rewatching the superbowl....

[Demonpenz]

the refs cost the patriots the superbowl. I know they are too proud to admit it but there were 5 or 6 fouls on the giants uncalled!

[LiL stumppy]

LOL

[FAX]

Impossible!!!

Knucklehead II won that game fair and square and could have done it blindfolded, handcuffed, alone, and hogtied to Oprah's backside with a becket hitch.

FAX

[OnTheWarpath15]

The refs by no means cost the Pats a win, but there were two huge calls that went against them that were absolutely incorrect.

The pushoff by Toomer early lead the 3 NY points.

The fumbled exchange between Eli and the RB that the Pats recovered. as soon as the recovering defender was touched, he was down.

Regardless, the Giants deserved to win. They were the better team last night.

[Demonpenz]

the fix was in that is for sure

[memyselfI]

ROFL ROFL ROFL

[kstater]

ROFL ROFL ROFL
Were you threatened with being banned? Is that why you brought this incredibly insightful post over to this side of the board?

[CrazyPhuD]

Karma is a bitch. Sorry when you get busted for cheating earlier in the season and have a repeated history of doing so, pardon me if I don't shed a tear that you might have gotten screwed by the refs.

[memyselfI]

Were you threatened with being banned? Is that why you brought this incredibly insightful post over to this side of the board?

No, it's just funny to see the Patriots be on opposite end of the "screwed by the refs" mantra.

Karma is a bitch.

But to say the refs hosed them is to take away from the Giants who played a very inspired game.

[Simplex3]

Looks like Demon's been hitting the bottle again.

[stevieray]

Looks like Demon's been hitting the bottle again.

that and meme's raider grudge is alive and well...

[Simply Red]

Looks like Demon's been hitting the bottle again.

[bowener]

can you be more specific on these calls please? Maybe some screen shots, john madden-esque scribblings (food crumbs included if possible)...

[Extra Point]

Looks like Demon's been hitting the bottle again.
Enfamil? :shrug:

Four holds on Pats offense weren't called either.

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[Demonpenz]

.k

[Demonpenz]

fd

[Extra Point]

.k
ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL !!!!!!!!!

[Bugeater]

Wow, that is some damning evidence there. Demon is on to something.

[PastorMikH]

I thought going for it on 4th and 16 instead of either trying a FG or trying to pin the giants inside their 20 had more to do with the L than the refs.

[OnTheWarpath15]

I thought going for it on 4th and 16 instead of either trying a FG or trying to pin the giants inside their 20 had more to do with the L than the refs.


Good call, Pastor.

[Joe Seahawk]

Rewatch XL and then see what you think..


the refs cost the patriots the superbowl. I know they are too proud to admit it but there were 5 or 6 fouls on the giants uncalled!

[acesn8s]

I thought going for it on 4th and 16 instead of either trying a FG or trying to pin the giants inside their 20 had more to do with the L than the refs.Or trying to go deep rather than trying to gain yardage and using their time outs effectively at the end of the game.

[Dylan]

the refs cost the patriots the superbowl. I know they are too proud to admit it but there were 5 or 6 fouls on the giants uncalled!

So...were the Beantown folks too lazy to torch the town?!?!

[Joe Seahawk]

The weirdest call i saw was bellicheck challenging a foul that wasn't called!

That was weird.. can you challenge If you see a hold that isn't called but shows up on replay? (I know you cant)

Seemed weird to me.

[Bugeater]

The weirdest call i saw was bellicheck challenging a foul that wasn't called!

That was weird.. If you see a hold that isn't called but shows up on replay? (I know you cant)

Seemed weird to me.
Yes, that was strange. I wasn't aware of any situation where a penalty (or lack of one) could be challenged.

[acesn8s]

Yes, that was strange. I wasn't aware of any situation where a penalty (or lack of one) could be challenged.Number of players on the field is the only one that I know of. Maybe intentional grounding but I don't think so.

[RibKing67]

If the refs cost the Pats the Superbowl then the damn clerk at QT cost me the lottery!!!!

[veist]

Stuff you can challenge: Scoring plays (except field goals)
Pass complete/incomplete/intercepted
Runner/receiver out of bounds
Recovery of a loose ball in or out of bounds
Touching of a forward pass, either by an ineligible receiver or a defensive player
Quarterback pass or fumble
Illegal forward pass
Forward or backward pass
Runner ruled not down by contact
Forward progress in regard to a first down
Touching of a kick
Other plays involving placement of the football
Whether a legal number of players are on the field at the time of the snap

[Amnorix]

I didn't like the Toomer push off on the deep out, but it was a close call and they were clearly letting the boys play a bit, so it was ok.

I really did think that the Pats defender had recovered that ball, but they always let them fight it out at the bottom of the pile, so whatever.

Can't pin that loss on the refs. No way, no how.

[cadmonkey]

I didn't like the Toomer push off on the deep out, but it was a close call and they were clearly letting the boys play a bit, so it was ok.

I really did think that the Pats defender had recovered that ball, but they always let them fight it out at the bottom of the pile, so whatever.

Can't pin that loss on the refs. No way, no how.


Toomer stiff armed the CB in the face mask as the ball got to him. I understand the "Let them play the game" mentality but that was an outright punch to the face that should have been called.

The fumble that the "Giants recovered" should have been the Patriots ball. I can understand having them fight for the ball if it was a pile up for the ball. It was one guy getting on the ball and having possesion. There is no difference if a running back goes to the ground and a LB coming over and ripping the ball out of his hands and saying it was a clean strip. Our guy had the ball and was downed by contact.

[Eleazar]

:drool:

[Amnorix]

Toomer stiff armed the CB in the face mask as the ball got to him. I understand the "Let them play the game" mentality but that was an outright punch to the face that should have been called.

The fumble that the "Giants recovered" should have been the Patriots ball. I can understand having them fight for the ball if it was a pile up for the ball. It was one guy getting on the ball and having possesion. There is no difference if a running back goes to the ground and a LB coming over and ripping the ball out of his hands and saying it was a clean strip. Our guy had the ball and was downed by contact.

I agree, but I also have no idea what else was going on downfield on the other plays.

The Toomer face-mask push off was pretty obvious, but it may have been average for the game, is what I mean.

[Bwana]

Refs my a**.

The relentless pass rush of the Giants resulting in Brady getting smacked around like a circus mule, cost the Pats the Super Bowl.

[morphius]

The fumble that the "Giants recovered" should have been the Patriots ball. I can understand having them fight for the ball if it was a pile up for the ball. It was one guy getting on the ball and having possesion. There is no difference if a running back goes to the ground and a LB coming over and ripping the ball out of his hands and saying it was a clean strip. Our guy had the ball and was downed by contact.

Your coach should have challenged that one, and didn't.

[cadmonkey]

Your coach should have challenged that one, and didn't.


He should have and didn't. He was doing some very odd things all game. Not going for the FG on 4th and 13. Maybe calling some QB draws to stop the D-ends from rushing right up the field every play. Leaving the field with a few seconds left on the clock.


NOT WEARING THE GRAY HOODED F*CKING SWEATSHIRT AND GOING WITH THE SAME RED ONE HE WORE WHEN WE LOST THE AFCCG LAST YEAR!!!!!

[penguinz]

He should have and didn't. He was doing some very odd things all game. Not going for the FG on 4th and 13. Maybe calling some QB draws to stop the D-ends from rushing right up the field every play. Leaving the field with a few seconds left on the clock.


NOT WEARING THE GRAY HOODED F*CKING SWEATSHIRT AND GOING WITH THE SAME RED ONE HE WORE WHEN WE LOST THE AFCCG LAST YEAR!!!!!Yep. The sweatshirt lost the game.
:rolleyes:

[Amnorix]

He should have and didn't. He was doing some very odd things all game. Not going for the FG on 4th and 13. Maybe calling some QB draws to stop the D-ends from rushing right up the field every play. Leaving the field with a few seconds left on the clock.


NOT WEARING THE GRAY HOODED F*CKING SWEATSHIRT AND GOING WITH THE SAME RED ONE HE WORE WHEN WE LOST THE AFCCG LAST YEAR!!!!!

So....it's the sweatshirt's fault?

How about the big one that you missed -- the total lack of in-game adjustments when it was clear that our offense was struggling mightily until the 4th quarter when the Giants got tired.

I would have likedt o have seen more 2 TE, 2 WR sets after it became clear out offensive line could NOT handle the 3 WR set.

[cadmonkey]

So....it's the sweatshirt's fault?

How about the big one that you missed -- the total lack of in-game adjustments when it was clear that our offense was struggling mightily until the 4th quarter when the Giants got tired.

I would have likedt o have seen more 2 TE, 2 WR sets after it became clear out offensive line could NOT handle the 3 WR set.

agreed. Maroney was running all over the place the past two games. I know we made it to the Playoffs on Brady's arm but we made it to the Super Bowl on Lawrence's legs.

I would have liked to see Larry run a bit more durring the game. I mean the front five looked like they were trying to block bull dozers all game.

[Amnorix]

agreed. Maroney was running all over the place the past two games. I know we made it to the Playoffs on Brady's arm but we made it to the Super Bowl on Lawrence's legs.

I would have liked to see Larry run a bit more durring the game. I mean the front five looked like they were trying to block bull dozers all game.

I'd love to hear the honest reason we lost. What was it that caused the Patriots to play SO unbelievably unlike themselves. I mean, all credit in the world to the Giants for taking advantage, but that was an extremely un-Patriot-like performance, and I really don't quite understand why.

We hung 38 on that same team, AT their house, with two starting offensive linemen and our best blocking tight end hurt. WTF was so different on Sunday that we suddenly couldn't do anything except suck ass in a big way...?

It's just weird.

[Rausch]

I'd love to hear the honest reason we lost. What was it that caused the Patriots to play SO unbelievably unlike themselves. I mean, all credit in the world to the Giants for taking advantage, but that was an extremely un-Patriot-like performance, and I really don't quite understand why.

We hung 38 on that same team, AT their house, with two starting offensive linemen and our best blocking tight end hurt. WTF was so different on Sunday that we suddenly couldn't do anything except suck ass in a big way...?

It's just weird.

I think the biggest issue was the play of your secondary. It seemed like every time the Gmen needed a big play they completed a pass and moved the chains.

That, and the long 4th down try I thought was a moronic call...

[blueballs]

so true
Giants played run run pass
no punt

[acesn8s]

I'd love to hear the honest reason we lost. What was it that caused the Patriots to play SO unbelievably unlike themselves. I mean, all credit in the world to the Giants for taking advantage, but that was an extremely un-Patriot-like performance, and I really don't quite understand why.

We hung 38 on that same team, AT their house, with two starting offensive linemen and our best blocking tight end hurt. WTF was so different on Sunday that we suddenly couldn't do anything except suck ass in a big way...?

It's just weird.Giants changed their signal calling between the NFC Campionship game and the SB. Patriots had no film on the new signals.

[blueballs]

There are parades today in Miami
Buffalo
and two in New York

[blueballs]

And New Orleans

[38yrsfan]

As mentioned before, karma caught up with them. The "fumble" and the "Toomerism" (and you know a Chief would have been flagged every time for that one) should be viewed in the light of the Patriot's past season, the Baltimore game comes to mind ).

There isn't a Chiefs fan alive that isn't aware of the game-changing power of the officials. Before instant replay it was always the mysterious and often unseen "foul away from the play". Sympathy? The Pats get no sympathy here.

[Demonpenz]

The nfl obvouisly wanted the whole spygate thing to go away. It would be bad buisness for cheaters to be the best team ever so I can't blame them for fixing it honestly. Especially with baseball cheating they have seen what negative pub does for you

[plbrdude]

Or trying to go deep rather than trying to gain yardage and using their time outs effectively at the end of the game.


that was pure desperation.

[plbrdude]

I'd love to hear the honest reason we lost. What was it that caused the Patriots to play SO unbelievably unlike themselves. I mean, all credit in the world to the Giants for taking advantage, but that was an extremely un-Patriot-like performance, and I really don't quite understand why.

We hung 38 on that same team, AT their house, with two starting offensive linemen and our best blocking tight end hurt. WTF was so different on Sunday that we suddenly couldn't do anything except suck ass in a big way...?

It's just weird.


maybe for some strange reason bill got some advice from herm and/or marty before the game.

[tmax63]

I read that the Los Vegas sports books lost 2.6 mil on the SB. Ought to be pretty easy to look the big winners up to see if the fix was "in".

[acesn8s]

that was pure desperation.35 seconds left and 3 time outs is plenty of time for a good offense. They panicked. called TO after an incomplete pass. Didn't try to use the side lines, or go over the middle 10 yards down the field. Instead they tried to hit the big play to Moss.

[Dylan]

I'd love to hear the honest reason we lost. What was it that caused the Patriots to play SO unbelievably unlike themselves. I mean, all credit in the world to the Giants for taking advantage, but that was an extremely un-Patriot-like performance, and I really don't quite understand why.

We hung 38 on that same team, AT their house, with two starting offensive linemen and our best blocking tight end hurt. WTF was so different on Sunday that we suddenly couldn't do anything except suck ass in a big way...?

It's just weird.
Great game.

The reason the Patriots lost the Super Bowl ...

TOM BRADY: Make no mistake, the Pats deserved to lose. The Giants were the better team - and that was the case well before Eli Manning got out of the grasp of three Patriots rushers and David Tyree caught a ball against the top of his helmet. One of the best catches in the history of the NFL. The Giants took the game to the Patriots from the outset, holding the ball for 9 minutes, 59 seconds on their opening possession and drilling Tom Brady into the ground with two rushers on his first pass attempt. Those trends would remain throughout the evening. The Pats couldn’t figure out how to close the deal with just 2:42 left.


OFFENSIVE LIVE: This is the first failing grade the Patriots had with the offensive line all year. Forget the final defensive collapse. The reason this game was close to begin with is because the Pats got spanked up front. The numbers were bad (five sacks, nine quarterback hits, 45 rushing yards as a team), but they still don’t accurately convey the carnage. Gave up two sacks to defensive lineman Justin Tuck in 1-on-1 blocking situations and another to linebacker Kawika Mitchell on a “no-look” delayed blitz that had Mankins grasping at air. Tuck was Mankins’ man for much of the night, and he finished with five solo tackles, two sacks and a forced fumble. Meanwhile, Matt Light gave up constant pressure to Osi Umenyiora while Nick Kaczur was no match for Michael Strahan on his third-quarter sack. Strahan also had two QB hits and a batted ball. The first-half injury to Stephen Neal certainly didn’t help, as replacement Russ Hochstein gave up a killer, final-possession sack to Jay Alford. Overall, the Pats offensive line is a very good unit, and they had a great season. We’ll take the exact same five guys next year. They just got their hats handed to them in this game.

(Kawika Mitchell came out with 3 tackles and 5 assist, and one brutal sack on Brady)

continued...

[Dylan]

DEFENSIVE LINE: Jarvis Green and Richard Seymour had Eli Manning, in their grasps in the final seconds - and they couldn’t hang on. Green had the better shot but couldn’t convert while Seymour never really found the handle.

Brandon Jacobs needed 14 carries to gain just 42 yards and he got it. You can blame the referees for not blowing a quicker whistle. But when Manning and Ahmad Bradshaw botched a handoff and the ball hit the ground right in front of Woods, it was up to one guy and one guy only: Woods. He absolutely, positively had to come up with that fumble, but he didn’t. Tedy Bruschi once again had the tackle stats (eight), but his most noticeable play came when Brandon Jacobs finished off a run and knocked him into next week in the second quarter. Anyone notice Vrabel or Junior Seau (two tackles apiece) out there?


SECONDARY: With the championship hanging in the balance, Manning put the ball up for grabs, and it was the Giants receivers who came down with it, not the Patriots defensive backs. Rodney Harrison did all he could on David Tyree’s miracle catch, but it just wasn’t good enough. Asante Samuel also had a chance for a game-saving pick along the sidelines but couldn’t make the play. Finally, Ellis Hobbs now will go down in infamy for his atrocious coverage on Plaxico Burress on the game-winning touchdown. Here’s the bottom line: the Giants had the ball on the Pats’ 13-yard line with :39 remaining and no time outs. We repeat: no time outs. Had Hobbs played over the top and allowed an in-cut to be completed, he could have come up and made the tackle in the field of play. The decision by Hobbs (or the coaches if he’s telling the truth) to jump the underneath route was unconscionable. He later broke up an in-cut to Burress deep over the middle.


But on the next play, the “Bad Ellis” reared his ugly head when he couldn’t adjust to a deep ball to Amani Toomer on a play that went for 38 yards. Yes, Toomer got away with a push to Hobbs’ facemask, but Hobbs never should have let it get that far. Of course, he made up for it a few plays later, collecting a deflected ball by Steve Smith for the pick. On the next drive, Hobbs stuck with Plaxico Burress to help force the coverage sack on Manning. Nickel back Randall Gay was picked on early, giving up the Giants’ first two third-down conversions, but he later jumped an in-cut to Burress to force a punt. Samuel also knocked away a would-be touchdown pass on a deep ball, but couldn’t come up with the big play in the end. (In one of the great Super Bowl upsets, the Giants defeated the Patriots 17-14 in Super Bowl XLII in Glendale, Ariz.

continued...

[Dylan]

SPECIAL TEAMS: Perhaps Kicker Stephen Gostkowski was feeling the pressure, or maybe he just lost his footing. But when he shanked a second-quarter kickoff out of bounds following the Pats’ first score, that may have set the stage for Belichick’s ruinous decision in the third quarter to bypass Gostkowski on a makable 48-yard field goal attempt. Belichick obviously didn’t trust him. Punter Chris Hanson wasn’t much better with several low, short kicks.

COACHING:
Just because Belichick and his staff were outschemed by their counterparts on the Giants doesn’t mean they deserve an “F”. But it still wasn’t pretty. Clearly, the offense was not operating well out of the shotgun for more than three quarters, yet the coaches never came up with the adjustment to counter the pressure. Against the Chargers in the AFC title game, the Pats adjusted by going to the power running game, but when Belichick decided to activate an extra defensive lineman (Le Kevin Smith) over a third tight end (Stephen Spach) against the Giants, he limited his personnel options on offense. Even without Spach, you have to wonder why the coaches didn’t go to Maroney. After all, Brady was getting pulverized out of the shotgun. Either the Pats had to figure out how to block the Giants in the passing game, or they had to put the ball on the ground. And they did neither. Then again, Brady was able to navigate his way down the field out of the ’gun late in the fourth quarter. The decision to forgo the long field goal attempt was much worse. The Pats had managed just 81 yards of offense in the first half and were in desperate need of some momentum. And they appeared to be getting some on their opening possession of the third quarter, when they faced a fourth-and-13 at the Giants 31. Again, Brady wasn’t completing anything down the field and the line was getting torched. The odds of Gostkowski knocking through a 48-yarder under a roof on a perfect field had to be greater than picking up 14 yards through the air. But, for whatever reason, Belichick didn’t take them. He obviously knew the second guessing was coming after the game, because he embellished the distance on the kick, calling it a 50-yarder. At least he went down with the ship and stayed on the field until the bitter end with the rest of his players. Or maybe not.


An excerpt from an article published by Boston Herald

To Sum it up: The Patriots were outcoached, outschemed, overpowered and no match for the NY Giants. NFC East is a Beast.

[Joe Seahawk]

Ellis Hobbs now will go down in infamy for his atrocious coverage on Plaxico Burress on the game-winning touchdown.



Good article, but I disagree on the hobbs thing The Pats had a blitz and there was no safety in the middle, where plax lined up he could have run a post or a flag and hobbs had no help. He was in a very compromising position, not many corners could have domne much with that. All he could do was pray one of the the seven blitzing guys got home in time..

Congrats to the giants and thanks for the fun game to watch!

[Dylan]

Good article, but I disagree on the hobbs thing The Pats had a blitz and there was no safety in the middle, where plax lined up he could have run a post or a flag and hobbs had no help. He was in a very compromising position, not many corners could have domne much with that. All he could do was pray one of the the seven blitzing guys got home in time..

Congrats to the giants and thanks for the fun game to watch!

Thanks. It was a great game.

Plax explained the play to the press... I'll post it

[Dylan]

What you can question, is why the Patriots opted to single cover 6-foot-5 Plax with 5-9 CB Hobbs on Plax' game winning, 13 yard touchdown catch. The Patriots had double coverage on him almost the entire game.

Plax: The game winning touchdown.

And then there was Ellis Hobbs, the corner who was a perpetual cause for concern, biting on a Plaxico Burress fake and being beaten for a game-winning, 13-yard touchdown pass just 35 seconds short of immortality.

“He thought I was going to run a slant,” Burress said of how he beat Hobbs, who also surrendered a 38-yard completion to Amani Toomer earlier in the game. “I gave him a slant move and he stopped his feet. Once he stopped his feet, I knew I had him.”



Eli:
The game-winner to Burress was a recognition play. Manning noticed that the Patriots were running a Cover Zero blitz. Everybody was coming. It was first-and-10 at the Patriots' 13 with 39 seconds left. The Patriots went for the throat. Manning ended up being the winner.
"It was just a fade route, and they came with an all-out blitz,'' Manning said. "They had been playing zone coverage. They came with an all-out blitz, and the corner sat because he thought we might run something short. Plaxico ran right by him and made a great catch to win the game.''

And at that moment, after that crazy play on this crazy day, the impossible seemed inevitable. Manning completed a 12-yard pass to Steve Smith that gave the Giants the ball on the New England 13. There were 39 seconds left in the game.

Then with the crowd stunned and thrilled, with the Patriots suddenly aware that, hey, they really and truly might lose, Manning dropped back. His best and loudest receiver, Plaxico Burress, faked as if he were going to run right. New England cornerback Ellis Hobbs believed him and headed that way.

Then Burress suddenly took off left, for the end zone. Hobbs was lost. He stumbled. Burress was alone. Eli lofted the pass. Burress caught it. The touchdown pass that beat the New England Patriots was so simple and so open, a child could have thrown it.

[Dylan]

Besides Brady eating dirt all night, this play is a favorite:

"Tedy Bruschi once again had the tackle stats (eight), but his most noticeable play came when Brandon Jacobs finished off a run and knocked him into next week in the second quarter."