Would you be willing to tag and trade DJ for a second rounder before the Draft?

['Hamas' Jenkins]

He has been a disappointment, but has a lot of physical tools and is still young. With that being said, why not just use the threat of tagging him to do so and work out a trade with another team, hopefully netting us another pick in the 45 range.

What do you think?

[ChiefsCountry]

Bring the right coach in and we have a star linebacker.

[StcChief]

Bring the right coach in and we have a star linebacker.again.... Gun has been FORCED to triyin the wrong SCHEME the cover2 has not really worked.... Still think DJ was a good draft

[DaneMcCloud]

Depending on his contract demands, yes.

[StcChief]

Depending on his contract demands, yes.that's always a given............. some how his numbers haven't been enough (due to scheme etc) to assume a good high pick.

[Demonpenz]

I would love to see what DJ could do in a eagles uni

[philfree]

NO.

PhilFree:arrow:

[B_Ambuehl]

Donnie Edwards, Scott Fujita, Kawika Mitchell......now Derrick Johnson?

hahaha

[Reerun_KC]

Also if you tag him, you cant trade him for a second round pick....

[DaFace]

No. I'm frankly tired of dumping all of our decent players in favor of draft picks. He may not be a star, but he's certainly a legitimate starting LB with potential to grow.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Depends on what his contract demands are.

I'd prefer to keep him, but if he goes all Jared Allen on us and thinks he's worth Top 5 money at his position, then ship his ass off.

[MahiMike]

Guy seems pretty average to me. But then again it could just be the coaching. Like u said, Kawika Mitchell looked much worse than DJ.

[Chief Faithful]

No, he is a fast multi-dimensional big play linebacker drafted by the team. Keep him.

[chiefs1111]

Depends on what his contract demands are.

I'd prefer to keep him, but if he goes all Jared Allen on us and thinks he's worth Top 5 money at his position, then ship his ass off.

agreed

[Frazod]

Ask me again when the memory of that SURE INTERCEPTION FOR A TOUCHDOWN BOUNCING OFF HIS FUCKING HANDS isn't quite so crystal clear.

:#

[The Franchise]

No...I'd keep him and sign him. This is all dependent on getting a head coach and a defensive coordinator that knows what the fuck they are doing.

[chiefzilla1501]

again.... Gun has been FORCED to triyin the wrong SCHEME the cover2 has not really worked.... Still think DJ was a good draft

Gun is a part of the problem.

And given that Gun is the guy coaching the LBs, there is no excuse for them to be so poor on fundamentals week after week.

[WilliamTheIrish]

TRade him. He'll never flourish here. We can draft another (hopefully) stud that can underachieve.

[Mecca]

Also if you tag him, you cant trade him for a second round pick....

Um yea you can...you only get 1sts if someone signs him, you can trade him for anything off the tag.

[TrickyNicky]

TRade him. He'll never flourish here. We can draft another (hopefully) stud that can underachieve.

Or convince LaVar Arrington out of retirement!

[Mecca]

I'm not even sure you could get a 2nd round pick, Lance Briggs basically got no interest in FA last year and he's much more proven than DJ. Non pass rushing LB's just aren't highly sought after anymore.

[Deberg_1990]

Isnt he like our only decent YOUNG linebacker?

['Hamas' Jenkins]

I'm not even sure you could get a 2nd round pick, Lance Briggs basically got no interest in FA last year and he's much more proven than DJ. Non pass rushing LB's just aren't highly sought after anymore.

I tend to agree with you. I first thought about putting 35-42 range, but I don't even think his value is that. He might only be worth a 50-60 level pick.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

Depends on what his contract demands are.

I'd prefer to keep him, but if he goes all Jared Allen on us and thinks he's worth Top 5 money at his position, then ship his ass off.

I don't really see that happening. JA was top 5 money, DJ's stats don't lie. If he asks for that kind of scratch it's just because he's trying to get the fuck out of here.

[Chiefnj2]

Get rid of all the young developing players. That's how you build championships.

[Mecca]

I think his point is that Johnson hasn't really developed.

[the Talking Can]

good teams find lbs all over the draft...why the hell would anyone trade a 2nd for DJ?

lmao....

[Brock]

I wouldn't trade Johnson. He's going to look a lot better when he gets more talent around him.

[ChiefsCountry]

There is some coach in Tennessee that developed Bulluck and Haynesworth. Hmm Johnson and Dorsey. :hmmm:

[jaa1025]

No less than a first, but he's a star in this league with the right coaching/scheme.

[Bwana]

Not only yes, but HELL YES!

[Ebolapox]

no. you don't trade your young/talented players unless their contract demands are other-worldly.

[milkman]

again.... Gun has been FORCED to triyin the wrong SCHEME the cover2 has not really worked.... Still think DJ was a good draft

It truly amazes me that there are people who still think Cunther is a legitimate NFL Coach.

He's just a loudmouth dumbass who doesn't have a fucking clue, that rode Marty's coat tail to a reputation as some kind of defensive guru.

Tell us how he's improved the LBing.

[Mecca]

Derrick Johnson is everything I don't like about players from Texas.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Other than the fact that he could just dominate with physical ability at Texas and had a good combine, what has he really shown at the next level that would dissuade you from offloading him for a younger, cheaper player who may actually respond to coaching?

I was a huge DJ supporter from the draft, but it's never clicked with him at this level, and you can't put all of that onus on coaching.

[Coach]

Derrick Johnson is everything I don't like about players from Texas.

Priest Holmes is from Texas.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Priest Holmes is from Texas.

Priest Holmes was a running back from a prior regime.

[Mecca]

I don't see how anyone can argue this...since Mack Brown has been at Texas, most of the players drafted from there regardless of their talent. Have not been ready for the league, they were very poorly coached at Texas and undisciplined which carried over to the NFL not to mention alot of them seem to be lazy and unresponsive to coaching.

Who from Texas has really succeeded? Roy Williams? And that one could be argued that he should be better than he is with what he brings to the table.

[ChiefsCountry]

Who from Texas has really succeeded?

Casey Hampton

[Mecca]

Is Hampton part of the Mack Brown era..if he is it's from the very very beginning.

[milkman]

Other than the fact that he could just dominate with physical ability at Texas and had a good combine, what has he really shown at the next level that would dissuade you from offloading him for a younger, cheaper player who may actually respond to coaching?

I was a huge DJ supporter from the draft, but it's never clicked with him at this level, and you can't put all of that onus on coaching.

Maybe not.

But Kawika Mitchell, while not a great player, is producing at a higher level over the last season and a hlf than he was ever able to reach here.

And Ryan Sim, while not playing at the level of a top 5 pick is playing far better in Tampa than he ever did here.

I don't know that DJ will ever be a great player, but I can almost gaurantee that he'll produce at a higher level for a real NFL coach.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Here are the current Longhorns in the league (player or coach)

<table class="multicol" style="background: transparent none repeat scroll 0% 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; width: 100%;" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td valign="top" width="33%" align="left">
Cedric Benson (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cedric_Benson), RB, Cincinnati Bengals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cincinnati_Bengals)
Justin Blalock (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_Blalock), OL, Atlanta Falcons (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanta_Falcons)
Tarell Brown (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarell_Brown), CB, San Francisco 49ers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_49ers)
Jamaal Charles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamaal_Charles), RB, Kansas City Chiefs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_City_Chiefs)
Tim Crowder (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Crowder), DE, Denver Broncos (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denver_Broncos)
Leonard Davis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonard_Davis), OG, Dallas Cowboys (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Cowboys)
Phil Dawson (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Dawson), K, Cleveland Browns (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_Browns)
Derrick Dockery (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derrick_Dockery), OG, Buffalo Bills (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffalo_Bills)
Jerry Gray (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Gray), Washington Redskins (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_Redskins)
Cedric Griffin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cedric_Griffin), CB, Minnesota Vikings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Vikings)
Michael Griffin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Griffin_%28football_player%29) , S, Tennessee Titans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennessee_Titans)
Ahmard Hall (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmard_Hall), FB, Tennessee Titans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennessee_Titans)
Casey Hampton (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casey_Hampton), NT, Pittsburgh Steelers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pittsburgh_Steelers) </td> <td valign="top" width="33%" align="left">
Richard Hightower (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Richard_Hightower&action=edit&redlink=1), Houston Texans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Houston_Texans)
Michael Huff (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Huff), S, Oakland Raiders (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oakland_Raiders)
Quentin Jammer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quentin_Jammer), CB, San Diego Chargers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego_Chargers)
Derrick Johnson (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derrick_Johnson), LB, Kansas City Chiefs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_City_Chiefs)
Cullen Loeffler (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cullen_Loeffler), DS, Minnesota Vikings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Vikings)
Alan Lowry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Lowry), Tennessee Titans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennessee_Titans)
Cory Redding (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cory_Redding), DE, Detroit Lions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroit_Lions)
Brian Robison (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Robison), DE, Minnesota Vikings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Vikings)
Shaun Rogers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaun_Rogers_%28American_football%29), DT, Cleveland Browns (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_Browns)
Aaron Ross (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aaron_Ross), CB, New York Giants (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_Giants)
Bo Scaife (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Scaife), TE, Tennessee Titans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennessee_Titans)
Jonathan Scott (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Scott), OT, Detroit Lions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroit_Lions) </td> <td valign="top" width="33%" align="left">
Lyle Sendlein (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyle_Sendlein), C, Arizona Cardinals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arizona_Cardinals)
Chris Simms (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Simms), QB, Tennessee Titans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennessee_Titans)
Kasey Studdard (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kasey_Studdard), OG, Houston Texans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Houston_Texans)
Limas Sweed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limas_Sweed), WR, Pittsburgh Steelers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pittsburgh_Steelers)
David Thomas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Thomas_%28American_football%29), TE, New England Patriots (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_England_Patriots)
Marcus Tubbs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcus_Tubbs), DT, Seattle Seahawks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle_Seahawks)
Nathan Vasher (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathan_Vasher), CB, Chicago Bears (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Bears)
Marcus Wilkins (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcus_Wilkins), LB, Atlanta Falcons (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanta_Falcons)
Ricky Williams (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ricky_Williams), RB, Miami Dolphins (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami_Dolphins)
Roy Williams (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roy_Williams), WR, Dallas Cowboys (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Cowboys)
Rodrique Wright (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rodrique_Wright), DT, Miami Dolphins (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami_Dolphins)
Selvin Young (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selvin_Young) , RB, Denver Broncos (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denver_Broncos)
Vince Young (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vince_Young), QB, Tennessee Titans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennessee_Titans)</td></tr></tbody></table>

[Mecca]

Maybe not.

But Kawika Mitchell, while not a great player, is producing at a higher level over the last season and a hlf than he was ever able to reach here.

And Ryan Sim, while not playing at the level of a top 5 pick is playing far better in Tampa than he ever did here.

I don't know that DJ will ever be a great player, but I can almost gaurantee that he'll produce at a higher level for a real NFL coach.

Some of that comes from the fact that for years now the Chiefs have asked role players to be their premier players. Those guys get in situations where they aren't "the guy" and just play a role next to the real studs and they're fine.

[Mecca]

Ok Michael Griffin he's good, but for all the hype Texas gets and all the players they've had drafted that is not a flattering list.

[TrickyNicky]

Here are the current Longhorns in the league (player or coach)


Wow, who coaches their secondary?

[ChiefsCountry]

Hampton played 3 years under Brown. Shaun Rogers was another player for Texas who has done pretty well. Him and Brees were the two players I wanted in the 2001 Draft.

[Mecca]

Shaun Rogers is great other than when he's being fat and lazy...

That list doesn't even include guys like Mike Williams who went in the top 10 and completely flamed out.

[SAUTO]

huff, jammer, ross, scaife, l davis, dawson. sweed looks ok so far

[SAUTO]

Shaun Rogers is great other than when he's being fat and lazy...

That list doesn't even include guys like Mike Williams who went in the top 10 and completely flamed out.

mike williams? what pos did he play?

[Mecca]

mike williams? what pos did he play?

He was an OT drafted by Buffalo.

[SAUTO]

He was an OT drafted by Buffalo.

thanks. but the ones i mentioned have all been passable as pro players IMO

[Mecca]

Michael Huff is a scrub for where he was drafted, he was a top 10 pick.

[SAUTO]

Michael Huff is a scrub for where he was drafted, he was a top 10 pick.

but he plays for an organization worse than ours. look at the talent in their secondary, they just cant get it together

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Looking at that list, Blalock, Hampton, Vasher, Dockery, Shaun Rogers, Corey Redding, are the ones who clearly outperformed their draft position.

Griffin, Huff, Jammer, Mike Williams, Young, Benson, Marcus Tubbs, Roy Williams, Ricky Williams, Davis, and Johnson have all been first round picks, ranging from #2 overall to #21, with the following top 10 picks

Mike Williams-2
Davis-2
Young-3
Williams-5
Jammer-5
Benson-5
Roy Williams 7
Huff-7

All of those top 10 picks have been either slight disappointments (Roy Williams, Huff, Jammer) or massive busts (Leonard Davis, Mike Williams, Vince Young, Cedric Benson).

That scares the shit out of me as a talent evaluator.

[milkman]

Some of that comes from the fact that for years now the Chiefs have asked role players to be their premier players. Those guys get in situations where they aren't "the guy" and just play a role next to the real studs and they're fine.

I get that.

But my point is that this staff doesn't have a clue how to effectively develop and utilize the talent they sign or draft.

I'm not advocating for DJ.

I'm just saying that this is the kind of thing that we can expect from these morons.

[SAUTO]

leonard davis a massive bust? maybe for the cards, but since going to the cowgals he's played pretty well. and i would say the book may not be closed on young just yet.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

leonard davis a massive bust? maybe for the cards, but since going to the cowgals he's played pretty well. and i would say the book may not be closed on young just yet.

Would you draft a guard #2 overall? The Cards tried him as LT and he was a massive, massive flop.

[SAUTO]

Would you draft a guard #2 overall? The Cards tried him as LT and he was a massive, massive flop.

no i wouldnt, but saying that he has played well for the cowboys.

[SAUTO]

and some guys take longer to " get it". all this expecting a guy to come in and dominate his first year is VERY ridiculous, just he took several years and a pos. change to get it. hell he might work out someday as lt

['Hamas' Jenkins]

and some guys take longer to " get it". all this expecting a guy to come in and dominate his first year is VERY ridiculous, just he took several years and a pos. change to get it. hell he might work out someday as lt

It shouldn't take 6 years and a shift from the most important and only position on the line worthy of a top 20 draft pick to a position almost never worth a first round pick for you to "get it".

That's an embarrassingly poor draft pick.

[SAUTO]

hey now wasnt shields a first rounder? but yeah i get what youre sayin, im just sayin that he's played pretty well since the switch, terrible for the cards, good for the 'boys

[milkman]

hey now wasnt shields a first rounder? but yeah i get what youre sayin, im just sayin that he's played pretty well since the switch, terrible for the cards, good for the 'boys

Shields was a third rounder.

[SAUTO]

Shields was a third rounder.

sorry brain fart

[Mecca]

I think the point still stands, Texas players are poorly coached and woefully ill prepared for the NFL.

[SAUTO]

I think the point still stands, Texas players are poorly coached and woefully ill prepared for the NFL.

seems like most probably are

[Mecca]

Which is another reason I hate drafting offensive skill players from the spread, they aren't prepared at all for what they'll see at the next level.

[Hammock Parties]

Other than the fact that he could just dominate with physical ability at Texas and had a good combine, what has he really shown at the next level that would dissuade you from offloading him for a younger, cheaper player who may actually respond to coaching?

I was a huge DJ supporter from the draft, but it's never clicked with him at this level, and you can't put all of that onus on coaching.

He had a good season last year. He led the entire goddamn league in tackles for loss.

He just needs better coaching...

['Hamas' Jenkins]

He had a good season last year. He led the entire goddamn league in tackles for loss.

He just needs better coaching...

And Tom Selleck led the entire American League in 9th inning doubles with two outs in the month of August before the Yankees DFA'ed him in Mr. Baseball.

[FAX]

Interesting idea.

I'm not ready to give up on DJ, though. Heck, I wasn't ready to give up on Mitchell, either. I am, however, ready to give up on our coaching staff. I don't think those guys are very good.

FAX

[Hammock Parties]

Har har.

You know another great argument for the "our coaches suck" theory is that in preseason, DJ looked AWESOME. Then we get to the regular season where things become much more complicated and he becomes pedestrian with an odd flash of greatness here and there...

[Mecca]

DJ looks awesome for a few minutes then disappears, that's the story of his career.

[FAX]

It could well be that the reason he appears to play well in spurts then "disappears" is that he isn't getting much help. It would certainly explain the phenomenon.

FAX

[Mecca]

It could well be that the reason he appears to play well in spurts then "disappears" is that he isn't getting much help. It would certainly explain the phenomenon.

FAX

Well it doesn't help when he drops an INT that literally hits him in the numbers.

[milkman]

It could well be that the reason he appears to play well in spurts then "disappears" is that he isn't getting much help. It would certainly explain the phenomenon.

FAX

It's a combination of all the factors discuss.

Poor coaching on the college level, and ill prepared for the NFL.
Poor coaching in the NFL, and a lack of talent and support around him.

It's a recipe for failure.

[milkman]

Well it doesn't help when he drops an INT that literally hits him in the numbers.

That's true, but he isn't the first, nor will he be the last, to do that.

It happens.

[Hammock Parties]

Well it doesn't help when he drops an INT that literally hits him in the numbers.

He's a fucking linebacker. It happens.

[Mecca]

He's a fucking linebacker. It happens.

Sure, but that's the difference in say him and say Keith Bulluck, remember that argument we had before the year?

[FAX]

Well it doesn't help when he drops an INT that literally hits him in the numbers.

Nope. Doesn't help at all.

I think that pass surprised him, though. Kind of like when some posters actually say something supportive or positive about our team. It just comes out of nowhere and it kind of freaks you out.

FAX

[Mecca]

I think the truth is Derrick Johnson is a relatively league average LB who will occasionally make a big play but overall isn't worth the pick that was used on him.

[Hammock Parties]

I think the truth is Derrick Johnson is a relatively league average LB who will occasionally make a big play but overall isn't worth the pick that was used on him.

Sorry Mecca, average linebackers DO NOT lead the league in tackles for loss.

[TrickyNicky]

So, our move is to tag him and let him see what other teams will offer salary-wise? If he gets lowballed by others then we re-sign him, if another team wants to make him the highest paid player at his position, then let him go and get compensation. Makes sense. I'm for it.

[FAX]

I honestly believe that, if DJ has decent coaching and some help on the field, he would be absolutely outstanding.

FAX

[KcMizzou]

Nah... not givin' up on DJ yet.

[jspchief]

What is the god damn obsession with draft picks lately? You honestly think a 2nd rnd pick will net a better player? Keep in mind that for this scenario to play out, some NFL front office believes that Johnson is worth more than a 2nd.

[Zouk]

Absolutely. Check out the way he got absolutely blown away on Washington's TD run.

[Chiefaholic]

Sounds to me like you guys want to get rid of the wrong guy named Johnson on this team. We're deep in talent at HB, and don't even have three starting caliber LB's, much less depth.

Ship LJ's selfish crybaby ass out of KC and absorb the cap hit while we have the cap space. Take that pick and build a damn O-Line that gives the QB more than 1.5 seconds to release the ball.

[KcMizzou]

Sounds to me like you guys want to get rid of the wrong guy named Johnson on this team. We're deep in talent at HB, and don't even have three starting caliber LB's, much less depth.

Ship LJ's selfish crybaby ass out of KC and absorb the cap hit while we have the cap space. Take that pick and build a damn O-Line that gives the QB more than 1.5 seconds to release the ball.That (in bold) is a hell of a point. Why would you further weaken, an already weak position? DJ might not be what we'd hoped for (yet) but I think it's pretty obvious that he's the best we've got.

We have gone draft pick crazy. (On Chiefsplanet) Always assuming the guy we get with the pick, is going to be better than the guy we've got.

News flash... often, on a shitty team... even quality players will look shitty at times.

[Shaid]

No.

[PastorMikH]

Trading DJ makes a lot of sense.:rolleyes:

He may not be the best LB in the NFL, shoot he may not be the best in the AFCW, but he's the best LB we have on the team.

Getting draft picks is great. But if we trade away every player we draft after he developes into a player, what good are the draft picks in the first place? Bust or trade, bust or trade.

Seems to me the best way to build a team is to draft, develop, and KEEP the good players, not the bad ones.



Shoot, I wonder how DT would have looked on this D. He had a D-Line that could generate a pass rush, a secondary that could play great man-to-man D, and other LBs that could handle things while he rushed the passer. He wouldn't have any of that here now. We'd probably want to trade him for picks too.

[kcxiv]

Nope. We have the most room avaliable, offer him a decent contract even if you have to overpay a tad. The Chiefs arent even close to cap hell.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Trading DJ makes a lot of sense.:rolleyes:

He may not be the best LB in the NFL, shoot he may not be the best in the AFCW, but he's the best LB we have on the team.

Getting draft picks is great. But if we trade away every player we draft after he developes into a player, what good are the draft picks in the first place? Bust or trade, bust or trade.

Seems to me the best way to build a team is to draft, develop, and KEEP the good players, not the bad ones.



Shoot, I wonder how DT would have looked on this D. He had a D-Line that could generate a pass rush, a secondary that could play great man-to-man D, and other LBs that could handle things while he rushed the passer. He wouldn't have any of that here now. We'd probably want to trade him for picks too.

Who cares if he's the best on the team? That literally means nothing. Should we have kept Warfield for all those years because he was the best corner?

The fact of the matter is that he's woefully underperformed his draft position, and if he commands more money than what he's worth, we should jettison him.

There's a reason why guys like Patrick Willis can produce from day 1 and why guys like Derrick Johnson still can't put it all together even in their 4th year in the league, and you can't place it all on scheme or talent.

[Mecca]

As far as that wrong Johnson comment, he has no value...and I've always been all for moving LJ..

[kcchiefsus]

Also if you tag him, you cant trade him for a second round pick....

Uhh, yeah you can. Nobody said a team HAS to give up the two 1sts for tagging somebody. That is only for signing a player without the team's permission. He could be tagged and traded for a 7th if we chose to do so.

[dj56dt58]

Well it doesn't help when he drops an INT that literally hits him in the numbers.

maybe he wants Stafford?

[Red Dawg]

HELL NO! DJ is A good young LB. The team is struggling but he has not played badly. The man needs help, not to be traded.

[Mama Hip Rockets]

WTF why do people always want to trade the only good players on the team? they already traded their best defensive player last year, and now you want to do it again?

[ChiefGator]

WTF why do people always want to trade the only good players on the team? they already traded their best defensive player last year, and now you want to do it again?

I know, I know. He is a solid starter, good linebacker. The only one we have. And we want to trade him just because he isn't the second coming of Ray Lewis, Derrick Thomas, Mike Singletary. (Can't think of many star OLB's actually). He is a solid starter. You feel your team with solid starters and you are a solid team. Not every 1st rounder will be a star, but you certainly hope they will at least be a solid starter... which he is.

Craziness is running rampant here. Just collecting draft picks does not a good team make.

[Mama Hip Rockets]

Just collecting draft picks does not a good team make.

obviously. look at the team now.

[milkman]

I know, I know. He is a solid starter, good linebacker. The only one we have. And we want to trade him just because he isn't the second coming of Ray Lewis, Derrick Thomas, Mike Singletary. (Can't think of many star OLB's actually). He is a solid starter. You feel your team with solid starters and you are a solid team. Not every 1st rounder will be a star, but you certainly hope they will at least be a solid starter... which he is.

Craziness is running rampant here. Just collecting draft picks does not a good team make.

When DJ was drafted, I had visions of Derek Brooks.

I honestly believe that Monte Kiffen could have gotten him to a level close to that calibre of play.

I also believe that DJ, if traded or signed elsewhere, will finally realize his potential whem he gets good coaching.

[SAUTO]

Sure, but that's the difference in say him and say Keith Bulluck, remember that argument we had before the year?

Keith Bulluck has NEVER dropped an int? surely he has sometime

[Red Dawg]

There is some coach in Tennessee that developed Bulluck and Haynesworth. Hmm Johnson and Dorsey. :hmmm:

Bullock said Gun made him the player he is today. Gun is a good coach but all coaches need good players to look good.

[Red Dawg]

He had a good season last year. He led the entire goddamn league in tackles for loss.

He just needs better coaching...

NOOOO! He needs better players around him. He's a fourth year player, he's been coached, he needs better team mates.

[Chiefnj2]

Trade him. Next year lets trade Flowers. We don't want any decent young talent on the team.

[whoman69]

This thread is ridiculous. Does anyone really think that DJ is so bad that he worth is only that of a rookie who may or may not be any better? Look at our 2nd rounders in the last decade and tell me how many were even marginal players. Perhaps our team is a bad example because CP has tended to reach (very far) with his 2nd round picks. Look at the league as a whole and find out how many 2nd rounders are busts. It could work out but the odds pretty low. We also will be slapping ourselves when DJ is traded to a team that has decent linebackers and safeties around him and he becomes all pro. Its easy to put the spotlight on DJ because he is the first round pick, but the other linebackers and the safeties we have are very poor. That leaves a lot of holes around DJ. He's also in a system where he's not rushing the QB often. IMO he could be a very good pass rusher if given a chance.

[PastorMikH]

The fact of the matter is that he's woefully underperformed his draft position,




So, because he's not playing up to your expectation of a mid-first round pick we should trade him for a third or fourth round pick that may not even make the team?

Sure, makes a lot of sense.

[milkman]

NOOOO! He needs better players around him. He's a fourth year player, he's been coached, he needs better team mates.

He's worked with the Chiefs coaches.

That is not being coached.

[bigbucks24]

So, our move is to tag him and let him see what other teams will offer salary-wise? If he gets lowballed by others then we re-sign him, if another team wants to make him the highest paid player at his position, then let him go and get compensation. Makes sense. I'm for it.
I'm confused. Do you mean tag, as in franchise tag, or just tender him?

[TommyHawk69]

What happened to the free him up and let him play like they said they did for the denver game?

[Sully]

And Tom Selleck led the entire American League in 9th inning doubles with two outs in the month of August before the Yankees DFA'ed him in Mr. Baseball.

There was a hole in his swing.

[PhillyChiefFan]

No. I'm frankly tired of dumping all of our decent players in favor of draft picks. He may not be a star, but he's certainly a legitimate starting LB with potential to grow.

I agree. If you dump every one of your decent to good players, they never grow or learn and you are stuck on square one perminately.

We already lost Allan, and most likely will loose Larry Johnson, he is detrimental to the team and I agree with whatever is decided to do with him, but he still is a good running back who will need to be replaced now (and I don't think Smith or Charles is the answer IMHO), at least until we gain a line that can blow open running lanes for them.

So a force at DE and a smashmouth back are already needing to be replaced, and if DJ goes, he will excel at another franchise and we will be saying "remember when DJ played for us..."

It is the coaching and Carl Peterson.

[Frankie]

He has been a disappointment, but has a lot of physical tools and is still young. With that being said, why not just use the threat of tagging him to do so and work out a trade with another team, hopefully netting us another pick in the 45 range.

What do you think?

I wouldn't call him a disappointment. But I distinctly wanted D'Marcus Ware over him in that draft. My son was all about DJ though and he got his wish......DAMN COWBOYS!!!!!

[PhillyChiefFan]

I wouldn't call him a disappointment. But I distinctly wanted D'Marcus Ware over him in that draft. My son was all about DJ though and he got his wish......DAMN COWBOYS!!!!!

I wanted Ware to go the Chiefs soo damn bad.

[Demonpenz]

Trade him. Next year lets trade Flowers. We don't want any decent young talent on the team.

although flowers has underwelmed I don't think we should trade him

[Dave Lane]

Given the curse of 2nd rounders for the Chiefs no way in hell.

[Frankie]

I wouldn't call him a disappointment. But I distinctly wanted D'Marcus Ware over him in that draft. My son was all about DJ though and he got his wish......DAMN COWBOYS!!!!!

Hypothetical variaton to this thread:

Ware, I hear, is also an FA next year. Would you do this trade?

DJ+LJ for Ware.

[The Franchise]

Given the curse of 2nd rounders for the Chiefs no way in hell.

Brandon Flowers?

['Hamas' Jenkins]

This thread is ridiculous. Does anyone really think that DJ is so bad that he worth is only that of a rookie who may or may not be any better? Look at our 2nd rounders in the last decade and tell me how many were even marginal players. Perhaps our team is a bad example because CP has tended to reach (very far) with his 2nd round picks. Look at the league as a whole and find out how many 2nd rounders are busts. It could work out but the odds pretty low. We also will be slapping ourselves when DJ is traded to a team that has decent linebackers and safeties around him and he becomes all pro. Its easy to put the spotlight on DJ because he is the first round pick, but the other linebackers and the safeties we have are very poor. That leaves a lot of holes around DJ. He's also in a system where he's not rushing the QB often. IMO he could be a very good pass rusher if given a chance.

I don't think that most of the people on this board really understand how the NFL works.

First of all, whether or not DJ was picked with a 1st round selection is immaterial at this point. He has fulfilled his rookie contract. He is a sunk cost. He is 3 1/2 years in and has shown little to no growth from his rookie year. He consistently makes poor decisions on the football field, takes bad angles, and runs himself out of plays. He has the physical ability to dominate, but the mental ability of a high school sophomore.

Now, if you don't think that you can draft well with your second round picks, you should really just pack up shop and go home, because you will never be able to compete without them.

Hell, the Colts didn't seem to have a problem letting go of Cato June, even though he had actually played at a pro bowl level.

Now, if you can tender Derrick Johnson at a first round level (he will be a RFA), then you can give him next year to show that he's actually worth a longer term deal. If he balks, trade his ass.

I'm not a fan of the team investing 12 million guaranteed on a player who can only flash potential, but can never consistently deliver upon it.

[The Franchise]

I don't think that most of the people on this board really understand how the NFL works.

First of all, whether or not DJ was picked with a 1st round selection is immaterial at this point. He has fulfilled his rookie contract. He is a sunk cost. He is 3 1/2 years in and has shown little to no growth from his rookie year. He consistently makes poor decisions on the football field, takes bad angles, and runs himself out of plays. He has the physical ability to dominate, but the mental ability of a high school sophomore.

Now, if you don't think that you can draft well with your second round picks, you should really just pack up shop and go home, because you will never be able to compete without them.

Hell, the Colts didn't seem to have a problem letting go of Cato June, even though he had actually played at a pro bowl level.

Now, if you can tender Derrick Johnson at a first round level (he will be a RFA), then you can give him next year to show that he's actually worth a longer term deal. If he balks, trade his ass.

I'm not a fan of the team investing 12 million guaranteed on a player who can only flash potential, but can never consistently deliver upon it.

I'm fine with tendering him at a 1st round and then seeing if anyone offers him anything. I'm against just going out and straight trading him for anything less than that......unless he raises hell about a contract.

[ChiefGator]

I'm not a fan of the team investing 12 million guaranteed on a player who can only flash potential, but can never consistently deliver upon it.

Glad you are looking out for Clark Hunt's money so much. However, give it up. He is going to get more than 12 million guaranteed. Average to solid LB's will be making that much in Free Agency this year. Hell, DJ should make more than Bell or Harris signed for.

Really, forget where he was drafted (because the other 31 teams in the league have) and forget that he will get more guaranteed than we see our whole lives (like many other RFA/UFA LB's will this offseason). Is DJ worth cutting for a total crapshoot in the draft? Hell no.

If you can get a 2nd for Donnie Edwards or Pat Thomas, let's do it.

[milkman]

I'd rather shitcan the staff and get a real coach to coach up DJ.

Really, think about this.

Since Marty left we've had one player, one, in the defensive front 7 play at an expected level or higher.

That's 1.

In 11 years.

[PhillyChiefFan]

This thread is ridiculous. Does anyone really think that DJ is so bad that he worth is only that of a rookie who may or may not be any better? Look at our 2nd rounders in the last decade and tell me how many were even marginal players. Perhaps our team is a bad example because CP has tended to reach (very far) with his 2nd round picks. Look at the league as a whole and find out how many 2nd rounders are busts. It could work out but the odds pretty low. We also will be slapping ourselves when DJ is traded to a team that has decent linebackers and safeties around him and he becomes all pro. Its easy to put the spotlight on DJ because he is the first round pick, but the other linebackers and the safeties we have are very poor. That leaves a lot of holes around DJ. He's also in a system where he's not rushing the QB often. IMO he could be a very good pass rusher if given a chance.

:clap:

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Glad you are looking out for Clark Hunt's money so much. However, give it up. He is going to get more than 12 million guaranteed. Average to solid LB's will be making that much in Free Agency this year. Hell, DJ should make more than Bell or Harris signed for.

Really, forget where he was drafted (because the other 31 teams in the league have) and forget that he will get more guaranteed than we see our whole lives (like many other RFA/UFA LB's will this offseason). Is DJ worth cutting for a total crapshoot in the draft? Hell no.

If you can get a 2nd for Donnie Edwards or Pat Thomas, let's do it.

I could give a shit about Clark Hunt's money, but if you think that if he signs a long-term, high dollar deal and it won't hurt the team down the road if he continues to be one grade above a stiff, you're insane.

Again, people who treat the draft like a crapshoot tend to be fans for teams that don't win.

Why don't you ask the Packers, Chargers, Colts, Giants, or Steelers how much of a "crapshoot" the draft is, and how much of it is a legitimate ability to identify and properly pluck talent.

[whoman69]

DJ has crap players around him from the line to the secondary behind him to the other linebackers beside him. He is not as bad as is being presented here. You can't expect him to be a one man wrecking crew from OLB especially when we have no other solid contributors on defense outside the cornerbacks. Last year with more talent around him he got serious Pro Bowl consideration. On the list of players to be replaced I'd put him pretty low down on the line. IMO he is part of the solution, not part of the problem.

[OnTheWarpath15]

I don't think that most of the people on this board really understand how the NFL works.

First of all, whether or not DJ was picked with a 1st round selection is immaterial at this point. He has fulfilled his rookie contract. He is a sunk cost. He is 3 1/2 years in and has shown little to no growth from his rookie year. He consistently makes poor decisions on the football field, takes bad angles, and runs himself out of plays. He has the physical ability to dominate, but the mental ability of a high school sophomore.

Now, if you don't think that you can draft well with your second round picks, you should really just pack up shop and go home, because you will never be able to compete without them.

Hell, the Colts didn't seem to have a problem letting go of Cato June, even though he had actually played at a pro bowl level.

Now, if you can tender Derrick Johnson at a first round level (he will be a RFA), then you can give him next year to show that he's actually worth a longer term deal. If he balks, trade his ass.

I'm not a fan of the team investing 12 million guaranteed on a player who can only flash potential, but can never consistently deliver upon it.

Rep.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

DJ has crap players around him from the line to the secondary behind him to the other linebackers beside him. He is not as bad as is being presented here. You can't expect him to be a one man wrecking crew from OLB especially when we have no other solid contributors on defense outside the cornerbacks. Last year with more talent around him he got serious Pro Bowl consideration. On the list of players to be replaced I'd put him pretty low down on the line. IMO he is part of the solution, not part of the problem.

I'm not saying he's a bad linebacker. What I'm saying is that we should do an honest cost/benefit analysis of retaining him.

[EyePod]

Gun is a part of the problem.

And given that Gun is the guy coaching the LBs, there is no excuse for them to be so poor on fundamentals week after week.

I agree. Our LB's are definitely the weakest part of our defense. Short passes and running kill us. They can't really expect our defensive line to be able to handle NFL o-line's with their inexperience, but if our MLB was actually good, he would help us out so much. And I'm not really that disappointed with Demorrio. I think he brings tons of effort and talent, but they don't use him correctly. We should be blitzing either him or DJ on almost every play! Those two are speedy LB's and not used enough...

[Brock]

I agree they shouldn't overpay. See what he can get on the market, I guess. It seems like you'd get compensation anyway, since he's going to be a RFA. Right?

['Hamas' Jenkins]

I agree they shouldn't overpay. See what he can get on the market, I guess. It seems like you'd get compensation anyway, since he's going to be a RFA. Right?

Provided that you tender him, yes.

[RustShack]

I wouldn't trade him, hes still young enough to be a part of the youth movement. I think we need a new DC and LB coach though(along with every other coach, but I'm talking DJ's sake right now). DJ is just a prime example of Texas players having great potential they were just poorly coached and are behind the curve.

[OnTheWarpath15]

I wouldn't trade him, hes still young enough to be a part of the youth movement. I think we need a new DC and LB coach though(along with every other coach, but I'm talking DJ's sake right now). DJ is just a prime example of Texas players having great potential they were just poorly coached and are behind the curve.

I believe in everything you posted that is in bold.

But I'm not willing to spend ridiculous money to find out whether your last statement is correct or not.

IMO, he's not worth the money he's likely going to be asking for. ($12-$15M guaranteed)

I think Hamas lays out a good plan of action to take.

[chiefsngop]

We have to try and be good again at some point in the next 3 years...

We already need 2 linebackers. We trade DJ and we'll need 3.

Put 2 solid linebackers alongside DJ and he'll be better. He'll also be better under a new head coach and d-coord.

Even if he stays at his current level, if we get 2 solid LB's in the mix then the 3 as a unit will be OK. IMO.

[Mecca]

We have to try and be good again at some point in the next 3 years...

We already need 2 linebackers. We trade DJ and we'll need 3.

Put 2 solid linebackers alongside DJ and he'll be better. He'll also be better under a new head coach and d-coord.

Even if he stays at his current level, if we get 2 solid LB's in the mix then the 3 as a unit will be OK. IMO.

You are aware LB is most cases is thought of like an RB, where most teams walk away from them don't pay them and think they are easy to replace yes?

[WilliamTheIrish]

Well it doesn't help when he drops an INT that literally hits him in the numbers.

Ugh.

[FAX]

You make a very strong case, Mr. 'Hamas' Jenkins. As usual.

Still, I think the priority here should be to discover and address the reasons behind the franchise's struggle to develop our young players. If we could be successful in that effort, DJ will come along just fine (his physical gifts didn't just magically evaporate) and the most troubling, aggravating, and inhibiting problem in the organization would be solved. Constantly trading, cutting, or releasing our draft picks who don't live up to their initial potential is not the answer. Developing them into solid contributors is.

We've been an organization that's always trying to treat symptoms - not the underlying cause of the problems. Eventually (and if we're ever going to be a truly and consistently competitive franchise), that has to end.

FAX

[Micjones]

This is crazy talk.
Johnson is our best LB, there isn't much in the cupboard, and we have a bunch of other positions that need to be upgraded. Adding OLB to that list makes no sense to me.

No, he hasn't exactly lived up to the expectations that being the 15th overall pick heaped upon his shoulders, but he's a legitimate starter in this league.

[OnTheWarpath15]

This is crazy talk.
Johnson is our best LB, there isn't much in the cupboard, and we have a bunch of other positions that need to be upgraded. Adding OLB to that list makes no sense to me.

No, he hasn't exactly lived up to the expectations of being the 15th overall pick heaped upon his shoulders, but he's a legitimate starter in this league.

What if he wants $15M in guaranteed money and $7M per season?

[philfree]

What if he wants $15M in guaranteed money and $7M per season?

We have loads of cap room so I don't know that money should be an issue. Trading DJ just creates another position to fill so IMO it's time to stand pat with a player. We need to keep DJ and find him some help at the other LB positions.

PhilFree:arrow:

[OnTheWarpath15]

We have loads of cap room so I don't know that money should be an issue. Trading DJ just creates another position to fill so IMO it's time to stand pat with a player. We need to keep DJ and find him some help at the other LB positions.

PhilFree:arrow:

Having a ton of cap room doesn't justify blatantly overpaying a player for the next 5 years.

Eventually, that contract will come back to haunt you.

[SAUTO]

Having a ton of cap room doesn't justify blatantly overpaying a player for the next 5 years.

Eventually, that contract will come back to haunt you.

not if it ends up uncapped

[FAX]

We have loads of cap room so I don't know that money should be an issue. Trading DJ just creates another position to fill so IMO it's time to stand pat with a player. We need to keep DJ and find him some help at the other LB positions.

PhilFree:arrow:

Correctolistic, Mr. philfree.

Constantly turning over players (especially good ones) isn't the response to our prayers we're looking for ... nope ... they will only be answered when we turn over a concrete mixer on Herm's head.

FAX

[The Franchise]

What if he wants $15M in guaranteed money and $7M per season?

Tender him.....and see if anyone wants to give up a pick for him.

[chiefs1111]

What if he wants $15M in guaranteed money and $7M per season?

If he wants anything close to that then he needs to be gone,he's not worth even close to that much.

[FAX]

You know, just thinking about this a little more ... my biggest worry is that DJ will actually not wish to play for the Chiefs any more. That's the most likely (and most sickening) negotiating point to arise. I wish I hadn't thought of that.

FAX

[milkman]

We have loads of cap room so I don't know that money should be an issue. Trading DJ just creates another position to fill so IMO it's time to stand pat with a player. We need to keep DJ and find him some help at the other LB positions.

PhilFree:arrow:

I'd like to keep DJ on board and find out if a real coaching staff can help him finally realize his potential, but not at that kind of cost.

It simply isn't worth it.

[Rain Man]

Don't make me get out my trade history thread, Hamas.

[FAX]

Do it, Mr. Rain Man! Do it!

FAX

['Hamas' Jenkins]

You make a very strong case, Mr. 'Hamas' Jenkins. As usual.

Still, I think the priority here should be to discover and address the reasons behind the franchise's struggle to develop our young players. If we could be successful in that effort, DJ will come along just fine (his physical gifts didn't just magically evaporate) and the most troubling, aggravating, and inhibiting problem in the organization would be solved. Constantly trading, cutting, or releasing our draft picks who don't live up to their initial potential is not the answer. Developing them into solid contributors is.

We've been an organization that's always trying to treat symptoms - not the underlying cause of the problems. Eventually (and if we're ever going to be a truly and consistently competitive franchise), that has to end.

FAX

Thanks for the response, FAX. The only thing I would offer, in counter, is that your assessment is correct, but in the case of DJ, perhaps he could be viewed as a cancer patient infested by this current group of nincompoops, and is too far gone to be worth saving.

Thus, we must tear his heart out and rend it upon the altar of Lombardichuetal, Aztec God of Super Bowls

:shrug:

[OnTheWarpath15]

not if it ends up uncapped

You realize this is KC, and not Dallas, New York or Washington, right?

[irishjayhawk]

I think his point is that Johnson hasn't really developed.

Personally, I see that as coaching. Look at the linebackers that have gotten out of KC.

[PastorMikH]

What if he wants $15M in guaranteed money and $7M per season?


First off, why are we signing first round picks to 4 year contracts in the first place?

Second of all, with all the cap space we have, why didn't we try to negotiate some extensions and put the extensions on this year's cap?

As for DJ wanting 15M/7M, if that's the case, we transition tag him and see what kind of offer he gets, then decide to match or not.

And IF DJ leaves, any ideas what an average LB will cost us? We paid $7.5M signing bonus on a 6 year $24M contract last year for Harris. Kawika signed a $17.5M this year with the Bills. Even average LBs aren't cheap.

[FAX]

Personally, I see that as coaching. Look at the linebackers that have gotten out of KC.

I can't recall the exact numbers, Mr. irishjayhawk, but I'm pretty sure we've signed well over 20 linebackers in the last 4 years or so. Those are guys who have played. Not just practice guys.

We go through linebackers like Mr. Phobia goes through toilet paper.

FAX

[PastorMikH]

We go through linebackers like Mr. Phobia goes through toilet paper.

FAX


Phobia uses toilet paper? I thought those American Standards were supposed to do it all?

[irishjayhawk]

I can't recall the exact numbers, Mr. irishjayhawk, but I'm pretty sure we've signed well over 20 linebackers in the last 4 years or so. Those are guys who have played. Not just practice guys.

We go through linebackers like Mr. Phobia goes through toilet paper.

FAX

Yes, but Donnie Edwards and Mitchell seem to indicate that under good coaching and scheme, they are valuable players.

They've found those things outside of the Chiefs.

[FAX]

Yes, but Donnie Edwards and Mitchell seem to indicate that under good coaching and scheme, they are valuable players.

They've found those things outside of the Chiefs.

Exactly so. Peeps seem inclined to blame the player alone for sucking (which is often, of course, a valid and appropriate criticism) but, in our case, we've busted so many young players at so many positions, it's clear (at least to me) that the Chiefs have an intrinsic and long-term problem at player development.

As has been mentioned, if you don't come to the Chiefs with vastly superior talent (like a Gonzo or a DT) or you aren't a skilled vet (like a Green or a Roaf or a Priest), you aren't likely to improve during your time with this team.

EDIT: Thinking about it, this problem dates back to the post-Marty years. It's been a very long time since we've developed a drafted player into something special. The exceptions (LJ and Waters) are rare.

FAX

[chiefsngop]

You are aware LB is most cases is thought of like an RB, where most teams walk away from them don't pay them and think they are easy to replace yes?

Kind of an invalid point here. This team does nothing like "most teams".

Most teams would not manage, allocate, or coach a team the way Herm & Carl have this one.

When it comes to the Chiefs it really doesn't matter what "most teams" do or don't do. We do things the Carl & Herm way and NO other organization is mimicking the way we do business, nor are Carl & Herm mimicking any other successful organization.

[Mr. Laz]

depending on contract.......

He's young and one of our best players.(even if that's not saying much) He's not getting arrested or anything like that and we have plenty of salary cap room.

no, i don't want to trade him ....

[13and3]

Why are people always talking about trades? Dont we have enough young players we dont know about? Why take a chance on a unknown for no reason at all? I guess some of us always want to be wheelers and dealers

[Mecca]

Why are people always talking about trades? Dont we have enough young players we dont know about? Why take a chance on a unknown for no reason at all? I guess some of us always want to be wheelers and dealers

Because honestly our team is built improperly we have highly paid players at positions you should really be saving money on.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Bump.

[RustShack]

Probably not still.

[wazu]

Hell no. I hold out hope that one day we will bring in a real coach who knows how to get production out of talented players like DJ, and at that point things will suddenly turn for the better.

[Hootie]

Johnson is a good player who can't stay healthy and is inconsistent...he won't ever be the star but he has never really had the benefit of anyone around him so who knows...if we can keep him for a reasonable contract (60% of what Briggs got), might as well resign him...I'm all for youth but we can't continue to have 40% of our roster being 1st and 2nd year players...

[pr_capone]

It truly amazes me that there are people who still think Cunther is a legitimate NFL Coach.

He's just a loudmouth dumbass who doesn't have a fucking clue, that rode Marty's coat tail to a reputation as some kind of defensive guru.

Tell us how he's improved the LBing.

I think he had it back in the day. He was good.

But the game has passed him.

He really doesn't have a clue.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Bump.

[WilliamTheIrish]

Outstanding bump. And yes, it's past time for DJ to have delivered. Not sure what his value would be now though.

[RippedmyFlesh]

He has been a disappointment, but has a lot of physical tools and is still young. With that being said, why not just use the threat of tagging him to do so and work out a trade with another team, hopefully netting us another pick in the 45 range.

What do you think?

A 2nd rounder for DJ would be an absolute steal. I am thinking a 4th maybe a 3rd if it's someone stupid like the raiders.

[DBOSHO]

if we get rid of him itll be kawika mitchell all over again

[Mr. Krab]

if we get rid of him itll be kawika mitchell all over again
Probably but it's our curse.

DJ barely was able to shine against 3rd stringers in the last preseason game.

[RippedmyFlesh]

if we get rid of him itll be kawika mitchell all over again
I agree I can see him being functional someplace else like mithchell.But like mitchell I don't think he'll be all pro.

[DBOSHO]

we are like the opposite of the patriots

[Micjones]

I'd ask for a 3rd Round pick but settle for a 4th.
They obviously aren't very high on Johnson here.
Get something for him.