Late night bullshit: Chiefs have been THE BEST drafting team from '08 to now.

[Direckshun]

I just compared the Chiefs to three teams that are highly regarded as the best drafting teams in football: the New England Patriots, the Green Bay Packers, and the Pittsburgh Steelers.

I put every player drafted by these four teams in one of two categories: "major contributor" (meaning they play a useful & regular role on the team which is beyond special teams) or "not."

Since 2008:

The Patriots selected 11 major contributors in '08-'10 and had what I would call one of the weakest draft hauls of 2011. The Packers selected 10 major contributors in '08-'10 and had what I would call a very good draft haul in 2011. The Steelers selected 6 major contributors in '08-'10 and had what I would call a weak draft haul in 2011. As for the Chiefs?

14 major contributors in '08-'10. And not only that, but I'd confidently say their 2011 draft haul was one of the top three in the league.

Fuck yes. This team is finally being built the right way, people.

The Steeler list of draftees over the past four years is particularly interesting -- this has not been a good drafting team the last several years. But when they hit, they hit very well: Rashard Mendenhall was the only major contributor they drafted in 2008, Maurkice Pouncey, etc.

The Packers picked up BJ Raji AND Clay Matthews in 2009, but they picked up jack and shit for the rest of the draft.

Kind of interesting to look them over.

Anybody you can think of that's done better than the Chiefs in the last four years? I submit that there isn't such a team.

[keg in kc]

In with the early "Tyson Jackson".

[Hammock Parties]

I thought this thread was scheduled for 2AM. Now what am I supposed to do at 2AM?

[Direckshun]

I thought this thread was scheduled for 2AM. Now what am I supposed to do at 2AM?

Hey now. Don't complain.

Take what you get and be thankful.

[Hammock Parties]

14 major contributors in '08-'10.

Glenn Dorsey
Branden Albert
Brandon Flowers
Brandon Carr
Jamaal Charles
Barry Richardson
Ryan Succop
Eric Berry
Javier Arenas
Tony Moeaki
Matt Cassel
Kendrick Lewis

Where are the other two?

[Titty Meat]

How far along would we have been if Mike Goff was a pro bowler?

[Direckshun]

In with the early "Tyson Jackson".

Right.

And not all major contributors are created equal.

For instance, I did count Tyson Jackson as a major contributor for us, because he does play a very large role on the team.

But I also counted Edelman for the Patriots, and Morgan Burnett for the Packers.

Basically, if a player was on the bubble like any of these players, I threw them into the "major contributor" category.

So any soft numbers you may be perceiving for the Chiefs, are approximately the same for all four teams.

[KurtCobain]

I thought this thread was scheduled for 2AM. Now what am I supposed to do at 2AM?

I have a fresh poop thread in the works. That could be good.

Maybe a poll?

I also have a good question about dental hygiene that could be a thread.

[Hammock Parties]

ok, so you counted Jackson and McCluster.

[Direckshun]

Glenn Dorsey
Branden Albert
Brandon Flowers
Brandon Carr
Jamaal Charles
Barry Richardson
Ryan Succop
Eric Berry
Javier Arenas
Tony Moeaki
Matt Cassel
Kendrick Lewis

Where are the other two?

Well, first of all, that's 12, so we're still doing better than everybody else on the list (and I included some iffy players for all four teams).

Take Matt Cassel off the list.

I included Dexter McCluster, Tyson Jackson, and Jon Asamoah.

[Hammock Parties]

You included a guy who has barely a handful of snaps?

I think you need to reevaluate your standards.

[KurtCobain]

Yeah, Asamoah as a major contributer is pushing it.

[Titty Meat]

You included a guy who has barely a handful of snaps?

I think you need to reevaluate your standards.

Didn't you boink a fat chick from Plenty Of Fish?

[Direckshun]

You included a guy who has barely a handful of snaps?

I think you need to reevaluate your standards.

There is absolutely no doubt that Asamoah will be a starting guard on this team.

Probably this upcoming this season, if not 2012.

And even barring whatever point you believe you're making, it doesn't deflate the central argument of the thread.

No team in the NFL has drafted better than the Chiefs since 2008.

[Direckshun]

Yeah, Asamoah as a major contributer is pushing it.

Take him off the list, then. No skin off my taint.

Take Edelman and Quarless and Burnett. The Chiefs still rule the NFL Draft since 2008.

[Hammock Parties]

Didn't you boink a fat chick from Plenty Of Fish?

Absolutely not.

[KurtCobain]

So you're saying that no other nfl team has drafted more than 14 major contributers to their team from 08-10?

[Hammock Parties]

Julian Edleman > Asamoah/McCluster

[KurtCobain]

Take him off the list, then. No skin off my taint.

Take Edelman and Quarless and Burnett. The Chiefs still rule the NFL Draft since 2008.

Edelman has been ten times the contributer to his team as asamoah, thus far.

[Direckshun]

So you're saying that no other nfl has drafted more than 14 major contributers to their team from 08-10?

Well, I just took us and the three teams with the best reputation for drafting.

I think if we ran down all teams in the NFL, the Rams and the Bucs would come super close to us. They both drafted pretty damn good in 2011, too.

[Direckshun]

Julian Edleman > Asamoah/McCluster

Edelman has been ten times the contributer to his team as asamoah, thus far.

Yeah, and Clay Matthews has been 100 x's the contributor than Edelman. But they still count the same in this drill because I don't exactly have a quaint way to quantify everything.

Edelman, for the record, is a solid deep threat and dynamic returner. Asamoah is a starting guard, if not now, then very close to now.

[keg in kc]

There's really sort of a limited value to quantifying the draft like this, because talent-poor teams like KC (or TB/StL as you mention later) will draft players who end up as contributors by default. And similarly, teams who are already built may not get as many rookies or young players on the field early in their career, aside from high draft picks (and their contracts....)

However....

Most of the players listed here as contributors would I think be contributors anywhere. They have drafted quite well, even with the disaster that was 2009.

And they'll need to keep doing it if they want to become a Green Bay or a Pissburgh or a New England.

[KurtCobain]

I just counted 13 on the cardinals.

[Titty Meat]

Julian Edleman > Asamoah/McCluster

If you did I wouldn't judge you. How was she?

[Direckshun]

There's really sort of a limited value to quantifying the draft like this, because talent-poor teams like KC (or TB/StL as you mention later) will draft players who end up as contributors by default. And similarly, teams who are already built may not get as many rookies or young players on the field early in their career, aside from high draft picks (and their contracts....)

However....

Most of the players listed here as contributors would I think be contributors anywhere. They have drafted quite well, even with the disaster that was 2009.

And they'll need to keep doing it if they want to become a Green Bay or a Pissburgh or a New England.

Yup.

The Chiefs' draft in 2009 was pretty freaking awful, but even Green Bay and Pittsburgh struck out very recently.

Like I said, the Steelers whiffed entirely in 2008 with the exception of their now Pro Bowl running back in the 1st. And the Packers were pathetic in 2009 with the exception of their now All Pro nose tackle and passrusher, both in the first.

[Direckshun]

I just counted 13 on the cardinals.

Interesting. I'll give them a look for a future thread.

They had, however, what I would consider a weak draft haul in 2011.

[KurtCobain]

12 on the bears AND they traded a buttload of picks for a 'franchise' qb.

[Hammock Parties]

I'm ready for some football so we get some quality Direckshun threads instead of this shit. :evil:

[cdcox]

Well, I just took us and the three teams with the best reputation for drafting.

I think if we ran down all teams in the NFL, the Rams and the Bucs would come super close to us. They both drafted pretty damn good in 2011, too.

You have to look at the impact of players, not just the number of players that are contributors. How long will the impact players be at the top of their game?

To date, Charles has been our best impact player, but RB have short careers.

The next teir we find Berry (up arrow), Flowers, Carr, Dorsey and Albert.

After that the impact falls off fast.

One franchise QB would probably cancel out Charles, Berry, and Flowers, in terms of career-long impact IMO. Still too early to declare us the best, but top 5 is probably not far off.

[KurtCobain]

Bengals and browns also up there in major contributer status.

Cowboys, Broncos, Texans and colts not so great the last three outings.

[RealSNR]

Repost, n00b

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=7752156&postcount=17

[Ming the Merciless]

CHIEFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


FUCK YES MEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


MY GOD I WOULD MAKE LOVE TO ALL OF YOU

[KurtCobain]

Interesting. I'll give them a look for a future thread.

They had, however, what I would consider a weak draft haul in 2011.

Yeah, but I counted guys who shouldn't be major contributers like Skelton and Wells although they are.

You have to take in to count how good the team's record is using this formula I guess.

[RealSNR]

12 on the bears AND they traded a buttload of picks for a 'franchise' qb.
Yeah, but the Bears drink their own pee. Fuck'em

[Hammock Parties]

Seems like there have been more football threads lately.

Planet is getting warmed up.

[Ming the Merciless]

Seems like there have been more football threads lately.

Planet is getting warmed up.

i will unleash my chiefs rage on all non true fans and non believers this season

[Hammock Parties]

RAPE THEM

[Shaid]

I agree we've been good but when you have a team with almost no talent, you're bound to draft a higher percentage of starters. With that said we really have done well if you throw out the abortion in '09.

[RealSNR]

The key is that Pioli drafted like a fucking BOSS in 2011. We had one of the best drafts in the conference.

In two years this team is going to be sick good. Sick, sick, sick good.

[Titty Meat]

The key is that Pioli drafted like a ****ing BOSS in 2011. We had one of the best drafts in the conference.

In two years this team is going to be sick good. Sick, sick, sick good.

This team can be sick good this year if he signs the proper free agents.

[Torpedo Jones]

eric berry will go down as the greatest of all time

[Just Passin' By]

I don't know if you're counting UDFAs, so I won't include them. I don't know your criteria for major contributions, so I'm using special teams player and 20% of snaps, either reached or projected prior to injury. The only exception to that is Edelman, who I included because you put him on your list.

2008:

Mayo (All Pro, played 96.8% of the defensive snaps)
Slater (#1 Special teams player)
Wilhite (Starting CB/Nickel, played 18.5% of the defensive snaps before injury in week 9)



2009:

Chung (Starting S, played 72.3% of the defensive snaps)
Vollmer (Starting RT)
Brace (Rotational DE, played 25.7% of defensive snaps despite injury)
Tate (WR3, 49.6% of the offensive snaps)
Edelman (WR4, 17.2% of the offensive snaps)
Butler (Starting CB/Nickel/Dime, 34.6% of the defensive snaps)
Pryor (backup to Wilfork and DT on some sub packages, 21.5% of defensive snaps)

2010:

McCourty (Pro Bowl as a rookie, 95.4% of the defensive snaps)
Gronkowski (42 catches as a rookie, monster blocker, 74.7% of offensive snaps)
Cunningham (Starting OLB, played 50.9% of the defensive snaps)
Spikes (ILB - paired with Guyton, Spikes v. run, Guyton v. Pass, 31.7% of the defensive snaps, even with 4 game suspension)
Hernandez - (45 catches as a rookie, 48% of offensive snaps)
Mesko - (punter)
Deaderick - (rotational DE, played 20% of the defensive snaps)

http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4691199/2010-patriots-defensive-snap-count

http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4691132/offensive-snaps-for-2010-season


That's 17 for the Patriots. McKenzie and Larsen were cuts, and they ended up playing for the Bucs, with Larsen becoming a starting O-lineman.

I don't have snap count for the Steelers or Packers, so I can't do the same with their picks.

[MagicHef]

By the criteria outlined here, the much-scorned duo of Robert Ayers and Knowshon Moreno would be considered major contributors.

Just sayin'.

[Gonzo]

You've always been a "glass half full" kinda guy, Direkshun.

You see the drafts as a success because we had so many major contributors.
I'm a "glass half empty" kind of guy.
I see this as a more of a glaring problem in that we had to have so many rookies play because we won't sign any free agents worth a shit.

But hey, to each his own. Hopefully the rookies turn into great veterans in 2 more years.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Our drafting is pretty tight. The trading not so much.

[notorious]

Wasted 1st round pick forfeits us from being in this conversation.


This last class has the makings of a very good group which could make up for T. Jackson.

[el borracho]

**** yes. This team is finally being built the right way, people.

Not really. The three teams you mention in the original post all drafted their starting QBs. The Chiefs traded for a backup (who plays like a backup). The Chiefs have acquired some nice players in the last few years, but they have not, IMO, built the team the right way. The Chiefs have, for twenty years now, failed to adequately address the most important position on the field. Until they get that centerpiece, everything else is relatively meaningless.

[notorious]

Not really. The three teams you mention in the original post all drafted their starting QBs. The Chiefs traded for a backup (who plays like a backup). The Chiefs have acquired some nice players in the last few years, but they have not, IMO, built the team the right way. The Chiefs have, for twenty years now, failed to adequately address the most important position on the field. Until they get that centerpiece, everything else is relatively meaningless.

I agree, but until we draft our 1st round QB we can all FAP to Stanzi.

[Okie_Apparition]

It don't mean a thing
if you ain't got that ring

[Chief Faithful]

There's really sort of a limited value to quantifying the draft like this, because talent-poor teams like KC (or TB/StL as you mention later) will draft players who end up as contributors by default. And similarly, teams who are already built may not get as many rookies or young players on the field early in their career, aside from high draft picks (and their contracts....)



How much talent exists and how high your team is in the draft order makes a big difference. That is why I'm interested to see how the 2011 draft pans out because I think it is a better comparison with the Patriots, Packers and Steelers as the teams are now more equal with record and talent.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Oh fuck it, let's just relive the 90's; the economy was good and I was younger and having more fun.