Philly and NE interested in Allen?

[Coogs]

There is a thread over on the Star BB. It has a link in it with regards to Philly's interest, and another poster from back east who heard on a local radio program that the Patriots could also have an interest in Allen. And, yes, apparently two 1st round draft picks are not a stumbling block.

[HemiEd]

That was my point the other day! Why does Carl get cute with this shit? He is worth more to us than two 1sts. He should have just franchised him and been done with it.

[BigRedChief]

There is a thread over on the Star BB. It has a link in it with regards to Philly's interest, and another poster from back east who heard on a local radio program that the Patriots could also have an interest in Allen. And, yes, apparently two 1st round draft picks are not a stumbling block.
I thought it was a 1st and a 3rd?

[milkman]

So why didn't you copy the link and post it here?

[The Franchise]

I thought it was a 1st and a 3rd?

1st and a 3rd go for a RFA.

We franchised Allen....if another team signs him then we get 2 1st round picks. That is unless we work out another deal for Allen with said team.

[milkman]

I thought it was a 1st and a 3rd?

Franchise tag is two firsts.

The first and third were the compensation that would have been required last year, I believe, when Allen was a RFA.

[Coogs]

So why didn't you copy the link and post it here?


It is one of those you can not copy, and I am too damn lazy to type the whole thing out. :)

[milkman]

It is one of those you can not copy, and I am too damn lazy to type the whole thing out. :)

Useless bastard! :mad:

:p

[milkman]

Actually, upon further thought, you could have linked the thread, at least.

[Coogs]

Useless bastard! :mad:

:p

:D I've heard that before!

[Coogs]

Actually, upon further thought, you could have linked the thread, at least.

Same thing. :shrug:

[crazycoffey]

print 'em


just not in Red & Gold.....

[raybec 4]

If he were to sign somewhere else, how much more evidence would Clark need to jettison the boat anchor that has been holding the franchise hostage for so many years.

[SithCeNtZ]

Slightly off topic question, but when was the last time a guy was franchised and actually signed with another team?

[Coogs]

Milkman,

Just for you...

http://forums.kansascity.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=kr-kcsports&msg=96542.1&ctx=128


Be sure and check out a few of Voyagers Mocks while you are over there! :thumb:

[RustShack]

If that happend, we could end up with Ellis AND Clady. I would HATE to see Allen go though...

[milkman]

Slightly off topic question, but when was the last time a guy was franchised and actually signed with another team?

Best guess would be that Seattle receiver who signed with Dallas about 7-8 years ago.

Name escapes me.

[milkman]

Best guess would be that Seattle receiver who signed with Dallas about 7-8 years ago.

Name escapes me.

Name came to me.

Joey Galloway in 2000.

[milkman]

Milkman,

Just for you...

http://forums.kansascity.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=kr-kcsports&msg=96542.1&ctx=128


Be sure and check out a few of Voyagers Mocks while you are over there! :thumb:

I'm not sure I can handle voyager's thousands of mocks.

[blueballs]

NE and Philly are notorious for being cheap
and for letting good players walk over $$$
-you've been punked

[Brock]

Speaking of voyager, holy shit...

Give up 1st and 3rd for Derek Anderson, QB, and sign Anderson.

Free agency...

1...Randall Gay, CB, 5'11" 190, age 26.
2...Brian Young, DT, 6'2" 298, age 31.

Draft...

1...Trade for D.Anderson.
2...Sam Baker, OT, 6'5" 310, 5.20...to start at LOT with McIntosh moving to ROT.
3...Trade for D.Anderson.
4...Center...Sullivan, Pollak, Justice, etc.
5...Stevens, TE, 6'3" 250, 4.80.
5...Zenon, CB, 6'0" 180, 4.54.
6...Brandon McAnderson, FB, 5'10" 235, 4.65...one of the quicker FB's in the draft.
7...Kicker.
7...OG.
7...WR/RS.

[blueballs]

he makes findthedoor
look atleast semi-savvy

[siberian khatru]

Carl will surrender Allen for 2 1sts, congratulating himself for saving Clark a lot of money while stockpiling draft picks to follow The Plan.

Then he'll play hardball with the 1st-round picks' contracts and they'll hold out all year and never play for us. Carl will congratulate himself for not giving into agents and for saving Clark a lot of money.

[pikesome]

he makes findthedoor
look atleast semi-savvy

I would have said this wasn't possible...then I read that post. :doh!:

[milkman]

How the hell do you even navigate through that hell hole known as the Star discussion board.

[Coogs]

its a fairly unsubstantiated rumor....just local radio talk filling air time.

That would be why the question mark, and the part about the guy saying he heard it on the local radio back east.

[Coogs]

How the hell do you even navigate through that hell hole known as the Star discussion board.

It isn't easy is it?

[Infidel Goat]

NE lost their real first round pick this year.

Would the NFL make them surrender the SF pick this year? Along with the 2009 1rst rounder?

Or we would be looking at the #30 or so pick in both 2009 and 2010? Teams as good as the Pats can afford to go after guys with the Franchise tag considering it costs them so much less in value...

[Amnorix]

IMHO there's about a 0% chance of the Pats giving up 2 1sts for a guy who is going to want top dollar. Pats tend to collect high draft picks, not (over)spend them.

[Amnorix]

NE lost their real first round pick this year.

Would the NFL make them surrender the SF pick this year? Along with the 2009 1rst rounder?

Or we would be looking at the #30 or so pick in both 2009 and 2010? Teams as good as the Pats can afford to go after guys with the Franchise tag considering it costs them so much less in value...


I'm thinking the '09 and '10 picks, but I can't see the Pats doing it.

[Coogs]

I'm thinking the '09 and '10 picks, but I can't see the Pats doing it.

I know this is going to be pretty obvious, but unless it (trade) is done before the draft it would about have to be '09 and '10 picks.

[The Bad Guy]

I would 1 million % agree that Jared Allen is worth more to this team than 2 first rounders. You would hope that one of the first rounders could equal Allen, but that's a tall task.

This defense without Jared Allen is a laughing stock.

[milkman]

IMHO there's about a 0% chance of the Pats giving up 2 1sts for a guy who is going to want top dollar. Pats tend to collect high draft picks, not (over)spend them.

I tend to agree.

[Fat Elvis]

I wouldn't count NE out of it....

It would be a heck of a deal for them; essentially, they'd be giving up 2 second round picks for Jared Allen given their level of domination the past few years. Who wouldn't do that?

[Silock]

LOL @ anyone who thinks this will actually happen.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

With the poison pills that are added to contracts these days, another team could make it very difficult for KC to match their offer. An example, Minnesota signed Steve Hutchinson a couple of years ago and put a clause in that if more than 7 games were played in Seattle over the course of the 7 year contract he signed, the whole thing became guaranteed. Seattle couldn't match it, even though they wanted too. I could easily see the same thing happening here. Carl is gonna **** around and we're gonna lose the one guy that we should give the money too.

[Undertaker #59]

Unless Belichick has completely lost his mind, the Patriots would never do this.

Also, this thread is the first I have seen it mentioned.

[FAX]

I sure would hate to lose JA. Honestly, I don't see this happening. Two 1st rounders is a lot of value.

FAX

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Jesus Christ ! Why do we have to go through this again. I was so glad when TG signed so everybody would shut up. READ MY LIPS, CARL DOES NOT LOSE THE GOOD PLAYERS HE WANTS TO KEEP. HE WANTS TO KEEP JA. JA WILL SIGN A LONG TERM CONTRACT DURING THE COURSE OF THE YEAR AND PROBABLY BEFORE TRAINING CAMP. Jesus Christ, SHUTUP!

[RustShack]

I don't get why he used the tag that allows other teams to give up picks instead of the one that just keeps him here. It's like hes willing to trade him...

[Mr. Flopnuts]

Jesus Christ ! Why do we have to go through this again. I was so glad when TG signed so everybody would shut up. READ MY LIPS, CARL DOES NOT LOSE THE GOOD PLAYERS HE WANTS TO KEEP. HE WANTS TO KEEP JA. JA WILL SIGN A LONG TERM CONTRACT DURING THE COURSE OF THE YEAR AND PROBABLY BEFORE TRAINING CAMP. Jesus Christ, SHUTUP!

Settle down Nancy and get back to work. That's right, go jack off a hog.

[Bob Dole]

I don't get why he used the tag that allows other teams to give up picks instead of the one that just keeps him here. It's like hes willing to trade him...

Trying to let the "market" determine Allen's value.

[Valiant]

With the poison pills that are added to contracts these days, another team could make it very difficult for KC to match their offer. An example, Minnesota signed Steve Hutchinson a couple of years ago and put a clause in that if more than 7 games were played in Seattle over the course of the 7 year contract he signed, the whole thing became guaranteed. Seattle couldn't match it, even though they wanted too. I could easily see the same thing happening here. Carl is gonna **** around and we're gonna lose the one guy that we should give the money too.

Didn't the NFL make it where you could not poison pill a contract last year??

[Valiant]

JA will never be traded..

But IF, we did I would not mind NE 1st this year, their first next year plus and additional 3rd to 5th rounder if they win the Superbowl..

Allen would make them sic on defense..

[blueballs]

Hypothetically
Would you trade Allen to Miami
for this years #1 over all

[Chief Wiggum]

In response to the #1 overall comment from Miami (Can't figure out how to put in quote while editing my post):

I don't think that you can even if you want to. Having two picks in the top five - the guaranteed money would be huge and both contracts would be amortized over the same timeline, so the cap overlap is 100% If we missed on either of them, it would put us in a difficult cap position for at least a couple of years. (I.e. Historical Cardinals)

[Valiant]

In response to the #1 overall comment from Miami (Can't figure out how to put in quote while editing my post):

I don't think that you can even if you want to. Having two picks in the top five - the guaranteed money would be huge and both contracts would be amortized over the same timeline, so the cap overlap is 100% If we missed on either of them, it would put us in a difficult cap position for at least a couple of years. (I.e. Historical Cardinals)

Not really.. The common trend of the cap going up each year would more then make up for it.. Imagine if we paid Jarred last year and used some of last years extra cap room.. We would be in even better shape this year..

The only thing that hinders this team is CP and management.. I wish we had a owner that was worried about winning championships as opposed to seeing how much money he can make...

[HemiEd]

Slightly off topic question, but when was the last time a guy was franchised and actually signed with another team?
When was the last time a GM exposed his best player to being signed by another team?

[HemiEd]

I would 1 million % agree that Jared Allen is worth more to this team than 2 first rounders. You would hope that one of the first rounders could equal Allen, but that's a tall task.

This defense without Jared Allen is a laughing stock.

Exactly, he is a once a decade player.

[HemiEd]

Hypothetically
Would you trade Allen to Miami
for this years #1 over all

Hell no.

[Valiant]

Hell no.

1st by itself, no..

1st, 2nd and 3rd yes..

[doomy3]

Exactly, he is a once a decade player.



Uhhhh, I like JA a lot and think he is good, but you are calling him a once a decade player?

[Frankie]

If that happend, we could end up with Ellis AND Clady.

That's what I was thinking. Who would be a good DE to pick up in round 2 or 3?

[Frankie]

That's what I was thinking. Who would be a good DE to pick up in round 2 or 3?

Or I wonder if Jason Taylor would be available for a couple of years of replacing JA until we get a long term guy in the '09 or '10 draft.

[Frankie]

Exactly, he is a once a decade player.

But you have to still be weary of a 3rd DWI strike, even if all indications are against it.

[BigRock]

With the poison pills that are added to contracts these days, another team could make it very difficult for KC to match their offer. An example, Minnesota signed Steve Hutchinson a couple of years ago and put a clause in that if more than 7 games were played in Seattle over the course of the 7 year contract he signed, the whole thing became guaranteed. Seattle couldn't match it, even though they wanted too. I could easily see the same thing happening here. Carl is gonna **** around and we're gonna lose the one guy that we should give the money too.
A poison pill doesn't really have any relevance here because there's compensation being exchanged between the teams. If KC didn't want another team signing Allen away and getting back 2 first round picks in return, they'd have put the exclusive tag on him to prevent it (even though the exclusive tag is used far less frequently than people seem to think it is).

Poison pills are used when someone gets the transition tag, which only gives the player's current team the right to match the offer. If they don't match it, they lose the player and get nothing in return. When the Vikings made it impossible for the Seahawks to keep Hutchinson, the use of the poison pill screwed Seattle over by letting the Vikes take a player without giving up anything.

But you're not really screwing anyone over if, by signing a guy, you have to send his team two first round picks. So there's not really a need for a poison pill in a franchise tag situation. Not that it'll never happen, though, if a team had a stockpile of picks or something.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

A poison pill doesn't really have any relevance here because there's compensation being exchanged between the teams. If KC didn't want another team signing Allen away and getting back 2 first round picks in return, they'd have put the exclusive tag on him to prevent it (even though the exclusive tag is used far less frequently than people seem to think it is).

Poison pills are used when someone gets the transition tag, which only gives the player's current team the right to match the offer. If they don't match it, they lose the player and get nothing in return. When the Vikings made it impossible for the Seahawks to keep Hutchinson, the use of the poison pill screwed Seattle over by letting the Vikes taking a player without giving up anything.

But you're not really screwing anyone over if you're sending a team two first round picks.

Yeah. My opinion is, I don't want 2 first round picks for Jared. By not using the exclusive rights tag, I could see Carl trying to let the "market decide" in order to try and save some coin. The franchise tag still gives the team the right to match any offer made, so the poison pill would be an issue, if that is in fact CP's intent. If not, then I think he's a bigger idiot than before.

[ct]

Slightly off topic question, but when was the last time a guy was franchised and actually signed with another team?

Joey Galloway is what I remember.

[J Diddy]

Exactly, he is a once a decade player.

I'm gonna probably not make any fans by saying this, but this is the same talk people were saying about Hicks too.

I'm gonna wait a year or too after his first probowl, before I proclaim him the second coming of Jesus.

[Red Dawg]

IMHO there's about a 0% chance of the Pats giving up 2 1sts for a guy who is going to want top dollar. Pats tend to collect high draft picks, not (over)spend them.


become poor sports when they lose and use sony handy cams to cheat.