How long can the NFL remain in Jacksonville?

[Prison Bitch]

That was probably the worst home crowd I've seen in the last 20 years. I went to a few Chiefs games in the late 70s/early 80s that were as bad but the League wasn't quite as popular. Jax is a tiny market that always will have questions about their ability to support a pro franchise but to come out with a half empty stadium week 1 was awful. If you removed the Chiefs fans it would've been even worse. With LA sitting empty and Jax playing in an antiquated stadium, in a tiny market, and with a new owner not from there.....is that city now "on the clock"?

[ChiefsCountry]

2030

Ironclad lease.

[chiefzilla1501]

Agreed.

Though I hate the idea of the NFL in LA. And please fire Goodell before he comes up with the mind numbingly stupid idea to put a franchise in London.

[MotherfuckerJones]

Til LA is ready

[Bugeater]

It never should've gone there in the first place.

[Prison Bitch]

Agreed.

Though I hate the idea of the NFL in LA. And please fire Goodell before he comes up with the mind numbingly stupid idea to put a franchise in London.

Jax doesn't bring anything to the TV contract. At least a crappy team in la does add eyeballs no matter if they suck or the fans don't show. Goodell seems serious about London but I'm betting Toronto becomes the first international franchise when the old man in Buffalo kicks it.

[Deberg_1990]

Outside of LA, we are sort of running out of cities that are big enough, have enough money and big business to support an NFL franchise.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Discuss Thrower]

Jax doesn't bring anything to the TV contract. At least a crappy team in la does add eyeballs no matter if they suck or the fans don't show. Goodell seems serious about London but I'm betting Toronto becomes the first international franchise when the old man in Buffalo kicks it.

CFL will block a permanent move to Toronto. If they're going international, it would have to be London. Which is stupid.

Maybe Mexico City, but I highly highly highly doubt that.

[Chiefaholic]

Look for the LA Californicators to build an even larger stadium and wonder why they can't fill it again. Teams left LA in the past for a reason. Why would today be any different?

[ChiefsCountry]

It never should've gone there in the first place.

They were a clean choice for the league. Baltimore and St. Louis were going to be sue happy because they had competing ownership groups.

[chiefzilla1501]

Look for the LA Californicators to build an even larger stadium and wonder why they can't fill it again. Teams left LA in the past for a reason. Why would today be any different?

Every idea, including the stupid ones, will be entertained as long as there's money and that buffoon Goodell is calling the shots.

Good luck trying to convince that market to root for an expansion team instead of the raiders.

[ChiefsCountry]

Teams left LA in the past for a reason.

Al Davis and Georgia the Whore that's why they left LA.

[Ace Gunner]

I have always thought the NFL has too many teams when they expanded to CAR/JAX.

Imo they should just cut those franchises that aren't surviving. SD/JAX.

[chiefzilla1501]

Outside of LA, we are sort of running out of cities that are big enough, have enough money and big business to support an NFL franchise.
Posted via Mobile Device

From a money perspective, yes. Which I think is unfortunate, because there are plenty of great NFL markets still left to explore if money wasn't an issue. San Antonio and Portland are two markets that would probably get a good, strong fan base.

[Valiant]

I have always thought the NFL has too many teams when they expanded to CAR/JAX.

Imo they should just cut those franchises that aren't surviving. SD/JAX.

Fuck up balance, I am happy with four divisions of 4 instead of three with 5

[hometeam]

Its not even there now.

[ChiefsCountry]

Portland is St. Louis and Pittsburgh size with 1 pro franchise, 2 if you count MLS. It could easily support either a NFL or MLB team.

[Deberg_1990]

From a money perspective, yes. Which I think is unfortunate, because there are plenty of great NFL markets still left to explore if money wasn't an issue. San Antonio and Portland are two markets that would probably get a good, strong fan base.

San Antonio has the population. They don't have enough big business and money.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Eleazar]

I said in another thread, there are only 1.3 million people in the metro. In the KC metro you have almost 2.5.

The crowd wasn't bad at the outset. It was the Hali interception that sent people scurrying for the exits.

It's hard to blame the fans, as poor as the team has been the past few years. I doubt we had much more in actual paying attendance last year.

[ChiefsCountry]

San Antonio has the population. They don't have enough big business and money.
Posted via Mobile Device

San Antonio has 5 Fortune 500 companies. They don't have the tv market.

[MahiMike]

That's quite the overreaction. It wasn't that bad. There definitely was fewer than last year's opener but I'd say the fans need some credit. Why continue to pay for an inferior product?

[chiefzilla1501]

San Antonio has the population. They don't have enough big business and money.
Posted via Mobile Device

I agree, and think that's really unfortunate. I mean, we have seen teams like Cleveland and Green Bay thrive despite similar problems. San Antonio would get a great fanbase. LA will bring the money, but the fans will probably suck. Sadly, we know how this story will end.

[Deberg_1990]

Another problem with San Antonio is, the fans here are 90% diehard, loyal to the Cowboys.
Posted via Mobile Device

[CrazyPhuD]

Till bugs saws them off at the panhandle?
http://gifs.gifbin.com/florida.gif

Or until global warming floods the stadium.

[chiefzilla1501]

I said in another thread, there are only 1.3 million people in the metro. In the KC metro you have almost 2.5.

The crowd wasn't bad at the outset. It was the Hali interception that sent people scurrying for the exits.

It's hard to blame the fans, as poor as the team has been the past few years. I doubt we had much more in actual paying attendance last year.

Except that the Jacksonville market was absolutely shitty even when they were making the playoffs. It's a terrible football market.

[Prison Bitch]

That's quite the overreaction. It wasn't that bad. There definitely was fewer than last year's opener but I'd say the fans need some credit. Why continue to pay for an inferior product?

It was terrible, come on. As to the product being bad, for sure. But there are plenty of cities that will also not draw. Why is Jax different or special?

[ChiefsCountry]

Jacksonville's problem is its about the size of Omaha, little bigger but similar.

[chiefzilla1501]

Another problem with San Antonio is, the fans here are 90% diehard, loyal to the Cowboys.
Posted via Mobile Device

I could see that. Same reason I didn't throw Columbus, Ohio in the mix -- would be an interesting NFL market, except that you have the Buckeyes, Browns, and Bengals to compete with.

[tk13]

San Antonio's biggest problem would be fighting the Cowboys. I think they could draw crowds. There's only one game a week. They could probably draw from San Antonio, and Austin too. Not too hard to travel down for a Sunday game.

[Prison Bitch]

I could see that. Same reason I didn't throw Columbus, Ohio in the mix -- would be an interesting NFL market, except that you have the Buckeyes, Browns, and Bengals to compete with.

Same problem Portland would have with U Oregon close by.

[ChiefsCountry]

Same problem Portland would have with U Oregon close by.

Portland is St. Louis's size. Its big enough.

[chiefzilla1501]

Jacksonville's problem is its about the size of Omaha, little bigger but similar.

I don't think that's Jacksonville's problem. I think it's that they're a small market + nobody there cares about football. I don't think Omaha's an attractive market, but I bet they would do a lot better than Jacksonville because they could get a real good quality fan base.

[tk13]

Plus not to diss Oregon fans... but Columbus is insane for Ohio State. If Ohio State told some of those fans to drink cyanide I think they'd do it.

[ChiefsCountry]

I don't think that's Jacksonville's problem. I think it's that they're a small market + nobody there cares about football. I don't think Omaha's an attractive market, but I bet they would do a lot better than Jacksonville because they could get a real good quality fan base.

Jacksonville loves football. Its SEC football that they love.

[GloucesterChief]

San Antonio's biggest problem would be fighting the Cowboys. I think they could draw crowds. There's only one game a week. They could probably draw from San Antonio, and Austin too.


Austin is a really small city though.

Portland is a good choice but Seattle would never have it. Portland is only about 2 hours from Seattle.

The Hampton Roads area in Virginia has a bigger population then Jacksonville, 3+ hours away from the nearest other team and has Richmond, VA area fairly close. The problem is that it is mostly transplants and military, so lack of money.

[chiefzilla1501]

Same problem Portland would have with U Oregon close by.

I don't think it's the same problem. Just because I don't think college sports will hurt your NFL draw too much, the fanaticism of Oregon's fan base isn't going to be even close to Ohio State's, and while Portland is close to Seattle I don't think the Seahawks are going to steal an NFL draw for them. In Columbus, you're probably not going to convince Bengals and Browns fans to change loyalty to a new Ohio team.

[a pp roach]

seahawks fans are seahawks fans. portland would get a team and i think they'd love it. you see how loud the seattle fans are...i'd like to see that happen.

[GloucesterChief]

seahawks fans are seahawks fans. portland would get a team and i think they'd love it. you see how loud the seattle fans are...i'd like to see that happen.

People in Portland are Seahawks fans since the bay area teams are more than a days drive away.

Paul Allen isn't going to let another team come in and take a good chunk of his media market and fan base.

[Deberg_1990]

San Antonio's biggest problem would be fighting the Cowboys. I think they could draw crowds. There's only one game a week. They could probably draw from San Antonio, and Austin too. Not too hard to travel down for a Sunday game.

They drew decent size crowds to the Saints games back in 05 during the Katrina relocation. I think it was 3 games? But yes, an NFC team permanently in SA would not work because people would be furious to lose the Cowboys games. Heh, it's funny, it's hard to find Texans fans. I've got a couple friends in Houston who love the Cowboys and who could give two sh*ts about the Texans.

[GloucesterChief]

Same thing with Portland. The Seahawks are really good right now, moving a dumpster fire like the Jags to Portland will not get many converts.

[Deberg_1990]

Oklahoma City Jaguars?

[Discuss Thrower]

Oklahoma City Jaguars?

OU, OSU and the Cowboys.

[FloridaMan88]

Jaguars move to LA, LA Jaguars move to the NFC West, St. Louis Rams move to the AFC South.

Done.

[GloucesterChief]

Maybe here?

http://www.hamptonroadschamber.com/uploads/images/HamptonRoadsMap.jpg

http://eastbeachnorfolk.com/images/Norfolk%20CVB%20skyline%20Banner%20Sized%20Aerial.jpg

[ChiefsCountry]

Maybe here?

http://www.hamptonroadschamber.com/uploads/images/HamptonRoadsMap.jpg

http://eastbeachnorfolk.com/images/Norfolk%20CVB%20skyline%20Banner%20Sized%20Aerial.jpg

And you think Portland is crazy over Seahawks. Norfolk is even crazier over the Redskins.

[GloucesterChief]

FedEx field is also 4+ hours away from Norfolk.

[a pp roach]

one navy town to another? interesting

[chiefzilla1501]

Same thing with Portland. The Seahawks are really good right now, moving a dumpster fire like the Jags to Portland will not get many converts.

I disagree. I think there's a lot to be said for owning your own market from your own city or state. No matter what market you're in, you're going to have problems stealing another team's fans. I think Portland by a mile is probably the market with the smallest problem building their own organic fan base with true loyalty to that team.

I agree that Seattle will fight against this, but I don't think the NFL will really care too much. They'll run into this problem no matter where they go, unless they go international.

[ekf028]

OU, OSU and the Cowboys.

Yup. Even though there is a pretty good amount of Chiefs fans here in NE Oklahoma.... it's definitely Cowboy country.

[Chiefshrink]

Til LA is ready

Yep ! Soon as the $$ is there which might be awhile since CA is broke:rolleyes:

[tk13]

We'll solve this problem. Time to meet your Fargo Jaguars.

[Deberg_1990]

Anchorage Jaguars?

[Discuss Thrower]

We'll solve this problem. Time to meet your Fargo Jaguars.

Only if the oil industry kicks ass up there.

[Deberg_1990]

Honolulu Jaguars?

[dirk digler]

Vegas would be the obvious choice but the NFL will never allow it

[Rudy tossed tigger's salad]

They drew decent size crowds to the Saints games back in 05 during the Katrina relocation. I think it was 3 games? But yes, an NFC team permanently in SA would not work because people would be furious to lose the Cowboys games. Heh, it's funny, it's hard to find Texans fans. I've got a couple friends in Houston who love the Cowboys and who could give two sh*ts about the Texans.

Houston does just fine. Get more Houston friends. Fuck Dallas

[chiefzilla1501]

I don't know if this is a crazy idea and maybe I'm just talking out loud, but I've always been surprised that Kentucky doesn't have any major sports teams. A market like Louisville could do really well. Probably more ideal for baseball, but still...

The other market that doesn't have any problems with fan loyalty is Salt Lake City. They have their college programs there, but they easily have the market and the money.

[chiefzilla1501]

Vegas would be the obvious choice but the NFL will never allow it

Yup. Too close to the gambling circuit, and honestly, I'd hate for a team to be there. I want football games to be rivalries, not tourist attractions.

[Discuss Thrower]

I don't know if this is a crazy idea and maybe I'm just talking out loud, but I've always been surprised that Kentucky doesn't have any major sports teams. A market like Louisville could do really well. Probably more ideal for baseball, but still...

The other market that doesn't have any problems with fan loyalty is Salt Lake City. They have their college programs there, but they easily have the market and the money.

SLC isn't even 200k

[ChiefsCountry]

I don't know if this is a crazy idea and maybe I'm just talking out loud, but I've always been surprised that Kentucky doesn't have any major sports teams. A market like Louisville could do really well. Probably more ideal for baseball, but still...

Louisville is 100 miles away from Indianapolis and Cincinnati.

[ChiefsCountry]

SLC isn't even 200k

1.1 million in the metro

[GloucesterChief]

Louisville is fairly close to Cinci.

[Deberg_1990]

Albuquerque or Boise Jaguars?

[dirk digler]

Yup. Too close to the gambling circuit, and honestly, I'd hate for a team to be there. I want football games to be rivalries, not tourist attractions.

If I was commish I would put a team there and help them build a big ass stadium and host the SB every other year.

[listopencil]

Maybe here?

http://www.hamptonroadschamber.com/uploads/images/HamptonRoadsMap.jpg



I would love to see another NFC team move into VA. I was born in Newport News, lived in between Newport News and Williamsburg for a good chunk of my life. I don't see it happening but it would be fun for me.

[ChiefsCountry]

Albuquerque or Boise Jaguars?

Albuquerque made a move for the Saints. Little small on population, they are right at a million. No Fortune 500 companies either.

[chiefzilla1501]

Louisville is 100 miles away from Indianapolis and Cincinnati.

I've never lived there, so I don't know the market. I never felt like that city had really much allegiance to any team. Cincinnati a little bit, but I see that as a market that could quickly rally behind a team of their own, especially if it was branded as a Kentucky team. I've heard some people in Louisville tell me that the Cubs have a huge fan base there, so that probably speaks to their Ohio loyalties.

Again, think the market's more ideal for baseball, but with Louisville and Lexington being pretty much right next door to each other, you have a decent market. And you have Yum Brands, Papa Johns, and big bourbon, so plenty of potential business backers.

[listopencil]

They could always go ahead and change the Washington Redskins name to the Virginia Somethings.

[Discuss Thrower]

I've never lived there, so I don't know the market. I never felt like that city had really much allegiance to any team. Cincinnati a little bit, but I see that as a market that could quickly rally behind a team of their own, especially if it was branded as a Kentucky team. I've heard some people in Louisville tell me that the Cubs have a huge fan base there, so that probably speaks to their Ohio loyalties.

Again, think the market's more ideal for baseball, but with Louisville and Lexington being pretty much right next door to each other, you have a decent market. And you have Yum Brands, Papa Johns, and big bourbon, so plenty of potential business backers.

No one cares about football.. And if anyone does, it's Louisville fans who've jumped on the bandwagon in the last 10-15 years.

[Kiimo]

Yep ! Soon as the $$ is there which might be awhile since CA is broke:rolleyes:


The Jags are moving to LA I'd bet anything on it. The stadium issues will get worked out. Remember when the Dodgers had no money? That seems like a distant dream and it was like a year or two ago.

I don't know why nobody would want a team in LA. I mean, I guess I understand people have preconceived notions based on the Rams and the Raiders but those were their own unique situations.

If the Jags moved to LA and won some games (big if) then they'd be the toast of the town.

But I'll say this: there will be no winning with Gabbert. That team is doomed with him at QB.

[chiefzilla1501]

If I was commish I would put a team there and help them build a big ass stadium and host the SB every other year.

As I've said before, it's the thing to do from a money perspective. I just think it's going to be completely shitty from the perspective of "does this make the NFL more interesting to watch?" The market would make money, but it would be a completely shitty fan base.

[GloucesterChief]

They could always go ahead and change the Washington Redskins name to the Virginia Somethings.

The only way they can do that is if the stadium is in Virginia. The Redskins practice facility is in VA and they play in Maryland. The naming here in the DC area is tricky.

[Discuss Thrower]

1.1 million in the metro

Then SLC might make sense but they'd have to share the stadium with the Utes which presents issues.

[chiefzilla1501]

No one cares about football.. And if anyone does, it's Louisville fans who've jumped on the bandwagon in the last 10-15 years.

Like I said, I think it's a good baseball market. In a lot of ways, I see it as being a St. Louis like market. Great for baseball, not good at all for football.

I disagree with the idea, by the way, that just because a fan base doesn't root for an NFL team, means they couldn't root for a team if it was based in their city. I mean, for a team in a new market, you're going to have to build that fan base from scratch. If anything, that makes it more likely they'll rally behind the team, because they don't have conflicting loyalties.

[Deberg_1990]

The Birmingham Jaguars!

[ChiefsCountry]

Like I said, I think it's a good baseball market. In a lot of ways, I see it as being a St. Louis like market. Great for baseball, not good at all for football.

I disagree with the idea, by the way, that just because a fan base doesn't root for an NFL team, means they couldn't root for a team if it was based in their city. I mean, for a team in a new market, you're going to have to build that fan base from scratch. If anything, that makes it more likely they'll rally behind the team, because they don't have conflicting loyalties.

Baseball is a population driven league, you need at least 2 million in the metro to have a shot.

[chiefzilla1501]

The Jags are moving to LA I'd bet anything on it. The stadium issues will get worked out. Remember when the Dodgers had no money? That seems like a distant dream and it was like a year or two ago.

I don't know why nobody would want a team in LA. I mean, I guess I understand people have preconceived notions based on the Rams and the Raiders but those were their own unique situations.

If the Jags moved to LA and won some games (big if) then they'd be the toast of the town.

But I'll say this: there will be no winning with Gabbert. That team is doomed with him at QB.

I think in LA, you get the same dumbass type fans who root for the Heat. Fans who will go to games because it's something to do, but have no passion whatsoever for the team. It will probably look and feel like the Chargers.

The true football fans in that area are going to root for the Raiders or the 49ers.

[tk13]

I don't think Indy or Cincy or Nashville would want Louisville to get a team. All are within an easy drive.

Plus the Yum Center has had a massive debt problem, if I'm not mistaken. You'd probably have a hard time getting public funding for a stadium.

[TimBone]

The Jaguars moved themselves to L.A. On my Madden franchise. Just putting that put there in case it helps.

[listopencil]

The only way they can do that is if the stadium is in Virginia. The Redskins practice facility is in VA and they play in Maryland. The naming here in the DC area is tricky.

Yeah, I would imagine that it's a major point of contention. I looked at the wiki just now. It says that the stadium was built in 1994, and that there has been talk of building a new one in DC. I wonder if they could get any traction for the idea of moving it down into VA and changing the name?

[GloucesterChief]

Last time they tried, Northern Virginia doesn't want it because Snyder wants to keep the Washington name instead of calling it the Virginia so and sos.

[chiefzilla1501]

I don't think Indy or Cincy or Nashville would want Louisville to get a team. All are within an easy drive.

Plus the Yum Center has had a massive debt problem, if I'm not mistaken. You'd probably have a hard time getting public funding for a stadium.

Yeah, I'm not crazy about the idea, just think it's an interesting sports market (probably not for football, but for something). The other markets are ones I'd really prefer over LA or London.

[Tombstone RJ]

That was probably the worst home crowd I've seen in the last 20 years. I went to a few Chiefs games in the late 70s/early 80s that were as bad but the League wasn't quite as popular. Jax is a tiny market that always will have questions about their ability to support a pro franchise but to come out with a half empty stadium week 1 was awful. If you removed the Chiefs fans it would've been even worse. With LA sitting empty and Jax playing in an antiquated stadium, in a tiny market, and with a new owner not from there.....is that city now "on the clock"?

the reason that nobody was there is probably because both teams suck? I hate to burst your bubble but kc is not a big draw team. As for Jax moving to LA who knows?

[tk13]

Yeah, I'm not crazy about the idea, just think it's an interesting sports market (probably not for football, but for something). The other markets are ones I'd really prefer over LA or London.

I remember reading an article a few months back where they floated the idea of an NBA team... it seemed mostly to help offset the massive debt they had on the building.

[chiefzilla1501]

the reason that nobody was there is probably because both teams suck? I hate to burst your bubble but kc is not a big draw team. As for Jax moving to LA who knows?

How can you call a team that has usually had no problems selling out games a team that doesn't draw fans? Same with Cleveland. Imagine if these two teams fielded winners.

It's not just about the market size. It's how many loyal fans you have in the market. And how many fans you can pull from outside of the market. The Chiefs' following extends way beyond Kansas City.

[Tombstone RJ]

How can you call a team that has usually had no problems selling out games a team that doesn't draw fans? Same with Cleveland. Imagine if these two teams fielded winners.

It's not just about the market size. It's how many loyal fans you have in the market. And how many fans you can pull from outside of the market. The Chiefs' following extends way beyond Kansas City.

the chiefs are not like the cowboys or even the packers in that when kc travels to a town like Jacksonville, the stadium isn't going to sell out just because it's the chiefs. That's what I mean by kc not being a big draw team. KC sells out at home (in Kansas City) just fine, but that doesn't mean they are a big draw team across the country.

[Prison Bitch]

the reason that nobody was there is probably because both teams suck? I hate to burst your bubble but kc is not a big draw team. As for Jax moving to LA who knows?

Oh the place woulda been just packed to the gills if Denver was there instead today. Lol, nice try boner.

[chiefzilla1501]

the chiefs are not like the cowboys or even the packers in that when kc travels to a town like Jacksonville, the stadium isn't going to sell out just because it's kc. That's what I mean by kc not being a big draw team. KC sells out at home (in Kansas City) just fine, but that doesn't mean they are a big draw team across the country.

Not a lot of teams are.

And I think the big difference is that KC has a really large draw in non-NFL markets. They own several states in the midwest excluding a very small pocket of fans who care about the Rams.

[KChiefs1]

Jaguars move to LA, LA Jaguars move to the NFC West, St. Louis Rams move to the AFC South.

Done.

I bet the Raiders end up in LA again.

[Tombstone RJ]

Oh the place woulda been just packed to the gills if Denver was there instead today. Lol, nice try boner.

Denver isn't a "big draw" team either. Rabid fans in and around Colorado yes, but I never said Denver was like the cowboys.

[chiefzilla1501]

I bet the Raiders end up in LA again.

I am not a fan of a new team in LA. Moving the Raiders back to LA makes a hell of a lot more sense.

[Barret]

If the NFL wants to go international but London seems kinda far away, why not Mexico City?

It is closer and the population is there. Is it just too dangerous or not enough corporations or something? I am just throwing out an idea.

The Azteca Stadium there can already seat 104,000 people but it was built in 1966.

[AussieChiefsFan]

Yeah, it really was amazing seeing a stadium so empty during the home opener. As much as LA wants a team, it wouldn't be hard to just move them and change their name. I'm not sure about if there's anything forcing them to stay in Jacksonville, but if not, I don't see why their new owner couldn't just move them to LA and change their name (and hopefully their jerseys too). Also, it'd make the Raiders even more irrelevant, which seems impossible, but this would do it.

[Portlantis]

Portland is St. Louis's size. Its big enough.

The population is there. Portland is the 28th largest city in the U.S., has the 19th largest metropolitan area and the 22nd largest media market.

It's not a great sports town, though. It's a city that tends to attract people who don't care about sports that much. There's a reason it only has one major sports franchise (two if you count the Timbers, but still). I doubt you could keep the stadium filled after the newness has worn off, and there is almost no way you could get Portland taxpayers to pay for a stadium.

[nychief]

London

[dannybcaitlyn]

If they would have signed the home town hero Tebow, the place would have been packed.

[Eleazar]

I don't think that's Jacksonville's problem. I think it's that they're a small market + nobody there cares about football.

You don't have the slightest idea what you're talking about.

[Red Gorilla]

It's a small town with a college football fan base. They would have sold the place out if they signed Tebow but, I don't think the owner wants to. He's ready to move to LA imo.

[Hoover]

Jacksonville shows the rest league that the product on the field still matters.
Locating another team in Florida was a big mistake in my opinion. Florida already had the Dolphins and Bucs, and while Jacksonville is far away enough from the other two, I think it was risky to locate another team there.

All that said, I don think that the Jacksonville franchise can work there. They have a great owner, and in time I think he can turn the team around. I think they have a good coach too, but without a legit QB, I think its impossible for a quick turnaround. I don't blame the fans for staying away. That team is awful, but I think they will come back as the product improves.

I also think it would be difficult for the NFL to relocate the franchise. This was an expansion team and moving them would involve the NFL admitting to a mistake. If anyone should be moved to LA its the Raiders. The Bay Area already has the 49ers, and Oakland is a nasty place. Al Davis made a stupid ass decision when they moved back to Oakland, it was a move that saved him money but was not in the best interest of the league or his team. Like Jacksonville, that team will be fine once they put a good product on the field.

Finally, the NFL doesn't need anymore east coast teams, but I do think it could use another team out west. Instead of adding a team in LA, I think Portland or even Las Vegas makes the more sense.

[Hoover]

Oh, and the idea of a London Team is stupid. The time change alone will make it difficult not only for TV but the team it self and the teams that have to travel there.

[chiefzilla1501]

You don't have the slightest idea what you're talking about.

I should have clarified. NFL Football. The fan bases for NFL Florida teams are okay, and Tampa and Miami are established franchises in major markets. Given the saturation of strong college football programs, makes sense. Jacksonville is an expansion franchise in a much smaller market. If you don't have a rabid fan base like Green Bay, you're dead in the water.

[Archie F. Swin]

Jacksonville's problem is its about the size of Omaha, little bigger but similar.

statistics/geography is not your strong suite, eh?

[AussieChiefsFan]

If they would have signed the home town hero Tebow, the place would have been packed.That would ahve been awesome. Too bad New England picked him up to turn the media away from the Hernandez situation, then dropped him.

[whoman69]

Yeah, it really was amazing seeing a stadium so empty during the home opener. As much as LA wants a team, it wouldn't be hard to just move them and change their name. I'm not sure about if there's anything forcing them to stay in Jacksonville, but if not, I don't see why their new owner couldn't just move them to LA and change their name (and hopefully their jerseys too). Also, it'd make the Raiders even more irrelevant, which seems impossible, but this would do it.

After they came up with the new helmets?

[AussieChiefsFan]

After they came up with the new helmets?Oh god those helmets. Jesus.

http://nesncom.files.wordpress.com/2013/04/jaguars-helmet.jpg?w=614&h=461


It's like someone just came over and spray painted them.

[MahiMike]

Jacksonville always gets picked on in this argument. There are plenty of other cities with worse attendance. 12 to be precise. Of the 3 cities in Florida w/a team, they have the best attendance.

They're only 4 spots behind KC.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/attendance/_/year/2012

[Prison Bitch]

This was an expansion team and moving them would involve the NFL admitting to a mistake.


It was a mistake from day 1. And the attendance over the years proves it. Yesterday wasn't the first (nor will be the last) time that place was a morgue.

[ChiliConCarnage]

Jacksonville always gets picked on in this argument. There are plenty of other cities with worse attendance. 12 to be precise. Of the 3 cities in Florida w/a team, they have the best attendance.

They're only 4 spots behind KC.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/attendance/_/year/2012

Interesting. In 2011 the Chiefs were 8th in attendance. I assume that was season ticket sales from the 2010 playoff run.

Jax only had 59k for the home opener yesterday so it was worse than their average game in recent years.

[Prison Bitch]

Interesting. In 2011 the Chiefs were 8th in attendance. I assume that was season ticket sales from the 2010 playoff run.

Jax only had 59k for the home opener yesterday so it was worse than their average game in recent years.

I'd eat my ass if there were even 30k actual warm bodies there yesterday.

[Archie F. Swin]

I'll never for get when Tom Coughlin, Mark Brunell and Tony Boselli(sp) visited Mile High one January in 97 and busted up some shit.

BEST GAME EVER

[Dayze]

Birmingham AL?

..wait, no way. That place is fucking batshit for either Auburn or The Tide.

[whoman69]

Jacksonville always gets picked on in this argument. There are plenty of other cities with worse attendance. 12 to be precise. Of the 3 cities in Florida w/a team, they have the best attendance.

They're only 4 spots behind KC.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/attendance/_/year/2012

I don't think they know how to count

[BigRedChief]

the chiefs are not like the cowboys or even the packers in that when kc travels to a town like Jacksonville, the stadium isn't going to sell out just because it's the chiefs. That's what I mean by kc not being a big draw team. KC sells out at home (in Kansas City) just fine, but that doesn't mean they are a big draw team across the country.The waitress who took care of us was told that Chief fans travel well and expect a big crowd tonight. The Landing was packed with Chief fans.

[Deberg_1990]

El Paso Jaguars!

[Lex Luthor]

Look for the LA Californicators to build an even larger stadium and wonder why they can't fill it again. Teams left LA in the past for a reason. Why would today be any different?
The Rams left because Georgia Frontiere was a stupid bitch who decided to move the team to her home town after she inherited it from her husband. The Raiders left because Al Davis is Al Davis. I don't think you can discern any legitimate reason why the city is without a team from those two moves.

I find it amazing that the NFL has let a city that large go without an NFL franchise for so long. It makes zero sense.

[Deberg_1990]

I find it amazing that the NFL has let a city that large go without an NFL franchise for so long. It makes zero sense.

This. They are leaving money on the table.....and the NFL doesn't leave money on the table.

[GloucesterChief]

LA isn't really a sports town unless you are winning or the Lakers.

[Brock]

The Rams left because Georgia Frontiere was a stupid bitch who decided to move the team to her home town after she inherited it from her husband. The Raiders left because Al Davis is Al Davis. I don't think you can discern any legitimate reason why the city is without a team from those two moves.

I find it amazing that the NFL has let a city that large go without an NFL franchise for so long. It makes zero sense.

LA hasn't spread its cheeks for the nfl like other cities do.

[ChiefsCountry]

I find it amazing that the NFL has let a city that large go without an NFL franchise for so long. It makes zero sense.

New or remodeled stadiums in:
Charlotte
Jacksonville
St. Louis
Baltimore
Nashville
Cleveland
Tampa Bay
Cincinnati
Seattle
Houston
Pittsburgh
Philadelphia
Denver
Detroit
Arizona
Chicago
New England
Kansas City
Indianapolis
Dallas
New York
San Francisco
Minnesota

Mainly used in the threat of team moving to Los Angeles.

[Prison Bitch]

As the last post points out, LA was used as the foil to get chump cities to pony up cash for stadiums. When the last one gets done, LA will have done their duty and will be rewarded by all the other thankful owners with a unanimous vote to move Mr Khan and his garbage roster out of Jax

[chiefzilla1501]

LA isn't really a sports town unless you are winning or the Lakers.

I am not excited about an LA franchise at all, unless it's moving the Raiders back there. I get that for the NFL, it's a no-brainer. But as a fan, I think it sucks.

[Prison Bitch]

Why? You have some affinity for Jacksonville?

[chiefzilla1501]

Why? You have some affinity for Jacksonville?

No, if you follow the thread, I'd rather a team get put somewhere else where you can get a really strong, loyal fan base.

[Mojo Jojo]

I find it funny all that want Jax to move...maybe they should. But let's be real...the NFL and other teams were saying the exact same thing about KC in late 70's/early 80's.