Pioli/NFL Consultant: The Chiefs will take a "safe" draft pick

[Quesadilla Joe]

Talked yesterday to a consultant for nearly a dozen NFL teams. He thinks the Chiefs will take a "safe" draft pick.

https://twitter.com/kentbabb/status/11951725667

This consultant has worked in the past with Scott Pioli, and he says "safe" likely means an offensive lineman, despite need 4 safety/LB.

https://twitter.com/kentbabb/status/11951752173

Says after Tyson Jackson pick last year (reach or not, depending on your point of view), Chiefs can't afford to swing for the fences.

https://twitter.com/kentbabb/status/11951773964

[Hammock Parties]

Berry is the safest goddamn pick in the whole draft.

[DeezNutz]

Approximately 2 weeks away from the potential start of the full-court press to fire Scott Pioli.

Please tell me we did not hire the biggest fucking fraud in the NFL.

[Mecca]

Berry is the safest goddamn pick in the whole draft.

Yea but to NFL people OT is the safe pick. They look at positions when deciding who's safe.

[Mr. Laz]

they have no idea

[Ming the Merciless]

Berry is the safest goddamn pick in the whole draft.

ROFL

[Mecca]

This Pawn guy is either the dumbest dude ever created or he's a serious dupe...I wonder which one it is.

[Mr. Laz]

Approximately 2 weeks away from the potential start of the full-court press to fire Scott Pioli.

Please tell me we did not hire the biggest fucking fraud in the NFL.
based on what these consultant are saying what might happen



bullshit, you've been looking for every excuse to "fire pioli" from day 1

[Sure-Oz]

Approximately 2 weeks away from the potential start of the full-court press to fire Scott Pioli.

Please tell me we did not hire the biggest ****ing fraud in the NFL.

We'll definetly find out if we have our NFL version of DM

[DeezNutz]

based on what these consultant are saying what might happen



bullshit, you've been looking for every excuse to "fire pioli" from day 1

Yeah, of course. I was desperately hoping he'd fail. I was NOT initially optimistic or excited by the hire. :rolleyes:

[Mecca]

Yeah, of course. I was desperately hoping he'd fail. I was NOT initially optimistic or excited by the hire. :rolleyes:

Laz knows you man!

How dare you make decisions on Pioli based on his awful moves to this point, how dare you give him another draft that if he fucks it up you'll know he sucks.

But all along you were just waiting for a reason! It's not like he hasn't give you any ammo...

[Sure-Oz]

He better not fuck this draft up with a bunch of 'wtf is that?' picks

I am really looking forward to the draft i think

[Mr. Laz]

Yeah, of course. I was desperately hoping he'd fail. I was NOT initially optimistic or excited by the hire. :rolleyes:
you have be bitching non-stop since the moment Pioli passed on Sanchez

every chance ... hell you guys are even inventing chances now based on drafter prognosticators.

no need to wait for Pioli to screw this draft up ... we just KNOW he will.

:rolleyes:

[LaChapelle]

Pioli has been in charge/last say/GM of 1 draft in his life
He has 2 coordinators now who he knows/know him inside and out
Trying to find a trend is beyond stupid

[Mecca]

He's spent basically 2 offseasons doing nothing now...Pioli deserves the shit he gets.

Who goes on TV during a preseason games talks about his love of evaluation and "this time of year" then puts in one claim on a guy from his former team?

[RedThat]

With the 5th pick in the NFL draft the Kansas City Chiefs select......Russell Okung

[Ming the Merciless]

This Pawn guy is either the dumbest dude ever created or he's a serious dupe...I wonder which one it is.

Both TBH..

[the Talking Can]

so fucking depressing

[Mecca]

So are you Saccopoo, I mean really it's fine to be different but creating a different name to do it is retarded.

[Mr. Laz]

so fucking depressing
the chiefs haven't done anything yet

you are getting depressed because some random dude is predicting something.

Kiper predicts the Chiefs will select Joe Dirt with the 1st pick ...


don't get mad at Pioli, get mad at Kiper


:doh!:

[BossChief]

I think this draft is gonna do one of two things:

1) kill what is left of Piolis cred from last years debacle and show how much of NE was in fact BB. Some of us will get further detached and stop caring a little more.

2) make Pioli look like a genius and give us all hope for the future.

[Mecca]

The Chiefs have given them that ammo by consistently making bad picks, the Chiefs first pick last year was only rivaled by the Raiders for how awful it is.

Look at the history of this team, why should anyone trust them to make a good pick?

[Mr. Laz]

I think this draft is gonna do one of two things:

1) kill what is left of Piolis cred from last years debacle and show how much of NE was in fact BB. Some of us will get further detached and stop caring a little more.

2) make Pioli look like a genius and give us all hope for the future.
nah ... chances are it will be somewhere in-between


the only way to know for sure is if we start playing better

['Hamas' Jenkins]

I don't understand the logic here.

After the Tyson Jackson pick, Pioli needs to take yet another low ceiling/low floor guy?

Talk about throwing good money after bad.

When you look at what we could have had and what we will have.

[WildTurkey]

ROFL

WTF are you laughing at? its the truth there isn't a safer pick in the entire draft

[Mecca]

I don't understand the logic here.

After the Tyson Jackson pick, Pioli needs to take yet another low ceiling/low floor guy?

Talk about throwing good money after bad.

When you look at what we could have had and what we will have.

Dude it's because the fan base is retarded, no high risk picks, win 8-10 games and you're in for 20 years.

That poll on the Chiefs site said it all when something like 80% wanted an offensive lineman.

[Hammock Parties]

I think this draft is gonna do one of two things:

1) kill what is left of Piolis cred from last years debacle and show how much of NE was in fact BB. Some of us will get further detached and stop caring a little more.

2) make Pioli look like a genius and give us all hope for the future.

Eh, maybe.

It could be a real "meh" draft like in 2007 that gets praised out of the gate.

No one can really say.

If they pass on Clausen and Cassel underperforms again, that's when the shit will really hit the fan. You can probably make a pretty good case that Pioli is a colossal moron if he passes on Sanchez AND Clausen while giving Cassel a bunch of money. That would be as bad, if not worse, than anything Carl ever did in 20 years.

[DeezNutz]

you have be bitching non-stop since the moment Pioli passed on Sanchez

every chance ... hell you guys are even inventing chances now based on drafter prognosticators.

no need to wait for Pioli to screw this draft up ... we just KNOW he will.

:rolleyes:

What?

No, I've consistently taken a wait-and-see approach with the 2010 draft.

If, note this important word, he pulls an '09 this year, we'll know what we have for a GM. I'd argue that it's the apologists who have been most inventive with their allowance of an "evaluation year," which is an amazing crock of ****ing shit.

[Mecca]

Scott Pioli's tenure so far is amazingly similar to Dayton Moore's.

[Mr. Laz]

What?

No, I've consistently taken a wait-and-see approach with the 2010 draft.

If, note this important word, he pulls an '09 this year, we'll know what we have for a GM. I'd argue that it's the apologists who have been most inventive with their allowance of an "evaluation year," which is an amazing crock of ****ing shit.what part of this post is "wait and see"?
Approximately 2 weeks away from the potential start of the full-court press to fire Scott Pioli.

Please tell me we did not hire the biggest fucking fraud in the NFL.
this is a lynch mob measuring the rope

[Mecca]

And if he has another shit draft what would you propose? Giving him some hot chocolate and saying "ah well it's a process, evaluation year 2"

[BossChief]

what part of this post is "wait and see"?


ummm, not meaning to but in or anything, but the whole post is wait and see, isnt it? He clearly says its 2 weeks away.

I dont think you read posts for what they are sometimes, only what you think they are.

Just an observation.

[nychief]

Does anybody else think it might be too early to judge last year's draft and, way too early, to judge a draft that hasn't even happened yet?

[the Talking Can]

the chiefs haven't done anything yet

you are getting depressed because some random dude is predicting something.

Kiper predicts the Chiefs will select Joe Dirt with the 1st pick ...


don't get mad at Pioli, get mad at Kiper


:doh!:

it's depressing to hear that people think pioli is this stupid....and based on last year, you'd have to give them the benefit of the doubt...


it would be nice if people were talking about how kc is interested in a QB...because really passing on clausen, even for berry, means that we're pissing in the wind...(and yes, i'd be happy with berry, but not going to pretend he's more important than a qb or that we're going anywhere until we finally draft one)

[chiefzilla1501]

I think this draft is gonna do one of two things:

1) kill what is left of Piolis cred from last years debacle and show how much of NE was in fact BB. Some of us will get further detached and stop caring a little more.

2) make Pioli look like a genius and give us all hope for the future.

That's probably the reaction, because things tend to be black or white.

Right now, I'm starting to worry a lot that the first pick is going to be ultra-conservative and it's not going to make me happy at all.

I do have a feeling, however, that the Chiefs are going to be very effective from the 2nd to 7th round. Will that land playmakers? Probably not.

I also have a feeling that next season, if the cap is kept (and I think it will be), you'll see the Chiefs be aggressive players in free agency. So we can bring in playmakers that way.

Just trying to see the bright side. I do think this team is showing signs of being on the right track, unfortunately, if we keep flubbing chances to bring in playmakers, as mecca said, that's only a track that leads you to 8-8.

[Fairplay]

Its impossible to mess up with the fifth pick in the draft, just impossible.

[Fairplay]

Does anybody else think it might be too early to judge last year's draft and, way too early, to judge a draft that hasn't even happened yet?


Well let me tell you, this board does things a little bit differently.

[DeezNutz]

what part of this post is "wait and see"?

this is a lynch mob measuring the rope

The word "potential."

For any GM, Pioli or otherwise, it's always wise to have a hammer handy.

I don't believe in a "honeymoon stage." Perform. Get results. No excuses.

[Brock]

Does anybody else think it might be too early to judge last year's draft and, way too early, to judge a draft that hasn't even happened yet?

Well, if you look at what they came away with in that draft, where they were drafted, and what their ceiling is, you can certainly judge how good it can potentially be vs. what was spent on it. Other than a KICKER, there's not a playmaker in the bunch, IMO.

[nychief]

Well, if you look at what they came away with in that draft, where they were drafted, and what their ceiling is, you can certainly judge how good it can potentially be vs. what was spent on it. Other than a KICKER, there's not a playmaker in the bunch, IMO.

seems like a myopic view, IMO.

[-King-]

KnoMo has succeeded.

The funny thing is that this thread is based on what some guy THINKS Pioli will do. Some guy that doesn't even work with the Chiefs and doesn't work with Pioli now.

[Brock]

seems like a myopic view, IMO.

Compared to not drafting a first round QB in almost 30 years?

[MMXcalibur]

I'm stocking the bomb shelter well in advance....

[DeezNutz]

seems like a myopic view, IMO.

No, that's appropriate analysis:

Who was drafted, his individual ceiling, positional value, draft value, players who were passed over as a result. Rinse, repeat.

[Marcellus]

Does anybody else think it might be too early to judge last year's draft and, way too early, to judge a draft that hasn't even happened yet?

Well then what would people bitch about? Oh yea, Cassel.

I do think all this speculation is purely that, speculation.

[RedThat]

The Chiefs have given them that ammo by consistently making bad picks, the Chiefs first pick last year was only rivaled by the Raiders for how awful it is.

Look at the history of this team, why should anyone trust them to make a good pick?

And thats why I think the experts are in that line of thinking where they will pass on Berry, f*ck it up and take someone else.

[nychief]

No, that's appropriate analysis:

Who was drafted, his individual ceiling, positional value, draft value, players who were passed over as a result. Rinse, repeat.

No offense, but I think a bunch of rubes on message board going on about "individual ceiling" is laughable... as though anybody here has the slightest notion as to how far Ty Jack and Alex Magee will improve over the course of the next couple of years.... Look, I'm a cynic also, but roundly writing off last years draft, a year out, is foolish.... much less bitching about a draft that has not happened yet? Come on.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

No offense, but I think a bunch of rubes on message board going on about "individual ceiling" is laughable... as though anybody here has the slightest notion as to how far Ty Jack and Alex Magee will improve over the course of the next couple of years.... Look, I'm a cynic also, but roundly writing off last years draft, a year out, is foolish.... much less bitching about a draft that has not happened yet? Come on.

The rubes are the dumb motherfuckers who defended picking a no pass rush 5 technique #3 overall when he couldn't even make 1st team all conference.

[Hammock Parties]

You act like this stuff is rocket science, nychief. It's not. For guys like Mecca who follow the college game religiously, it's not difficult to point out the players who have just about reached their potential. In fact, when Tamba Hali was drafted many on this board said he was maxed out and wouldn't improve much...and lo and behold, what happened? He had a great rookie season and hasn't gotten much better.

[Marcellus]

You act like this stuff is rocket science, nychief. It's not. For guys like Mecca who follow the college game religiously, it's not difficult to point out the players who have just about reached their potential. In fact, when Tamba Hali was drafted many on this board said he was maxed out and wouldn't improve much...and lo and behold, what happened? He had a great rookie season and hasn't gotten much better.

If there wasn't some rocket science involved every team would simply have a "Mecca" working for them and none would ever have a bad draft. GM's would be making $80,000 a year not $2MM.

It's not that simple. The number of 1st round busts by every team prove it.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

LMAO

Fingers in ears. LALALALALALALALALALALA

Hurry up and get here April 22.

[Hammock Parties]

If there wasn't some rocket science involved every team would simply have a "Mecca" working for them and none would ever have a bad draft. GM's would be making $80,000 a year not $2MM.

It's not that simple. The number of 1st round busts by every team prove it.

I'm not saying Hali was a bad pick by any stretch. Teams know if a guy is maxed out. They still take them for whatever reason.

So for nychief to sit here and say people on this board can't identify what a player is and where his ceiling stands is complete garbage.

Especially one year after a lot of well informed people were outraged over Tyson Jackson and oh, hey, looks like they were probably right.

$2 million dollar GMs get it wrong all the time. Bill Parcells drafted Bobby fucking Carpenter in the first round. To act like NFL front officers have all the answers and "rubes" on a message board have none is a bullshit argument brought up by true fans looking to defend the Chiefs just because they're the Chiefs.

[DeezNutz]

If there wasn't some rocket science involved every team would simply have a "Mecca" working for them and none would ever have a bad draft. GM's would be making $80,000 a year not $2MM.

It's not that simple. The number of 1st round busts by every team prove it.

There's not. It's a network, just like a host of other professions.

And, like others, those on the "inside" assume they're the most knowledgeable. It's not like Pioli has a Ph.D. in advanced NFL management. He's a fucking dude who paid his dues, caught a few breaks, worked hard, largely did his job well, and has thus advanced.

We'll soon know if he's advanced too far.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

If there wasn't some rocket science involved every team would simply have a "Mecca" working for them and none would ever have a bad draft. GM's would be making $80,000 a year not $2MM.

It's not that simple. The number of 1st round busts by every team prove it.

Personally I think the busts come down to the difficulty in predicting who is going to keep working after getting more money in their pockets than they've ever seen.

Guys get complacent with that kind of jack, and that IMO is a large reason why they bust.

[Brock]

No offense, but I think a bunch of rubes on message board going on about "individual ceiling" is laughable... as though anybody here has the slightest notion as to how far Ty Jack and Alex Magee will improve over the course of the next couple of years.... Look, I'm a cynic also, but roundly writing off last years draft, a year out, is foolish.... much less bitching about a draft that has not happened yet? Come on.

No offense, but I don't think you understand what Tyson Jackson is and what he's asked to do. He will never, ever justify his draft position. If he was drafted 10 spots later, nobody would say a bad word about it (well, maybe not). You don't get it. He could be the best 5 tech end in the league, but he's still only a 5 tech end.

[DeezNutz]

Personally I think the busts come down to the difficulty in predicting who is going to keep working after getting more money in their pockets than they've ever seen.

Guys get complacent with that kind of jack, and that IMO is a large reason why they bust.

Or when the "experts" think they're smarter than everyone else and select a second-team all-conference player, believing he'll develop into the value of #3 overall.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

Or when the "experts" think they're smarter than everyone else and select a second-team all-conference player, believing he'll develop into the value of #3 overall.

Absolutely.

[Shag]

A lot of doom and gloom in here based on second hand information from a guy speculating what Pioli will do...

[Mr. Flopnuts]

A lot of doom and gloom in here based on second hand information from a guy speculating what Pioli will do...

I agree. I'm firmly keeping my head in the sand until draft day. I'm confident we're not going OT, but I am scared we're going to draft Dan Williams when we could find a space eater later in the draft.

Berry/Clausen or bust.

[Pioli Zombie]

The entire fanbase goes mental because of some opinion from some consultant.
Posted via Mobile Device

[RedThat]

LMAO

Fingers in ears. LALALALALALALALALALALA

Hurry up and get here April 22.

WITH THE 5TH PICK IN THE NFL DRAFT, THE KANSAS CITY CHIEFS SELECT.....RUSSELL OKUNG!!:p

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

I think this draft is gonna do one of two things:

1) kill what is left of Piolis cred from last years debacle and show how much of NE was in fact BB. Some of us will get further detached and stop caring a little more.

2) make Pioli look like a genius and give us all hope for the future.

Yep.

WITH THE 5TH PICK IN THE NFL DRAFT, THE KANSAS CITY CHIEFS SELECT.....RUSSELL OKUNG!!:p

And the crowd goes mild!:spock:

[KCChiefsMan]

Berry is the safest goddamn pick in the whole draft.

this

[Tribal Warfare]

I wouldn't blow a gasket yet guys, this is all bullshit a few weeks before draft and information is being leaked to the media that they are going to pick "X" guy. Just chill and see what happens.

[Ming the Merciless]

Personally I think the busts come down to the difficulty in predicting who is going to keep working after getting more money in their pockets than they've ever seen.

Guys get complacent with that kind of jack, and that IMO is a large reason why they bust.

I totally agree with this and think this is a HUGE part of the bust factor....It is much easier to be a warrior savage when you are hungry.

[patteeu]

You act like this stuff is rocket science, nychief. It's not. For guys like Mecca who follow the college game religiously, it's not difficult to point out the players who have just about reached their potential. In fact, when Tamba Hali was drafted many on this board said he was maxed out and wouldn't improve much...and lo and behold, what happened? He had a great rookie season and hasn't gotten much better.

You act like it's easy to figure out which prospects will become players, which will fail, and which have already maxed out, but yet we have 32 teams filled with professional scouts missing on guys every single year. How can that be?

[Hammock Parties]

You act like it's easy to figure out which prospects will become players, which will fail, and which have already maxed out, but yet we have 32 teams filled with professional scouts missing on guys every single year. How can that be?

That's not what I said, and there's a huge difference between having a crystal ball and realizing a player is maxed out.

[DeezNutz]

You act like it's easy to figure out which prospects will become players, which will fail, and which have already maxed out, but yet we have 32 teams filled with professional scouts missing on guys every single year. How can that be?

Because it's not a binary: it's not super easy, and it's not ridiculously complicated.

And a lot of the people involved in professional sports are neither professional nor expert, in reality.

[TheGuardian]

You act like this stuff is rocket science, nychief. It's not. For guys like Mecca who follow the college game religiously, it's not difficult to point out the players who have just about reached their potential. In fact, when Tamba Hali was drafted many on this board said he was maxed out and wouldn't improve much...and lo and behold, what happened? He had a great rookie season and hasn't gotten much better.

He also thought Antonio Cromartie was going to be the shit. He's the "shit" alright. The guy can't cover and couldn't tackle an old lady with 1 leg. Mecca misses more than he gets right.

[Hammock Parties]

Mecca misses more than he gets right.

Is there documented proof of this? It seems like the people that dislike Mecca focus on the few players he was wrong about it.

Either way, the same can be said for people in the NFL.

[The Bad Guy]

Tyson Jackson was about the unsafest pick in the entire draft last year.

Berry is basically a stone cold lock to be a stud.

[The Bad Guy]

I find it highly disturbing that KnowNothing searches on Twitter for Chiefs news.

[DeezNutz]

Tyson Jackson was about the unsafest pick in the entire draft last year.

Berry is basically a stone cold lock to be a stud.

Safeties aren't worth top-5 picks. /1978

[cdcox]

Dude it's because the fan base is retarded, no high risk picks, win 8-10 games and you're in for 20 years.

That poll on the Chiefs site said it all when something like 80% wanted an offensive lineman.

Even this mindset doesn't explain why you would take "safe" picks. The only reason the Chiefs won all those games in the 90's was DT. Without that one play maker, we would have gone through the '90s trying to make it to 8-8 on a consistent basis.

It is the coaches' job to get the most out of your players. If you don't take high variance players (high top end but having some risk) it means that you think your coaching staff isn't very good.

You have to have some players that turn out better than their average expected value if you are going to win a championship.

[The Bad Guy]

Safeties aren't worth top-5 picks. /1978

That whole mindset is like reading Bob Gretz columns about how great the 90s Chiefs were when it was 2006.

Fucking ridiculous. Scott Pioli should know how valuable safeties are that are playmakers. He had a ton of them in New England from Lawyer to Rodney, but I wouldn't expect his thick skull to think rationally anymore. It's like once guys get to Kansas City to coach or run an organization, they become braindead.

If he passes on Berry for an inferior offensive lineman, he's dead to me.

[DeezNutz]

That whole mindset is like reading Bob Gretz columns about how great the 90s Chiefs were when it was 2006.

****ing ridiculous. Scott Pioli should know how valuable safeties are that are playmakers. He had a ton of them in New England from Lawyer to Rodney, but I wouldn't expect his thick skull to think rationally anymore. It's like once guys get to Kansas City to coach or run an organization, they become braindead.

If he passes on Berry for an inferior offensive lineman, he's dead to me.

Peter Principle.

We were just talking about this with respect to Dayton Moore. Might apply at 1 Arrowhead, too.

Too early to tell, now, but indications aren't promising thus far.

[The Bad Guy]

It's also hilarious that Pioli supposedly is from the BB school of thought that information should be ironclad. Yet, if all these mockers are right and he takes Bulaga, then the fortress he's tried to build is as tough as craypaper.

[The Bad Guy]

Peter Principle.

We were just talking about this with respect to Dayton Moore. Might apply at 1 Arrowhead, too.

Too early to tell, now, but indications aren't promising thus far.

It's remarkable.

[DaneMcCloud]

He also thought Antonio Cromartie was going to be the shit. He's the "shit" alright. The guy can't cover and couldn't tackle an old lady with 1 leg. Mecca misses more than he gets right.

Bullshit about Mecca. He gets far more correct than incorrect.

And why did Rex Ryan of all people just trade for Cromartie? He must not agree with your assessment.

[FlaChief58]

Holy shit! Finally someone with something intelligent to say! This team was left a complete cluster fuck by the previous gm & "coach". Its going to take time to fix what they fucked up soooo badly! Because of that I am giving pioli & haley at least 2 more years before I start calling for their heads!Does anybody else think it might be too early to judge last year's draft and, way too early, to judge a draft that hasn't even happened yet?
Posted via Mobile Device

[DaneMcCloud]

Holy shit! Finally someone with something intelligent to say! This team was left a complete cluster fuck by the previous gm & "coach". Its going to take time to fix what they fucked up soooo badly! Because of that I am giving pioli & haley at least 2 more years before I start calling for their heads!
Posted via Mobile Device

Urine Idiot.

The ONLY guys that performed at an to above average level last year were guys drafted by CP & Herm.

And the #3 overall pick shouldn't need ANY adjustment time. He should be a badass from day one.

And TyJack sucked ass.

Oh, and you don't "fix" a team by bypassing playmakers in each and every round in favor of depth.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

Holy shit! Finally someone with something intelligent to say! This team was left a complete cluster fuck by the previous gm & "coach". Its going to take time to fix what they fucked up soooo badly! Because of that I am giving pioli & haley at least 2 more years before I start calling for their heads!
Posted via Mobile Device

Alarms are definitely going off. But I agree that it's too soon to abandon ship. Unless you're a Somali pirate of course.

[The Bad Guy]

Alarms are definitely going off. But I agree that it's too soon to abandon ship. Unless you're a Somali pirate of course.

It could be too early, but back to back questionable first round picks in the top 5 would be enough for me to say I was 100% wrong about wanting Scott Pioli to be the GM of the Kansas City Chiefs.

You want to turn things around quick? Hit on your first rounders and stop passing on guys just because you value position above all else.

[milkman]

Urine Idiot.

The ONLY guys that performed at an to above average level last year were guys drafted by CP & Herm.

And the #3 overall pick shouldn't need ANY adjustment time. He should be a badass from day one.

And TyJack sucked ass.

Oh, and you don't "fix" a team by bypassing playmakers in each and every round in favor of depth.

Don't waste your time Dane.

This is a guy that has watched Chiefs football for 35 years and imparted the some of the wisdom he picked up in that 35 years in a post that tells us that Matt Cassel is a good QB because Trent Dilfer won a SB.

You can not debate with a guy that possesses that kind of wisdom.

[whoman69]

I think Pioli plays his cards too close to his vest to let some consultant who works with multiple teams have an idea of what's going on inside his mind. Granted I have to say that last year he was pathetic in bringing in talent whether that be through free agency or the draft. He did bring a lot of people in, but they all seemed to be retreads or contingency plans.

He's had more time to work with the scouting department this year. He claims he looks for the best player. I personally don't think Okung will even be there when we pick. Washington has to grab him. If Okung is available I really don't think the statement can be made that he's not taking the best player by choosing Okung.

I don't think its fair to lay CP's drafting problems at Pioli's feet. Pioli screwed up one draft. He should be better prepared this year.

[FlaChief58]

You do remeber king carl trading away the foundation of our defense so his buddy the werm could get a couple more draft picks right? What was that guys name again? O yea jarred allen! Even a dumass like mat millen would have given him the keys to the stadium to get him to stay. But not the king, he would rather have that pos johnson who's career was clearly over, instead of a game changer in allen! Pretty fucking stupid if you ask me!

It could be a real "meh" draft like in 2007 that gets praised out of the gate.

No one can really say.

If they pass on Clausen and Cassel underperforms again, that's when the shit will really hit the fan. You can probably make a pretty good case that Pioli is a colossal moron if he passes on Sanchez AND Clausen while giving Cassel a bunch of money. That would be as bad, if not worse, than anything Carl ever did in 20 years.[/QUOTE]
Posted via Mobile Device

[The Bad Guy]

I don't think its fair to lay CP's drafting problems at Pioli's feet. Pioli screwed up one draft. He should be better prepared this year.

I think that's the key here. If he takes a Brian Bulaga in year 2 when Eric Berry is on the board, then he should absolutely be ripped apart. He should be better prepared, but I'm not sure his preperation would even trump his opinion that safeties aren't "value picks".

[DeezNutz]

I think Pioli plays his cards too close to his vest to let some consultant who works with multiple teams have an idea of what's going on inside his mind. Granted I have to say that last year he was pathetic in bringing in talent whether that be through free agency or the draft. He did bring a lot of people in, but they all seemed to be retreads or contingency plans.

He's had more time to work with the scouting department this year. He claims he looks for the best player. I personally don't think Okung will even be there when we pick. Washington has to grab him. If Okung is available I really don't think the statement can be made that he's not taking the best player by choosing Okung.

I don't think its fair to lay CP's drafting problems at Pioli's feet. Pioli screwed up one draft. He should be better prepared this year.

:(

[Mr. Flopnuts]

It could be too early, but back to back questionable first round picks in the top 5 would be enough for me to say I was 100% wrong about wanting Scott Pioli to be the GM of the Kansas City Chiefs.

You want to turn things around quick? Hit on your first rounders and stop passing on guys just because you value position above all else.

Well, if he fucks this pick off I'm going straight to the 8-8 this year, playoffs next year, deep playoffs following year or GTFO boat.

But my fingers are still in my ears until April 22nd. I'm convinced we're not drafting an OT. I just hope it's not Dan Williams. Like Tyson Jackson, he'll never earn his contract. We can find a fat ass space eater in the 3rd-4th round.

[dirk digler]

LMAO

Fingers in ears. LALALALALALALALALALALA

Hurry up and get here April 22.

No shit. I am tired of all this "speculation".

I am hoping that when the Chiefs pick both Clausen and Berry is there and if he passes on both well then shit will hit the fan and rightfully so.

[Sure-Oz]

I am definetly hopeful that Pioli won't fuck up this pick...it's a no brainer to draft berry at 5 if he's there. Last year it kinda was up in the air who we'd pick but i didn't expect a 10-15th pick player to be picked fucking 3rd. I really hope im not spitting out my booze when the selection is made.

[FlaChief58]

That's not what I said, numbnuts! I was simply stating that cassell can't win all by himself! There are 52 other players on the team and if you don't have the right players in a supporting role, the team as a whole cannot win! I used dilfer as an example of that, but I guess I didn't use small enough words for your dumbass! Don't waste your time Dane.

This is a guy that has watched Chiefs football for 35 years and imparted the some of the wisdom he picked up in that 35 years in a post that tells us that Matt Cassel is a good QB because Trent Dilfer won a SB.

You can not debate with a guy that possesses that kind of wisdom.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Fairplay]

Holy shit! Finally someone with something intelligent to say! This team was left a complete cluster **** by the previous gm & "coach". Its going to take time to fix what they ****ed up soooo badly! Because of that I am giving pioli & haley at least 2 more years before I start calling for their heads!
Posted via Mobile Device


Ask your doctor for some Xanax dude.

Show him this post, he will write it out immediately.

[Fairplay]

That's not what I said, numbnuts! I was simply stating that cassell can't win all by himself! There are 52 other players on the team and if you don't have the right players in a supporting role, the team as a whole cannot win! I used dilfer as an example of that, but I guess I didn't use small enough words for your dumbass!
Posted via Mobile Device

Ask your doctor for some Xanax dude.

Show him this post, he will write it out immediately.

[warpaint*]

Eric Berry. That is my vote.

[milkman]

That's not what I said, numbnuts! I was simply stating that cassell can't win all by himself! There are 52 other players on the team and if you don't have the right players in a supporting role, the team as a whole cannot win! I used dilfer as an example of that, but I guess I didn't use small enough words for your dumbass!
Posted via Mobile Device

Using Dilfer to support an opinion that Cassel is good, regardless of the intent, is stupidity at such a high level that it defies description.

[Pioli Zombie]

I hope they draft Cunt Cunterson.
Posted via Mobile Device

[tk13]

We are entering the time of year right before the draft where it seems like every possible scenario is passed on as rumor. We'll see which ones are real. Just in the last couple days I've heard one that says there's still a chance the Rams draft Clausen, and the Redskins draft Berry.

[Fat Elvis]

If we don't draft either Berry or Clausen, I won't give two shits about the Chiefs for a while.

I want something to look forward to; I want some excitement.

[FlaChief58]

Again, you just don't get it! The point is that you can win with an average qb (insert any name you want here) as long as you have a good enough team around said qb!! Is cassel the answer? I don't know that he is, however he is better than what we've had and given the right tools (quality players) this team can win.You assumed(incorrectly) that I compared dilfer to cassel, wich leads me to believe that your comprehension skills are at about a 3rd grade level! Sorry I can't make it any simpler for you...Using Dilfer to support an opinion that Cassel is good, regardless of the intent, is stupidity at such a high level that it defies description.
Posted via Mobile Device

[-King-]

Again, you just don't get it! The point is that you can win with an average qb (insert any name you want here) as long as you have a good enough team around said qb!! Is cassel the answer? I don't know that he is, however he is better than what we've had and given the right tools (quality players) this team can win.You assumed(incorrectly) that I compared dilfer to cassel, wich leads me to believe that your comprehension skills are at about a 3rd grade level! Sorry I can't make it any simpler for you...
Posted via Mobile Device

:shake: :facepalm:

[cdcox]

Again, you just don't get it! The point is that you can win with an average qb (insert any name you want here) as long as you have a good enough team around said qb!! Is cassel the answer? I don't know that he is, however he is better than what we've had and given the right tools (quality players) this team can win.You assumed(incorrectly) that I compared dilfer to cassel, wich leads me to believe that your comprehension skills are at about a 3rd grade level! Sorry I can't make it any simpler for you...
Posted via Mobile Device

But you can't be a dynasty with an average QB (well, maybe if you are the '70s Steelers but you'll never come close to replicating that in the modern NFL). It is just mindless handicap yourself by having a below average player at the league's most important position.

[Mecca]

I'd like for him to list off how many teams win championships with average QB's.

The Chiefs tried that approach for 20 years, it didn't work, please stop.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

Again, you just don't get it! The point is that you can win with an average qb (insert any name you want here) as long as you have a good enough team around said qb!! Is cassel the answer? I don't know that he is, however he is better than what we've had and given the right tools (quality players) this team can win.You assumed(incorrectly) that I compared dilfer to cassel, wich leads me to believe that your comprehension skills are at about a 3rd grade level! Sorry I can't make it any simpler for you...
Posted via Mobile Device

Who is he better than that we've had? Croyle? Nooooo. Not in accuracy, or arm strength. Thigpen? Pretty similar if you ask me. Green? No way. Who?

[Mecca]

I remember him being called a taller Tyler Thigpen last year at this time on the Walter site and people being upset about it.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

I remember him being called a taller Tyler Thigpen last year at this time on the Walter site and people being upset about it.

I was upset about it, because I knew it was fairly accurate.

[Fish]

Again, you just don't get it! The point is that you can win with an average qb (insert any name you want here) as long as you have a good enough team around said qb!! Is cassel the answer? I don't know that he is, however he is better than what we've had and given the right tools (quality players) this team can win.You assumed(incorrectly) that I compared dilfer to cassel, wich leads me to believe that your comprehension skills are at about a 3rd grade level! Sorry I can't make it any simpler for you...
Posted via Mobile Device

So our QB can suck as long as everyone around him can pick up the slack?

Yeah... that's just the way I want to go about building a franchise...

Dumbest mindset ever. You're asking for the odds to be stacked favorably against us. Instead of addressing the single most important position on the field, you'd rather hope that we have 21 other positions addressed that can mask the suck from the most important position. Guess logic just isn't your thing.

And by the way, Trent Dilfer was released directly after his SB win...

[Mecca]

Why must we always be stuck with a shit brick QB?

Is even attempting to find one to much to ask? You know god forbid we actually use a high draft pick on a QB.

[Mecca]

You want a QB that leads the team and elevates the rest of the team, there's a reason the Colts can replace every offensive player but 1 and still go...there's a reason Brett Favre took the Vikings from marginal playoff team to bowl contender at 40 years old. The list goes on and on.

This idea of just getting by with an average QB, is bullshit, either that or you legit want the team to win with an average QB just to be different which is a flawed strategy. This team got beat by Elway numerous times when the Chiefs had the better team.

If any fan base should understand QB's what they mean and what they're value is, it's this one, yet it appears numerous still don't.

[cdcox]

And by the way, Trent Dilfer was released directly after his SB win...

For Elvis Fucking Grbac none the less.

[FlaChief58]

Croyle may have the skills needed, but he's made of glass! Can't really qualify him as an nfl qb based on that fact alone! Put cassel behind the line that green had and he'll look a lot better too! By the way, what happened when greens line went away? He was knocked out of football! So thanks for making my point for me! Who is he better than that we've had? Croyle? Nooooo. Not in accuracy, or arm strength. Thigpen? Pretty similar if you ask me. Green? No way. Who?
Posted via Mobile Device

[milkman]

Again, you just don't get it! The point is that you can win with an average qb (insert any name you want here) as long as you have a good enough team around said qb!! Is cassel the answer? I don't know that he is, however he is better than what we've had and given the right tools (quality players) this team can win.You assumed(incorrectly) that I compared dilfer to cassel, wich leads me to believe that your comprehension skills are at about a 3rd grade level! Sorry I can't make it any simpler for you...
Posted via Mobile Device

Sorry dumbass.

I get it.

All we have to do is build a team with an outstanding offensive line and one of the all time great defenses, and hope that Cassel achieves the same high level of mediocrity that Dilfer achieved.

Great plan, dumbass.

[Dinny Bossa Nova]

Jim McMahon wasn't a great quarterback. I don't know if he was better than average or not.

I remember the '85 Bears saying they just felt like they'd win when he was in the huddle.

But of course, he had a full-size Ditka willing his team down the field.

Could a full-size Ditka will Cassel and the Chiefs down the field?

We shoulda hired Ditka.

Dinny

[Mecca]

If the 49ers draft Dez Bryant and a OT they'll achieve this guys dream...

Talent everywhere except QB...and they'll struggle to win 10 games.

[milkman]

But you can't be a dynasty with an average QB (well, maybe if you are the '70s Steelers but you'll never come close to replicating that in the modern NFL). It is just mindless handicap yourself by having a below average player at the league's most important position.

If you're suggesting that Bradshaw was average, I would strongly disagree.

One of the most underrated QBs ever who adapted to changes in the offense while leading his team to 4 SB wins.

[FlaChief58]

How do you know he sucks? Based upon last season where he was running for his life on every snap or the fact that his receiving corps dropped more balls than any other team in the league? Like it or not, he is the chiefs qb for now! Dilfer may have been released after the superbowl, but he is sporting a big shiney ring! I'd bet if you asked him he would say that he got everything he wanted out of his career!So our QB can suck as long as everyone around him can pick up the slack?

Yeah... that's just the way I want to go about building a franchise...

Dumbest mindset ever. You're asking for the odds to be stacked favorably against us. Instead of addressing the single most important position on the field, you'd rather hope that we have 21 other positions addressed that can mask the suck from the most important position. Guess logic just isn't your thing.

And by the way, Trent Dilfer was released directly after his SB win...
Posted via Mobile Device

[Mecca]

How about that even when he played for NE their passing game revolved around him throwing WR screens.

The guy is a wildly inaccurate passer, no amount of talent around him will change that.

[RustShack]

Pioli's "safe" pick is going to be McClain. Need, reach, safe, position of need, physical measurements, hes just all around the "type" that fits the "right 53". Hes the ILB Tyson Jackson.

[DeezNutz]

How do you know he sucks? Based upon last season where he was running for his life on every snap or the fact that his receiving corps dropped more balls than any other team in the league? Like it or not, he is the chiefs qb for now! Dilfer may have been released after the superbowl, but he is sporting a big shiney ring! I'd bet if you asked him he would say that he got everything he wanted out of his career!
Posted via Mobile Device

I know he sucks because he's played football. And these games are usually on television, and analysts often track various statistics.

[The Bad Guy]

Why the fuck does FlaChief keep putting exclamation points after everything?

[DeezNutz]

intrawebz are exciting!

[Mecca]

He's really excited!!!

[RustShack]

How can any competent person who has ever watch Cassel play think hes any good!

?

[Mecca]

How can any competent person who has ever watch Cassel play think hes any good!

?

He's wearing a Chiefs uniform, that's really all it takes for a lot of people.

[RustShack]

He's wearing a Chiefs uniform, that's really all it takes for a lot of people.

Oh yeah, plus hes white and has a good guy story.. thats what really gets them!

[milkman]

How can any competent person who has ever watch Cassel play think hes any good!

?

How can you question someone that has watched 35 years of Chiefs football?

[Mecca]

I mean really if you asked people here in a thread, if you were taking over the Chiefs how many players on the current team do you think you could win a title with..

Do you really think anyone who thought they were building a winner would list Matt Cassel?

[cdcox]

If you're suggesting that Bradshaw was average, I would strongly disagree.

One of the most underrated QBs ever who adapted to changes in the offense while leading his team to 4 SB wins.

I really respect your football opinions but we just disagree on Bradshaw. I think the bowl wins were more "despite of" than "because of". I think there were several QBs in the league who could have won 4 SB with that team: Tarkenton, Anderson, Staubach, Fouts and Stabler to name 5 off the top of my head.

I understand what you say about adaptability in that in his early years he was a game manager whose chief duty was to hand the ball off to Franco Harris and that he did air it out more in his later years. But over the course of his career, he was seldom considered to be the best QB in the league even though his surrounding talent was far superior than most.

Bradshaw as better than average, but not HOF worthy in my opinion.

[cdcox]

Pioli's "safe" pick is going to be McClain. Need, reach, safe, position of need, physical measurements, hes just all around the "type" that fits the "right 53". Hes the ILB Tyson Jackson.

I think I'd rather see an OT.

[Mecca]

Rolando McClain has problems with his ass, the market will love it, a good poop story everyday.

[milkman]

I really respect your football opinions but we just disagree on Bradshaw. I think the bowl wins were more "despite of" than "because of". I think there were several QBs in the league who could have won 4 SB with that team: Tarkenton, Anderson, Staubach, Fouts and Stabler to name 5 off the top of my head.

I understand what you say about adaptability in that in his early years he was a game manager whose chief duty was to hand the ball off to Franco Harris and that he did air it out more in his later years. But over the course of his career, he was seldom considered to be the best QB in the league even though his surrounding talent was far superior than most.

Bradshaw as better than average, but not HOF worthy in my opinion.

I don't disagree that he was never the best QB in the league at the time, but he was still a very good QB that adapted to changes in the offense better than almost any QB I've ever seen.

Very few QBs, ever have been able to make the adjustment through the course of their careers like Bradshaw did.

Yes, a lot of those guys could have won with that team, but that speaks more to the quality of QBs at the time than it does to Bradshaw's talent.

[FlaChief58]

Because there are to many dumasses on here who obviously know nothing about football, but who think they do! Really quite disturbing!!!!!!!!!!Why the fuck does FlaChief keep putting exclamation points after everything?
Posted via Mobile Device

[RustShack]

giggle

[Mecca]

You know I never really thought football was a difficult game to understand...I now question that thought.

[RustShack]

You know I never really thought football was a difficult game to understand...I now question that thought.

Because you realized you don't know what your talking about?

ha ho

:evil:

[milkman]

Because there are to many dumasses on here who obviously know nothing about football, but who think they do! Really quite disturbing!!!!!!!!!!
Posted via Mobile Device

Perhaps you should go to someplace like WPI, where their football knowledge is the equal to yours.

[RustShack]

Perhaps you should go to someplace like WPI, where their football knowledge is the equal to yours.

Don't tell Athan what to do!!!

[Hammock Parties]

For Elvis Fucking Grbac none the less.

You know it's serious when cdcox resorts to profanity.

[beer bacon]

Drafting an O-lineman would seem awfully similar to drafting Jackson last year. Jackson was graded out as an end of the 1st type player, and the OTs around at five are all graded out better than that, but they are still not blue chippers.

Berry is likely to be the only elite prospect left at #5. That seems like the safe pick to me...

[FlaChief58]

Well, you would think that if you've never put on the uniform and lined up! Its a team sport for crist sake. As such you are only as strong as your weakest link and that ain't cassel! There are so many holes to plug on this abortion of a team, it'll take at least 3 years to turn this thing around! All im saying is you can't judge this team after only 1 year. I wanted us to turn it around in 1 year too ala miami of a few years ago, but the reality is, that kind of turnaround doesn't happen all the time and we as fans have to be patient and let the chiefs office do what they need to do. You know I never really thought football was a difficult game to understand...I now question that thought.
Posted via Mobile Device

[-King-]

Well, you would think that if you've never put on the uniform and lined up! Its a team sport for crist sake. As such you are only as strong as your weakest link and that ain't cassel! There are so many holes to plug on this abortion of a team, it'll take at least 3 years to turn this thing around! All im saying is you can't judge this team after only 1 year. I wanted us to turn it around in 1 year too ala miami of a few years ago, but the reality is, that kind of turnaround doesn't happen all the time and we as fans have to be patient and let the chiefs office do what they need to do.
Posted via Mobile Device

You've been on this forum since 2006. Haven't you learned a thing?

[Quesadilla Joe]

I remember him being called a taller Tyler Thigpen last year at this time on the Walter site and people being upset about it.

If you are going to quote somebodies opinion at least get the source right :)

Mike Martz was right.... Cassel is the worst QB in the league against the blitz. He reminds me of a taller version of Tyler Thigpen.
8/21/2009

[Slainte]

.

[cdcox]

Well, you would think that if you've never put on the uniform and lined up! Its a team sport for crist sake. As such you are only as strong as your weakest link and that ain't cassel! There are so many holes to plug on this abortion of a team, it'll take at least 3 years to turn this thing around! All im saying is you can't judge this team after only 1 year. I wanted us to turn it around in 1 year too ala miami of a few years ago, but the reality is, that kind of turnaround doesn't happen all the time and we as fans have to be patient and let the chiefs office do what they need to do.
Posted via Mobile Device

Believe it or not, it is possible to simultaneously believe that 1) Cassel has a bad supporting cast, 2) this team is going to take a long time to rebuild and 3) Cassel isn't the right player to fill the team's most important position.

[FlaChief58]

I know, but dammit I forgot my waders and there is a whole lot of bs in here...You've been on this forum since 2006. Haven't you learned a thing?
Posted via Mobile Device

[Mr. Flopnuts]

You want a QB that leads the team and elevates the rest of the team, there's a reason the Colts can replace every offensive player but 1 and still go...there's a reason Brett Favre took the Vikings from marginal playoff team to bowl contender at 40 years old. The list goes on and on.

This idea of just getting by with an average QB, is bullshit, either that or you legit want the team to win with an average QB just to be different which is a flawed strategy. This team got beat by Elway numerous times when the Chiefs had the better team.

If any fan base should understand QB's what they mean and what they're value is, it's this one, yet it appears numerous still don't.

This could be your best post ever.

[FlaChief58]

I never said otherwise, but he is our qb and we need to fix other parts first and pick up a good young qb along the way that we can groom into that franchise qb we all want.Believe it or not, it is possible to simultaneously believe that 1) Cassel has a bad supporting cast, 2) this team is going to take a long time to rebuild and 3) Cassel isn't the right player to fill the team's most important position.
Posted via Mobile Device

[MoreLemonPledge]

I'M SO PISSED THAT PIOLI DRAFTED HIM!!!!1

Oh, wait. The draft hasn't happened yet.

[cdcox]

I never said otherwise, but he is our qb and we need to fix other parts first and pick up a good young qb along the way that we can groom into that franchise qb we all want.
Posted via Mobile Device

Getting a franchise quality QB is never a sure thing. I did an analysis once that showed that you have an equal chance of drafting a franchise-quality QB in the first round as you do in all the other rounds combined. So if we want a franchise level QB, we should either grab one in the first round or we should use all of our remaining picks on a QB. Which of these two strategies do you advocate? If you advocate the first round strategy, this would seem to be the year to do it since there will be a QB sitting there at our pick that is very accurate, which is the chief predictor of pro success.

[threebag]

I just hope it's a good draft. I hate talking to my buddies about other teams drafts. Cause ours are a damned embarassment

[FlaChief58]

True, but there are the tom brady's of the world, granted it's a crapshoot either way you go and selecting a qb in this draft would be a sexy pick, but berry would have to be the way I would go providing he's there. My feeling is we will have high picks in next years draft as well. This should give us the chance at a qb then.Getting a franchise quality QB is never a sure thing. I did an analysis once that showed that you have an equal chance of drafting a franchise-quality QB in the first round as you do in all the other rounds combined. So if we want a franchise level QB, we should either grab one in the first round or we should use all of our remaining picks on a QB. Which of these two strategies do you advocate? If you advocate the first round strategy, this would seem to be the year to do it since there will be a QB sitting there at our pick that is very accurate, which is the chief predictor of pro success.
Posted via Mobile Device

[MadMax]

Matt Castle is the shiznit the razle shadazzle and he just needs 53 pro bowlers around him to show you how wrong you are. He is the baby daddy of the draft picks you covet.

[Mecca]

According to your "we need other pieces first" idea,the Colts shouldn't have taken Manning, Aikman shouldn't have been a Cowboy etc etc etc.

The truth is the reason you take the QB first is because odds are if you have other pieces you'll win 5-7 games, you do that you don't pick high enough to get that QB.

[FlaChief58]

So your saying that winning 5 games would give you such a bad pick that you couldn't get a franchise qb in the top 15 picks? So I guess the possibility of trading up to get the guy you really want is out of the question too. There are many ways to skin a cat, so I guess we'll have to wait till the 22nd to find out who's right. According to your "we need other pieces first" idea,the Colts shouldn't have taken Manning, Aikman shouldn't have been a Cowboy etc etc etc.

The truth is the reason you take the QB first is because odds are if you have other pieces you'll win 5-7 games, you do that you don't pick high enough to get that QB.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Mecca]

Playing to be the exception has bitten this franchise in the ass time and time again, why can't we learn to play by the rules instead of praying we get lucky?

We've done it with RB's twice and QB's forever...can't we follow the damn formula?

[BIG K]

The mastermind behind the entire Patriot experience wants to take a safe pick this year? After getting 'his' coach, 'his' OFF Cordinator, 'his' Def Cordinator, he resides to take a 'safe' pick?

Does anyone else find this ammusing?

[Sure-Oz]

Start BOTTOM to TOP, Kent is tweeting tonight

# This class is also incredibly deep on linemen. I mean, look at how many are projected to be taken in 1st round. Can get very good RT in 2nd 12 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

Chiefs don't seem to know exactly what they've got in Branden Albert. Unless they're sure he's no LT, don't draft one. Can get RT later. 13 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

Plus, I've never liked taking a RT early in the first round. You've GOT to be sure the OT is a left tackle ... or pass. 14 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

The McClain possibility makes some sense. Big school guy, won a championship, physical freak, and most important: would fill a HUGE need. 16 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

@BradChura: Depends on KC's interest in Berry. If Chiefs wanna pass on him, there might be trade interest. In later rounds, who knows. 20 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

Personally, I think Berry is a can't-miss. But this feels an awful lot like the Aaron Curry discussion last yr. KC doesn't think like that. 21 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

I'm not comparing Berry to Jackson. The point was that whomever this yr's pick is HAS to be very good immediately or ppl will get restless. 22 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

For a team with tons of needs, that's huge. 3 high draft picks, grade-wise, is a giant help. If nothing else, kudos to KC for gathering pix 23 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

KC will get a 1st-round-caliber player in early 2nd. The second 2nd-rounder will likely grade as a low 1st-rounder or, more likely, high 2nd 24 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

Some good news for the Chiefs is that this class is seen as incredibly deep bc of so many underclassmen. That means spillover into 2nd rnd. 25 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

@BradChura @mattyku: This guy specifically mentioned Stuckey as a possibility. 26 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

This is potentially interesting, too: "Don't be shocked if it's (Alabama LB) Rolando McClain. It's a safe pick." 27 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

He also wasn't fond of the Tyson Jax pick last yr: "I don't think they can do what happened last year. It would be very, very alarming." 28 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

And "safe" doesn't necessarily mean offensive lineman. Could be mean linebacker. His point was that need AND value have to mesh for Chiefs. 28 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

This is one of the best safety classes in years; some think it's irresponsible to go S at 5 when a decent one is available in 2nd or 3rd rnd 30 minutes ago via web

* Reply
* Retweet

#

Here's a little more detail from earlier: The NFL consultant/former scout says a safety at No. 5 is unlikely. Can get a value safety later.

[nychief]

The mastermind behind the entire Patriot experience wants to take a safe pick this year? After getting 'his' coach, 'his' OFF Cordinator, 'his' Def Cordinator, he resides to take a 'safe' pick?

Does anyone else find this ammusing?


explain.

[BigMeatballDave]

I'm not gonna read thru all this crap, but as much as I want Pioli to draft Berry or Clausen, I will be shocked if that happens. I've been supportive of Pioli, even tho he laid an egg last off season, with the exception of getting a 2nd for TG. If he fucks this draft up, I'm done and he will have a shit-ton of work to do to get me back. Seriously, passing Berry AND Clausen might be unforgivable, unless he could pull off a great deal to move down and grab Thomas. We will see...
Posted via Mobile Device

[chiefs1111]

Playing to be the exception has bitten this franchise in the ass time and time again, why can't we learn to play by the rules instead of praying we get lucky?

We've done it with RB's twice and QB's forever...can't we follow the damn formula?

Nope. Thats the price we pay for being fans of the Chiefs

[Chief Roundup]

First off if the pick turns out ot be Clausen, great, if it is Berry, great! I am like all the rest I hope we don't reach big for someone.
QB is the most important position on the team.
Dan Marino was a very good QB but that didn't do that much for the Dolphins as far as being a dynasty. Marino had his own problems that kept the Dolphins from being better. He always thought that he had to be the highest paid QB in the league. He would not call the plays that Jimmy Johnson called. I would not want Dan Marino as my teams QB because of his attitude.
Brett Favre is a very good QB. But he sure likes to break the rules of a QB. This place would of hung him for throwing back across his body to the middle of the field and basicly costing the vikings from the Super Bowl. And Brett has always done that.
How many first round QB's actually make it in the NFL? Not very many. But a risk that still has to be taken.
I am not ready to give up on Cassel yet. I have seen a lot of QB's look like crap until they have been playing for several years and maybe even several teams.
How many Super Bowls has Peyton won? How many times has he even made it to the Bowl? How many years in the league now?

[Hammock Parties]

Dan Marino was a very good QB but that didn't do that much for the Dolphins as far as being a dynasty.

Bullshit.

The Dolphins made the playoffs 9 times in 15 years with Marino at the helm. They only had ONE losing season.

If their defense hadn't been consistently HORRIBLE almost every year of his career he would have had multiple Super Bowl rings.

Marino's biggest problem was that the Buffalo Bills built a much better all-around team during his prime years. They consistently beat Miami in the regular season and the playoffs.

[Chief Roundup]

Bullshit.

The Dolphins made the playoffs 9 times in 15 years with Marino at the helm. They only had ONE losing season.

If their defense hadn't been consistently HORRIBLE almost every year of his career he would have had multiple Super Bowl rings.

Marino's biggest problem was that the Buffalo Bills built a much better all-around team during his prime years. They consistently beat Miami in the regular season and the playoffs.

Way to pick one sentence out of the paragraph.
I use to live down there and listen to the locals. Fans and Media.

[Fairplay]

Marino had his own problems that kept the Dolphins from being better. He always thought that he had to be the highest paid QB in the league.


Marino was arguably the best QB at the time. He deserved the $$$.

The Dolphins worst enemy was their defense, certainly not him.

[Fairplay]

How many Super Bowls has Peyton won?
How many times has he even made it to the Bowl?
How many years in the league now?


Question one: I'm not sure. Is it between 1 and ten?

Question two: Can you give me a hint?

Question three: Are you talking about Archie, Peyton or Eli?

[The Bad Guy]

Personally, I think Kent Babb is a fucking moron. What NFL team hires a consultant that works with almost half of the other teams?

Just so I can follow here...a 5-tech DE, who will have hardly any impact on rushing the passer and showed year one that he's awful against the run is worth a top 5 pick when a vast majority of teams in the NFL use later picks (late first, 2nd, 3rd) to fill those voids. A ILB in a 3-4 is also worth a top 5 pick when that position should be the easiest on your defense to fill.

However, a safety, specifically a guy like Eric Berry, who could play multiple positons in the secondary and offer flexibility like few others, is not worth that pick.

That line of thinking just makes me fucking crazy.

This safety class is deep. So is inside linebacker and offensive tackle. I'd rather take someone like Brandon Spikes in the 4th round than draft McClain in the first.

[Coogs]

You want a QB that leads the team and elevates the rest of the team, there's a reason the Colts can replace every offensive player but 1 and still go...there's a reason Brett Favre took the Vikings from marginal playoff team to bowl contender at 40 years old. The list goes on and on.

This idea of just getting by with an average QB, is bullshit, either that or you legit want the team to win with an average QB just to be different which is a flawed strategy. This team got beat by Elway numerous times when the Chiefs had the better team.

If any fan base should understand QB's what they mean and what they're value is, it's this one, yet it appears numerous still don't.

:bravo: Outstanding post.

I was watching Total Access last night, and Clausen was the topic of choice. They started comparing Clausen to Sanchez, and all of them were in agreement that Clausen has a better skill set than Sanchez... it just comes down to the "IT" thing.

Charlie Weis knows Clausen's "IT" thing better than anyone else in the draft.

As much as I like Berry, I am going to be damn disappointed if we do not select Clausen. Especially if over the next 15 years Clausen's "IT" thing turns out to be total bullshit.

Drafting Berry and haveing him turn into Ed Reed would be the only thing that might temper that disappointment.

[Coogs]

So your saying that winning 5 games would give you such a bad pick that you couldn't get a franchise qb in the top 15 picks? So I guess the possibility of trading up to get the guy you really want is out of the question too. There are many ways to skin a cat, so I guess we'll have to wait till the 22nd to find out who's right.
Posted via Mobile Device

Herm's draft from a couple of years ago appears to be the foundation of what this team is going to be built on. While Jared Allen is a stud, we appear to have come out of that trade in pretty fair shape. Albert and Charles for sure. Possibly Cottam too.

And while your trade up theory here is nice and all, we had a chance to trade up with Atlanta for Ryan and did not do that under Herm's watch. Last season, we would not have had to traded up, we just let Sanchez slide by. Detroit was wanting to trade down last year too, so we could have went up for Stafford. And this year, it appears we are going to have a shot at Clausen at 5.

What makes you think we are going to trade up for a QB, if we just keep letting franchise guys go past in the first place... while we have a poor mans Scott Mitchell taking the snaps for our team.

[Pioli Zombie]

They didn't trade a 2nd round pick and give Cassel the money and bring in Charlie Weis so that the following year they could draft a QB at 5. They are not going to draft a QB. Everybody knows this except CP.
Posted via Mobile Device

[the Talking Can]

They didn't trade a 2nd round pick and give Cassel the money and bring in Charlie Weis so that the following year they could draft a QB at 5. They are not going to draft a QB. Everybody knows this except CP.
Posted via Mobile Device

how about reading the planet before boring us with old news


everyone knows it is a pipe dream that this franchise will do the right thing, they never have....but that doesn't mean that we're going to stop talking about it

[Coogs]

They didn't trade a 2nd round pick and give Cassel the money and bring in Charlie Weis so that the following year they could draft a QB at 5. They are not going to draft a QB. Everybody knows this except CP.
Posted via Mobile Device

But they should. If we draft Brian Bulaga or a clone of Bulaga at #5, I would hope the crowd at Arrowhead would boo the shit out of the front office much the same as the Dolphins fans did a few years back when they drafted Ted Ginn.

[FlaChief58]

My thoughts as well. We all want to have the second coming of montana as our qb, but we unloaded a boatload of cash on cassel, therefore qb won't be high on the list of needs for pioli at this time. This draft will be all about defense in my opinion since the free agency period seemed to be about helping cassel stay upright.They didn't trade a 2nd round pick and give Cassel the money and bring in Charlie Weis so that the following year they could draft a QB at 5. They are not going to draft a QB. Everybody knows this except CP.
Posted via Mobile Device
Posted via Mobile Device

[Coogs]

My thoughts as well. We all want to have the second coming of montana as our qb, but we unloaded a boatload of cash on cassel, therefore qb won't be high on the list of needs for pioli at this time. This draft will be all about defense in my opinion since the free agency period seemed to be about helping cassel stay upright.
Posted via Mobile Device

Did you miss the free agency period?

[The Bad Guy]

My thoughts as well. We all want to have the second coming of montana as our qb, but we unloaded a boatload of cash on cassel, therefore qb won't be high on the list of needs for pioli at this time. This draft will be all about defense in my opinion since the free agency period seemed to be about helping cassel stay upright.
Posted via Mobile Device

Well, I don't think you want a Montana. You'd rather have Trent Dilfer.

[Fairplay]

:bravo: Outstanding post.




Husssh, don't encourage him he will do it more now.

[Coogs]

Husssh, don't encourage him he will do it more now.

I don't always agree with what Mecca says. That post, however, was absolutely spot on.

[Chiefnj2]

Why do teams think Pioli will take a "Safe" pick? Was Tyson Jackson really a safe pick? Aaron Curry was a safe pick last year - highest rated player at a safe position of LB. Pioli took a bigger risk taking a much lower ranked player.

[Coogs]

Why do teams think Pioli will take a "Safe" pick? Was Tyson Jackson really a safe pick? Aaron Curry was a safe pick last year - highest rated player at a safe position of LB. Pioli took a bigger risk taking a much lower ranked player.

There is a hell of a lot of truth in this post.

[FlaChief58]

Your an idiot!Well, I don't think you want a Montana. You'd rather have Trent Dilfer.
Posted via Mobile Device

[LaChapelle]

'09...#3...................#67
'10...#5...#36...#50...#68

That kinda changes things a bit

[MoreLemonPledge]

'09...#3...................#67
'10...#5...#36...#50...#68

That kinda changes things a bit

BUT THEY'RE GOING TO GET ALL OF THOSE PICKS WRONG!

/cp

[LaChapelle]

Safe is less important
when you have 4 cards instead of 2

[milkman]

They didn't trade a 2nd round pick and give Cassel the money and bring in Charlie Weis so that the following year they could draft a QB at 5. They are not going to draft a QB. Everybody knows this except CP.
Posted via Mobile Device

I highly doubt there are more than a couple of people who actually believe that the Chiefs will spend a pick on Clausen.

The fact is, though, that Cassel sucks ass, and people can't help but dream.

Even I think about it even though I'm not convinced that Clausen is all that.

He is better than Cassel.

I'm expecting Dan Williams, or Brian Bulaga, but my real pipe dream is Eric Berry even though I have about zero hope that he will be the guy.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

'09...#3...................#67
'10...#5...#36...#50...#68

That kinda changes things a bit

Hooray!!! Even more but, but, but they didn't take the guy I had highest on my handcrafted bigboard posts ;)

[MoreLemonPledge]

I would be very surprised if we didn't take one of the Tennessee players.

[The Bad Guy]

Your an idiot!
Posted via Mobile Device

Well considering all your posts resemble someone who either never watched the NFL, I take that as a compliment.

[boogblaster]

Our needs are so many its hard to say what the first pick will be .. Id say its Berry but it might be a lineman ..

[FlaChief58]

Wow, you make it so easy to prove a point. Lets see if you can figure out where you went wrong.........Give up? the word "either" means you should have 2 options to choose from. Don't forget to put on your helmet Corkey. Fuckin tard.....Well considering all your posts resemble someone who either never watched the NFL, I take that as a compliment.

[The Bad Guy]

Wow, you make it so easy to prove a point. Lets see if you can figure out where you went wrong.........Give up? the word "either" means you should have 2 options to choose from. Don't forget to put on your helmet Corkey. ****in tard.....

I've proven my point in this thread. You have too except your football takes are a cross between Findthedr, voyager, and Royr17.

Basically, go fuck yourself with your nonsense.

[FlaChief58]

And yet you can't seem to finish a simple thought, can you Corkey. Who's my special lil boy?! QUOTE=The Bad Guy;6665947]I've proven my point in this thread. You have too except your football takes are a cross between Findthedr, voyager, and Royr17.

Basically, go **** yourself with your nonsense.[/QUOTE]

[The Bad Guy]

And yet you can't seem to finish a simple thought, can you Corkey. Who's my special lil boy?! QUOTE=The Bad Guy;6665947]I've proven my point in this thread. You have too except your football takes are a cross between Findthedr, voyager, and Royr17.

Basically, go **** yourself with your nonsense.[/quote]

Yes, I'm the retard that thinks this team doesn't need a franchise QB.

Again, please light yourself on fire with antifreeze and aqua net hairspray and jump into a Roberto Alomar aids tree.

[FlaChief58]

No thanks. I don't want to participate in your gaydeer games.
P.S. I never said we don't need a franchise qb. It's just not this teams BIGGEST need right now. Time for a diapy change Corkey

[Ebolapox]

crazy idea: franchise qbs win super bowls (with a few minor exceptions: you can win one without if you have a dominating defense, which we aren't close to having). in today's nfl, a franchise qb can make your team, break it if you don't have one. we haven't had one since montana was decrepit and since my dad was 12 years old (around the time of the late 60's early 70's).

so yeah. it's not our biggest need, is it? hell, let other teams pursue super bowls. we're too fucking busy chasing mediocrity.

fucking true fans.

[Fish]

No thanks. I don't want to participate in your gaydeer games.
P.S. I never said we don't need a franchise qb. It's just not this teams BIGGEST need right now. Time for a diapy change Corkey

In today's NFL, franchise QB IS the biggest need. For any team. You can't be a serious contender without it. No way, no how. Without one, the best you could accomplish is a one and done playoff game. If that.

True Fan™ idiots can deny it all they want, but it just makes you look more unintelligent.

[beach tribe]

Approximately 2 weeks away from the potential start of the full-court press to fire Scott Pioli.

Please tell me we did not hire the biggest fucking fraud in the NFL.

I've been the biggest Pioli supporter here, but if we come out of this draft with Brian MFn Bulaga or a comperable pick, I want to be the first to join the fuck Pioli army.

[The Bad Guy]

No thanks. I don't want to participate in your gaydeer games.
P.S. I never said we don't need a franchise qb. It's just not this teams BIGGEST need right now. Time for a diapy change Corkey

When you don't have even a mediocre QB, that's the biggest need.

I wouldn't expect you to understand that, ****head.

You've also landed on the ignore list. Take you, your exclamation points, and your inability to really understand football and off yourself somewhere, perferably slowly.

[chiefzilla1501]

When you don't have even a mediocre QB, that's the biggest need.

I wouldn't expect you to understand that, ****head.

You've also landed on the ignore list. Take you, your exclamation points, and your inability to really understand football and off yourself somewhere, perferably slowly.

I haven't entirely given up on Cassel, but I have a lot of doubt that he's a franchise QB.

That being said, the pick is even a bigger no-brainer when you factor in that if Cassel does really well in 2010, you can trade Jimmy Clausen in 2011 and probably lose little value. A QB like Brady Quinn loses a lot of trade value when he starts and fails. A QB like Clausen wouldn't lose a lot of trade value if he didn't get a chance to start because of the guy in front of him. Actually, if Cassel does really well and Clausen handles the situation like a pro, his stock could even go up.

It's a pretty sweet insurance policy, when you think about it.

[The Bad Guy]

I haven't entirely given up on Cassel, but I have a lot of doubt that he's a franchise QB.

That being said, the pick is even a bigger no-brainer when you factor in that if Cassel does really well in 2010, you can trade Jimmy Clausen in 2011 and probably lose little value. A QB like Brady Quinn loses a lot of trade value when he starts and fails. A QB like Clausen wouldn't lose a lot of trade value if he didn't get a chance to start because of the guy in front of him. Actually, if Cassel does really well and Clausen handles the situation like a pro, his stock could even go up.

It's a pretty sweet insurance policy, when you think about it.

I wouldn't trade Jimmy Claussen in that scenario. I'd deal Cassel and get back a 2nd or 3rd rounder and move forward with Claussen.

[FlaChief58]

I have another crazy idea. DEFENSE WINS TROPHYS. I have been getting beat up here for saying that you need a core group of great players and a bunch of quality secondary players to build a team that can win for years to come (eg. the pats). Whether the offense is dominating or the defense is, (unlikely you'll get both anymore) you can be a contender! I guess those of you who are objecting the most think that the O is the way to go. I beg to differ. The Chiefs had one of the most dominating offenses ever during the Vermiel era and could'nt do jack shit! I believe that if we can manage a top 15 O, but have a top 5 D, we will have something special. So go ahead and say I have no idea what I'm talking about, but if you look at history, D is where it's at.crazy idea: franchise qbs win super bowls (with a few minor exceptions: you can win one without if you have a dominating defense, which we aren't close to having). in today's nfl, a franchise qb can make your team, break it if you don't have one. we haven't had one since montana was decrepit and since my dad was 12 years old (around the time of the late 60's early 70's).

so yeah. it's not our biggest need, is it? hell, let other teams pursue super bowls. we're too ****ing busy chasing mediocrity.

****ing true fans.

[chiefzilla1501]

I wouldn't trade Jimmy Claussen in that scenario. I'd deal Cassel and get back a 2nd or 3rd rounder and move forward with Claussen.

I'm talking about a scenario where Cassel proves in 2010 that he's a franchise QB.

You bring up an interesting point, though. Do you keep the guaranteed franchise QB that can give you about 7 years of franchise production? Or do you take the risk of keeping the younger guy who has franchise potential, but is in no way a guarantee? That's a toughee.

Of course, it's a complete hypothetical. It implies that Cassel will be a franchise QB in 2010.

But you also bring up another great point. No matter what, Cassel carries trade value after this season. I think Cassel is going to have a good not great season in 2010. If he does, it's hard to imagine you can't get that 2nd round pick back.

[milkman]

I have another crazy idea. DEFENSE WINS TROPHYS. I have been getting beat up here for saying that you need a core group of great players and a bunch of quality secondary players to build a team that can win for years to come (eg. the pats). Whether the offense is dominating or the defense is, (unlikely you'll get both anymore) you can be a contender! I guess those of you who are objecting the most think that the O is the way to go. I beg to differ. The Chiefs had one of the most dominating offenses ever during the Vermiel era and could'nt do jack shit! I believe that if we can manage a top 15 O, but have a top 5 D, we will have something special. So go ahead and say I have no idea what I'm talking about, but if you look at history, D is where it's at.

Historically, that's true, which is the reason you saw teams like the Bears, the Bucs and the Ravens win.

However, with rules getting more and more slanted to favor offense, that is simply no longer the the formula, which is why you see teams like the Colts and Saints in the SB last year.

In today's NFL, you need a QB that can make plays, an offense that can put points on the board, and a defense with a couple of playmakers making plays.

[The Bad Guy]

I'm talking about a scenario where Cassel proves in 2010 that he's a franchise QB.

You bring up an interesting point, though. Do you keep the guaranteed franchise QB that can give you about 7 years of franchise production? Or do you take the risk of keeping the younger guy who has franchise potential, but is in no way a guarantee? That's a toughee.

Of course, it's a complete hypothetical. It implies that Cassel will be a franchise QB in 2010.

But you also bring up another great point. No matter what, Cassel carries trade value after this season. I think Cassel is going to have a good not great season in 2010. If he does, it's hard to imagine you can't get that 2nd round pick back.

I don't think it's a 'no matter what' situation with Cassel's draft value. I think he would have to perform insanely well to get back to a 2nd round value.

I don't think Cassel is going to be able to show that in just one year. I just don't think you acquire arm strength, accuracy and the ability to read defenses in one offseason. The likelyhood that Claussen turns in to a consistent franchise guy is far greater than if Cassel can. Cassel's absolute ceiling, I believe, is what he did his first year with the Patriots.

I take the risk with Jimmy. I think he has been groomed by one of the best that we now have and I'd like to see them continue to work together for a long long time.

[chiefzilla1501]

I have another crazy idea. DEFENSE WINS TROPHYS. I have been getting beat up here for saying that you need a core group of great players and a bunch of quality secondary players to build a team that can win for years to come (eg. the pats). Whether the offense is dominating or the defense is, (unlikely you'll get both anymore) you can be a contender! I guess those of you who are objecting the most think that the O is the way to go. I beg to differ. The Chiefs had one of the most dominating offenses ever during the Vermiel era and could'nt do jack shit! I believe that if we can manage a top 15 O, but have a top 5 D, we will have something special. So go ahead and say I have no idea what I'm talking about, but if you look at history, D is where it's at.

Nobody is saying you need a dominant offense. I agree with the premise that even defensive teams, like the Super Bowl Giants, had a franchise QB leading that offense. Teams without franchise QBs, like the Bears w/Grossman or the Ravens w/Dilfer are becoming the exception rather than the rule, especially with relaxed Defensive P.I. rules.

Even if your O is only good enough to be top 15, you would like that to be managed by a really good QB.

[chiefzilla1501]

I don't think it's a 'no matter what' situation with Cassel's draft value. I think he would have to perform insanely well to get back to a 2nd round value.

I don't think Cassel is going to be able to show that in just one year. I just don't think you acquire arm strength, accuracy and the ability to read defenses in one offseason. The likelyhood that Claussen turns in to a consistent franchise guy is far greater than if Cassel can. Cassel's absolute ceiling, I believe, is what he did his first year with the Patriots.

I take the risk with Jimmy. I think he has been groomed by one of the best that we now have and I'd like to see them continue to work together for a long long time.

I disagree, in that I think a good season will definitely get him 2nd round value or better. I'm talking about a 3,500 yard season with something like a 2:1 TD/INT ratio. A team would definitely give good value for that kind of a player, who can give you 6 good seasons. Particularly teams who are desperate to win now with a short window of time. I could easily see a team like Arizona or post-Favre Minnesota, for example, considering a late first rounder.

And I think Cassel's numbers will improve because I think Weis is going to design the offense around his strengths. Weis' offense is extremely simple. And as in New England, I don't think they're going to ask Cassel to do much. If there's anything I worry about, it's that these improvements might also convince the Chiefs' front office that they have a franchise QB, when in fact, it was the offensive coordinator designing an offense that limits his weaknesses.

[Saccopoo]

In today's NFL, franchise QB IS the biggest need. For any team. You can't be a serious contender without it. No way, no how. Without one, the best you could accomplish is a one and done playoff game. If that.

True Fan™ idiots can deny it all they want, but it just makes you look more unintelligent.

I doubt that there is anyone out there that wouldn't appreciate the acquisition of what could be considered a true "franchise" level quarterback for this team. However, guys like that aren't a dime a dozen and it is almost an effort in futility to try to chase that veritable pipe dream in a draft day scenario. For every John Elway or Peyton Manning (the undeniable stud QB who is a once in a generation "sure thing" that is a legitimate #1 overall pick), there is a Joe Montana or Tom Brady (a guy without those elite physical attributes, but has "intangibles" through the roof that enables him to be that once in a generation franchise QB). But there's also the multitude of Jamarcus Russell's, Akili Smith's, Tim Couch's, etc. that are taken with the hopes that they will be that franchise level guy.

I think that a certain segment of the Chiefs fan base has become so enamored, enraptured with the concept of having a "franchise" quarterback that they are willing to take just about any QB that is deemed to be a first rounder in the hopes that they will be that guy.

However, there are some people that think that having a competent coaching staff and front office will be able to selectively choose and groom a quarterback that will develop into such a type of player. At least to me, Weis has done a remarkable job of developing quarterbacks, and having a system in place with Haley and Weis on the same page setting the stage for a specific type of player to succeed gives the Chiefs the potential for success in getting such a player developed.

I think Cassel can be that type of player. He was thought highly enough to be kept in the NE system for four seasons and Denver coach McDaniels was confident enough in his abilities to show one of those "franchise" level quarterbacks (Cutler) the door in order to possibly acquire his services. One has to remember that Cassel was working on a short time frame with Haley's offense and played behind one of the worst, if not the worst offensive line in the NFL last season. With a coach (Weis) who has proven he can develop quarterbacks, a full season of Jamaal Charles at RB and everyone with a full off-season of working in the offensive system, I think we will see a much improved Matt Cassel this next season. I don't necessarily think that he'll be a "franchise" level QB in the strictest sense of the word, but I don't think that he's bad enough to warrant the Chiefs to be selecting a quarterback in the first round in any given draft in the hopes that they are the next "big thing." I'd much rather see them build a solid foundation with quality players at key positions than pick a guy like Sanchez or Clausen just because he plays the QB position. That being said, if they have the opportunity to draft a guy with a boat load of potential at the QB position, then I don't think that they should pass. I'd even be happy to see them trade up if there is a guy there who they really like. The next couple of seasons have guys like Ryan Mallet, Jake Locker and Blaine Gabbert who all scream "franchise" potential to me. That's the type of quarterback that's worth a first round pick. Otherwise, I'd rather see them build up the core positions/foundation, develop a good quarterback for the system in place (making sure that it is in fact a good system that will be there for a number of years - and it looks like that's what the Chiefs now have in place), and then make a move for a franchise QB if the opportunity presents itself.

[RustShack]

giggle

I can't remember the guys name... hes not new CP dumbass.. Flaflap or something.. be he neg repped me for this comment ROFL

Well the rep thing was gray, whatever that means.

[Fish]

I think that a certain segment of the Chiefs fan base has become so enamored, enraptured with the concept of having a "franchise" quarterback that they are willing to take just about any QB that is deemed to be a first rounder in the hopes that they will be that guy.

That is anything but the truth. Do you see me or others pining to trade up to get Bradford? No. I don't want Bradford at all. I want Jimmy, and only Jimmy. It has absolutely nothing to do with him just being a QB, and everything to do with where he came from, who groomed him through college, the system he ran, and the superior qualities he displays. I want Jimmy because he's Jimmy, not because he's another QB.

However, there are some people that think that having a competent coaching staff and front office will be able to selectively choose and groom a quarterback that will develop into such a type of player. At least to me, Weis has done a remarkable job of developing quarterbacks, and having a system in place with Haley and Weis on the same page setting the stage for a specific type of player to succeed gives the Chiefs the potential for success in getting such a player developed.

I think Cassel can be that type of player. He was thought highly enough to be kept in the NE system for four seasons and Denver coach McDaniels was confident enough in his abilities to show one of those "franchise" level quarterbacks (Cutler) the door in order to possibly acquire his services. One has to remember that Cassel was working on a short time frame with Haley's offense and played behind one of the worst, if not the worst offensive line in the NFL last season. With a coach (Weis) who has proven he can develop quarterbacks, a full season of Jamaal Charles at RB and everyone with a full off-season of working in the offensive system, I think we will see a much improved Matt Cassel this next season. I don't necessarily think that he'll be a "franchise" level QB in the strictest sense of the word, but I don't think that he's bad enough to warrant the Chiefs to be selecting a quarterback in the first round in any given draft in the hopes that they are the next "big thing." I'd much rather see them build a solid foundation with quality players at key positions than pick a guy like Sanchez or Clausen just because he plays the QB position.

Yes, Weis has done a pretty good job of grooming QBs. Which makes it all the more logical to take a QB that he personally groomed. He knows the kid better than anyone. The already have a very strong relationship, and know what to expect from each other. THIS is the reason I want Jimmy, not just because of the position he plays.

And if you don't think Cassel is a "franchise" level QB, then you continue to pursue that "franchise" level QB position until you find one. That is enough to warrant a first round pick. Any time, any year. QB is the difference maker in today's NFL. It can't be denied. Yes, you can do other things to get you by if you don't have that yet. But you have to jump on the opportunity when it presents itself. It's that important. And I see that opportunity sitting right in front of us. Jimmy has the tools. He has a better relationship with our OC than anyone we could ask for. He's played with a less than stellar OLine in college, and did so playing injured all year. He's proven his toughness and the fact that he doesn't need a pro bowl OLine to succeed.

[Saccopoo]

The likelyhood that Claussen turns in to a consistent franchise guy is far greater than if Cassel can.

Based on what? Clausen had one very good season and two less-than-mediocre seasons in college. And his one very good season (this past season), he was throwing to two potential first round WR talents in Tate and Floyd. His numbers were not as good as Brady Quinn's in the same system, and he doesn't have the physical skills of Quinn. Clausen is also completely immobile. (Imagine Drew Bledsoe without the physical size and that's a pretty good charaterization of Clausen.)

I think that Clausen is a good quarterback, but he's an early entry with only one good season behind him. He also has short arms, small hands and has never shown any real mobility. While he has familiarity in the Weis system, I don't think he's got the physical size or skill set to be a franchise level player in the NFL. To me, he screams career backup.

I think people are placing way too much emphasis on the fact that he played under Weis versus his real ability to translate to the NFL level effectively.

Cassel's absolute ceiling, I believe, is what he did his first year with the Patriots.

Perhaps. Not much more, but I don't think that he's as bad as everyone hopes/anticipates that it mandates that the Chiefs pick up any quarterback that played in a pro-style college system in the first round. Cassel had a substantially better year statisically than Mark Sanchez while playing behind a substantially worse offensive line and a substantially worse defense. If the Chiefs can improve the talent level around him, Cassel can be an effective NFL level quarterback.

I take the risk with Jimmy. I think he has been groomed by one of the best that we now have and I'd like to see them continue to work together for a long long time.

I think that Clausen was a product of the system and doesn't have the skills that would enable him to be an effective starter in the NFL. He had one good year, statistically, but never put it together in the win/loss column. Being 6'1" with short arms, small hands, a 3/4 delivery and no mobility doesn't give me much confidence in his potential at the next level. And he certainly won't have wide receivers to throw to with the same talent level that he did at Notre Dame. Hell, his center and tackle at Notre Dame were better than what he would play behind on the Chiefs.

[RustShack]

I'm sorry Sacapoo, but your flat our wrong in every way. Because Most people don't like Bradford, McCoy, or Tebow who are graded as first round QB's. Clausen is physically better than Quinn with more accuracy, and Quinn never touched the stats Clausen had last year. Your talking about him being successful with great talent, that talent isn't half as good as the Patriots offense, and Cassel still coudln't look great. Clausen has played more the last three years than Cassel has the last ten. If you think Cassel has more upside, I'm sorry but your a flat our fucking idiot that doesn't deserve to live.

[Pablo]

And he certainly won't have wide receivers to throw to with the same talent level that he did at Notre Dame. LMAO

Because, you know, NFL teams don't tend to have at least one good WR on their rosters or anything.

[Saccopoo]

I'm sorry Sacapoo, but your flat our wrong in every way. Because Most people don't like Bradford, McCoy, or Tebow who are graded as first round QB's.

Most people have Bradford as their #1 quarterback. That includes most people associated with professional football analysis that are paid to to just that.

Your talking about him being successful with great talent, that talent isn't half as good as the Patriots offense, and Cassel still coudln't look great.

I never said Cassel was a franchise level guy in the mold of Peyton Manning or John Elway. I don't think he's a bum either, at least to the extent that a number of people around here want to make him out to be. I don't think he'll ever be considered a "great" quarterback, but he's got the tools to be effective and transition the team to the point where they can build up around him and when/if they have the opportunity to get that "franchise" level guy, they can. Where the team is at now, personnel wise, even a "franchise" level guy isn't going to do much because they have little to work with.

Clausen is physically better than Quinn with more accuracy, and Quinn never touched the stats Clausen had last year.

You obviously think highly of Clausen for whatever reason, but you are flat out wrong on this:

Best seasons:
Clausen:
2008:
268/440
3,172 yds
60.9% completion
25 TD, 17 Int
Win/loss: 3-9

2009:
289/425
3,722 yds
68% completion
28 TD, 4 Int.
Win/loss: 6-6

Quinn:
2005:
292/450
3,919 yds
64.9% completion
32 TD, 7 Int.
W/L: 10-3

2006:
289/467
3,426 yds
61.9% completion
37 TDs, 7 Int.
W/L: 9-3

Clausen has played more the last three years than Cassel has the last ten. If you think Cassel has more upside, I'm sorry but your a flat our ****ing idiot that doesn't deserve to live.

Wow...I get the Emperor Nero thumbs down because I think that Cassel has more upside than Jimmy Clausen? I can only hope St. Peter is more forgiving and less judgmental than you.

Call me crazy, but yes, I think that a 6'5", 235 lb. mobile guy with two years of NFL starting experience has more potential to me than a 6'1", 220 lb. non-mobile guy with short arms, small hands and one good college season.

[Saccopoo]

LMAO

Because, you know, NFL teams don't tend to have at least one good WR on their rosters or anything.

:shrug: We're talking about the Chiefs here. Do you really think that the Chiefs have guys of the same caliber as Golden Tate and Michael Floyd currently on the roster?

[Pablo]

:shrug: We're talking about the Chiefs here. Do you really think that the Chiefs have guys of the same caliber as Golden Tate and Michael Floyd currently on the roster?I think Dwayne Bowe is and will continue to be a better WR than Tate.

[Hootie]

Berry is the safest goddamn pick in the whole draft.

Really?

Safeties are never a safe pick.

Early safeties have been as hit or miss as QB's lately.

[WildTurkey]

Really?

Safeties are never a safe pick.

Early safeties have been as hit or miss as QB's lately.

Berry being safe has nothing to do with his position.... He's just that good of a player that I and a lot of others have a hard time seeing him as anything other than an elite safety in the NFL... so IMO that makes him pretty fucking safe

[Hootie]

well then if he's a sure thing we should be happy about the Chiefs wanting to take a "safe" pick, no?

[Pablo]

Berry being safe has nothing to do with his position.... He's just that good of a player that I and a lot of others have a hard time seeing him as anything other than an elite safety in the NFL... so IMO that makes him pretty fucking safeRemember when we were all super excited about Dorsey dropping into our laps?

How he was the sure thing in that draft; a can't miss, Pro Bowl type of player?

Never underestimate this organization's ability to fuck up good, young players.

[WildTurkey]

well then if he's a sure thing we should be happy about the Chiefs wanting to take a "safe" pick, no?

well its not up to who I think is a sure thing... Its up to Pioli and after last year I have no idea what he's thinking

[WildTurkey]

Remember when we were all super excited about Dorsey dropping into our laps?

How he was the sure thing in that draft; a can't miss, Pro Bowl type of player?

Never underestimate this organization's ability to **** up good, young players.

Dorsey was probably the best player on our D last year outside of B Flowers, and he was playing out of position... Im not sure you could fuck up Berry unless you played him at FB or something stupid like that

[Pablo]

Dorsey was probably the best player on our D last year outside of B Flowers, and he was playing out of position... Im not sure you could fuck up Berry unless you played him at FB or something stupid like thatCrennel will insist on playing him at DE.

[HIChief]

...is LEFT TACKLE. Since when was Safety a glaring weakness, a gaping hole that needed to be filled with the first pick of the draft? That being said, should the Left Tackle already be off the board by the time we pick, then it should be the best player available, or trade the pick.

[WildTurkey]

...is LEFT TACKLE. Since when was Safety a glaring weakness, a gaping hole that needed to be filled with the first pick of the draft? That being said, should the Left Tackle already be off the board by the time we pick, then it should be the best player available, or trade the pick.

When your Safeties are McGraw and Mike Brown, I would say its a glaring weakness.... whats with the fucking Oline fetish around here shit :shake:

[Hootie]

well if they draft Williams, Okung or Baluaga I'd imagine they'd probably be our starting RT while we watch Albert at LT for one more year to see if he's worth a damn over there or not...

[chiefzilla1501]

...is LEFT TACKLE. Since when was Safety a glaring weakness, a gaping hole that needed to be filled with the first pick of the draft? That being said, should the Left Tackle already be off the board by the time we pick, then it should be the best player available, or trade the pick.

It's not obvious.
And in many opinions, myself included, is not need.

[-King-]

...is LEFT TACKLE. Since when was Safety a glaring weakness, a gaping hole that needed to be filled with the first pick of the draft? That being said, should the Left Tackle already be off the board by the time we pick, then it should be the best player available, or trade the pick.

Mike Brown single handedly allowed 7+ TDs by missing tackles or taking the worst angles possible. Safety is the most glaring need IMO.

Left tackle isn't even close. Albert had a great rookie year, last year he was forced to lose 40 pounds and play in a new scheme and at the end of the year, looked very good.

[Saccopoo]

Dorsey was probably the best player on our D last year outside of B Flowers, and he was playing out of position... Im not sure you could **** up Berry unless you played him at FB or something stupid like that

Actually, he was a quarterback in high school. He got offered a scholarship to Tennessee based on being an "athlete" versus his "gifts" at a specific position.

[Pablo]

...is LEFT TACKLE. Since when was Safety a glaring weakness, a gaping hole that needed to be filled with the first pick of the draft? That being said, should the Left Tackle already be off the board by the time we pick, then it should be the best player available, or trade the pick.Brah, we kinda already got one of those left tackles. If you want to grab a RT then it's all copacetic, but we can do that later on.

[ChiefsCountry]

Really?

Safeties are never a safe pick.

Early safeties have been as hit or miss as QB's lately.

The two top 5 safeties were pretty damn good players. Cancer and a stupid thug were the undoings of both of them.

[Saccopoo]

When your Safeties are McGraw and Mike Brown, I would say its a glaring weakness.... whats with the ****ing Oline fetish around here shit :shake:

It's probably due to the fact that our offensive line, as a collective, sucked dog nuts for the past two seasons. That and the fact that the Chiefs haven't taken but ONE offensive linemen in the first three rounds of the draft over the past TEN years.

It's been a position that has been seriously neglected for a long, long time. People talk all they want about how we've plugged in journeymen castoffs/end of the career players in the QB position, but it's nothing compared to what we've done to the offensive line positions. (And there is five of those compared to one or two of the other positions on the team.)

[milkman]

It's probably due to the fact that our offensive line, as a collective, sucked dog nuts for the past two seasons. That and the fact that the Chiefs haven't taken but ONE offensive linemen in the first three rounds of the draft over the past TEN years.

It's been a position that has been seriously neglected for a long, long time. People talk all they want about how we've plugged in journeymen castoffs/end of the career players in the QB position, but it's nothing compared to what we've done to the offensive line positions. (And there is five of those compared to one or two of the other positions on the team.)

No position for this team has been neglected like QB, the most important position on the field.

[milkman]

You're a real piece of work, Okung's sac.

[Saccopoo]

Brah, we kinda already got one of those left tackles. If you want to grab a RT then it's all copacetic, but we can do that later on.

Kinda being the key word. We (Carl/Herm) drafted a guy who never played the left tackle position and projected him to that spot. It's kinda like drafting the best fullback in a specific draft and making him your starting halfback from day one his rookie year based on his "potential."

[ChiefsCountry]

No position for this team has been neglected like QB, the most important position on the field.

No shit. Considering we had a 1st round left tackle from 1984 to 1994, drafted on in 1995. Fucked up and took another in 1999. Not to mention 1998. Traded a 3rd in 2002 for a 3 year rental. Took another in 2008. Yep sure have neglected that positon.

[chiefzilla1501]

Kinda being the key word. We (Carl/Herm) drafted a guy who never played the left tackle position and projected him to that spot. It's kinda like drafting the best fullback in a specific draft and making him your starting halfback from day one his rookie year based on his "potential."

Or like drafting a Left Tackle so you can move a productive offensive lineman, Branden Albert, to play Right Tackle--a position he's never played before and is ill-equipped to play. And asking him to play the third position in just five years.

[Saccopoo]

No position for this team has been neglected like QB, the most important position on the field.

C'mon - this team has drafted quarterbacks like no tomorrow.

Since the format changed to a seven round draft in 1993, the Chiefs have drafted quarterbacks like Steve Matthews, Steve Stenstrom, Pat Barnes and Brodie Croyle.

Geez...some people will complain about anything, no matter how good they have it...

[RustShack]

I just don't get how people can say safety isn't a need, but LT isn't? I mean Jesus how is LT more of a need than QB?

[milkman]

C'mon - this team has drafted quarterbacks like no tomorrow.

Since the format changed to a seven round draft in 1993, the Chiefs have drafted quarterbacks like Steve Matthews, Steve Stenstrom, Pat Barnes and Brodie Croyle.

Geez...some people will complain about anything, no matter how good they have it...

:facepalm:

[BossChief]

Remember when we were all super excited about Dorsey dropping into our laps?

How he was the sure thing in that draft; a can't miss, Pro Bowl type of player?

Never underestimate this organization's ability to fuck up good, young players.

Crennel is a much better coach than Gunther.

Im confident that if we can get some good draft picks for him to work with, he will bring our defense back to where it once was.

[Saccopoo]

Or like drafting a Left Tackle so you can move a productive offensive lineman, Branden Albert, to play Right Tackle--a position he's never played before and is ill-equipped to play. And asking him to play the third position in just five years.

I'm not advocating moving Albert to right tackle. I don't think he'd be a very effective right tackle. I think he'd make a pretty darn good left guard though, and that would allow the team to move Waters into a backup role which would be most beneficial seeing as he just doesn't seem to have the speed or ability to be an effective starter at this point in his career. The left guard spot needs an upgrade, and by picking a left tackle, we could effectively do that. However, seeing as the only guy I really like as a left tackle in the first round is Okung, and he'll most likely be gone when the Chiefs pick, I'd rather have Eric Berry than Bulaga, Williams, Davis, etc. If Okung is there, I hope he's the Chiefs pick. If he's gone, then I hope it's Berry.

Now if Saffold is there at the top of round two or Veldheer at the top of round three or they want to take a flyer on Fox in the later rounds, I wouldn't have a problem with that. (I would also hope that they will give a long look at guys like Zane Beadles, Marshall Newhouse and Ciron Black - guys that have played at a high level in college extensively at the left tackle position, but will be able to play multiple positions at the next level.)

[Ming the Merciless]

I just don't get how people can say safety isn't a need, but LT isn't? I mean Jesus how is LT more of a need than QB?

I think you meant to say "but LT _is_ a need?"...

I see what you're saying though. I guess I just think we should get our lines of scrimmage solid before drafting a franchise QB when we have Cassel who we paid good $ for and haven't given quite enough of a chance yet.

[chiefzilla1501]

I think you meant to say "but LT _is_ a need?"...

I see what you're saying though. I guess I just think we should get our lines of scrimmage solid before drafting a franchise QB when we have Cassel who we paid good $ for and haven't given quite enough of a chance yet.

Or you can get a QB who makes quick, smart decisions and keeps your o-line out of trouble. The difference between a quick-acting QB and a bad one is 35 sacks. If you need proof of that, look at New England's sack totals every year with Brady compared to the one year with Cassel.

And besides, in a zone blocking scheme, you don't need a ton of studs on the o-line. Weis is going to build a scheme that is going to have a lot of really quick passing options.

[RustShack]

Yeah I don't think people understand different schemes and what types of players they need.

[kcchiefsus]

Remember when we were all super excited about Dorsey dropping into our laps?

How he was the sure thing in that draft; a can't miss, Pro Bowl type of player?

Never underestimate this organization's ability to **** up good, young players.

How did we fuck him up? He's still a young player. He will probably never live up to the hype since he is playing in a system where the linebackers make the plays but that doesn't mean he can't be a good player for a long time.

Albert Haynesworth wasn't anything special his first few seasons in the league. Then he blew up. Give Dorsey time. Calling him (or Tyson Jackson) a bust at this time is pretty short sighted.

[milkman]

How did we **** him up? He's still a young player. He will probably never live up to the hype since he is playing in a system where the linebackers make the plays but that doesn't mean he can't be a good player for a long time.

Albert Haynesworth wasn't anything special his first few seasons in the league. Then he blew up. Give Dorsey time. Calling him (or Tyson Jackson) a bust at this time is pretty short sighted.

The problem is that Dorsey had/has the potential to be a dominating DT in a 43 scheme.
He did play well, and will probably continue to improve playing the 5 tech last year, but that is not his natural position, and he will never live up to his potential, or his draft status because he's both playing out of position and a non impact position.

And Tyson Jackson, because of the nature of the position, will also never play to the level of his draft position.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

I hope they draft Cunt Cunterson.
Posted via Mobile Device

Definitely a Cunterson man myself this year!LMAO

Perhaps you should go to someplace like WPI, where their football knowledge is the equal to yours.

:LOL:LMAO

Matt Castle is the shiznit the razle shadazzle and he just needs 53 pro bowlers around him to show you how wrong you are. He is the baby daddy of the draft picks you covet.

So much Glorious WIN in this thread!

I've proven my point in this thread. You have too except your football takes are a cross between Findthedr, voyager, and Royr17.

Basically, go fuck yourself with your nonsense.

LMAO

I have another crazy idea!

Well turdwhacker, we're absolutely fucking shocked by this notion!

[/quote=Saccopoo;6666453]C'mon - this team has drafted quarterbacks like no tomorrow.

[quote]

WTF?!?!? :facepalm: