Chiefs Breaking Down Dex. [Archive]

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Micjones

04-12-2012, 11:57 AM

An article ChiefsPlanet will probably hate with the power of a thousand suns.

Running back is a position that still gets talked about here more than a little. The Chiefs currently have Jamaal Charles, Peyton Hillis, and Dexter McCluster as their presumable 3-back combo. Many, like me, are very happy with this group. Others are interested in getting a RB sooner rather than later.

The justification I hear most often for this is that Dex can't play RB in the traditional sense, that he's more of a "gadget player" without a true position. Less often is the argument that he's just not that good a player and was a drastic reach in the 2nd. I'm in the camp that argues that Dex is a solid contributor, and one that we want to keep at RB to maximize his production.

http://l.yimg.com/j/assets/p/sp/getty/cb/fullj.c4cb93a125eb17a7db7ed4faa03fc919/c4cb93a125eb17a7db7ed4faa03fc919-getty-136322158.jpg

But who gives a crap about my OPINION? Not even me, honestly. What do stats say? What does gametape say? Time to find out...

NOTE- For those who don't know, this will be a detailed breakdown of Dex in 2011 based on basic stats, ProFootballFocus stats (h/t Steve), and (most importantly) reviewing the game tape. I watched pretty much every snap Dex took this year for this one, and like always, this isn't a "short" read. Hardcore fans only.

Basic Stats
Let's do this the short way, ok? I think we can all agree that stats, especially basic stats, don't tell us much about a player. So I will defy all my instincts and keep this part short (although to be fair, I suppose I could've just eliminated those last two sentences. And that last one. And that one. OK, let's just move on before I'm caught in a time vortex or something).

Rushing stats: 113 carries, 510 yards (4.5 YPC). 1 TD, 2 fumbles

Receiving stats: 46 catches, 328 yards (7.1 YP Catch), 1 TD.

What do we learn from these stats? Well, I think we've learned one thing right out of the gate: those who say Dex didn't produce were wrong. He had 844 yards of total offense from scrimmage. Compare that to, say, Darren Sproles in his SD years and he stacks up very nicely. Throw in that our offense had a TOTAL of not-quite-5000 yards this seasn and we see that Dex had 17% of our offensive production. That's more than anyone but Dwayne Bowe.

So now that we've put to rest the idea that Dex isn't capable of major contribution, let's look at PFF stats and see what we find.

http://www.sportsgeekery.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/Dexter-McCluster.jpg

PFF Stats

First off, remember that when looking to PFF "grades" that this is NOT an infallible system. It's at least somewhat subjective. Now that that's out of the way, let's talk about Dex's grades. He's rated at 8.5 Overall among RBs, 24th in the NFL. He rates 34th as a receiver among backs (more on that soon), 34th as a runner, and (are you ready to have your mind blown?) 7th as a blocker.

Now I don't know about you, but it was the "blocker" rating that threw me. I didn't expect that, as it's WIDELY held here (and everywhere) that Dex is a liability when protecting the QB. So let's put that in our pocket for now until it's time to break down film. But know that PFF rates Dex as a top 10 blocker. Crazy world.

An interesting fact about Dex: he averaged 7.1 yards per reception, and 6.7 YAC per reception! What does this tell us? It tells us that our widely held fears about Dex's TERRIBLE misuse early on in the season, as well as the playcalling in general, were entirely justified. Of Dex's 334 yards receiving, 313 of them were earned by him after the catch. There could not be a clearer indication that Dex was constantly asked to make something out of nothing.

Additionally, that stat tells me that if Dex were to get the ball with better playcalling and execution, his yards per catch would likely shoot up. Hopefully, we'll better utilize the talents of a guy who can turn something into nothing this year.

Another interesting thing to note is that Dex caught 79.7% of the passes thrown his way. That's an excellent percentage, especially considering who he had throwing him the ball this season. Of course, this could be skewed by the fact that (as shown above) he was catching passes thrown by a guy a few yards away from him.

So far, we see that Dex by and large made his own yards when catching the ball, that he caught most of what came his way, and that he's (apparently) a good blocker. But what about actually, you know, running the ball? You know, the thing that makes most of us hesitate about using him consistently in our rotation? CAN he be part of a successful RB group?

PFF Stats- Rushing

First things first: Dex averaged 2.1 Yards After Contact when running the ball. Without delving into too many comparative statistics, that's bad. Not Thomas Jones bad (he was at 1.4, worst in the league), but bad. No surprise, he's a little dude.

In other areas, though, Dex's PFF stats were largely encouraging. He had 13 "Missed Tackles" (basically, just what it sounds like. Tackles broken or avoided) in 113 attempts. So he's got a 11.5% rating for making guys miss when he runs the ball. While it doesn't place him in quite elite company in the league (MJD is at 16%, for example), it DOES put him comfortably above many very good backs (like Ray Rice, Arian Foster, and Frank Gore to name a few).

So this tells us that despite not being a guy who can get a lot of yards after contact, Dex makes enough guys MISS to still give defenses problems.

Now for the real issue with Dex: can he run between the tackles? The consensus here on AP is "absolutely not" from everything I've read. It's treated as a given that Dex has to get the ball on sweeps or something else to the edge or he is ineffective. So what does PFF say on that subject? I'm glad you asked!

PFF is kind enough to provide a breakdown of runs the RB made and what "gaps" they were attempting to run through. There are 7 different categories: Left End (outside of LT), LT, LG, ML (left of C), MR (right of C), RG, RT, and RE (outside of RT). So, imagine our line and the gaps Dex would've been asked to run through below, and I'll provide the YPC behind each "gap"

LE LT LG ML MR RG RT RE

5.1 7.2 6.8 4.3 2.4 2.3 2.9 4.5

Most concerning is that staggeringly bad numbers from MR to RT. Apparently, we all need to re-think the idea that Asamoah is a good run blocker. Now, in his defense, our other backs had more success running behind him. But to a man, every single RB we marched out there had problems running behind Barry Richardson. He simply was not the road grater we sometimes pretended he was in the running game.

However... You see that Dex averaged 6.8 YPC running between the Albert and Lilja, and 4.3 YPC when running between Lilja and Weigmann. Those who believe that Dex is incapable of running anywhere but the edges are likely blown away by this. Frankly, I was too, and I'm about as hardcore a Dex defender as you'll find on this site.

Long story short... Dex CAN run successfully between the tackles. He did it last year with a line that really, really struggled when run blocking (other than Albert), so there's no reason to believe he'll be anything but better with the HUGE upgrade we got at RT (I mean seriously... HUGE. Especially after looking at how crappy our backs did running behind B-Rich. Everyone KNEW he was bad at pass blocking, but I though he was at least OK at run blocking. I was wrong).

Now we've finished with base stats and PFF stats. Onto the most important aspect of this... game tape. Specifically, I'm going to look for a few things: is Dex a good blocker, can he run between the tackles, how was he affected by the way he was used, and what "worked" with him as a RB? The real question I'm attempting to answer is simple: is Dex good enough at RB to where we want him to get at least 10-12 touches per game?

http://missourisportsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/kc_chiefs_dexter_mccluster-450x282.jpg

Game Tape

This is where the rubber meets the road. I don't care HOW in depth PFF is, or how nerdy we can get using stats and ratios and percentages and whatever else. For me, it mostly comes down to how the guy looks when reviewing the tape. So how does Dex do regarding the issues above? Let's see...

Dex as a Blocker- The first play I watched Dex block, he went low into a blitzing LB and took out his legs. Nice block! The very next play, Dex was blocking again, but this time there were no blitzing LBs. So Dex sat back and waited for a tick, looking at the linemen. He then went to Albert, who has getting pushed back farther than any of the other OL, and applied a technique I'd never seen used... He pushed on ALBERT'S back! He placed his hands squarely on Albert's back and shoved with everything he had. With the additional weight behind him, Albert's backward walk was halted and Cassel got the ball away cleanly (maybe this is a common tactic used by RB's. I just know don't remember ever seeing it before).

Those two plays turned out to be a GREAT summary of why PFF gives Dex good grades as a blocker. He's extremely smart about his blocking. Those two techniques are the ones I saw him use the vast majority of the time he was blocking. Because of his quickness, he's almost always able to get low on a defender and hit him hard enough to slow him down. And the 2nd technique works well when OL are being pushed backward. It seems that even as light as he is, Dex is able to halt the backward movement of an OL being bullrushed.

When not using either of these techniques, Dex is an average blocker. He uses excellent technique and is not at all afraid to sacrifice his body to slow down a defender. The problem is, of course, that that's all he can really do: slow people down. Unless he takes out the legs of a defender, he's not going to stop him. So he needs to be put in a position to where he has time to see a blitzer coming in order to get low on him. Otherwise he gets brushed off. When a defender has an OL beat (say, to the outside) and Dex comes in to help, he'll chuck his body in there and do what he can. But he's just too small to do more than slow a DL down for a second.

All in all, I walked away from the tape with a good understanding of why Dex rates highly as a blocker: unlike many RB's, he puts absolute 100% effort into every block. He kind of has to in order to do anything. You know how every group of friends has that one guy who weighs about a buck forty soaking wet, but when provoked he fights like a demon on PCP and is willing to crack someone over the head with a 2x4 rather than lose? Dex is the Chiefs version of that guy when it comes to blocking. He doesn't have the size or strength to really match up with the guys he's battling, but he makes up for it with CRAZY effort and a willingness to do whatever it takes. BIG thumbs up on this part of his game.

Dex as a Receiver- First and foremost, let me say something to Dex: dude, I'm REALLY sorry how many plays you got hung out to dry early in the season. Seriously, on behalf of the Chiefs and whoever kept calling your number on screens and wheel routes despite teams just HOVERING around you with 2 or 3 defenders... I'm sorry.

Watching the first few games of the year it became apparent that without JC we were a tad screwed at playmaker (at least, from the RB position). So it seemed like Haley overcompensated for a weakness by trying to MAKE it work with Dex. The problem is, when teams are expecting a screen, it just doesn't work. I'd say 80% of the passes that came Dex's way early in the season he had absolutely no chance to do anything after he caught the ball. Ugh.

Another thing... of the passes that Dex didn't haul in (remember, he caught about 80% of what was thrown his way), most of them were intentional throwaways. Don't know how much this means, but it's worth noting that if you don't include passes thrown at his feet (or to Eric Weddle. Ugh, I hated re-watching that play... let's move on) Dex caught 90+ percent of the passes thrown his way.

I feel as though Dex as a receiver out the backfield this year was kind of like watching the movie Immortals. I saw some stuff I liked, and the big time potential was definitely there... and yet, something was lacking. Honestly, I think the injuries to Jamaal Charles, Tony Moeaki, and Jonathan Baldwin really messed with Dex's ability to produce. Defenses were absolutely KEYING on him when he'd come out of the backfield. Throw in the fact that roughly a quarter of the screens ran to him were disgustingly obvious from the get-go and you found a guy in a no-win situation all too often.

However, his ability to make something from nothing is pretty impressive. He's exceptional at making the first defender miss when he gets the ball in space. That explains the fact that virtually all his yards were YAC. Personally, I'm excited to see what Dex can do when he's NOT keyed on by opposing defenses and the playcalling isn't quite so predictable.

One thing that the coaches didn't seem to take advantage of much was how much attention Dex gets when he comes out of the backfield. Teams were constantly shading guys in the direction Dex went. Now, this could be due to the fact that we just didn't have a ton of playmakers out there. or it could be due to the fact that our QB situation was... iffy (was that a kind enough word?).

There were a few changes made in the way Dex was used once Crennel took over. First, I saw him lined up in the slot (and actually thrown to) a couple of times. Honestly, he looks IMPOSSIBLY quick when running routes in the middle of the field, and I imagine we could see more of this next year.

Second, other than the usual wheel routes and screens, Dex came out of the backfield across the middle to catch a few passes, something I don't remember seeing even once with Todd as HC. Again, this was a good wrinkle, and it was pretty effective. It seemed as though the defenses weren't expecting Dex to be in the middle of the field. And why would they? He hadn't been there all year (I'm getting angry again... our playcalling this year may go down as the worst I've ever seen as a fan)!

Hopefully we see a few more changes made this next year, and Daboll can figure out a way to use Dex in the passing game that isn't predictable, and takes advantage of his unique skills. With other players demanding opposing defenses' attention, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Dex caught 60 passes for 800 yards this next year.

http://www.kcchiefsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/DexterMcCluster6.jpg

Dex as a Runner-

Dex is a good runner. I say this without hesitation. His strengths and weaknesses upon watching him aren't altogether surprising. A few things...

It's almost impossible throughout the first half of the season to figure out what Dex can do when taking handoffs that aren't draws or some kind of cutesy trick play. Haley just did not run normal plays for Dex. They only started showing up about Week 8. And even then they were the exception, not the rule. I can say one thing though... Running draws and trick plays does when defenses are EXPECTING those types of plays does not work. Even a little.

After RAC took over, we again saw a change in how Dex was used. First, toss sweeps were used several times each game, after having not made much of an appearance all year. These plays met with mixed success. Another change was an uptick in "normal" running plays. A larger percentage of Dex's carries over the final three games consisted of standard handoffs and stretch plays. These also had mixed success. However, the COMBINATION of sweeps, draws, stretches, and standard handoffs were more successful as a whole than "draws, draws, and more draws" playbook we'd used for Dex until then.

Dex as a runner is interesting to see. Bad news first. If a defender gets an arm around him, he's done for. He lacks JC's vision and fluidity. And of course, there's always the risk of a dude his size getting CRUSHED. Another problem is more of a coaching one: it's tough to tell what he can do as a RB because coaches are trying so hard to use him "creatively." There's not a ton of tape of him running standard plays, so it's tough to say if he can do it.

Based on that limited number of times, though, I'd say that Dex IS capable of being used in a more "standard" fashion. While he'll never be a "move the pile" RB, he runs with a toughness that belies his size and his burst through any hole the OL can make is just as fast as JC's. If there's an opening (whether that opening is to the outside or between the C and LG) Dex gets through it faster than most backs. That ability allows him to gain positive yardage very quickly.

Besides acceleration, Dex has one elite ability: cutting. His ability to cut, whether to go through a hole in the line or to avoid a defender, is absolutely unmatched. Even JC can't make cuts as quickly as Dex can. It's his bread and butter, and when he's in space he nearly always makes the first defender miss to get positive yardage (or at least makes the first defender hit him at such an angle as to allow him to dive for an extra couple of yards).

The key with Dex, whether it's on draws or regular running plays, is blocking (cue 50 of you saying "DUH!"). Yes, blocking is a big deal for any RB, but with Dex it becomes imperative. He's unusual in that with GOOD blocking he can get you 3-4 more yards than the average RB due to his exceptional acceleration. The flip side of this is that with BAD blocking he's more liable than most RB's to lose yardage because he's so easy to bring down once a defensive player gets ahold of him

So snapshot version of Dex, comparing him to JC to make things easy: Just as good acceleration. Actually a superior cutter. Doesn't have as good of vision or patience, though. Also, isn't as fluid going through holes and is more easily knocked off balance (JC just seems to glide out there, while Dex is actually running like the rest of us mortals). Finally, not nearly as good at shrugging off contact, although he's just as good at AVOIDING contact.

Final Word

Dex is a playmaker who produced decent stats in a terrible situation. Game tape backs this up: the dude was horribly misused and put in a position to fail constantly. Despite that, he produced. Personally, I want Dex getting the ball 12 times a game.

As far as durability goes, allow me to make one final point. I saw Dex get hit HARD more than a few times. And every time, he bounced back up instantly. He actually gets nicked up less often than JC does. Dude's tough as nails and can handle getting the rock consistently.

More than ever, I say our RB rotation is set for this year, and any move we make that takes carries and catches from Dex is a bad one. Get him the ball 12 times a game with some decent playcalling, and he'll be getting us at least a thousand yards from scrimmage, and likely more.

Oh, and one more thing...

http://nimg.sulekha.com/sports/original700/dexter-mccluster-2010-9-14-0-24-32.jpg

The Story. (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2012/4/11/2942890/breaking-down-the-chiefs-dexter-mccluster#storyjump)

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:00 PM

All that shit is meaningless. He's a dime a dozen RB3. Fuck him.

http://i40.tinypic.com/2n71cnq.jpg

Pasta Little Brioni

04-12-2012, 12:01 PM

Uh-oh :popcorn:

Bugeater

04-12-2012, 12:01 PM

Damn, that's a lot of words.

suds79

04-12-2012, 12:02 PM

Nice 3rd down back.

Done.

KCUnited

04-12-2012, 12:03 PM

I nearly made it through the first paragraph but got tripped up on the first sentence.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:03 PM

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:04 PM

he'll definitely contribute to his team if used properly.

I agree. I look forward to his contributions as the 7th option on our offense.

Warrior5

04-12-2012, 12:06 PM

He still needs a haircut.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:08 PM

when he's in space he nearly always makes the first defender miss to get positive yardage

This is a flat out fucking lie and whoever wrote this needs to die.

the Talking Can

04-12-2012, 12:08 PM

yeah, not reading that

but I will summarize:

Dex is such a good WR that the team that drafted him as a WR moved him to RB, then signed Breaston and drafted a WR in the first round

Dex is such a good RB that with Charles out last year he was still our #3 RB, and this year we signed Hillis to be our #2 RB...

did I miss anything?

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:08 PM

Chiefs fans are incorrigible.

In one breath they crucify Bowe for a perceived lack of effort.
McCluster gives 110% on every play and he's the Al Sharpton of the NFL.

Okay gang.

OnTheWarpath15

04-12-2012, 12:08 PM

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:08 PM

Get him the ball 12 times a game

LMAO LMAO LMAO LMAO

What the FUCK?

Find me a RB3 in this league who touches it 192 times.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:11 PM

You know, if he were actually valuable enough to be taken with the 36th pick in one of the deepest drafts in recent memory, people wouldn't need to write these novels trying to defend the pick.

You sure as hell don't see "Breaking Down Rob Gronkowski" articles on PatriotsPlanet, attempting to justify the pick - ironically 6 after Dex.

Why?

Because he was worth being taken that high.

Or it might be because the general consensus in Chiefs Kingdom is that he's a colossal bust (which is known to everyone who covers this team). And that idea, might not line up so neatly with the facts.

the Talking Can

04-12-2012, 12:12 PM

Chiefs fans are incorrigible.

In one breath they crucify Bowe for a perceived lack of effort.
McCluster gives 110% on every play and he's the Al Sharpton of the NFL.

Okay gang.

Bowe is awesome

Dex isn't

any other questions?

El Jefe

04-12-2012, 12:13 PM

You can't honestly expect us to read all of that, especially considering it's about McCluster.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:14 PM

Bowe is awesome

Dex isn't

any other questions?

Gee that was eloquent.

Coogs

04-12-2012, 12:14 PM

Find me a RB3 in this league who touches it 192 times.

In Matt Cassel wins in 2010 we averaged 39 carries a game. Factor in when he does pass he is know as Captain Checkdown, so 12 touches a game may happen for the #3 RB in KC this season.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:15 PM

You can't honestly expect us to read all of that, especially considering it's about McCluster.

Of course not.

I do think it's a great read though.
Very well written. AP does their homework.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:15 PM

In Matt Cassel wins in 2010 we averaged 39 carries a game. Factor in when he does pass he is know as Captain Checkdown, so 12 touches a game may happen for the #3 RB in KC this season.

No, you are ridiculous. And ignorant as fuck.

RB3s do not touch it that much. Jesus fucking Christ.

OnTheWarpath15

04-12-2012, 12:15 PM

Or it might be because the general consensus in Chiefs Kingdom is that he's a colossal bust (which is known to everyone who covers this team). And that idea, might not line up so neatly with the facts.

If he were taken in the 3rd or 4th round, no one would be complaining. He'd be living up to his draft slot.

Sorry, but nothing I read makes me believe he was worth the 36th pick in an insanely deep draft.

It's fluff, and wouldn't be necessary if he were taken later, or was a significant contributor.

the Talking Can

04-12-2012, 12:15 PM

Gee that was eloquent.

allow me to clarify

after failing as a WR, the team has made him a #3 RB

name other #3 RBs in the league that fans spend this much time pulling their puds over?

I'll give a shit when the team that drafted him stops trying to replace him

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:16 PM

No, you are ridiculous. And ignorant as ****.

RB3s do not touch it that much. Jesus ****ing Christ.

Would 130-150 times per season be too much for an RB3?

OnTheWarpath15

04-12-2012, 12:17 PM

Chiefs fans are incorrigible.

In one breath they crucify Bowe for a perceived lack of effort.
McCluster gives 110% on every play and he's the Al Sharpton of the NFL.

Okay gang.

He's worth the 36th pick in a deep draft because he tries hard.

Awesome.

OnTheWarpath15

04-12-2012, 12:17 PM

allow me to clarify

after failing as a WR, the team has made him a #3 RB

name other #3 RBs in the league that fans spend this much time pulling their puds over?

I'll give a shit when the team that drafted him stops trying to replace him

.

Coogs

04-12-2012, 12:18 PM

No, you are ridiculous. And ignorant as fuck.

RB3s do not touch it that much. Jesus fucking Christ.

I'm not joking on the first part. 39 times a game average running the ball on wins in 2010.

Just screwing with you a bit on Dex touching it 12 times a game 'cause I knew it would set you off.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:22 PM

I'm not joking on the first part. 39 times a game average running the ball on wins in 2010.

I don't care. It's meaningless.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:22 PM

If he were taken in the 3rd or 4th round, no one would be complaining. He'd be living up to his draft slot.

I tend to agree.

Where McCluster was drafted weighs heavily into this discussion, but I also don't think it's an "all or nothing" proposition as it often seems around here. A player can be taken higher than he should've been in the Draft, but ALSO be a solid contributing piece of your football team.

Sorry, but nothing I read makes me believe he was worth the 36th pick in an insanely deep draft.

It's fluff, and wouldn't be necessary if he were taken later, or was a significant contributor.

I think it's important to note that he's been misused AND that he's only two years into his career. I'd love to revisit this conversation after this season. Then I'll be prepared to determine whether or not he was a waste of a draft pick. For now...I'll reserve judgment.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:23 PM

He's worth the 36th pick in a deep draft because he tries hard.

Awesome.

You oversimplified my post.

Awesome.

Coogs

04-12-2012, 12:24 PM

I don't care. It's meaningless.

It's what the Chiefs have to do with Matt Cassel at QB. We all know it.

Hog's Gone Fishin

04-12-2012, 12:24 PM

I think Dex would flourish as the feature back. But he's third in line. Anyway , Thats one position we just don't need to draft. Even if Richardson is there.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:24 PM

Would 130-150 times per season be too much for an RB3?

Here's a good idea of what a RB3 does.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WardDe01.htm

That's from the #2 rushing offense in the NFL. 45 carries all season.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:26 PM

Here's a good idea of what a RB3 does.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WardDe01.htm

That's from the #2 rushing offense in the NFL. 45 carries all season.

I said "touches" not "carries".

He could very well split that 130 between carries and catches.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:28 PM

I said "touches" not "carries".

He could very well split that 130 between carries and catches.

:facepalm:

Dex is going to catch 60 fucking balls?

With BOWE, BALDWIN, BREASTON, MOEAKI AND CHARLES in line for catches before him?

Get the fuck out.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:28 PM

This is the main reason I fucking loathe this useless midget and take delight in pounding his reputation into the dirt every chance I get.

Not because he sucks. Not because he is a colossal waste of a #36.

BECAUSE IDIOTS CONSTANTLY DEFEND HIM.

The Franchise

04-12-2012, 12:30 PM

He is at best.....a gadget player.

DJ's left nut

04-12-2012, 12:33 PM

If he were taken in the 5th round, where a guy of his skill set should have been taken, he'd be a nice addition to the team.

As it is, all I see when I watch him play is Terrance Cody, the guy we should've drafted instead, running Charles down from behind and forcing a fumble in a playoff game. Then McCluster, the guy we drafted instead, losing the ball when Lewis hit him.

It's possible that he's not a horrible player. He is, however, a horrible draft pick.

HemiEd

04-12-2012, 12:35 PM

You can't honestly expect us to read all of that, especially considering it's about McCluster.

This.

He is not worth the effort to read all that rationalization.

In fact, he gets me pissed off almost every time he is involved in a play.

2 TDs and 2 fumbles, that ratio is a little high to me.

He is not big enough to be an NFL player, end of story.

the Talking Can

04-12-2012, 12:37 PM

Dex was almost a first round pick, drafted one slot lower than pro-bowl corner Brandon Flowers....

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 12:37 PM

He is at best.....a gadget player.

This.

But aside from that....

Why does an article about Dexter's production have to turn into a bitch fest about where he was drafted?

JFC people, it was going on 3 drafts ago, get over it already.

Does he produce when he touches the ball? His numbers suggest that he does.

There. It's the only argument that matters at this point.

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 12:39 PM

Dex was almost a first round pick, drafted one slot lower than pro-bowl corner Brandon Flowers....

So. Fucking. What.

When it comes that kid, that's all anyone around here can talk about.

Find something else to bitch about, this is old already.

I can't wait for the '12 draft so people can find new shit to nit-pick.

"OMGZ, they reached for Tannehill!"

the Talking Can

04-12-2012, 12:40 PM

So. ****ing. What.

When it comes that kid, that's all anyone around here can talk about.

Find something else to bitch about, this is old already.

I can't wait for the '12 draft so people can find new shit to nit-pick.

"OMGZ, they reached for Tannehill!"

um...it matters

when you draft 5th round picks in the 2nd, it's a bad thing...does that really require an explanation?

El Jefe

04-12-2012, 12:40 PM

So. ****ing. What.

When it comes that kid, that's all anyone around here can talk about.

Find something else to bitch about, this is old already.

I can't wait for the '12 draft so people can find new shit to nit-pick.

"OMGZ, they reached for Tannehill!"

Hey Bro Namath, did your shop start selling parts solely yet? Hows biness been?

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 12:41 PM

Hey Bro Namath, did your shop start selling parts solely yet? Hows biness been?

yup. It's been picking up. We're actually in the middle of expanding our parts line, thanks for asking.

Dr. Gigglepants

04-12-2012, 12:41 PM

This.

He is not worth the effort to read all that rationalization.

In fact, he gets me pissed off almost every time he is involved in a play.

2 TDs and 2 fumbles, that ratio is a little high to me.

He is not big enough to be an NFL player, end of story.

I tend to agree. I wouldn't mind limiting Arenas in the PR game to reduce injury risk and moving Dex to that role full time. Now, if he ends up unable to do that without fumbling and getting broke in half, I have no use for him on the team.
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HemiEd

04-12-2012, 12:41 PM

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:42 PM

:facepalm:

Dex is going to catch 60 ****ing balls?

With BOWE, BALDWIN, BREASTON, MOEAKI AND CHARLES in line for catches before him?

Get the **** out.

Who said 60 of those 130 had to be receptions?

Dayze

04-12-2012, 12:42 PM

my only memory of Dex is on the Monday night game where he ran the Punt back. I remember telling the guy in front of me and my brother "watch this guy...he's quick"....then Boom....he was gone for the TD. We were sitting in the corner endzone where he fielded it.

one of the few times a prediction of mine ever came true. lol.

other than that....he's a gadget/match up player at best.

threebag

04-12-2012, 12:42 PM

Too bad that Chris Sembower got run off.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:43 PM

Does he produce when he touches the ball? His numbers suggest that he does.

Then why did we sign a RB2 this offseason? I mean, DEXTER PRODUCES, bro!

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:44 PM

Who said 60 of those 130 had to be receptions?

So Dexter fucking McCluster is going to carry the ball 100 times next season? As a RB3?

Get the fuck out.

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 12:44 PM

um...it matters

when you draft 5th round picks in the 2nd, it's a bad thing...does that really require an explanation?

uhmm....no it doesn't.

It doesn't matter anymore. What's done is done.

All that matters now, is what kind of production you get out of him.

The only conversations that this article should spark, is whether or not he's being used properly, and whether or not he is productive.

That's it.

Bringing up rehashed shit from 3 SEASONS ago is something a wife would do.

Get over it already.

OnTheWarpath15

04-12-2012, 12:46 PM

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 12:46 PM

Then why did we sign a RB2 this offseason? I mean, DEXTER PRODUCES, bro!

Nothing you say matters, so don't bother.

"OMG, they drafted Baldwin because Bowe & Breaston don't produce"

-Gochiefs logic.

Just STFU already.

Like I said, what you doesn't matter, no one takes you seriously.

RealSNR

04-12-2012, 12:48 PM

The worst part about his midgetness? It's not that defenders can face off against him like they're playing touch football. It's not that the whole "makes people miss" thing is a farce.

It's his fumbles.

Look at his arms and his hands. The football barely fits in that breadbasket. Dante Hall was a midget, but he knew how to hold onto the damn ball. And that's with him playing as a receiver against some very opportunistic S/CBs who tried very mightily to strip the ball away from him, because that's all they could do to even slow him down.

The OP points to only two fumbles, but how many times last year (with Charles going down and Dex receiving extra carries) did you count that we'd have to burn a challenge because Dex's arms weren't big enough to cradle the ball properly when he went down to the ground? It seems like every fucking time he got tackled near the line of scrimmage the ball came loose.

He might not be a shitty player, but that's still no excuse for taking him in the 2nd fucking round when we could have had (currently) one of the best NTs in football, one of the best TEs in football, or really ANY fucking player besides Midget McFuckstick.

Also, get off your highhorse, Micjones. NOBODY around here bitches about Bowe like you say they do. The people challenging his effort at the end of the Steelers game last year only did so because the MNF crew had their periods about it. With the help of GoChiefs' gifs, that accusation was ditched a long time ago.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:49 PM

"OMG, they drafted Baldwin because Bowe & Breaston don't produce"

-Gochiefs logic.

Your logic fucking sucks. WR3 is not the same position as RB3.

Fucking idiot.

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 12:49 PM

other than that....he's a gadget/match up player at best.

Exactly.

And that's how he should be judged.

Judging him based off of where he was picked is retarded.

If you wanna bitch about Pioli, then bitch about Pioli. McCluster didn't decide where he was gong to be picked.

How does Dexter perform as a Gadget player? How does he compare to other Gadget players?

That's the only argument worth arguing over at this point.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 12:50 PM

So Dexter ****ing McCluster is going to carry the ball 100 times next season? As a RB3?

Get the **** out.

Charles and Hillis played a total of 11 games last season.
You're certain they'll both be back at 100% this year? I'm not.

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 12:51 PM

Your logic ****ing sucks. WR3 is not the same position as RB3.

****ing idiot.

Yeah, because Dexter is used like a RB3, right? :facepalm:

Like i said, STFU, you're not even worth arguing with.

RealSNR

04-12-2012, 12:52 PM

So. Fucking. What.

When it comes that kid, that's all anyone around here can talk about.

Find something else to bitch about, this is old already.

I can't wait for the '12 draft so people can find new shit to nit-pick.

"OMGZ, they reached for Tannehill!"It's one thing to perform a multiple-round reach on a scat back when your backfield is one-dimensional.

It's another thing to reach on a scat back when you already had on your roster the best fucking 3rd down back in the fucking game, who ended up being so much more than just a 3rd down back.

If we draft Tannehill, at least we'll be reaching because we don't have a fucking franchise QB on this goddamn roster. It'd be quite another thing to reach on Tannehill if we already had Aaron Rodgers as the starter.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:53 PM

Yeah, because Dexter is used like a RB3, right? :facepalm:

Why wouldn't he be used as a RB3 this season?

The only reason he got so many touches last season is because Charles got hurt.

Explain how a guy who is LITERALLY the 7th best skill position player on our offense is going to contribute so much next season.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 12:53 PM

Charles and Hillis played a total of 11 games last season.
You're certain they'll both be back at 100% this year? I'm not.

Then we better fucking draft someone.

RealSNR

04-12-2012, 12:54 PM

Charles and Hillis played a total of 11 games last season.
You're certain they'll both be back at 100% this year? I'm not.It's a far more likely scenario that Charles returns close to his 2010 explosive form than it is for McCluster to not be a piece of shit next year.

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 12:56 PM

It's one thing to perform a multiple-round reach on a scat back when your backfield is one-dimensional.

It's another thing to reach on a scat back when you already had on your roster the best ****ing 3rd down back in the ****ing game, who ended up being so much more than just a 3rd down back.

If we draft Tannehill, at least we'll be reaching because we don't have a ****ing franchise QB on this goddamn roster. It'd be quite another thing to reach on Tannehill if we already had Aaron Rodgers as the starter.

My point is that people should be focusing on Dexter, the player, not Dexter the 2nd round draft pick, that occured 3 god damn years ago.

Like your previous post for example.

The majority of your post was about Dexter the player, but then you had to take a shot at him about where he was drafted, as if that matters THREE YEARS LATER.

It's over now.

Your point about his fumbling issues is a good one.

Your point about where he was drafted is not.

Where he was drafted has no bearing on what kind of player he is or can be for the Chiefs.

And that's the only discussion that should matter at this point.

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 12:59 PM

It's a far more likely scenario that Charles returns close to his 2010 explosive form than it is for McCluster to not be a piece of shit next year.

He wasn't a PoS last year, so why would he be a PoS this year?

Micjones

04-12-2012, 01:05 PM

My point is that people should be focusing on Dexter, the player, not Dexter the 2nd round draft pick, that occured 3 god damn years ago.

Like your previous post for example.

The majority of your post was about Dexter the player, but then you had to take a shot at him about where he was drafted, as if that matters THREE YEARS LATER.

It's over now.

Your point about his fumbling issues is a good one.

Your point about where he was drafted is not.

Where he was drafted has no bearing on what kind of player he is or can be for the Chiefs.

And that's the only discussion that should matter at this point.

I think it's important to note where a player was drafted in relation to how he produces on the field. That says something about the administration's ability to locate talent and draft for value.

But I don't agree that a player taken too high is a lost cause if he doesn't play to his draft position.
That player can still be very productive.

It's not exactly like Round Two is a "Can't Miss" round for offensive talent anyway.

Mr. Laz

04-12-2012, 01:08 PM

Decent 3rd down back.

Done.
FYP

doesn't make people miss enough
major weakness in pass protection

DJ's left nut

04-12-2012, 01:09 PM

If you wanna bitch about Pioli, then bitch about Pioli. McCluster didn't decide where he was gong to be picked.

Don't you believe that's exactly what people are doing?

Nobody's questioning McCluster's efforts. Nobody is saying they want to see him die screaming. Hell, most people aren't even saying he has absolutely no use on this team.

Virtually everyone that has a problem with McCluster has a problem with McCluster the second round draft pick, as even you appear to acknowledge.

So isn't bitching about Pioli exactly what people are doing there? Just because they don't start the thread with: [Pioli bitch] "McCluster sucks dicks!" [/Pioli bitch] - doesn't mean they aren't clearly bitching about Pioli.

I didn't think this needed to be broken down, but it appears I was mistaken.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 01:10 PM

He wasn't a PoS last year, so why would he be a PoS this year?

Depends on your definition of POS.

I can find guys like Dexter on the waiver wire.

He's nothing special.

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 01:11 PM

I think it's important to note where a player was drafted in relation to how he produces on the field. That says something about the administration's ability to locate talent and draft for value.

You're talking about the administration, while the article, and myself, are talking about the player.

If you wanna bitch about Scott Pioli, ok fine, bitch away.

But that's NOT what this article is about. It's about whether or not Dexter is a solid contributor. It's not about where he was drafted. And it shouldn't be, because it's over now.

All that matters now (i know i've been saying it a lot) is whether or not he's productive on the field and if he's worth a roster spot.

Every fucking McCluster conversation has to be about his draft slot, and never about the player.

People are putting waaay too much stock into where he was drafted, and not enough into the player on the field.

Dayze

04-12-2012, 01:11 PM

RealSNR

04-12-2012, 01:11 PM

He wasn't a PoS last year, so why would he be a PoS this year?Maybe his function in this offense will change with Daboll's new system, with less emphasis on shitty ass bubble screens and more emphasis on zone blocking creating huge holes for Charles and Hillis, which sets up the play action pass. THAT'S how this offense is going to roll if they have any chance in 2012.

It's not going to function at all if we become so obsessed with getting the ball in McCluster's hands that we get out of rhythm and balance with our playcalling to poop out a 3 yard bubble screen to Dex. That's exactly what we did last year, and that's just one of the many reasons why scoring more than two TDs in a game last year seemed like the Chiefs were an arena league team.

McCluster isn't Dante Hall, and he's not Jamaal Charles. Crafting plays that exist for the sole reason of getting McCluster the ball never work. They're too obvious. The defense knows they're coming, and they always blow up in our faces. McCluster will have to get his touches by not being the first option. When we get him the ball it needs to come as a surprise to the defense. THAT'S how you get him the ball in space, and that's the only way McCluster can function as a big play weapon.

But I'm not holding my breath. Daboll is a real offensive coordinator at least, unlike that Muir/Haley/Zorn abortion we ran last year. But he's still not a very good coordinator.

Dr. Gigglepants

04-12-2012, 01:14 PM

Most of the times he touched it out of the backfield last year were 3rd and long draw plays. His 4.5 ypc is inflated bc the defense is laying back and coming up to make the tackle. Last year isn't really comparable to how I think he'll be used this year since we are getting Charles back and have added Hillis. Draws and screens are the only time we use him though, is that misuse or indicative of worthlessness?

I will wait until we see how he is used this year with a full complement of offensive players to choose from, but I don't think he sees the field nearly as much this season. That's why I said move him to PR, just get some use out of him at least.
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ModSocks

04-12-2012, 01:16 PM

Don't you believe that's exactly what people are doing?

Nobody's questioning McCluster's efforts. Nobody is saying they want to see him die screaming. Hell, most people aren't even saying he has absolutely no use on this team.

Virtually everyone that has a problem with McCluster has a problem with McCluster the second round draft pick, as even you appear to acknowledge.

So isn't bitching about Pioli exactly what people are doing there? Just because they don't start the thread with: [Pioli bitch] "McCluster sucks dicks!" [/Pioli bitch] - doesn't mean they aren't clearly bitching about Pioli.

I didn't think this needed to be broken down, but it appears I was mistaken.

When the thread is about McCluster's production, then bashing on McCluster in order to indirectly bash Pioli is stupid.

This conversation piece should've been about how he can work on the field. Instead, it INSTANTLY became about his draft position.

And btw, i think you give people more credit than they deserve. I think there are a ton of people that directly correlate his draft position to his production and then draw the conclusion that he sucks.

Goqueer is a prime example of that.

While YOU may understand that they are two different subjects, I don't think that lot of people around here do.

If they did, then this thread would be about Dexter the player, not Dexter the Draft pick.

Mr. Laz

04-12-2012, 01:17 PM

DMC brings nothing to the team that another player on the roster can't do better

Charles is a uber 3rd down back ... UBER!! He can run the ball,catch the ball and block better than DMC

Breaston can catch the short passes and WR screen passes better and runs after the catch just as well.

Arenas is a better Kick and Punt returner

DMC isn't big enough to do anything else

so imo we should use the roster spot on a guy that actually brings something unique to the team. With Hillis on the team for power, Charles should get EVERY 3rd/passing down type carry.

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 01:18 PM

I think Dexter is good to plug in there every now and again when we get a nice chunk of yards of 1st down. I think he's a good change up to have on say 2nd & 2 etc.
Or some scenario where youdon't have to rely on his blitz pick up/pass protection.

I don't like him in 2nd/3rd and Long situations.

either give it to him/pass to him on 1st downs every now and again, or 2nd & shorts.

my $.02

Exactly. And that's what we should be talking about here.

But we can never get to that on CP, because it has to become a bitch fest about where he was drafted as if that somehow still matters 3 years later.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 01:18 PM

You're talking about the administration, while the article, and myself, are talking about the player.

If you wanna bitch about Scott Pioli, ok fine, bitch away.

But that's NOT what this article is about. It's about whether or not Dexter is a solid contributor. It's not about where he was drafted. And it shouldn't be, because it's over now.

All that matters now (i know i've been saying it a lot) is whether or not he's productive on the field and if he's worth a roster spot.

Every ****ing McCluster conversation has to be about his draft slot, and never about the player.

People are putting waaay too much stock into where he was drafted, and not enough into the player on the field.

Calm down cowboy.
I happen to like McCluster and don't share the common CP perspective on how that pick was used.

Remember it was me who posted the article.

I was simply saying, to some extent, that you can't completely separate where a player was drafted from what he ultimately becomes in the NFL.

Is he responsible for where he was drafted? Absolutely not.
Will that affect how fans perceive him? No doubt it.
Is there middle ground? Yes. Yes there is.

Mr. Laz

04-12-2012, 01:19 PM

Exactly. And that's what we should be talking about here.

But we can never get to that on CP, because it has to become a bitch fest about where he was drafted as if that somehow still matters 3 years later.
what does Dex bring to the team that someone else, on the roster, doesn't do better?

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 01:19 PM

Maybe his function in this offense will change with Daboll's new system, with less emphasis on shitty ass bubble screens and more emphasis on zone blocking creating huge holes for Charles and Hillis, which sets up the play action pass. THAT'S how this offense is going to roll if they have any chance in 2012.

It's not going to function at all if we become so obsessed with getting the ball in McCluster's hands that we get out of rhythm and balance with our playcalling to poop out a 3 yard bubble screen to Dex. That's exactly what we did last year, and that's just one of the many reasons why scoring more than two TDs in a game last year seemed like the Chiefs were an arena league team.

McCluster isn't Dante Hall, and he's not Jamaal Charles. Crafting plays that exist for the sole reason of getting McCluster the ball never work. They're too obvious. The defense knows they're coming, and they always blow up in our faces. McCluster will have to get his touches by not being the first option. When we get him the ball it needs to come as a surprise to the defense. THAT'S how you get him the ball in space, and that's the only way McCluster can function as a big play weapon.

But I'm not holding my breath. Daboll is a real offensive coordinator at least, unlike that Muir/Haley/Zorn abortion we ran last year. But he's still not a very good coordinator.

I agree 100%

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 01:20 PM

I think there are a ton of people that directly correlate his draft position to his production and then draw the conclusion that he sucks.

Goqueer is a prime example of that.

Have you even been reading anything I've posted about Dex in the last year?

My main problem with the little shitstain is that he does nothing special. He has no unique talent that separates him from any other scatback RB on the street.

The majority of the time, when he gets the ball, he doesn't make anyone miss or do anything special. He's a 170 pound back who can't make people miss. That's fucking HORRIBLE.

The fact he was #36 only makes it worse.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 01:21 PM

Mr. Laz

04-12-2012, 01:25 PM

Being a smaller back means you ought to be shifty?
absolutely

an NFL RB needs to shifty,savvy,powerful or some combination of the 3.

make people miss by 'breaking their ankles'
be instinctive enough to set up blocks and great at finding the holes
powerful enough to break arm tackles etc so you don't need to be shifty etc

I've seen none of the 3 from DMC

He is a tough SOB though ... only a tough SOB could survive they way he has with no power or elusiveness.

He's not even particularly fast ... just quick

Rausch

04-12-2012, 01:26 PM

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 01:26 PM

Have you even been reading anything I've posted about Dex in the last year?

My main problem with the little shitstain is that he does nothing special. He has no unique talent that separates him from any other scatback RB on the street.

The majority of the time, when he gets the ball, he doesn't make anyone miss or do anything special. He's a 170 pound back who can't make people miss. That's ****ing HORRIBLE.

The fact he was #36 only makes it worse.

4.54 ypc

844 Yards from scrimmage.

Your opinion that he can't make someone miss (which is wrong, and there are plenty of examples of him creating YAC) doesn't matter.

Does he produce?

Well, last season he produced.

He had more offensive production than any Chief last year not named Bowe.

So CLEARLY, his ability is there. Even if he gets burried on the Depth chart, his ability is there.

There are some starting HB's in the league that aren't as good as our Number 1 and 2. So the fact that he's #3 means little to me.

Fritz88

04-12-2012, 01:27 PM

The guy won us the Denver game and put us on position to win the Oak game. He's okay in my book.

el borracho

04-12-2012, 01:27 PM

Dex didn't merit the #36 pick in the draft and he certainly doesn't merit this much discussion. His uses are few and he will probably be out of the league and out of our minds in two more years.

Dayze

04-12-2012, 01:27 PM

Will drafting of a RB in mid-rounds signal the end of Dex?

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 01:28 PM

Your opinion that he can't make someone miss (which is wrong, and there are plenty of examples of him creating YAC) doesn't matter.

LMAO

Dude was one of the least elusive backs in the NFL, which is pretty fucking important for being A RUNNING BACK IN THE NFL, and you're telling me it doesn't matter.

And again, I'm not wrong. We have two different sources backing me up on this (Pro Football Focus and Football Outsiders). I do not have a biased opinion of the little pipsqueak. I know what I see.

Fucking moron.

Rausch

04-12-2012, 01:28 PM

Dex didn't merit the #36 pick in the draft and he certainly doesn't merit this much discussion. His uses are few and he will probably be out of the league and out of our minds in two more years.

On any other team he'd be a P/K returner only...

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 01:29 PM

The guy won us the Denver game and put us on position to win the Oak game. He's okay in my book.

Our defense won us the Denver game. Dex did not do much at all in that Denver game. He did well to run through a couple of gaping holes and gain YAC when defenders literally were nowhere near him. That's it.

Mr. Laz

04-12-2012, 01:31 PM

4.54 ypc

844 Yards from scrimmage.

Your opinion that he can't make someone miss (which is wrong, and there are plenty of examples of him creating YAC) doesn't matter.

Does he produce?

Well, last season he produced.

He had more offensive production than any Chief last year not named Bowe.

So CLEARLY, his ability is there. Even if he gets burried on the Depth chart, his ability is there.

There are some starting HB's in the league that aren't as good as our Number 1 and 2. So the fact that he's #3 means little to me.
you realize that almost all the production was generated by the scheme and situation not by DMC doing anything special ... right?

forget the numbers

watch the games and see if DMC is making the play better or just getting the basic yards the play is generates.

Does DMC makes someone miss?
Does DMC make a read or cut that creates?
Does DMC make a catch or play that is special?

With DMC, 90% of the time the answer for those 3 questions is 'No'.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 01:32 PM

4.54 ypc

844 Yards from scrimmage.

Thomas Jones had over A THOUSAND yards from scrimmage in 2010, but he sucked the second half of the year.

Racking up yards because there's no one else to touch the ball isn't impressive. And we literally had NO ONE else who was a decent third down back, so all those touches went to Dex.

And if you actually took the time to look at his game logs, you'd realize a ton of his yards came in garbage time.

The guy is fucking worthless and we could find a player off the street to do what he does.

Mr. Laz

04-12-2012, 01:32 PM

On any other team he'd be a P/K returner only...
The only reason he does returns on this team is because Arenas needs a break after so many plays on defense.

RealSNR

04-12-2012, 01:33 PM

As for the 2nd round pick bitch fest:

Remember when the Chiefs drafted Kris Wilson? Most people wouldn't have had a problem with the pick if it came at a position of need for the Chiefs, like a WR or hell... ANY defensive position. The reach isn't what made them mad. It was the fact that the pick was justified by Vermeil and Carl as a hybrid/H-back/RB/TE/blocker amorphous genderless player that would take that offense from lethal to god mode.

The concept sounded stupid at the time that an offense with the best RB in the game, the best FB in the game, the best offensive line in the game, and the best TE in the game needed the help of a no-name piece of shit who would fulfill the needs of all of those positions without having even demonstrated a consistent stretch of talent for ANY of those positions in college. It was the concept that a player like Wilson without elite college game film or elite physical measurables was going to be the key to unlocking God Mode. And even then, the role being created for him seemed like something you'd write a PhD dissertation about, not a fucking playbook.

Sure enough nothing ever came out of his play on the team. Fans weren't upset about the fact that he busted as a 2nd rounder. They were FURIOUS that we pissed away a 2nd round pick on a cumstain like Wilson when we were the last-ranked defense in the entire fucking NFL. Drafting something like Wilson is something you do when the warroom has had way too much to drink and the rest of the team has a solid core. You DON'T draft a Kris Wilson when one of your starting DTs is Derrick fucking Ransom and the most talented player on your defense is Jerome Woods

With McCluster, the 2nd round pick bitching is the same kind of legit. It's one thing to reach, it's quite another thing to reach on a guy whose role to the team beyond returning kicks is up-in-the-air and confusing due to the fact that the role he would NORMALLY play for a team is already occupied by the best player at that position in the game.

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 01:33 PM

LMAO

Dude was one of the least elusive backs in the NFL, which is pretty ****ing important for being A RUNNING BACK IN THE NFL, and you're telling me it doesn't matter.

And again, I'm not wrong. We have two different sources backing me up on this (Pro Football Focus and Football Outsiders). I do not have a biased opinion of the little pipsqueak. I know what I see.

****ing moron.

No, I said YOUR OPINION doesn't matter.

You don't have a biased opinion?

ROFL ROFL ROFL

Do you actually believe the shit you type?

Rausch

04-12-2012, 01:34 PM

The only reason he does returns on this team is because Arenas needs a break after so many plays on defense.

That is either sarcasm or you go on iggy...

Mr. Laz

04-12-2012, 01:35 PM

That is either sarcasm or you go on iggy...
put me on iggy then because Javier Arenas is a better returner than DMC imo

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 01:37 PM

put me on iggy then because Javier Arenas is a better returner than DMC imo

I agree, he is.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 01:38 PM

As for the 2nd round pick bitch fest:

Remember when the Chiefs drafted Kris Wilson? Most people wouldn't have had a problem with the pick if it came at a position of need for the Chiefs, like a WR or hell... ANY defensive position. The reach isn't what made them mad. It was the fact that the pick was justified by Vermeil and Carl as a hybrid/H-back/RB/TE/blocker amorphous genderless player that would take that offense from lethal to god mode.

The concept sounded stupid at the time that an offense with the best RB in the game, the best FB in the game, the best offensive line in the game, and the best TE in the game needed the help of a no-name piece of shit who would fulfill the needs of all of those positions without having even demonstrated a consistent stretch of talent for ANY of those positions in college. It was the concept that a player like Wilson without elite college game film or elite physical measurables was going to be the key to unlocking God Mode. And even then, the role being created for him seemed like something you'd write a PhD dissertation about, not a ****ing playbook.

Sure enough nothing ever came out of his play on the team. Fans weren't upset about the fact that he busted as a 2nd rounder. They were FURIOUS that we pissed away a 2nd round pick on a cumstain like Wilson when we were the last-ranked defense in the entire ****ing NFL. Drafting something like Wilson is something you do when the warroom has had way too much to drink and the rest of the team has a solid core. You DON'T draft a Kris Wilson when one of your starting DTs is Derrick ****ing Ransom and the most talented player on your defense is Jerome Woods

With McCluster, the 2nd round pick bitching is the same kind of legit. It's one thing to reach, it's quite another thing to reach on a guy whose role to the team beyond returning kicks is up-in-the-air and confusing due to the fact that the role he would NORMALLY play for a team is already occupied by the best player at that position in the game.

Seriously?

McCluster had more rushing yards LAST YEAR than Wilson has receiving yards...in an EIGHT YEAR CAREER.

Rausch

04-12-2012, 01:38 PM

put me on iggy then because Javier Arenas is a better returner than DMC imo

:grr:

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/QFX835IN02w" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Dayze

04-12-2012, 01:39 PM

lol. holy shit.

Dayze

04-12-2012, 01:39 PM

Should the thread title be changed to "Bringing Down Dex"?

ModSocks

04-12-2012, 01:39 PM

Dayze

04-12-2012, 01:40 PM

Some how I've found myself in this position acting as the McCluster apologist, which I am not.

I am very meh about the guy, though i don't think as bad about him as some of you do.

And Laz, the only thing you and I are in disagreement about here is his shiftyness.

I do think he is shifty. Quicker than fast, and can in fact make people miss.

At least i got this thread going in the right direction, lol.

I'm in the same boat.
We've got him, might as well try to use him in certain situations.

Rausch

04-12-2012, 01:42 PM

And Laz, the only thing you and I are in disagreement about here is shiftyness.

:hmmm:

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 01:43 PM

I do think he is shifty. Quicker than fast, and can in fact make people miss.

He moves quickly, it's true.

He looks so quick and shifty when he busts out a juke that gets him nowhere.

43rd out of 56 running backs for elusive rating. HE CAN MAKE PEOPLE MISS BRO!

RealSNR

04-12-2012, 01:43 PM

People aren't upset about the Arenas pick anymore because at least they see that he was filling a legitimate need for the team. It also helps that he's quite good at what he does, but regardless, rarely does anyone bitch about where he was drafted anymore. Hell, if he had been taken at McCluster's spot at the beginning of the 2nd round, we'd still be laying off him. The pick was made with good faith, and draft gurus can understand the rationale behind the pick.

McCluster is a head-scratcher. The only explanation I've been able to come up with is that Price Chopper did a contest where the winner got to make the Chiefs' pick in the 2nd round. The winner was a hardcore Ole Miss fan who showed up drunk to the war room and said, "DEXTER MCCLUSTER! WOOOO!" and instantly passed out on the ground.

Mr. Laz

04-12-2012, 01:43 PM

Some how I've found myself in this position acting as the McCluster apologist, which I am not.

I am very meh about the guy, though i don't think as bad about him as some of you do.

And Laz, the only thing you and I are in disagreement about here is his shiftyness.

I do think he is shifty. Quicker than fast, and can in fact make people miss.

At least i got this thread going in the right direction, lol.
well then he needs to get to it then because he doesn't make them miss often enough.

every time i see DMC touch the ball all i think is we just wasted a chance to use a more talented player. (Charles,Breaston,Arenas)

:shrug:

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 01:44 PM

No, I said YOUR OPINION doesn't matter.

You don't have a biased opinion?

ROFL ROFL ROFL

Do you actually believe the shit you type?

My opinion is based in reality.

That opinion is backed up by TWO sources which are COMPLETELY unbiased.

Anyone who believes Dexter is an effective NFL RB at this point is a delusional homer.

the Talking Can

04-12-2012, 01:45 PM

yeah, Arenas turned to be an excellent kick returner...which is another thing Dex failed out...

WR...fail
kick returner...fail
RB...#3

RealSNR

04-12-2012, 01:50 PM

Seriously?

McCluster had more rushing yards LAST YEAR than Wilson has receiving yards...in an EIGHT YEAR CAREER.Did you not read what I wrote?

It's not the bust factor people give a shit about. It's the fact that his role for the team was to perform all these different tasks, none of which made any sense. At first it was talked about that he could play the slot while sharing duties as a 3rd down back and also as a gadget player that would have designed plays. Of course, all of it was theoretical. The fans didn't buy it, and I half expect that Charlie Weis didn't buy it either.

That draft pick screamed Todd Haley. An asshole maniac who thought he knew everything there was to know about the game of football and was eager to prove to everybody how smart he was.

KCDC

04-12-2012, 01:50 PM

For the record, I tend to agree with the general rub of the article.
He's been misused, but despite that fact he's contributed.

Will he play to his draft position?
That remains to be seen, but he'll definitely contribute to his team if used properly.

Chiefs fans have a tendency to throw out any contributions a player makes if he's initially perceived to have been taken too high.
We're unforgiving in that regard.

This.

CPers are still crushed that we didn't draft Jimmy Claussen here. They will never forgive Pioli. I was upset at the time too. But, I've come around that a team needs a playmaker like him. There was hope he'd be an every down threat, but he's been turned into a 3rd down back, or an occasional slot. Still, he's on the field as much as a NT, who no one questions should be taken in the first or second round.

Claussen would have made Cassel look better, so maybe he would have had some value after all. ;)

Bottom line, Dex was not a steal like a JC. It is hard for a second rounder to ever be a steal; but, he adds an interesting weapon on offense that is valuable.

The same bellyachers point to the wasted pick of Arenas in the late 2nd round. Finally, those complainers are starting to be silenced. I think both of these guys could have their best days ahead of them. I'm fine with them both.

Setsuna

04-12-2012, 01:50 PM

.

Yeah don't insult MM by associating DM with a legend. GTFO.

Mr. Laz

04-12-2012, 01:53 PM

What you can say about Dexter is that he is a utility player.

he backs up 3 positions from 1 roster spot

HemiEd

04-12-2012, 02:02 PM

DJ's left nut

04-12-2012, 02:16 PM

The same bellyachers point to the wasted pick of Arenas in the late 2nd round. Finally, those complainers are starting to be silenced. I think both of these guys could have their best days ahead of them. I'm fine with them both.

A nickle back and slightly above average punt-returner is not a good value for a 2nd round pick.

McCluster was an abortion of a draft pick; Arenas was merely a sub-par one.

Okie_Apparition

04-12-2012, 02:26 PM

With the Chiefs' history of 2nd round picks
he may be in the top 10%

qabbaan

04-12-2012, 02:46 PM

He is fast, but a special teamer/gadget player. Those guys hang around the league for a few years and then fall out when their speed diminishes.

What's the difference between him and Dante Hall? Hall was a good return man.

QuikSsurfer

04-12-2012, 03:54 PM

LMAO

I do not have a biased opinion of the little pipsqueak.

:hmmm:

whoman69

04-12-2012, 04:08 PM

Mr. Laz

04-12-2012, 04:12 PM

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 04:16 PM

He was much better with Orton. Heck, even Palko improved his game.

Urban myth.

RealSNR

04-12-2012, 04:19 PM

I think part of the problem with Dex has been Cassel. He was constantly checking down to Dex when he was right next to a defender. They're not stupid, they know Check Down will live up to his nickname. He was much better with Orton. Heck, even Palko improved his game.
A lot of that is the obsession Haley had with forcing the playcalling to include touches for McCluster. The designed plays to Dex were always predictable and boring, and defenses outside of San Francisco's in 2010 have never had much trouble at all at sniffing out the play and stopping McCluster short of a 5 yard gain. That kind of thing is like calling a reverse that gets you 3 yards. Nothing wrong with it, but it's pretty demoralizing for the offense. It chips away at their confidence and affects the play of the team as a whole.

Pasta Little Brioni

04-12-2012, 04:21 PM

You can always tell what players people didn't want at that time in the draft. Comical.

Deberg_1990

04-12-2012, 04:43 PM

You can always tell what players people didn't want at that time in the draft. Comical.

Dex will be a worthless pick in some fans eyes unless he performs like Gale Sayers.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 04:55 PM

Dex will be a worthless pick in some fans eyes unless he performs like Gale Sayers.

This is so stupid. He'd be a worthwhile pick if he played as well as Lesean McCoy, who was taken 17 picks later. And that's setting the bar pretty high. Most of us would settle for Darren Sproles.

Deberg_1990

04-12-2012, 04:57 PM

This is so stupid. He'd be a worthwhile pick if he played as well as Lesean McCoy, who was taken 17 picks later. And that's setting the bar pretty high. Most of us would settle for Darren Sproles.

He's been ok, not spectacular, but ok. Everyone acts as if he's been a total failure.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 04:59 PM

He's been ok, not spectacular, but ok. Everyone acts as if he's been a total failure.

He has been. He literally brings nothing to the field that we couldn't easily find elsewhere.

He's a failure as a wide receiver. He's a failure as a kick returner. He's not a starting running back, he's not a backup running back.

He's a third running back who only got a chance to do anything last season because we had the worst running back depth chart in the NFL.

Deberg_1990

04-12-2012, 05:01 PM

He has been. He literally brings nothing to the field that we couldn't easily find elsewhere.

He's a failure as a wide receiver. He's a failure as a kick returner. He's not a starting running back, he's not a backup running back.

He's a third running back who only got a chance to do anything last season because we had the worst running back depth chart in the NFL.

He wasnt drafted to be a savior. He's a complimentary player, and that's fine. Why does everyone have a problem wih this? Not every player can be a superstar.

Pasta Little Brioni

04-12-2012, 05:06 PM

Alot of people wanted Golden Taint and Arrelious Benn, who have done jack and shit thus far.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:08 PM

He wasnt drafted to be a savior. He's a complimentary player, and that's fine. Why does everyone have a problem wih this? Not every player can be a superstar.

He was drafted to be a god damn good slot receiver.

You don't spend a #36 on a player not expect him to be pretty good.

He's a "complementary player" in the same vein that Derrick Blaylock "complemented" the 2003 Chiefs offense: totally fucking irrelevant for the most part.

Deberg_1990

04-12-2012, 05:10 PM

He was drafted to be a god damn good slot receiver.

You don't spend a #36 on a player not expect him to be pretty good.

He's a "complementary player" in the same vein that Derrick Blaylock "complemented" the 2003 Chiefs offense: totally ****ing irrelevant for the most part.

And there's nothing wrong with that. We get production ot of him, not every player can be a star, and that's fine. Relax

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:10 PM

Alot of people wanted Golden Taint and Arrelious Benn, who have done jack and shit thus far.

And yet they are still better receivers than McCluster will ever be, and there were much better players taken after him other than those two.

Colossal fucking bust and no one should be trying to sugar coat it.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:11 PM

And there's nothing wrong with that. We get production ot of him, not every player can be a star, and that's fine. Relax

We won't be getting production out of him this season.

He might have 300 total yards and 1 TD all season.

There is a lot wrong with that.

Pasta Little Brioni

04-12-2012, 05:13 PM

It's a 2nd rounder, not a top 5 pick. They have a higher bust rate than people care to admit.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:14 PM

It's a 2nd rounder, not a top 5 pick. They have a higher bust rate than people care to admit.

So we can agree he is a huge bust. Congrats.

The Franchise

04-12-2012, 05:15 PM

Alot of people wanted Golden Taint and Arrelious Benn, who have done jack and shit thus far.

Ummm.....no. They would have been just fine as slot receivers. Not stupid fucking gadget players who can't play one position properly.

Pasta Little Brioni

04-12-2012, 05:19 PM

They don't take the yard away if he gains it on a handoff. He outgained both those guys combined last year.

Deberg_1990

04-12-2012, 05:21 PM

We won't be getting production out of him this season.

He might have 300 total yards and 1 TD all season.

There is a lot wrong with that.

and you can predict things that are 6-10 months away how??

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:22 PM

They don't take the yard away if he gains it on a handoff. He outgained both those guys combined last year.

Do you honestly think either of those guys wouldn't be doing our roster more good now than a worthless RB3?

It's takes WRs 3 years to get it and Benn made some strides last year moving to full-time starter.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:22 PM

and you can predict things that are 6-10 months away how??

It doesn't take a crystal ball to know a RB3 isn't gonna touch it much with all our offensive talent.

Pasta Little Brioni

04-12-2012, 05:24 PM

...and again I go back to my original point about who people wanted in the draft. "Thier guys" will get every excuse in the book.

Deberg_1990

04-12-2012, 05:25 PM

It doesn't take a crystal ball to know a RB3 isn't gonna touch it much with all our offensive talent.

Injuries....

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:29 PM

Injuries....

I'd wager our running game goes to shit if DMC has to touch the ball more than 10 times a game.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:32 PM

...and again I go back to my original point about who people wanted in the draft. "Thier guys" will get every excuse in the book.

If DMC was playing WR I would give him three years to develop.

He's not. He's so fucking god awful they immediately abandoned any hope he could learn the position.

Fucking embarrassment.

KCDC

04-12-2012, 05:32 PM

Colossal ****ing bust and no one should be trying to sugar coat it.

Time to change your name to Hyperbole.

He is "colossal bust" in your mind, which is obviously a passionate one that blinds you. Ryan Leaf was a colossal bust. Dex has not lived up to expectations and hopes, and has yet to justify where he was selected in the draft. Yet, he is not a detriment to the team, like Cassel. He is productive; but, just not as much as we would have liked.

Easy 6

04-12-2012, 05:34 PM

Exactly.

And that's how he should be judged.

Judging him based off of where he was picked is retarded.

If you wanna bitch about Pioli, then bitch about Pioli. McCluster didn't decide where he was gong to be picked.

How does Dexter perform as a Gadget player? How does he compare to other Gadget players?

That's the only argument worth arguing over at this point.

.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:38 PM

Seriously, he's fairly shitty as a gadget player.

He's maybe half the player Sproles is.

Dante Hall was a gadget player on offense. At least he could play some WR.

Rudy tossed tigger's salad

04-12-2012, 05:44 PM

In other news, Jimmy Clausen, Golden Tate and Sergio Kindle still suck ass

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:48 PM

In other news, Jimmy Clausen, Golden Tate and Sergio Kindle still suck ass

Yeah, asshole? How about Nate Allen, TJ Ward, Rob Gronkowski, Toby Gerhart, Carlos Dunlap, Pat Angerer and Jared Veldheer?

Do they suck? No?

Were they all taken within 30 picks of McCluster? Yes?

Did we fuck the pick up? Yes?

Will you now shut the fuck up? Eat shit.

Deberg_1990

04-12-2012, 05:51 PM

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:53 PM

Toby Gerhart? What has he done?

He's a fairly solid RB2. He averaged 4.9 YPC last year and scored 4 TD (in only 130 touches).

More than DMC can say.

Discuss Thrower

04-12-2012, 05:54 PM

Breaking down DMC:

Great character guy; fast but is absolutely of no use to his current team.

The end.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:54 PM

Remember that elusive rating I was talking about? Gerhart was 5th. Dude is a fucking bulldozer RB.

DMC gets bulldozed.

The Franchise

04-12-2012, 05:56 PM

In other news, Jimmy Clausen, Golden Tate and Sergio Kindle still suck ass

And Terrance Cody is lighting it up at NT for the Ravens.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 05:58 PM

And Terrance Cody is lighting it up at NT for the Ravens.

Not really, but there are still plenty of good players we could have picked.

Holy shit, Rob Gronkowski.

And then we could have spent the Moeaki pick on another position.

whoman69

04-12-2012, 06:08 PM

Urban myth.

Really? With Cassel, 25 catches 113 yards, 4.52 avg. Post Cassel 21 catches 202 yards, 9.62 avg. 0 TD with Cassel, 2 TD without Cassel. What is an urban myth is your irrational hatred of this player.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 06:11 PM

Really? With Cassel, 25 catches 113 yards, 4.52 avg. Post Cassel 21 catches 202 yards, 9.62 avg. 0 TD with Cassel, 2 TD without Cassel.

Yeah, it's an urban myth. Almost HALF of that yardage came on two plays. A 49-yard screen pass and a 38-yard hail mary TD.

Flukey as shit. Not indicative of any real difference.

And there is nothing irrational about my hatred. It's based on rational facts:

1. He is a huge draft bust.

2. People defend him for no fucking good reason because he is cutesy and his hair flys all over.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 06:14 PM

This thread has gone full retard.

Dexter McCluster should be performing at a level comparable to LeSean McCoy?
An RB3 should be producing like a starter?

And I was planning to make the comparison of Dex to Toby Gerhart earlier, but I thought that would fall on deaf ears. Now that it's come out...

I can't recall ever having heard that Gerhart's a failure and a waste of a #2.
Know what's funny about that? McCluster has better numbers offensively...
AND his return ability/production makes him even more productive on the field.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 06:18 PM

This thread has gone full retard.

Dexter McCluster should be performing at a level comparable to LeSean McCoy?
He's a starter.

And I was planning to make the comparison of Dex to Toby Gerhart earlier, but I thought that would fall on deaf ears. Now that it's come out...

I can't recall ever having heard that Gerhart's a failure and a waste of a #2.
Know what's funny about that? McCluster has better numbers offensively...
AND his return ability/production makes him even more productive on the field.

LMAO

Let me address these asinine points.

1. Yes, it would be awesome if McCluster could perform like McCoy. You know, considering McCoy was taken at a LOWER draft position.

2. McCluster only has better numbers because he touched the ball more, because we had NO ONE ELSE THAT WAS WORTH A SHIT to give it to. Gerhart played with Adrian fucking Peterson. And when Peterson went down with injury, and Gerhart stepped in, he was pretty damn good. On a per-carry basis, Gerhart is the better player, no question.

3. McCluster fucking sucks as a kick returner and does not play that position anymore.

Deberg_1990

04-12-2012, 06:24 PM

LMAO

Let me address these asinine points.

1. Yes, it would be awesome if McCluster could perform like McCoy. You know, considering McCoy was taken at a LOWER draft position.

2. McCluster only has better numbers because he touched the ball more, because we had NO ONE ELSE THAT WAS WORTH A SHIT to give it to. Gerhart played with Adrian ****ing Peterson. And when Peterson went down with injury, and Gerhart stepped in, he was pretty damn good. On a per-carry basis, Gerhart is the better player, no question.

3. McCluster ****ing sucks as a kick returner and does not play that position anymore.

I just don't know what you expect? You just can't expect every draft pick to be a home run. A solid single or double is fine as long as u get reasonable production.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 06:27 PM

I just don't know what you expect? You just can't expect every draft pick to be a home run. A solid single or double is fine as long as u get reasonable production.

Yeah, a solid single would be nice. McCluster is a bunt.

This guy is not going to have reasonable production going forward. He has a limited role, and he sucks at it. Get a clue.

whoman69

04-12-2012, 06:35 PM

Yeah, it's an urban myth. Almost HALF of that yardage came on two plays. A 49-yard screen pass and a 38-yard hail mary TD.

Flukey as shit. Not indicative of any real difference.

So busting big plays is not a positive?

Rudy tossed tigger's salad

04-12-2012, 06:35 PM

Yeah, asshole? How about Nate Allen, TJ Ward, Rob Gronkowski, Toby Gerhart, Carlos Dunlap, Pat Angerer and Jared Veldheer?

Do they suck? No?

Were they all taken within 30 picks of McCluster? Yes?

Did we **** the pick up? Yes?

Will you now shut the **** up? Eat shit.

I'm just pointing to the guys CP would have drafted. I remember in a thread where there were only like 3 or 4 people who would have gone with a player outside of Clausen, Cody, Kindle, and Tate.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 06:37 PM

1. Yes, it would be awesome if McCluster could perform like McCoy. You know, considering McCoy was taken at a LOWER draft position.

1. He wasn't drafted to be a starter.
2. McCoy's three inches taller.
3. McCoy's almost 40 pounds heavier.

I'm sure that's all McCluster's fault though.

2. McCluster only has better numbers because he touched the ball more, because we had NO ONE ELSE THAT WAS WORTH A SHIT to give it to.

Their numbers were comparable (offensively), but Gerhart's not a colossal failure in your book. I find that strange. Especially when considering the bonus you get from McCluster in the return game.

Gerhart played with Adrian ****ing Peterson. And when Peterson went down with injury, and Gerhart stepped in, he was pretty damn good. On a per-carry basis, Gerhart is the better player, no question.

By what...less than half a yard?
That's the line between contributor and bust?

McCluster ****ing sucks as a kick returner and does not play that position anymore.

On the contrary sir. It's punt returns he's been relieved of.

Rudy tossed tigger's salad

04-12-2012, 06:41 PM

I'm just pointing to the guys CP would have drafted. I remember in a thread where there were only like 3 or 4 people who would have gone with a player outside of Clausen, Cody, Kindle, and Tate.

Add Taylor Mays to this list :D

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 06:48 PM

1. He wasn't drafted to be a starter.
2. McCoy's three inches taller.
3. McCoy's almost 40 pounds heavier.

I'm sure that's all McCluster's fault though.

1. Actually, he was. Slot WR is almost a starting position in today's league. And what you don't even realize is that McCoy wasn't drafted to be a starter, either. At least he wasn't as a rookie.

It really doesn't matter though. McCoy is an example of excellent draft value. McCluster is the EXACT opposite. EXACT.

Their numbers were comparable (offensively), but Gerhart's not a colossal failure in your book. I find that strange. Especially when considering the bonus you get from McCluster in the return game.

I know you don't understand, so let me explain it in simple terms:

Toby Gerhart runs people the fuck over and does stuff on the field that is valuable. McCluster gets run the fuck over and is pretty useless. Does that make sense?

On the contrary sir. It's punt returns he's been relieved of.

Yeah, too bad he sucks dick at kickoff returns, too. And he only returned kickoffs because Arenas was hurt or needed a breather.

He's a terrible player.

Easy 6

04-12-2012, 06:53 PM

I just don't know what you expect? You just can't expect every draft pick to be a home run. A solid single or double is fine as long as u get reasonable production.

Never you mind that, GC is currently doing his best shticks.

DMC is the Tyson Jackson of scatbacks, you're disappointed at first, yet they slowly adjust, late bloomers who get better each year... as long as Lightfoot & Maximus stay healthy, he's a 100% perfect changeup player to throw in there.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 06:57 PM

This is not shtick. I'm trying to educate you ignoramuses. McCluster has failed in more ways than any Chiefs second round pick I can remember, yet you don't seem to fucking get it.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 06:58 PM

DMC is the Tyson Jackson of scatbacks, you're disappointed at first, yet they slowly adjust, late bloomers who get better each year...

Scatbacks are as good as they're going to be the minute they step on the field. They don't learn how to make people miss, get faster, or develop better hands.

You can't remotely think he's comparable to Tyson Jackson, who plays a position that actually takes time to learn in this league.

Deberg_1990

04-12-2012, 07:01 PM

This is not shtick. I'm trying to educate you ignoramuses. McCluster has failed in more ways than any Chiefs second round pick I can remember, yet you don't seem to ****ing get it.

No, I think your probably just trolling. Even u can't be this dumb

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 07:02 PM

No, I think your probably just trolling. Even u can't be this dumb

WHAT?

What is dumb about hating a player who sucks?

Please tell me what Dexter McCluster does that is valuable, or in any way justifies his draft position.

Dave Lane

04-12-2012, 07:04 PM

If he were taken in the 3rd or 4th round, no one would be complaining. He'd be living up to his draft slot.

Sorry, but nothing I read makes me believe he was worth the 36th pick in an insanely deep draft.

It's fluff, and wouldn't be necessary if he were taken later, or was a significant contributor.

You know you have a very valid point because Dex is the only draft pick that ever had this problem cool catch.

Deberg_1990

04-12-2012, 07:08 PM

WHAT?

What is dumb about hating a player who sucks?

Please tell me what Dexter McCluster does that is valuable, or in any way justifies his draft position.

No, I'm done talking to you because everytime i do I feel like I lose brain cells.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 07:14 PM

No, I'm done talking to you because everytime i do I feel like I lose brain cells.

Yeah, the facts really confuse your brain, huh?

I have yet to hear one piece of factual evidence that justifies McCluster's draft position or "12 touches a year" status.

There is no way in hell this pipsqueak should be getting the ball over ANYONE on our offense.

Al Bundy

04-12-2012, 07:30 PM

This is not shtick. I'm trying to educate you ignoramuses. McCluster has failed in more ways than any Chiefs second round pick I can remember, yet you don't seem to ****ing get it.

Mike Elkins you dumbfuck.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 07:34 PM

Mike Elkins you dumbfuck.

Did he fail at three different positions?

keg in kc

04-12-2012, 07:44 PM

Dex wishes he was Mike Cloud.

Al Bundy

04-12-2012, 07:53 PM

Did he fail at three different positions?

He only had the chance to fail at one... massively.

WhiteWhale

04-12-2012, 07:58 PM

Micjones

04-12-2012, 08:06 PM

1. Actually, he was. Slot WR is almost a starting position in today's league. And what you don't even realize is that McCoy wasn't drafted to be a starter, either. At least he wasn't as a rookie.

He was drafted to succeed Westbrook (who was on his last legs).
He started 4 games that year and went on to double Westbrook's carries once he went down. He's been the starter ever since.

I know you don't understand, so let me explain it in simple terms:

Toby Gerhart runs people the **** over and does stuff on the field that is valuable. McCluster gets run the **** over and is pretty useless. Does that make sense?

He also outweighs McCluster by 60 pounds.

Yeah, too bad he sucks dick at kickoff returns, too. And he only returned kickoffs because Arenas was hurt or needed a breather.

He had a higher kick return average than Devin Hester last season.
Guess he sucks dick, too?

AND Danny Woodhead, Leodis McKelvin, Javier Arenas...
They all suck dick, too?

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 08:12 PM

He was drafted to succeed Westbrook (who was on his last legs).
He started 4 games that year and went on to double Westbrook's carries once he went down. He's been the starter ever since.

Don't care. Dex failed at a position where he could have started.

He also outweighs McCluster by 60 pounds.

Why does this matter? Has a 170-pound player never succeeded in the NFL? If so, Pioli should be hung for wasting a pick on one.

He had a higher kick return average than Devin Hester last season.

Are you fucking kidding me with this shit?

Really?

You just compared DMC to DEVIN HESTER and you expect me to treat you as anything less than a mouth breathing retard who has his head stuffed way up his homer ass?

Get the fuck out.

Micjones

04-12-2012, 08:21 PM

Don't care. Dex failed at a position where he could have started.

Why does this matter? Has a 170-pound player never succeeded in the NFL? If so, Pioli should be hung for wasting a pick on one.

Are you ****ing kidding me with this shit?

Really?

You just compared DMC to DEVIN HESTER and you expect me to treat you as anything less than a mouth breathing retard who has his head stuffed way up his homer ass?

Get the **** out.

Yep. At this point...
Those Ad Hominem rounds are all that are left in the chamber.

Your argument went limp.

Hammock Parties

04-12-2012, 08:25 PM

My argument went limp? You're the one comparing DEXTER MCCLUSTER to DEVIN FUCKING HESTER.

Dexter McCluster SUCKS as a returner. Devin Hester has HALL OF FAME CREDENTIALS as a kick returner.

AND MY ARGUMENT WENT LIMP?

http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lgrvfjS5kB1qesc3io1_250.gif

Phobia

04-12-2012, 10:13 PM

It would take longer to read that thing than to watch every single play involving Dex in 2011 (and probably his entire career). I'm not doing it. Sorry.

BossChief

04-12-2012, 10:13 PM

I like Dex, but there is no way he would have been in my top ten guys for his draft slot at the time.

That pick should have been Cody, Gronk or Clausen.

Ultra Peanut

04-13-2012, 05:08 AM

Bowe is awesome

Dex isn't

any other questions?
Man. Bowe is awesome.

Micjones

04-13-2012, 06:07 AM

My argument went limp? You're the one comparing DEXTER MCCLUSTER to DEVIN ****ING HESTER.

Dexter McCluster SUCKS as a returner. Devin Hester has HALL OF FAME CREDENTIALS as a kick returner.

AND MY ARGUMENT WENT LIMP?

http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lgrvfjS5kB1qesc3io1_250.gif

We were talking about last season. Not what Devin Hester did in '07 or '08 or over the course of his entire career.

I get it. You don't like Dexter McCluster.
It should be noted that it's simpler to concede that than to ignore numbers that suggest he can and does produce when given the opportunity.