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View Full Version : Query, did this game cost Allen his payday


Baby Lee
11-25-2007, 05:10 PM
Not that he played particularly bad, but this unit presents itself as one with NO ONE deserving of a big payday.
There's no one who screams we need this guy or we'll fall apart. We've fallen apart. Now to rebuild.
Franchise him? Sure, if you sense he'll perform as a franchised player. Set the bar for D-Line Ks? Not with this squad.

CoMoChief
11-25-2007, 05:15 PM
Allen is still in running for DPOY.

So what he had one bad game. The entire defense was bad, not just him.

He deserves to get paid, and he will get paid.

CupidStunt
11-25-2007, 05:16 PM
Gotta sign him long-term and hope for the best, which isn't what I said about LJ. Allen is young, plays at a much, much more important position and should get better.

Even IF you get picks for him, who do you take? No one in this entire draft is worth Allen; MAYBE Chris Long or Glenn Dorsey are great but you just don't do that.

Mecca
11-25-2007, 05:18 PM
Cost him his pay day.......depends on the rest of the year. If he turns invisible and does nothing the rest of the year then yes he will get a lot less money...

But after resigning a RB if they walked away from a DE it would be a bonehead move of monumental proportions.

gblowfish
11-25-2007, 05:21 PM
Don't give up on him yet. I think he played most of the second half with a shoulder stinger. He looked like he was really hurt coming off the field in the 3rd Quarter. He chased the doctors off. I think he played with it, but it affected his mobility and strength.

Wouldn't be surprised to see him on the injury report next week.

Baby Lee
11-25-2007, 05:24 PM
Again, I'm not talking about his personal performance. I'm talking about a team that needs a different approach than retaining superstars. Because at this point we don't have a UNIT that can bring out a superstar.
We need to coach up a bunch of 'nobodies' to mold into somebodies, not a bunch of scrubs to fill out a roster around a core of superstars.

We've already seen what surrounding our superstar RB with scrubs on the o-line paid off.

Mecca
11-25-2007, 05:28 PM
You build a team around DE's you don't get rid of them.....they need better DT's and some other guys need to be replaced.

Hell Hali has been invisible nearly this entire year.

CupidStunt
11-25-2007, 05:31 PM
I'm not the type of guy to go bumping old threads, especially after a loss like this, but I do love how people acknowledge things after a loss but fail to do so after the wins and good performances.

I said a long time ago this season Hali was not playing well and stated how invisible he'd been. People should've either buttoned it or watched the guy more to realize what I was saying was true; THAT way, your expectations won't be destroyed as the year goes on.

Rain Man
11-25-2007, 05:34 PM
He's been great, and he had one bad game. Walter Payton and Barry Sanders had occasional bad games, too.

I don't know if he just felt bad today, or if that Raider LT was having a great day. Either way, he got shut down badly and it really hurt us.

Baby Lee
11-25-2007, 05:35 PM
You build a team around DE's you don't get rid of them.....they need better DT's and some other guys need to be replaced.

Hell Hali has been invisible nearly this entire year.
You build your team around LTs. That's the ONE surefire foundational position. It defines/d the Rams, Seahawks, and our offensive success. It's an underappreciated cog in the Pats' dynasty, it's effect is even now being shown in that 'shell' of a team, the Colts. The closest to having a 'foundation' DE is Cinci with Justin Smith, and they haven't exactly thrived either.

Rain Man
11-25-2007, 05:55 PM
You build your team around good coaching that has a philosophy that allows winning.

Extra Point
11-25-2007, 05:57 PM
They got their yardage on the left side. Donnie Edwards was vacant in the flat. Hali got trapped/pushed out of contain. A lot of ooo's and oow's and "Oh, that's what I should have done"'s in the film room.

FAX
11-25-2007, 06:04 PM
Great point, Mr. Baby Lee. That is, if I understand it correctly.

Every good team has one or two standout players, though. Now, do they stand out because they are that much better than their teammates or is it because the scheme showcases them?

Although true that Carl has proven once and for all that having a multi-million dollar RB and no offensive line is a bad plan. I don't think, however, that Allen's situation is identical. We have a lot of youth on defense and Allen was playing hurt today (or so I've heard).

The fact remains that, if Allen has a bad day - or doesn't play at all, the defense suffers. It should be easy to evaluate on film which should be enough to guarantee him a well-paying roster spot somewhere, if not on the Chiefs.

By the way, did we run any stunts with Allen today?

FAX

Bump
11-25-2007, 06:07 PM
our defense isn't good enough to have to rely on it with zero offense.

Simplex3
11-25-2007, 07:03 PM
From what I've seen you could bench JA in the second half and see no drop off in his yearly stats. That isn't what you want in your highest paid DE.

Baby Lee
11-25-2007, 07:14 PM
Great point, Mr. Baby Lee. That is, if I understand it correctly.

Every good team has one or two standout players, though. Now, do they stand out because they are that much better than their teammates or is it because the scheme showcases them?

Although true that Carl has proven once and for all that having a multi-million dollar RB and no offensive line is a bad plan. I don't think, however, that Allen's situation is identical. We have a lot of youth on defense and Allen was playing hurt today (or so I've heard).

The fact remains that, if Allen has a bad day - or doesn't play at all, the defense suffers. It should be easy to evaluate on film which should be enough to guarantee him a well-paying roster spot somewhere, if not on the Chiefs.

By the way, did we run any stunts with Allen today?

FAX
I'm not talking about not paying him any payday. I'm talking about whether to make him THE DE gold standard for salary, given the state of the team.
To that end, I titled the thread incorrectly. Should've been 'cost Allen his payday as a Chief.' ie, if he's gonna get that payday, and he probably will, does the state of the team overall as evidenced today signify that it'll probably be a team closer to being a winner that grants it to him?

Mr_Raider
11-25-2007, 11:10 PM
Maybe JA was drunk. LMAO, sorry. I couldnt resist.

I swear he looks like a porn star from the 60's. LMAO.

MadMax
11-25-2007, 11:16 PM
Maybe JA was drunk. LMAO, sorry. I couldnt resist.

I swear he looks like a porn star from the 60's. LMAO.


porn didnt start till the 70's get your facts straight.. :p :D

MadMax
11-25-2007, 11:19 PM
I'm not talking about not paying him any payday. I'm talking about whether to make him THE DE gold standard for salary, given the state of the team.
To that end, I titled the thread incorrectly. Should've been 'cost Allen his payday as a Chief.' ie, if he's gonna get that payday, and he probably will, does the state of the team overall as evidenced today signify that it'll probably be a team closer to being a winner that grants it to him?



I'm in favor of performance based contracts :)

'Hamas' Jenkins
11-25-2007, 11:19 PM
I'm not talking about not paying him any payday. I'm talking about whether to make him THE DE gold standard for salary, given the state of the team.
To that end, I titled the thread incorrectly. Should've been 'cost Allen his payday as a Chief.' ie, if he's gonna get that payday, and he probably will, does the state of the team overall as evidenced today signify that it'll probably be a team closer to being a winner that grants it to him?

JA seems to fit the profile of career Chiefs. He'll likely put up good stats, a couple of PBs, and never win a playoff game.

:(

Mr_Raider
11-25-2007, 11:22 PM
porn didnt start till the 70's get your facts straight.. :p :D

Ok, Jared. ROFL

Burgess 2 sacks,today. Oh yeah.

Pablo
11-25-2007, 11:22 PM
JA has been one of the biggest reasons we've been in so many games..even if our playcalling and offensive production lost those games. He's the force behind this defense.

The intensity and push he brings to that D up front is phenomenal, and when he doesn't play hard, the defense falls in on itself. LB's get caught out of position, our old CB's get burned and our inexperienced safeties drop off coverage and give up easy plays because the QB has all day to pick them apart. JA is the motor and transmission for this defense, without him our D is sitting in park, looking stupid, inexperienced and old.

Boone has been a monster DT and Hali has been a ghost. I don't expect JA to have another bad game this year, but if he does then I really don't suspect we'll pay him any less than he deserves. Our team in general is sorry, but on every game day you can typically count on our defense showing up, especially if JA is in gear.

Is he gonna get Dwight Freeney money? No. I didn't think he would a couple weeks ago when he was really tearing it up and I don't now. He's a great DE, and something solid to build our D and franchise upon, but not the gold standard. He's one of the Top 5 in the League, but I don't think he's the best.

He's gonna make a great amount of money here, and if he doesn't, he'll make it somewhere else.

OctoberFart
11-25-2007, 11:32 PM
Not that he played particularly bad, but this unit presents itself as one with NO ONE deserving of a big payday.
There's no one who screams we need this guy or we'll fall apart. We've fallen apart. Now to rebuild.
Franchise him? Sure, if you sense he'll perform as a franchised player. Set the bar for D-Line Ks? Not with this squad.


I would like to see what you think a great DE looks like? Will swap Allen for Brayton and throw Gallery in on the deal okay.