KCJ on Moss to KC

[KCJohnny]

Bear with me, I just passed my 10th year on Chiefs Planet... o:-)

I'm for bringing Moss in but I have no delusions that it will repair the calamity at QB. You could give Cassell Jerry Rice and Steve Largent in their primes and he would still put up similar numbers.

Case in point: Brady threw for 50 TDs with the 2007 Pats. With the same exact offense, Cassel threw for 21. He's being paid Peyton Manning type money by Pioli even though in his first year starting he couldn't even get to Tyler Thigpen-level achievement (Thiggy 22 TDs in 11 starts, Cassel 16 in 14). Thigpen was paid the league minimum.

Moss could stretch the field in theory, but what will that really do, if anything? Can Cassel read a defense? Can he call an audible? Can he make his progression reads? What other QB in the NFL throws for 107 yds in regulation time at home against an 0-6 team with the NFL's best rushing attack and best pass protection and is considered 'successful' let alone worth $64 million?

Not sure Moss fixes what ails this offense. But certainly can't hurt the league's #31 passing attack.

KCJ
:arrow:

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/images/photos/001/061/460/105996055_crop_340x234.jpg?1288630747

[Consistent1]

There really isn't much need for much Moss hysteria for Chiefs fans IMO. The waiver process is going to kill it for one. I am also not sure that these guys would take him at this point with the team in at least decent shape. There were so many guys on here 100% against trying to grab Owens, and all he has done is keep fairly quiet and tear it up to a much higher degree than Ochocinco. I know we are winning now, but do you really want to see Moss come in and immediately try to get face time on TV leading chants in the locker room like the crap that he pulled when he thought he was going to turn the Vikes around? People think that Haley is a hardcore mo-fo that can handle him, but whatever goes on in in Randy's head at this point isn't going to be affected by what he would surely see as a "green" head coach. Then if we lose a couple games....well, ya know.

[KCJohnny]

Good points, Consistent1. My take is that Moss is arguably still the one of the best WRs in the NFL who can get beyond coverage on play-action. With KC averaging 190 ypg on the ground, you'd think we'd at least have a decent play-action game, right? Wrong. Chiefs are ranked #31 in passing. Moss hasn't caught many passes this year but he still score TDs.

[SLAG]

If Duane Washington can contain moss in 2005 - we don't need him today

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Moss > Chambers

I'm all for it.

As Consistent1 said , it's mute because he'll never fall to us in the waiver process.

[KCJohnny]

I tend to think of Chambers as a pretty good WR if he has a QB who can get him the ball. I saw Chambers open several times vs Buffalo while Cassel was throwing at the RB's feet or into double coverage. You can't blame Chambers for the targets he never got unless he can't separate from defenders, which was not the case vs. the hapless Bills' D.

I mean think about it. At home against an 0-6 team when you have the NFL's best OL for pass protection and RBs getting 274 yards. And at the end of regulation, KC has 107 passing yards???????

Those stats also expose Haley for what he is - the beneficiary of the gaudy numbers put up by Warner/Fitzgerald/Boldin/Hightower/Breaston and decidedly not the offensive genuis Pioli must have thought him to be. How can you have the NFL's best ground game and your pass O is second to last? Genius?

[Hammock Parties]

Thank you, Captain Obvious.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

I didn't realize Johnny was a Captain now.

[Reaper16]

Thank you, Captain Obvious.
Obvious is a huge improvement for him. I'm sort of proud.

[Ebolapox]

this thread just reiterates what we've known all along. kcjohnny is a fucking idiot.

[Simply Red]

serving the country > serving the planet.


;)

[Dartgod]

Those stats also expose Haley for what he is - the beneficiary of the gaudy numbers put up by Warner/Fitzgerald/Boldin/Hightower/Breaston and decidedly not the offensive genuis Pioli must have thought him to be. How can you have the NFL's best ground game and your pass O is second to last? Genius?
All those stats prove is how inept Cassel is. It has nothing to do with Haley's coaching ability.

And you misspelled genious.

[stevieray]

there are no absolutes in football. one player at one point in time with another team doesn't mean much. just like stats aren't bigger than the game.


...the other I thing I think is weird, which never applies in real life, is somes obssession with how much someone earns. its' none of your/our business.

[Fire Me Boy!]

Moss > Chambers

I'm all for it.

As Consistent1 said , it's mute because he'll never fall to us in the waiver process.

Please see below.

mute
/myut/ [myoot] adjective, mut·er, mut·est, noun, verb, mut·ed, mut·ing.
–adjective
1. silent; refraining from speech or utterance.
2. not emitting or having sound of any kind.
3. incapable of speech; dumb.
4. (of letters) silent; not pronounced.

moot
/mut/ [moot]
–adjective
1. open to discussion or debate; debatable; doubtful: a moot point.
2. of little or no practical value or meaning; purely academic.
3. Chiefly Law . not actual; theoretical; hypothetical.

[penchief]

I wonder if Coach Haley gets credit for having the best running attack in the NFL? It's called playing to your strengths and making the most out of what you have to work with. In case you didn't know, KCJ, that's good coaching.

[burt]

I am afraid to post while English Nazi's are watching!

[Fire Me Boy!]

I am afraid to post while English Nazi's are watching!

I generally am not a grammar Nazi, but seriously...... that wasn't even the right word!

Post away. I've gotta get to work anyway. :)

[BigVE]

I tend to think of Chambers as a pretty good WR if he has a QB who can get him the ball. I saw Chambers open several times vs Buffalo while Cassel was throwing at the RB's feet or into double coverage. You can't blame Chambers for the targets he never got unless he can't separate from defenders, which was not the case vs. the hapless Bills' D.

I mean think about it. At home against an 0-6 team when you have the NFL's best OL for pass protection and RBs getting 274 yards. And at the end of regulation, KC has 107 passing yards???????

Those stats also expose Haley for what he is - the beneficiary of the gaudy numbers put up by Warner/Fitzgerald/Boldin/Hightower/Breaston and decidedly not the offensive genuis Pioli must have thought him to be. How can you have the NFL's best ground game and your pass O is second to last? Genius?


Well, a couple of things. First off, Haley is NOT the offensive coordinator in KC...Weis is. It has been pointed out many times that Haley has handed over the offense to Weis and is concentrating on overall coaching of the games. 2nd, if you were the OC in AZ a few years ago and had Warner, a former MVP and potential HOF'er throwing the THOSE guys OF COURSE your going the sling the ball all over the place...they hardly ran the ball and didnt really need to. NO comparison what so ever. Totally different situation in KC now...weak QB play, average to below average WR's and standout RB's and O'line....we will run the ball and struggle to pass and at this point it's not Haley's COACHING that is to blame for that.

[burt]

I generally am not a grammar Nazi, but seriously...... that wasn't even the right word!

Post away. I've gotta get to work anyway. :)

actually, I thought your correction was very funny.

[Hammock Parties]

KCJOhnny is a moron.

He probably thinks Herm could ride this team's talent to the Super Bowl with his genious Bucball coaching.

That's why he rags on Haley.

[burt]

Well, ...weak QB play, not Haley's COACHING that is to blame for that.

FYP

[burt]

KCJOhnny is a moron.

He probably thinks Herm could ride this team's talent to the Super Bowl with his genious Bucball coaching.

That's why he rags on Haley.

I disagree. It's just fun to rag on Haley. and our QB, Grbac light.....

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

actually, I thought your correction was very funny.

Me two!

[burt]

Me two!

I think that you and I are very easily entertained.......

[TimeForWasp]

I tend to think of Chambers as a pretty good WR if he has a QB who can get him the ball. I saw Chambers open several times vs Buffalo while Cassel was throwing at the RB's feet or into double coverage. You can't blame Chambers for the targets he never got unless he can't separate from defenders, which was not the case vs. the hapless Bills' D.

I mean think about it. At home against an 0-6 team when you have the NFL's best OL for pass protection and RBs getting 274 yards. And at the end of regulation, KC has 107 passing yards???????

Those stats also expose Haley for what he is - the beneficiary of the gaudy numbers put up by Warner/Fitzgerald/Boldin/Hightower/Breaston and decidedly not the offensive genuis Pioli must have thought him to be. How can you have the NFL's best ground game and your pass O is second to last? Genius?


you are not playing a teams record, you are playing the team, then, you get the record

[milkman]

I mean think about it. At home against an 0-6 team when you have the NFL's best OL for pass protection and RBs getting 274 yards. And at the end of regulation, KC has 107 passing yards???????

Those stats also expose Haley for what he is - the beneficiary of the gaudy numbers put up by Warner/Fitzgerald/Boldin/Hightower/Breaston and decidedly not the offensive genuis Pioli must have thought him to be. How can you have the NFL's best ground game and your pass O is second to last? Genius?

The NFL's best OL for protection?

This OL, while improved is certainly not the best.

Credit for the low number of sacks goes to the coaching that you want to deride.

Weis has accomplished the near impossible in getting Cassel to get the ball out much quicker than he ever has in the past.

Now, why don't you tell us how much you muss Cunther?

[Sully]

Kris Wilson should be our QB/HC!!!

[BigMeatballDave]

I tend to think of Chambers as a pretty good WR if he has a QB who can get him the ball. I saw Chambers open several times vs Buffalo while Cassel was throwing at the RB's feet or into double coverage. You can't blame Chambers for the targets he never got unless he can't separate from defenders, which was not the case vs. the hapless Bills' D.

Thats odd. Were you at the game? Someone here was at the game and said Chambers was not getting open.

[keg in kc]

I'm almost tempted to take him off ignore just for a laugh.

[loochy]

I am afraid to post while English Nazi's are watching!

Well, while we are at it, consider this:

The correct usage here would be Nazis. Apostrophes are used to indicate possession or a contraction. Apostrophes should not be used for plurals.

[RustShack]

Well KCJ, I would assume that we keep Moss for more than one year. Also Cassel will likely have to restructure his contract or will be hitting the road soon. I would assume Pioli isn't going to keep him around with that contract if he isn't winning games himself. He also could get hurt, in which case Croyle steps in. If Croyle has the #1 rushing attack, Moss, Bowe, Moeaki, and McCluster... its game over.

[loochy]

If Croyle has the #1 rushing attack, Moss, Bowe, Moeaki, and McCluster... its game over.

Until he breaks. Then what? How will Palko fare?

[|Zach|]

Brutal reception from the board on a thread made by an old time CP'er achievement unlocked.

http://cdn.medialib.computerandvideogames.com/screens/screenshot_213536_thumb300.jpg

[Deberg_1990]

heh, KCJohnny.....God Bless him...

Always good for a few laughs.

[milkman]

Well KCJ, I would assume that we keep Moss for more than one year. Also Cassel will likely have to restructure his contract or will be hitting the road soon. I would assume Pioli isn't going to keep him around with that contract if he isn't winning games himself. He also could get hurt, in which case Croyle steps in. If Croyle has the #1 rushing attack, Moss, Bowe, Moeaki, and McCluster... its game over.

What has Croyle ever done to make anyone think he has any more upside than Cassel?

They are virtually interchangable useless bastards.

[keg in kc]

What has Croyle ever done to make anyone think he has any more upside than Cassel?

They are virtually interchangable useless bastards.All NFL backups are magical creatures with laser-guided shoulder-mounted pigskin launchers who would never ever make errors in games if only they could just get on the field. They are hall of famers waiting to happen, they are the greener grass in your neighbor's lawn, they are the fairer days gone by, they are all that is and ever has been good in the world.

[LaChapelle]

Some Vikings players on board with dumping Moss

Posted by Mike Florio on November 2, 2010 9:33 AM ET

Though initial reports suggests that Vikings players generally disagreed with the decision to cut Randy Moss (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NFL&id=1655), Michael Silver of Yahoo! Sports reports that, when coach Brad Childress explained the situation to the team, "several" nodded approval (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ms-mossbehavior110210).

Though Randy's bizarre post-game press conference on Sunday was likely the catalyst for change, Silver reports that "Moss had alienated some of his teammates with his brash, entitled behavior, most glaringly in an incident that occurred in the team's locker room last Friday afternoon."

Moss, per Silver, berated workers from a local restaurant that catered the team's Friday afternoon meal.

"What the [expletive]?" Moss reportedly said. "Who ordered this crap? I wouldn't feed this to my dog!"

Here's how an eyewitness explained the situation to Silver: "It was brutal. The truth is, he deserved to be cut after that. It was such an uncomfortable moment. You know that feeling where you just can tell someone feels so small? That's what it was like being there.

"This wasn't a chain - it was a mom-and-pop restaurant, and you could tell it was their best stuff. They had a special carving station set up, and there were players and other support staff lining up to eat it. And [Moss] is at his locker saying, 'You know, I used to have to eat that crap -- but now I've got money.' You just felt so sad for them. I had never seen anyone treated like that.

"And by the way, the food was actually really good."

This kind of stuff is old hat for Moss, when his true nature isn't otherwise suppressed by playing on a team that is chasing a championship. The Vikings experienced the behavior during his first stint with the team, when he berated key sponsors on a team bus.

That's why, even though Childress may have made the right call, Childress should be blamed for bringing Moss to town in the first place. They knew or should have known that the guy is/was/always will be trouble. And now they've handed to the Patriots a third-round draft pick for the privilege of re-learning in a month something that the organization previously had seven seasons to figure out.

[kstater]

I didn't realize Johnny was a Captain now.

LMAO

[MahiMike]

Those stats also expose Haley for what he is - the beneficiary of the gaudy numbers put up by Warner/Fitzgerald/Boldin/Hightower/Breaston and decidedly not the offensive genuis Pioli must have thought him to be. How can you have the NFL's best ground game and your pass O is second to last? Genius?

I'm sorry but that is ignorant. Arizona had a passing attack offense because they had Warner, Boldin and Larry. Here, our best players are clearly the RB's and we're using the Parcells scheme. If anything, you have to say that Haley knows how to recognize his talent and schemes for it. Why on earth do we need to pass for more than 100 yds when we can run for almost 300? Haley's strategy has us at 5-2 and one bad call and one drop away from 7-0. A little respect is in store.

[Reerun_KC]

All NFL backups are magical creatures with laser-guided shoulder-mounted pigskin launchers who would never ever make errors in games if only they could just get on the field. They are hall of famers waiting to happen, they are the greener grass in your neighbor's lawn, they are the fairer days gone by, they are all that is and ever has been good in the world.

That was pretty good!

[Reerun_KC]

What has Croyle ever done to make anyone think he has any more upside than Cassel?

They are virtually interchangable useless bastards.

:hmmm:

Pretty much...

[Chiefnj2]

Some Vikings players on board with dumping Moss

Posted by Mike Florio on November 2, 2010 9:33 AM ET

Though initial reports suggests that Vikings players generally disagreed with the decision to cut Randy Moss (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NFL&id=1655), Michael Silver of Yahoo! Sports reports that, when coach Brad Childress explained the situation to the team, "several" nodded approval (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ms-mossbehavior110210).

Though Randy's bizarre post-game press conference on Sunday was likely the catalyst for change, Silver reports that "Moss had alienated some of his teammates with his brash, entitled behavior, most glaringly in an incident that occurred in the team's locker room last Friday afternoon."

Moss, per Silver, berated workers from a local restaurant that catered the team's Friday afternoon meal.

"What the [expletive]?" Moss reportedly said. "Who ordered this crap? I wouldn't feed this to my dog!"

Here's how an eyewitness explained the situation to Silver: "It was brutal. The truth is, he deserved to be cut after that. It was such an uncomfortable moment. You know that feeling where you just can tell someone feels so small? That's what it was like being there.

"This wasn't a chain - it was a mom-and-pop restaurant, and you could tell it was their best stuff. They had a special carving station set up, and there were players and other support staff lining up to eat it. And [Moss] is at his locker saying, 'You know, I used to have to eat that crap -- but now I've got money.' You just felt so sad for them. I had never seen anyone treated like that.

"And by the way, the food was actually really good."

This kind of stuff is old hat for Moss, when his true nature isn't otherwise suppressed by playing on a team that is chasing a championship. The Vikings experienced the behavior during his first stint with the team, when he berated key sponsors on a team bus.

That's why, even though Childress may have made the right call, Childress should be blamed for bringing Moss to town in the first place. They knew or should have known that the guy is/was/always will be trouble. And now they've handed to the Patriots a third-round draft pick for the privilege of re-learning in a month something that the organization previously had seven seasons to figure out.

The food server should have just said "The food is delicious and nutritious. If you eat some, maybe you'll have enough energy to give 100% the entire game, and not just when you feel like it."

[JTagg7754]

LOL

You guys want Moss?? That's hilarious. By all means, take him!! I hope he comes to KC. It's gonna make your team worse.

[|Zach|]

LOL

You guys want Moss?? That's hilarious. By all means, take him!! I hope he comes to KC. It's gonna make your team worse.

Who are you?

[JTagg7754]

Who are you?

JTagg7754

I figured that would be the most obvious fact about me.

EDIT: Then again, if I could figure out how to upload an avatar, it'd be a little bit more clear as to who I am. Do you have to post a certain amount of times first?

[|Zach|]

JTagg7754

I figured that would be the most obvious fact about me.

It isn't.

[Phobia]

...the other I thing I think is weird, which never applies in real life, is somes obssession with how much someone earns. its' none of your/our business.

As a general rule, yes. But when you're talking about a football team that has a salary cap and there is only so much of the pie to divvy up - it's everybody's business. Same thing for publicly traded companies - executive salary and bonuses are our business if you're a shareholder or considering purchasing stock in that company.

[Phobia]

I'm almost tempted to take him off ignore just for a laugh.

This is one of his best threads of all time. He hasn't even brought religion or military service into the discussion.... yet.

[MahiMike]

Those stats also expose Haley for what he is - the beneficiary of the gaudy numbers put up by Warner/Fitzgerald/Boldin/Hightower/Breaston and decidedly not the offensive genuis Pioli must have thought him to be. How can you have the NFL's best ground game and your pass O is second to last? Genius?

I'm sorry but that is ignorant. Arizona had a passing attack offense because they had Warner, Boldin and Larry. Here, our best players are clearly the RB's and we're using the Parcells scheme. If anything, you have to say that Haley knows how to recognize his talent and schemes for it. Why on earth do we need to pass for more than 100 yds when we can run for almost 300? Haley's strategy has us at 5-2 and one bad call and one drop away from 7-0. A little respect is in store.

[Dave Lane]

What has Croyle ever done to make anyone think he has any more upside than Cassel?

They are virtually interchangable useless bastards.

Completely.

[Dave Lane]

This is one of his best threads of all time. He hasn't even brought religion or military service into the discussion.... yet.

Anything about a bronze star?

[KCJohnny]

I wonder if Coach Haley gets credit for having the best running attack in the NFL? It's called playing to your strengths and making the most out of what you have to work with. In case you didn't know, KCJ, that's good coaching.

Uh, $64 million for a guy who gains 107 yds passing against an 0-6 team at home with the league's best pass protection and top running game? C'mon, this is not that hard to figure out.

[KCJohnny]

Well, a couple of things. First off, Haley is NOT the offensive coordinator in KC...Weis is. It has been pointed out many times that Haley has handed over the offense to Weis and is concentrating on overall coaching of the games. 2nd, if you were the OC in AZ a few years ago and had Warner, a former MVP and potential HOF'er throwing the THOSE guys OF COURSE your going the sling the ball all over the place...they hardly ran the ball and didnt really need to. NO comparison what so ever. Totally different situation in KC now...weak QB play, average to below average WR's and standout RB's and O'line....we will run the ball and struggle to pass and at this point it's not Haley's COACHING that is to blame for that.

Fair 'nuff, BigVE. But honestly, don't you expect the coaching staff to do more than 'cover' for Cassel by leaning on rushing, defense and STs? I mean, if he was getting the league minimum, I'd be sympathetic. But he's getting Brady/Manning/Rogers type money for Leaf/Russell type performances. Maybe my disapproval is misplaced (full disclosure, I am not a Haley fan). KC had ten points at the end of regulation against one of the league's most porous defenses - is that all the OC or is the HC culpable for any of that?

[KCJohnny]

Why on earth do we need to pass for more than 100 yds when we can run for almost 300? Haley's strategy has us at 5-2 and one bad call and one drop away from 7-0. A little respect is in store.

Uh, points? At the end of regulation we had 10 points against a very weak defense. Even with nearly 300 yds rushing (nice achievement!) you still need points to win the game. Truth be told, that timeout gimmick negated the Bills' game-winner.

[Hammock Parties]

Why on earth do we need to pass for more than 100 yds

Because it's 2010, not 1910.

[penchief]

Uh, $64 million for a guy who gains 107 yds passing against an 0-6 team at home with the league's best pass protection and top running game? C'mon, this is not that hard to figure out.

Apparently, for you it is. Our quarterback is horrible yet coaching has made him servicable. Our receivers are subpar and drop way too many passes. Even with a lousy quarterback and below average receivers this team is 5-2 and is the top rushing team in the league. I'd say that's pretty damn good coaching.

[Dave Lane]

KCJ is unfamiliar with the term coaching. His lips are still attached to Gunthers nutsack and likely will never be removed.

I think the team of coaches we have are why the Chiefs are 5-2 period end of discussion. I shudder to think how bad Herm could mess this up. I'm thinking he would have been 2-5 with his crack team of assistant coaches, if that.

[Coogs]

Uh, points? At the end of regulation we had 10 points against a very weak defense. Even with nearly 300 yds rushing (nice achievement!) you still need points to win the game. Truth be told, that timeout gimmick negated the Bills' game-winner.

A case could be made that going to the pass cost us points against the Bills. If we had continued to run the ball on the Bills half of the field like we did on our half, who knows ow many points we might have ended up with. My guess is more than 10... but we will never know.

[milkman]

Fair 'nuff, BigVE. But honestly, don't you expect the coaching staff to do more than 'cover' for Cassel by leaning on rushing, defense and STs? I mean, if he was getting the league minimum, I'd be sympathetic. But he's getting Brady/Manning/Rogers type money for Leaf/Russell type performances. Maybe my disapproval is misplaced (full disclosure, I am not a Haley fan). KC had ten points at the end of regulation against one of the league's most porous defenses - is that all the OC or is the HC culpable for any of that?

I didn't think it possible, but I believe you've grown even more stupid.

[Chiefs Pantalones]

Wow.

Thread = fail before it even started.

[Earthling]

I'm for bringing Moss in but I have no delusions that it will repair the calamity at QB. You could give Cassell Jerry Rice and Steve Largent in their primes and he would still put up similar numbers.

If you truely believe this then why would you support bringing Moss in here with all his garbage and downside? I mean as you stated Cassell would just continue to put up similar numbers....

[KCJohnny]

If you truely believe this then why would you support bringing Moss in here with all his garbage and downside? I mean as you stated Cassell would just continue to put up similar numbers....

Because Moss scores TDs. But you are correct on my point: Cassel is not NFL starting QB material. The addition of Moss would have put the arguement to bed for good: the problem is #7.

[penchief]

Because Moss scores TDs. But you are correct on my point: Cassel is not NFL starting QB material. The addition of Moss would have put the arguement to bed for good: the problem is #7.

So the problem is not Coach Haley. Glad you cleared that up.

[Rausch]

So the problem is not Coach Haley. Glad you cleared that up.

I think Haley can fix his negatives.

I don't think Casshole can...

[penchief]

I think Haley can fix his negatives.

I don't think Casshole can...

My comments were aimed directly at KCJ's somewhat inane claim that the Chiefs subpar passing game was proof that Todd Haley was overrated and nothing more than a product of Warner and Bolden.