Whitlock: Gailey, system deserve more credit than Thigpen Thigpen

[Tribal Warfare]

Gailey, system deserve more credit than Thigpen (http://www.kansascity.com/sports/story/898309.html)


The safe bet is to fall in love with the offense, not the quarterback. Credit Chan Gailey more than you do Tyler Thigpen for Kansas City’s improved offensive production.

Look, I readily admit there’s a 1.5 percent chance that I’m wrong about Tyler Thigpen, and he is, as many of you Chiefs fans believe, the second coming of Rich Gannon. In fact, I hope you’re right and I’m wrong.

Tyler Thigpen as franchise quarterback would be a great story to chronicle. So were Derek Anderson in Cleveland, and Jon Kitna in Cincinnati a few years back, and Scott Mitchell in Miami and Detroit more than a decade ago.

For every Rich Gannon and Kurt Warner and Tony Romo unearthed from some obscure quarterback village, there is just as much fool’s gold hiding in the hills.

Some of you are offended that I regard Thigpen as Kansas City’s backup quarterback of the future. You think my evaluation is an insult. It’s not. It’s high praise for a second-year, late-round draft pick from Coastal Carolina who played running back in high school.

I’m acknowledging that Thigpen belongs in the NFL, something most scouts did not foresee two years ago and most Chiefs fans couldn’t fathom in training camp.

I’m not down on Thigpen. I’m high on offensive coordinator Chan Gailey’s midseason adjustment and future of the spread offense in the NFL. Gailey and the college-style attack have turned Thigpen into a viable player.

Given the widespread use of the strategy at the collegiate level, I envision more NFL coordinators incorporating the spread into their game plans. If you haven’t noticed, the allegedly broken-down, no-playoffs Division I game is heavily influencing the pro league. It seems like every week a new NFL team is implementing the “Wildcat” system that made Darren McFadden and Felix Jones superstars at Arkansas.

For years the shotgun spread turned Mike Leach’s Texas Tech quarterbacks into NCAA passing record-setters. Now, with the addition of Michael Crabtree and a powerful offensive line, the offense has the Red Raiders in the thick of the national-title race.

The spread is different from the old run-and-shoot offense. It totally abandoned the running game, did not use a tight end, asked receivers and quarterbacks to adjust on the fly and, for the most part, had the quarterback under center.

The run-and-shoot had a short NFL shelf life. Teams that ran it had a difficult time preparing for an opponent with a traditional offense and closing out games by milking the clock with the run.

The one relevant/significant knock on the spread is its ineffectiveness in goal-line and short-yardage situations. But I blame that on college coaches who don’t carry fullbacks and discard the shotgun spread when they absolutely must run the football.

OK, back to Thigpen. His passing numbers spiked considerably when Gailey employed the spread a month ago against the New York Jets. Before the spread (BTS), Thigpen completed 38 of 90 passes (42 percent) in four appearances running a traditional offense. Running the spread, Thigpen has connected on 85 of 140 passes (60 percent).

The system is the principal reason for the dramatic improvement. The spread, with its multiple wideouts and QB 6 yards off the line of scrimmage, makes defenses easier to read. The throws are generally a bit shorter, especially the drags across the middle, the receiver screens.

Texas runs a watered-down, NFL version of the spread. In that offense, Vince Young completed 65 percent of his passes for 3,036 yards, 26 TDs and 10 interceptions during the Longhorns’ national-title run. Young is not an accurate passer or much of a field general.

The true spread turned Chase Daniel into a Heisman Trophy candidate and Todd Reesing into an Orange Bowl champion.

Don’t be fooled by the system. It has a future in the NFL, but it will need to be operated by a legit, hang-in-the-pocket, big-time talent to produce victories on a consistent basis.

Thigpen has yet to demonstrate he’s that guy. Maybe he will over time. Maybe his accuracy, touch and ability to deliver the ball on the move and from the “phone booth” will all improve between now and next season.

There’s just no reason to plan on it.

Finding a franchise quarterback remains the organization’s highest priority. I disagree with my respected peers who claim a pass rusher is the team’s greatest need.

We’ve had Derrick Thomas, Neil Smith and Jared Allen. I miss watching those guys. But, if my memory is correct, Lenny Dawson won Kansas City its lone Super Bowl.

[TrickyNicky]

Obligatory "Usually Shitlock is shitty, but this one smells just right" comment.

[bowener]

Thigpen has yet to demonstrate he’s that guy. Maybe he will over time. Maybe his accuracy, touch and ability to deliver the ball on the move and from the “phone booth” will all improve between now and next season.Was whitlock on this board looking at the phone booth picture? Is he mocking CP or repping it?

[Mecca]

Whoa me and Whitlock pretty much agree spot on, on this.

[HemiEd]

Whoa me and Whitlock pretty much agree spot on, on this.

Two days in a row.

[BigRock]

Thigpen Thigpen? Like Kelly Kelly?

[chiefs1111]

Thigpen Thigpen? Like Kelly Kelly?

ROFL

[dj56dt58]

Gaily is good..great system..he's not the one on the field with the confident/borderline cocky attitude making sure everyone is lined up in the right spot, reading the defense, throwing the ball at the right time, to the right reciever, to the perfect spot...

Brady must be overrated too..it's the system

[SPchief]

Whitlock will eventually admit that he steals his ideas from here

[BigMeatballDave]

I'd say its a little of both. Huard certainly would not be this successful in this O.

[mikey23545]

I don't know how Fatass figures he's only got a 1.5% chance of being wrong about Thigpen when he's 80% wrong about everything in general....

[C-Mac]

But, if my memory is correct, Lenny Dawson won Kansas City its lone Super Bowl.

Len Dawson missed many games that year. His team had one of the greatest defenses ever assembled to help him win the Superbowl. He would not had won it without them...period.

[Deberg_1990]

Whoa me and Whitlock pretty much agree spot on, on this.


Id almost be willing to bet he lurks over here quite a bit.

[ChiefGator]

Len Dawson missed many games that year. His team had one of the greatest defenses ever assembled to help him win the Superbowl. He would not had won it without them...period.

This...

And also, did we draft Len Dawson really high, and groom him as QB? I guess I missed that part.

Laurence Taylor and Ray Lewis never won superbowls either I guess. Or the Chicago defense?

[Deberg_1990]

This...

Laurence Taylor and Ray Lewis never won superbowls either I guess. Or the Chicago defense?


Those were the exception, not the rule. Those teams had once in a generation all world defenses.

The misconception was they also had bad offenses. Not true. They didnt have great offenses, but they moved the ball with effeciency when they had to.

[the Talking Can]

props to big fat ass for getting it right


and I made the mitchell comparison first...

[Hootie]

Whoa me and Whitlock pretty much agree spot on, on this.

I thought the spread was ruining football...is the Chiefs offense opening your eyes?

[Hootie]

Id almost be willing to bet he lurks over here quite a bit.

he does...so what? He's EASILY the best media person Kansas City has...

[Hootie]

I don't care what anyone thinks...I'm willing to give T Thig a shot...he deserves it for saving this disaster of a season from unwatchable to at least somewhat entertaining

[TommyHawk69]

I posted this in another thread but more appropriate here. What if we are running the spread cause they are thinkin about taking one of the spread quarterbacks in the draft?

[Skip Towne]

I posted this in another thread but more appropriate here. What if we are running the spread cause they are thinkin about taking one of the spread quarterbacks in the draft?

I dunno. Reesing is just a Jr. this year.

[58-4ever]

I dunno. Reesing is just a Jr. this year.

HA!

[KCJohnny]

Gaily is good..great system..he's not the one on the field with the confident/borderline cocky attitude making sure everyone is lined up in the right spot, reading the defense, throwing the ball at the right time, to the right reciever, to the perfect spot...

Brady must be overrated too..it's the system

:clap: :thumb:

[milkman]

I posted this in another thread but more appropriate here. What if we are running the spread cause they are thinkin about taking one of the spread quarterbacks in the draft?

They are running the spread because Bones struggles runnning the offense out of the pro set.

[KCJohnny]

Len Dawson missed many games that year. His team had one of the greatest defenses ever assembled to help him win the Superbowl. He would not had won it without them...period.

The 1969-70 Chiefs allowed just 177 total points in an 11-3 season. Those are 2000 Ravens-like numbers. That said, its doubtful Mike Livingston would have beaten the Vikes. Lenny is and probably always will be the face of the Championship caliber Chiefs.

[TrickyNicky]

We're also running the spread because McIntosh can't block and every other play is a jail-break on his side. I rewatched the first three drives just watching him and he is getting beat regularly.

[milkman]

The 1969-70 Chiefs allowed just 177 total points in an 11-3 season. Those are 2000 Ravens-like numbers. That said, its doubtful Mike Livingston would have beaten the Vikes. Lenny is and probably always will be the face of the Championship caliber Chiefs.

The Chiefs D held the Vikings to 7 points, and Dawson didn't really have a great game or do anything all that special.

Dawson is the face of that team, but that was a team defined by it's defense.

[KCJohnny]

The Chiefs D held the Vikings to 7 points, and Dawson didn't really have a great game or do anything all that special.

Dawson is the face of that team, but that was a team defined by it's defense.

Stram's "offense of the 70s" (or did you forget?) was the most innovative of its day. The traps, end-arounds, roll outs, WR screens were all pretty edgy for 1969. I will not disagree that the '69 Chiefs D is among the greatest of all time in the NFL, but the Chiefs' 23 points against a very intimidating Vikes team that featured several HoFers (Eller, Marshall, Page, Krause, etc...) was not a gimmee.

[SAUTO]

:popcorn:

[ChiefGator]

Those were the exception, not the rule. Those teams had once in a generation all world defenses.

The misconception was they also had bad offenses. Not true. They didnt have great offenses, but they moved the ball with effeciency when they had to.

I'll give you semi-efficient offenses, but the misconception I was countering was not that. It was Whitlock's sudden claim that the QB was soley responsible for the Chiefs Super Bowl win. That's total crap, and is crap in every single super bowl win. I was just trying to site the most obvious examples. You could just as easily say the O-Line wins the super bowl.

It's a T-E-A-M game. Trent couldn't get us into the Super Bowl when he was clicking on all cylinders. I don't blame him for the loss to the Colts in the Playoffs. You need an entire team.

[Chiefnj2]

They are running the spread because THE ENTIRE TEAM struggles runnning the offense out of the pro set.

FYP.

[Sully]

I'm softening on my position a little, but I still don't think the spread is a legit NFL offense. I like the hybrid the Chiefs are running, and I hope they continue to use it while it works. But I'd also argue that it's success, so far, is dependent upon the weekly new wrinkles Gailey has added...and he can only do that for so long.
I don't know, maybe I'm completely wrong on this. I just don't see it lasting with any kind of real success.

[Kerberos]

he does...so what? He's EASILY the best media person Kansas City has...


:hmmm: I would take 1 JoPo over 3 Whitlocks. Which is really one for one if you think about it.

[milkman]

Stram's "offense of the 70s" (or did you forget?) was the most innovative of its day. The traps, end-arounds, roll outs, WR screens were all pretty edgy for 1969. I will not disagree that the '69 Chiefs D is among the greatest of all time in the NFL, but the Chiefs' 23 points against a very intimidating Vikes team that featured several HoFers (Eller, Marshall, Page, Krause, etc...) was not a gimmee.

I know Johnny.

Hank was far more innovative nad creative than he ever gets credit for.

But the fact is, that offense only scored 13 against the Jets, and 17 against the Raiders on the way to that SB.

The defense only allowed a total of 24 points in the playoffs and SB to the defending SB champions, the AFL Western Conference champions, and the NFL champions.

The offense did it's job well enough.

The defense did it's job as well as it's ever been done.

[milkman]

I'm softening on my position a little, but I still don't think the spread is a legit NFL offense. I like the hybrid the Chiefs are running, and I hope they continue to use it while it works. But I'd also argue that it's success, so far, is dependent upon the weekly new wrinkles Gailey has added...and he can only do that for so long.
I don't know, maybe I'm completely wrong on this. I just don't see it lasting with any kind of real success.

I think the spread can be a part of, even the biggest part of, an offensive package.

But in order for this offense to move forward, Thigpen, or whoever the QB will be, needs to be able to operate effectively taking snaps under center, especially inside the 10 yard line.

[KCJohnny]

I know Johnny.

Hank was far more innovative nad creative than he ever gets credit for.

But the fact is, that offense only scored 13 against the Jets, and 17 against the Raiders on the way to that SB.

The defense only allowed a total of 24 points in the playoffs and SB to the defending SB champions, the AFL Western Conference champions, and the NFL champions.

The offense did it's job well enough.

The defense did it's job as well as it's ever been done.

True. And Hank's space age ground attack which featured RBbC was a big part of both victories.

[Hammock Parties]

Wow, Whitlock and I see eye to eye. Incredible.

[bkkcoh]

Give us a team that can win in the playoffs and most people don't give a crap what kind of offense we run. Win a super bowl in this town and you can anything you want to in town.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Great.....now Fatlock is acting like a little girl. Here it comes; "Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"The Chiefs Suck for not picking my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"The Chiefs Suck for not picking my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"The Chiefs Suck for not picking my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"The Chiefs Suck for not picking my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"The Chiefs Suck for not picking my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"The Chiefs Suck for not picking my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"The Chiefs Suck for not picking my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"The Chiefs Suck for not picking my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".
"The Chiefs Suck for not picking my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".



Somebody get that fat motherfucker a Wimpy Burger to plug his useless pie hole with.

[StcChief]

Whitlock will eventually admit that he steals his ideas from here pass the :bong: over. Steal ideas. no one does that.

Why would he with internet plagiarism is too easy....

[Kerberos]

Great.....now Fatlock is acting like a little girl. Here it comes; "Kansas City should pick my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".

"The Chiefs Suck for not picking my latest, favorite douchebag from Ball State".




Somebody get that fat motherfucker a Wimpy Burger to plug his useless pie hole with.

You forgot the "Chiefs need a verteran to help develop Nate Davis from Ball State and I have Jeff Georges phone # handy".

I agree with stuffing his pie hole to shut him up.

[Reerun_KC]

pass the :bong: over. Steal ideas. no one does that.

Why would he with internet plagiarism is too easy....

Ask Claythan?

[Mr. Laz]

meh .... Whitlock and the rest of you buttheads are just playing the odds not really evaluating anything.


the chances are that "quarterback X" will fail because most do

:shake:

brilliant!!!


fuggin cowards

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

You forgot the "Chiefs need a verteran to help develop Nate Davis from Ball State and I have Jeff Georges phone # handy".

I agree with stuffing his pie hole to shut him up.

ROFLROFLROFL:thumb: WORD!

[Micjones]

I still say if this were Brodie Croyle there wouldn't be as many skeptics.

I'm fine with waiting 6 more games before the Chiefs make a decision about Thigpen, but I'm not going to gloss over what he's done in the meantime. He's played some damn good football.

[KCCHIEFS27]

You can totally see this spread catching like wild fire..just look at the Chiefs, we play the spread offense AND the spread defense..

[Cormac]

Thigpen has done great - spread offense or not. But he is simply not an accurate thrower of the ball (yet?). That's what keeps my feet on the ground.

I don't care what scheme/formation he's passing the ball from, if he's going to get happy feet and throw awful passes in the redzone (see failed 2pt conversion attempt to win the game the other week), I'm not going to get excited about him. That is not to say he can't improve, just that he's got a long way to go.

If - and it's a big IF - there is an excellent QB prospect available at our draft slot, that WARRANTS that pick, next year, we should take him. I'd love to have the problem SD had a couple of years ago (Rivers and Brees) or Cleveland this year (Anderson and Quinn). Pick a good QB if available. Don't be afraid of success.

[dtebbe]

All I know is that Thigpen can move, and he basically flicked the ball 50 yards last week. I don't care how good the system is, the QB still has to execute it.

DT

[Mr. Laz]

if he's going to get happy feet and throw awful passes in the redzone
virtually every QB get inaccurate when they get happy feet

look at our offense ..... Manning would look like crap if he had our Oline/WR/Coaching earlier this year.

[crazycoffey]

Whoa me and Whitlock pretty much agree spot on, on this.


I don't read J twit saying he thinks the spread can never work in the nfl,
but other than that I guess....

[orange]

The defense only allowed a total of 24 points in the playoffs and SB to the defending SB champions, the AFL Western Conference champions, and the NFL champions.

...

The defense did it's job as well as it's ever been done.

*cough* Chicago Bears *cough*

21-0
24-0
46-10

*cough*

[Gonzo]

Thigpen Thigpen? Like Kelly Kelly?

"I'm gonna go get the papers, get the papers."

[orange]

You can totally see this spread catching like wild fire..just look at the Chiefs, we play the spread offense AND the spread defense..

Slight correction. The Chiefs play the "turn around and spread'em" defense.

[Reerun_KC]

*cough* Chicago Bears *cough*

21-0
24-0
46-10

*cough*

Looks like you could use some of these?

http://blogs.riverfronttimes.com/gutcheck/halls.jpg

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

virtually every QB get inaccurate when they get happy feet

look at our offense ..... Manning would look like crap if he had our Oline/WR/Coaching earlier this year.

I thought Manning WAS the definition of "Happy Feet"; standing there in the backfield and doing the "cat getting comfy before settling-in"-move with his feet/paws, yes?

[KCJohnny]

You can totally see this spread catching like wild fire..just look at the Chiefs, we play the spread offense AND the spread defense..

ROFL

[petegz28]

All I know is that Thigpen can move, and he basically flicked the ball 50 yards last week. I don't care how good the system is, the QB still has to execute it.

DT

QFT