Cardinals vs. Cubs at Bush Stadium Thread

[BigRedChief]

Cardinals vs. Chicago at Busch Stadium

Kyle Lohse
RH
Record 13-6

VS.

Ryan Dempster
RH
Record 15-6
ERA 2.99


Braden Looper
RH
Record 12-11
ERA 4.09

VS.

Ted Lilly
LH
Record 13-9
ERA 4.43

Todd Wellemeyer
RH
Record 12-6
ERA 3.74

VS.

Rich Harden
RH
Record 9-2
ERA 1.99

Scouting the Cubs
• The Cubs have lost seven of their past eight games, blew a two-run lead in the ninth Sunday and now start a trek with 19 games remaining, all against winning teams, including six against the Cardinals.
• Harden will have gone more than a week between starts to buy his right elbow some rest. He’s won his past four decisions, and he finished August with a 1.82 ERA and 36 strikeouts in 29 2⁄3 innings.
• Derrek Lee has seen a dip in power since the All-Star break. The Cubs’ first baseman has three home runs in 182 at-bats, and just 12 of his 50 hits have been for extra bases.

[StcChief]

well then Let the Choking continue.... if they blow this it's 1969 all over to the Brew Crew

[BigRedChief]

well then Let the Choking continue.... if they blow this it's 1969 all over to the Brew Crew
7 out of 8 games lost. Wonder what Hootie has to say about the best team ever?

[Ultra Peanut]

well then Let the Choking continue.... if they blow this it's 1969 all over to the Brew CrewThe Cubs have a 4.5 game lead in the Central and a 9-game cushion in the wild card.

Frankly, I'm pretty comfortable with the fact that they managed to get ice cold now. This gives them a chance to build back up over the rest of the month and get hot in time for the playoffs.

[BigRedChief]

The Cubs have a 4.5 game lead in the Central and a 9-game cushion in the wild card.

Frankly, I'm pretty comfortable with the fact that they managed to get ice cold now. This gives them a chance to build back up over the rest of the month and get hot in time for the playoffs.
You are correct sir. But on the other hand the Cubs choke in the playoffs a lot too like......last year.:)

[Flustrated]

Cardinals vs. Chicago at Busch Stadium

Kyle Lohse
RH
Record 13-6

VS.

Ryan Dempster
RH
Record 15-6
ERA 2.99


Braden Looper
RH
Record 12-11
ERA 4.09

VS.

Ted Lilly
LH
Record 13-9
ERA 4.43

Todd Wellemeyer
RH
Record 12-6
ERA 3.74

VS.

Rich Harden
RH
Record 9-2
ERA 1.99

Scouting the Cubs
• The Cubs have lost seven of their past eight games,But still lead the Cards by 9 games and have the best record in the NL blew a two-run lead in the ninth Sunday and now start a trek with 19 games remaining, all against winning teams, including six against the Cardinals.
• Harden will have gone more than a week between starts to buy his right elbow some rest. He’s won his past four decisions, and he finished August with a 1.82 ERA and 36 strikeouts in 29 2⁄3 innings.
• Derrek Lee has seen a dip in power since the All-Star break. The Cubs’ first baseman has three home runs in 182 at-bats, and just 12 of his 50 hits have been for extra bases.

FYP :evil:

[BigRedChief]

FYP :evil:
Its just a copy and paste. Not my words. Are you worried about choking again?

[Frazod]

Sure, the Cardinals have stunk it up lately as well, however......

I would like to point out that since the All Knowing Genious Hootie declared the Cubs to have no weaknesses, they've gone 1-7. LMAO

[StcChief]

The Cubs have a 4.5 game lead in the Central and a 9-game cushion in the wild card.

Frankly, I'm pretty comfortable with the fact that they managed to get ice cold now. This gives them a chance to build back up over the rest of the month and get hot in time for the playoffs.that always works well...
get hot and peak end of sept and Wait.... this sounds like a Detriot 2006. Cards 2004.....

you better hope not or the Goat will keep the curse alive.

[BigRedChief]

Sure, the Cardinals have stunk it up lately as well, however......

I would like to point out that since the All Knowing Genious Hootie declared the Cubs to have no weaknesses, they've gone 1-7. LMAO
No, they are not worried at all about choking. ROFL Front page of the Chicago sun Times today.
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/1152102,CST-SPT-cub09.article

September 9, 2008
<!-- Article By Line -->BY GORDON WITTENMYER (gwittenmyer@suntimes.com) gwittenmyer@suntimes.com
<!-- Article's First Paragraph --><!-- BlogBurst ContentStart -->Thirty-nine years ago today, a black cat found Ron Santo in the on-deck circle at Shea Stadium in New York, walked around him, then headed through the Cubs' dugout, past manager Leo Durocher and disappeared under the stands.

Of course, the Cubs' high hopes during an extraordinary season disappeared right behind the feline. They lost to the New York Mets that night -- the sixth of eight straight losses -- and the next day, the Mets overtook them in the National League East race for good.
<!-- BlogBurst ContentEnd --><!-- start sidebar -->» Click to enlarge image
http://media1.suntimes.com/multimedia/090908cub_cst_feed_20080908_23_55_49_194-116-165.imageContent (http://javascript<b></b>:dc_popup_win('http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/1152368,090908cub.fullimage', 'fullimage', 'toolbar=no,location=no,directories=no,status=no,menubar=no,scrollbars=no,resizable=no,width=650,hei ght=650')) A black cat that crossed Ron Santo's path spooked the Cubs on Sept. 9, 1969, at Shea Stadium. Could the collapse that befell those Cubs happen this year?
(Sun-Times files)
''At the time, I didn't think anything of it,'' Santo told the New York Daily News earlier this summer. ''But, jeez, what an omen. It was like walking under a ladder.''

Fast forward to now, with the Cubs in a 1-7 swoon heading into the toughest part of their schedule, and there are some eerie similarities between this team and that one.

Five months of great baseball followed by their worst stretch of the season at the worst possible time. The records are almost identical, both with 57 losses on this date -- and both 1-5 in September -- entering a game against a division rival, in this case St. Louis.

The '69 team had its entire infield and catcher make the All-Star team. This one had a club-record eight players make it. Both had fiery managers famous for high-voltage ejections and considered among the best of their generations.
It's a perfect-storm nightmare for Cub cursemongers.
But what's worth believing?

The fact is, this franchise and September rarely have had a good relationship since the Cubs' last World Series appearance in 1945. They've had 42 losing Septembers since then, along with a pair of break-even ones and a canceled one in 1994.

In the only World Series played entirely in September, the Cubs lost to a team that would take 86 years to win another: the Boston Red Sox in 1918.

And even the guy who saw the ''omen'' that day in 1969 said he knows the real reason the Cubs faded to an 8-17 September that year: They were tired.
In a conversation two weeks ago, Santo recalled a writer interviewing all the players on that team after the season ended.

''I was really surprised,'' he said. ''They all talked about the fact that they were tired, meaning with all the day games.''

Many of the regulars played every game that season: Billy Williams 163 games, Santo 160, Don Kessinger 158 and 38-year-old Ernie Banks 155. Randy Hundley caught 151, a year after catching 160.

''I never thought about it until I saw what we hit,'' Santo said. ''I think the highest batting average in September was Glenn Beckert at about .260. Now I realize we were probably tired.''

These Cubs have stopped hitting, too. But they also have 30 home night games the '69 team didn't have. And nobody admits to weariness.
Shortstop Ryan Theriot, who seemed to wear down late last season, said he's starting to feel refreshed after a dip in August. First baseman Derrek Lee, whose power has been down dramatically since late July, laughed at the question.
''No, I'm not tired,'' he said, chuckling. ''I'm not tired at all.''

Center fielder Jim Edmonds, 38, who played on St. Louis teams that survived September to make deep October runs, as well as Anaheim teams that swooned out of races, said he sees plenty of energy from the Cubs.
''The one thing you can probably get into is maybe you see the light at the end of the tunnel,'' Edmonds said, ''and you kind of take a step back, start looking at the schedule and realizing there's only three weeks left and maybe get a little complacent.

''But I don't see anybody doing that. I just don't see it. We just don't have that extra kick that we need, and we need to find a way to get it back.''

Seeing red might be a start, with the intensity of the Cardinals series over the next three days.

Seeing a few more healthy pitchers wouldn't hurt the Cubs' cause, either. A good start from Rich Harden on Thursday -- his first start in 13 days after reporting shoulder ''discomfort'' -- and a good bullpen session this week from Carlos Zambrano's balky shoulder might provide every answer the Cubs need.

And, of course, they have a few more things going for them than the '69 team did as they face their final 19 games. Nobody within sight of pursuing the Cubs for a playoff spot shows any signs of pulling off the kind of 23-7 September the Mets did that year.

Those Cubs also didn't have the fallback position of a wild-card playoff spot, which they would have won had the format been in place.

The odds of the Cubs tailspinning all the way out of the postseason are extremely long. Just do the math. If they win only one game in each series the rest of the way for a 6-13 finish, the top challenger in a would-be wild-card race, Philadelphia, would need to go 13-5 to tie the Cubs.
But until they actually close it out, there always will be black cats and curses. Just depends on what you believe.
<!-- BlogBurst ContentEnd --><!-- Start Bottom Story --><!--text-->

[StcChief]

I got this today from Cub fan faithfully it's Doom and Gloom... the choking is really starting to set in.

[BigRedChief]

After the Cubs blew a lead in Sunday’s loss to Cincinnati, irate manager Lou Piniella refused to speak to the media, the only time that’s happened this season.

The Cubs’ lead over second-place Milwaukee is down to 4.5 games … and in that regard, the Cubs are fortunate, because the Brewers are also dragging, having dropped six of their last 8.
So what’s gone wrong for the NL’s best team?

* Two frontline starters, Carlos Zambrano and Rich Harden, are nursing tender shoulders, though Harden is slated to pitch against the Cardinals on Thursday. It’s a nervous time; if these aces blow up, the Cubs will make a quick disappearance, either now or in October.

* Cubs’ pitching, which was third in the NL with a 3.75 ERA from the start of the season until the end of August, is getting pounded this month. Their 6.29 ERA in September is the NL’s worst. In this 1-7 crash, the bullpen has allowed 24 runs in 27 innings, and Kerry Wood blew a save on Sunday. And setup men Bobby Howry, Neal Cotts and Jeff Samardzija are taking a beating.

* And then there’s underrated reliever Chad Gaudin, who came over in the same deal that sent Harden from Oakland to Chicago. Gaudin hasn’t pitched since Aug. 29 after injuring his back in a bizarre off-field accident; he slipped off a curb and slammed his back on a dumpster.
* In their last seven losses, the Cubs have scored a total of 17 runs.

* Aramis Ramirez, Jim Edmonds, Kosuke Fukudome and Derrek Lee are scuffling.

Ramirez is 5 for his last 33 and is playing with a sore quad.
Fukudome is batting .233 since May 17.

Lee has three homers in 182 ABs since the All-Star break.
Since homering twice against St. Louis on Aug. 8, Edmonds is 9 for 53 with 15 Ks.

These are just a few of the reasons why the anxiety is spreading on Chicago’s North Side. As we mentioned earlier, this 1-7 slump is being likened to the Cubs’ shocking collapse in 1969, when they went 1-11 in the first two weeks of September and coughed up a 9.5 game lead to the Mets.

And pulling out of this malaise won’t be easy; the Cubs are beginning a season-ending stretch of playing 19 consecutive games against winning teams. And 13 of those final 19 will be on the road. The Cubs are 19-17 so far this season against their remaining opponents.

All of that said, the Cubs have a lot working in their favor.

The Brewers’ own mettle is being tested. At this point, Milwaukee hardly looks like those late-rushing ‘69 Mets, who went 23-7 in the final month. And there was no wild-card playoff berth in ‘69.

As Gordon Wittenmyer of the Sun-Times pointed out, even if the Cubs went 6-13 the rest of the way, the top wild-card contender, Philadelphia, would have to go 13-5 to to the Cubs.

[Chief Henry]

Completely
Useless
By
Septemebr

[Jewish Rabbi]

Completely
Useless
By
Septemebr

Hey Chief Henry...What part of Iowa are you from?

[triple]

cubs will hold on and win the division. brewers will probably miss the playoffs though. i think Philly is going to steal it.

[Chief Henry]

Hey Chief Henry...What part of Iowa are you from?

NW Iowa originally.

[Chief Henry]

cubs will hold on and win the division. brewers will probably miss the playoffs though. i think Philly is going to steal it.

Philly will be tough for the Brewers and Cardinals and Houston to over come.

How many games have the Cardinals bullpen blown now ? Is it up to 35 or more.

[Jewish Rabbi]

Philly will be tough for the Brewers and Cardinals and Houston to over come.

How many games have the Cardinals bullpen blown now ? Is it up to 35 or more.
Nope still only 30 :D

[POND_OF_RED]

From the way you guys are all talking you would think you were fans of a team not getting ready to move into 4th place in there division and about to lose there All-Star for the beginning of there "futures so bright in 09" season.

[bango]

Go Cardinals. I say that as a Brew Crew Fan always and a Cardinal Fan in this series.

[teedubya]

Sweet... I didnt know that George Bush had a stadium

[BigRedChief]

Sweet... I didnt know that George Bush had a stadium
He snuck it in under a Iraq funding bill. He's going to hang out there after January.

[POND_OF_RED]

I've got $1000 casino cash on the series. Any takers?

[BigRedChief]

I've got $1000 casino cash on the series. Any takers?
I'll take your money.wellll casino cash.

Whoever's team loses 2 out of 3 in the series pays the other a grand. Deal?

[POND_OF_RED]

I'll take your money.wellll casino cash.

Whoever's team loses 2 out of 3 in the series pays the other a grand. Deal?

You are on. With winter coming I will need the extra money for poker. :D

[Coltman]

Quite posting on this site, its for the Chiefs you moron

[Frazod]

Quite posting on this site, its for the Chiefs you moron

Wow, four whole posts and you think you can dictate terms.

Go f#ck yourself.

[Coach]

3-0 Chicago, top of th sixth.

[Frazod]

I'm watching it. Kind of lame so far, although I'm encouraged by that leadoff double Skip just hit.

[Frazod]

Tie game. Suck it, Dumpster. :D

[Frazod]

Well, they're into the Cardinal bullpen now.

fearfearfear

[BigRedChief]

Perez walks the lead off guy in the ninth to face the top of the line up?

[BigRedChief]

espn gamecast says a 43% chance of scoring now

[Frazod]

Thank you Sosa-ano.

[Frazod]

Perez walks the lead off guy in the ninth to face the top of the line up?

No, it was that useless piece of shit Villone.

How is he still on this team? :banghead:

[BigRedChief]

Damn Perez gets Soriano to ground into a DP

[Frazod]

Both teams playing some spectacular defense tonight. That play Marmol made was amazing.

The bastard.

[BigRedChief]

I just now turned on gamecast

[BigRedChief]

Pujols 3 run homer. What a game

[Frazod]

Pujols 3 run homer. What a game

Yes, that was the inspiration for my "Suck it Dumpster" post. :)

[Frazod]

Winning run on 1st, no outs.

[BigRedChief]

Yadi!Yadi!

[BigRedChief]

pinch runner for Yadi. Larussa going for it

[Frazod]

Balk on Marmol LMAO

Winning run on 2nd, no outs.

[BigRedChief]

Gamecast says we have a 56% chance of scoring now

[BigRedChief]

not walking to set up the DP?

[Frazod]

Gamecast says we have a 56% chance of scoring now

The game's on WGN.

[Jewish Rabbi]

not walking to set up the DP?

Not intentionally :D

[Frazod]

Walk. 1st and 2nd, no outs.

[BigRedChief]

The game's on WGN.
cool got it on now

[Frazod]

The n00b puts down a good bunt. Runners and 2nd and 3rd, one out.

[Jewish Rabbi]

What the hell is Lou thinking? Walk Izturis to set up the dp...

[Jewish Rabbi]

YAY!

[OnTheWarpath15]

Great slide by Ryan...

[Frazod]

CARDINALS WIN

SUCK IT CUBS

[Jewish Rabbi]

Ugly as shit but I'll take the W :D

[Frazod]

Boy, I don't know how we beat those guys.

Hootie says they've got no weaknesses. LMAO

[BigRedChief]

Beat their closer. Our new 2009 closer got the job done again. Nice on the job training.

[BigRedChief]

Boy, I don't know how we beat those guys.

Hootie says they've got no weaknesses. LMAO
So how do you lose 8 out of 9 games then hootie?

[Frazod]

So how do you lose 8 out of 9 games then hootie?

I don't know. He's been curiously absent from the baseball threads lately.

Can't imagine why.

[Coach]

Beat their closer. Our new 2009 closer got the job done again. Nice on the job training.

Incorrect. Marmol is not the Cubs closer.

[Flustrated]

congratz, now you're only 8 back

[bango]

HA. You see that Chicago. You eat like that. Cards Win, Cards Win.

[Frazod]

congratz, now your only 8 back

Thanks. I hope you're enjoying September.

[Flustrated]

Thanks. I hope you're enjoying September.

good call

[Frazod]

good call

I preferred the one at the plate that ended the game. :)

[Frazod]

Bottom of the 9th in Milwaukee, game tied 4-4.

[BigRedChief]

congratz, now you're only 8 back
Are you getting nervous?

Your newspaper sure is. ROFL

[Frazod]

Brewers winning run on 1st, one out.

[Frazod]

Double play ends the inning. Great play by the right fielder plus really shitting baserunning by the Brewers.

On to the top of the 10th.

[Frazod]

Gagne walks a runner with one out.

I don't think the home plate umpire likes Gagne. Or Milwaukee.

[Frazod]

Two outs on a deep fly ball to center. Runner does not advance.

[Frazod]

On to the bottom of the 10th.

[Frazod]

Brewers lose, 5-4, in 11. Cards now 3 1/2 out of the wildcard.

[BigRedChief]

Brewers lose, 5-4, in 11. Cards now 3 1/2 out of the wildcard.
Wainright/Looper/Lohse/Wellenmeyer with Carp and Perez in the bullpen might just be enough in a short series? Especially wih the way Pujols is swinging the bat.

[BigRedChief]

jeezzz neither the Bucks or the Cubs want the division. They are going to mess around and let us back in it.

[Frazod]

You spoke too soon - Brewers won this afternoon.

[BigRedChief]

You spoke too soon - Brewers won this afternoon.
:LOL: one game out of 20 or so left. We shall see.

[Frazod]

:LOL: one game out of 20 or so left. We shall see.

karma..... We just lost Glaus for at least a few days, Carpenter's not ready to close and I trust our bullpen about as much as I trusted Greg Robinson's defense.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

For a team without any holes, those cubbies sure aren't looking too great lately. I see the collapse has begun even before expected.

[BigRedChief]

karma..... We just lost Glaus for at least a few days, Carpenter's not ready to close and I trust our bullpen about as much as I trusted Greg Robinson's defense.
ohhh I understand we are not really ready to compete with the big dogs on a consistent basis but we wern't in 2006 either.:)

No team that has Albert Pujols on it is ever out it.:clap:

[BigRedChief]

Wednesday, September 10, 2008
This is not 1969 all over again for Cubs

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=rogers_phil&page=pennantpulse

There was a time when one of the best-selling jerseys in Chicago was a Cubs top, No. 03, bearing the name "Bartman." It was very popular among White Sox fans.


Picking up on that theme, on Tuesday night in St. Louis, a fan wore a Cubs jersey, No. 69, with the words "Next Year" written from shoulder to shoulder. This, of course, was hardly the only link to the Cubs' ongoing crisis -- semicrisis, really -- and the collapse of Leo Durocher's team in 1969, a calamity that ranks alongside the one starring Mrs. O'Leary's cow in Chicago annals.

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD width=5 rowSpan=2><SPACER height="1" width="5" type="block"></TD><TD width=300>http://sports.espn.go.com/photo/2008/0910/mlb_a_izturis_300.jpg</TD></TR><TR><TD width=300>Cesar Izturis' check-swing grounder in the bottom of the ninth gave the Cardinals a 4-3 victory over the Cubs and their 78th win of the season.</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

After a Carlos Marmol (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=28486) balk and the difference in properly executed bunts allowed St. Louis to hand the Cubs their eighth loss in nine games, manager Lou Piniella finally began acting like, well, Lou Piniella.


"We're playing like we're waiting to get beat," said Piniella, who had declined to do a postgame interview after Sunday's 4-3 loss in Cincinnati. "You don't have a big enough lead in September to play ball like that. Teams [that] play ball like that invariably get caught, no matter how big the lead."


Piniella was shouting by the end of his soliloquy, which was directed at a room full of reporters, not a clubhouse full of players.


"You can talk about having fun, talk about relaxing," Piniella said. "You've got to get your shirt[sleeves] rolled up and go out and kick somebody's ass! Period!"


You can't blame Piniella for getting angry. That's his job, and his character. He was trying to bring a sense of urgency to the closing stretch for the Cubs, but the reality is that this is still not an especially urgent time for the National League's best team. This is 2008, not 1969.



The Cubs led by nine games on Aug. 16, 1969 but went 17-26 the rest of the way and had their doors blown off by the New York Amazin's. In the worst stretch, the team built around Ernie Banks, Billy Williams, Ron Santo and Fergie Jenkins lost 11 of 12.

<INLINE1>
But the 2008 Milwaukee Brewers (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=mil) show few signs of being the '69 Mets, who won 38 of their last 49 games. Despite the one-two combination of CC Sabathia (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=4553) and Ben Sheets (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=4571) (who are due to start again on Wednesday and Thursday), the Brew Crew has serious problems of its own.


Ned Yost's team has lost seven of nine, including a horrid, 11-inning 5-4 loss to Cincinnati on Tuesday night when it wasted another chance to gain ground. The Brewers have gained only two games on the Cubs during the stretch that had Piniella screaming; they've moved from 6½ back to 4½ games back.


"The guys are trying their hearts out," Yost said. "They're just not getting much production. … It's like, 'Man, where is this coming from?'"


The Brewers aren't the only saving grace for the Cubs this September. Had the wild card been in effect in 1969, the Cubs would have hung on to make the playoffs. Their 92 wins were two more than that of any other runner-up.


Back on Aug. 29, the Cubs had an 11-game cushion for making the playoffs. That has slid to 7½ games over Philadelphia, the wild-card runner-up. That margin would be 6½ if the Phillies had been able to beat Florida on Tuesday, but like the Brewers, they missed the chance to pick up any ground. The Cubs' magic numbers shrunk without their having to win.


That's why Piniella is screaming in the middle of a forest.


Strength in numbers


Because Major League Baseball is sticking to the prolonged postseason schedule that includes unnecessary off days, pitching depth will not be required in October. Teams willing to occasionally use their best starters on short rest could go to the World Series behind three starters, with the top two starting eight of 11 games in the first two rounds.


But pitching depth will be tested as teams fight to play in October. The White Sox are most feeling that, thanks to Monday's rainout against Toronto. They were swept by the Blue Jays in Tuesday's doubleheader, with No. 5 starter Clayton Richard (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=29195) allowing five runs in four innings. They're scrambling to find a starter for Saturday's game when they play Detroit.

[Frazod]

Stop poking karma in the eye, dammit.

Cards down 4-1 in the 3rd.

[Frazod]

Cards just got hosed on a close play at the plate. Run should have scored, but instead it was the last out.

It was close enough, though, that it's hard to fault the ump.

[Ultra Peanut]

Al Hrabgrfrfrfrr is so awful.

[Frazod]

Al Hrabgrfrfrfrr is so awful.

Living up here, when the Cubs and Cards play, I can't get the Cards feed. Annoys the shit out of me.

But at least their TV guys aren't as bad as their radio guys. If Marconi had known Ron Santo would one day do color commentary, he would not have invented the radio.

[Frazod]

Cards attempting to make a game of it in the bottom of the 9th. Ludwick hits a two-run shot, Cards now trail 4-3 with one out.

[Ultra Peanut]

That's cool.

[Frazod]

Good game. I like that they showed a little fight at the end.

[Frazod]

Cubs won, Hootie. It's safe to post now.

[BigRedChief]

Cubs won, Hootie. It's safe to post now.
ROFL

[StcChief]

Rubber game tonite.
http://stlouis.cardinals.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080910&content_id=3451862&vkey=news_stl&fext=.jsp&c_id=stl

ST. LOUIS -- The stakes are surely still too high for any hijinks, but it's clear that some elements in the Cardinals' clubhouse are a little irritated with some actions by the Cubs as Thursday's series finale approaches. On Tuesday, it was infielder Brian Barden expressing frustration with a high-and-tight pitch from Carlos Marmol. On Wednesday, manager Tony La Russa made it clear -- without explicitly saying so -- that he was annoyed by Ted Lilly's collision with Yadier Molina at home plate.
"I have no problem as long as both sides play hard-nosed," La Russa said. "He [Lilly] wanted to take a shot at the catcher. That's right on the line. They want to play hard. We're going to play hard. That's how we play anyway. As long as when we play hard, they know it goes both ways."
Asked later about Lilly's pitching, La Russa said, "I'll let the other side talk about him. I have no comment about him."
However, Molina had no complaints about the play, in which Lilly's knee hit him in the thigh.
"It's a strong play," said Molina. "It's a clean play. He came in hard. I wasn't expecting the hit, but he hit me hard. It's a clean play."
Still, however inflamed the emotions may or may not be, the ballgame matters. Quite a bit. The Cubs are fighting to maintain their division lead over the Brewers, while the Cardinals are trying to catch up with that same Milwaukee team in the Wild Card race.
<!--CHANGE c_id for team-specific probables page--> Pitching matchup (http://stlouis.cardinals.mlb.com/news/probable_pitchers.jsp?c_id=stl)
STL: RHP Todd Wellemeyer (12-6, 3.74 ERA)
Wellemeyer is dealing lately. He started the year hot, hurt his elbow and struggled upon his return to action, but over the past six weeks, he's going as well as he has all year. In his past eight starts, Wellemeyer has a 2.75 ERA, 37 strikeouts and 12 walks in 52 1/3 innings. One thing worth watching is his durability, since he's coming off the longest start of his career -- eight innings and 119 pitches, both new personal highs.
CHC: RHP Rich Harden (9-2, 1.99 ERA)
Harden should be well rested. Because of his history of arm troubles, the Cubs chose to give the right-hander an extended breather. Harden's last start was on Aug. 29, against the Phillies, and he did not get a decision. Harden threw 100 pitches in five innings, giving up two runs (one earned) on three hits and four walks. He now has 167 strikeouts, matching his career high set in 2004, when he was a member of the A's. Harden finished August with a 3-0 record and a 1.82 ERA, giving up six earned runs in 29 2/3 innings.
Tidbits
Felipe Lopez (7-for-22) is the only Cardinal with more than four at-bats against Harden. ... Wellemeyer has a 4.57 ERA at home vs. 2.87 on the road. ... Albert Pujols is 37-for-81 (.457) since Aug. 15 with 11 doubles, nine home runs, 24 RBIs and a .926 slugging percentage. ... Ryan Ludwick became the first Cardinal other than Pujols to drive in 100 runs in a season since Jim Edmonds and Scott Rolen in 2004.

[BigRedChief]

bottom of the 9th down 3-2. We need a rally

[Coach]

Cubs win in a dramatic ending.

[BigRedChief]

Dang Pujols up to win it again and.....fail. You can't expect him to hit the winning run in every time,

[BigRedChief]

Cubs win in a dramatic ending.
Got a rally going but just couldn't quite get it done.

Nice job Cubs!:clap:

[Coach]

Dang Pujols up to win it again and.....fail. You can't expect him to hit the winning run in every time,

Hmm hmm, plus the Cards did had other chances, like the 8th inning IIRC.

Still though, I tip my cap to both the Cards and the Cubs for a very entertaining series.

[BigRedChief]

fricking Ryan over slid the bag. After such a great slide to win game 1 he blows this one. 1st and 3rd and no one out in the bottom of the ninth with the #2 hitter, Pujols and Ludwick due up. That was our game to win.

[BigRedChief]

You are on. With winter coming I will need the extra money for poker. :D
Don't spend it all in one place.:cuss:

[Coach]

fricking Ryan over slid the bag. After such a great slide to win game 1 he blows this one. 1st and 3rd and no one out in the bottom of the ninth with the #2 hitter, Pujols and Ludwick due up. That was our game to win.

That was very costly. Both starting pitchers did pretty well. Welly looked decent. Harden hits 94 on the gun and looked sharp after a lay-off.

[Hoover]

Well maybe next time Card fans. How's 4th place in the NL Central feel?

[Frazod]

Well maybe next time Card fans. How's 4th place in the NL Central feel?

Not nearly as bad as being a 100 year loser.

Always nice to see the fair weather Cub fans who only show up after a win. Where's Hootie?

[Hoover]

I'm no fair weather fan, I have the slits on my wrists over the last 2 weeks to prove it.

Hell the mere fact that i'm a Chiefs fan should be proof enough that I'm not a bandwagon sports fan.

[Frazod]

I'm no fair weather fan, I have the slits on my wrists over the last 2 weeks to prove it.

Hell the mere fact that i'm a Chiefs fan should be proof enough that I'm not a bandwagon sports fan.

Silly me, why on earth would I think that?

Perhaps because your first post on this thread didn't come until after the last out in the deciding game.

:rolleyes:

But you're in good company. I spend five days a week in Chicago, and you're just like all the rest of them.

[Hoover]

Yeah, sorry I usually post on the Cubs win, Cubs win post...

Anyway, I think what the Cards have done this year is remarkable. If the pitching staff was fully healthy this division would be even tougher.

And your like every asshole Card fan I know too. congrats

[Frazod]

Yeah, sorry I usually post on the Cubs win, Cubs win post...

Anyway, I think what the Cards have done this year is remarkable. If the pitching staff was fully healthy this division would be even tougher.

And your like every asshole Card fan I know too. congrats

I'll take that as a compliment.

When the Cubs get bounced in the NLDS, take comfort in the fact that I'll be out and about wearing my 10 time world champion hat.

:)

[Hoover]

I wouldn't expect anything less, but I doubt it comes to that.

[Frazod]

I wouldn't expect anything less, but I doubt it comes to that.

Yeah, they could win it all. *snicker*

OR....

They could be five outs away from advancing to the World Series in game 6 of the NLCS again, when some hapless pigeon swoops down towards left field, causing Soriano to misplay an easy fly ball. After that, 10 unearned runs score and they lose the game 10-9. Pinella's head explodes like the guy in Scanners, and Zambrano gets in an argument with Soto over missed signs and beats him to death with a Gatorade cooler. The next night, they lose Game 7 by a score of 20-3. Later, all over Chicago, angry Cub fans take to the streets and embark on a pigeon-killing rampage, and the streets run gray, green and red with shit, guts and blood. A couple of months later, Cub faithful gather at Harry Caray's restaurant and have a fine meal of linguine with white pigeon sauce and truffles, putting the latest curse to rest once and for all. And the following year, they go 60-102.

That sounds much more likely to me. :D

[Ultra Peanut]

SLUMP BUSTERS

[BigRedChief]

Yeah, they could win it all. *snicker*

OR....

They could be five outs away from advancing to the World Series in game 6 of the NLCS again, when some hapless pigeon swoops down towards left field, causing Soriano to misplay an easy fly ball. After that, 10 unearned runs score and they lose the game 10-9. Pinella's head explodes like the guy in Scanners, and Zambrano gets in an argument with Soto over missed signs and beats him to death with a Gatorade cooler. The next night, they lose Game 7 by a score of 20-3. Later, all over Chicago, angry Cub fans take to the streets and embark on a pigeon-killing rampage, and the streets run gray, green and red with shit, guts and blood. A couple of months later, Cub faithful gather at Harry Caray's restaurant and have a fine meal of linguine with white pigeon sauce and truffles, putting the latest curse to rest once and for all. And the following year, they go 60-102.

That sounds much more likely to me. :D
You just know "something" is going to happen. ROFL

We went to the playoffs 8 times from 1996-2006 concluding with a win of a World Series. Even the Yankees don't get to win the World Series every year. We have had a down year last year and we were competing for a playoff spot until September this year when a lot of people thought we lose a 100 games this year.

2009 and 2010 are looking good for both the Cubbies and Cardinals. Should be fun.