us win, but I think it's shortsighted to think that if I gave up my tickets, Carl would get fired.

Hell, he'll be gone in 3 years max as it is. I've waited this long, I can wait a few more......

I know you're a die hard fan, and I am too. But when is it gonna change? When is enough, enough?!?!? Every year people bitch about this and no one ever does anything about it.

I'm waiting for the moment when Carl decides to get another contract extension and Clark gives him the go on it. Then hopefully people will realize what this organization is all about.

[Otter]

Hell, he'll be gone in 3 years max as it is. I've waited this long, I can wait a few more......

Unfortunately Carl leaving doesn't guarantee change in philosophy. There's been men above him who refused to call a spade a spade for quiet awhile.

San Diego put up with 1 and out Shotty for how long? The Chiefs put up with 1 and out Peterson for how long?

[ChiefsCountry]

Of course it's about filling up Arrowhead. How can it not be? Carl hasn't done anything while he's been here as far as winning. What else could it be? Why do you think Carl has a job still after almost 20 years? He's still making Lamar money. He's still filling up Arrowhead. Before Carl got here Arrowhead was a ghost town. No one went to the games. Lamar was losing money at the time, a lot of money. A change needed to be made.

As a business man, which Lamar is, why would you change anything if you are profiting over $40-$50M a year?!?! Arrowhead is a great atmosphere that keeps people coming back for more and more. If that changes, especially with Clark as the head guy with his father no longer looking over his shoulder, you can bet your ass Carl would be canned.

NFL teams make so much more than just ticket money. Hell they dont even get to keep all their own ticket money. Only about 60% of it.

[ChiefsCountry]

San Diego put up with 1 and out Shotty for how long? The Chiefs put up with 1 and out Peterson for how long?

San Diego got rid of Marty bc the GM and him didnt like each other.

[OnTheWarpath15]

I know you're a die hard fan, and I am too. But when is it gonna change? When is enough, enough?!?!? Every year people bitch about this and no one ever does anything about it.

I guess you'd have to ask each and every person who threated to cancel their tickets but renewed anyway what the reasoning was.

This may piss some people off, but I think it's much easier to walk away from a team when the only thing you're sacrificing is your time. I waited 10 years to get good seats. I came up on the waiting list in the 90's and passed because I didn't want to sit in the worst seats in the house and be stuck there for years. I was lucky enough to find someone who transferred me his seats. I'm not gonna let them go now because were going through a transition period.


I'm waiting for the moment when Carl decides to get another contract extension and Clark gives him the go on it. Then hopefully people will realize what this organization is all about.

I really don't think that's gonna happen, but if it did, I think you'd see a lot more people walk away, unless we happen to be winning.

[Otter]

San Diego got rid of Marty bc the GM and him didnt like each other.

So you're saying that if Marty would have took them to the Super Bowl that year they would have still got rid of him? A BIG reason SD got rid of Marty was because of his constant playoff failures, it's been documented.

Google is your friend and Carl is a bigger post-season loser than Marty.

[ChiefsCountry]

So you're saying that if Marty would have took them to the Super Bowl that year they would have still got rid of him? A BIG reason SD got rid of Marty was because of his constant playoff failures, it's been documented.

Google is your friend and Carl is a bigger post-season loser than Marty.

I know Marty is a comple playoff failure. Its also well documented that AJ Smith and Marty hated each other.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Unfortunately Carl leaving doesn't guarantee change in philosophy. There's been men above him who refused to call a spade a spade for quiet awhile.

San Diego put up with 1 and out Shotty for how long? The Chiefs put up with 1 and out Peterson for how long?

I'm in 100% agreement, Otter.

I've said numerous times that Carl leaving/getting fired probably means that either Bill Kuharich or Denny Thum would be the new GM.

And to me, that's like having Carl Peterson's twin brother at the helm.

But I'm gonna have the patience to see if my theory is correct, instead of just assuming it is.

[ChiefsCountry]

I've said numerous times that Carl leaving/getting fired probably means that either Bill Kuharich or Denny Thum would be the new GM.

I know Denny Thum would take over for his president and ceo roles I dont know about the football side though.

[Archie Bunker]

I'm in 100% agreement, Otter.

I've said numerous times that Carl leaving/getting fired probably means that either Bill Kuharich or Denny Thum would be the new GM.

And to me, that's like having Carl Peterson's twin brother at the helm.

But I'm gonna have the patience to see if my theory is correct, instead of just assuming it is.

I would be shocked if Kuharich doesn't take over.

[beavis]

He's been running this team like he did Walmart. If you really can't see that then you are so insanely blind. I remember him saying after one season in the KC star and that one of the first things he said about the previous season (a season in which we lost a shit ton of games, yeah I know that narrows it down alot huh?) is that the Royals made a profit. REALLY DAVE?!?!? Who really in this town ****in gives two shits whether or not you ****in made a profit on your baseball team!?!? I sure as **** don't. After he said that I haven't been to Kauffman Stadium since.

He's probably one of the richest owners in baseball. He sure as hell doesn't act like it. You keep your prized players you developed in the farm system. When Glass didn't do that, it sent a message to other players on the team that this team wasn't about winning, and they eventually left as well.

Yes the economics in baseball are ****ed up. But having that said you have to adapt to the economic changes that have been made ever since the strike. Now for the most part you have to pay to play. Sure there are exceptions to the rule, but those are exceptions that have kept their own farm players that have blossomed, Royals haven't done that and until this past season haven't done anything about it.
What you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

[suds79]

What you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

ROFL One of the funniest movie quotes of all time. ROFL

[Archie Bunker]

What you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Rep for Billy Madison :clap:

[el borracho]

Gun likes what Sapp brings for blitzes. Before we found some promising (and that's all they are ATM) CBs I would have agreed.
Well, Sapp is a small concern so I can't say I'm too unhappy about it. He literally won't matter at all this season or any other season. Knowing that, however, means his spot could go to someone else and we lose nothing so I probably would have preferred it. Then again, the odds are his replacement would also amount to zero in the grand scheme of things so, who cares?

[htismaqe]

Gun likes what Sapp brings for blitzes. Before we found some promising (and that's all they are ATM) CBs I would have agreed.

As of right now, Sapp is most productive kick returner on the team...

[htismaqe]

I'm in 100% agreement, Otter.

I've said numerous times that Carl leaving/getting fired probably means that either Bill Kuharich or Denny Thum would be the new GM.

And to me, that's like having Carl Peterson's twin brother at the helm.

But I'm gonna have the patience to see if my theory is correct, instead of just assuming it is.

Bingo.

This team needs a thorough cleaning. Hiring Kuharich or Thum is essentially sweeping the dirt under the rug and YET AGAIN pretending it doesn't exist...

[htismaqe]

I think the Chiefs believe if you get into the playoffs anything can happen so the best chance is just to ge there.

The last 2 decades definitively prove that their belief is wrong.

When are they going to swallow their pride and admit that they're wrong?

[ChiefsCountry]

The last 2 decades definitively prove that their belief is wrong.

When are they going to swallow their pride and admit that they're wrong?

That isnt my opinion its what the jackasses on Arrowhead Drive beleive.

[htismaqe]

That isnt my opinion its what the jackasses on Arrowhead Drive beleive.

Oh, I know that.

[kregger]

That isnt my opinion its what the jackasses on Arrowhead Drive beleive.
They don't know what to believe. Whether it's 13-3 or 9-7, the team has NO idea how to perform in the post season. Home-field advantage is a cruel joke in these parts.

[ChiefsCountry]

So I'm supposed to give up my seats to stick it to the man, then be screwed when the team is good again in a year or two? Then instead of having good/decent seats, I have to sit in row 40 of the upper corners.

Wow that reminds me of my family's story. Throught the late 70's and 80's had season tickets on the 50 yard line, lower bowl and suite access. Gave them up in early 1989.

[Mecca]

I would be shocked if Kuharich doesn't take over.

Because we need the guy who traded a whole draft for Ricky Williams.

[shaneo69]

I know you're a die hard fan, and I am too. But when is it gonna change? When is enough, enough?!?!? Every year people bitch about this and no one ever does anything about it.


I gave up my season tickets after the Great Collapse of 2005. And I haven't missed it at all.

I'm pretty sure that by the time this franchise hires someone who gives us a legit chance to get to the Super Bowl, there will be plenty of good seats available.

In the meantime, buy baseball season tickets. At least the Royals have upside.

[Messier]

At least the Royals have upside.


So will the Chiefs if they're one of the worst teams in the league for fifteen years like the Royals have been.

[Calcountry]

I remember getting some neg rep for pointing out the fact that it's been Lamar's fault that this organization hasn't won a championship since late 60's. His completely blind loyalty to Carl has hurt this team in so many ways that it's gonna take years for this team to be any good to actually make a real push.

Lamar is an oil tycoon. He's a business man. Always has been. He runs the Chiefs organization as if it were a business. Things got so bad in the 70's nad 80's that he had to clean house or he knew he wouldn't have his business for much longer. So he went and hired one of the best coaches in the game at that time in Marty Schottenheimer and brought in a promising GM in Carl. What those 2 did in the short span of just a few years is something that not many other NFL franchises have done. I mean there was an instant turnaround of how the Chiefs were being ran. We had some good drafts back then that produced many impact players for this team and it set up a good foundation for years to come. The NFL draft is the life blood of the league. You build championship teams through the draft. Carl knows this as does Herm.

If Lamar REALLY cared about winning a SB he would have let Carl go when Marty left. That season was in such disarray and there were signs that this organization needed another cleaned house. Lamar didn't do that (meaning Carl still stayed around). Lamar has been about money. We all know this and some refuse to believe that. If Carl didn't fill the seats at Arrowhead year after year, do you really think Carl would have stayed here all this time without really winning anything more than a couple of division championships? Hell No!!! That is the ONLY thing keeping Carl in his job.

Everyone bitches about Carl, myself included. But the ONLY and ONLY way we are ever gonna see him leave is to just simply not re-new your season tickets and simply don't show up to the games. Don't support the team in any way financially and that will more than damn sure get Carl's ass fired. That's the only way we are going to show the owners of this team that we are tired of the same ****ing shit season after season.That is usually right about the time the Owner says something like this to himself, "Time to get a new location".

Somewhere the fans will be so excited at even having the NFL, they will sell out a mediocre team for years before they demand a winner.