Frustration and temptation (Mike Alden interview)

[KcMizzou]

I posted this in another thread, but thought it probably deserved it's own. It's long, but it's an interesting and revealing read.

I like Alden a lot. Damned glad they didn't get rid of him years ago. (I understand that they were very close.)



Frustration and temptation

By Joe Walljasper

Sunday, December 20, 2009

For as long as the Big Ten Conference has hinted about expanding, Missouri has been mentioned as a candidate to switch allegiances from the Big 12. But that back-burner issue has heated up recently, with the Big Ten publicly stating it will consider expanding and MU’s frustration with the Big 12 at an all-time high.



For three straight years, the Tigers have been sent to a bowl game lower on the conference pecking order than their record warranted, and the Missouri soccer team didn’t get an NCAA Tournament bid despite winning the Big 12 regular-season title. Among MU’s other complaints is that the Big 12’s football revenuesharing formula — half the television money is split evenly, and the other half is distributed based on TV appearances — is causing a class divide in the league and led to the conference sitting on its hands while the Big Ten and SEC signed better TV deals.

On Thursday, Tribune sports editor Joe Walljasper spoke at length with Missouri Athletic Director Mike Alden about the possibility of defection to the Big Ten.

Q: What are some of your frustrations with the Big 12 or why isn’t it working the greatest for Missouri?

A: I don’t know if I would approach it saying, “Not working the greatest.” I think the challenges we face as a league — and they do impact Missouri — are our television contract and our ability to have equal revenue distribution. I don’t think there’s any question that if we don’t get to that level at some point, we’re going to continue to find ourselves further and further behind the Big Ten, the SEC and probably the ACC, as well as behind Texas and Oklahoma, in particular, and maybe Nebraska in our league. Our hope would be that the league would continue to push harder in those areas, for a new television contract for more exposure and for equal revenue distribution.

Another thing that probably is frustrating a little bit for Missouri — and that’s not to disparage any other programs, because there are really fine academic institutions in our entire league, they all are — but academically our student-athletes have done a great job and they’ve really performed at a high level. I think that the perception of the league has to continue to grow because if that doesn’t happen, that doesn’t help Missouri. We’re somewhat of an outlier with how our kids are doing academically. The affiliation with a league that is perceived to be really strong academically is really important to our institution.

Q: What is the difference in the football television revenue Missouri made this year vs. Texas?

A: Mizzou has been pretty fortunate the last few years. We’ve been on the higher end. We’ve been in the top four schools in our league for the last four years in television revenue for football. But still the difference in television revenue with us and Texas would be about $3 million. Mizzou may get approximately $9 million in television revenue, all things being equal, and Texas would be about $12 million. Then Baylor would be around $7.5 million.

That gap is there, but more importantly, let’s take a look at Illinois. We’re not only competing against our league, we’re competing against Illinois. The question is, what is the difference between what Illinois is getting in revenue distribution from the league — that’s television, basically — and what Mizzou is getting? Ours is $9 million. Illinois’ is $21 million.

Q: Why doesn’t the Big 12 have a better television deal?

A: Because when we had the opportunity to do that, which we did three years ago, and it was brought to our attention that we could start our own Big 12 Network and a couple of other things — that was actually presented to us in New York City, I believe three years ago — we couldn’t get consensus among 12 institutions to say this is what’s best for the league. When we couldn’t get consensus on that, nobody could make a decision. And then the Big Ten went forward and did their deal, the SEC did their deal with ABC and ESPN and took up a bunch of money there, and the Big 12 Conference was behind both of those leagues on that.

Q: What was the sticking point for the Big 12?

A: It had to do with revenue distribution and fear of the unknown. The unknown being that a network had never been done with college athletics before. We had heard rumors about the Big Ten getting ready to do it. So various voices in the room were concerned that we were going into uncharted waters. We have this pretty good contract with ABC, ESPN and Fox, and why would we want to give up a sure thing for a speculative deal? By us backing away from that, the Big Ten went forward with that. It was fear of the unknown. We had the same presentation at the same time by CSTV. CSTV had talked to us at the same set of meetings about starting our own network based upon the theory of ESPN Classic. When ESPN Classic was started, everybody said, “Who’s going to watch this? Old video of teams that used to play, 24-7? How is this going to be successful?”

The same people that started ESPN Classic came to us as a league and wanted us to use a similar model to start our own network, based upon this pro forma that had been shown. And we couldn’t come to a consensus. It was pretty frustrating. So we stayed the course and continued the same direction we were, and what we found is we found today that the SEC contract is worth $205 million per year, the Big Ten contract is worth $190 million per year — and both of those leagues share equally — and the Big 12 Conference contract is worth $80 million per year and we don’t share equally. That is a significant gap. Not only is that a significant difference in our league, between appearance fees and not sharing it equally, but when we’re recruiting against Illinois, Arkansas, Ole Miss, Mississippi State, Indiana, schools like that, we’re in the hole as far as resources are concerned.

Q: Are there reasons that the Big Ten and SEC would have better contracts based on the cities involved rather than the fact they have their own conference TV networks?

A: There are a couple of things. The households are important for television, how many homes are in that market. In our footprint, we have less homes in the Midwest, upper Midwest, down through Texas, than they do in the SEC or Big Ten Conference. Immediately they’re going to have more homes to be able to sell cable networks or their own network to. So that, in itself, would have an impact, but certainly not to a level of $110 and $125 million per year difference right now. But it would have some percentage difference, maybe 10 percent less or 15 percent less because of the number of homes.

Q: The Big 12’s current TV deal runs through what year?

A: I believe it’s four more years.

Q: Are there opportunities to renegotiate?

A: There’s a current opportunity to possibly renegotiate the current cable package, which is really the Fox package, and that’s the smaller part of that $80 million. You can’t negotiate the big package for three or four years. You’re three or four years from doing anything of any significance.

Q: On the topic of revenue sharing, my understanding is you have to have a super majority of nine votes to change rules in the Big 12. Why haven’t the nine schools other than Nebraska, Oklahoma and Texas gotten together as a block and decided it would be in their best interest to change the formula?

A: I couldn’t answer that. I know where Mizzou is on that, where our chancellor and our leadership is on equal revenue distribution. But I couldn’t answer why the other schools haven’t.

Q: Has it ever come to a vote, or do you know where each other stands and know there’s no point in a vote?

A: I think from the board of directors, and those are the ones that make the decision — Dr. (Brady) Deaton and his counterparts — I don’t believe it’s come to a formal vote. From what I understand, because I’m not in those meetings, is that the sentiment of the room is that there may not be enough votes to push that forward at this time. They want to make sure that’s something that will carry the day when they go forward.

Q: Is there some sort of concern about alienating Texas to the point it would leave the conference?

A: You know what, I don’t know the answer to that question. There are a couple of schools — Texas, Oklahoma, maybe Nebraska — that aren’t in favor of sharing things equally. But whether that means people are worried about alienating Texas, I don’t know.

Q: The Big Ten is officially talking about expanding. What would be the advantages of the Big Ten for Mizzou?

A: Right now, we have a tremendous advantage in the Big 12. I think we do. The teams we compete against and the footprint we’re in is certainly an asset to our institution. I think the focus needs to be on what do we need to do to make Mizzou better and hopefully by Mizzou being better, the Big 12 gets to be better.

I don’t know if there are advantages or disadvantages. The image of the Big Ten, all schools are AAU (Association of American Universities) members, like Mizzou is. There are only 34 publics in the whole country that are part of that. Mizzou is one of those schools, and that means nationally, academically, we’re seen as a really strong program, just like all of the schools in the Big Ten are. That’s a strength the Big Ten would have.

… (Former Big 12 Commissioner) Kevin Weiberg was quoted as saying this a few days ago in USA Today — he was commenting on the Big Ten — he said, “Rest assured, this will not be about athletics.” Everybody in our world thinks this is about athletics, but it’s not. Conference realignments are always based primarily on academics. From Weiberg, a guy that used to be our commissioner and the No. 2 guy in the Big Ten, he’s got a pretty strong knowledge base. It has to do with similarities of institutions, similarities of academic mission, similarities of research, professional schools that they have, contiguous ideals, regionalization, things like that.

I know I haven’t answered your question, but I would tell you that the Big Ten has a certain brand and a certain image. We have a certain brand and a certain image, and I think both of them are outstanding, but they’re just different, that’s all.

Q: Outside of athletics, what sort of connection is there among conference schools?

A: From a regionalization standpoint, we do a lot of stuff with Kansas State, we do a lot of stuff with Iowa State, with Kansas, with Illinois, relative to research — international conferences on agricultural research or biodiesel efforts — so it’s important, particularly academically, that you have an ability to align with other schools, because again, we’re competitive against Kansas every day when we play against them, but if there’s an ability for our institutions to get together to do something great research-wise or academically, we’re going to do that.

Q: You mentioned the difference of $12 million in TV football revenue between Missouri and Illinois. That’s $12 million you wouldn’t have to work the phones to get. Wouldn’t that have to play a role in the decision?

A: It would be for anyone. When the Big Ten takes a look at expanding, they have to look at: You’re splitting it 11 ways now, and you’re going to have to split it 12 ways. What’s the value that people are bringing to the table revenue-wise, household-wise, competitive-wise — all of this athletically — but also academically, what are you doing as far as similarities with our institutions? … If I’m one of their institutions, I want to make sure if I’m getting $21 million now, I continue to get $21 million.

Q: Is the profit of a football championship game in any way enough to offset the difference to splitting the pot with a 12th team?

A: I don’t think so. Our championship game impact for all the Big 12 schools — and we share that equally — is probably about $400,000 per school.

Q: Would you rather work it out with the Big 12 and try to make the Big 12 a better conference for you, or would you rather go to the Big Ten?

A: Are you asking me personally?

Q: Yes.

A: We need to keep making Mizzou stronger and stronger and making the Big 12 stronger and stronger. We need to keep saying — and we are — proud members of the Big 12 Conference. We’re fortunate to be associated. If you’re asking me personally, my preference would be to do everything you can to strengthen the Big 12. That’s what you’ve got to do. But as Dr. Deaton said recently, you’re always going to continue to evaluate what’s best for the university.

Q: In terms of travel expenses or anything else, what would be the disadvantages of Missouri joining the Big Ten?

A: We keep looking at the strengths we have in our league. There are great advantages and disadvantages for us. We’re flying to Colorado, or Colorado has to fly here. We’re flying to Lubbock, or they have to fly here. So geographically, I don’t think that footprint helps or hurts any schools any more. You’re traveling all these distances. Like Penn State has to travel all the way to Champaign — that’s a long trip — or all the way to East Lansing. So I don’t think the geography part of it, I don’t think the challenges or benefits are much different in our league vs. other leagues.

Q: This topic has been coming up forever, and in the past when I asked about it, it was a total nonstarter with you, and now it isn’t. Is that fair to say? Would you consider yourself more interested in looking into it than you were four or five years ago?

A: I don’t know if I would say that. I wouldn’t say that. I would say that as a league, we’ve got to continue to do everything we can to make our league stronger — not one or two or three schools. We’ve got to do what makes our league stronger, and we believe as proud members of the Big 12 that we have been good citizens, we have given of ourselves to make everybody stronger, we have been, hopefully, good members of the league. So I wouldn’t say it’s changed. I would say it’s as strong as it’s always been. But we’ve got to see some movement in those directions, and I’ve been here 12 years, and frankly, I haven’t seen a lot of movement.

Q: Aside from the revenue-sharing issue, do you feel like the Big 12 hasn’t been good about throwing its weight around for its members. For example, you’ve got a soccer team that wins the Big 12 regular-season title, loses only one conference game and doesn’t make the NCAA Tournament. For three straight years you’re getting bowl games that are lower on the list than you deserve. Do you think league officials could be more assertive about supporting their schools?

A: Yes.

Q: And why do you think they aren’t?

A: I wouldn’t want to speculate on that. But my answer to you on that is yes.

Q: Gut feeling, do you think a switch to the Big Ten happens?

A: My gut isn’t telling me one thing or the other. I don’t know.

Q: The chancellor has been quoted as saying that if the Big Ten is interested, Missouri would listen. Is that a different answer than he would have given five years ago?

A: I don’t know. I would guess that the answer would have been the same and would always be the same. We’re all part of the team, and you’re not trying to be individualistic, you’re just trying to say that we look at everything we can be able to do as an institution. I can’t speak for Brady, but I think that answer would be consistent.

http://www.columbiatribune.com/news/2009/dec/20/frustration-and-temptation/

[KcMizzou]

Ok, last bump. (I promise)

Keitzman was all over this today. (I know, I know) Saying that this is a big punch to the jaw from Alden to the people in charge of the Big XII. Said he hopes it'll wake them up, and change some things. And that if Mizzou does get the offer, he assumes they're gone.

[ArrowheadHawk]

Big 12 football TV deal is horrible. There should not be an untelevised Big 12 game.

[KcMizzou]

Big 12 football TV deal is horrible. There should not be an untelevised Big 12 game.Exactly. And that's just part of it.

The Big XII sat on their hands afraid to make a move, while other conferences passed them by. We're fine now... but the long term effects could be huge.

[luv]

I can't see MU and KU not being in the same conference.

[|Zach|]

I can't see MU and KU not being in the same conference.

*shrug* We could play them non conference.

[KcMizzou]

I can't see MU and KU not being in the same conference.I can't either, doesn't seem right... but if Mizzou gets the offer, I can't see how they could turn it down. As things stand, they'd be stupid not to go.

[Spott]

*shrug* We could play them non conference.

I don't see that happening either if Mizzou goes to the Big 10.

[KcMizzou]

I don't see that happening either if Mizzou goes to the Big 10.Why not?

The Arrowhead game is a money maker.

[Extra Point]

Big 12 football TV deal is horrible. There should not be an untelevised Big 12 game.

Let's see the Big 12 Network, then.

[KcMizzou]

Let's see the Big 12 Network, then.We could have had one...

[Spott]

Why not?

The Arrowhead game is a money maker.

I don't see KU playing a BCS school out of conference if they don't have to, especially if it's not at home. On the other hand, I don't think MU will be jumping through hoops to play KU in basketball if they went to the Big 10.

[luv]

Why not?

The Arrowhead game is a money maker.

You think that would continue for a non-conference game?

[ArrowheadMagic]

http://www.theboxset.com/images/reviewcaptures/612capture_tombstone03.jpg

[KcMizzou]

You think that would continue for a non-conference game? We do play Illinois in St. Louis every season.

Read the interview... IF it's offered, Mizzou would be stupid to pass on the chance.

[KcMizzou]

http://www.theboxset.com/images/reviewcaptures/612capture_tombstone03.jpgThe way the Big XII is being run right now... your team is being fucked too.

[luv]

We do play Illinois in St. Louis every season.

Read the interview... IF it's offered, Mizzou would be stupid to pass on the chance.

Forgot about that.

And I'm definitely not disagreeing that it would be stupid to pass up.

[ArrowheadMagic]

The way the Big XII is being run right now... your team is being ****ed too.

LOL... I'm an OU fan... I see nothing wrong. Except UT keeps winning.

[KcMizzou]

LOL... I'm an OU fan... I see nothing wrong. Except UT keeps winning.Oh... in that case... not so much.

But you're still not making the TV revenue say... Illinois is.

[|Zach|]

I don't see that happening either if Mizzou goes to the Big 10.

To much money to be made. Fans would shit bricks if those two teams don't play.

We are not dropping a Kansas \ Mizzou rivalry.

[luv]

I was talking to my dad over the weekend about what would happen to the Big XII if Mizzou left. We started talking about who they would invite to join? TCU? Or would that be too may Texas schools? Maybe Arkansas?

[Frazod]

LOL... I'm an OU fan... I see nothing wrong. Except UT keeps winning.

Well, we won't have to worry about running into Texas or Oklahoma in the Big 10. I'm pretty sure they require their athletes to read and have two human parents.

[ArrowheadMagic]

The way the Big XII is being run right now... your team is being ****ed too.


Grass isnt greener on the other side. Does money run college FB, of course, but if think you'll out fan or viewer OSU or Michigan, think again. It will come down to money in that conference again. Then where are you? IT'S not the conference your in. It's the fact your fan base doesnt travel, that wont change if you switch conferences. Purdue or Northwestern will travel better than MU. Mich St also. Until your fan base starts traveling to bowl games, you will get passed over regardless conferences. Unless you go undefeated in the Big 10 and thats not happening.

[KcMizzou]

I was talking to my dad over the weekend about what would happen to the Big XII if Mizzou left. We started talking about who they would invite to join? TCU? Or would that be too may Texas schools? Maybe Arkansas?I assume it'd be TCU... the more Texas, the better. /sarcasm

[ArrowheadMagic]

Well, we won't have to worry about running into Texas or Oklahoma in the Big 10. I'm pretty sure they require their athletes to read and have two human parents.


You cant beat them in football and you will never travel as well as them. Both are facts. Both equal money and MU football doesnt generate as much. OSU well beat you yearly and then travel better, Mich will travel better.

[ArrowheadMagic]

I assume it'd be TCU... the more Texas, the better. /sarcasm


TCU. Texas is the largest state in the conference.. More viewers and money.. Its better to stop acting like the big 10 wouldnt rather have Notre Dame or Rutgers over MU.

[verbaljitsu]

If Mizzou moves to the Big Ten (and I certainly hope it gets the opportunity), I am certain that Missouri and Kansas will continue to play every year (at least in football and basketball).

But even if they do not, it would be worth moving. It would be sad, but playing kansas is not worth 12 million dollars a year. That is how much money Missouri would be leaving on the table, just to stay in the crappy Big XII and play kansas. 12 million dollars. And that is just in tv revenue. That doesn't even count the academic money from the CIC cooperative that all Big Ten schools are part of, or the increased merchandising from better television exposure. Frankly, it doesn't count a lot. I love watching the MU-kU rivalry, but I would trade it for 12 million 100 times out of 100.

[Spott]

To much money to be made. Fans would shit bricks if those two teams don't play.

We are not dropping a Kansas \ Mizzou rivalry.

MU would be the team looking to replace a BCS game in a neutral site every year, not Kansas. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the 2 teams didn't play anymore and MU started playing some other team like Arkansas every year.

[Frazod]

You cant beat them in football and you will never travel as well as them. Both are facts. Both equal money and MU football doesnt generate as much. OSU well beat you yearly and then travel better, Mich will travel better.

Who knows what we'll accomplish if we get an equal slice of the pie? You certainly don't. Michigan is horrible right now and Ohio State regularly shits itself against good competition. And as for traveling, going to bowls we've actually earned instead the shit we get stuck with because the Big Texas Conference won't back us will help in that regard.

[ArrowheadMagic]

If Mizzou moves to the Big Ten (and I certainly hope it gets the opportunity), I am certain that Missouri and Kansas will continue to play every year (at least in football and basketball).

But even if they do not, it would be worth moving. It would be sad, but playing kansas is not worth 12 million dollars a year. That is how much money Missouri would be leaving on the table, just to stay in the crappy Big XII and play kansas. 12 million dollars. And that is just in tv revenue. That doesn't even count the academic money from the CIC cooperative that all Big Ten schools are part of, or the increased merchandising from better television exposure. Frankly, it doesn't count a lot. I love watching the MU-kU rivalry, but I would trade it for 12 million 100 times out of 100.


Link to your figure. Once the Big 10 gets wind of your lack of following to a bowl game, why wouldnt you get passed over for a list of schools in the big 10 that do travel? Or is riding on the tail coats of a different 2 teams a goal?

[ArrowheadMagic]

BTW, it would put a serious dent into any recruiting of Texas. Isnt that why this bowl was a win?

[verbaljitsu]

The figure is in the article ArrowheadMagic.

Illinois (and all other Big Ten schools) made 21 million last year from the shared tv revenue. Mizzou made 9. 21-9=12.

The Big Ten wants Missouri because they are generally a good fit for the conference and bring two top 30 media markets. Not to mention, because of the Big Ten Network's deal with several cable companies. The cable companies have to provide the Big Ten network on their basic package in states that have Big Ten teams. Right now that package is generally on a sports tier in Missouri b/c it is "out of market." Making Missouri a Big Ten market would be worth millions of dollars a year, b/c they would make .70-1.20 per cable subscriber in the state, per month.

Mizzou doesn't have a lack of following to bowl games. It is a myth.

This site (which I now write for) has a ton of information on several topics related to Missouri moving to the Big Ten. Read it. www.big10mizzou.com

[Spott]

Link to your figure. Once the Big 10 gets wind of your lack of following to a bowl game, why wouldnt you get passed over for a list of schools in the big 10 that do travel? Or is riding on the tail coats of a different 2 teams a goal?

Maybe the lack of travelling is due to the locations of the bowl games. The Big 12 generally gets sent to the Southwest during bowl season and the Big 10 generally gets a lot of games in Florida as well as the Rose Bowl.

[kcchiefsus]

I don't see that happening either if Mizzou goes to the Big 10.

Why not? It's no different than Missouri and Illinois playing every year recently. It's no different than Florida playing Miami every year.

[verbaljitsu]

BTW, it would put a serious dent into any recruiting of Texas. Isnt that why this bowl was a win?

How much recruiting does 12 million dollars buy?

In general Mizzou's recruits out of Texas are "diamonds that are mined." It picks up an occasional four star or three star, but don't be fooled. Anyone we get out of Texas is basically a scrap left over from the Texas schools. I don't see how that goes away. Texas is a huge state, and its not like those kids families are traveling to all the games. Maybe one a year. Mizzou would actually be on tv more often, and more accessible to watch, instead of languishing in pay-per-view hell.

[Spott]

Why not? It's no different than Missouri and Illinois playing every year recently. It's no different than Florida playing Miami every year.

I think Mizzou would want to play that game, but Kansas doesn't exactly go out of it's way to schedule BCS teams out of conference.

[ArrowheadMagic]

Maybe the lack of travelling is due to the locations of the bowl games. The Big 12 generally gets sent to the Southwest during bowl season and the Big 10 generally gets a lot of games in Florida as well as the Rose Bowl.


Location isnt the problem. Big XII sends more bowl eligible teams. You dont recruit Florida. You recruit Texas.......... Your team no longer plays in the state most of recruits will be able to play in front of their families. You will not out recruit anyone in Fla or So.Cal...... you just took your recruiting base out of the equation.

[|Zach|]

I think Mizzou would want to play that game, but Kansas doesn't exactly go out of it's way to schedule BCS teams out of conference.

I think you underestimate each fanbases need for that game to happen. It is one of the oldest rivalries around. It isn't getting put on hold.

There is literally no way.

[Frazod]

Why not? It's no different than Missouri and Illinois playing every year recently. It's no different than Florida playing Miami every year.

Kansas doesn't exactly go out of its way to play decent competition during its non-conference games, especially on the road. Of course, I understand why - they've only played one good non-conference team on the road in recent memory, and lost.

I would like to think there would be enough pressure from the fanbase to make them play us, but KU's football success isn't based on who they play, but rather who they avoid.

[kcchiefsus]

Location isnt the problem. Big XII sends more bowl eligible teams. You dont recruit Florida. You recruit Texas.......... Your team no longer plays in the state most of recruits will be able to play in front of their families. You will not out recruit anyone in Fla or So.Cal...... you just took your recruiting base out of the equation.

Actually Missouri does recruit Florida.

And Missouri fans not travelling is a myth, just like the supposedly only 9,000 Missouri fans at their bowl last year is misleading. That is based off of tickets sold for the allotted tickets set aside for the team. Tickets bought elsewhere or through another source besides the school are not counted. I guarantee there were more than 9,000 Missouri fans at that game. Of the almost 56,000 fans in attendance, do you really think there were only 9,000 Missouri fans and the other 47,000 were Northwestern fans or neutral? I very seriously doubt that. It's no different than the 2007 MU-KU game at Arrowhead where the game was supposed to be something like a 70-30 split in favor of KU fans due to KU getting a larger allotment since it was their home game. As we all know, black and gold dominated the stands that night.

[Spott]

I think you underestimate each fanbases need for that game to happen. It is one of the oldest rivalries around. It isn't getting put on hold.

There is literally no way.

It's really not that big of a rivalry nationally. It's only been relevant in football a handful of times out of the hundred some times they play every year. The fans would get over it, especially if they started scheduling a MU/Iowa game at Arrowhead to make up for it.

[|Zach|]

It's really not that big of a rivalry nationally. It's only been relevant in football a handful of times out of the hundred some times they play every year. The fans would get over it, especially if they started scheduling a MU/Iowa game at Arrowhead to make up for it.

I didn't say it is a big rivalry nationally.

It IS important to each school. Very important. When Pinkle was hired? He said all the alumni came to him and first wished him luck, and then told him to beat Kansas.

You are way underestimating the importance of this game to fans and the schools in general that are not you. Of course its pretty rare that I read an opinion you have on Mizzou matters I agree with so this isnt much of a surprise.

[KcMizzou]

I didn't say it is a big rivalry nationally.

It IS important to each school. Very important. When Pinkle was hired? He said all the alumni came to him and first wished him luck, and then told him to beat Kansas.

You are way underestimating the importance of this game to fans and the schools in general that are not you. Of course its pretty rare that I read an opinion you have on Mizzou matters I agree with so this isnt much of a surprise.Turner Gill, "beat Missouri".

[ArrowheadMagic]

The figure is in the article ArrowheadMagic.

Illinois (and all other Big Ten schools) made 21 million last year from the shared tv revenue. Mizzou made 9. 21-9=12.

The Big Ten wants Missouri because they are generally a good fit for the conference and bring two top 30 media markets. Not to mention, because of the Big Ten Network's deal with several cable companies. The cable companies have to provide the Big Ten network on their basic package in states that have Big Ten teams. Right now that package is generally on a sports tier in Missouri b/c it is "out of market." Making Missouri a Big Ten market would be worth millions of dollars a year, b/c they would make .70-1.20 per cable subscriber in the state, per month.

Mizzou doesn't have a lack of following to bowl games. It is a myth.

This site (which I now write for) has a ton of information on several topics related to Missouri moving to the Big Ten. Read it. www.big10mizzou.com



The $$$ amount is assumed. Doubt you win over the KC market, since the Big 10 channel is already basic cable.........Surewest at least. STL market is already mostly Big 10. In the end. its a wash. Its not Rutgers nor is it ND. Their 1st two choices. Add on the loss of texas recruiting......


Once the newness wears off, you will get side stepped for the conference teams that travel well. If thats a myth, then your AD needs to be fired because he isnt offering tickets..... but pretty sure your school will return unsold tickets for this bowl game that is much easier to travel to for your midwest fans.

I have Zero dog in this fight, but your FB team will not recruit better than OSU or Mich. You lose Texas..... What you have now is based off Texas recruiting. No kid from Texas is going to MU to play in the Big 10, when he could go to OSU. You will not pull any kids from Ohio...hotbed.... where is your new recruiting hotbed? Help me see how you compete.. Missouri wont put out enough talent to compete, especially when Illinois recruits as well in state.

[ArrowheadMagic]

It's really not that big of a rivalry nationally. It's only been relevant in football a handful of times out of the hundred some times they play every year. The fans would get over it, especially if they started scheduling a MU/Iowa game at Arrowhead to make up for it.


Who would show up? It would be half empty. Why would anyone show up?

[|Zach|]

Who would show up? It would be half empty. Why would anyone show up?

Wait you are saying only 40k. Would go to a Mizzou\Iowa game in Kansas City?

[|Zach|]

There are not many people here who know what the fuck they are talking about.

[ArrowheadMagic]

Actually Missouri does recruit Florida.

And Missouri fans not travelling is a myth, just like the supposedly only 9,000 Missouri fans at their bowl last year is misleading. That is based off of tickets sold for the allotted tickets set aside for the team. Tickets bought elsewhere or through another source besides the school are not counted. I guarantee there were more than 9,000 Missouri fans at that game. Of the almost 56,000 fans in attendance, do you really think there were only 9,000 Missouri fans and the other 47,000 were Northwestern fans or neutral? I very seriously doubt that. It's no different than the 2007 MU-KU game at Arrowhead where the game was supposed to be something like a 70-30 split in favor of KU fans due to KU getting a larger allotment since it was their home game. As we all know, black and gold dominated the stands that night.


It was traveling to KC. Show me stats for traveling to Texas...Florida..... SO.Cal. You dont recruit Florida. You get leftovers that dont build a program.... MU isnt a THAT kind of program. Texas is why your winning now.

[|Zach|]

It was traveling to KC. Show me stats for traveling to Texas...Florida..... SO.Cal. You dont recruit Florida. You get leftovers that dont build a program.... MU isnt a THAT kind of program. Texas is why your winning now.

I agree that we are not the kind of program to hit SoCal or Florida hard.

But saying Texas would be flat out dead is dramatic and wouldn't be true. We are sending big time players to go on and play on Sunday. We have a high powered offense and are an ascending football team. Recruiting is about relationships...Big 10 offers us increased exposure.

Texas wouldn't be "dead"

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Well, we won't have to worry about running into Texas or Oklahoma in the Big 10. I'm pretty sure they require their athletes to read and have two human parents.

LMAO

[verbaljitsu]

The $$$ amount is assumed. Doubt you win over the KC market, since the Big 10 channel is already basic cable.........Surewest at least. STL market is already mostly Big 10. In the end. its a wash. Its not Rutgers nor is it ND. Their 1st two choices. Add on the loss of texas recruiting......


Once the newness wears off, you will get side stepped for the conference teams that travel well. If thats a myth, then your AD needs to be fired because he isnt offering tickets..... but pretty sure your school will return unsold tickets for this bowl game that is much easier to travel to for your midwest fans.

I have Zero dog in this fight, but your FB team will not recruit better than OSU or Mich. You lose Texas..... What you have now is based off Texas recruiting. No kid from Texas is going to MU to play in the Big 10, when he could go to OSU. You will not pull any kids from Ohio...hotbed.... where is your new recruiting hotbed? Help me see how you compete.. Missouri wont put out enough talent to compete, especially when Illinois recruits as well in state.

??? now you are just saying stuff. First, the dollar amount is not assumed, and is almost certainly an understatement. The Big Ten shares money equally. All Big Ten schools made 21 million in tv money last year. Mike Alden himself said that (and you can see other sources on the site I linked). The Big Ten would almost certainly make more money with mizzou. They get millions of new cable subscriber dollars guaranteed by their existing contracts. They also get to renegotiate the deal with ESPN/ABC etc. with two new top 30 media markets. That matters. And on top of it all, they get to play a title game. The SEC pulled down over 14 million from its title game. The Big Ten probably wouldn't make as much, but 7-10 million is doable.

On recruiting: Mizzou is ALREADY out recruiting Michigan and Ohio State. http://www.big10mizzou.com/2009/12/football-recruiting-missouri-destroys.html
The Texas recruiting argument is frankly ridiculous. Mizzou is not stealing recruits from Texas, Texas A&M, Oklahoma, or Oklahoma State. It is getting kids who play positions that those schools are already too deep on, or kids that WANT to move out of the state of Texas.

It is silly to assume that the Pinkel coaching staff's pipeline will just dry up because the school isn't on tv in Texas all the time. Mizzou is already not on tv in Texas...except when it plays Texas...and then it loses. I know it is screwed up, but seriously, someone in Texas with the right tv package, would have seen more Big Ten than Missouri games.

What do you think an extra 12 million dollars could do for recruiting?

And hell, even if Missouri does lose some Texas recruits, the academic and monetary improvements are worth it.

[CoMoChief]

I don't see KU playing a BCS school out of conference if they don't have to, especially if it's not at home. On the other hand, I don't think MU will be jumping through hoops to play KU in basketball if they went to the Big 10.

THIS

[Frazod]

And the notion that St. Louis is a Big 10 town right now is ridiculous. Does this clown really think Illinois out-recruits Missouri in St. Louis? Who in their right mind would choose the Illini over Mizzou? These programs are going in absolute opposite directions. Zook won't survive another year and God only knows who they'll get as a HC after that.

[ArrowheadMagic]

I don't agree that we are not the kind of program to hit SoCal or Florida hard.

But saying Texas would be flat out dead is dramatic and wouldn't be true. We are sending big time players to go on and play on Sunday. We have a high powered offense and are an ascending football team. Recruiting is about relationships...Big 10 offers us increased exposure.

Texas wouldn't be "dead"


You'd lose guys to KU. ......... No Iowa would send 65k to the game..... MU wouldnt sniff 40k. Your "relationships" in recruiting wont mean anything when they wont play in front of their family 2X a year. You wont pull 4 or 3 star recruits out of Texas..... especially if TCU takes your spot.... ITS NOT HAPPENING. Those kids want to play in front of their family.. MU now gives that opp. at least 2X a year..... move and it doesnt... those kids can go to KU and they will.....You will lose Texas in recruiting. Kids wont be on TV in Texas...


Please tell me how the Big 10 is on TV in Texas...... Outside of OSU/MU ..... really think your program is that big?

[Frazod]

You'd lose guys to KU. ......... No Iowa would send 65k to the game..... MU wouldnt sniff 40k. Your "relationships" in recruiting wont mean anything when they wont play in front of their family 2X a year. You wont pull 4 or 3 star recruits out of Texas..... especially if TCU takes your spot.... ITS NOT HAPPENING. Those kids want to play in front of their family.. MU now gives that opp. at least 2X a year..... move and it doesnt... those kids can go to KU and they will.....You will lose Texas in recruiting. Kids wont be on TV in Texas...


Please tell me how the Big 10 is on TV in Texas...... Outside of OSU/MU ..... really think your program is that big?

You and CoMo are related, aren't you?

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Illinois can't recruit their own state for shit. I'm not concerned about them in the least. Jimmie Hunt and Kyle Prater both told Zook to kiss their nuts.

I will say that the one thing that concerns me about a potential move is Texas recruiting. Now, it should be said that we aren't getting the best and brightest at Texas, anyway.

However, we still get more out of Texas than Baylor, Rice, or TCU. I'd hate to lose out on the Sean Weatherspoons and Danario Alexanders and have them go to second-tier Texas schools, but that alone isn't enough to steer us away from the Big X. Take half that TV money and put it into recruiting, then see what happens.

[verbaljitsu]

*sigh* you are answering facts with assertions. The Big Ten is on tv in Texas because of its superb deals with ABC/ESPN and the Big Ten Network. ALL BIG TEN GAMES ARE TELEVISED, EVERYWHERE IN THE CONTINENTAL UNITED STATES.

[verbaljitsu]

Take half that TV money and put it into recruiting, then see what happens.
Exactly

['Hamas' Jenkins]

And the notion that St. Louis is a Big 10 town right now is ridiculous. Does this clown really think Illinois out-recruits Missouri in St. Louis? Who in their right mind would choose the Illini over Mizzou? These programs are going in absolute opposite directions. Zook won't survive another year and God only knows who they'll get as a HC after that.

Yeah, we hand to fight Zook off with a flamethrower to get him from taking Gabbert and Sheldon Richardson from us. Oh wait...

[Frazod]

Yeah, we hand to fight Zook off with a flamethrower to get him from taking Gabbert and Sheldon Richardson from us. Oh wait...

Yeah, it sure sucked when Maclin went to Illinois. Oh wait...

[verbaljitsu]

It seems to me that the criteria that matters in recruiting are:
Coaching Staff
Facilities
Exposure
Capability to Send to the NFL
Prestige
Geography
Resources
and to the rare few, Academics.

Missouri would get significantly getter in every category, or stay the same. But because it doesn't play Texas every other year no one will go there?

[ArrowheadMagic]

??? now you are just saying stuff. First, the dollar amount is not assumed, and is almost certainly an understatement. The Big Ten shares money equally. All Big Ten schools made 21 million in tv money last year. Mike Alden himself said that (and you can see other sources on the site I linked). The Big Ten would almost certainly make more money with mizzou. They get millions of new cable subscriber dollars guaranteed by their existing contracts. They also get to renegotiate the deal with ESPN/ABC etc. with two new top 30 media markets. That matters. And on top of it all, they get to play a title game. The SEC pulled down over 14 million from its title game. The Big Ten probably wouldn't make as much, but 7-10 million is doable.

On recruiting: Mizzou is ALREADY out recruiting Michigan and Ohio State. http://www.big10mizzou.com/2009/12/football-recruiting-missouri-destroys.html
The Texas recruiting argument is frankly ridiculous. Mizzou is not stealing recruits from Texas, Texas A&M, Oklahoma, or Oklahoma State. It is getting kids who play positions that those schools are already too deep on, or kids that WANT to move out of the state of Texas.

It is silly to assume that the Pinkel coaching staff's pipeline will just dry up because the school isn't on tv in Texas all the time. Mizzou is already not on tv in Texas...except when it plays Texas...and then it loses. I know it is screwed up, but seriously, someone in Texas with the right tv package, would have seen more Big Ten than Missouri games.

What do you think an extra 12 million dollars could do for recruiting?

And hell, even if Missouri does lose some Texas recruits, the academic and monetary improvements are worth it.



Sharing money is ok.... but they(MU) arent making the money...hence the getting passed over for better bowls, your riding coattails of 2 different teams, which appears to be a goal(whomever pays the most).... you still get passed over... Sorry, you arent out recruiting OSU ..... you arent taking talent from the big 3 in Florida...... and you wont take more more talent out of Texas if TCU goes to the Big XII.


Your getting talent out of Texas because they can play in front of their family, who doesnt have to travel to far to see them play. Those kids wont have family willing to travel to the big 10 to watch them play, nor will they see them on TV. Especially when there are schools with as good programs that play locally.


Your basing your recruiting now, with them playing in the BigXII.... it wont be the same if you move.

[ArrowheadMagic]

Yeah, we hand to fight Zook off with a flamethrower to get him from taking Gabbert and Sheldon Richardson from us. Oh wait...


Sorry, what school did Richardson play at because he couldnt qualify?

[ArrowheadMagic]

Yeah, it sure sucked when Maclin went to Illinois. Oh wait...


What did he win you in FB? He did have a chance to win a conference championship, right?

[kcchiefsus]

You'd lose guys to KU. ......... No Iowa would send 65k to the game..... MU wouldnt sniff 40k. Your "relationships" in recruiting wont mean anything when they wont play in front of their family 2X a year. You wont pull 4 or 3 star recruits out of Texas..... especially if TCU takes your spot.... ITS NOT HAPPENING. Those kids want to play in front of their family.. MU now gives that opp. at least 2X a year..... move and it doesnt... those kids can go to KU and they will.....You will lose Texas in recruiting. Kids wont be on TV in Texas...


Please tell me how the Big 10 is on TV in Texas...... Outside of OSU/MU ..... really think your program is that big?

Missouri wins head to head recruiting battles with KU 9 times out of 10. I seriously doubt we start losing any guys to Kansas. But go ahead and keep telling yourself that.

We won't pull 4 or 3 star recruits out of Texas if we leave the big 12? And where do you think those players will start going? It's not like we are currently getting players that have offers from Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas A&M, etc. There are so many kids in Texas that we are still getting good players despite them being the "leftovers" that none of the top schools offered. Your out of your mind if you think KU is going to start winning recruiting battles with Missouri.

Missouri has commits from 10 different states this year. If playing in front of your family is such a big deal that it would alter where you commit then I seriously doubt we would have gotten recruits out of states such as Michigan, Florida, California, or Iowa. What matters more is a good education and the opportunity to make it the next level, both things that Missouri offers.

Sure Missouri might have a slight dropoff in Texas recruiting but it's not going to be the huge fall that you are suggesting. We would make up for it with improved recruiting in Ohio, Illinois, and the other Big 10 states. Also, of the top 100 ranked players in Texas there are recruits that are committed to schools such as Alabama, LSU, Oregon, Utah, BYU, Arkansas, West Virginia, Florida State, Miami, Stanford, Iowa, Minnesota, and Illinois. Not sure where you get this false idea that only big 12 or local schools are able to recruit Texas players. Basically, the scraps that Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas A&M, etc. don't want are there for the taking. Changing to the big 10 won't change that.

Missouri already has facilities that are not far off from the top teams in the big 12 and with the improved revenue sharing in the big 10 we would be able to improve them even more.

[ArrowheadMagic]

If your moving conferences because you can make more money off other teams.... Then you really arent a FB school, are you?

[kcchiefsus]

If your moving conferences because you can make more money off other teams.... Then you really arent a FB school, are you?

What does that have to do with anything?

Based off of the article, the point is that the big 12 television contract sucks. Texas made 13 million last year while every school in the big 10 made 21 million, even schools that in no way compare to Texas athletically such as Illinois, Purdue, and Northwestern.

[Frazod]

What did he win you in FB? He did have a chance to win a conference championship, right?

Yeah, poor Maclin. He didn't amount to shit because he played at Missouri. :shake:

['Hamas' Jenkins]

What did he win you in FB? He did have a chance to win a conference championship, right?

http://lastrow.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/ou-girl-crying.jpg

[DeezNutz]

http://lastrow.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/ou-girl-crying.jpg

Bad picture of Mangino.

[ArrowheadMagic]

Missouri wins head to head recruiting battles with KU 9 times out of 10. I seriously doubt we start losing any guys to Kansas. But go ahead and keep telling yourself that.

We won't pull 4 or 3 star recruits out of Texas if we leave the big 12? And where do you think those players will start going? It's not like we are currently getting players that have offers from Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas A&M, etc. There are so many kids in Texas that we are still getting good players despite them being the "leftovers" that none of the top schools offered. Your out of your mind if you think KU is going to start winning recruiting battles with Missouri.

Missouri has commits from 10 different states this year. If playing in front of your family is such a big deal that it would alter where you commit then I seriously doubt we would have gotten recruits out of states such as Michigan, Florida, California, or Iowa. What matters more is a good education and the opportunity to make it the next level, both things that Missouri offers.

Sure Missouri might have a slight dropoff in Texas recruiting but it's not going to be the huge fall that you are suggesting. We would make up for it with improved recruiting in Ohio, Illinois, and the other Big 10 states. Also, of the top 100 ranked players in Texas there are recruits that are committed to schools such as Alabama, LSU, Oregon, Utah, BYU, Arkansas, West Virginia, Florida State, Miami, Stanford, Iowa, Minnesota, and Illinois. Not sure where you get this false idea that only big 12 or local schools are able to recruit Texas players. Basically, the scraps that Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas A&M, etc. don't want are there for the taking. Changing to the big 10 won't change that.

Missouri already has facilities that are not far off from the top teams in the big 12 and with the improved revenue sharing in the big 10 we would be able to improve them even more.


Your basing all your recruiting off playing in the Big XII, and it will make a differnce once you move. Which means ND.... and Rutgers, didnt want to move. Will you completely lose Texas, no. But those kids you recruited against KU, KSU and now TCU.... wont go to MU. You wont out recruit OSU in Big 10 country. They will be you Texas/OU every year. Sure you get more TV revenue......... but you wont beat OSU......


Big XII would send you to the best bowl they could, if it meant more money for them..... they send the teams that mean money....... It is all about the money..... thats why you get lesser bowls.....

[Frazod]

If only Maclin had went to Oklahoma. He might have ended up a first round draft pick and a multi-millionaire.

[ArrowheadMagic]

Bad picture of Mangino.



How much time do you need to find a picture of a MU fan losing a championship game? In any sport.

[DeezNutz]

Having football discussions about a move that should and would be made only because of academics...

It's win-win all around.

[DeezNutz]

How much time do you need to find a picture of a MU fan losing a championship game? In any sport.

Are you an OU fan? Why? How?

[ArrowheadMagic]

Are you an OU fan? Why? How?


Dad stationed at McConnell in the late 70's...... Liked football...... state of Kansas didnt have any teams that played the sport. Dont know if they still do.

[ArrowheadMagic]

JC Watts and Billy Sims...

[DeezNutz]

Dad stationed at McConnell in the late 70's...... Liked football...... state of Kansas didnt have any teams that played the sport. Dont know if they still do.

LMAO (at the last sentence).

[Frazod]

Dad stationed at McConnell in the late 70's...... Liked football...... state of Kansas didnt have any teams that played the sport. Dont know if they still do.

LMAO

Another bandwagon douchebag.

[ArrowheadMagic]

Ok.. maybe Hamas and Frazod can find a picture of MU fans winning a national championship. Does that make it easier? Again... any sport.

[ArrowheadMagic]

LMAO

Another bandwagon douchebag.


Yeah..... being 2 hours from a school and following them for 30 yrs makes me a bandwagon fan. You'll need to do better. Doubt you will..



But do try.

[DeezNutz]

http://graphics.fansonly.com/photos/schools/miss/sports/m-wrestl/auto_action/476648.jpeg

[Frazod]

Ok.. maybe Hamas and Frazod can find a picture of MU fans winning a national championship. Does that make it easier? Again... any sport.

Gotta love bandwagon smack, especially from some know-it-all moron who converses at a sixth grade level.

[ArrowheadMagic]

http://graphics.fansonly.com/photos/schools/miss/sports/m-wrestl/auto_action/476648.jpeg

If basketball is a secondary sport...... where the hell does this rank? Shit I was atleast hoping for a baseball pic............. but at last..... fuck..is MU a wrestling school?

[ArrowheadMagic]

Gotta love bandwagon smack, especially from some know-it-all moron who converses at a sixth grade level.


Weak. You have all night to come up something good.

[ArrowheadMagic]

dont disappoint the masses.

[Frazod]

Weak. You have all night to come up something good.

Unfortunately, I'm going to bed, CoMoMagic. I guess I'll cry myself to sleep because Missouri is doomed, because you said so. ROFL

[ArrowheadMagic]

Unfortunately, I'm going to bed, CoMoMagic. I guess I'll cry myself to sleep because Missouri is doomed, because you said so. ROFL

Still weak... maybe its the lack of sleep? Good night.

[beer bacon]

The $$$ amount is assumed. Doubt you win over the KC market, since the Big 10 channel is already basic cable.........Surewest at least. STL market is already mostly Big 10. In the end. its a wash. Its not Rutgers nor is it ND. Their 1st two choices. Add on the loss of texas recruiting......


Once the newness wears off, you will get side stepped for the conference teams that travel well. If thats a myth, then your AD needs to be fired because he isnt offering tickets..... but pretty sure your school will return unsold tickets for this bowl game that is much easier to travel to for your midwest fans.

I have Zero dog in this fight, but your FB team will not recruit better than OSU or Mich. You lose Texas..... What you have now is based off Texas recruiting. No kid from Texas is going to MU to play in the Big 10, when he could go to OSU. You will not pull any kids from Ohio...hotbed.... where is your new recruiting hotbed? Help me see how you compete.. Missouri wont put out enough talent to compete, especially when Illinois recruits as well in state.

You dumb fucker, if you don't have any dog in this fight then get out, because you're ignorance is making you look like a fool. How many posts do you have in this thread?

[ArrowheadMagic]

You dumb ****er, if you don't have any dog in this fight then get out, because you're ignorance is making you look like a fool. How many posts do you have in this thread?



Enough because you basing your schools ability to recruit based off the conference it plays in... That will change. Like you know anything about the sport.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Ok.. maybe Hamas and Frazod can find a picture of MU fans winning a national championship. Does that make it easier? Again... any sport.

http://mikeresponts.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/bosworth3.jpg

[beer bacon]

Hey ArrowheadMagic. You don't know how the Big Ten divides TV revenue, you don't know how the Big Ten or any unfucked BCS conference decides which teams go to which bowls, and you don't know how well Missouri fans travel. Is there football related topic you aren't completely ignorant about?

['Hamas' Jenkins]

http://thesportschickblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/sam_bradford_injury.jpg

['Hamas' Jenkins]

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/lTIfTXDPvpc&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/lTIfTXDPvpc&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Jamele.......Come out an playyyyayyyyy.

[ArrowheadMagic]

http://thesportschickblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/sam_bradford_injury.jpg

Would you like a ring with that? Unless you dont think its important for FB schools to have actual championships?

[ArrowheadMagic]

Hey ArrowheadMagic. You don't know how the Big Ten divides TV revenue, you don't know how the Big Ten or any un****ed BCS conference decides which teams go to which bowls, and you don't know how well Missouri fans travel. Is there football related topic you aren't completely ignorant about?


Blah Blah..... Your wanting to switch conferences because of money.... not because the system is unfair. You are following the money... Real FB schools go out and win championships.... Might try it. and no...MU doesnt travel well.... Play Iowa/MU at Arrowhead and watch Iowa put 65k in the seats. Thats how you travel.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Would you like a ring with that? Unless you dont think its important for FB schools to have actual championships?

Well I know he can't give me one, because he was too busy throwing picks in the Red Zone last year to get his.

[beer bacon]

Oklahoma is to college football as the 2007-2008 Missouri Tigers were to the Big 12. Sure, Stoops can win conference championships, but he gets stomped in the bowl games.

[ArrowheadMagic]

Well I know he can't give me one, because he was too busy throwing picks in the Red Zone last year to get his.


Maybe...but when the biggest game in your schools history is a regular season matchup against KU, you probably arent a FB school.

[beer bacon]

I guess I better pick USC as my football so I can finally feel validated as a college football fan. Also, time to drop the Chiefs and Royals. Patriots and Yankees here I come. You stupid fucking peons better bow to a superior sports fan!

[CoMoChief]

Still weak... maybe its the lack of sleep? Good night.

Don't worry, the lack of winning anything eventually takes a toll on people like Frazod.

[beer bacon]

Don't worry, the lack of winning anything eventually takes a toll on people like Frazod.

You and this dumbass should get along real well. Why are you a KU AND MU fan again?

[ArrowheadMagic]

Oklahoma is to college football as the 2007-2008 Missouri Tigers were to the Big 12. Sure, Stoops can win conference championships, but he gets stomped in the bowl games.


True... big game bob has his faults. Sorry, MU cant get to those games to fail....... you get by passed by KU for BCS bowl games..... Play 1 BCS bowl game before you talk shit... you biggest game is a regular season game against KU... Really? Even the BCS bypasses you.... Think that changes with the Big 10? OSU every year..... beats you...even in your best year... You dont make it past them.... Then you figure... you wont beat Iowa.... and if Mich becomes good again..... they get a better bowl. Lots of fail for a FB school. 4th best winning school... then figure in... Purdue, Mich ST and shit Illinois and Northwestern will travel as well as MU does. But you get equal money...



Your not a FB school... your an Equal money school.

[CoMoChief]

Hey ArrowheadMagic. You don't know how the Big Ten divides TV revenue, you don't know how the Big Ten or any un****ed BCS conference decides which teams go to which bowls, and you don't know how well Missouri fans travel. Is there football related topic you aren't completely ignorant about?

Missouri generally doesn't travel well. This is a known fact.

[CoMoChief]

You and this dumbass should get along real well. Why are you a KU AND MU fan again?

Not an MU fan, never have been, Good try though. You and Frazod have a lot in common. You're both completely ignorant when it comes to MU sports and bitch and cry whenever someone tells you the truth about mu sports. They're athletic dept is improving overall. And I do think getting out of the Big12 would help them. I also think they wouldnt want to play KU in bball in their non con schedule. Whether that game is played at the Sprint Center or not.

[beer bacon]

True... big game bob has his faults. Sorry, MU cant get to those games to fail....... you get by passed by KU for BCS bowl games..... Play 1 BCS bowl game before you talk shit... you biggest game is a regular season game against KU... Really? Even the BCS bypasses you.... Think that changes with the Big 10? OSU every year..... beats you...even in your best year... You dont make it past them.... Then you figure... you wont beat Iowa.... and if Mich becomes good again..... they get a better bowl. Lots of fail for a FB school. 4th best winning school... then figure in... Purdue, Mich ST and shit Illinois and Northwestern will travel as well as MU does. But you get equal money...



Your not a FB school... your an Equal money school.

The word you are looking for is you're.

[beer bacon]

Missouri generally doesn't travel well. This is a known fact.

Ok, cite some evidence. I mean, it is known fact, so it should be easy for you to find plenty of data that backs it up right?

[beer bacon]

So what is the attendance going to be at the Texas Bowl this year? 40,000 or so?

[ArrowheadMagic]

Well I know he can't give me one, because he was too busy throwing picks in the Red Zone last year to get his.


Real FB schools dare to be great, dont run to other conferences because the money is better....

[ArrowheadMagic]

I guess I better pick USC as my football so I can finally feel validated as a college football fan. Also, time to drop the Chiefs and Royals. Patriots and Yankees here I come. You stupid ****ing peons better bow to a superior sports fan!


I'm not Mecca.

[beer bacon]

Real FB schools dare to be great, dont run to other conferences because the money is better....

Somebody has hurt feelings.

[ArrowheadMagic]

Somebody has hurt feelings :sad:


How am I hurt?

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Real FB schools dare to be great, dont run to other conferences because the money is better....

That's pretty damned funny, coming from someone whose school had to run to another conference because the money was better, because his own school was so fucking crooked (along with the rest of the conference) that they bankrupted themselves.

[CoMoChief]

Ok, cite some evidence. I mean, it is known fact, so it should be easy for you to find plenty of data that backs it up right?

Well explain to me then why Kansas was picked to go to the Orange Bowl over MU? It's about money. I don't know why some of you can't get this through your heads. BCS thought KU would travel better........for football. If that's not a slap in the face to every MU fan I dont know what is.

[beer bacon]

Well explain to me then why Kansas was picked to go to the Orange Bowl over MU? It's about money. I don't know why some of you can't get this through your heads. BCS thought KU would travel better........for football. If that's not a slap in the face to every MU fan I dont know what is.

Really, KU travels better than Mizzou? What evidence do you have of that?

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Really, KU travels better than Mizzou? What evidence do you have of that?

Scar tissue on Perkins' knees.

[CoMoChief]

So what is the attendance going to be at the Texas Bowl this year? 40,000 or so?

No offense but Texas Bowl = Who fucking cares Bowl. Again MU gets passed for Iowa St for a better bowl game.

[beer bacon]

No offense but Texas Bowl = Who ****ing cares Bowl. Again MU gets passed for Iowa St for a better bowl game.

It would be great if you could predict something astronomically low like 35,000. I think that would give Mizzou and Navy a great chance at setting a new attendance record.

[ArrowheadMagic]

Ok, cite some evidence. I mean, it is known fact, so it should be easy for you to find plenty of data that backs it up right?


Here's a fact...... CFB is all about money.... The bowls choose what teams they think will make more money for them. We can all agree on that.



A MU team that beat KU elects to have KU come to their bowl because their fans travel better.


MU gets passed over for one reason. If only those bowls knew what a FB school you really are..... I am sure you would have played in a BCS bowl by now. I mean surely....its M fucking U ... you know..that FB school...... that we all fear.... with all their rings..... errrr.... that wrestler guy deez nuts found a picture of.

[CoMoChief]

Really, KU travels better than Mizzou? What evidence do you have of that?

KU playing VT in the 2008 Orange Bowl as opposed to MU.

Mu deserved to play in that game. They got screwed. It's about money, it is what it is.

I think MU should go to the Big10, they'd have a chance to play in the Rose Bowl. TX and OU are better than anything that's in the Big10.

[beer bacon]

That isn't evidence dumbass.

[ArrowheadMagic]

It would be great if you could predict something astronomically low like 35,000. I think that would give Mizzou and Navy a great chance at setting a new attendance record.


I know Navy's HC ...just another reason to rout against that vaunted FB school that is MIZ......ZOU.

[CoMoChief]

That isn't evidence dumbass.

Think what you want. In the end it's about what school the BCS thought would make the most money out of the deal. In terms of record, wins, strength of sched, MU winning the north, KU didn't have any other ground to stand on as to why they should be chosen to play VT in the Orange Bowl. They (BCS) chose Kansas over Mizzou. Even this year they chose ISU over MU in the Insight Bowl, sending MU to the Texas Nobody Watches Bowl.

[|Zach|]

You'd lose guys to KU. ......... No Iowa would send 65k to the game..... MU wouldnt sniff 40k. Your "relationships" in recruiting wont mean anything when they wont play in front of their family 2X a year. You wont pull 4 or 3 star recruits out of Texas..... especially if TCU takes your spot.... ITS NOT HAPPENING. Those kids want to play in front of their family.. MU now gives that opp. at least 2X a year..... move and it doesnt... those kids can go to KU and they will.....You will lose Texas in recruiting. Kids wont be on TV in Texas...


Please tell me how the Big 10 is on TV in Texas...... Outside of OSU/MU ..... really think your program is that big?

Dude you said it wouldn't be half full. Half full is 40k. Yet you just said Iowa would bring 65.

Whoever is reading your posts for you is doing a bad job. Nobody is going to fucking play football at Kansas for Missouri.

[Frazod]

Don't worry, the lack of winning anything eventually takes a toll on people like Frazod.

Luckily for me my baseball team is the most successful franchise in any sport for a 1,000 miles in any direction.

And I didn't have to go cherrypicking them, either, you fucking dildo.

[eazyb81]

Hey ArrowheadMagic. You don't know how the Big Ten divides TV revenue, you don't know how the Big Ten or any un****ed BCS conference decides which teams go to which bowls, and you don't know how well Missouri fans travel. Is there football related topic you aren't completely ignorant about?

ROFL

This thread made my morning.

[kepp]

Grass isnt greener on the other side. Does money run college FB, of course, but if think you'll out fan or viewer OSU or Michigan, think again. It will come down to money in that conference again. Then where are you? IT'S not the conference your in. It's the fact your fan base doesnt travel, that wont change if you switch conferences. Purdue or Northwestern will travel better than MU. Mich St also. Until your fan base starts traveling to bowl games, you will get passed over regardless conferences. Unless you go undefeated in the Big 10 and thats not happening.

TCU. Texas is the largest state in the conference.. More viewers and money.. Its better to stop acting like the big 10 wouldnt rather have Notre Dame or Rutgers over MU.

Location isnt the problem. Big XII sends more bowl eligible teams. You dont recruit Florida. You recruit Texas.......... Your team no longer plays in the state most of recruits will be able to play in front of their families. You will not out recruit anyone in Fla or So.Cal...... you just took your recruiting base out of the equation.

Seriously...please spend at least five minutes on Google researching. Literally, everything you said is wrong.

1. The Big10 has said that the main decision for expansion will NOT come down to athletics. Every point you've attempted to make is about athletics and athletics alone.
2. The Big10 splits revenue evenly among it's schools so statements like "but if think you'll out fan or viewer OSU or Michigan, think again. It will come down to money in that conference again" are wrong.
3. The Big10's agreements with bowls stipulate the order in which the bowls can choose the teams based on performance, not based on some perceived standard of how their fans travel.
4. As far as who would replace Mizzou in the Big12, TCU is probably the worst choice, and for the very reason you said they were best. The Big12 already has the TX viewership...TCU would add nothing.
5. We DO recruit Florida and TX recruiting is NOT the only reason we're winning. Blain Gabbert, Jeremy Maclin, Chase Coffman, Derrick Washington...and in the future...Marcus Lucas, Nick Demien (both of whom had offers from OU, BTW), Tyler Gabbert, and 4 or 5 more of Missouri's top-ranked players this year.
6. Ask anyone who knows and they'll tell you that Rutgers DOES NOT bring you the NY TV market...not even close.
7. Notre Dame has stated that they are still not an option for Big10 expansion.

I'm getting tired of typing...

[Frazod]

Seriously...please spend at least five minutes on Google researching.

1. The Big10 has said that the main decision for expansion will NOT come down to athletics. Every point you've attempted to make is about athletics and athletics alone.
2. The Big10 splits revenue evenly among it's schools so statements like "but if think you'll out fan or viewer OSU or Michigan, think again. It will come down to money in that conference again" are wrong.
3. The Big10's agreements with bowls stipulate the order in which the bowls can choose the teams based on performance, not based on some perceived standard of how their fans travel.
4. As far as who would replace Mizzou in the Big12, TCU is probably the worst choice, and for the very reason you said they were best. The Big12 already has the TX viewership...TCU would add nothing.
5. We DO recruit Florida and TX recruiting is NOT the only reason we're winning. Blain Gabbert, Jeremy Maclin, Chase Coffman, Derrick Washington...and in the future...Marcus Lucas, Nick Demien (both of whom had offers from OU, BTW), Tyler Gabbert, and 4 or 5 more of Missouri's top-ranked players this year.
6. Ask anyone who knows and they'll tell you that Rutgers DOES NOT bring you the NY TV market...not even close.
7. Notre Dame has stated that they are still not an option for Big10 expansion.

I'm getting tired of typing...

Doesn't matter - we suck if we stay and we suck if we go. We're doomed, I tell you! DOOMED! And he'll always be "routing" against us!

BOOMER GOONER! I got gas in Enid once! I'm their No. 1 fan!!1111!!!! :D

[Saul Good]

Here's a fact...... CFB is all about money.... The bowls choose what teams they think will make more money for them. We can all agree on that.



A MU team that beat KU elects to have KU come to their bowl because their fans travel better.


MU gets passed over for one reason. If only those bowls knew what a FB school you really are..... I am sure you would have played in a BCS bowl by now. I mean surely....its M ****ing U ... you know..that FB school...... that we all fear.... with all their rings..... errrr.... that wrestler guy deez nuts found a picture of.

Sorry you've got an inferiority complex about being from a 5th rate state where the biggest event outside of Oklahoma football is a barn raising. You're (if that word confuses you, just replace it with "your") like a jilted lover trying to make yourself pretend that you didn't just get dumped for someone better.