Police stun stepdad trying to save son from fire

[petegz28]

ST. LOUIS (AP) — The family of a 3-year-old killed in a northern Missouri house fire says it is outraged after police used a stun gun on the boy's stepfather as he tried to run back in and save the child.

Riley Miller died early Oct. 31 in the Mississippi River town of Louisiana. A city police officer fired his stun gun at Ryan Miller as he tried to re-enter his burning home, which was destroyed.

Grandmother Lori Miller says she witnessed two officers use the stun gun three times, twice after Ryan Miller had been handcuffed.

Miller suffered chest burns and was later released from the city jail without being charged.

The family says it is considering legal action against the city.

City Administrator Bob Jenne called the police response a "judgment call."

Copyright 2013 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

Read more: http://www.myfoxny.com/Story/23906473/police-stun-stepdad-trying-to-save-son-from-fire#ixzz2jzWETTPz

[kepp]

Wow. I'm sure they'll say they were protecting him as he was a danger to himself, but damn.

[Predarat]

I hate suing, but I hope they sue the hell out of that damn police department and win a shitload. Police everywhere are getting way out of hand.

[Dayze]

"Judgement call" ahh, those are my favorite.

[Frosty]

TV and movies always show it as no big deal to go into a burning home but, irl, it is really stupid and frequently deadly. The police probably saved his life.

That said, I can completely see where Miller was coming from. :(

[Ace Gunner]

"safety first"

[InChiefsHeaven]

Say it goes down like this:

"Police fail to stop a man from going into a burning house to try to save his stepson. Both the man and the child were killed in the blaze.

The family is demanding an investigation in to how the police could let the man, who is not trained to enter a burning house, go in to his death."

You could see it going both ways. I think it just sucks, the cops probably did save his life, but damn...it just sucks...

[The Franchise]

Say it goes down like this:

"Police fail to stop a man from going into a burning house to try to save his stepson. Both the man and the child were killed in the blaze.

The family is demanding an investigation in to how the police could let the man, who is not trained to enter a burning house, go in to his death."

You could see it going both ways. I think it just sucks, the cops probably did save his life, but damn...it just sucks...

This.

[Dante84]

Yeah, sucks, but I'm with the cops on this one

[MIAdragon]

Yeah, sucks, but I'm with the cops on this one

Fuck that, if my child is in a burning house I'm doing everything I can to get them out, if I die trying so be it but Id rather die trying than live knowing I didn't try. Anyone else can get bent.

[wazu]

Say it goes down like this:

"Police fail to stop a man from going into a burning house to try to save his stepson. Both the man and the child were killed in the blaze.

The family is demanding an investigation in to how the police could let the man, who is not trained to enter a burning house, go in to his death."

You could see it going both ways. I think it just sucks, the cops probably did save his life, but damn...it just sucks...

The problem is, if it's your kid, you'd probably rather die trying to save them than to not even get to try.

[Predarat]

**** that, if my child is in a burning house I'm doing everything I can to get them out, if I die trying so be it but Id rather die trying than live knowing I didn't try. Anyone else can get bent.

Exactly, that shit should not be left up to the damn cops.

[demonhero]

**** that, if my child is in a burning house I'm doing everything I can to get them out, if I die trying so be it but Id rather die trying than live knowing I didn't try. Anyone else can get bent.

meh, what if you have other kids that made it out of the house and you are their last kin. You got to be a father for them right?

[Gonzo]

I think this could be split either way depending on if you have a kid.

[The Franchise]

The problem is, if it's your kid, you'd probably rather die trying to save them than to not even get to try.

He's not saying that. He's stating that people could flip it around to sue the cops if they didn't stop him.

[JENKINSWINS]

**** that, if my child is in a burning house I'm doing everything I can to get them out, if I die trying so be it but Id rather die trying than live knowing I didn't try. Anyone else can get bent.

Those nipples doe!

[A Salt Weapon]

**** that, if my child is in a burning house I'm doing everything I can to get them out, if I die trying so be it but Id rather die trying than live knowing I didn't try. Anyone else can get bent.

This, anyone attempting to stop me from saving one of my children would see a rath like no other. It speaks volumes for this man that he tried and his step-son no less. This is a real dad here. Awesome story and I hope this man receives the largest settlement ever.

If this ever happened to me those cops would be worried every time they closed their eyes to sleep. And I would love to be on this man's jury if he decided to pursue justice on his own.

[Dante84]

**** that, if my child is in a burning house I'm doing everything I can to get them out, if I die trying so be it but Id rather die trying than live knowing I didn't try. Anyone else can get bent.

Absolutely agree with that mindset.

I also agree with the mindset of the officer, who's job it is to stop more people from dying.

[Ace Gunner]

I believe a man is born with the liberty to choose the day to die. or to potentially die.

[wazu]

He's not saying that. He's stating that people could flip it around to sue the cops if they didn't stop him.

People "could" sue you for just about anything you do or don't do. In this case they will probably sue for what they DID do.

Want to CYA? Make a failing attempt to physically restrain the Dad without a Taser. "I tried but he was just too strong."

[The Franchise]

This, anyone attempting to stop me from saving one of my children would see a rath like no other. It speaks volumes for this man that he tried and his step-son no less. This is a real dad here. Awesome story and I hope this man receives the largest settlement ever.

If this ever happened to me those cops would be worried every time they closed their eyes to sleep. And I would love to be on this man's jury if he decided to pursue justice on his own.

http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/watch-out-we-got-a-badass-over-here-meme.png

[Dante84]

This, anyone attempting to stop me from saving one of my children would see a rath like no other. It speaks volumes for this man that he tried and his step-son no less. This is a real dad here. Awesome story and I hope this man receives the largest settlement ever.

If this ever happened to me those cops would be worried every time they closed their eyes to sleep. And I would love to be on this man's jury if he decided to pursue justice on his own.

The cops didnt start the fire or kill the little boy...

Its tough. I know what you're saying, but its like, you can't be mad at the police for doing their job, too.

[Marcellus]

Without being there to see the situation its impossible to know if the Police did the right thing or not.

I mean did the wife need to lose her son and her husband, become a widow for no reason in a potentially helpless situation?

[BIG_DADDY]

You don't stop parents from trying to keep their child from burning to death. Good god.

[Eleazar]

Supposedly just taking one or two breaths of that superheated air will render you unconscious, but when you're talking about a man and his child... jeez, let him assume the risk

[Ace Gunner]

He's not saying that. He's stating that people could flip it around to sue the cops if they didn't stop him.

I don't think that would have any legal ground.

[Eleazar]

If this ever happened to me those cops would be worried every time they closed their eyes to sleep. And I would love to be on this man's jury if he decided to pursue justice on his own.

Ah yes, the obligatory "I would go Rambo on people" and "I would love to be on the jury" post

[BIG_DADDY]

Without being there to see the situation its impossible to know if the Police did the right thing or not.

I mean did the wife need to lose her son and her husband, become a widow for no reason in a potentially helpless situation?

It's not their place to make that decision.

[Dante84]

I believe a man is born with the liberty to choose the day to die. or to potentially die.

That opens a can of worms regarding legalized euthanasia.

Good point, though. I can see the side of the dad being allowed to make the decision for himself.

However, it may put the fireman's life at risk for having to go save the dad, and then you've caused even more death, intentional or not.

[The Franchise]

Look.....I'd be the first one to run back into a burning building to rescue any of my three daughters. But we have no clue about the situation. It says the house was destroyed. We have no idea how long the boy had been in the fire.

[Marcellus]

It's not their place to make that decision.

Actually it is.

[The Franchise]

It's not their place to make that decision.

Yeah, it's totally not the cop's job to save lives. :rolleyes:

[HoneyBadger]

Sad a kid has to die, but the police did a good job of possibly saving the life of the father.

[Frazod]

I've seen several versions of this story, and all have been written to some degree with an anti-cop bias. Bias is what it is, regardless of whether you tend to agree with the slant or not.

If the cop lets the guy run into the house and he dies, how are they not liable? Although it's more likely that the stepfather would have hit that wall of heat and stopped on his own. That's a serious attitude changer, loved one in peril or not. And it also sounds like the kid was probably dead already anyway.

They do enough bad shit that's legitimate, I'm not going to get bent out of shape over this.

[Aspengc8]

**** that, if my child is in a burning house I'm doing everything I can to get them out, if I die trying so be it but Id rather die trying than live knowing I didn't try. Anyone else can get bent.

This.

[Predarat]

I believe a man is born with the liberty to choose the day to die. or to potentially die.

Yes and those damn cops took that right away from that man.

[demonhero]

there's a time to be rambo and then there's time to use you're brain. If the dad gets a phone call from the neighbor and he rushes home from work and no firefighters insight, yes he should run in and attempt to save the boy. However, if he gets there and the firefighters are doing their job.... leave it up to the guys that fight fires for a living.

[Buns]

What is a three year old doing inside of a house, let alone a burning house, by himself?

[BIG_DADDY]

Yeah, it's totally not the cop's job to save lives. :rolleyes:

If you don't have the freedom to try and save your own child's life you really have nothing.

[warrior]

If you don't have the freedom to try and save your own child's life you really have nothing.



Have to agree and its not being a bad ass they should have let him try to save the kid since they were not going to but with not knowing more about the story who knows just sucks a three year old died.

[crazycoffey]

Say it goes down like this:

"Police fail to stop a man from going into a burning house to try to save his stepson. Both the man and the child were killed in the blaze.

The family is demanding an investigation in to how the police could let the man, who is not trained to enter a burning house, go in to his death."

You could see it going both ways. I think it just sucks, the cops probably did save his life, but damn...it just sucks...

This, smoke in burning houses are nothing like you see in the movies, it's thick, hot and immediately overwhelming. I once made it in the back door of a house with a fire in the basement. If the resident hadn't made it upstairs on her own, I would not have been able to go any further.

But I'm sure in this case, the cop just wanted to be a control freak and taze someone, let a child die and play god. :rolleyes: it's a very tragic situation on all fronts, let's not over react people....

[BIG_DADDY]

Have to agree and its not being a bad ass they should have let him try to save the kid since they were not going to but with not knowing more about the story who knows just sucks a three year old died.

Big time, I can't even imagine.

[Iowanian]

I can understand why the cops did what they did.

I can also understand all too well why the dad was going in.

When your child is in danger, you just react and I know from experience that you don't care about your own safety whatsoever.

Either way, it's a terrible outcome for that family.

[Mr. Laz]

lose/lose

[crazycoffey]

I can understand why the cops did what they did.

I can also understand all too well why the dad was going in.

When your child is in danger, you just react and I know from experience that you don't care about your own safety whatsoever.

Either way, it's a terrible outcome for that family.

Yup, I don't blame dad either, I'd try too, regardless of the odds of success or my own survival.

[Frazod]

This, smoke in burning houses are nothing like you see in the movies, it's thick, hot and immediately overwhelming. I once made it in the back door of a house with a fire in the basement. If the resident hadn't made it upstairs on her own, I would not have been able to go any further.

Exactly. Until you've charged into a burning building or compartment, you just don't know what it's like. Hell, I got burned through my clothes fighting a controlled fire at firefighting school.

[kepp]

lose/lose

Pretty much this. I'm sure the cops felt absolutely horrible about what they did, even though they were sure they had to do it. And the dad...goodness...I can't imagine. There's just no winning in that situation.

[wazu]

What is a three year old doing inside of a house, let alone a burning house, by himself?

Yeah, this is a pretty gaping hole in the story.

[Frazod]

Here's a link to a more detailed story.

http://www.christianpost.com/news/missouri-police-tasered-desperate-father-trying-to-save-3-y-o-son-as-he-dies-helplessly-in-house-fire-108061/

[alnorth]

I don't have a problem with the father, and I don't have a problem with the cops, either. They did the right thing. The only issue I have is with the family threatening to sue, they obviously have no case.

[The Franchise]

Here's a link to a more detailed story.

http://www.christianpost.com/news/missouri-police-tasered-desperate-father-trying-to-save-3-y-o-son-as-he-dies-helplessly-in-house-fire-108061/

So wait a second.....the parents initially left the house without getting their son first? Why didn't he try and save him then?

[Mr. Laz]

So wait a second.....the parents initially left the house without getting their son first? Why didn't he try and save him then?

maybe he was intent on saving his wife and then tried to go back in for the son


it's just a shitty situation

[Randallflagg]

Without being there to see the situation its impossible to know if the Police did the right thing or not.

I mean did the wife need to lose her son and her husband, become a widow for no reason in a potentially helpless situation?

I don't think that it's so much that the police stopped the man from entering the house but it's the way they did it. Tasered him three times - once while in handcuffs in the back of the car.

[The Franchise]

Oh....and the police are heartless because they didn't try and run into the building themselves to save the kid? Fuck this bitch.

[The Franchise]

maybe he was intent on saving his wife and then tried to go back in for the son


it's just a shitty situation

That may be. But if it's me....I'm telling my wife to go outside and call 911 while I go get my son.

The parents reportedly escaped the burning house through a rear door in the building when smoke woke them from their sleep and they called 911. They then ran to the front of the house and Ryan Miller was trying to break down the front door as police and firefighters arrived on the scene. Jenne confirmed that he was stunned with a Taser and restrained.

[Frazod]

From the other article:

State Fire Marshal Investigator Scott Stoneberger explained that a firefighter in full gear had attempted to enter the house but the flames were too hot.

If a fireman in full gear won't go in, the stepfather isn't getting in. It's really that simple.

[The Franchise]

From the other article:



If a fireman in full gear won't go in, the stepfather isn't getting in. It's really that simple.

And apparently the cops were assholes for not going in themselves.

[Mr. Laz]

From the other article:

If a fireman in full gear won't go in, the stepfather isn't getting in. It's really that simple.
and sadly the boy was already gone

[wazu]

That may be. But if it's me....I'm telling my wife to go outside and call 911 while I go get my son.

Since he was trying to break down the front door, I'm assuming that the path from the room they woke up in must have been blocked by the fire.

[crazycoffey]

That may be. But if it's me....I'm telling my wife to go outside and call 911 while I go get my son.

Agree

[Ace Gunner]

From the other article:



If a fireman in full gear won't go in, the stepfather isn't getting in. It's really that simple.

true dat

[Iowanian]

18 seconds.
On average, it takes 18 agonizing seconds for a child to die in a fire.


This is one of the few stories posted here that makes me physically ill.

[The Franchise]

Since he was trying to break down the front door, I'm assuming that the path from the room they woke up in must have been blocked by the fire.

And by that time....the kid is gone.

[trndobrd]

I can understand the police actions if the firefighters are actively fighting the fire and someone trying to run back in would interfere with their efforts. If it's just a bunch of people standing around watching a house burn, then let the guy try to get his kid.

[A Salt Weapon]

What is a three year old doing inside of a house, let alone a burning house, by himself?

Clearly starting fires is the answer to this question.

[A Salt Weapon]

bad ass picture

Hardly, but I'm guessing you are not a parent.

[A Salt Weapon]

If you don't have the freedom to try and save your own child's life you really have nothing.

100% spot on.

[demonhero]

this "father" had his rambo moment. Its too bad he spent it running out the back door per say the other news article. This father probably could circumvent his whole house crawling on his knees with a blindfold on, but he spent his heroic effort making his way out the back hatch.

[Jimmya]

Too many liberal lovers here saying cops should decide what's best for us. If he wanted to go back in that's his choice.

[Canofbier]

Too many liberal lovers here saying cops should decide what's best for us. If he wanted to go back in that's his choice.

This n00b is going to fit in nicely with the "red BUT NOT THAT KIND OF RED I'M NOT A COMMUNIST YOU ARE" crowd at CP.

[Aries Walker]

I'm with you, Jimmya, and Big Daddy, and everyone else who said the decision should have been the man's. Yeah, he might have died going in, or the kid might have already been gone, but (and call my old-fashioned) it's a man's purpose in life to try.

Beyond just this instance, this is a problem with tasers, pepper spray, and other less-lethal weapons since their introduction a decade or two ago; instead of having their use replacing lethal force - as they were intended and advertised - their use is in many cases replacing the lack of force.

[LoneWolf]

It's not their place to make that decision.

It is their job. To serve and protect is what they are supposed to do. If the house is a raging inferno and they know it is a suicide mission for the father to enter the house, they have an obligation to stop him.

Oh, and before the obligatory "you must not have kids" post. I have a 2 year old son and I would absolutely try to go in after him, but I would also understand the cops doing what they could to stop me.

[LoneWolf]

18 seconds.
On average, it takes 18 agonizing seconds for a child to die in a fire.


This is one of the few stories posted here that makes me physically ill.

Hope your little man is still doing well. This story probably hits a little too close to home.

[T-post Tom]

**** that, if my child is in a burning house I'm doing everything I can to get them out, if I die trying so be it but Id rather die trying than live knowing I didn't try. Anyone else can get bent.

If I were the cop, I would have let the parent go in. I couldn't live with myself if I hadn't. There is no good answer to that situation.

[The Franchise]

Hardly, but I'm guessing you are not a parent.

I have 3 daughters, moron.

[A Salt Weapon]

I have 3 daughters, moron.

I stand corrected, I have 3 boys myself and there isn't a force on this earth that could stop me from doing everything in my power including sacrificing my own life to protect them. As was said earlier, I would rather die trying than live knowing I did not.
I made a choice to be willing to sacrifice my life for this country, the fuck if I wouldn't do the same for my family. I love them and don't even like most of the people in this country.

[Pitt Gorilla]

**** that, if my child is in a burning house I'm doing everything I can to get them out, if I die trying so be it but Id rather die trying than live knowing I didn't try. Anyone else can get bent.This. I'm going in. At that moment, nothing else matters.

[A Salt Weapon]

It is their job. To serve and protect is what they are supposed to do. If the house is a raging inferno and they know it is a suicide mission for the father to enter the house, they have an obligation to stop him.

Actually they don't. The US Supreme Court has even ruled on this issue. Police have no obligation to protect the citizens. Also, "to serve and protect" was the motto for the LAPD and nothing more. It is not the duty of police.

[Mr. Laz]

Too many liberal lovers here saying cops should decide what's best for us. If he wanted to go back in that's his choice.
if it's any consolation, i would definitely let you go back inside a burning building

[Gravedigger]

Say it goes down like this:

"Police fail to stop a man from going into a burning house to try to save his stepson. Both the man and the child were killed in the blaze.

The family is demanding an investigation in to how the police could let the man, who is not trained to enter a burning house, go in to his death."

You could see it going both ways. I think it just sucks, the cops probably did save his life, but damn...it just sucks...

An investigation but probably not a lawsuit. I don't pity Police Officers, they have extremely difficult jobs that are thankless most of the time. He made the right decision going by the rule that 2 lives lost is worse than 1 life lost. I sympathize with both parties.

[LoneWolf]

Actually they don't. The US Supreme Court has even ruled on this issue. Police have no obligation to protect the citizens. Also, "to serve and protect" was the motto for the LAPD and nothing more. It is not the duty of police.

I'll be damned. I can admit when I'm wrong. I couldn't find any cases like this one, but I did read the Supreme Court ruling.

It doesn't change my opinion that I believe the police did he right thing in this particular situation (would've liked to see them restrain the stepfather without the taser). It sucks either way, but one person dead instead of two is the better outcome.

[petegz28]

All I will say is this....we made heroes and deservedly so, out of the cops and firefighters that ran into the two towers and lost their lives trying to save people they didn't know.

This man was prevented from doing the same for his own son or step son in this case.

I think I have to side with those who say I wouldn't have even given a second thought to going in and saving my Son, even if it meant we both don't come out.

[The Franchise]

All I will say is this....we made heroes and deservedly so, out of the cops and firefighters that ran into the two towers and lost their lives trying to save people they didn't know.

This man was prevented from doing the same for his own son or step son in this case.

I think I have to side with those who say I wouldn't have even given a second thought to going in and saving my Son, even if it meant we both don't come out.

No one is giving the father shit for trying to go back in. But demonizing the cops for trying to save another life is fucking retarded.

[petegz28]

No one is giving the father shit for trying to go back in. But demonizing the cops for trying to save another life is ****ing retarded.

Let me rephrase, I agree that I did not word that as intended. If I were a Cop I'd let the guy go try and save his son.

[The Franchise]

The only thing that is questionable is the use of the tazers. But I'm sure the cops knew that it was going to take multiple cops just to hold the guy back...and then they're risking injury trying to keep him from going back in.

So question....do you let the kid's 16 year old brother run back in?

[InChiefsHeaven]

We can all talk about what we would or would not do in that situation. I can't imagine myself NOT going back into the house for either of my two children. I also can't imagine leaving in the first place without everyone in front of me. I'm NOT saying the guy didn't care about the kid. He made a split decision to get his wife out and then tried to go back for the stepson. I wasn't there, I have no idea what the fuck was going on in that chaos. What I'm sure of is that the guy is probably going over everything in his mind on how he might have done things differently. Maybe some of those cops are as well. Cops are not robots, they are human beings. I err on the side of this was a fucking horrible situation, everyone involved made split second decisions based on what their minds allowed for at the time. I pray for this man and his wife and the soul of that poor child.

It. Just. Sucks. That is all...

[Chiefaholic]

I sincerely hope I never get put in the same circumstances. However, there's no doubt in my mind I'd run back into the house if a child were still inside. The burns will eventually heal, but I couldn't live with myself knowing I didn't make an attempt to save a childs life.