Chiefs' defense may need more time

[Hammock Parties]

http://kan.scout.com/2/755142.html

It has been nine years since Arrowhead Stadium roared for a top 10 defense. Chiefs fans are tired of waiting for the return of such an experience after sitting patiently through three head coaches, three defensive coordinators and a myriad of in-the-door with hope, out-the-door with disappointment defenders.

Bad news. Chiefs fans may have to wait a little longer for that top 10 defense if you put any stock into the following observations from May’s admittedly cloudy crystal ball.

Since defensive coordinator Gunther Cunningham returned to Kansas City, his defense has been inching back toward respectability. He outlined that much earlier this offseason by shedding light on the improving trend of total touchdowns surrendered by his defenses since 2004.

The Chiefs gave up 50 touchdowns in 2004, 36 in 2005, 32 in 2006 and 28 a year ago. That’s progress, as mirrored by KC’s improvement in total defensive ranking over the same time period – from 31st to 25th to 16th and 13th last season.

Considering the continuity on the coaching staff, many might say the next logical step is for Kansas City’s defense to make that quantum leap into the elite, to become one of the ten best defenses in the NFL. Maybe so, but taking into account the developments of the 2008 offseason, a few more baby steps might be required before Gunther’s boys can walk or run into Arrowhead’s Ring of Fame just yet.

DEFENSIVE LINE

The loss of defensive end Jared Allen (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3716719), simply put, is enormous. The Chiefs’ apparent band-aid, moving Tamba Hali (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3698856) to right defensive end and sliding defensive tackle Alfonso Boone (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3698847) out to left end, might create more problems than it fixes.

First, look around the league at other Cover Two defenses. How many 305-pound ends do you see lining up in Tampa Bay and Chicago? Even if Boone’s transition to end is a shocking success, it still creates a hole inside.

Boone was KC’s best defensive tackle a year ago. No matter how good Glenn Dorsey (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3722647) may be (and let’s be honest with ourselves – rookie linemen take time to develop), the Chiefs will miss what Boone provided a year ago at tackle if he remains outside.

Top 10 scenario – Rookie defensive end Brian Johnston (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3724390) comes out of nowhere, wins a starting job in training camp, and makes everyone forget about Allen, allowing Boone to return inside and make NFL quarterback sandwiches with Dorsey.

LINEBACKER

No one really knows what the Chiefs have in Napoleon Harris (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3698857). Is he the Cover Two middle linebacker for the future, or the same player who couldn’t stick in Oakland and Minnesota?

Offseason speculation by some media sources have Donnie Edwards (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3698852) moving to the middle this year. While the Chiefs have announced no such plan, how much gas does Edwards even have left in the tank at age 35? Remember, nagging hamstring injuries plagued the veteran last season, particularly at the end of the year.

If Edwards should move, where does that leave the right outside linebacker position? Does free-agent acquisition DeMorrio Williams wind up starting? The Chiefs return the same starters for now (Edwards-Harris-Johnson), but there are plenty of questions about KC’s linebacker corps heading into 2008.

Top 10 scenario – Harris locks down the middle linebacker spot and Edwards stays healthy.

SECONDARY

Youth in the secondary coupled with questions about the Chiefs’ pass rush should keep Herm Edwards and Cunningham up late Saturday nights this year. There are questions at both cornerback and safety.

The Chiefs are looking for two starters at cornerback. Do they go with old and slow (Patrick Surtain (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3698875)) or athletic but inexperienced (Brandon Flowers (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3723953))? Do they dare stick two green corners on the field at the same time?

Meanwhile, everyone is wondering what Bernard Pollard (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3698871)’s future holds after a lackluster first season a starter. What if third-round pick DaJuan Morgan (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3723961) is forced into starting duty? KC’s defense might feature three rookies in the secondary this year – not a recipe for a top 10 defense.

Can you imagine Tom Brady (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3694702) sitting in the pocket all day long this September while Randy Moss (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=3694737) blazes through Kansas City’s soft zone like a rocket? Should the Patriots sign their old friend Ty Law (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=2980141) in the coming months, it’s easy to imagine him cracking a smile on the sideline while witnessing such a scenario.

Top 10 scenario – Surtain pulls off a Darrell Green (http://kan.scout.com/a.z?s=115&p=8&c=1&nid=293187) act, a rookie corner emerges from the pack and Pollard turns into a latter-day Steve Atwater.

[the Talking Can]

based on the title, it should be a Teicher article...

[LiL stumppy]

Meh, Stuff we already know.

[Chiefaholic]

It'll help the defensive rankings if they didn't play 40 minutes a game as well. These guys are exhausted late in the game and will be again this year barring a miracle on the O-Line and chemistry between Croyle and his new recieving core.

[Phobia]

It's written fairly well but there's no substance here. I found myself rolling my eyes early and often.

[DaneMcCloud]

It's written fairly well but there's no substance here. I found myself rolling my eyes early and often.

I agree but my eyes aren't rolling as quickly as reading Teicher.

I just can't say it enough: The guy is worthless.

One fatal flaw of the Kansas City sports reporting scene is the failure to bring in young and fresh television reporters.

I think the city would be much more informed and inspired had a guy like Ivan Carter been moved up the ladder instead of keeping with the same ol', same ol'.

Quite frankly, I don't know how you guys can stand it.

[Baby Lee]

Edwards [or finding a replacement Edwards] is key. The guy flat out got to the spot the D had funneled the play and made the stop. Without him in there, the D funneled to a spot where there was no one to stop and the runner exploited the hole for a big gain.

[blueballs]

The Chiefs gave up 50 touchdowns in 2004, 36 in 2005, 32 in 2006 and 28 a year ago. That’s progress, as mirrored by KC’s improvement in total defensive ranking over the same time period – from 31st to 25th to 16th and 13th last season.

they gave up less TDs as the seasons progessed
because it took few TDs to beat a slipping offense
-article pointless

[whoman69]

The Chiefs gave up 50 touchdowns in 2004, 36 in 2005, 32 in 2006 and 28 a year ago. That’s progress, as mirrored by KC’s improvement in total defensive ranking over the same time period – from 31st to 25th to 16th and 13th last season.

they gave up less TDs as the seasons progessed
because it took few TDs to beat a slipping offense
-article pointless

So you think the other teams stopped trying to score? If I'm an opposing coach and see KCs offense my goal is to score more than three touchdowns and put the game away. Why put yourself into another week where you have to wait until the last minutes, like most NFL games are, when you can give your guys a breather and have an easy victory?

[OnTheWarpath15]

The Chiefs gave up 50 touchdowns in 2004, 36 in 2005, 32 in 2006 and 28 a year ago. That’s progress, as mirrored by KC’s improvement in total defensive ranking over the same time period – from 31st to 25th to 16th and 13th last season.

they gave up less TDs as the seasons progessed
because it took few TDs to beat a slipping offense
-article pointless

If that were the case, we'd be the best defense in the league from a PPG standpoint.

Teams would stop when they got to 10.

[whoman69]

Two steps forward, one step back. That's how it always seems with the Chiefs, even when we're winning. If our defense can't step up this year, it could look even worse than last year.

[RealSNR]

If that were the case, we'd be the best defense in the league from a PPG standpoint.

Teams would stop when they got to 10.This IS the NFL. It's not Arena.

[Mr. Laz]

So you think the other teams stopped trying to score? If I'm an opposing coach and see KCs offense my goal is to score more than three touchdowns and put the game away. Why put yourself into another week where you have to wait until the last minutes, like most NFL games are, when you can give your guys a breather and have an easy victory?

they didn't stop TRYING to score but they were much more patient about it ... much less aggressive.

why take the chance on 3rd and long when you know that the Chief's offense can't score 20 points?

[Easy 6]

Its probably going to be very rough until the latter part of the season.

All of the brand newbies at DT, CB, S are going to need time to figure out what in the hells going on out there.

We'll take a temporary step back this year IMO.

[TEX]

The loss of defensive end Jared Allen, simply put, is enormous. The Chiefs’ apparent band-aid, moving Tamba Hali to right defensive end and sliding defensive tackle Alfonso Boone out to left end, might create more problems than it fixes.

IMO, This is a bad plan which is certain to fail.


No one really knows what the Chiefs have in Napoleon Harris. Is he the Cover Two middle linebacker for the future, or the same player who couldn’t stick in Oakland and Minnesota?

Yes we do. He is that same player that couldn't stick with 2 teams, soon to be 3. Just like everyone, except those in denial, could see from day 1 that Kendrell Bell was damaged goods.

Anyway, just my opinions...

[whoman69]

they didn't stop TRYING to score but they were much more patient about it ... much less aggressive.

why take the chance on 3rd and long when you know that the Chief's offense can't score 20 points?

Because they know the Chiefs will not take the chance on 3rd and long. They also know that even if they make a mistake, the Chiefs will probably not be able to take advantage with anything more than a FG. Herm doesn't think TDs are important. He would be happy to settle for a FG anytime.

[milkman]

The loss of defensive end Jared Allen, simply put, is enormous. The Chiefs’ apparent band-aid, moving Tamba Hali to right defensive end and sliding defensive tackle Alfonso Boone out to left end, might create more problems than it fixes.

IMO, This is a bad plan which is certain to fail.


No one really knows what the Chiefs have in Napoleon Harris. Is he the Cover Two middle linebacker for the future, or the same player who couldn’t stick in Oakland and Minnesota?

Yes we do. He is that same player that couldn't stick with 2 teams, soon to be 3. Just like everyone, except those in denial, could see from day 1 that Kendrell Bell was damaged goods.

Anyway, just my opinions...

This idea of moving a 300+lber to DE in a Tampa Two is sheer idiocy.

If there are no other options, I'd rather let McBride play there until we can address the position later.

I also hope that Johnston can step up and have the same kind of unexpected rookie season that Jared Allen had.

The other thing I'd expect is that the Chiefs will pick up someone as cuts come down the wire in TC and preseason.

[alanm]

Steve Octavian is good enough to challenge Harris for the starting MLB spot this year. I expect Williams to split time with Edwards.
Yeah I know Octavian is just another guy from Nebraska. He wasn't even drafted so he sucks.:spock:

Octavian has the talent to do what ever he wants to do. He wasn't drafted due to injury history from 3 yrs ago when he broke his leg on the opening day in 05 and missed the season. In 06 he still had a few lingering problems and missed 6 games but last fall he didn't miss a game and led the Huskers in tackles. His leg is fine

He's going to make the team and contribute to special teams right off but I expect him to be challenging Harris for the starting spot at some point during the season.

[blueballs]

Yes
the Chiefs secondary wasn't a liability
I must have been wasted thinking otherwise

[beach tribe]

I dont consider a top 10 defense to be "elite". I consider that in the top third.

Flowers, and Surtain will probably start, so what is the choice between the two?

[Rausch]

I dont consider a top 10 defense to be "elite". I consider that in the top third.

Exactly. Top 10 means you should be a playoff team, that's about it.

It's gotta' be pretty rare to be top 10 in both offense and defense and not make the postseason...

[KCChiefsMan]

Only the extreme homer fans could expect us to pull off a winning record this year. This is a year for development and getting our youngsters prepared for 2009 where hopefully we can compete.

[Rausch]

Only the extreme homer fans could expect us to pull off a winning record this year. This is a year for development and getting our youngsters prepared for 2009 where hopefully we can compete.

I think it all depends on QB play. If the offense is able to sustain drives and shorten the game our raw talent might shock with an upset or two.

No, not enough for a winning record, but some really good single-game performances. Remember how dominant our old, washed-up defense looked last year vs. the Colts? And that was with very little help at all from the offense...

[Dave Lane]

I think it all depends on QB play. If the offense is able to sustain drives and shorten the game our raw talent might shock with an upset or two.

No, not enough for a winning record, but some really good single-game performances. Remember how dominant our old, washed-up defense looked last year vs. the Colts? And that was with very little help at all from the offense...

I agree good coaching and a little luck is key but the schedule is the easiest we have had in years and going 8-8 would not be that hard a trick.

Basing or preformance against last year would have lead everyone to say that last year we would be 9-7 or 10-6 and make the playoffs again. I thought 6-10 last year and I think an improvement this year to 8-8 is not even difficult.

Dave

[Valiant]

Meh, Stuff we already know.

Considering he steals all of his ideas from here and other posters are you surprised??

[Valiant]

I agree good coaching and a little luck is key but the schedule is the easiest we have had in years and going 8-8 would not be that hard a trick.

Basing or preformance against last year would have lead everyone to say that last year we would be 9-7 or 10-6 and make the playoffs again. I thought 6-10 last year and I think an improvement this year to 8-8 is not even difficult.

Dave

Screw that.. I want another elite player to fall to us before we think about playoffs.. Ala 88 and 89 with Smith and DT..

[kcxiv]

The Chiefs gave up 50 touchdowns in 2004, 36 in 2005, 32 in 2006 and 28 a year ago. That’s progress, as mirrored by KC’s improvement in total defensive ranking over the same time period – from 31st to 25th to 16th and 13th last season.

they gave up less TDs as the seasons progessed
because it took few TDs to beat a slipping offense
-article pointlessThats pretty good considering how horrible our offensve was and how many 3 and outs the Chiefs had.

[Rausch]

Screw that.. I want another elite player to fall to us before we think about playoffs.. Ala 88 and 89 with Smith and DT..

That's what we need - game changers. I think Dorsey could help be one but we need more. Not guys that can get a sack but guys that every offense must account for every play.

I think we have solid LB's but no game changers. DJ might be super talented but no one fears him like a DT, LLoyd, Green, Hardy Nickerson, or Urlacher. Same for the D line with Allen gone. And CB's can make plays but these days rarely change games. We don't have an enforcer type either. No Atwater, Lynch, Lott, type of player.

On offense we do have guys that can take over a game. Bowe, Gonzo, and LJ (if healthy) can come up with big plays. Just having a legit change of pace back to keep LJ fresh will be huge. Think back to when Priest was still the no 1 and LJ had an INSANE YPC average. He was fresh.

[blueballs]

Thats pretty good considering how horrible our offensve was and how many 3 and outs the Chiefs had.

unless your Martz
you run the ball

[Ebolapox]

Steve Octavian is good enough to challenge Harris for the starting MLB spot this year. I expect Williams to split time with Edwards.
Yeah I know Octavian is just another guy from Nebraska. He wasn't even drafted so he sucks.:spock:

Octavian has the talent to do what ever he wants to do. He wasn't drafted due to injury history from 3 yrs ago when he broke his leg on the opening day in 05 and missed the season. In 06 he still had a few lingering problems and missed 6 games but last fall he didn't miss a game and led the Huskers in tackles. His leg is fine

He's going to make the team and contribute to special teams right off but I expect him to be challenging Harris for the starting spot at some point during the season.

insert 'scanlon' for octavian, and you're Royc. and/or III.

[Deberg_1990]

I wish we would get a new defensive coordinator personally.

Gun has been back 4 years now and we still seem the same mistakes over and over again.

Hes had every excuse in the book and the talent level has increased considerably, but yet we still see the same defensive lapses. He doesnt know how to get enough out of his personel.

The 2nd half of last season the defense was awful. We got raped by the running game over and over.

[milkman]

I think we have solid LB's but no game changers. DJ might be super talented but no one fears him like a DT, LLoyd, Green, Hardy Nickerson, or Urlacher. .

I think that Deberg hits on the problem a little here.

I wish we would get a new defensive coordinator personally.

Gun has been back 4 years now and we still seem the same mistakes over and over again.

Hes had every excuse in the book and the talent level has increased considerably, but yet we still see the same defensive lapses. He doesnt know how to get enough out of his personel.

The 2nd half of last season the defense was awful. We got raped by the running game over and over.

Gunt is a bad talent evaluator, and has found ways to limit players.

I always felt that the Falcon for DT was a terrible plan, and think Gunt did more to contain DT than any offense ever did.

With DJ, he took a kid that excelled at the Weakside LB position and turned him into a strongside LB, because he had some coverage skills.

DJ, with his speed, could be a beast if he had been let loose on the weakside.

And Gunt stubbornly clings to these failed ideas.

[Hammock Parties]

DJ, with his speed, could be a beast if he had been let loose on the weakside.

And Gunt stubbornly clings to these failed ideas.

DJ spent a ton of time on the weakside last year. I don't know what they're doing. They should just leave him there.

[milkman]

DJ spent a ton of time on the weakside last year. I don't know what they're doing. They should just leave him there.

Yes, they should just leave him there, and Donnie Edwards, even though I have never thought much of him, is better suited for the strong side than DJ.

So what we have is a Sam starting at Will, and a Will starting at Sam, and people think that Gunt is a defensive genius.

Hell, if he were even a good LB coach, that shit wouldn't happen.

[alanm]

insert 'scanlon' for octavian, and you're Royc. and/or III.
Naw.. Just a gut feeling. If he can't beat out Nap Harris it's time to look for a new career.

[Deberg_1990]

Gun also doesnt do a very good job of disguising blitzes.

He never did, but he was able to get away with it in the 90's because we had better pure pass rushers and a great secondary.

All i know is, im very tired of Gunther Cunningham. Why cant this team ever get rid of the past and move on??

[KCinNY]

Gun also doesnt do a very good job of disguising blitzes.

This is my biggest pet peeve with Goonthar. The QB always, and I mean ALWAYS, sees our blitzes coming from a mile away. One quick audible and it's an easy 1st down for the offense.

[kcxiv]

Gun also doesnt do a very good job of disguising blitzes.

He never did, but he was able to get away with it in the 90's because we had better pure pass rushers and a great secondary.

All i know is, im very tired of Gunther Cunningham. Why cant this team ever get rid of the past and move on??

Eh, gun never really diguises blitz's. He wanted you to know that they are coming, but like you said, with DT and NS he could get away with it.

[Rausch]

I think that Deberg hits on the problem a little here.

Gunt is a bad talent evaluator, and has found ways to limit players.

For the most part, yes.

He seems like the perfect example of the great JV coach that just doesn't have "it" to coach the varsity (in the NFL.)

He is a pure coach - not an instructor. He's the kind of guy I would have loved as a wrestler in high school, and you'd have run walls through for, but might not really improve your skill set.

I always felt that the Falcon for DT was a terrible plan, and think Gunt did more to contain DT than any offense ever did.

The Falcon was a dog$#it idea. And I don't know who's geni(0)us plan it was to bench DT when we played the Bills in the playoffs years ago but that man should be taped to a fire ant hole and given a 4 gallon honey enema.

With DJ, he took a kid that excelled at the Weakside LB position and turned him into a strongside LB, because he had some coverage skills.

DJ, with his speed, could be a beast if he had been let loose on the weakside.

And Gunt stubbornly clings to these failed ideas.

Gun has managed to find a way to hide both Edwards (twice) and DJ by taming them and putting them in coverage more than blitzing/playing the run. He's made the both of them rabbits in the proverbial hat.

1/3 of the time you expect DJ or Edwards to drop back they should be rushing the passer. DJ is a dominating pass rushing presence with the ability to shake off and push aside bigger pass blockers.

IMHO we're using our talent at LB as a "safety valve" since the front 4 can't rush the passer for $#it. Instead of storming forward at the QB we're pulling off to cover and sitting in zones to due to the lack of rush/productivity by the front 4.

[Hammock Parties]

DJ is a dominating pass rushing presence

I like DJ, but this is just not true, at all.

[Rausch]

Eh, gun never really diguises blitz's. He wanted you to know that they are coming, but like you said, with DT and NS he could get away with it.

Well, yeah.

If you rushed them both one of them was sure to MAKE the sake when they got there.

Mitchel, DE, Nappy, all these guys have made hide-your-face misses on helpless QB's...

[Rausch]

I like DJ, but this is just not true, at all.

He has the ability, and has shown as much at the NFL level, to push aside the FB/TE/T and still get to the passer. He's also aware of the ball and goes for the sack/strip.

You're the clip master, show some from last year.

He's leashed.

[Hammock Parties]

He has the ability, and has shown as much at the NFL level, to push aside the FB/TE/T and still get to the passer. He's also aware of the ball and goes for the sack/strip.

You're the clip master, show some from last year.

He's leashed.

I've watched plenty of DJ rushing the passer...he's not a guy that's going to beat a tackle one on one. He's good when you send six guys after the quarterback and he can take on a fullback or tight end, yes.

I do agree when he has a free hit on the QB he makes it count.

And he's pretty leashed by the Cover 2 but in Gun's defense, last year we played more of a hybrid defense. DJ LED THE LEAGUE in tackles for loss because of it.

It will be interesting to see what Gunther does with the LBs this year since he's coaching them.

[Rausch]

I've watched plenty of DJ rushing the passer...he's not a guy that's going to beat a tackle one on one. He's good when you send six guys after the quarterback and he can take on a fullback or tight end, yes.

I do agree when he has a free hit on the QB he makes it count.

And he's pretty leashed by the Cover 2 but in Gun's defense, last year we played more of a hybrid defense. DJ LED THE LEAGUE in tackles for loss because of it.

It will be interesting to see what Gunther does with the LBs this year since he's coaching them.

You know I'm a big Gun fan but his clear weakness is getting production = talent out of the LB's here.

And the Cover2 doesn't rule out a zone blitz. We used it the way the Steelers use the trick play on offense. **** that - we have players who can scoot on the D line. USE THAT MOBILITY!

[Hammock Parties]

And the Cover2 doesn't rule out a zone blitz.

We did some of that last year. You have to realize Gunther was constantly compensating for his slow-ass corners. Leaving them on an island = bad idea. He had to drop seven into coverage quite a bit.

I'm pretty happy with DJ's game, just wish he was a bit more consistent. He missed some tackles last year, dropped a couple INTs.

[Deberg_1990]

You know I'm a big Gun fan

Why?? Ill admit, i like his personality but thats about it.

[Rausch]

We did some of that last year. You have to realize Gunther was constantly compensating for his slow-ass corners. Leaving them on an island = bad idea. He had to drop seven into coverage quite a bit.

I'm pretty happy with DJ's game, just wish he was a bit more consistent. He missed some tackles last year, dropped a couple INTs.

The corners couldn't play 3 deep and the safetys sucked in the Cover2. Surtain was respectable. I don't think he deserves the knocks he gets on here.

We didn't have squat in the secondary or D line. We had one decent DT (who rotated in and out) and Allen.

If Dorsey can play up to his ability for just 50% of the snaps we'll be much improved...

[Hammock Parties]

Surtain was respectable. I don't think he deserves the knocks he gets on here.


He's just as slow as Law, but at least he tackled. Candidate for nickel job this year.

Anyway, RE: the article, I think we'll probably drop a couple spots this year while improving in run defense (offense will be better), and hopefully we can make the jump to top 10 in 2009.

[Rausch]

Why?? Ill admit, i like his personality but thats about it.

I like his personality + he's got history with KC + I like his style of football + he's a Kraut.

Frankly, same goes for Herm.

I want them to do well. That doesn't mean I'll gloss over their failures if'n they don't...

[Rausch]

Anyway, RE: the article, I think we'll probably drop a couple spots this year while improving in run defense (offense will be better), and hopefully we can make the jump to top 10 in 2009.

I think we could have easily pulled it off last year if not for a 32 offense...

[Hammock Parties]

I think we could have easily pulled it off last year if not for a 32 offense...

Yeah I agree with that. I don't think the run defense is near as bad as the ranking. It wasn't good, but it wasn't among the league's worst. Putting the defense out there all day will do that, though.

[Hammock Parties]

I like his personality + he's got history with KC + I like his style of football + he's a Kraut.

Frankly, same goes for Herm.

I want them to do well. That doesn't mean I'll gloss over their failures if'n they don't...

I pretty much feel the same way.

And Herm is half German, too. LMAO

[Rausch]

I pretty much feel the same way.

And Herm is half German, too. LMAO

No kidding?

I figured you'd have picked up the fact I knew that by my 1,000 "why is Herm considered black but not German!?!" posts...

[Hammock Parties]

No kidding?

I figured you'd have picked up the fact I knew that by my 1,000 "why is Herm considered black but not German!?!" posts...

I think he's embraced black culture...but his parents sure were an odd couple.

My grandfathers were born in Germany, you know. Maybe we're distant cousins. :evil: