What if Pioli & RAC stay, but we get a 1st rd QB?

[RunKC]

Haven't seen this discussed. What are your feelings on if Clark keeps Pioli and RAC, but Cassel is shown the door and we draft a Tyler Wilson/Geno Smith/Tyler Bray next year?

I think I'd still be pissed because Pioli is the end-all problem and a new QB gives him 3 more years.

[RealSNR]

We're nothing unless we go get Black Russian

[Brock]

If by "keep" Pioli, you mean he extends him for 4 years, I'm against it. Against it doesn't really come close to describing how against it I am.

[milkman]

This team is going nowhere with Crennel on the sidelines.

I fully expected things to go bad with Crennel, but didn't expect them to go bad as quickly as they have.

[Chiefs Pantalones]

I don't care. Just get us a QB. A QB really does make it all better. Look at guys like Mike Tomlin and Belichick. I'm sorry, we don't truly know their true genius beyond their franchise QBs. Tony Dungy was a terrible head coach but he had Manning and rode his forehead to a Super Bowl title. It's a players league. I would be fine if those guys stayed because good players make coaches look better, IMO. Coaches do serve their purpose though. Players all the time credit coaches for their development, sometimes everyone needs a push. But in the end, you can coach all you want but if the player doesn't have the talent you and him are looking for another job. Do I want them here? No. Do I have a say in it? No again. Just get a franchise QB and add some more pieces and you'll be surprised. JMO.

[007]

no. I want them gone. I don't want them picking another QB.

[Bowser]

What exactly has either Pioli or Crennel done to make you feel comfortable about them picking up a quarterback in the first round next year?

Their track records with QB's isn't exactly all sparkly.

[Quesadilla Joe]

What if the QB busts? And saying, "at least we tried" is really dumb to me.

You don't just take a QB because you need one, you should only take a QB if he is the right one. If you miss your entire franchise is set back at least 3 or 4 years.

[FAX]

What if Crennel is infected with a virus that found its way to Earth on an asteroid and it turned him into a giant, fat zombie who obeyed Pioli's every command? I haven't seen that discussed, either.

... wait a minute ...

Crennel is a giant, fat zombie who obeys Pioli's every command. And we have discussed that.

Never mind.

FAX

[Chiefs Pantalones]

What if the QB busts? And saying, "at least we tried" is really dumb to me.

You don't just take a QB because you need one, you should only take a QB if he is the right one. If you miss your entire franchise is set back at least 3 or 4 years.

Only losers live in "what if" mode. Take the risk.

[DeezNutz]

What exactly has either Pioli or Crennel done to make you feel comfortable about them picking up a quarterback in the first round next year?

Their track records with QB's isn't exactly all sparkly.

If Herm would have stayed, I'm confident that he would have pushed to take Sanchez, not because of the player but because it would have extended Herm's contract by default.

Let's not set ourselves up for the same bullshit here, please. Management and coaching are incompetent; fine, let's move on.

[NJChiefsFan]

What if the QB busts? And saying, "at least we tried" is really dumb to me.

You don't just take a QB because you need one, you should only take a QB if he is the right one. If you miss your entire franchise is set back at least 3 or 4 years.

I don't think thats really that true anymore. Its certainly not true cap-wise. The time set back is on seeing if the QB works out. Certainly you don't want to just literally draft anyone, but its time to do what it takes to get a guy who at least has a shot. Right now we don't have a guy with a shot. Not drafting a QB for a while because you are afraid of missing is setting the franchise back as it is.

[DeezNutz]

What if the QB busts? And saying, "at least we tried" is really dumb to me.

You don't just take a QB because you need one, you should only take a QB if he is the right one. If you miss your entire franchise is set back at least 3 or 4 years.

Yep, making the dumbest decision in history on a QB in the first sure set the Broncos back 4 years.

[-King-]

If we get a franchise QB, it's worth it.

[New World Order]

I don't want them touching our future qb, Pioli brought in Matt Cassel to be our franchise guy, that didn't work out. He brought Palko in to be our backup, which failed, and drafted Ricky Stanzi.

Just say no.

[Munson]

no. I want them gone. I don't want them picking another QB.

This. I don't want to suffer through another Pioli draft fail. They all need to leave town and never come back. Its time for a new regime.

[Brock]

What if the QB busts? And saying, "at least we tried" is really dumb to me.

You don't just take a QB because you need one, you should only take a QB if he is the right one. If you miss your entire franchise is set back at least 3 or 4 years.

Set back from what for 3 or 4 years? What exactly do the Chiefs lose?

[cdcox]

New QB of franchise potential and HC is the minimum I would accept for Pioli to stay. And Pioli has to publicly admit that Grape Nuts > Matt Cassel.

[007]

What if the QB busts? And saying, "at least we tried" is really dumb to me.

You don't just take a QB because you need one, you should only take a QB if he is the right one. If you miss your entire franchise is set back at least 3 or 4 years.

And you trust Pioli to pick the right one? Shit has he even picked a single "right 1" out of 53?

[DeezNutz]

I don't want them touching our future qb, Pioli brought in Matt Cassel to be our franchise guy, that didn't work out. He brought Palko in to be our backup, which failed, and drafted Ricky Stanzi.

Just say no.

In the preseason, the Stanzi slam would have resulted in numerous calls for apology threads.

The "Executive of the Decade" selected the "GFRPOAT" (greatest fifth-round...)

[Quesadilla Joe]

I don't think thats really that true anymore. Its certainly not true cap-wise. The time set back is on seeing if the QB works out. Certainly you don't want to just literally draft anyone, but its time to do what it takes to get a guy who at least has a shot. Right now we don't have a guy with a shot. Not drafting a QB for a while because you are afraid of missing is setting the franchise back as it is.

I don't think the Chiefs are afraid of missing. I just don't think they have had a franchise guy fall into their lap yet. You guys would know better than I do, but I can't recall a single instance where they passed on a franchise QB in the first round. I guess they had a shot at Flacco, Freeman, and Sanchez but I wouldn't consider them "Franchise QB's".

[DeezNutz]

I don't think the Chiefs are afraid of missing. I just don't think they have had a franchise guy fall into their lap yet. You guys would know better than I do, but I can't recall a single instance where they passed on a franchise QB in the first round. I guess they had a shot at Flacco, Freeman, and Sanchez but I wouldn't consider them "Franchise QB's".

The Redskins had RGIII fall into their laps. Lucky bastards who gave up way too much.

[Molitoth]

I don't care who the coach is... the Coordinators are the important job.

That said, it's the coach/GM job to put a quality effing QB on this roster.
I'm not blaming Daboll.... yet.

[Rasputin]

We need a new "new beginning". I thought about this too. I don't trust Pioli to draft us that QB unless he is told to do so by Clark and if he has to be told how to do his job then he is FN worthless.

[NJChiefsFan]

I don't think the Chiefs are afraid of missing. I just don't think they have had a franchise guy fall into their lap yet. You guys would know better than I do, but I can't recall a single instance where they passed on a franchise QB in the first round. I guess they had a shot at Flacco, Freeman, and Sanchez but I wouldn't consider them "Franchise QB's".

Can't just sit there and wait for it to happen sometimes. I'm not saying they have passed a great chance up every year. Its been how freaking long with this franchise now? 1989. Yeah the Chiefs are afraid of missing. You don't trot out average QB after average QB for 20 plus yrs save for Trent and Montana at the end of his career.

Its time for a risk. Not asking for maniac risk, but its time to sell what we can and buy the best new car we can afford and see how far it goes.

[Unsmooth-Moment]

I'd be ok with Pioli staying, but I want RAC at least demoted.

[Quesadilla Joe]

Set back from what for 3 or 4 years? What exactly do the Chiefs lose?
I don't see what you would have to gain from drafting a guy you don't totally believe in.

[FAX]

And you trust Pioli to pick the right one? Shit has he even picked a single "right 1" out of 53?

I don't have much faith that Pioli will ever hire the kind of head coach we really need, let alone find us a quarterback.

We're upside down on this deal. The first thing we need is a really good HC. The right HC for the Chiefs would address our QB situation ... which is as it should be. He would know how to maximize the talent we have, prioritize the areas of need, communicate these requirements to the GM who then figures out how to acquire players via the draft and FA that are consistent with the HC's program and plan. That's what Carl and Vermeil were able to do, for example.

Right now, we have everything backwards. Pioli is hiring coaches who, as a job requirement, must accept and play his quarterback. That is completely and utterly wrong. It is something Al Davis would do, for crying out loud.

Meanwhile, our player acquisition efforts appear dangerously haphazard which has left us exposed when it comes to roster depth.

Overall, the decisions we've seen so far mostly seem to be about retaining power and control at the GM level. An NFL franchise should not work that way.

FAX

[Quesadilla Joe]

The Redskins had RGIII fall into their laps. Lucky bastards who gave up way too much.

I don't see how you could blame Pioli for not topping that offer. Maybe the Chiefs could have been more aggressive in years past, but then again teams that need a QB aren't going to trade down when a franchise QB is just sitting there when it's their turn to pick.

[Psyko Tek]

What if the QB busts? And saying, "at least we tried" is really dumb to me.

You don't just take a QB because you need one, you should only take a QB if he is the right one. If you miss your entire franchise is set back at least 3 or 4 years.

this franchise has beet set back 3 or 4 years since trent green left
see no big deal if someone tries
do you se it getting better if we don't?

[New World Order]

I don't think the Chiefs are afraid of missing. I just don't think they have had a franchise guy fall into their lap yet. You guys would know better than I do, but I can't recall a single instance where they passed on a franchise QB in the first round. I guess they had a shot at Flacco, Freeman, and Sanchez but I wouldn't consider them "Franchise QB's".



I wouldn't call Tyson Jackson a "Franchise Player" but we selected him third

[Rasputin]

I don't see how Pioli can deserve another year after all the lop sided losses we have had under him. We have taken some major ass whoopings, no excuses for them after his second year.

[BigMeatballDave]

NO

They can fuck off

[Bump]

I don't care. Just get us a QB. A QB really does make it all better. Look at guys like Mike Tomlin and Belichick. I'm sorry, we don't truly know their true genius beyond their franchise QBs. Tony Dungy was a terrible head coach but he had Manning and rode his forehead to a Super Bowl title. It's a players league. I would be fine if those guys stayed because good players make coaches look better, IMO. Coaches do serve their purpose though. Players all the time credit coaches for their development, sometimes everyone needs a push. But in the end, you can coach all you want but if the player doesn't have the talent you and him are looking for another job. Do I want them here? No. Do I have a say in it? No again. Just get a franchise QB and add some more pieces and you'll be surprised. JMO.

he won 11 games with Cassel for that one year...

Belicheck is a pretty good coach.

[BigMeatballDave]

What if the QB busts? And saying, "at least we tried" is really dumb to me.

You don't just take a QB because you need one, you should only take a QB if he is the right one. If you miss your entire franchise is set back at least 3 or 4 years.

You have to try. Period.

[Dr. Johnny Fever]

Haven't seen this discussed. What are your feelings on if Clark keeps Pioli and RAC, but Cassel is shown the door and we draft a Tyler Wilson/Geno Smith/Tyler Bray next year?

I think I'd still be pissed because Pioli is the end-all problem and a new QB gives him 3 more years.

We'll pick the 1st rounder who's a bust. Chiefs way.

[bevischief]

This team is going nowhere with Crennel on the sidelines.

I fully expected things to go bad with Crennel, but didn't expect them to go bad as quickly as they have.

I agree.

[RunKC]

I just don't feel like Pioli will be fired. It just sounds too good to be true. Clark is a loyal guy like his dad. Yeah he fired King Carl, but that was his daddy's main man.

Maybe I can beg Bill Gates for 2 of his 80+ billion dollars he has so I can buy the team! Hey I can dream can't I?

[bevischief]

This team is going nowhere with Crennel on the sidelines.

I fully expected things to go bad with Crennel, but didn't expect them to go bad as quickly as they have.

This.

[Rasputin]

Each of the four drafts Pioli has taken a defensive player in the first round. Three of those were on the d-line & one stud saftey. Yet our defense sucks this year. We got three line backers Hali, DJ & Houston who all should be beasting this year. Yet our defense sucks. We have a defensive HC, yet our defense is sucking this year. Any more blow outs, I don't see how Crennel can keep his job. I don't see how Pioli can keep his job. FN BS if they do.

[Chiefs Pantalones]

he won 11 games with Cassel for that one year...

Belicheck is a pretty good coach.

But they still didn't make the playoffs, even with all that talent coming off an 18-1 season. They obviously missed Brady, who doesn't miss their HOF QB?

I'm not saying he's not a good coach, he's just overrated. Players make coaches, not the other way around IMO.

[Saccopoo]

Cassel has been shoved down our throats for four years. He's trying to make a point with Poe when Powe obviously outplayed him in the preseason. Dexter McCluster has become our featured offensive weapon on a team with Dwayne Bowe, Peyton Hillis and Jamaal Charles. We've had to suffer mediocrity or worse with Patriot-way retreads in the coaching staff over and over and over. The most consistent player drafted over the past four years has been a seventh round kicker.

What the fuck has Pioli done to deserve a job if they tank it yet again this season?!

I don't trust him to pick a QB. I don't trust Crennel or Daboll to coach a good QB.

Screw them.

Let's get a franchise QB *cough* Geno Smith *cough* and a coach that knows what the hell to do with one. And get a GM who doesn't piss off an entire city, all media outlets in said city and who wants to put the fans back in the seats with winning football that reflects the values of the town it's located in.

[spanky 52]

Gotta go with what Sac said.

[BoneKrusher]

i'd rather Clark make changes, Pioli and Romeo grooming a QB sounds scary as hell.
(i mean they believe in Cassel) LMAO

[bricks]

I'm okay with Pioli staying IF and only IF we drafted a QB in the first round and Crennel was demoted to DC and Weis was brought back to coach the offense.

That's the only way this guy stays. Other than that, he could take a hike.

[Hammock Parties]

It's the minimum they can do to inspire hope.

Anything else and I will just sit back and laugh again, and post 10,000 times about what idiots are running the franchise, for another entire fucking offseason.

[Hammock Parties]

This team is going nowhere with Crennel on the sidelines.

I fully expected things to go bad with Crennel, but didn't expect them to go bad as quickly as they have.

This.

It's amazing how the franchise fails to even meet the mediocre expectations I set.

[OnTheWarpath15]

I don't want Pioli to have any part in drafting a R1 QB.

Look at the QB's this team has had, and tell me he's a good talent evaluator at the position.

I've said it for a few years now, but this whole thing needs to be burned to the ground. And that includes the ownership.

That's unlikely to happen, so Pioli, you're Next Man Up.

[milkman]

he won 11 games with Cassel for that one year...

Belicheck is a pretty good coach.

Todd Haley won 10 games with Matt Cassel for that one year.

Haley must be a pretty good coach.

I'm okay with Pioli staying IF and only IF we drafted a QB in the first round and Crennel was demoted to DC and Weis was brought back to coach the offense.

That's the only way this guy stays. Other than that, he could take a hike.

I am happy with the team building philosophy employed by Scott Pioli.
I have argued for years that building a team through the draft is the best way to build a winning team that sustains success.

However, I haven't been happy with many of his selections in the drafts he's overseen.
He's going about it the right way, but making bad decisions.

I want him gone.

I want Romeo Crennel gone.

The antequated passive defensive scheme he prefers doesn't work in today's NFL.
The defense showed some vast improvement over the last half of the season, especially the last 3 games, when he tweeked his system to play a far more aggressive brand of defense, when he attacked more, rather that read an react.

I want a guy that employs an attacking style consistently, not just when things already have gone to shit.

Get me a new GM.
Get me a new HC, and a completely new staff.
Get me a brand new QB, fresh off the lot.

Until that happens, we will just be spinning our wheels.

[qabbaan]

There isn't much I wouldn't consent to in order to get a real QB on this team.

That being said, Romeo isn't good enough as a head coach, and we can't keep coordinators around. We'd still have major issues.

[SAUTO]

Each of the four drafts Pioli has taken a defensive player in the first round. Three of those were on the d-line & one stud saftey. Yet our defense sucks this year. We got three line backers Hali, DJ & Houston who all should be beasting this year. Yet our defense sucks. We have a defensive HC, yet our defense is sucking this year. Any more blow outs, I don't see how Crennel can keep his job. I don't see how Pioli can keep his job. FN BS if they do.
Two linemen a safety and a wr. Dorsey was drafted by Carl
Posted via Mobile Device

[Rausch]

Haven't seen this discussed. What are your feelings on if Clark keeps Pioli and RAC, but Cassel is shown the door and we draft a Tyler Wilson/Geno Smith/Tyler Bray next year?


We can always fire them later...

[bevischief]

I'm okay with Pioli staying IF and only IF we drafted a QB in the first round and Crennel was demoted to DC and Weis was brought back to coach the offense.

That's the only way this guy stays. Other than that, he could take a hike.

Keep smoking whatever you are smoking not going to happen.

[bevischief]

Todd Haley won 10 games with Matt Cassel for that one year.

Haley must be a pretty good coach.



I am happy with the team building philosophy employed by Scott Pioli.
I have argued for years that building a team through the draft is the best way to build a winning team that sustains success.

However, I haven't been happy with many of his selections in the drafts he's overseen.
He's going about it the right way, but making bad decisions.

I want him gone.

I want Romeo Crennel gone.

The antequated passive defensive scheme he prefers doesn't work in today's NFL.
The defense showed some vast improvement over the last half of the season, especially the last 3 games, when he tweeked his system to play a far more aggressive brand of defense, when he attacked more, rather that read an react.

I want a guy that employs an attacking style consistently, not just when things already have gone to shit.

Get me a new GM.
Get me a new HC, and a completely new staff.
Get me a brand new QB, fresh off the lot.

Until that happens, we will just be spinning our wheels.

I am on board for this.

[ILChief]

We can always fire them later...

This. A stud QB will mask many warts

[bevischief]

That's some good stuff share it with Clark.

[jd1020]

If Pioli can put aside his love for Cassel then fine.

Crennel can stay as well... as long as he takes a demotion back to DC where he belongs.

[Rausch]

Todd Haley won 10 games with Matt Cassel for that one year.

Haley must be a pretty good coach.

Rausch spent almost 10 years in college.

He must be a doctor...

[DJ's left nut]

If Pioli and RAC stay, we'll simply be a bad team with a 1st round quarterback and no leadership.

In other words, we'll need to draft another QB in 4 years after this shithouse of a franchise fails to develop the one we drafted in 2013.

If you're content with wasting another 4 years of your life, you should be pretty happy with 4 more years of RAC and Pioli.

They both need to go....badly.

[Rausch]

If Pioli and RAC stay, we'll simply be a bad team with a 1st round quarterback and no leadership.

Odds are we'll be a bad team with a new 3-4 DE drafted in the top 10 and no leadership...

[OnTheWarpath15]

If Pioli and RAC stay, we'll simply be a bad team with a 1st round quarterback and no leadership.

In other words, we'll need to draft another QB in 4 years after this shithouse of a franchise fails to develop the one we drafted in 2013.

If you're content with wasting another 4 years of your life, you should be pretty happy with 4 more years of RAC and Pioli.

They both need to go....badly.

This.

[Bump]

But they still didn't make the playoffs, even with all that talent coming off an 18-1 season. They obviously missed Brady, who doesn't miss their HOF QB?

I'm not saying he's not a good coach, he's just overrated. Players make coaches, not the other way around IMO.

ya, just like the Saints right now?

a good or great head coach makes a world of difference.

[Chiefs Pantalones]

ya, just like the Saints right now?

a good or great head coach makes a world of difference.

The Saints aren't losing because of their head coach being gone. Their defense is garbage.

[Rausch]

The Saints aren't losing because of their head coach being gone. Their defense is garbage.

And never was all that great.

Their HC/play calling covered that up...

[Chief_For_Life58]

if we draft landry jones with our first ill kill myself

[Chiefs Pantalones]

And never was all that great.

Their HC/play calling covered that up...

Their D was more opportunistic than it has been these last two games. They made more plays, they are missing their bounty hunters there. Play-calling is as good as the the players executing it. JMO.

[MahiMike]

Yes, that would be the Jacksonville Jaguars scenario. EXACTLY what you don't want. I could not BELIEVE they drafted Gabbert with a lame duck coach. We better hope the Chiefs don't go this route.

[Rasputin]

Two linemen a safety and a wr. Dorsey was drafted by Carl
Posted via Mobile Device

LOLOL my fail, I forgot about Baldwin him being almost non existent so far this season. IMO Pioli does the same things that Carl had done no difference.

[milkman]

Their D was more opportunistic than it has been these last two games. They made more plays, they are missing their bounty hunters there. Play-calling is as good as the the players executing it. JMO.

Their defense was not nearly as opportinistic last year as they were the year before, and they were even more opportunistic the year before that.

The fact is, that defenses has been bad for as long as Payton has been there.

They were the most opportunistic defense in the league the year they won the SB, but they were a poor D otherwise.

Payton's playcalling, and his adjustments, and the lack thereof this season, are the difference between the Saints now and then.

[Chiefs Pantalones]

Their defense was not nearly as opportinistic last year as they were the year before, and they were even more opportunistic the year before that.

The fact is, that defenses has been bad for as long as Payton has been there.

They were the most opportunistic defense in the league the year they won the SB, but they were a poor D otherwise.

Payton's playcalling, and his adjustments, and the lack thereof this season, are the difference between the Saints now and then.

Agree to disagree. :)