How much is Berry worth to YOU?

[Christofire]

Purely speculation, but really curious:

Let's say the Bucs are on the clock, and rumors are flying that the Redskins will take Berry OR that Cleveland plans to trade up and take him. If you were GM would spend the extra picks needed to trade up to #3 to ensure we get Berry? Or shake your head and take the next best player?

[Mr. Laz]

no, you don't trade up for Berry.

[boogblaster]

If we trade up its Suh we need ...

[ChiefGator]

Even if he IS there, I'm still open for business to trade down. The dropoff to the next safety is not as big as some may imply.

I am certainly not spending additional picks to move up and get him.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to fuck us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Washington - Berry

Kansas City - Fucked

[BigCatDaddy]

You stand pat and take Dan Williams or Brandon Graham, if you refuse to draft Clausen.

[talastan]

No trading up period. Unless we want a QB, there isn't a player so valuable that we need to lock on to him so we can win it all now. If Berry is there great, if not so be it. If we get offered a great opportunity to trade down, why not. Flexiablility in the draft is how teams draft well in the first place.

[warrior]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to **** us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Washington - Berry

Kansas City - ****ed



That would suck

[Mr. Laz]

Kansas City - Fucked
you've been predicting this in some fashion for months :shrug:

[Christofire]

I'm sure as a former AFC West rival, Shanahan might still find a little joy in screwing us over.

[Hootie]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to **** us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Washington - Berry

Kansas City - ****ed

Me too.

[The Bad Guy]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to **** us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Washington - Berry

Kansas City - ****ed

I'd relax about it. Mike Shanahan knows how to build an offense. He's not that stupid to tie up another resource in a secondary they've already spent a lot on.

[spanky 52]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to **** us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Washington - Berry

Kansas City - ****ed

And if it happens this way, it will be either Okung or McClain. I would have been okay with McClain until the revelation about his health concerns came out. And I'm all for rebuilding the interior of the OL but not with the 5th pick. And I don't see anyone wanting to come up to the 5 spot. Looks like I'll be hating me some Washington Redsins after tonight.

[Sofa King]

no way do you trade up, for anyone...


Berry will be there at 5... whether we screw it up or not is the real question..

[Hootie]

if we ended up with Okung at #5...the only way the draft would be saved for me is if we miracled it up and took Clausen around #20-23...

that's been my dream scenario since our pick was announced...(and I was laughed at, for the record)...

Berry at 5, Clausen at mid-late 1st...

[Christofire]

If the four above aren't available, I'd rock with Whitlock and prefer a Dez Bryant type over an o-lineman.

[keg in kc]

I wouldn't trade up for him, no. He's not the only stud in the draft, and not the only player who could make a tremendous impact on this team.

I think in the end, we're going to end up with somebody really good, whether it's Berry or somebody else.

Unless we draft a fucking o-tackle, in which case I'm going to commit homicide on my tv set.

[spanky 52]

Purely speculation, but really curious:

Let's say the Bucs are on the clock, and rumors are flying that the Redskins will take Berry OR that Cleveland plans to trade up and take him. If you were GM would spend the extra picks needed to trade up to #3 to ensure we get Berry? Or shake your head and take the next best player?

I wouldn't trade up. At that point if Berry were gone and I couldn' get anyone to trade up to our spot, take the BPA on the board. It's not like we don't have a lot of holes to plug.

[Zman]

I wouldn't trade up for him, no. He's not the only stud in the draft, and not the only player who could make a tremendous impact on this team.

I think in the end, we're going to end up with somebody really good, whether it's Berry or somebody else.

Unless we draft a fucking o-tackle, in which case I'm going to commit homicide on my tv set.
You better load your Gun. It will be O-Line. I would never pay Berry number 5 money.

[The Franchise]

No....because we'd still have a shot at Clausen.

[patteeu]

No, and hopefully Cleveland won't do it either.

[Rausch]

No fucking way I'd trade up.

Not for anyone...

[Frosty]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to **** us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Cleveland - Berry

Kansas City - ****ed

FYP.

By the way, if this happens, do you think anyone (Buffalo) would be willing to trade to get in front of Seattle and Washington to get the top tackle? Then the Chiefs could take Thomas, Graham or McClain at a more reasonable spot.

[spanky 52]

FYP.

By the way, if this happens, do you think anyone (Buffalo) would be willing to trade to get in front of Seattle and Washington to get the top tackle? Then the Chiefs could take Thomas, Graham or McClain at a more reasonable spot.

Arc, I think that's wishful thinking but I believe the Bills are the cheapest team in the NFL. I could see them trying to move down. Not that I wouldn't like this to happen, just don't think it will.

[OnTheWarpath15]

I'd relax about it. Mike Shanahan knows how to build an offense. He's not that stupid to tie up another resource in a secondary they've already spent a lot on.

What scares me about Shanahan is that he IS smart enough to take the BPA regardless of need.

[OnTheWarpath15]

I wouldn't trade up for him, no. He's not the only stud in the draft, and not the only player who could make a tremendous impact on this team.

I think in the end, we're going to end up with somebody really good, whether it's Berry or somebody else.

Unless we draft a fucking o-tackle, in which case I'm going to commit homicide on my tv set.

"Really good" isn't good enough when you're picking 5th, IMO.

[The Bad Guy]

What scares me about Shanahan is that he IS smart enough to take the BPA regardless of need.

He's also smart enough to know that he can't work with the line in it's current form. They have limited picks to fix a unit that's the worst in the NFL.

[CaliforniaChief]

I would not trade up for Berry...unless they'd do it for 2 5ths, which they wouldn't.

Just let the chips fall where they may at the top and pick Berry if he's there.

If he's not, we're in OTWP's nightmare scenario.

[keg in kc]

"Really good" isn't good enough when you're picking 5th, IMO.I think that depends on your definition of "really good".

Either way, I wasn't using the phrase as some kind of tangible player rating. You can substitute any term for "great" that you like. Awesome. Pants-shattering. Perennial pro-bowl. Stud. Star. Superstar. Aaron Curry Christ. Mike Peterson.

All I was saying is that (unlike last year) this is a draft that's pretty rich at the top, and I don't think it's "Berry or Bust!" to the point that it has to be him or nobody. So I wouldn't trade up.

[Ralphy Boy]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to **** us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Washington - Berry

Kansas City - ****ed

Entertain trade offers for Clausen. If you can't get a deal done in 10 minutes, draft Clausen and hold him for ransom. If somebody is willing to pay the price, you trade him and if not, you have your starting QB for the next 10+ years.

Either way we are in charge of what happens at that point.

Isn't the hot rumor of the morning that Washington will trade up for Bradford or Suh, using Haynesworth as leverage?

[spanky 52]

He's also smart enough to know that he can't work with the line in it's current form. They have limited picks to fix a unit that's the worst in the NFL.

Thanks for using common sense here. My emotions have been up and down this morning as I tend to look at the glass half empty. The Redskins have to get a LT in this draft. They don't have a 2 or 3rd round pick. If they take Berry and hope to get a starter in the 4th round, good luck with that.

If they trade down say to Cleveland and pick up an extra 3rd, there is no guarantee there would be one of the quality tackles left. Assuming KC took Okung and Seattle took Williams. Maybe we all should take some deep breaths and relax.

[OnTheWarpath15]

I think that depends on your definition of "really good".

Either way, I wasn't using the phrase as some kind of tangible player rating. You can substitute any term for "great" that you like. Awesome. Pants-shattering. Perennial pro-bowl. Stud. Star. Superstar. Aaron Curry Christ. Mike Peterson.

All I was saying is that (unlike last year) this is a draft that's pretty rich at the top, and I don't think it's "Berry or Bust!" to the point that it has to be him or nobody. So I wouldn't trade up.

Actually, I think it's a lot like last year.

There are 3 elite talents and two potential franchise QB's in this draft.

The problem is, 2 of the elite talents either don't fit our scheme, or would be a complete waste of their talents.

That leaves Berry, Bradford, Clausen.

Bradford will be gone.

Berry potentially could be gone.

Pioli doesn't have the stones to take Clausen.

Which means for the 3rd year in a row, the 5th overall pick isn't worthy of being taken 5th overall.*


*Dorsey was at the time, but his value has since been neutered by the move to 5-tech.

[Christofire]

I think that depends on your definition of "really good".

Either way, I wasn't using the phrase as some kind of tangible player rating. You can substitute any term for "great" that you like. Awesome. Pants-shattering. Perennial pro-bowl. Stud. Star. Superstar. Aaron Curry Christ. Mike Peterson.


Personally, I don't think there's enough use of the adjective "pants-shattering" in the world.

[dirk digler]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to fuck us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Washington - Berry

Kansas City - Fucked

Me too but at the same time I just can't see the Skins passing on OL when they don't have either a LT or a RT to protect McNabb.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Thanks for using common sense here. My emotions have been up and down this morning as I tend to look at the glass half empty. The Redskins have to get a LT in this draft. They don't have a 2 or 3rd round pick. If they take Berry and hope to get a starter in the 4th round, good luck with that.

If they trade down say to Cleveland and pick up an extra 3rd, there is no guarantee there would be one of the quality tackles left. Assuming KC took Okung and Seattle took Williams. Maybe we all should take some deep breaths and relax.

Common sense is that good teams don't draft for need, they draft for a combination of talent and value.

[OnTheWarpath15]

For the record, I'm not saying that Washington WILL take Berry, all I'm saying is that it's foolish to rule it out.

[ModSocks]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to **** us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Washington - Berry

Kansas City - ****ed

Hush your mouth!

[dirk digler]

The Skins don't have a 2nd or a 3rd? No way they can pass on OL. That would be really really stupid.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Hush your mouth!

LMAO

[The Franchise]

I'm more worried about Washington trading out of the spot to a team that wants Berry.

[OnTheWarpath15]

I'm more worried about Washington trading out of the spot to a team that wants Berry.

That too.

The end result is the same.

[dirk digler]

I'm more worried about Washington trading out of the spot to a team that wants Berry.

Yep. Cleveland comes to mind

[Christofire]

I would kill to have a War Room cam on Haley if we get screwed by someone. Seriously. I'd pay for it. It wouldn't even need audio, so they wouldn't have to worry about giving away their plans. I just want to see every goofy smile and pissed off ranting.

[ModSocks]

I'm more worried about Washington trading out of the spot to a team that wants Berry.

I'm HOPING that the teams behind us that do value Berry, see Earl Thomas as his equal and feel like they wont need to trade up to land that kind of talent.

With Thomas and Haden still on the board, Cleveland needs to just stay right where they are.

[KChiefs1]

If Berry isn't there you have to take the best OT on the board. Don't you?

[patteeu]

Thanks for using common sense here. My emotions have been up and down this morning as I tend to look at the glass half empty. The Redskins have to get a LT in this draft. They don't have a 2 or 3rd round pick. If they take Berry and hope to get a starter in the 4th round, good luck with that.

If they trade down say to Cleveland and pick up an extra 3rd, there is no guarantee there would be one of the quality tackles left. Assuming KC took Okung and Seattle took Williams. Maybe we all should take some deep breaths and relax.

Okung and Williams aren't the only OTs in the draft. There aren't many people who say that the dropoff from those 2 to the next 2 or 3 guys is that substantial. I think Washington would be foolish not to trade down with Cleveland for a 3rd. The bigger question, IMO, is whether Cleveland would be willing to pay that much to trade up for Berry and I'm hoping the answer to that question is no.

[keg in kc]

Pioli doesn't have the stones to take Clausen.I think that statement's kind of a silly way to look at it, but that's a whole 'nother thread.

I guess I just see the first round this year as stronger than you do. I thought last year was maybe the worst top 10 (and worst first round) talent-wise maybe ever. And I don't think that's the case this year.

I'm just not the kind of guy to get married to a single player. I'd be just as fine with McClain or Brandon Graham later in the round, and a safety in the early 2nd, as I would be with Berry.

What I want out of the first round is something that will leave me thinking "hey, that was a good move". Whether it's a trade down where we get good return and then a good player later in the round, or whether it's staying put at 5 and drafting Berry. Just something that makes sense, and doesn't lead to me throwing shit.

I'm expecting, however, to end up throwing shit.

Because that seems to be the established annual tradition.

[Mr. Laz]

Okung and Williams aren't the only OTs in the draft. There aren't many people who say that the dropoff from those 2 to the next 2 or 3 guys is that substantial. I think Washington would be foolish not to trade down with Cleveland for a 3rd. The bigger question, IMO, is whether Cleveland would be willing to pay that much to trade up for Berry and I'm hoping the answer to that question is no.

which is why the Chiefs don't want to act like they want Berry so Cleveland knows it has to trade up.

Cleveland won't want to spend extra unless they absolutely have to ... if they think there is a decent chance the chiefs go Oline then they won't trade up and we can fuck them up their dog pound azz. :clap:

[FlaChief58]

As much as I like Berry, moving up from 5 doesn't make a lot of sense to me. It's that whole risk reward thing. If he's not there at 5, hopefully okung or suh will be. (Just the thought of suh on our team gives me a tingle in my shorts. Not likely though) If not, I would be ok with trading down for the extra pic. Kiper thinks clausen could drop as low as 30 so we may get a qbotf, and not break the bank doing it.

[BigChiefFan]

I'd trade up, but only for Bradford or Suh.

[The Bad Guy]

There is a lot of smoke with the Redskins today. There are tons of reports that Shanahan will pull a shocker. Shanahan builds his lines first. I don't know why that fact is lost.

If it was any other team but the Redskins, I'd say this is a legit chance of happening. But the Redskins have invested a ton into the safety position. They have Landry, who could move to SS, but they also have Chris Horton and Reed Doughty, who are solid players.

I think Shanahan is putting out a lot of smoke to get someone to trade up for Berry. Put it out there that you want Berry so you could jump ahead of the Chiefs, who will take him.

[Frosty]

What scares me about Shanahan is that he IS smart enough to take the BPA regardless of need.

Shanahan has the "genious" label but, in reality, drafts under him weren't that great, especially in the first three rounds. He did a great job in the later rounds with players like Davis and Dumervil. Here is the draft history under Shanahan. There are some okay players there but there is a lot of fail, too. he seemed really good at picking LB'ers. 2008's top pick was Clady, obviously.

2007

1 17 Jarvis Moss DE Florida
2 56 Tim Crowder DE Texas
3 70 Ryan Harris OT Notre Dame

2006

1 11 Jay Cutler QB Vanderbilt
2 61 Tony Scheffler TE Western Michigan

2005

2 56 Darrent Williams CB Oklahoma State
3 76 Karl Paymah DB Washington State
3 97 Domonique Foxworth CB Maryland
3 101 Maurice Clarett -- Ohio State

2004

1 17 D.J. Williams OLB Miami (Fla.)
2 41 Tatum Bell RB Oklahoma State
2 54 Darius Watts WR Marshall
3 85 Jeremy LeSueur CB Michigan

2003

1 20 George Foster T Georgia
2 51 Terry Pierce LB Kansas State

2002

1 19 Ashley Lelie WR Hawaii
2 51 Clinton Portis RB Miami (Fla.)
3 96 Dorsett Davis DT Mississippi State



2001

1 24 Willie Middlebrooks CB Minnesota
2 51 Paul Toviessi DE Marshall
3 87 Reggie Hayward DE Iowa State

2000

1 15 Deltha O'Neal CB California
2 40 Ian Gold LB Michigan
2 45 Kenoy Kennedy SAF Arkansas
3 70 Chris Cole WR Texas A&M

1999

1 31 Al Wilson MLB Tennessee
2 58 Montae Reagor DE Texas Tech
2 61 Lennie Friedman C Duke
3 67 Chris Watson CB Eastern Illinois
3 93 Travis McGriff WR Florida


1998

1 30 Marcus Nash WR Tennessee
2 61 Eric Brown SS Mississippi State
3 91 Brian Griese QB Michigan

1997

1 28 Trevor Pryce DT Clemson
3 67 Dan Neil G Texas

1996

1 15 John Mobley OLB Kutztown
2 44 Tory James DB Louisiana State
3 65 Detron Smith RB Texas A&M
3 78 Mark Campbell DT Florida

1995

No selections in first 3 rounds

Analysis of Shanahan's Draft Tendencies (http://www.theomfield.com/2010/02/analysis-of-shanahans-draft-tendencies.html)

[Hootie]

hey OTWP...

you think I should throw down $50 on Berry at #4 at 9:1 odds?

[bowener]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to **** us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Washington - Berry (****ed if they pick him - no OL)

Kansas City - ****ed

FYP

[OnTheWarpath15]

hey OTWP...

you think I should throw down $50 on Berry at #4 at 9:1 odds?

If I had the money, I'd consider it. Like I've pointed out, I'm worried about Washington, or someone moving up to Washington's spot.

What's the vig?

[LaChapelle]

Three 2nds in 2 years for QBs
don't seem likely

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Trade aside, I'm scared shitless that Washington is going to **** us right in the ass tonight.

STL - Bradford
Detroit - Suh
Tampa - McCoy
Washington - Berry

Kansas City - ****ed

If the Chiefs are set on taking an OT, then I would prefer this scenario. At least Okung is still sitting on the board. Oh, and he is not Tait, he is going to be a good LT.

Now, I would still prefer Berry, but so long as it isn't Bulaga.... I am relieved if not happy.

[Reaper16]

Heh, the poll results didn't prove as interesting as the OP may have hoped.