Scott Pioli has holdout experience

[Quesadilla Joe]

Dwayne Bowe’s holdout from the Kansas City Chiefs is sure to wear on the nerves of the team’s general manager, Scott Pioli.

No general manger has much patience for a veteran holdout and I’m sure Pioli is no different. Yet, he does have experience in this situation, as this is not Pioli’s first holdout rodeo.

In 2007, when Pioli was an executive with the New England Patriots, cornerback Asante Samuel held out as the franchise player.

It will be interesting to see if Bowe’s situation resolves itself the same way as Samuel’s issue in New England did. Samuel reported to the Patriots on Aug. 27, 2007, after missing training camp and three preseason games. Bowe -- who missed the entire offseason -- has been out since Chiefs camp started Friday.

Interestingly, Samuel received some concessions from the Patriots as he ended his holdout and signed his franchise tender in 2007. The reported agreement was if Samuel played 60 percent of the defensive snaps or if the Patriots won 12 games in 2007, New England would not put the franchise tag on him. The requirements were met and Samuel went on to sign a monster deal with Philadelphia in 2008 as an unrestricted free agent.

I’m sure Bowe would be interested in a similar agreement, but there are no guarantees the Chiefs would do something similar. If so, I’d think the requirements would be more difficult to attain in Bowe’s particular situation. There was little chance a healthy Samuel would play less than 60 percent of the snaps and the loaded Patriots went 16-0 that season, so the odds were Samuel would not be franchised.

The Chiefs may want to give themselves more protection.

Plus, Samuel was a different player than Bowe. Cornerbacks are valued more than receivers, Samuel was part of two Super Bowl winning teams and he was always a good team player. Who knows how Pioli will react, but the Samuel situation gave him valuable experience in dealing with a veteran holdout.

http://espn.go.com/blog/afcwest/post/_/id/46265/scott-pioli-has-holdout-experience

I wasn't going to post this until I read the bolded part. I remember reading some debate here about whether or not Bowe could work out a deal with the Chiefs so that he couldn't be tagged next year.

[Hammock Parties]

Should read cornerbacks WERE valued more than receivers.

[007]

Pioli wasn't the GM there so he still doesn't have experience in this.

[oldman]

Bowe will play this year. If he leaves $9+M on the table, I'd question if he's smart enough to get on the team bus. That said, the longer he holds out, the farther behind he's going to be in a new system. While that may not be all that important for a WR, it's sure to effect his numbers when he does see the field. That may wind up backfiring on him when it comes to contract time either with us or another team.

[Hammock Parties]

Bowe will play this year. If he leaves $9+M on the table, I'd question if he's smart enough to get on the team bus.

So every player who refuses to play under the franchise tag is a moron?

[King_Chief_Fan]

So every player who refuses to play under the franchise tag is a moron?

yup...in this case for sure. If Bowe thinks he is worth more, then he is a moron

[petegz28]

So every player who refuses to play under the franchise tag is a moron?

Anyone who opts for $0 as opposed to $9.5 mil at the end of the day is a moron. If he doesn't like he plays this year then walks.

[Hammock Parties]

yup...in this case for sure. If Bowe thinks he is worth more, then he is a moron

It's not a question of is he worth more, moron. Bowe would probably happily accept a contract that paid him 9.5 per with a good signing bonus.

He blows out a knee in training camp he gets ZERO MONEY WHATSOEVER this year.

And you call him a moron for not signing a contract that puts him into that kind of risk.

[petegz28]

It's not a question of is he worth more, moron. Bowe would probably happily accept a contract that paid him 9.5 per with a good signing bonus.

He blows out a knee in training camp he gets ZERO MONEY WHATSOEVER this year.

And you call him a moron for not signing a contract that puts him into that kind of risk.

Well, if he holds out he gets zero money.

[Amnorix]

Pioli wasn't the GM there so he still doesn't have experience in this.


This post doesn't make that much sense. Did he have final authority over hte situation? No. But Belichick made it clear that the BB/SP team was a true "team" and Pioli, as the senior guy on the personnel side, was probably the one most closely involved in discussions with Samuel's agent, etc. He was on the front lines of the situation and involved in EVERY discussion on the Patriots side on what to do.

So to say he doesn't have experience dealing with a holdout situation is ridiculous.

[Hammock Parties]

Well, if he holds out he gets zero money.

:facepalm:

He doesn't have to hold out into the regular season.

Risking his health in TC right now though is a pretty questionable idea.

[philfree]

It's not a question of is he worth more, moron. Bowe would probably happily accept a contract that paid him 9.5 per with a good signing bonus.

He blows out a knee in training camp he gets ZERO MONEY WHATSOEVER this year.

And you call him a moron for not signing a contract that puts him into that kind of risk.

I think the new CBA took care of this. He'd get a cool million or so in that situation. And knees can be fixed these days so a career ending injury is unlikely. Bowe would be a fool not to play.

[penguinz]

So every player who refuses to play under the franchise tag is a moron?With the new CBA they pretty much are. Since they are not allowed to negotiate a new contract once the cutoff date has come they really have no choice. They can only lose money for the season not get more.

[Hammock Parties]

He'd get a cool million or so in that situation. And knees can be fixed these days so a career ending injury is unlikely.

Hey, example of this fanbase being full of fucking mouthbreathers.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Hey, example of this fanbase being full of fucking mouthbreathers.

LMAO

[philfree]

Hey, example of this fanbase being full of ****ing mouthbreathers.

You're the Jerry Sundusky of this forum so you probably shouldn't be calling people mouth breathers.

I don't blame Bowe for holding out of camp for now. IMO he needs to show up a day before the 3rd preseason game. He gets three days to acclimate a week of practice and one preseason game to take a handful of reps.

He leaves almost $10mil on the table by holding out for the season then he's a fool.

[BossChief]

It's not a question of is he worth more, moron. Bowe would probably happily accept a contract that paid him 9.5 per with a good signing bonus.

He blows out a knee in training camp he gets ZERO MONEY WHATSOEVER this year.

And you call him a moron for not signing a contract that puts him into that kind of risk.

1) You think Bowe would accept FAR LESS than what comparable players have gotten recently? Vincent Jackson got 11 million per year with a 5.555 million dollar signing bonus. 9.5 million per hear and a gold signing bonus wouldn't get it done.

2) The 9.5 million is FULLY GUARANTEED. Once it's signed, he gets every sime no matter what would cause him to miss the year (as long as it's football related)

If he shows up to camp and blows out his ACL, he still gets the 9.5...but he puts his ability to sign a big deal after the year in jeopardy.

I think Bowe is gonna regret not signing an extension and that he is putting his whole careers earning potential in jeopardy by playing the year on the tag. There isn't a whole lot that can increase his value going forward.

[petegz28]

:facepalm:

He doesn't have to hold out into the regular season.

Risking his health in TC right now though is a pretty questionable idea.

Risking being behind and thus possibly looking not so good ain't gonna help him.

[BossChief]

You're the Jerry Sundusky of this forum so you probably shouldn't be calling people mouth breathers.

:shake:

[King_Chief_Fan]

It's not a question of is he worth more, moron. Bowe would probably happily accept a contract that paid him 9.5 per with a good signing bonus.

He blows out a knee in training camp he gets ZERO MONEY WHATSOEVER this year.

And you call him a moron for not signing a contract that puts him into that kind of risk.
he gets zero either way dip shit. He is guranteed the 9.5 if he has an injury related to football.
what he is risking is waiting until the season starts and not knowing the play book and having less chance for the big pay day.

you are some kind of stupid

[Hammock Parties]

He's guaranteed the 9.5 if he gets hurt in TC?

[O.city]

He's guaranteed the 9.5 if he gets hurt in TC?

That doesn't sound right, but I digress.

[Quesadilla Joe]

He's guaranteed the 9.5 if he gets hurt in TC?

Yes. As soon as he signs that tender his entire salary for the year is guaranteed.

Edit: Assuming he doesn't miss any regular season games because of the holdout, not the injury.

[BossChief]

he gets zero either way dip shit. He is guranteed the 9.5 if he has an injury related to football.
what he is risking is waiting until the season starts and not knowing the play book and having less chance for the big pay day.

you are some kind of stupid

Even if he doesn't know that playbook, he will be a difference maker from the first snap of the regular season.

If the coaching staff isn't prepared to get a player of Bowes ability level ready to play "on the fly", we don't deserve to be a playoff team.

With our opening stretch of games, we NEED Bowe out there if we are to have a chance at getting a good start to the season.

[BossChief]

He's guaranteed the 9.5 if he gets hurt in TC?
Yup. The franchise tag is fully guaranteed.
Yes. As soon as he signs that tender his entire salary for the year is guaranteed.

Edit: Assuming he doesn't miss any regular season games because of the holdout, not the injury.
Nevermind...you edited it.

[philfree]

I was wrong in my psot about the cool million that being said i knew there were rule changes in the new CBA to protect players from not recieving any money if they were injured.

I think the cool million is for playrs under contract but not franchised. Is that right?

[whoman69]

With the new CBA they pretty much are. Since they are not allowed to negotiate a new contract once the cutoff date has come they really have no choice. They can only lose money for the season not get more.

I'm kind of curious when they can? Do they have to wait until February?