Detailed KC Star article about John Dorsey

[FloridaMan88]

http://www.kansascity.com/2013/01/13/4009205/new-chiefs-gm-dorsey-has-prepared.html


New Chiefs GM Dorsey has prepared for this task

By RANDY COVITZ
The Kansas City Star

In the final days before each NFL draft, longtime Green Bay Packers chairman Bob Harlan would make it a point to sit in the draft room and listen to the discussions.

The one voice he wanted to hear was John Dorsey’s.

Dorsey, who will be introduced today as the Chiefs’ new general manager, spent 21 years in the Packers organization as a scout and later director of college scouting under highly regarded general managers Ron Wolf and Ted Thompson. His opinion went a long way in determining the club’s draft choices that produced three Super Bowl teams and two world champions.

“I noticed under both Ron and Ted, John speaks out, he’s well prepared,” Harlan, now the club’s chairman emeritus after retiring in 2007. “They listened to him. He will say this guy is a prospect, or he’s not. He’s not afraid to put somebody down if other people are praising him and he doesn’t like him. He’ll say why doesn’t like him.

“He’s just as quick to tell everybody about the talents a player has and how he thinks he’ll fit in with Green Bay. He’s patterned himself to build a football team the way they built the Green Bay Packers. He’ll build through the draft. He’ll be very cautious on his free agency ...but he knows talent.”

Dorsey has another characteristic that will be just as important in Kansas City. Though requests to speak to Dorsey were declined by the Chiefs, he’s regarded as a people person, unlike the man he is replacing in Kansas City, the unapproachable Scott *****.

“One of the things that’s going to be very appealing in Kansas City is John’s personality,” said Harlan. “He’s very down to earth. The fans will take to him in a hurry. He’s great in the office, he’s great in the locker room.

“His enthusiasm will rub off on everybody. … There’s no arrogance, there’s no ego … I think he’s perfect for a franchise like Kansas City, and I think Kansas City needs some of that right now.”

Dorsey has turned down opportunities to leave Green Bay in the past _ other than spending 1999 with Thompson and coach Mike Holmgren in Seattle _ and has been a Packer since his playing days as a linebacker during 1984-89.

But Dorsey, 52, worked with new Chiefs coach Andy Reid when Reid was a Packers assistant during 1992-98, and couldn’t pass up this chance.

“He’s a very capable guy who deserved this,” Harlan said. “He called me a couple of weeks ago when this process started, and I told him it’s a great place to go. It’s a great franchise, a wonderful fan base, and he and Andy are so close, they’ll work extremely well together. I think it’s a natural fit.”

And, Dorsey’s wife, Patricia is a graduate of Kansas with a law degree from Washburn University and practiced law in Kansas City before moving to Green Bay. She still works from home for the Kansas City-based law firm, Polsinelli-Shugart.

“They’ve got a wonderful family,” Harlan said, “and are huge KU basketball fans, I can tell you that.”


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While a two-time Yankee Conference Defensive Player of the Year and Division I-AA all-America linebacker at the University of Connecticut in 1983, Dorsey envisioned a career as a trader on Wall Street before he was taken in the fourth-round of the 1984 draft by the Packers.

Dorsey was an overachieving, special teams captain for the Packers, leading the club in special teams tackles three times and playing in 76 consecutive games before suffering a freak knee injury in pregame warmups before the 1989 season opener.

“I guess you could call him a robust player,” Harlan said. “He was a hard-charger. I don’t know that he had the greatest talent the world, but he worked extremely hard, played extremely hard. He was on some bad Packers teams in the ‘80s. We were not a good football team. It was not an easy team to play for. “

Once his career was over, instead of making investments in the stock market, Dorsey began sizing up NFL futures by going into scouting for the Packers.

"After my playing days, I wanted to stay involved with football,” Dorsey told the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel a few years ago. “I could have gone the coaching route, but there is something about scouting and the college game, the college environment that is unique and enjoyable to me. It’s fun."

Dorsey spent 1991-97 as a college scout, then 1997-98 as the Packers director of college scouting; a year at Seattl e as director of player personnel; followed by stints as director of college scouting for the Packers during 2000-11 before his promotion as director of football operations in 2012.

Dorsey first approached then-general manager Tom Braatz in the fall of 1989 about a scouting position.

"I went to Tom Braatz and said, ’I notice your scouts are 55-60 years old … it’s time for some new blood,’’’ Dorsey said. “He really tried to discourage me from getting into it. He said to come back in May after the draft and that we would talk some more if I was still interested."

Dorsey returned and the job unsung job of scouting players on college campuses and evaluating them on film was his. For the next 22 years.

“He’s got a great relationship with the college coaches around the country,” Harlan said. “People like to see John Dorsey arrive on their campus.”

Dorsey applied the same work ethic to scouting and evaluating talent as he did as a player.

"I always say if you’re not out there working, someone else is," Dorsey said. "You have to put in the time to find the players. You have to personally visit the schools and build relationships."

When Wolf was hired as the new general manager in 1991, Dorsey wondered about his future. He got the answer while on a scouting trip.

“I was at Rutgers scouting,” Dorsey told the Milwaukee paper, “and I got a call from Ron saying, ’Can you fly back here and show me how to work this computer?’"


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Dorsey credits his principles of drafting and building a team to what he learned from Wolf and Thompson, including the philosophy of acquiring value in the draft. Dorsey has said the Packers have always been committed to drafting the best available player.

“Best player available. We live it,” Dorsey told the Packers’ web site before the 2011 draft. “Our job is to find the best player we can possibly find to improve our roster. If we can make our roster as competitive as we possibly can, that’s all you can do. We’ve always been taught to stay true to the board, whatever you do, and we stay true to the board.”

That’s what happened in 2005 when quarterback Aaron Rodgers slid to the 25th spot because so many teams drafting ahead of the Packers in the first round did not see the position as one of need, including the Chiefs ,who took linebacker Derrick Johnson with the 15th pick. At the time, Packers legend and future Hall of Famer Brett Favre was coming off his 13th season, but Green Bay kept to their board and drafted Rodgers.

Rodgers understudied Favre for three years before taking over in 2008 and led the Packers to a Super Bowl title following the 2010 season and was league MVP in 2011.

Aside from a player’s height, weight, speed and strength, Dorsey said he looks at five intangibles in a player.

“One, are they a good guy? Two, do they work at their craft? Three, do they love football? Four, are they going to be good in the locker room? And five, would you like to have them as your neighbor?” Dorsey said.

Dorsey also told the Journal-Sentinel that he strongly considers things such as societal factors in figuring out a player.

"Alcoholism, bipolar depression, learning disabilities, ADHD. Each one of those specific types of disabilities will carry over to a person," Dorsey said. "I’m sure there’s a certain percentage of players that have varying degrees of these types of things. We’ve probably found one of the best tests in terms of helping us not to specifically label somebody but at least to throw up a flag to do deeper study in case it does come up.

"We turn rocks over. But tests alone are not the sole determining factor of a person, now, because I can sit down with a person for 10 minutes and kind of walk away and tell you exactly what he’s all about."

All of those factors will be taken into consideration for the Chiefs, who have the first overall pick in the 2013 draft.

“You have the No. 1 draft choice,” Harlan said of the Chiefs. “They can make some hay this year with what they’ve got. I don’t think John feels they’re far way. You’ve got some Pro Bowlers … there’s some talent there. You’re picking up a head coach and personnel man with a lot of experience. That team isn’t very far away. I didn’t think we were in 1991 when I hired Ron Wolf.

“John’s the same age Ron Wolf was when I hired Ron in 1991 … it seems to me it’s a great time for someone to come in and take over a ball club. “

In fact, Harlan points out, in the two decades of the 1970s and 1980s, before Wolf was hired, the Packers had four winning teams and made two playoff appearances. In the last 21 years, under Wolf and Thompson as general manager, the Packers have had 17 winning seasons, made 15 playoff appearances and won two Super Bowls.

“Those,” Harlan said, “are the gentlemen (Dorsey) has learned under.”

[KC Hawks]

Huge KU basketball fan? I already love him.

[RealSNR]

He turns over every rock on a player? So does he talk to Carl the janitor?

[The Bad Guy]

The guy's mantra is best player available. If he doesn't deem Geno Smith the best player available, even though his draft track record with GB is impeccable, this place is going to erupt something fierce.

[KC_Lee]

He turns over every rock on a player? So does he talk to Carl the janitor?

No, Scruffy the Janitor.

[Goldmember]

I'm more excited about this hire than Reid's. I'm not too excited about his choice of def coordinator.

[Goldmember]

The guy's mantra is best player available. If he doesn't deem Geno Smith the best player available, even though his draft track record with GB is impeccable, this place is going to erupt something fierce.

I'd trust his judgment over anyone on this board, except if he brings Matt Flynn in. :)

[Rain Man]

He turns over every rock on a player? So does he talk to Carl the janitor?

"We decided to pass on the defensive end from Auburn because he taped a kid's buns together."

[The Bad Guy]

I'd trust his judgment over anyone on this board, except if he brings Matt Flynn in. :)

You will, I will as well, but there's tons that will freak out.

[the Talking Can]

unlike the man he is replacing in Kansas City, the unapproachable Scott *****.

.

Dorsey returned and the job unsung job of scouting players on college campuses and evaluating them on film was his. For the next 22 years.

“He’s got a great relationship with the college coaches around the country,” Harlan said. “People like to see John Dorsey arrive on their campus.”

[Bowser]

“His enthusiasm will rub off on everybody. … There’s no arrogance, there’s no ego I think he’s perfect for a franchise like Kansas City, and I think Kansas City needs some of that right now.”


You better believe we need some of that right now. Employees, players, and fans.

I'm not jumping the gun with any potential enthusiasm, but things are really looking up right now.

[milkman]

You will, I will as well, but there's tons that will freak out.

You're right.

I will be pissed.

[GloryDayz]

I'm not sure why we even play next year's season, save some QBs and just FedEx the trophy...

[The Bad Guy]

I was 8 years old when Carl Peterson arrived, but everything I've read, these situations are very similar.

You have an rising GM paired with a coach who couldn't get over the hurdle in his last gig.

Top draft pick.

The Chiefs are going back to the family environment that attracted so many.

Bravo Clark. Really unreal job in just 2 weeks.

[tk13]

The guy's mantra is best player available. If he doesn't deem Geno Smith the best player available, even though his draft track record with GB is impeccable, this place is going to erupt something fierce.

It's coming. There's nothing that can be done about it. I don't know if it'll be Geno exactly, but it will happen. I remember friends of mine who were Packer fans when Ted Thompson took over, scratching their head wondering what he was doing with some of their draft picks.

[crossbow]

A perfect hire. He has the experience and knowledge. Clark drives it out of the park.

[teedubya]

Dorsey is HUGE. He could be here for the next 15 years... Damn. Great news for KC fans and for our franchise.

Holy shit.

[GloryDayz]

A perfect hire. He has the experience and knowledge. Clark drives it out of the park.

I wanna "do" the girl in your signature....

[Bowser]

I was 8 years old when Carl Peterson arrived, but everything I've read, these situations are very similar.

You have an rising GM paired with a coach who couldn't get over the hurdle in his last gig.

Top draft pick.

The Chiefs are going back to the family environment that attracted so many.

Bravo Clark. Really unreal job in just 2 weeks.

I wonder who counseled Clark during this year, because he has hit on every move so far this season.

[The Bad Guy]

Dorsey is HUGE. He could be here for the next 15 years... Damn. Great news for KC fans and for our franchise.

Holy shit.

Very well could be. Thought the same thing when he was hired.

[Hammock Parties]

I'm crying.

[Coogs]

Wonder if all of the old retired ex-Chiefs will be welcome around the facilities again... like they should be.

With the kind of personality Dorsey supposedly has, I would think so. Lots of fences need to be mended around KC. Even maybe more so than the fans, ex-Chiefs players would be a good place to start.

[The Bad Guy]

I wonder who counseled Clark during this year, because he has hit on every move so far this season.

A lot of this can be linked to Mark Donovan. Donovan, the guy who leads the business side, was with Reid in Philly and fostered all these relationships.

[crossbow]

I wanna "do" the girl in your signature....

She pissed me off. We were on a hunting trip and all she talked about was oral sex.

[FloridaMan88]

A GM who isn't focused on Rufus Dawes or candy wrappers... what a wonderfully novel concept.

[CaliforniaChief]

Relationships are everything in life...and football is no different. One of the reasons Pioli couldn't go outside "the tree" was that outside of that tree, he was/is reviled. Dorsey's ability to relate well and lack of ego will work well with agents, in negotiations, and with community relations.

It's been an outstanding 2 weeks, as TBG already said.

[Hammock Parties]

http://i.imgur.com/brfPz.gif

[JoeyChuckles]

Dorsey is HUGE. He could be here for the next 15 years... Damn. Great news for KC fans and for our franchise.

Holy shit.

If Green Bay ever fires their GM, it sounds like Dorsey will come running back.

[the Talking Can]

no reid, no dorsey....

reid has already paid a dividend vs any other coach we could have (waited) to hire

[Deberg_1990]

I wonder who counseled Clark during this year, because he has hit on every move so far this season.

Marty

[The Bad Guy]

If Green Bay ever fires their GM, it sounds like Dorsey will come running back.

The only way he'd be able to go running back is if he's fired from here.

[KC Jones]

He sound very committed to BPA. I'll be curious to see how that works with our need for a legitimate QB and the #1 position.

[crossbow]

Politics is a powerful Ally or Enemy depending how you handle it. You can go around spanking people for dropping candy wrappers or you can motivate them with your inspiring leadership.

[GloryDayz]

She pissed me off. We were on a hunting trip and all she talked about was oral sex.

That's your fault, you should heard little more than a muffled sound!

[KC Jones]

If Green Bay ever fires their GM, it sounds like Dorsey will come running back.

Doubt it after reading the article - they're huge KU bball fans and his wife works for a KC law firm and has deep Kansas roots.

[Deberg_1990]

He sound very committed to BPA. I'll be curious to see how that works with our need for a legitimate QB and the #1 position.

Good point because I keep hearing stuff like Geno being only the 15th or 20th best prospect.

[ChiefsCountry]

Chiefs football is back.

[AussieChiefsFan]

Clark has really out-done himself :clap:

[crossbow]

That's your fault, you should heard little more than a muffled sound!

Lol, good advice. Actualy she is Kate Upton. She is going out with Justin Vlander.

[Chiefs Pantalones]

I'm scared. I'm scared we're gonna go after a Flynn or an Alex Smith and draft a QB in the mid-rounds. Ugh.

[Bowser]

http://i.imgur.com/brfPz.gif

Haha, perfect

[Chiefs Pantalones]

Huge KU basketball fan? I already love him.

He knows a winner that's for sure. :) Great taste.

[HolyHat]

I'm scared. I'm scared we're gonna go after a Flynn or an Alex Smith and draft a QB in the mid-rounds. Ugh.

Exact opposite. Reid and Dorsey love to build through the draft. It will be Geno, Wilson or Barkley

[FloridaMan88]

I'm scared. I'm scared we're gonna go after a Flynn or an Alex Smith and draft a QB in the mid-rounds. Ugh.

Dorsey and Reid's track records are to find QB's via the draft rather than in free agency/trades.

[suzzer99]

The guy's mantra is best player available. If he doesn't deem Geno Smith the best player available, even though his draft track record with GB is impeccable, this place is going to erupt something fierce.

I heard he's got his eye on a long snapper at #1.

[CaliforniaChief]

I would assume that when you are choosing best player available, you're also weighting the position they play as a part of the formula you are using to determine your draft board.

[Chiefs Pantalones]

Exact opposite. Reid and Dorsey love to build through the draft. It will be Geno, Wilson or Barkley

But will one of those guys be the BPA at #1? If not, in the later rounds will one of them be there? The pressure will be on by the city and the fans with that #1 overall pick. If it isn't a QB at #1, they better be selling some fancy shit or Chiefs fans won't be buying. Dorsey and Reid's honeymoon will be over in KC already. It's been 30 years.

[the Talking Can]

no one drafts pure bpa

and every team makes their own evaluations so bpa is relative, 32 versions of bpa...no one gives a shit what kiper thinks

[Line Judge]

“One, are they a good guy? Two, do they work at their craft? Three, do they love football? Four, are they going to be good in the locker room? And five, would you like to have them as your neighbor?”

Thank God. No Vick.

[BossChief]

Guys like Reid and Dorsey know the value of a franchise quarterback more than nearly everyone else on the planet.

They wouldn't have came here unless they think they can win here.

Do the math.

Geno Smith will be the pick. No question.

[Rasputin]

He sound very committed to BPA. I'll be curious to see how that works with our need for a legitimate QB and the #1 position.

I am guessing here with my assumption. IMO he puts value with BPA and position like QB being top value. Even if we have a QB he would draft BPA and if that happens to be a QB so be it. He doesn't look at our needs but what players bring in value to the team. JMO.

[DTLB58]

I am guessing here with my assumption. IMO he puts value with BPA and position like QB being top value. Even if we have a QB he would draft BPA and if that happens to be a QB so be it. He doesn't look at our needs but what players bring in value to the team. JMO.

But I can't imagine we resign Albert and they draft the best OT?

[DTLB58]

“One, are they a good guy? Two, do they work at their craft? Three, do they love football? Four, are they going to be good in the locker room? And five, would you like to have them as your neighbor?”

Thank God. No Vick.

Nope. I already said it. No Vick.

[Smed1065]

The guy's mantra is best player available. If he doesn't deem Geno Smith the best player available, even though his draft track record with GB is impeccable, this place is going to erupt something fierce.

They will get over it. This is a great hire and even given our recent history-I will give this FO the benefit of the doubt. They actually have a track record.

[DTLB58]

Exact opposite. Reid and Dorsey love to build through the draft. It will be Geno, Wilson or Barkley

I'm fine with that. At least we are trying again. It's only been since 1983! About time!

[MotherfuckerJones]

I trust Reid, Dorsey and their staff. I really think Geno is the BPA for us. We have to get a QB and take a chance on him. I hope he goes to the combine lights it up and has a great interview. I have no doubt in my mind he'll score well on the wonderlic because Geno has a great IQ.

[DTLB58]

You will, I will as well, but there's tons that will freak out.

I'll be good with it, I might shake my head at first,but I gotta trust them. What else are we gonna do? They aren't gonna take a poll and ask for our opinion.
And these guys should know more than us.

[DTLB58]

Wonder if all of the old retired ex-Chiefs will be welcome around the facilities again... like they should be.

With the kind of personality Dorsey supposedly has, I would think so. Lots of fences need to be mended around KC. Even maybe more so than the fans, ex-Chiefs players would be a good place to start.

Yes, Lynn Stiles talked about that in the audio interview I posted here yesterday.
Old players and front office types would be welcomed back again.

[mcaj22]

no one drafts pure bpa

and every team makes their own evaluations so bpa is relative, 32 versions of bpa...no one gives a shit what kiper thinks

not pure BPA but pure BPA to their system, regardless of depth chart/roster

so their big board is BPA, if the BPA is a guy that might be buried on the draft chart the good teams draft him anyway and groom him. Packers, Ravens do this.

[DTLB58]

“His enthusiasm will rub off on everybody. … There’s no arrogance, there’s no ego I think he’s perfect for a franchise like Kansas City, and I think Kansas City needs some of that right now.”


You better believe we need some of that right now. Employees, players, and fans.

I'm not jumping the gun with any potential enthusiasm, but things are really looking up right now.

So Clark went after exact opposite of what he had in a GM before. Bravo! :clap:

[Lex Luthor]

But will one of those guys be the BPA at #1? If not, in the later rounds will one of them be there? The pressure will be on by the city and the fans with that #1 overall pick. If it isn't a QB at #1, they better be selling some fancy shit or Chiefs fans won't be buying. Dorsey and Reid's honeymoon will be over in KC already. It's been 30 years.
Oh, bullshit.

Reid and Dorsey aren't going to listen to the fans or even the drafturbators on Chiefsplanet, and I wouldn't want them to.

GMs who listen to fans wind up acquiring guys like Tim Tebow. I know, I know, the situations are completely different because the Tebow fans are stupid and the Chiefsplanet fans are smart.

The point is that I hope the Chiefs take Geno Smith with the #1 pick. But if they don't, I'm not going to melt down about it.

The Chiefsplanet drafturbators are never wrong about a quarterback. /Mark Sanchez

[RealSNR]

The guy's mantra is best player available. If he doesn't deem Geno Smith the best player available, even though his draft track record with GB is impeccable, this place is going to erupt something fierce.

See this:

no one drafts pure bpa

and every team makes their own evaluations so bpa is relative, 32 versions of bpa...no one gives a shit what kiper thinks

We're not taking a fucking LT. And we're not taking a DE. Dorsey might be all about BPA, but he's also not a fucking dumbass.

[Rasputin]

But I can't imagine we resign Albert and they draft the best OT?

They are still going be smart with the picks. I think they do want to create "real" competition and when you have two good players you create trade value with one of them. I know what your saying though. It's a philosophy to pick BPA, doesn't mean it always works out that way, but they try to stick with the board.

I think you fill holes in FA but you build your team through the draft making FA players expendable unless they prove to be worth keeping.

[NJChiefsFan]

The Packers drafted 5 straight defensive players to start last years draft, following a season where their defense killed them. Unless its a coincidence, their BPA formula includes need.

[RealSNR]

Oh, bullshit.

Reid and Dorsey aren't going to listen to the fans or even the drafturbators on Chiefsplanet, and I wouldn't want them to.

GMs who listen to fans wind up acquiring guys like Tim Tebow. I know, I know, the situations are completely different because the Tebow fans are stupid and the Chiefsplanet fans are smart.

The point is that I hope the Chiefs take Geno Smith with the #1 pick. But if they don't, I'm not going to melt down about it.

The Chiefsplanet drafturbators are never wrong about a quarterback. /Mark Sanchez
We're never wrong about the need to take a QB. If Dorsey is worth an ounce of shit, he'll put his elite scouting talent to use and find the best QB in the draft, and that will be our pick at #1.

No other position is worth the #1 overall pick pricetag except for a handful, and the Chiefs are covered there.

For fuck's sake, the point of acquiring the #1 overall pick is not just to get a great player, but it's to DEMONSTRABLY make your team better.

A QB and a QB alone will do that for Kansas City. Nothing. Else.

[Hammock Parties]

GMs who listen to fans wind up acquiring guys like Tim Tebow.

What.

There was not a single Broncos fan who wanted Tebow in that draft in the 1st round.

Drafting a QB is smart. (Tebow wasn't a QB, btw)

People here are not gonna bitch if we take a QB. Doesn't have to be Geno. Just fucking take one.

[RealSNR]

The Packers drafted 5 straight defensive players to start last years draft, following a season where their defense killed them. Unless its a coincidence, their BPA formula includes need.

:clap:

[NJChiefsFan]

What.

There was not a single Broncos fan who wanted Tebow in that draft in the 1st round.

Drafting a QB is smart. (Tebow wasn't a QB, btw)

People here are not gonna bitch if we take a QB. Doesn't have to be Geno. Just ****ing take one.

Yeah that was McDaniels trying to get a toy and show he could master the NFL with a player nobody else wanted.

[AussieChiefsFan]

Yeah that was McDaniels trying to get a toy and show he could master the NFL with a player nobody else wanted.Reminds me of someone :hmmm:

[NJChiefsFan]

Reminds me of someone :hmmm:

Yeah, it's weird. Perhaps the two worked together at some point.

[Sorter]

Yeah, it's weird. Perhaps the two worked together at some point.

They might even be pals?

[NJChiefsFan]

They might even be pals?

Compatriots even.

[Titty Meat]

We're never wrong about the need to take a QB. If Dorsey is worth an ounce of shit, he'll put his elite scouting talent to use and find the best QB in the draft, and that will be our pick at #1.

No other position is worth the #1 overall pick pricetag except for a handful, and the Chiefs are covered there.

For ****'s sake, the point of acquiring the #1 overall pick is not just to get a great player, but it's to DEMONSTRABLY make your team better.

A QB and a QB alone will do that for Kansas City. Nothing. Else.

Jimmy Clausen says what up though?

[mcaj22]

The Packers drafted 5 straight defensive players to start last years draft, following a season where their defense killed them. Unless its a coincidence, their BPA formula includes need.

not really.

all depth. Their BPA just fell that way.

I find it hard to believe drafting Casey Hayward includes a NEED when you have Sam Shields, Tramon Williams and Charles Woodson on the roster. Essentially drafting a 4th CB. He at that time was their BPA on their board at that slot, regardless of who they had on their team and they still snatched him. Great insurance policy to groom if Sam Shields walks in a year or when Woodson retires. It's not an immediate need for the 2012 season, is the point.

Yeah the guy had a good year because he was sprung into starters minutes cause a couple of the guys ahead of him got hurt. But it's not like they know that on draft day. They are just a team that always drafts secondary, whether to groom and develop or as an insurance policy. Not because there is necessarily a need.

Same with LBer and D-line. Jerrell Worthy didnt fit a need other than a perfect talent to groom. Even then he's not a need that gets thrown into the starting lineup, he's still 2nd/3rd string depth.

That's just how they draft. Players for positional competition and grooming, not necessarily a positional need.

[Sorter]

Compatriots even.

LMAO

[Sorter]

not really.

all depth. Their BPA just fell that way.

I find it hard to believe drafting Casey Heyward includes a NEED when you have Sam Shields, Tramon Williams and Charles Woodson on the roster. Essentially drafting a 4th CB

Yeah the guy had a good year because he was sprung into starters minutes cause a couple of the guys ahead of him got hurt. But it's not like they know that on draft day. They are just a team that always drafts secondary, whether to groom and develop or as an insurance policy. Not because there is necessarily a need.

Same with LBer and D-line. Jerrell Worthy didnt fit a need other than a perfect talent to groom. Even then he's not a need that gets thrown into the starting lineup, he's still 2nd/3rd string depth.

That's just how they draft. Players for positional competition and grooming, not necessarily a positional need.

Worthy definitely fit a need considering how much they;ve struggled at DE since Cullen Jenkins left IMO.

[RealSNR]

Jimmy Clausen says what up though?

You would agree that there are better QBs in this draft across the board than Jimmy Clausen, yes?

[mcaj22]

Worthy definitely fit a need considering how much they;ve struggled at DE since Cullen Jenkins left IMO.

need as a rotational player yes, not a need as a starter

[Sorter]

need as a rotational player yes, not a need as a starter

I think they drafted him expecting to contribute occasionally this year and step in as a starter next year.

[NJChiefsFan]

Jimmy Clausen says what up though?

And still the Panthers end up fixing their QB issue quicker than us. Picking a QB isn't a death sentence. It just means you are giving yourselves a chance to actually find one some day.

[DaneMcCloud]

Marty

ROFL

[DaWolf]

What they do with Albert will tell us everything that we need to know about how they plan on drafting with that first pick.

The QB position may also be dependent on how they end up ranking the QBs. For example, if Geno is the 7th best player on their board, they may not take him at 1 overall. But if they've got another QB on their board that they think will be around late first, I wouldn't be surprised to see them try to trade back into the first round later on and take that guy. We shall see...

[chiefzilla1501]

And still the Panthers end up fixing their QB issue quicker than us. Picking a QB isn't a death sentence. It just means you are giving yourselves a chance to actually find one some day.

I wouldn't get too excited about "fixing" a QB situation with Cam as your long-term guy.

[DaWolf]

The guy's mantra is best player available. If he doesn't deem Geno Smith the best player available, even though his draft track record with GB is impeccable, this place is going to erupt something fierce.

I think another thing people are going to have to realize is that we're not hiring Dan Snyder here. We will not be going out and signing big ticket free agents in the offseason. This team is going to be built in the draft. People are going to go bonkers when we ignore free agent after free agent and go back to calling Clark cheap.

I have faith that Dorsey and Reid are going to get the draft right in the long term. But in the short term, I don't see us making many sexy moves...

[BossChief]

Who knows what Jimmy Clausen would have been if we drafted him when Charlie Weis was still here. That was a large part of why we liked him so much at the time.

I'd also like to say that it's unfair to judge the guy when he didn't have a chance to develop...lots of qbs have came out looking bad till the point where the game slows down for them kicks in.

[RustShack]

Reid is great with QB's. If he doesn't think Geno is his franchise QB, he can make him look good for a year and trade him for a killing if he really wants to to get his own guy.

But I think Geno has it. Hes very talented, has the size, has speed, and most importantly has arm strength and accuracy. His problems are fixable, and Reid is one of the best in the business to fix him. I think he has everything Dorsey also looks for in a QB.

[Mecca]

not really.

all depth. Their BPA just fell that way.

I find it hard to believe drafting Casey Hayward includes a NEED when you have Sam Shields, Tramon Williams and Charles Woodson on the roster. Essentially drafting a 4th CB. He at that time was their BPA on their board at that slot, regardless of who they had on their team and they still snatched him. Great insurance policy to groom if Sam Shields walks in a year or when Woodson retires. It's not an immediate need for the 2012 season, is the point.

Yeah the guy had a good year because he was sprung into starters minutes cause a couple of the guys ahead of him got hurt. But it's not like they know that on draft day. They are just a team that always drafts secondary, whether to groom and develop or as an insurance policy. Not because there is necessarily a need.

Same with LBer and D-line. Jerrell Worthy didnt fit a need other than a perfect talent to groom. Even then he's not a need that gets thrown into the starting lineup, he's still 2nd/3rd string depth.

That's just how they draft. Players for positional competition and grooming, not necessarily a positional need.

Woodson plays safety now so that opened a CB need.

[TimeForWasp]

I would assume that when you are choosing best player available, you're also weighting the position they play as a part of the formula you are using to determine your draft board.

BINGO!!!

[The Franchise]

I'd take Clausen over Stanzi as the 3rd QB.

[BossChief]

John Dorsey is planting the seeds for drafting Geno Smith. He has basically described him to a t.

[BossChief]

I'd take Clausen over Stanzi as the 3rd QB.

I'd be ok with having those two as the backups. Let Reid coach them up and flip one of em for picks.

[Austin Ed]

Huge KU basketball fan? I already love him.

At least one negative.

[Austin Ed]

Reid is great with QB's. If he doesn't think Geno is his franchise QB, he can make him look good for a year and trade him for a killing if he really wants to to get his own guy.

But I think Geno has it. Hes very talented, has the size, has speed, and most importantly has arm strength and accuracy. His problems are fixable, and Reid is one of the best in the business to fix him. I think he has everything Dorsey also looks for in a QB.

Fast? Geno's low 40 time is 4.76. High is 5.02.

[RustShack]

Fast? Geno's low 40 time is 4.76. High is 5.02.

Which would make him one of the faster QB's in the league.

[Titty Meat]

Which would make him one of the faster QB's in the league.

Doesn't matter he never runs which is one of the annoying things about him.

[Bowser]

Doesn't matter he never runs which is one of the annoying things about him.

If he can develop his game into what Russell Wilson is, that is always looking downfield and running as the very last option, I'd be perfectly ok with that.

[HolyHat]

His fastest 40 time was 4.55, he will run when need be. Kind of like what Aaron Rodgers does. Pass first but very athletic.

[tk13]

At some point we're going to have to put it on the banner at the top of the board: GENO SMITH IS NOT A RUNNING QB. HE'S NOT RUSSELL WILSON OR RGIII, PLEASE MOVE ALONG NOW.

[Bowser]

At some point we're going to have to put it on the banner at the top of the board: GENO SMITH IS NOT A RUNNING QB. HE'S NOT RUSSELL WILSON OR RGIII, PLEASE MOVE ALONG NOW.

But how are we going to implement the pistol offense now?

[HolyHat]

He will run the pistol read option a lot, but throw mostly play action screens and slants out of it, with the occasional keep.

[HolyHat]

That pistol offense is what makes Geno so deadly on 3rd down or in the red zone. When you run it correctly it is almost impossible to defend.

[Chief'nDisBiznitch]

this guy is another ***** hell **** everything up

[Sorter]

this guy is another ***** hell **** everything up

http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/7089/closet.gif

[RustShack]

I don't want him to run. But he has the legs to make something happen if be needs too.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

The guy's mantra is best player available. If he doesn't deem Geno Smith the best player available, even though his draft track record with GB is impeccable, this place is going to erupt something fierce.

It's a bit more nuanced than that. He did say the guy who would improve the roster the most. By that metric, you have to figure the Chiefs are thinking QB. The surplus value is astronomical.

[rtmike]

Good point because I keep hearing stuff like Geno being only the 15th or 20th best prospect.

Best case scenario, trading the #1 pick & still get Geno around 10 or so. :hmmm:

[HolyHat]

If we don't take him, the jags will. Especially with him being from Florida. We have to take him #1 or we will lose him.

[ChiefGator]

The Packers drafted 5 straight defensive players to start last years draft, following a season where their defense killed them. Unless its a coincidence, their BPA formula includes need.

As does Reid's. They have been drafting very heavy in defense the last 2-3 years in Philly trying to repair that D.

[ChiefGator]

I think another thing people are going to have to realize is that we're not hiring Dan Snyder here. We will not be going out and signing big ticket free agents in the offseason. This team is going to be built in the draft. People are going to go bonkers when we ignore free agent after free agent and go back to calling Clark cheap.

I have faith that Dorsey and Reid are going to get the draft right in the long term. But in the short term, I don't see us making many sexy moves...

I think we may see more with Reid prompting him. Reid has made some splashes with trades and free agents over the last couple years. I generally agree though. Slow and steady through the draft is MOST of what we will do. Which isn't really that different than what Piolli was trying to do (despite his bad drafting record).

[HonestChieffan]

But will one of those guys be the BPA at #1? If not, in the later rounds will one of them be there? The pressure will be on by the city and the fans with that #1 overall pick. If it isn't a QB at #1, they better be selling some fancy shit or Chiefs fans won't be buying. Dorsey and Reid's honeymoon will be over in KC already. It's been 30 years.

Seriously doubt Dorsey will walk away from his deep evaluations to get Geno to placate a few fans who have fallen in love with that option. These guys sound like they will move with little emotion and a lot of thought. Tought spot with no top drawer clear winner QB in the draft but you have to trust their study over the Geno or die we read here. One move wont define how fans react. Drop a few wins in Arrowhead and the place will be full

[the Talking Can]

At some point we're going to have to put it on the banner at the top of the board: GENO SMITH IS NOT A RUNNING QB. HE'S NOT RUSSELL WILSON OR RGIII, PLEASE MOVE ALONG NOW.

wrong, he's black

[ncCHIEFfan]

I think we may see more with Reid prompting him. Reid has made some splashes with trades and free agents over the last couple years. I generally agree though. Slow and steady through the draft is MOST of what we will do. Which isn't really that different than what Piolli was trying to do (despite his bad drafting record).

I don't think any team will be successful building through the draft when the coaching is/was a bad as it was in KC the past several years.

[Deberg_1990]

wrong, he's black

If Warren Moon were playing today he would for sure run the read option. : )

[the Talking Can]

If Warren Moon were playing today he would for sure run the read option. : )

WHILE WEARING PARACHUTE PANTS

[Deberg_1990]

heh, someone on the radio this morning brought up an interesting thought. Would Vince Young have benefitted from the read option? Was he mis used by Fisher or maybe a few years too early?

[Crush]

heh, someone on the radio this morning brought up an interesting thought. Would Vince Young have benefitted from the read option? Was he mis used by Fisher or maybe a few years too early?

No, he was just an immature headcase forced down Fisher's throat by Bud Adams.

[RippedmyFlesh]

Doesn't matter he never runs which is one of the best things about him.

FYP

[htismaqe]

Seriously doubt Dorsey will walk away from his deep evaluations to get Geno to placate a few fans who have fallen in love with that option. These guys sound like they will move with little emotion and a lot of thought. Tought spot with no top drawer clear winner QB in the draft but you have to trust their study over the Geno or die we read here. One move wont define how fans react. Drop a few wins in Arrowhead and the place will be full

In your mind.

These guys absolutely DO operate with depth of thought and analysis. That's why they like Geno A LOT more than the average fan.

[htismaqe]

It's a bit more nuanced than that. He did say the guy who would improve the roster the most. By that metric, you have to figure the Chiefs are thinking QB. The surplus value is astronomical.

Exactly.

[dallaschiefsfan]

We won't know for sure until after the combine and east/west game and senior bowl, but if it's pure BPA...prepare for Jarvis Jones...regardless of our current needs...unless we're able to somehow trade down and Geno or Wilson last until our traded down pick. This is not what I want to happen...it's what I'm guessing will happen.

The only consolation is that I'm pretty sure that there will be a QB of low first round value that will slip to our 2nd pick. That's the nature of drafts where the perception is that there are no worthwhile franchise QB's. In this rare instance, this flawed perception could work for us.

[htismaqe]

Best case scenario, trading the #1 pick & still get Geno around 10 or so. :hmmm:

ROFL

Geno falling to 10 is almost as hilarious as people who think we can take Luke Joeckel at 1-1 and still get Tyler Wilson in the 2nd round.

[htismaqe]

We won't know for sure until after the combine and east/west game and senior bowl, but if it's pure BPA...prepare for Jarvis Jones...regardless of our current needs...unless we're able to somehow trade down and Geno or Wilson last until our traded down pick. This is not what I want to happen...it's what I'm guessing will happen.

The only consolation is that I'm pretty sure that there will be a QB of low first round value that will slip to our 2nd pick. That's the nature of drafts where the perception is that there are no worthwhile franchise QB's. In this rare instance, this flawed perception could work for us.

Spinal stenosis.

Jarvis Jones won't be the top pick. He might not even be a top 10 pick when it's all said an done. Hell, he could fall clear out of the 1st round like Marcus McNeill did.

[WildTurkey]

ROFL

Geno falling to 10 is almost as hilarious as people who think we can take Luke Joeckel at 1-1 and still get Tyler Wilson in the 2nd round.

Sweet! Can we move Albert to guard once we get the almighty Joeckel? I hope so. *sarcasm*

[dallaschiefsfan]

Spinal stenosis.

Jarvis Jones won't be the top pick. He might not even be a top 10 pick when it's all said an done. Hell, he could fall clear out of the 1st round like Marcus McNeill did.

You might be right...but without the combine and final games, I'm in a holding pattern on what I think. Currently, this is my best guess. You know how this works. Several guys drop...several rise. I think Jones will either stay steady or rise. We will see.

[htismaqe]

You might be right...but without the combine and final games, I'm in a holding pattern on what I think. Currently, this is my best guess. You know how this works. Several guys drop...several rise. I think Jones will either stay steady or rise. We will see.

He's going to be thoroughly examined by doctors at the combine.

That same examination caused Marcus McNeill's grade to drop a FULL ROUND instantaneously.

[RealSNR]

The only consolation is that I'm pretty sure that there will be a QB of low first round value that will slip to our 2nd pick.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/WrjwaqZfjIY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[ChiefMojo]

We don't need a OLB though as we have Houston and Hali. If we don't take a QB with the #1 pick, it will likely be a LT in Joeckel. With that said I still don't understand why we would take a LT when we can re-sign Albert or at worst tag him for another year?

Star is a excellent prospect but we don't need him at NT after selecting Poe.

[htismaqe]

With that said I still don't understand why we would take a LT when we can re-sign Albert or at worst tag him for another year?

Unless Albert's back is worse than we all think, he'll be re-signed quickly.

Don't worry about it.

[dallaschiefsfan]

He's going to be thoroughly examined by doctors at the combine.

That same examination caused Marcus McNeill's grade to drop a FULL ROUND instantaneously.

All depends on whether he's projected to be an elite pass rusher for at least the length of the first contract. Win now...teams don't care about the longevity of guy's careers. Can he play elite for the next 5 years? That's what the physicals will seek to answer.

[ChiefMojo]

Btw next years OT class looks real good with Taylor Lewan and Jake Matthews also if we need one then. Both were 1st round locks and went back to school.

Dallas, why Jones when we have Hali and Houston???

[htismaqe]

All depends on whether he's projected to be an elite pass rusher for at least the length of the first contract. Win now...teams don't care about the longevity of guy's careers. Can he play elite for the next 5 years? That's what the physicals will seek to answer.

Marcus McNeill was an elite LT prospect. One of the "big 3" of QB, LT, and DE/OLB. He was a potential top 10 pick that fell to the 2nd round. Why do you suppose that was?

They absolutely DO care about it. The fact that McNeill struggled to finish his rookie contract and now looks to be finished after just 5 years is going to further hurt Jones.

[Easy 6]

Just made a $20 bet with a co-worker who says we wont even reach 8-8 next year, how many others here would make the same wager?

[dallaschiefsfan]

They absolutely DO care about it. The fact that McNeill struggled to finish his rookie contract and now looks to be finished after just 5 years is going to further hurt Jones.

That's my point. McNeil slipped because the physicals did not project him to finish his contract as elite. They were right. We'll see what they find and project regarding Jones. This is why I said that the combine has to pass before having a definitive opinion on any of these guys...and the pro-days in some guys' cases.

[RealSNR]

Btw next years OT class looks real good with Taylor Lewan and Jake Matthews also if we need one then.

God damn it! Charlie Casserly has found out where we live! :eek:

[Titty Meat]

FYP

How is that a good thing?

[KCrockaholic]

I trust Dorsey to make the right call on Geno. With that said, if we don't draft him, I'll be pissed. And if we don't draft him, we had better of raped somebody for picks with a trade down of some sort. There is no other option. You live and die by the quarterback. I'm sure Dorsey knows this. So getting that potential franchise QB is what this off season is all about. If we get an average washed up retread, this off season is a failure.

There is 1 goal this off season.

[ChiefMojo]

Lol trust me I hate the talk of LT's with the first pick but just showing that by tagging Albert this year at worst and his back doesn't hold up.... we have good options next year if needed.

We NEED a QB with the #1 pick this year!

[Nightfyre]

Just made a $20 bet with a co-worker who says we wont even reach 8-8 next year, how many others here would make the same wager?

I'd wait til after the draft to make such a bet. JMO.

[The Franchise]

If you don't re-sign Albert.....put fucking Stephenson in. He was at least serviceable.

[Easy 6]

I'd wait til after the draft to make such a bet. JMO.

I have faith that the draft will be just fine, we'll get a QB and given a solid scheme and faith in their leadership, they should be good for atleast 8-8.

Not going to go overboard into 10-6, 11-5 land, but 8-8 should be more than doable.

We'll also have a patsy schedule.

[allen_kcCard]

I am not all that worried about the draft now. I do really hope that we draft Geno, but not because of what I think about him, instead because if we do that means that Dorsey and Reid think that he is the real deal. If we don't, then I will accept that either they don't see enough of an upside to justify taking him above someone else that they see more in to take them in spite of the huge void at the QB position.

My pipe dream is as some others have said here, in either trading back and getting Geno anyhow, or take someone else and trade back into the first to get someone that they see as damn near the same as Geno.

[Chief_For_Life58]

dorsey and AR know the qb position and they certainly know talent. I want Geno but like others have said, these guys know better than probably just about anyone if they think hes the real deal or not, i'll be content with any decision they make. They know whats best.

[rabblerouser]

He turns over every rock on a player? So does he talk to Carl the janitor?

Well, those gum wrappers aren't going to pick themselves up, Carl!!

Sorry...had to.

[Chiefshrink]

I'm more excited about this hire than Reid's. I'm not too excited about his choice of def coordinator.

This !!

[Chiefshrink]

The fact that you see in the last 2yrs very young, athletic QB guys emerge like Cam, RGIII, Wilson, and even Luck with Johnny Football waiting in the wings who are defying the NFL developmental 'consistent success timeline logic' makes it much much easier for Dorsey/Reid to take Geno at ONE regardless of whether he is a solid No.1 or not especially when you NEED a QB !.

How in the hell, do you not take Geno when you see guys like Cam,RGIII, Wilson and Luck rise to the top knowing Geno can be every bit as good if not better in some cases?

[mikey23545]

God, I hope Dorsey passes on Geno Smith just to listen to the shrieking of all the internet football experts on here...LMAO

[HolyHat]

God, I hope Dorsey passes on Geno Smith just to listen to the shrieking of all the internet football experts on here...LMAO

^^^Definition of a total Douchebag ^^^

[mikey23545]

The guy's mantra is best player available. If he doesn't deem Geno Smith the best player available, even though his draft track record with GB is impeccable, this place is going to erupt something fierce.


I assume you realize there are several posters on this board with a far greater NFL drafting acumen than John Dorsey.

[htismaqe]

I assume you realize there are several posters on this board with a far greater NFL drafting acumen than John Dorsey.

Your and idiot.

[BigMeatballDave]

God, I hope Dorsey passes on Geno Smith just to listen to the shrieking of all the internet football experts on here...LMAO

We hope you die in a fire.

[HolyHat]

I assume you realize there are several posters on this board with a far greater NFL drafting acumen than John Dorsey.

I can tell your ass this, I have forgotten more about football in my 28 years of life than you will ever learn. I WAS a scout, and WORKED for an NFL team. GTFO with your bullshit.

[Sorter]

I can tell your ass this, I have forgotten more about football in my 28 years of life than you will ever learn. I WAS a scout, and WORKED for an NFL team. GTFO with your bullshit.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-byu8rLK3RhE/TwI66vskmhI/AAAAAAAAZIE/VI11j7o4YDE/s1600/fistbump.gif

[mikey23545]

I assume you realize there are several posters on this board with a far greater NFL drafting acumen than John Dorsey.



Your and idiot.

We hope you die in a fire.

I can tell your ass this, I have forgotten more about football in my 28 years of life than you will ever learn. I WAS a scout, and WORKED for an NFL team. GTFO with your bullshit.


You're so vain, I bet you thought that post was about you, bout you, bout you...LMAO

[mikey23545]

I can tell your ass this, I have forgotten more about football in my 28 years of life than you will ever learn. I WAS a scout, and WORKED for an NFL team. GTFO with your bullshit.

Link?

[O.city]

As bad as it will be if we don't draft geno, if we do, everyone who was/is against him will be under immense fire.

[Titty Meat]

You're so vain, I bet you thought that post was about you, bout you, bout you...LMAO

Fag

[htismaqe]

You're so vain, I bet you thought that post was about you, bout you, bout you...LMAO

Thinking you're a fucking moron has nothing to do with thinking you were speaking directly to me, or anybody else you quoted.

You're a fucking moron. That's just a general observation.

Moron.