View Full Version : Chiefs Scouts Inc.: Ranking the top pass-rushers - Hali # 9
Tamba Hali, LB, Chiefs: Hali doesn’t get the credit he deserves or the accolades of the others on this list. In fact, Kansas City has really struggled to get after opposing quarterbacks over the last few years. But don’t blame Hali. He has recently blossomed into a great 3-4 outside linebacker after spending time as a defensive end in Herm Edwards’ Cover 2 scheme. The Chiefs are starting to get some recognition. Go out of your way to watch Hali. You will not be disappointed.
:clap:
http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_/id/17528/scouts-inc-ranking-the-top-pass-rushers
Red Brooklyn
10-07-2010, 02:00 PM
Nice.
Jared Allen is #8, too. Sweet.
Hydrae
10-07-2010, 02:14 PM
Jared Allen is #8, too. Sweet.
Maybe we kept the right one of the two? :hmmm:
Oh wait, that can't be or it would mean Carl did something right.
Rudy tossed tigger's salad
10-07-2010, 02:15 PM
Where is Manny Lawson?
Quesadilla Joe
10-07-2010, 02:17 PM
They didn't even mention the reigning sack champ and best pass rusher in the NFL. FAIL.
-King-
10-07-2010, 02:21 PM
They didn't even mention the reigning sack champ and best pass rusher in the NFL. FAIL.
How many sacks does that midget have so far?
pkane
10-07-2010, 02:55 PM
They didn't even mention the reigning sack champ and best pass rusher in the NFL. FAIL.
Sure they did, in the honorable mention. ROFL
Dante84
10-07-2010, 02:57 PM
They didn't even mention the reigning sack champ and best pass rusher in the NFL. FAIL.
hai.
Rausch
10-07-2010, 03:02 PM
Maybe we kept the right one of the two? :hmmm:
...
http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0905/you-you-stfu-military-funny-pointing-demotivational-poster-1243745077.jpg
Fansy the Famous Bard
10-07-2010, 03:02 PM
So you have the Greatest Left Tackle in the history of the game. The greatest Pass rusher in the NFL. The future greatest coach in the history of football.
Yet, The Denver Broncos are still not very good. Something is not quite adding up.......
Hydrae
10-07-2010, 03:04 PM
...
http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0905/you-you-stfu-military-funny-pointing-demotivational-poster-1243745077.jpg
ROFL
ModSocks
10-07-2010, 03:05 PM
So you have the Greatest Left Tackle in the history of the game. The greatest Pass rusher in the NFL. The future greatest coach in the history of football.
Yet, The Denver Broncos are still not very good. Something is not quite adding up.......
The Messiah hasn't taken the field yet....
sedated
10-07-2010, 03:07 PM
how many people on CP said Hali would/could NEVER be a good OLB? IIRC, the coaching staff was getting ripped up and down for that move.
They didn't even mention the reigning sack champ and best pass rusher in the NFL. FAIL.
I would guess that's because he doesn't play in the NFL at the present time.
beach tribe
10-07-2010, 03:47 PM
how many people on CP said Hali would/could NEVER be a good OLB? IIRC, the coaching staff was getting ripped up and down for that move.I didn't rip the coaching staff because I welcomed the switch to the 3-4, and Hali's role in it would either be as a rush backer or to be traded for draft picks that wouldn't come anywhere close to equaling the value of the late 1st that we used on him.
That said, I AM guilty of having serious doubts about whether he could be successful, and actually kind of gave up on the guy after his stint at RDE, following the JA trade. LTs were just swallowing him.
Dude has proven me wrong. He's better at OLB that he ever was at DE. especially RDE. If he continues this way, or (OMG) gets better, our secondary is going to start devouring QBs. I'm already set on the fact that our secondary is going to be...just sick. Adding another legit pass rusher, would send Hali, and our secondary into elite territory.
Have you guys been watching Hali's hands? As soon as the LT punches, Hali slaps their hands away like Fn Bruce Lee. His #s are no fluke or streaky anomaly. I know he had 3 in this last game, but he is constantly pressuring, which is why another pass rusher will push him over the wall. Dude has developed into a non-stop terror
Pasta Little Brioni
10-07-2010, 05:05 PM
Very well deserved :clap:
BWillie
10-07-2010, 05:14 PM
Dude, at the very worst Jared Allen is #3. Of course it depends on what schemes you run and Hali is a nice player, but JA is much, much better.
keg in kc
10-07-2010, 05:22 PM
Dude, at the very worst Jared Allen is #3. Of course it depends on what schemes you run and Hali is a nice player, but JA is much, much better.Allen would be awesome if he got to play the packers 16 times a year.
beach tribe
10-07-2010, 05:22 PM
Dude, at the very worst Jared Allen is #3. Of course it depends on what schemes you run and Hali is a nice player, but JA is much, much better.
True, but Charles and Albert have turned out alright. The deal wasn't all that bad, and we at least still have a legitimate pass rusher.
JA was my favorite Chief since DT, but I'm over it. You probably are too. He's gone. It's time to put it to bed.
jjchieffan
10-07-2010, 05:27 PM
Aren't the Williams' on suspension right now? That could be affecting Allens numbers
TheGuardian
10-07-2010, 05:37 PM
Dude, at the very worst Jared Allen is #3. Of course it depends on what schemes you run and Hali is a nice player, but JA is much, much better.
Actually he's not but some Chief fans can't get their lips off of his pelvic bone.
Marcellus
10-07-2010, 05:42 PM
Dude, at the very worst Jared Allen is #3. Of course it depends on what schemes you run and Hali is a nice player, but JA is much, much better.
What big play at a crucial time in any game has Allen ever made?
Marcellus
10-07-2010, 05:42 PM
I would guess that's because he doesn't play in the NFL at the present time.
LMAO
I don't know how to get the pic attached but that's funny.
TheGuardian
10-07-2010, 05:49 PM
Aren't the Williams' on suspension right now? That could be affecting Allens numbers
Nope. Not suspended. He just isn't as great as some Chief fans think he is.
sedated
10-07-2010, 06:13 PM
Hali, arguably, has no position on any team. Without a premier pass rusher pushing the pocket toward Hali every play he was unable to really do much damage in the back field, ever.
Edit: He seems good at not leaving the LOS, so maybe they can convince him to play heavy and add 20+ lbs and play DE in a rotation or something. Hopefully he would be strong enough then to hold up his blocker and shed him to make some plays some times.
Tamba is done here. He might fit as a 3-4 end but I doubt it.
DJ will make a good inside backer. Hali will make a poor OLB.
You're faster than Hali, Rain Man. He's not going to be able to cover anyone or show the necessary lateral quickness and speed.
If we do indeed move to the 3-4, it would likely be asking Hali and Dorsey to do things they're simply not physically capable of achieving.
uhhh he sux. peace out
as depth, hali can be an asset
as a starter....not so sure
.
Marcellus
10-07-2010, 06:16 PM
I think Deez take on Hali and Dorsey has been spot on.:)
ElGringo
10-07-2010, 06:24 PM
I liked JA, but since he wasn't here an extended period of time, had no emotional investment in him as a player. Hali is turning into a solid pass rusher (#9, really, well, not so sure about that), and appears to be staying a while, I will enjoy him for hopefully years to come.
BWillie
10-07-2010, 06:46 PM
Actually he's not but some Chief fans can't get their lips off of his pelvic bone.
You honestly think that Tamba Hali is better than Jared Allen???!?!?!?!
ROFL
cabletech94
10-07-2010, 06:46 PM
.
wow, you did some homework.
i'm glad i never say anything stupid. :D
Useful Idiot
10-07-2010, 06:52 PM
Tamba Hali sucks. Mario Williams shouldnt be number 3 either. He mails it in too often.
DeezNutz
10-07-2010, 06:58 PM
I think Deez take on Hali and Dorsey has been spot on.:)
I have been correct about Hali. Can he cover for shit? Does he have the necessary speed and lateral quickness?
Dorsey, well...talent trumps. Looks like I was very wrong there.
(and note my use of "likely" but that's too nuanced, obviously) Again, Hali is a "nice" player. Dude definitely has a role in the league, but he is not and has not been a primary pass rusher.
Marcellus
10-07-2010, 07:03 PM
I have been correct about Hali. Can he cover for shit? Does he have the necessary speed and lateral quickness?
Dorsey, well...talent trumps. Looks like I was very wrong there.
(and note my use of "likely" but that's too nuanced, obviously) Again, Hali is a "nice" player. Dude definitely has a role in the league, but he is not and has not been a primary pass rusher.
If Hali finishes in the top 10 in sacks he did his job. He is doing better in coverage and better against the run.
Lots of games left.
DeezNutz
10-07-2010, 07:06 PM
If Hali finishes in the top 10 in sacks he did his job. He is doing better in coverage and better against the run.
Lots of games left.
Fair enough.
Thus far, his season has looked like this: nothing, nothing, solid. And in the SD game I pointed to a moment that was a microcosm of his career in KC. Got to the QB, wasn't able to wrap up. And, contrary to popular myth, it wasn't because of the lack of push up the middle.
It's because Hali has a recurring problem of not finishing plays.
The Bad Guy
10-07-2010, 07:23 PM
A 3 sack game is considered solid?
What kind of scale is that?
DeezNutz
10-07-2010, 07:28 PM
A 3 sack game is considered solid?
What kind of scale is that?
We're going to play semantics? Really?
Fucking awesome? Unfuckingbelievable? Yes, solid. Good. When that's preceded by nothing and nothing, you'll forgive the conservatism.
Hali is a nice player. Nothing more. And I'm confused why some think this is a criticism.
The Bad Guy
10-07-2010, 07:32 PM
We're going to play semantics? Really?
****ing awesome? Un****ingbelievable? Yes, solid. Good. When that's preceded by nothing and nothing, you'll forgive the conservatism.
Hali is a nice player. Nothing more. And I'm confused why some think this is a criticism.
Semantics? You've hammered the guy forever. So forgive me when I see someone who has heaped a wealth of criticism at the guy not actually give him his due when he has a phenominal game.
DeezNutz
10-07-2010, 07:35 PM
Semantics? You've hammered the guy forever. So forgive me when I see someone who has heaped a wealth of criticism at the guy not actually give him his due when he has a phenominal game.
I don't think I've hammered him. Perhaps it comes off differently from what I intend. I know that I've mocked those who have argued that he's a foundational player. I didn't think he'd be a solid 34 LB, etc.
I would say that I was wrong about how well he'd transition. But those who claimed he'd have "no problem" making the switch were equally wrong.
He's a "fine" player. Nothing more. Nothing less (and I was wrong about this part).
JoeyChuckles
10-07-2010, 07:37 PM
Met Hali, he told me "I'm the greatest", so this can't be true.
BossChief
10-07-2010, 07:44 PM
He is having his best year as a pro and it is no coincidence that comes at a time when we are getting good play from our nose.
Ive said it a few times before, once we get THAT and a solid pass rush opposite him, he can be a 12-15 sack/yr player.
So far this year, he is on pace for like what?....almost 20 sacks?...and he hasn't faced Clady yet....
boogblaster
10-07-2010, 07:55 PM
He is having his best year by far .. hopefully it continues ....
B_Ambuehl
10-07-2010, 08:32 PM
I was right there with the group that didn't think Hali would amount to much as a 3-4 backer but he's proven us all wrong. I don't know what he did last offseason but he is physically a different player. He's quicker, stronger, and more explosive.
One could make a fairly decent argument that he affects a game as much as Allen. Allen is a great finisher. When he gets to the QB he usually gets the sack. Hali seems to get more consistent pressure though.
Does anyone have access to pro football focus that can look up the pressures and hits from the last couple of years? Wouldnt be surprised if Hali is ahead of Allen in those non-sack categories.
Hammock Parties
10-07-2010, 08:34 PM
Hali was at the top of the list for pressures last year, I know that much. He was a few less than Dumervil if memory serves.
Marcellus
10-07-2010, 08:36 PM
I was right there with the group that didn't think Hali would amount to much as a 3-4 backer but he's proven us all wrong. I don't know what he did last offseason but he is physically a different player. He's quicker, stronger, and more explosive.
One could make a fairly decent argument that he affects a game as much as Allen. Allen is a great finisher. When he gets to the QB he usually gets the sack. Hali seems to get more consistent pressure though.
Does anyone have access to pro football focus that can look up the pressures and hits from the last couple of years? Wouldnt be surprised if Hali is ahead of Allen in those non-sack categories.
There is another thread somewhere with those stats and Hali was 2nd or 3rd in the league with pressures. He was ahead of Allen. I will see if I can ind it.
Pressure is only good if it negatively effects the play though, I don;t think that is separated.
Marcellus
10-07-2010, 08:38 PM
Hali was at the top of the list for pressures last year, I know that much. He was a few less than Dumervil if memory serves.
I think he was actually ahead of Dumervil.
Marcellus
10-07-2010, 08:41 PM
Chiefs LB Tamba Hali Could Surpass Broncos LB Elvis Dumervil In 2010
http://cdn0.sbnation.com/profile_images/240996/headshot_tiny.jpg by Joel Thorman (http://www.sbnation.com/users/Joel%20Thorman) on Aug 2, 2010 12:16 PM PDT (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2010/8/2/1601400/chiefs-lb-tamba-hali-could-surpass) in 2010 Kansas City Chiefs Season (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/section/2010-campaign)
Recently I chatted with Bill Barnwell of FootballOutsiders.com (http://www.footballoutsiders.com/) about the 2010 version of the Kansas City Chiefs (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/teams/KAN). FO came out with their 2010 Almanac (http://www.amazon.com/Football-Outsiders-Almanac-2010-Essential/dp/1453671188/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1279989316&sr=8-3)and I was was able to get a sneak peek at it.
It's a fascinating read (http://www.amazon.com/Football-Outsiders-Almanac-2010-Essential/dp/1453671188/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1279989316&sr=8-3) the way they try to break down the games in numbers, similar to Sabermetrics in baseball.
We already know that FO's numbers say the Chiefs will win the AFC West and that their schedule is predicted to be among the easiest in the league.
They also said way back in February that Chiefs OLB Tamba Hali (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/players/2371/Tamba_Hali) is the best pass-rusher in the AFC West (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2010/2/28/1330754/im-convinced-tamba-hali-is-going) -- and that includes Broncos (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/teams/DEN) OLB Elvis Dumervil (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/players/2920/Elvis_Dumervil).
http://cdn1.sbnation.com/images/blog/star-divide.v5e9d7f1.jpg
"I think that the difference between them is much smaller than the public perception of the difference between them," Barnwell told us this week. "Dumervil attacks an offense's weakest point; Hali usually spends most of his time rushing at left tackle, and he does a good job of it; he abused Ryan Clady (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/players/4107/Ryan_Clady) last year, among the league's best left tackles.
"When you add hits and hurries to the equation, Hali had 41.5 quarterback "incidents", and Dumervil had 41. He's better against the run, and with Dumervil playing in front of a far superior secondary, Hali likely had to get to the quarterback quicker."
I've said this week that during training camp Hali is one of those guys with a non-stop motor. He's definitely a coach's favorite because of that and even though the sack numbers may not show it, his hustle is making a difference.
Barnwell, by the way, has a good track record of predicting this sort of stuff.
He wrote in (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/8/14/989286/talking-chiefs-and-stats-with) August of 2009 (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/8/14/989286/talking-chiefs-and-stats-with): "We're very high on Charles, who was far better than either Johnson or Kolby Smith (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2010/8/nfl/players/18964/Kolby_Smith) a year ago. I think the chances of Johnson making it to the Pro Bowl are probably a little below that of Johnson losing his job to Charles altogether. So we'll see, I guess."
Some of you (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/8/14/989286/talking-chiefs-and-stats-with#19685993) didn't think that was possible last year at this time. Maybe we'll see the same result with Hali.
We'll have some more from Barnwell and the FO crew as the week goes on.
Here it is.
DumbHillbillies
10-07-2010, 08:55 PM
Where is Manny Lawson?
Lol...I remember the year he came out and the hype he had.
BossChief
10-07-2010, 09:19 PM
Hali was at the top of the list for pressures last year, I know that much. He was a few less than Dumervil if memory serves.
He has been top three in pressures for three years straight. Dumervil has been top ten, but is a better finisher.
Has his lack of speed and arm length caused him to only get pressures in situations when other pass rushers would have gotten a sack? Sure.
Had quarterbacks ability to step up in the pocket (because of our lack of any rush up the middle) to avoid pressure or just to slide away from him (because there was no other threat) caused an equal amount of his inability to make a pressure a sack....absolutely.
I guarantee you that we haven't seen the best of our kid quite yet.
He has been top three in pressures for three years straight. Dumervil has been top ten, but is a better finisher.
Has his lack of speed and arm length caused him to only get pressures in situations when other pass rushers would have gotten a sack? Sure.
Had quarterbacks ability to step up in the pocket (because of our lack of any rush up the middle) to avoid pressure or just to slide away from him (because there was no other threat) caused an equal amount of his inability to make a pressure a sack....absolutely.
I guarantee you that we haven't seen the best of our kid quite yet.
That will come Dungver week.He owns Clady!That is if Clady has the balls to show up.In that case Smith will "handle" him!
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