Personal Bragging: My 50th Half-Marathon

[Rain Man]

Last Saturday's race (in 42 degree temps in the rain, I might add) was my 50th half-marathon since I started my hobby in June of 2009.

My vital statistics are:

Completed races in 12 states so far (AK, HI, CA, NV, UT, WY, CO, TX, LA, FL, OH, and WI)

Median pace = 10:15 per mile
Median pace in flat, sea level races =9:37 per mile
Fastest pace = 9:04 per mile (Beaumont, TX - flat and sea level)
Slowest pace = 29:36 per mile (Pike's Peak Ascent - 7,800 foot climb from 6,300 ft to 14,100 ft and I was not good at it.)

14 have been at elevations between sea level and 3,000 feet (Median pace = 9:52)
21 have been at elevations of 3,000 to 6,000 feet (Median pace = 10:06)
9 have been at elevations of 6,000 to 9,000 feet (Median pace = 11:08)
9 have been at elevations of 9,000 feet or higher (Median pace = 15:29)

26 have been more or less flat with total hills < 300 ft (Median pace = 9:50). Three were net downhill.
12 have had moderate hills with total hills of 301-1,000 ft (Median pace = 10:43)
6 have had strong hills with total hills of 1,001-2,500 ft (Median pace = 12:10)
9 have had major hills with total hills of 2,500 ft or more (Median pace = 15:29)

The 9 with major hills are the same 9 that were over 9,000 feet in elevation.

3 races were run in the rain and 1 in snow.

I've only fallen once, and it wasn't in the rain or snow. (Tripped on a trail rock.)

24 were primarily on pavement or asphalt
6 were primarily on dirt roads
20 were primarily on trails

I've gone the wrong way on trails 4 times but only twice did it for more than 30 seconds. The worst mistake added 3/4 of a mile.

I've also had 2 10-mile races and a 10K in there, so that's 53 races in 54 months.

[SPchief]

Congrats! Ever done the full?

[Superbowltrashcan]

Never ran that many races but plenty of training runs of 13.1 and farther. Be careful how much you do. You only have so much articular cartilage in those joints. I started running competitively at 14 and ran my last step at 45. Bone on bone in my knees now. Paid for most of college so I guess it was worth it. Those altitude races can be killer. Curious have you kept track of your total entry fees amount? Or tracked it to see if race costs are rising faster than inflation?

[Superbowltrashcan]

Crap too late for me!! Congrats on this. It is quite an accomplishment. And do a full if you can at least once.

[cdcox]

Some of his high altitude races were already run for a longer time and at a higher heart rate than a flat marathon.

[Rain Man]

Congrats! Ever done the full?

Some of his high altitude races were already run for a longer time and at a higher heart rate than a flat marathon.

No, I've never done a full one. The longest distance race I've done is a 25K (about 15.6 miles). I've done some longer training runs to test the theory and I don't think I'm serious enough to do one. It starts becoming non-fun after about 15 miles.

However as cdcox mentioned, some of my mountain runs have been similar in terms of total time and effort. I've had 1 race of more than 4 hours and 2 in the 6 hour range just because of the elevation and hills.

[Rain Man]

Never ran that many races but plenty of training runs of 13.1 and farther. Be careful how much you do. You only have so much articular cartilage in those joints. I started running competitively at 14 and ran my last step at 45. Bone on bone in my knees now. Paid for most of college so I guess it was worth it. Those altitude races can be killer. Curious have you kept track of your total entry fees amount? Or tracked it to see if race costs are rising faster than inflation?

Y'know, I haven't kept track of entry fees. I'm not sure if I've been doing it long enough to compare inflation. They've ranged from about $35 to about $120, and I think they've averaged about $70.

Sorry about the knee problems. Those can take a guy down. I'm always surprised by how fast the top guys in my age group are, though. There are some really fast 50-somethings out there. I'm kind of glad to get out of the 40-something category, though, because the top guys there are scary fast.

[ThaVirus]

Congratulations.

I run a mile and a half to the gym every day and I fucking hate it. It's usually the worst part of my day.

[007]

I do 5k, 4 mile and 10k runs. I just don't know that I want to even try a half marathon. Don't know how you do that. But it is impressive!!!!

[Silock]

CAN YOU PLAY RIGHT TACKLE?

[farmerchief]

Kudos, Rain Main! I wish I had your motivation, along with your stamina!

[HemiEd]

Congrats Kevin, that is awesome. I am going to venture a guess you don't smoke, or never have?:D

[Marcellus]

Congrats! Thats impressive for 4.5 years or so. Sounds like its time for Leadville!

[the Talking Can]

eh...that's only 25 full marathons

[ChiTown]

Y'know, I haven't kept track of entry fees. I'm not sure if I've been doing it long enough to compare inflation. They've ranged from about $35 to about $120, and I think they've averaged about $70.

Sorry about the knee problems. Those can take a guy down. I'm always surprised by how fast the top guys in my age group are, though. There are some really fast 50-somethings out there. I'm kind of glad to get out of the 40-something category, though, because the top guys there are scary fast.

A minor victory for us older types.:D

[Dayze]

Jesus dude. Props to you.

no way I could ever do that.
.....ever.

[HonestChieffan]

Very cool. My niece finished her 50 under 50 this fall. 50 full marathons under 50 years old.

[seclark]

geeze, you runners...blows my mind.

wife has ran all her life(mostly from me). I have no idea how many halfs she's ran. ran her first full marathon the day she turned 50. I figured she'd do it, then hurt so bad she'd quit and shut the fuck up about it. nope.

she's ran 6 this year and qualified for boston in april, so we're going that.

actually, I usually have a pretty good time going w/her and watching everyone run. I think Chicago has been my favorite so far. pretty awesome watching and hearing everyone cheer the runners on. all makes and models of runners...pretty cool.

as for this old fat man...piss on that. I walk 5.5 miles a day, 6 days a week and really don't care to do it. sure, I feel better after, except for my feet, ankles, knees and chaffed taint, but that's over an hour and a half of my life that could be used for getting numb.

congrats to you, rain man...does your wife run with you, or go to your races?
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[BlackHelicopters]

Can you play RF or 2B?

[Superbowltrashcan]

Sorry about the knee problems. Those can take a guy down. I'm always surprised by how fast the top guys in my age group are, though. There are some really fast 50-somethings out there. I'm kind of glad to get out of the 40-something category, though, because the top guys there are scary fast.

Not to brag but I used to be one of those "fast"er guys. But it comes at a cost. I was always good for a 18 flat 5k or a 1:30 half up to the day I heard that MCL pop. When they went in they found almost no cartilage left as well. Overuse. I think the body only has so many miles in it.

Been almost 8 years and I still miss running. Nothing like it.

If you want to do a full marathon maybe you can do the KC marathon and a Chiefs game the same weekend? I bet plenty of CPers would turn out along the route to cheer you on....

[Rain Man]

Thanks, all. I'm pretty proud of myself right now.

[AndChiefs]

I'm sorry you had to go to Beaumont to do this.

[patteeu]

Oh, I get it. This is a parody thread mocking FMB's donut accomplishments. Good job!

[Tombstone RJ]

ever done one while eating a donut?

[kepp]

Last Saturday's race (in 42 degree temps in the rain, I might add) was my 50th half-marathon since I started my hobby in June of 2009....

That's awesome! I've probably done 15 or so HMs. I have two overall goals for next year: my first full, and to run the Vail HM. I'm signed up for the 39.3 series again (a series of 3 local half marathons in 6 weeks) and Hospital Hill before that, so I *should* be in decent shape for it.

Not to brag but I used to be one of those "fast"er guys. But it comes at a cost. I was always good for a 18 flat 5k or a 1:30 half up to the day I heard that MCL pop. When they went in they found almost no cartilage left as well. Overuse. I think the body only has so many miles in it.

I started running a few years ago with a local 5K and gradually progressed to half marathons. My fastest 5K is 20:46, but I'd really like to break 20 minutes. My fastest half is 1:41. I'd like to break 1:40, but at 41/42 years old, I'm not sure I'm going to get much faster at either distance.

[Garcia Bronco]

It's either a marathon or it's not. that's like saying you're "almost pregnant" or you're going to "dig half a hole" :)

[Rain Man]

Oh, I get it. This is a parody thread mocking FMB's donut accomplishments. Good job!

I was hoping people would catch onto that.

[Garcia Bronco]

Well my boss says he ran in KC last month...in a full Marathon...and his median pace was 6.something. He's really good though. :)

[Earthling]

Well my boss says he ran in KC last month...in a full Marathon...and his median pace was 6.something. He's really good though. :)

If he was wearing some Bronco gear I can understand his fast pace...

[seclark]

my wife ran one in st. Louis a couple years ago. I was walking w/her throught the registration deal the day before the race. we were going through the lines where she picked up her race packet and shit and some gal put a yellow snap on bracelet on her and then reached out to put one on me:

me: "what's this for?"
her: "beer tent at the finish line."

cool! so I let her put it on me and the next day i'm walking around the finish line, waiting for the wife to come through and figure, what the hell...i'll go grab one of those free beers. they're up there popping tabs just as fast as they can, while all these sweaty runners are grabbing and chugging. I saunter up in my sweat shirt and cargo shorts and pick one up:

beer bitch: "that's $3."
me: "what for?"
beer bitch: "for the beer."
me: "I've got a bracelet."
beer bitch: "you sayin you ran the marathon?"
me: "i'm sayin I've got the fuckin bracelet."
beer bitch: "and i'm sayin that beer's $3."

well, I've got enough pride that I went ahead and chucked $3 at her and sulked off, sipping on that shitty beer.

still pisses me off.
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[Rain Man]

Maybe you weren't sweaty enough, seclark. Try sweating more next time.

[Garcia Bronco]

If he was wearing some Bronco gear I can understand his fast pace...

He would wear something Husker related so he probably blended in. lol

[seclark]

Maybe you weren't sweaty enough, seclark. Try sweating more next time.

well, as I was gimping through the crowd, a couple gals came up and gave me some free samples of some kinda bengay smelling stuff to rub on my knees...surely I had them fooled, cause I never asked for it.
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[The Iron Chief]

Very Nice Rain Man.
My wife just this past year convinced me to start running and I think I've done a fair job at it.
Tomorrow morning I'm in a 10k called the Turkey Trot and I'm hoping to average under 11 minutes a mile.
This will be my first bad weather race and I'm unsure how I'm going to dress for it.
High of 20 possibly light snow winds 10-20 gusts.
I hate running in pants so i'll probably just make sure my tops heavy and light gloves.

[-King-]

I wanted to do one but man.... 13 miles of running? I just can't imagine doing that. Most I ever ran at once was 3 miles during football off season in high school.
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[Renegade]

I did my first half this year. I was fine until mile 11 when the leg cramps set in. 50 is quite impressive RainMan.

[kepp]

Very Nice Rain Man.
My wife just this past year convinced me to start running and I think I've done a fair job at it.
Tomorrow morning I'm in a 10k called the Turkey Trot and I'm hoping to average under 11 minutes a mile.
This will be my first bad weather race and I'm unsure how I'm going to dress for it.
High of 20 possibly light snow winds 10-20 gusts.
I hate running in pants so i'll probably just make sure my tops heavy and light gloves.
Layer your clothes. And I usually wear a throw-away sweatshirt while waiting for the start. For me, as long as my head and hands are warm, I'm OK. My legs usually don't stay cold for long after starting, but if my ears or fingers freeze, it really affects my running.
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[kepp]

I did my first half this year. I was fine until mile 11 when the leg cramps set in. 50 is quite impressive RainMan.

Proper hydration will prevent most cramping. There is cramping due to your body not having the nutrients/electrolytes replaced effectively, and cramping due to lactic acid buildup. Your lactic acid threshhold is a training thing, but the other cramping can be controlled easier.
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[Dave Lane]

Congrats dude you are an inspiration

[Rain Man]

Very Nice Rain Man.
My wife just this past year convinced me to start running and I think I've done a fair job at it.
Tomorrow morning I'm in a 10k called the Turkey Trot and I'm hoping to average under 11 minutes a mile.
This will be my first bad weather race and I'm unsure how I'm going to dress for it.
High of 20 possibly light snow winds 10-20 gusts.
I hate running in pants so i'll probably just make sure my tops heavy and light gloves.

Good luck to you.

Don't run in pants if you can avoid it. They'll chafe your legs unless they're really soft. As much as they make you wince for your manliness, running tights are great for cold weather.

My race last weekend was in Nevada. Nevada's warm, right? I brought a short sleeve t-shirt and shorts. As it turns out, they got a freak weather system and it rained for three days solid prior to the race. Fortunately, I had a light running jacket by coincidence, so I wore it. The entire race was low 40s in temperature with a steady cold rain. However, around Mile 5 I took the jacket off and carried it. It's amazing how you warm up when you're running. (Admittedly, in part I took the jacket off because it was soaked and just holding cold water on my skin.) So underdress for the starting line. You're better off freezing while you wait rather than carrying a sweatshirt or something for the whole race.

[Marcellus]

I started running a few years ago with a local 5K and gradually progressed to half marathons. My fastest 5K is 20:46, but I'd really like to break 20 minutes. My fastest half is 1:41. I'd like to break 1:40, but at 41/42 years old, I'm not sure I'm going to get much faster at either distance.

You can get faster. I am 42 and we have the same PR in the 5K and I have run a 1:37 half.

I have done 2 fulls at a 3:32 and a 3:30. The last one was 3 weeks ago.


I ran a 1:40 on the front of my last full, was averaging 7:45 still at mile 20 then fell apart at mile 23.

My only advice is when you do the full don't set any goals except finishing. It will be much more enjoyable that way.

[The Iron Chief]

Thx guys a couple of very good tips.
It ended up being under 20 with snow and wind gusts 15+
I did end up getting some running tights for my legs..layered my top also I had a throw away sweatshirt for the wait at the start.

I had a good run smashing my hopes to stay under 11 minutes a mile and went 8.30 a mile.
800 people ran in it and I seem to do much better the bigger the herd.

[Rain Man]

Thx guys a couple of very good tips.
It ended up being under 20 with snow and wind gusts 15+
I did end up getting some running tights for my legs..layered my top also I had a throw away sweatshirt for the wait at the start.

I had a good run smashing my hopes to stay under 11 minutes a mile and went 8.30 a mile.
800 people ran in it and I seem to do much better the bigger the herd.

You were targeting 11 and ran 8:30? That's beyond smashing.

Congratulations!

[bricks]

Hey Rainman,

I was wondering do you do anything in particular to try to enhance your overall endurance prior to preparing for these type of events?

And do you do anything in particular to slow down the fatigue process?

Please get back to me. Thanks.

*P.S. I may be able to help you out. I am currently studying an exercise physiology course and have some really valuable information that Im willing to share.

[Rain Man]

Hey Rainman,

I was wondering do you do anything in particular to try to enhance your overall endurance prior to preparing for these type of events?

And do you do anything in particular to slow down the fatigue process?

Please get back to me. Thanks.

*P.S. I may be able to help you out. I am currently studying an exercise physiology course and have some really valuable information that Im willing to share.

I'm kind of lazy about training. My goal for 2014 is to be more disciplined about it. Some of the faster guys may think more about this, but essentially what I do is:

1. Go run around on weekends to train. I bought a book that recommends three paces for training - intervals, "race day pace", and longer slower runs for endurance. However, I haven't been following it. I plan to do that more in 2014, and am pondering adding a mid-week run as well.

2. I try to eat relatively light the few days before a race, and on race day for some reason I seem to do well if I eat a couple of slices of bread right before the race.

3. I have an energy gel or maybe two during the race.

If you have tips or tricks, I'd love to hear them. I want to do better this year since I feel like I've been kind of slow in 2013.

[bricks]

Okay cool. I’m glad I could provide some assistance for you. I promise you that you will improve no doubt about it.

First off, I wanted to talk to you about training. You are doing the right thing by considering it and trying to enforce yourself to be more disciplined about it. That is for sure.

Since you are a marathon runner, you want to be primarily concerned with endurance training. You need to endurance train because endurance training improves your aerobic systems (i.e., mitochondria) capacity to extract and utilize more oxygen so that you can create more Adenosine Triphosphate (energy molecules) through this particular system. The strongest correlate to endurance is the mitochondrial content in the muscle. Don’t ever forget that. You want that to go up because it also means there will be less lactic acid production.

The key is, you want to rely less and less on anaerobic (meaning making ATP without the presence of oxygen) sources of energy production (i.e., glycolysis) because the by-product of glycolysis is lactic acid. Lactic acid build up is probably the reason why you’re getting slower. It is associated with fatigue. Lactic acid is what makes your muscle cells acidic and as a result you won’t be able to generate as much force over time. The less force there is, the greater the likelihood there will be less velocity or acceleration behind your movements.

So, goal #1 should be to Increase mitochondrial content inside your muscles that way you can extract and utilize more oxygen and produce less lactic acid over time. You can get a VO2max test to get an idea of how aerobically fit you are. I would recommend it. It’s pretty useful. Its usually a sign of how active and effective your mitochondria is at extracting and utilizing oxygen. What I would recommend is that you do a VO2max test before and after getting involved in an endurance training program. That way you could draw comparisons to see where your level of aerobic fitness is at or to see if you’ve improved. The VO2max test will simply assess the volume of oxygen consumed in litres per min by the aerobic system. That improves with training.

Okay, training. Here is the type of training program that I would prescribe or recommend:

4x/wk, 30 min/day, at 50-85% VO2 max. Length of training program should be 6 weeks in total. But, if you could do more by all means do it. Im saying that just so you maintain the benefits that you acquire through training.

To make it easier for you, train at 60-90% of your maximal heart rate. It’s the same as 50-85% of VO2max. If you don’t know your maximal heart rate, it is simple to figure out. 220-age=maximal heart rate. Whatever value you get there, multiply it by the percentages 60, 70, 80, or 90% to get an idea of where your heart rate should be when you train. If you do this, I can assure you that your VO2max will go up, you will increase the number of mitochondria in your muscle, produce less lactic acid over time and not be as fatigued. All of this combined equals better endurance.

Goal #2 should be diet. This is very very important. You want to LOAD up on glucose prior to the event. Our bodies have a limited supply of carbohydrate that unfortunately puts us at a disadvantage. In fact, it is stored in gram quantities in both the liver and the muscle cells. The limiting factor behind performance is lack of availability of carbohydrate. You want that to go up as well. I guarantee you that you will be able to exercise longer with an over supply of carbohydrates. For sure. Having an over supply of carbohydrates will delay the onset of exhaustion and fatigue. The key is, you want to prevent hypoglycemia from occuring in the body. You want to support your body in protecting your blood glucose levels so that they stay pretty constant over time. You don’t want to experience the symptoms of hypoglycemia its brutal (i.e, blurred vision, loss of motor skills, etc such things could hinder performance). The longer the race is, the more glycogen levels deplete and the more a person is at risk if they’re not careful. That is one of the reasons why the most challenging part of a marathon is near the end.

Anyway, here is a diet that I’d recommend:

-For the first day follow a mixed diet. Eat both carbohydrates and fats.

-For the next 3 days eat both fats and proteins, no carbohydrates. Starve yourself of carbohydrates for 3 days.

-For the next 3 days, eat carbohydrates only. Load up on them. This diet is in prep of a week before the event.

This diet supposedly makes your glycogen levels skyrocket beyond normal. So, when you go into the race, you will have an over supply of glycogen and that is a good thing because that means it’ll take you longer to deplete your glycogen levels and you won’t be as susceptible to conditions like hypoglycemia. In this way, you will not be as exhausted and fatigued. I would carry a glucose drink just in case though . It is a good idea because it can also contribute in maintaining your glycogen levels in both the liver and muscle. You do those things and you further support in keeping your blood glucose levels constant over time.

Finally, I could sense that from looking at your profile that you probably reside in an area above sea level. You have a huge advantage of running a marathon because of where you live. There is a saying that goes, “live high and train low.” In other words, live at high altitudes and train at sea level or at least close to it. That’s the idea. This is a very effective tactic to increase your performance and I’ll explain why.
Is it possible that you could find other regions to reside in your state that are at a higher altitudes from where you currently live? I would imagine that altitude does vary in different regions of your state. If you could find other regions within your state that are at higher altitudes, I’d highly recommend that you live there for a month. Generally speaking, that is a specific, appropriate dosage of living at altitude that’s needed to generate a response/adaptation. It is suggested that about 4 weeks of altitude exposure is necessary and you have to live there for at least 22 hours of the day.

Anyway, what happens when you expose yourself to higher altitudes? The atmospheric pressure within the air is less. The less the atmospheric pressure ( i.e., higher altitude), the total amount of oxygen inspired or entering your lungs is also going to be less. That is going to impact the amount of oxygen content within your arteries. Meaning, you will have less oxygen in your arteries and therefore less will be delivered over to the tissues. Your kidneys are sensitive to a lack of oxygen delivery and release a hormone called erythopoetin. This hormone stimulates the differentiation of stem cells within the bone marrow into erythroblasts. The erythroblasts eventually mature and proliferate into red blood cells over time. Basically, when the kidneys release erythropoietin, its going to increase the production/amount of red blood cells in the bone marrow. Your body does this to protect you so that you adapt to the environment and prevent yourself from becoming hypoxemic (lack of oxygen content in the blood).
When you increase the amount of red blood cells in the blood, you increase the amount of hemoglobin as well. Red blood cells contain hemoglobin which is what the oxygen molecules bind to and that is responsible for transporting oxygen over to the tissues. The more of this you have, the better. It means there is more hemoglobin for the oxygen to bind to and you will improve oxygen carrying capacity that way. The more oxygen you carry over, the better the oxygen delivery and the more oxygen your mitochondria has to work with. So that is another way you can improve your aerobic capacity and endurance by increasing your red blood cell count.

*Anyway this is all I have to say. I know this message is long winded and I apologize for that. But, I promise you this is very valuable and useful info. I hope that you consider these tips and if you do they serve you well by helping you win the race. Good luck to you!

[Rain Man]

Some followup questions for you:


So, goal #1 should be to Increase mitochondrial content inside your muscles that way you can extract and utilize more oxygen and produce less lactic acid over time. You can get a VO2max test to get an idea of how aerobically fit you are. I would recommend it.

Where does a person get this type of test done?

Okay, training. Here is the type of training program that I would prescribe or recommend:

4x/wk, 30 min/day, at 50-85% VO2 max. Length of training program should be 6 weeks in total. But, if you could do more by all means do it. Im saying that just so you maintain the benefits that you acquire through training.

To make it easier for you, train at 60-90% of your maximal heart rate. It’s the same as 50-85% of VO2max. If you don’t know your maximal heart rate, it is simple to figure out. 220-age=maximal heart rate. Whatever value you get there, multiply it by the percentages 60, 70, 80, or 90% to get an idea of where your heart rate should be when you train. If you do this, I can assure you that your VO2max will go up, you will increase the number of mitochondria in your muscle, produce less lactic acid over time and not be as fatigued. All of this combined equals better endurance.

60-90% seems like a pretty broad range. Is that within the context of the three types of training runs I mentioned earlier? 60% for long slow runs and 90% for intervals?

Goal #2 should be diet. ...

Anyway, here is a diet that I’d recommend:

-For the first day follow a mixed diet. Eat both carbohydrates and fats.

-For the next 3 days eat both fats and proteins, no carbohydrates. Starve yourself of carbohydrates for 3 days.

-For the next 3 days, eat carbohydrates only. Load up on them. This diet is in prep of a week before the event.

Is this just for the week before a race? Or is it a normal seven-day cycle?



Is it possible that you could find other regions to reside in your state that are at a higher altitudes from where you currently live? I would imagine that altitude does vary in different regions of your state. If you could find other regions within your state that are at higher altitudes, I’d highly recommend that you live there for a month. Generally speaking, that is a specific, appropriate dosage of living at altitude that’s needed to generate a response/adaptation. It is suggested that about 4 weeks of altitude exposure is necessary and you have to live there for at least 22 hours of the day.


I'm not serious enough about running to do this, but I am envious of the high-altitude people in my mountain races.

[MahiMike]

Good job. Didn't know you were a runner. Did my share of 15K runs but getting too old now.

[bricks]

Some followup questions for you:



Where does a person get this type of test done?

Well, I do know that most university institutions do it. Aside from that, not really sure. Now, pending on your age, you may need a physician present. The American College of Sports Medicine recommends physicians to be present for all maximal exercise tests for men that are aged 45 or older. Thing is, VO2 max is a maximal exercise test. So you may need to consult with your doctor on this one if you're interested in doing this test.

Now, I will tell you in advance that VO2 max tests are hard, hard tests because you will be exerting yourself to maximal effort. What they do is they keep increasing the exercise intensity/workload until they see that your mitochondria has maxed out and that there is no further increase as far as oxygen consumption is concerned. I've never done one myself personally but I do know people that have and seen them actually do it. Some people don't prefer them because it is too uncomfortable to do. That is the only consequence of a VO2 max test that I could think of. What they do is they place nose clips on your nose, and they hook you up to a mouthpiece with a tube attached to it that connects to a tank. The volume of expired air is collected and then measured that way.

The benefit of this test is that it is very, very accurate because it directly measures oxygen consumption.

There are alternative ways of knowing your VO2 max but they are estimates and not exactly accurate. You can simply calculate it. I can provide a formula for you:

Take your maximal heart rate. 220-age

Take your resting heart rate. You can simply use a timer and set it at 20 seconds. Whatever value you get once the 20 second timer expires, use that value and multiply it by 3 and that'll give you your resting heart rate.

Divide your maximal heart rate by your resting heart rate and then multiply it by 15. Now what ever value you get here has to be converted to litres. So what you do is, take that value and multiply it by your body mass in kilograms and then divide by 1000. That'll give you an estimate of your VO2 max at a maximal workload. I'll show you an example just to clarify things. I'll use myself as an example:

My maximal heart rate, 220-34=186 beats per minute

My resting heart rate, 72 beats per minute

186/72 x 15=38.75.....This number, is expressed as 38.75ml/kg/min. Thats why you have to convert it to litres because VO2 is usually preferred to be expressed pound for pound. In case you don't know how to convert pounds to kilograms you simply take your weight in pounds and divide by 2.2.

So, what I'd do is this 38.75 x's 95kg=3681.25/1000= 3.6 LO2/min

3.6LO2/min is what I consume when working at a maximal workload. What a lot of people do is +/- 5 with your corresponding value. Give or take. So for me, it would be 3.1LO2/min - 4.1LO2/min thats just a range in which my VO2 max would fall into.

If you choose to rely on this calculation, I will tell you that the only variable in this formula that gets manipulated is your resting heart rate. Endurance training decreases your resting heart rate. So if you happen to notice that your resting heart rate is lower in lets say 6 weeks down the road, great thing to have happen. This means that the ratio of maximum heart rate to resting heart rate will be significantly larger which means larger corresponding value in return. Larger corresponding value equals more oxygen consumed by the mitochondria.



60-90% seems like a pretty broad range. Is that within the context of the three types of training runs I mentioned earlier? 60% for long slow runs and 90% for intervals?

Yes. That can be applicable to all types of cardiovascular training.
The question that I think is appropriate for you would be, "does the training that you do i.e., long slow runs or intervals fall within the range of 60-90% of your maximal hear rate?" You can get this checked by measuring your pulse right at the end of your exercise bout. Whatever value you get, divide it by your maximal heart rate value and then multiply it by 100 to see if the value corresponds to 60-90% of your maximal heart rate. If it does, then great! Stick with what you're doing. If not, then you may need to up the intensity a notch. I do know that exercise intensity is the most potent exercise parameter in helping a person increase their VO2 max.




Is this just for the week before a race? Or is it a normal seven-day cycle?

Yes. It is a week just before the race. Not a normal seven day cycle.



I'm not serious enough about running to do this, but I am envious of the high-altitude people in my mountain races.

lol I hear ya. You can do blood doping but that is illegal. I don't know if you guys get tested. If you do, then its probably not a good idea and best to stick with what you got.

[Simply Red]

:clap:

[kepp]

Thx guys a couple of very good tips.
It ended up being under 20 with snow and wind gusts 15+
I did end up getting some running tights for my legs..layered my top also I had a throw away sweatshirt for the wait at the start.

I had a good run smashing my hopes to stay under 11 minutes a mile and went 8.30 a mile.
800 people ran in it and I seem to do much better the bigger the herd.

That's awesome! If you averaged an 8:30 for 10K, you can do a half marathon fairly comfortably.

[kepp]

Some followup questions for you:

Where does a person get this type of test done?


I got lucky and learned of a local doctor at KU medical center doing a study tied to VO2 max a couple years ago and got it measured for free. And listen to bricks when he says it is very taxing. It didn't necessarily take long, but it was quite difficult.

[GloryDayz]

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/2013-11/enhanced/webdr06/11/14/anigif_enhanced-buzz-26362-1384197853-14.gif

[kepp]

You can get faster. I am 42 and we have the same PR in the 5K and I have run a 1:37 half.

I have done 2 fulls at a 3:32 and a 3:30. The last one was 3 weeks ago.

I ran a 1:40 on the front of my last full, was averaging 7:45 still at mile 20 then fell apart at mile 23.

My only advice is when you do the full don't set any goals except finishing. It will be much more enjoyable that way.

So I ran Rock the Parkway half marathon here in KC last weekend and improved my PR by a bit. I came in at 01:39:00 even - 07:33 / mile. And I was in day 2 of a cold that I conveniently caught last week. So I think I can improve on that in my upcoming 1/2s. And I should learn today whether I made it into the Chicago Marathon via the lottery.

[Marcellus]

So I ran Rock the Parkway half marathon here in KC last weekend and improved my PR by a bit. I came in at 01:39:00 even - 07:33 / mile. And I was in day 2 of a cold that I conveniently caught last week. So I think I can improve on that in my upcoming 1/2s. And I should learn today whether I made it into the Chicago Marathon via the lottery.

Excellent job!

I am doing the OKC Half in 2 weeks, I was planning to do the full but pulled a hamstring in Little Rock doing the full 7 weeks ago. I don't think I will PR but I hope to come in around 1:39.

I am planing to do Hospital Hill this year for some reason. and in the middle of June some friends are putting together a team for a 144 mile relay race from Springdale AR to Springfield MO.

I have never done one of those long relay races and it sounds fun, which in itself sounds crazy.

If you get a chance the Joplin Memorial Half Marathon is a great event. Its on May 10th this year.

[seclark]

leaving Friday for boston.
sec

[Mr_Tomahawk]

leaving Friday for boston.
sec

Badass. :clap:

That is on my bucket list...don't know if I will ever qualify though.

Good Luck! :clap:

[Rain Man]

You guys are way faster than me, but I have to brag that I came in third in my age/gender division in my half-marathon yesterday. It was a smaller race so there were only 7 people in my category, but hey, I beat 4 of the other 6 so I'm happy.

I didn't have a fast time (2:07:58, while my Denver-altitude record is 2:04:20), but it was variously raining, sleeting, and snowing over the whole course, and quite windy. Miles 8 and 9 were on a dirt trail that was all slick mud, and I also made a wrong turn at one point that cost me some time. Without the mud and the wrong turn I would've been probably around 2:05, which I would've been happy with.

Next month I've got a sea-level race in southern California, which will be a change of pace. Three of my last five races have been in rain or snow. I actually kind of like those bad-weather races, though.

I'm at 54 half-marathons now, and added Mississippi to my list of states. I'm thinking of hitting a Nebraska one in June to mark that state off.

[seclark]

Badass. :clap:

That is on my bucket list...don't know if I will ever qualify though.

Good Luck! :clap:

oh hell no...not me! the wife is running it. she's ran 6 since she turned 50 two years ago.

me? hahahahaha. no fuckin way.
sec

[saphojunkie]

No, I've never done a full one. The longest distance race I've done is a 25K (about 15.6 miles). I've done some longer training runs to test the theory and I don't think I'm serious enough to do one. It starts becoming non-fun after about 15 miles.

However as cdcox mentioned, some of my mountain runs have been similar in terms of total time and effort. I've had 1 race of more than 4 hours and 2 in the 6 hour range just because of the elevation and hills.

Absolutely true.

I mean, I think the longest run I've done that was still fun was 18 miles. Even going up to 20 was just too long.

Fifteen is actually fun, because you get that long endorphin run but you don't torture yourself.

Also, over 15 miles you have to really add back in calories to keep going and every mile you add actually lowers your net benefit from the run.

Half are the way to go. I'm doing a pasadena one this fall and am going to sprinkle in some more over the summer, but last year's LA marathon is the last full one I will ever subject myself to. It's just not worth it, IMHO.

[Rain Man]

Absolutely true.

I mean, I think the longest run I've done that was still fun was 18 miles. Even going up to 20 was just too long.

Fifteen is actually fun, because you get that long endorphin run but you don't torture yourself.

Also, over 15 miles you have to really add back in calories to keep going and every mile you add actually lowers your net benefit from the run.

Half are the way to go. I'm doing a pasadena one this fall and am going to sprinkle in some more over the summer, but last year's LA marathon is the last full one I will ever subject myself to. It's just not worth it, IMHO.

Granted, a person can probably find a study that supports any position, but I read something recently that showed that long-distance running tended to have a negative impact on health once you control for the fact that long-distance runners are more healthy to start with. It found that running distances under 15 miles has a net positive impact, but concluded that marathons have a negative impact. That's sure been my personal experience. I really hurt after long runs.

[TEX]

Congrats Rain Man! :clap:

I can't imagine running 50 of them...I JUST competed in my 1st Half Iron Man Triathlon a few weeks back.

Swim - 1.2 Miles
Bike - 56 Miles
Run - 13.1 Miles

I did better than I expected BUT the swimming did get me a bit and it's the shortest discipline... Maybe one day I can say I did 50 Half TRI's but I DOUBT it - ONLY 49 more to go! LOL!

All the best to you and your future events!

[Rain Man]

Anyone want to meet up and do this one in June? I know we've got some Nebraskans around here.

http://www.hastingsmarathon.com/

[kepp]

Excellent job!

I am doing the OKC Half in 2 weeks, I was planning to do the full but pulled a hamstring in Little Rock doing the full 7 weeks ago. I don't think I will PR but I hope to come in around 1:39.

I am planing to do Hospital Hill this year for some reason. and in the middle of June some friends are putting together a team for a 144 mile relay race from Springdale AR to Springfield MO.

I have never done one of those long relay races and it sounds fun, which in itself sounds crazy.

If you get a chance the Joplin Memorial Half Marathon is a great event. Its on May 10th this year.

I'll be doing Running with the Cows on May 10th...the last race of the Heartland 39.3 series. And I got into the Chicago Marathon, so I'll be signing up for that today. And I'm also doing Hospital Hill...it'll be my third year.

And a long relay race sounds like fun. I suppose you'd have some sort of support vehicle and run a few 10 mile legs?

After this year's road races, I'm thinking of getting more into trail running. I have a friend that does ultras and most of those are trail instead of road.

[kepp]

Congrats Rain Man! :clap:

I can't imagine running 50 of them...I JUST competed in my 1st Half Iron Man Triathlon a few weeks back.

Swim - 1.2 Miles
Bike - 56 Miles
Run - 13.1 Miles

I did better than I expected BUT the swimming did get me a bit and it's the shortest discipline... Maybe one day I can say I did 50 Half TRI's but I DOUBT it - ONLY 49 more to go! LOL!

All the best to you and your future events!

I wish I could do some sort of TRIs, but I would sink like a rock and not make it out of the water.

[Marcellus]

I'll be doing Running with the Cows on May 10th...the last race of the Heartland 39.3 series. And I got into the Chicago Marathon, so I'll be signing up for that today. And I'm also doing Hospital Hill...it'll be my third year.

And a long relay race sounds like fun. I suppose you'd have some sort of support vehicle and run a few 10 mile legs?

After this year's road races, I'm thinking of getting more into trail running. I have a friend that does ultras and most of those are trail instead of road.

Congrats on Chicago that should be awesome.

Yea on the relays you have a few vehicles depending on how many people. It's 12 miles a piece but its split up into 3 legs each I think. Its going to be interesting as I have never split up 3 runs over that much time but it should be fairly easy. I think its pretty hilly terrain.

Interesting you mention trail running that's exactly what I was thinking of starting later this summer. Easier on the legs and feet.

I have some friends who are doing 50 and 100 mile races this summer. Crazy stuff.

[MahiMike]

Congrats. I've only ran 3 races - all the 15K river run here in Jax. Every time I think about getting in more I always wonder - "why am I PAYING to run again"?

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Just read where two runners died at the finish line at a North Carolina marathon.

[Rain Man]

Just read where two runners died at the finish line at a North Carolina marathon.

Murder-suicide? Or marijuana overdose?

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Murder-suicide? Or marijuana overdose?

I didn't read the article , just the headline but I am assuming they were either hit by meteorites or had heart attacks.

[kepp]

I didn't read the article , just the headline but I am assuming they were either hit by meteorites or had heart attacks.

Heart attacks, I believe I read.

[kepp]

Congrats. I've only ran 3 races - all the 15K river run here in Jax. Every time I think about getting in more I always wonder - "why am I PAYING to run again"?

LOL I ask myself that during every race. That's partially why I'm thinking of doing more trail running after this year...to kind of get back to doing it for fun rather than entering a bunch of races.

[DaKCMan AP]

Awesome Rain Main. Awesome.

The current gf runs - a lot. She's already done (I think) a full and 2 half's this year. She has more fulls scheduled for June, July, Sept, and Oct along with a Tri in 2 weeks. Her goal is to participate in a race in each of the 50 states.

DaKCMan AP will be participating in his first 5K in 3 weeks.

[Rain Man]

LOL I ask myself that during every race. That's partially why I'm thinking of doing more trail running after this year...to kind of get back to doing it for fun rather than entering a bunch of races.

Trail running is definitely the way to go, in my opinion. It's much more fun.

[Rain Man]

DaKCMan AP will be participating in his first 5K in 3 weeks.


The key is to eat lots and lots of ice cream right before you run, and then sprint out of the starting line as fast as possible.

[DaKCMan AP]

The key is to eat lots and lots of ice cream right before you run, and then sprint out of the starting line as fast as possible.

Noted.

[luv]

The key is to eat lots and lots of ice cream right before you run, and then sprint out of the starting line as fast as possible.

Drinking coffee a little while beforehand will add a bit of urgency to his run, as well.

[kepp]

Noted.

And fiber. The more the better.

[kepp]

Trail running is definitely the way to go, in my opinion. It's much more fun.

And I was an avid mt. biker back when I lived in California...I miss being out on the trails. I think it will allow me to focus less on times and pace and just enjoy it.

[ROYC75]

Now for the $ 64,000.00 question , Did you take up marathons since you lost your bike and was it part of your training exercises?

[Iconic]

I don't understand why people run marathons... like I just don't get it. Why would I pay $60 bucks to wake up at 5AM on a Saturday morning to run with bunch of people I don't know and will probably hate.

[kepp]

Now for the $ 64,000.00 question , Did you take up marathons since you lost your bike and was it part of your training exercises?

After my bike got stolen I basically sat on my rear for six or seven years and gained weight. Then about four years ago I got a physical and didn't like the results, so I decided to start exercising. I had several friends who were runners, so I started doing that. I took off about 30 pounds and dropped my cholesterol numbers and decided to keep on running. It took a little while for it to catch on with me.

[Rain Man]

Now for the $ 64,000.00 question , Did you take up marathons since you lost your bike and was it part of your training exercises?

They can't steal my feet.

[Rain Man]

I don't understand why people run marathons... like I just don't get it. Why would I pay $60 bucks to wake up at 5AM on a Saturday morning to run with bunch of people I don't know and will probably hate.

You get a t-shirt and you get to see slender women in running tights.

[kepp]

I don't understand why people run marathons... like I just don't get it. Why would I pay $60 bucks to wake up at 5AM on a Saturday morning to run with bunch of people I don't know and will probably hate.

You'd pay $60 for a half marathon. Full marathons are north of $100, with the popular ones being more than $150. All of which makes your question even more applicable. I think some people need (or think they need...or like) the added motivation.

[htismaqe]

So you've done 50 marathons half-assed. When are you going to run your first FULL marathon, you lazy ass?

[Rain Man]

So you've done 50 marathons half-assed. When are you going to run your first FULL marathon, you lazy ass?

I'm up to 54 now. This thread is old.

And some of us are meant to be sprinters and others are plodders. I'll let the plodders mess with those long distances.

[Marcellus]

I don't understand why people run marathons... like I just don't get it. Why would I pay $60 bucks to wake up at 5AM on a Saturday morning to run with bunch of people I don't know and will probably hate.

I used to think the same thing. Unless you are into it and have been to an event an experienced race day you just wont get it.

Don't get me wrong most runners htink the same thing you do at times, but its just something you have to go through to understand I think.

Some people dont like it, and I understand why. I happen to have several good friends who are into like I am so its competitive and fun for the most part.

[Marcellus]

I'm up to 54 now. This thread is old.

And some of us are meant to be sprinters and others are plodders. I'll let the plodders mess with those long distances.

That an impressive number. I doubt I ever get there.

[cosmo20002]

I'm up to 54 now. This thread is old.

And some of us are meant to be sprinters and others are plodders. I'll let the plodders mess with those long distances.

What are you running from, Rain Man? What are you running from?

[htismaqe]

That an impressive number. I doubt I ever get there.

Shit, I won't ever run ONE, let alone 54. ROFL

[htismaqe]

What are you running from, Rain Man? What are you running from?

Wolves on crack.

[Iconic]

I used to think the same thing. Unless you are into it and have been to an event an experienced race day you just wont get it.

Don't get me wrong most runners htink the same thing you do at times, but its just something you have to go through to understand I think.

Some people dont like it, and I understand why. I happen to have several good friends who are into like I am so its competitive and fun for the most part.

Yeah, it's probably an acquired taste. Like excrement, goat's blood or any other terrible thing people eventually get used to.

[Rain Man]

Wolves on crack.

If I ever encounter them, I'll be ready.

[Rain Man]

What are you running from, Rain Man? What are you running from?


If I only knew, then perhaps I could stop running.

[Rausch]

If I only knew, then perhaps I could stop running.

Old age is a punishment, not a gift...

[kepp]

You get a t-shirt and you get to see slender women in running tights.

This is who I followed for about 3 of the last 5 miles before passing her by. I've blacked out her face and bib number to preserve her anonymity, but you can see me over her right shoulder. It took my mind off the pain for a while.

[Rain Man]

I'm worried about a runner in my race today. It was pretty disturbing. He was down and the paramedics were giving him CPR as I came upon him, but he was unconscious and his eyes were open. It really looked like he was dead.

I'm not a medical guy. I'm presuming that CPR in the middle of the street is a really bad sign. What are the odds of a person surviving this? If their eyes are open and they're unconscious, can they still be alive and have that happen?

[BigBeauford]

I'm worried about a runner in my race today. It was pretty disturbing. He was down and the paramedics were giving him CPR as I came upon him, but he was unconscious and his eyes were open. It really looked like he was dead.

I'm not a medical guy. I'm presuming that CPR in the middle of the street is a really bad sign. What are the odds of a person surviving this? If their eyes are open and they're unconscious, can they still be alive and have that happen?

Usually CPR is administered due to lack of pulse/breathing. Terribly bad sign.

[Rain Man]

Usually CPR is administered due to lack of pulse/breathing. Terribly bad sign.

Wow. It sounds like they saved the guy. Another runner posted that they were doing the defibrillator on him and it revived him. That's pretty amazing. I would've bet that they guy was dead when I went by. He looked for all the world like he was dead.

[DaKCMan AP]

Awesome Rain Main. Awesome.

The current gf runs - a lot. She's already done (I think) a full and 2 half's this year. She has more fulls scheduled for June, July, Sept, and Oct along with a Tri in 2 weeks. Her goal is to participate in a race in each of the 50 states.

DaKCMan AP will be participating in his first 5K in 3 weeks.

So I did the c25k but in a 4-week span. The 5K is this Saturday. My goal is to run it in under 26.

[seclark]

the wife ran her boston marathon a couple weeks ago. finished but not very happy w/her time. about 35minutes over her best time. doc wanted to put a walking boot on her foot about 5weeks before the race(tendonitis), but she's already registered, booked tickets, etc.

she's going back next year(qualified at Chicago last year). doing pt, got a couple toenails cut out and skipped a week of doing any running at all. plans on doing either Chicago or st. Louis again this fall.

sec

[patteeu]

the wife ran her boston marathon a couple weeks ago. finished but not very happy w/her time. about 35minutes over her best time. doc wanted to put a walking boot on her foot about 5weeks before the race(tendonitis), but she's already registered, booked tickets, etc.

she's going back next year(qualified at Chicago last year). doing pt, got a couple toenails cut out and skipped a week of doing any running at all. plans on doing either Chicago or st. Louis again this fall.

sec

You make running sound like a joyful experience. :)

[Rain Man]

So I did the c25k but in a 4-week span. The 5K is this Saturday. My goal is to run it in under 26.

Report back on your time.

Other than one isolated race 20 years ago, I've never run a 5K. My watch records the fastest 5K of my runs, and my best time in the past couple of years is 26:37. I think it happened in about Mile 8 of a half-marathon that has an absolutely perfect and long downhill stretch where a person can fly. My fastest flat one has been in the 27's.

[Rain Man]

the wife ran her boston marathon a couple weeks ago. finished but not very happy w/her time. about 35minutes over her best time. doc wanted to put a walking boot on her foot about 5weeks before the race(tendonitis), but she's already registered, booked tickets, etc.

she's going back next year(qualified at Chicago last year). doing pt, got a couple toenails cut out and skipped a week of doing any running at all. plans on doing either Chicago or st. Louis again this fall.

sec

35 minutes over is probably a disaster run for her, I bet. I had a disaster run of my own this weekend where I was about 11 minutes over my best time in a half-marathon. I've been running really well this year, but it got hot around Mile 10 and just melted me. I completely coasted in the last couple of miles and it was one of my worst times ever for a healthy run. Bleah.

Of course, seeing the guy with the heart attack at Mile 11 also sapped my desire to push myself in hot weather. It was disturbing.

[seclark]

You make running sound like a joyful experience. :)

hey, it's not my fucking hobby either.
sec

[patteeu]

hey, it's not my fucking hobby either.
sec

Yeah, I know. I like your role better.

[seclark]

35 minutes over is probably a disaster run for her, I bet. I had a disaster run of my own this weekend where I was about 11 minutes over my best time in a half-marathon. I've been running really well this year, but it got hot around Mile 10 and just melted me. I completely coasted in the last couple of miles and it was one of my worst times ever for a healthy run. Bleah.

Of course, seeing the guy with the heart attack at Mile 11 also sapped my desire to push myself in hot weather. It was disturbing.

yeah, she was kinda pissed. actually said she didn't like the course. first few miles are downhill. jacks w/her setting a pace or something. plus she thinks going downhill so long made the tendonitis start hurting her earlier than she figured. thought she could get 18miles in before the pain started, but it didn't work out that way.

you see all kinds of painful looking runners at the 25mile marker.
sec

[Rain Man]

yeah, she was kinda pissed. actually said she didn't like the course. first few miles are downhill. jacks w/her setting a pace or something. plus she thinks going downhill so long made the tendonitis start hurting her earlier than she figured. thought she could get 18miles in before the pain started, but it didn't work out that way.

you see all kinds of painful looking runners at the 25mile marker.
sec

Yeah, starting with a downhill is a pain. It makes you go too fast early on, which hurts you later. Assuming an overall level course, I like starting with an uphill because it forces me to slow down, and then I make up the time later on the downhill side when I'm loosened up.

But as I type this, I'm realizing that you probably don't give a damn and already hear more of this stuff than you want anyway.

[kepp]

yeah, she was kinda pissed. actually said she didn't like the course. first few miles are downhill. jacks w/her setting a pace or something. plus she thinks going downhill so long made the tendonitis start hurting her earlier than she figured. thought she could get 18miles in before the pain started, but it didn't work out that way.

you see all kinds of painful looking runners at the 25mile marker.
sec

I hate long downhills. They can absolutely screw with your body.

[kepp]

So I did the c25k but in a 4-week span. The 5K is this Saturday. My goal is to run it in under 26.

Nice...let us know how it goes. I ran my first 5K in about 2 years this past weekend and was able to set a new PR, so I was pretty pleased with it.

[DaKCMan AP]

Report back on your time.

Other than one isolated race 20 years ago, I've never run a 5K. My watch records the fastest 5K of my runs, and my best time in the past couple of years is 26:37. I think it happened in about Mile 8 of a half-marathon that has an absolutely perfect and long downhill stretch where a person can fly. My fastest flat one has been in the 27's.

Will-do. This is my first race so we'll see. I'm sure after this the next race will be a 10K or a Sprint Tri.

Nice...let us know how it goes. I ran my first 5K in about 2 years this past weekend and was able to set a new PR, so I was pretty pleased with it.

Awesome.

[seclark]

But as I type this, I'm realizing that you probably don't give a damn and already hear more of this stuff than you want anyway.

ROFL no shit. I spent 3 days w/5 marathon runners. while they all sat down to "gahden" salads and water, I'd kill a cheeseburger and 3 large beers. and the discussions:rolleyes: I'd just order another beer and watch espn on the wall TV's.

sec

[kepp]

ROFL no shit. I spent 3 days w/5 marathon runners. while they all sat down to "gahden" salads and water, I'd kill a cheeseburger and 3 large beers. and the discussions:rolleyes: I'd just order another beer and watch espn on the wall TV's.

sec

So you tuned out all the talk about fartleks and bonking?

[seclark]

So you tuned out all the talk about fartleks and bonking?

I guess I stopped paying attention when I realized they were talking about professional runners like I talk about players on my favorite sports teams.

plus, there were 2 English profs, 1 physiology(sp? wgaf!) dude and some retired editor. I was in an atmosphere I'm totally not used to. so, I drank beer and watched games at the bar. I'm easy.
sec

[DaKCMan AP]

My official time was 25:06 with a pace of 8:06. 15th out of 153 in my age group. There were over 4100 people in the 5k. Using GPS to track my run including dodging and zigzaging around people I ran 3.18 miles in 25:06 for a pace of 7:54 with negative splits (7:57, 7:53, 7:53, and 7:48 for the final 0.18).

Overall, pleased with my first 5k and surpassed my time goal.

[DaKCMan AP]

Signed up for a half marathon in September.

[Rain Man]

Signed up for a half marathon in September.

Which one?

And negative splits are impressive. I've never done it, but I came really close on a couple of six-mile runs last month. Usually I'm not even close.

I've been running pretty well all month after a terrible May. I almost ran my fastest 5K ever yesterday at about 26:47. My record is 26:39 (correction of erroneous time mentioned earlier), though in my defense I never run 5Ks, so those are 5K times within longer runs.

I'm hoping that my hot streak will continue in my race this Saturday.

[DaKCMan AP]

Which one?

http://www.beattheblerch.com/



And negative splits are impressive. I've never done it, but I came really close on a couple of six-mile runs last month. Usually I'm not even close.

I've been running pretty well all month after a terrible May. I almost ran my fastest 5K ever yesterday at about 26:47. My record is 26:39, though in my defense I never run 5Ks, so those are 5K times within longer runs.

I'm hoping that my hot streak will continue in my race this Saturday.

Which race are you running Saturday?

[Rain Man]

http://www.beattheblerch.com/




Which race are you running Saturday?


Well, that's not in Florida.

I'm running the Hastings Half in Hasting, NE. That'll mark off my 14th state. I'm registered for #15 in Maryland in November and will also do a race in Quebec that month, though that doesn't really count toward my 50 states goal.

[DaKCMan AP]

Well, that's not in Florida.

I'm running the Hastings Half in Hasting, NE. That'll mark off my 14th state. I'm registered for #15 in Maryland in November and will also do a race in Quebec that month, though that doesn't really count toward my 50 states goal.

Awesome! Which one in Maryland?

I was going to do the 1st half for the San Fran marathon in July but right when I was going to start training I broke my arm. My girlfriend is doing the full marathon there and now I'm just doing a 5k. In Seattle she's doing the full while I'll do the half. She's also registered for a full in Wash DC toward the end of the year and I'm sure we'll both do another half and/or a Sprint Triathlon prior to the year's end. This past weekend she did a Ragnar trail race in West Virginia. I want to do one of those!

[Marcellus]

http://www.beattheblerch.com/




Which race are you running Saturday?

That looks like a blast. Beautiful country.

I did my first long distance relay race starting Friday night. We had an 11 member team and we went 156 miles from Springdale AR to Springfield Mo in 22.5hrs so we averaged 8:39 per mile. We started at 4:00pm Friday and finished 2:30pm Saturday.

My part was 3 legs totaling a little over 18 miles and I averaged 7:45.

That was some of the hilliest 156 miles I have ever seen though I am sure there are worse courses. Terrain varied from basic roads in town to almost single lane dirt road and even a 6 mile stretch that was single track trail running.

If you ever get the chance to do a big relay with a group its fun. I plan to do more. It was a blast.

[DaKCMan AP]

That looks like a blast. Beautiful country.

I did my first long distance relay race starting Friday night. We had an 11 member team and we went 156 miles from Springdale AR to Springfield Mo in 22.5hrs so we averaged 8:39 per mile. We started at 4:00pm Friday and finished 2:30pm Saturday.

My part was 3 legs totaling a little over 18 miles and I averaged 7:45.

That was some of the hilliest 156 miles I have ever seen though I am sure there are worse courses. Terrain varied from basic roads in town to almost single lane dirt road and even a 6 mile stretch that was single track trail running.

If you ever get the chance to do a big relay with a group its fun. I plan to do more. It was a blast.

That's awesome. They do a relay here in FL from Miami down to Key West. My gf has done that before and has mentioned doing it again. The Ragnar trail race she did this past weekend was also relay but all legs began and ended at a base camp.

[Rain Man]

Awesome! Which one in Maryland?



Annapolis. November 22nd. It's where all the cool kids are going to be.


Those relay races seem intriguing, but I think the logistics would bother me. The one time I was looking into it, it seemed like you spend a lot of time sitting in a van, and that doesn't sound all that fun. Maybe I'm missing something.

[Marcellus]

That's awesome. They do a relay here in FL from Miami down to Key West. My gf has done that before and has mentioned doing it again. The Ragnar trail race she did this past weekend was also relay but all legs began and ended at a base camp.

Interesting. How many routes are there to get from Miami to the Keys?

[Fire Me Boy!]

http://theoatmeal.com/comics/marathon_do

[DaKCMan AP]

Interesting. How many routes are there to get from Miami to the Keys?

http://www.ragnarrelay.com/race/floridakeys/legs

[Rain Man]

Interesting. How many routes are there to get from Miami to the Keys?

Counting swimming and flying? Three.

[DaKCMan AP]

PR'd my 5K this past weekend @ The San Francisco Marathon. Previous 5K time was 25:06. This time ran a 23:38. PBJ

Continuing to train for the next race: my first half marathon in September.

[kepp]

PR'd my 5K this past weekend @ The San Francisco Marathon. Previous 5K time was 25:06. This time ran a 23:38. PBJ

Continuing to train for the next race: my first half marathon in September.

Nice! A 2.5 minute improvement is huge for a 5K.

[Rain Man]

That's like Jamaal Charles speed. Or at least Mike Cloud.


I've been kind of slow recently, and I've got a nasty race coming up. http://www.halfmarathons.net/usa_half_marathons_colorado_glenwood_springs_half_marathon.html. I ran it last year and the hill at the beginning was tough, but doable. The annoying part is that the last four or five miles was on these little rough trails that wound up and down through a bunch of brush, and it was hot as blazes. They start this race too late in the day for August.

[DaKCMan AP]

PR'd my 5K this past weekend @ The San Francisco Marathon. Previous 5K time was 25:06. This time ran a 23:38. PBJ

Continuing to train for the next race: my first half marathon in September.

Completed my first half marathon last month. My goal was to run it in under 2 hours. I finished in 1:52:36. Very pleased.

I signed up for another one in December, still expect to finish in under 2hrs, but don't feel the need to try and PR.

[Beef Supreme]

I have done half of 1/50 of a marathon.

[kepp]

Completed my first half marathon last month. My goal was to run it in under 2 hours. I finished in 1:52:36. Very pleased.

I signed up for another one in December, still expect to finish in under 2hrs, but don't feel the need to try and PR.

Nice! Which one? What was the course like?

I'm running Chicago this weekend. It'll be my first marathon. I've done the training but I'm actually pretty nervous. We'll see how it goes.

[DaKCMan AP]

Nice! Which one? What was the course like?

I'm running Chicago this weekend. It'll be my first marathon. I've done the training but I'm actually pretty nervous. We'll see how it goes.

It was the inaugural Beat the Blerch put on by the comic blog The Oatmeal.

It was a trail-ish, out and back course. The course map and elevation profile are here: https://www.runningahead.com/maps/b1c6eef4a0524cb29138a515f7a52fc1?unit=mi


That's Awesome! My girlfriend's first full was Chicago and I've heard good things about that course (it's fast!). Good luck and enjoy the moment!

[Rain Man]

Ugh. I've got this race coming up on Sunday, but have been having knee problems. I've been running 4 to 8 miles before I have problems over the last month and don't want to have problems early and end up hurting myself worse, but I really want to run it. However, I took last week off and it's been feeling really good.

I'm trying to figure out if I can take the risk and gut it out or if I just need to rest it for a month.

http://www.marathonmajic.com/EventInfo-CheyenneMountain.html

http://www.marathonmajic.com/HalfMarathon-Elevation.pdf

[kepp]

Ugh. I've got this race coming up on Sunday, but have been having knee problems. I've been running 4 to 8 miles before I have problems over the last month and don't want to have problems early and end up hurting myself worse, but I really want to run it. However, I took last week off and it's been feeling really good.

I'm trying to figure out if I can take the risk and gut it out or if I just need to rest it for a month.

http://www.marathonmajic.com/EventInfo-CheyenneMountain.html

http://www.marathonmajic.com/HalfMarathon-Elevation.pdf

Do you have anything coming up soon afterwards? If not...DO IT!
http://bullshitnotincluded.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/benStillerDoIt.jpg

[Marcellus]

This Sunday I am doing my first 50K, its a trail race at Trail Of Tears State Park in Jackson Mo.

Kind of intimidating but I have done 3 full marathons and its only another 5 miles but its on narrow trail and pretty hilly. Hope to do it in about 5.5 hrs.

My marathon PR is 3:30:02 so that kind of gives you an idea of the difference in trail and road running.

[Marcellus]

Ugh. I've got this race coming up on Sunday, but have been having knee problems. I've been running 4 to 8 miles before I have problems over the last month and don't want to have problems early and end up hurting myself worse, but I really want to run it. However, I took last week off and it's been feeling really good.

I'm trying to figure out if I can take the risk and gut it out or if I just need to rest it for a month.

http://www.marathonmajic.com/EventInfo-CheyenneMountain.html

http://www.marathonmajic.com/HalfMarathon-Elevation.pdf

Thats looks like fun! All that downhill will probably be as tough as the uphill by the time you are done.

[Rain Man]

Do you have anything coming up soon afterwards? If not...DO IT!
http://bullshitnotincluded.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/benStillerDoIt.jpg


That's my worry. I've got a race in Montreal coming up on November 3rd, and I really want that t-shirt. Plus, all of the hills in this week's race are risky since it's downhills that are my big problem for my knee.

I really want to run it because I like the trail races, and my knee is feeling good right now, but I don't want to screw up both this race and the Montreal one.

[Rain Man]

Thats looks like fun! All that downhill will probably be as tough as the uphill by the time you are done.

Yeah, I love one mile of downhill, but 4 straight miles of downhill isn't that productive. I just like hills in general, though.

[Rain Man]

This Sunday I am doing my first 50K, its a trail race at Trail Of Tears State Park in Jackson Mo.

Kind of intimidating but I have done 3 full marathons and its only another 5 miles but its on narrow trail and pretty hilly. Hope to do it in about 5.5 hrs.

My marathon PR is 3:30:02 so that kind of gives you an idea of the difference in trail and road running.

Good luck. Trails will be slower, but I bet you'll recover quicker.

[kepp]

That's my worry. I've got a race in Montreal coming up on November 3rd, and I really want that t-shirt. Plus, all of the hills in this week's race are risky since it's downhills that are my big problem for my knee.

I really want to run it because I like the trail races, and my knee is feeling good right now, but I don't want to screw up both this race and the Montreal one.

Yeah, that course isn't good for the knees. You could try it and then DNF if it starts hurting. I guess it depends on which race you want more. Of course, there's 3 weeks in between races which can be plenty of time to heal minor knee issues.

[DaKCMan AP]

I've got a race in Montreal coming up on November 3rd, and I really want that t-shirt.

Speaking of tech shirts, I was very happy with how the Blerch shirts turned out.

[kepp]

I'm running Chicago this weekend. It'll be my first marathon. I've done the training but I'm actually pretty nervous. We'll see how it goes.

Well, I finished at 03:54:34. I didn't hit my goal of 03:45, but I was on pace for it until after mile 22.

My first mistake was timing my pre-race bathroom break wrong. I had to stop and use a porta-potty at mile 4 and that took a minute or so away from me. Thinking back, I should have left my corral, went to take a leak, and then just started with the next wave.

Then, at mile 22 I started having side cramps that I could not get rid of. My 25 was my worst. I had to stop several times to stretch and breathe because of the side cramp. But I was able to pick it back up and finish the last 1.2 almost at pace.

I want to do it again next year to get it right.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

Speaking of tech shirts, I was very happy with how the Blerch shirts turned out.

Carnation is a beautiful, sleepy, little town. Still fairly close to the Seattle area as well. Great place. Couple of good eating spots in Duvall, I wish I'd known you were going.

[DaKCMan AP]

Well, I finished at 03:54:34. I didn't hit my goal of 03:45, but I was on pace for it until after mile 22.

My first mistake was timing my pre-race bathroom break wrong. I had to stop and use a porta-potty at mile 4 and that took a minute or so away from me. Thinking back, I should have left my corral, went to take a leak, and then just started with the next wave.

Then, at mile 22 I started having side cramps that I could not get rid of. My 25 was my worst. I had to stop several times to stretch and breathe because of the side cramp. But I was able to pick it back up and finish the last 1.2 almost at pace.

I want to do it again next year to get it right.


Congrats man, 3:54 is a great time!

[Mr. Flopnuts]

Well, I finished at 03:54:34. I didn't hit my goal of 03:45, but I was on pace for it until after mile 22.

My first mistake was timing my pre-race bathroom break wrong. I had to stop and use a porta-potty at mile 4 and that took a minute or so away from me. Thinking back, I should have left my corral, went to take a leak, and then just started with the next wave.

Then, at mile 22 I started having side cramps that I could not get rid of. My 25 was my worst. I had to stop several times to stretch and breathe because of the side cramp. But I was able to pick it back up and finish the last 1.2 almost at pace.

I want to do it again next year to get it right.

You finished it. Congratulations!

[kepp]

This Sunday I am doing my first 50K, its a trail race at Trail Of Tears State Park in Jackson Mo.

Ugh. I've got this race coming up on Sunday, but have been having knee problems. I've been running 4 to 8 miles before I have problems over the last month and don't want to have problems early and end up hurting myself worse, but I really want to run it. However, I took last week off and it's been feeling really good.

How did your guys' races go?

[kepp]

Congrats man, 3:54 is a great time!

You finished it. Congratulations!

Thank you! It was definitely the hardest physical thing I've ever done.

[Renegade]

I just finished my third 1/2 marathon this weekend, and I am not sure my body could do a full. At 47, the body just takes too long to recover. I hope next year to do the trail run that Bass Pro sponsors, The Dogwood Canyon Run.

I admire all you long distance runners.

[Rain Man]

How did your guys' races go?

I made a big mistake by running mine. I was 50/50 on it, but was feeling good and thought I'd give it a whirl.

I was doing fine up until I hit a steeper downhill on Mile 6, and my knee made a big sad face. I basically limped and walked the rest of the way. Given my injury, it was about the worst course possible for me - very rough trail with lots of little "step down" steep spots on the back half.

But hey, I got the t-shirt.

I'm debating the shame of changing to the 10k for my Montreal race coming up. I generally don't have problems for the first few miles, so I bet I can run a 10k at full speed. And in a schedule oddity, I have two half-marathons scheduled for November so if I shorten the Montreal race I can still check off a November half-marathon if I can heal in time for one in Annapolis later in the month.

I may try an experiment this weekend to see if I can run five, walk one to stave off problems, and then run again, just to see how far I can get before it starts hurting.

[kepp]

I just finished my third 1/2 marathon this weekend, and I am not sure my body could do a full. At 47, the body just takes too long to recover. I hope next year to do the trail run that Bass Pro sponsors, The Dogwood Canyon Run.

I admire all you long distance runners.

First off...great job! A half isn't easy...especially where you are because I imagine it's all hills.

I ran half marathons for 3 years before deciding to do a full. I never really felt the need/desire to. Then I starting thinking about it and decided to go through a marathon training plan instead of a half marathon plan just to see what it was like and how my body held up. Something that helps your body recover quicker from long runs is doing extra strength training on the side. Do some runner-specific workouts a couple times a week.

If you feel you might want to go further than a half, try going out on a Saturday and running 15 or 16...SLOWLY. Get a feel for it.

[kepp]

I made a big mistake by running mine. I was 50/50 on it, but was feeling good and thought I'd give it a whirl.

I was doing fine up until I hit a steeper downhill on Mile 6, and my knee made a big sad face. I basically limped and walked the rest of the way. Given my injury, it was about the worst course possible for me - very rough trail with lots of little "step down" steep spots on the back half.

But hey, I got the t-shirt.

I'm debating the shame of changing to the 10k for my Montreal race coming up. I generally don't have problems for the first few miles, so I bet I can run a 10k at full speed. And in a schedule oddity, I have two half-marathons scheduled for November so if I shorten the Montreal race I can still check off a November half-marathon if I can heal in time for one in Annapolis later in the month.

I may try an experiment this weekend to see if I can run five, walk one to stave off problems, and then run again, just to see how far I can get before it starts hurting.

Bummer.

Where does your knee hurt when it starts? It sounds like a tendonitis issue given that it doesn't start until after 6 miles. The solution could be as easy as walking through the aid stations...give it a short rest like you're talking about.

[Rain Man]

Bummer.

Where does your knee hurt when it starts? It sounds like a tendonitis issue given that it doesn't start until after 6 miles. The solution could be as easy as walking through the aid stations...give it a short rest like you're talking about.

It's deep inside the knee, like something's getting pinched between the upper and lower leg bones, and when it happens it hurts like a mofo. But only when I'm running. I can walk and it doesn't hurt at all. It doesn't seem like it's the typical runner's knee, and literally one step it's fine and the next step it's a problem. It's quite frustrating.

[Renegade]

So I am debating on running a 1/2 marathon on a trail the last part of November. Having never done a trail run, what should I expect? Obviously my times will be MUCH slower, but what other advise can you offer?

[Sorter]

So I am debating on running a 1/2 marathon on a trail the last part of November. Having never done a trail run, what should I expect? Obviously my times will be MUCH slower, but what other advise can you offer?

Where is this taking place(what kind of terrain)? Additonally, I'd recommend investing in some quality trail running footwear. LaSportiva has made a nice product.

[Rain Man]

So I am debating on running a 1/2 marathon on a trail the last part of November. Having never done a trail run, what should I expect? Obviously my times will be MUCH slower, but what other advise can you offer?

My observations on the biggest differences between trail races and road races are presented below. I've run road races in a bunch of places, but almost all of my trail races have been in Colorado, so that may impact my perceptions.

1. Road races generally strive for flat and fast. Trail races will often intentionally build in hills.

2. There are two types of trail races: single-track and "wide". (I don't have a name for the second type.) I'm not a huge fan of races with a lot of single-track because it's hard to pass and be passed. You're running on a trail that may be a foot wide or less, so when someone comes up behind you, you have to stop and step off the trail to let them by. I prefer wider tracks where you don't have to worry about other people. Most trail races have a mix, and will generally just say, "there's a lot of single-track" or "there's a mile of single-track" or something.

3. Trail quality varies widely. A lot of trail races are on smooth bike trails and they're just as fast as road races. They're not even really trail races in my opinion - you're just running on a softer material. A lot of trail races (at least in Colorado) have a mix. You may have a couple of miles on wide bike trails and then a few miles on a rougher trail and then short stretches of "watch your feet and pick through this field of big rocks".

4. Some trail races will intentionally have some weird stuff. I've done a couple of races where you had to wade through a couple of knee-deep streams, a couple of races where there were really, really steep spots that you had to use your hands to help get down, and a couple of races where you had to pick your way across a field of watermelon-sized rocks. None of these are dangerous or require technical skills; they just slow you down a lot. (However, there was a part of the Moab Trail Half-Marathon where I think a fall could kill you, so I took that stretch very slowly.)

5. The scenery in trail races is a lot better, but in the races with the best scenery, you tend to have the roughest trails, so you never get to look up and see the scenery.

6. I'm not convinced that trail races are easier on the knees. You're on a softer material, but you're also on more uneven terrain if the trail is rough. You also tend to have steeper downhills in some races, which are hard on the knees.

7. You have to pay more attention in trail races because they're usually smaller and it's easier to screw up and get off the course. But it's not much risk. Usually they're marked pretty well. I've gotten off the course a couple of times but not by much. You have to pay attention, though, particularly if it's a small race where the runners spread out fast.

8. Trail races tend to be smaller with a faster field. You don't get the casual runners and the charity runners, so you'll generally finish lower in a trail race than in a road race.

9. There's enormous variety in trail races, so everything above really depends on the race. Some are really no different than a road race, and some are really challenging and slow. I did the Leadville Heavy Half a couple of years ago, which had a 3,000 foot climb in the first half. I planned to grunt uphill and fly downhill, but the trail was so rough in some spots that you couldn't make up any time at all on the downhill.


Overall, I really like trail races and prefer them to road races. But each trail race is very different.

[Rain Man]

Okay, I figured out that if I stop and walk at Mile 6 and Mile 10 for a half mile, I can finish a half-marathon even with my knee problem. My time will be terrible, but I can at least run my race next week and get the t-shirt since I'm already registered.

[DaKCMan AP]

In mid-December I completed my 2nd Half Marathon. I didn't train nearly as much as I did for my first (travel, illness, and nagging injuries). Still finished under 2h (1:58) so I was happy.

It's now been 3 weeks since that race and I've been resting hoping to recover from injuries. Plan to start running again this week. No races planned yet for 2015 though looking into the Maine marathon (half) in October.

[kepp]

In mid-December I completed my 2nd Half Marathon. I didn't train nearly as much as I did for my first (travel, illness, and nagging injuries). Still finished under 2h (1:58) so I was happy.

It's now been 3 weeks since that race and I've been resting hoping to recover from injuries. Plan to start running again this week. No races planned yet for 2015 though looking into the Maine marathon (half) in October.

Nice job!

I'm not registered for any 2015 races yet either. I know I want to run Chicago again, and I *think* I want to do the Vail HM, but other than those, there isn't a race that I really feel I want to do. I'm sure I'll come across a couple though.

[DaKCMan AP]

Nice job!

I'm not registered for any 2015 races yet either. I know I want to run Chicago again, and I *think* I want to do the Vail HM, but other than those, there isn't a race that I really feel I want to do. I'm sure I'll come across a couple though.

Both myself and the gf are trying to get into NY marathon. If either of us get in then we're both going to do it.

[kepp]

Okay, I figured out that if I stop and walk at Mile 6 and Mile 10 for a half mile, I can finish a half-marathon even with my knee problem. My time will be terrible, but I can at least run my race next week and get the t-shirt since I'm already registered.

That definitely sounds like some sort of tendonitis being that it seems fairly predictable. It starts around the same distance and you can get it to calm down by walking. I don't know how you would treat it though, since its deep in the knee. Its not like you can roll it out or anything.

[Eleazar]

That's awesome, Rain Man. I have never been able to run much because of my flat feet, so I adopted the road bike instead.

[Rain Man]

Here's been my last three months:

October - I ran the race that I was wavering over, and it was a disaster. It was a really rugged and hilly trail race with a big hill at Mile 6, which was the worst course possible for my knee. The Mile 6 hill killed it, and I walked the back half home in pain and finished in the bottom ten percent of runners. Horrible, horrible race at 3:11:10 when I should have finished in around 2:30.

Early November - I'd already signed up for a race so I went. It was at sea level and I was flying. I was on pace for a personal record until my knee went out in Mile 9 on a hill. I grimaced and walked for a bit, then started jogging, and by Mile 11 my knee wasn't hurting any more. I finished in 2:02:34, and I lost a full four minutes in Miles 9 and 10. It was my fourth-fastest race ever, but I lament not being able to get under 2 hours and if my knee was fine I think I could've beaten my all-time best of 1:58:56. I was feeling so good other than Miles 9 and 10 that I wasn't even breathing hard. No knee problems at all afterward. Oddly, though, I didn't even finish in the top half of runners. I guess it was a very fast course.

Late November - I was pre-registered for another race at sea level, and I was feeling good. I cruised along and then the kneed started acting up in Mile 5, which surprised me. I walked through it for about a minute and then it was fine and I took off running again. It started hurting in Mile 12 but I kept running. I finished in 2:01:05 for my second-best time ever, beating over 60 percent of runners, but I could barely walk for a couple of days afterwards. Wicked knee pain.

I was doing some running in December and can generally make it five to eight miles before I have to stop. It finally hurt so bad that I stopped running about two weeks ago and will try to start up again in February. I hate stopping completely, but just can't seem to shake this thing.

[Rain Man]

In mid-December I completed my 2nd Half Marathon. I didn't train nearly as much as I did for my first (travel, illness, and nagging injuries). Still finished under 2h (1:58) so I was happy.

It's now been 3 weeks since that race and I've been resting hoping to recover from injuries. Plan to start running again this week. No races planned yet for 2015 though looking into the Maine marathon (half) in October.


Maine, eh? I need a race up in that area. But November is the month where I can't get a race in Colorado. October is generally pretty good for races around here.

[kepp]

So I just signed up for a 50K trail race in October :eek: 100% single track. I don't even know how to begin training for it LOL

[Rain Man]

So I just signed up for a 50K trail race in October :eek: 100% single track. I don't even know how to begin training for it LOL

Where?

I must admit that I'm not a huge fan of single track. Good luck to you.

I just started running again after 6 weeks off for knee healing. I'm having a huge internal debate about signing up for a race in March in Chicago. I'd love to mark Illinois off my list, but I am in terrible shape right now. 5 miles has me gassed. I need to get up to 8 to 10 just to see if my knee is okay, and won't do that for another couple of weeks.

[kepp]

Where?

I must admit that I'm not a huge fan of single track. Good luck to you.

I just started running again after 6 weeks off for knee healing. I'm having a huge internal debate about signing up for a race in March in Chicago. I'd love to mark Illinois off my list, but I am in terrible shape right now. 5 miles has me gassed. I need to get up to 8 to 10 just to see if my knee is okay, and won't do that for another couple of weeks.

Rock Bridge Revenge in Columbia, MO - http://columbiatrackclub.com/results/rockbridge/index.html

I'm toying with the idea of "running the gamut" this year - 5k, 10k, 1/2 marathon, marathon...and then end with this 50k.

[Rain Man]

Rock Bridge Revenge in Columbia, MO - http://columbiatrackclub.com/results/rockbridge/index.html

I'm toying with the idea of "running the gamut" this year - 5k, 10k, 1/2 marathon, marathon...and then end with this 50k.

You oughtta do that. It's like hitting for the cycle.

[seclark]

Where?

I must admit that I'm not a huge fan of single track. Good luck to you.

I just started running again after 6 weeks off for knee healing. I'm having a huge internal debate about signing up for a race in March in Chicago. I'd love to mark Illinois off my list, but I am in terrible shape right now. 5 miles has me gassed. I need to get up to 8 to 10 just to see if my knee is okay, and won't do that for another couple of weeks.

wife liked running the marathon in champaign better than Chicago.
sec

[DaKCMan AP]

Signed up for this in 2016:
http://www.sarasotahalf.com/

Got in on Sunday when they had a special $45 entry.

[kepp]

Signed up for this in 2016:
http://www.sarasotahalf.com/

Got in on Sunday when they had a special $45 entry.

Sounds fun. How humid is it usually for those races in FL? I'm imagining Missouri in August.

[Nightfyre]

So that 50k got me thinking - that is a long run. A guy I was talking to last week said he was gonna do a 36 mile trail race of some kind in the Tobacco Root range here in Montana. Well it turns out that the Tobacco Root range run doesn't stop there - there is a 100 mile trail race with a 38 hour time limit (just over 22 minute miles for those of us keeping track. That said, in crunching the numbers, you could conceivably rest for 8 hours and run 18 minute miles.) However, the tobacco root range tops out over 10,000 feet and is some pretty rugged country. I have to say, that run would probably be pretty humbling.

[DaKCMan AP]

Sounds fun. How humid is it usually for those races in FL? I'm imagining Missouri in August.

That race is in February so if it's like it is right now - gorgeous. Sunny, 60 degrees, 45% humidity.

[kepp]

So that 50k got me thinking - that is a long run. A guy I was talking to last week said he was gonna do a 36 mile trail race of some kind in the Tobacco Root range here in Montana. Well it turns out that the Tobacco Root range run doesn't stop there - there is a 100 mile trail race with a 38 hour time limit (just over 22 minute miles for those of us keeping track. That said, in crunching the numbers, you could conceivably rest for 8 hours and run 18 minute miles.) However, the tobacco root range tops out over 10,000 feet and is some pretty rugged country. I have to say, that run would probably be pretty humbling.

Yeah, there are quite a few of those 100+ mile races - Leadville, Western States 100, Badwater, etc. Those are the races where you need a support team and pacers. I was going to be a pacer for a friend of mine doing a 50 miler a couple years ago, but he didn't end up running. I need to find a way to get out on some trails soon.

[DaKCMan AP]

Yeah, there are quite a few of those 100+ mile races - Leadville, Western States 100, Badwater, etc. Those are the races where you need a support team and pacers. I was going to be a pacer for a friend of mine doing a 50 miler a couple years ago, but he didn't end up running. I need to find a way to get out on some trails soon.

One guy I know through a professional network did Leadville twice. Extremely impressive!

[Rain Man]

So that 50k got me thinking - that is a long run. A guy I was talking to last week said he was gonna do a 36 mile trail race of some kind in the Tobacco Root range here in Montana. Well it turns out that the Tobacco Root range run doesn't stop there - there is a 100 mile trail race with a 38 hour time limit (just over 22 minute miles for those of us keeping track. That said, in crunching the numbers, you could conceivably rest for 8 hours and run 18 minute miles.) However, the tobacco root range tops out over 10,000 feet and is some pretty rugged country. I have to say, that run would probably be pretty humbling.

It's kind of true about everything. No matter how good you are, there's always someone else out there doing something ten times more impressive. Sometimes I think that's more depressing than inspiring, but at the same time it's sure impressive.

[kepp]

So that 50k got me thinking - that is a long run. A guy I was talking to last week said he was gonna do a 36 mile trail race of some kind in the Tobacco Root range here in Montana. Well it turns out that the Tobacco Root range run doesn't stop there - there is a 100 mile trail race with a 38 hour time limit (just over 22 minute miles for those of us keeping track. That said, in crunching the numbers, you could conceivably rest for 8 hours and run 18 minute miles.) However, the tobacco root range tops out over 10,000 feet and is some pretty rugged country. I have to say, that run would probably be pretty humbling.

22 minute miles definitely sounds slow, but when you think about it, you're doing four marathons (almost) in a day and a half over/around/through mountains/rivers/weather/animals...pretty crazy.

[Nightfyre]

The fastest runner to complete the race in 2013 did so in 19 hours and 40 minutes; The fastest in 2014 was 23 hours 38 minutes

[Nightfyre]

It's kind of true about everything. No matter how good you are, there's always someone else out there doing something ten times more impressive. Sometimes I think that's more depressing than inspiring, but at the same time it's sure impressive.

By no means am I trying to knock the accomplishments of anyone here by pointing out these ultra marathons. I have personally never run more than 6 miles straight - because I hate running. I just thought others would find the stuff interesting.

[kepp]

By no means am I trying to knock the accomplishments of anyone here by pointing out these ultra marathons. I have personally never run more than 6 miles straight - because I hate running. I just thought others would find the stuff interesting.

I didn't take it that way. I think those races are mostly inspiring, with a lot of crazy mixed in.

[Rain Man]

By no means am I trying to knock the accomplishments of anyone here by pointing out these ultra marathons. I have personally never run more than 6 miles straight - because I hate running. I just thought others would find the stuff interesting.

Oh, I didn't mean to imply a message like that. I find the ultras interesting as well. It's just amazing to me how there are people so far beyond what I would consider to be good or even great. I have no idea how a person gets to that point.

[cdcox]

The Barkley Marathons
The race that eats it's young

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[DaKCMan AP]

Both myself and the gf are trying to get into NY marathon. If either of us get in then we're both going to do it.

We didn't get into NYC. Last night we registered for the Maine Marathon (the half for me, full for her) and the Philadelphia Marathon (the half for both of us).

Works out nicely that I don't have to get serious about training until after we get back from our June Italy and July 4th trips. :thumb:

[Marcellus]

A friend of mine did his first 50 miler Saturday and it looks like I am going to take the plunge and do one in October. I know a solid dozen people who have done at least a 50.

On a side note another running friend of mine won that same 50 miler Saturday, he averaged 7:27 and stopped to go to the restroom 3 times. Holy shit its crazy I know someone who is that much of a beast.

[Marcellus]

We didn't get into NYC. Last night we registered for the Maine Marathon (the half for me, full for her) and the Philadelphia Marathon (the half for both of us).

Works out nicely that I don't have to get serious about training until after we get back from our June Italy and July 4th trips. :thumb:

Sounds fun! Fall races are the best.

[DaKCMan AP]

A friend of mine did his first 50 miler Saturday and it looks like I am going to take the plunge and do one in October. I know a solid dozen people who have done at least a 50.

On a side note another running friend of mine won that same 50 miler Saturday, he averaged 7:27 and stopped to go to the restroom 3 times. Holy shit its crazy I know someone who is that much of a beast.

Good luck! One of the guys in our run club did a 100 miler this past weekend. It's crazy!

[kepp]

A friend of mine did his first 50 miler Saturday and it looks like I am going to take the plunge and do one in October. I know a solid dozen people who have done at least a 50.

On a side note another running friend of mine won that same 50 miler Saturday, he averaged 7:27 and stopped to go to the restroom 3 times. Holy shit its crazy I know someone who is that much of a beast.

7:27? Geez. Was it road or trail? Most ultras are trail.

[Marcellus]

7:27? Geez. Was it road or trail? Most ultras are trail.

Limestone trail. Definitely not as bad as technical trail but slower than road.

He did a ridiculously tough 50k on single track technical trail averaged a little over 9:00 which seems almost inhuman since it's barely runnable to most people.

His Boston time last year was 2:43:30 or something like that.

[Rain Man]

I might be able to run a 7:27 for two blocks.

[kepp]

My 1/2 marathon PR is 1:39:00, which is just over a 7:33 pace. But on a trail...for 50 miles...nuh-uh. For my 50K in October I'm hoping to come in somewhere between 5:30:00 and 6:00:00 which would put my pace between 10:30 & 11:30.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

This is very impressive, Mr. Rain Man.

[Rain Man]

2/3rds of the way to 100. I did my 67th half-marathon today, and it was a challenging one. The starting line was at 9,900 feet in elevation, and went up to 10,750 feet. It had about two miles of deep mud because of rain last night, and mud really slows a person down. Plus, it was a 15.3 mile half marathon, which is more than I ever run.

[lewdog]

http://www.liveyourbestlifeguide.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/running-640x404.jpg

[Rain Man]

You may be right. This may be some sort of psychological coping mechanism.

[kepp]

2/3rds of the way to 100. I did my 67th half-marathon today, and it was a challenging one. The starting line was at 9,900 feet in elevation, and went up to 10,750 feet. It had about two miles of deep mud because of rain last night, and mud really slows a person down. Plus, it was a 15.3 mile half marathon, which is more than I every run.

Nice! Which one was that? Are you running Vail HM this year? One of these years I'm going to get out there for Vail.

Today is day one of my 50K training plan. Coincidentally, I think I may have torn some ligaments in my ankle yesterday...while mowing the yard...on a riding mower :shake:

[Rain Man]

Nice! Which one was that? Are you running Vail HM this year? One of these years I'm going to get out there for Vail.

Today is day one of my 50K training plan. Coincidentally, I think I may have torn some ligaments in my ankle yesterday...while mowing the yard...on a riding mower :shake:

I was just looking this morning and pondering Vail versus a convenient one that's about five miles from my house.

I realized yesterday with the South Park Half Marathon that I'm not in the best shape of my career, and Vail is tougher than yesterday's race. I should do Vail just for that reason, but I've done it enough times that I might just do the convenient race and save some budget to hit a race in another state later in the year.

Hopefully your ankle heals quickly. You must have been shifting gears aggressively.

[lewdog]

Have you ever ran the Missoula marathon? It's widely know for being great.

[Rain Man]

Have you ever ran the Missoula marathon? It's widely know for being great.

I haven't, but I haven't had an excuse to visit Montana since I started running these. I've run them in 16 states and one foreign country so far, and I'm hoping to knock a few more states off each year.

[lewdog]

I haven't, but I haven't had an excuse to visit Montana since I started running these. I've run them in 16 states and one foreign country so far, and I'm hoping to knock a few more states off each year.

There's always an excuse to visit Montana.

http://competitivetiming.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/532974_315953548463836_109832655742594_837208_1307494983_n.jpg

[Mr. Flopnuts]

There's always an excuse to visit Montana.

http://competitivetiming.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/532974_315953548463836_109832655742594_837208_1307494983_n.jpg

Strip clubs and steakhouses?

[Marcellus]

I haven't, but I haven't had an excuse to visit Montana since I started running these. I've run them in 16 states and one foreign country so far, and I'm hoping to knock a few more states off each year.

Thats damn impressive. I only have 4 states to my credit. May get to add Alaska this year though.

[Rain Man]

Strip clubs and steakhouses?

In the same establishment? And do they serve freshly baked bread and butter before the entrees?

[Rain Man]

If anyone's interested, here's a video of the race that I ran last Sunday. I just ran the half-marathon, so I didn't do the BAMF stuff through the snow. The half-marathon topped out a little below 11,000 feet in elevation, and the full marathon went up to 13,000 feet. You'll note that the race director went up and shoveled a path through that one large snow drift.

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The dude in the dreadlocks who shows up around 4:00 won the marathon, and finished about 10 minutes after I finished the half-marathon. (In my defense, the half marathon was over 15 miles and I'm old.) Pretty amazing. He ran a marathon at high altitude up a mountain, and finished in a little over 3.5 hours.

[Marcellus]

Damn that looks awesome.

[cdcox]

I saw this bumper sticker today that made me think of this thread:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/81UK9qJpNTL._SX425_.jpg

[kepp]

In the same establishment? And do they serve freshly baked bread and butter before the entrees?

I heard the strippers actually throw you your dinner rolls.

[Rain Man]

Damn that looks awesome.

You should come out and do a race with me. And by 'with me', I mean 'way ahead of me'.

[Rain Man]

I heard the strippers actually throw you your dinner rolls.

My god, what a fantastic concept.

[DaKCMan AP]

I need to start training next week when I get back from Italy. Next race is first week of October.

[kepp]

I need to start training next week when I get back from Italy. Next race is first week of October.

What race?

Mine is Oct. 3rd. I have my longest training run this weekend...26 miles of singletrack. Its gonna be rough.

[Rain Man]

Thats damn impressive. I only have 4 states to my credit. May get to add Alaska this year though.


Where in Alaska? I did one in Juneau to mark Alaska off my list. It was an easy flat paved course, not exactly what one thinks about in Alaska.

[Rain Man]

I had a horrific race in August. It was hot and somewhat high-altitude, and I don't know if I got dehydrated or something, but it about killed me. After three miles I was not feeling good at all, and it just got worse from there. I'm usually in the bottom 20 percent of mountain runs, with a goal of beating 20+% of runners. It was a weird loopy course, so I could count how many people were behind me. I thought I was still ahead of 7%, which would have qualified as a disaster run, but it got worse. Apparently every single person behind me dropped out. Dead last, 89th out of 89. That was pretty humiliating.

[DaKCMan AP]

What race?

Mine is Oct. 3rd. I have my longest training run this weekend...26 miles of singletrack. Its gonna be rough.

Maine Marathon - I'm doing the half, fiance is doing the full.

Where's your race?

[kepp]

Maine Marathon - I'm doing the half, fiance is doing the full.

Where's your race?

It's the Rock Bridge Revenge 50K in Columbia, MO.

[kepp]

I had a horrific race in August. It was hot and somewhat high-altitude, and I don't know if I got dehydrated or something, but it about killed me. After three miles I was not feeling good at all, and it just got worse from there. I'm usually in the bottom 20 percent of mountain runs, with a goal of beating 20+% of runners. It was a weird loopy course, so I could count how many people were behind me. I thought I was still ahead of 7%, which would have qualified as a disaster run, but it got worse. Apparently every single person behind me dropped out. Dead last, 89th out of 89. That was pretty humiliating.

But you didn't drop :thumb:

If that many people dropped out, you know it wasn't just a bad day for you. There were extenuating circumstances.

[Rain Man]

But you didn't drop :thumb:

If that many people dropped out, you know it wasn't just a bad day for you. There were extenuating circumstances.

Yeah, I'll count that as a pyrrhic victory.

When I finally staggered across the finish line, it was apparent that I was being treated with pity. I said, "I'm not the last person out there. There are still others." They said, "No, there aren't." 10 percent of the field dropped out, which I'd never heard of before (10 of 99). I think the issue is that it was hot and the first three miles were tougher than expected - loose gravel trails on hills - and then Mile 4 looped back directly across the starting line. I've never given up, and when I came back through and was already struggling, even I briefly thought, "Maybe it would be best to just stop here." The course made it a really easy race to quit.

I still don't get why it was that hard, though. It was high, but I've done way higher. And the trail was rough, though probably not the roughest I've run. And since it was high, it was still only in the high 70s, so it's not like it was Death Valley out there. But man, it was brutal.

Oh, well. I'm off to The Hungerford Games in Michigan for my next race. http://www.hungerfordgames.com/Hungerford_Games.html A nice sea-level race will be a pleasant change.

[kepp]

So not a good experience for me this weekend for my 50K. I go through 4 months of training and things are looking great...then I get sick Thursday night with some sort of intestinal virus. I spent most of Friday in the bathroom. I knew going into it that it was 50/50 whether I'd be able to finish, but I decided to give it a shot. I actually felt great for the first 13 miles or so (probably adrenaline), then I felt like death. I dropped out at 22 miles. I'm unsure right now whether I'm going to try that again.

[Rain Man]

So not a good experience for me this weekend for my 50K. I go through 4 months of training and things are looking great...then I get sick Thursday night with some sort of intestinal virus. I spent most of Friday in the bathroom. I knew going into it that it was 50/50 whether I'd be able to finish, but I decided to give it a shot. I actually felt great for the first 13 miles or so (probably adrenaline), then I felt like death. I dropped out at 22 miles. I'm unsure right now whether I'm going to try that again.


Oh, bummer. That would have to be disappointing, but there's not anything you can do about it. It was unrelated to your training and just an unfortunate fluke.

I'm surprised how many people are sick right now. I was sick last week and keep hearing about others who are sick. Some sort of October virus is kicking humanity around.

A month after my last place finish, I actually won my age group in a race. First time I've ever come in first place in an athletic event. It was a small race and there were only seven people in my category, but still ... first out of seven was a good feeling after my disaster last month.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Oh, bummer. That would have to be disappointing, but there's not anything you can do about it. It was unrelated to your training and just an unfortunate fluke.

I'm surprised how many people are sick right now. I was sick last week and keep hearing about others who are sick. Some sort of October virus is kicking humanity around.

A month after my last place finish, I actually won my age group in a race. First time I've ever come in first place in an athletic event. It was a small race and there were only seven people in my category, but still ... first out of seven was a good feeling after my disaster last month.

If it makes you feel any better about that last place finish ,it's only because I wasn't racing.

[kepp]

Oh, bummer. That would have to be disappointing, but there's not anything you can do about it. It was unrelated to your training and just an unfortunate fluke.

I'm surprised how many people are sick right now. I was sick last week and keep hearing about others who are sick. Some sort of October virus is kicking humanity around.

A month after my last place finish, I actually won my age group in a race. First time I've ever come in first place in an athletic event. It was a small race and there were only seven people in my category, but still ... first out of seven was a good feeling after my disaster last month.

Nice job! I think the closest I've come is 4th in my age group at the 10k I ran last month for training.

[Rain Man]

If it makes you feel any better about that last place finish ,it's only because I wasn't racing.

I'm not so sure about that.

[seclark]

A month after my last place finish, I actually won my age group in a race. First time I've ever come in first place in an athletic event. It was a small race and there were only seven people in my category, but still ... first out of seven was a good feeling after my disaster last month.

good job...the wife runs next weekend in the Springfield, Il marathon.
sec

[Rain Man]

good job...the wife runs next weekend in the Springfield, Il marathon.
sec

I wonder if there'll be runners in Lincoln costumes. I hate it when I get passed by a runner in a costume.

[DaKCMan AP]

Maine Marathon was a great course and a lot of fun. I ran the half (fiance ran the full) and we both had an awesome time along with 30+ members of our run club.

My training this summer was slower than normal as it was extra hot & humid (crazy high dew points) so I was preparing myself for a >2 hr half. Weather the day of the race was gorgeous and the run felt great. Not my fastest time, but I finished in 1:57:55. My Garmin (along with everyone else I talked to) measured the course to be long and according to my watch my average pace was 8:55 - I'm happy with that.

Hopefully the soreness will be gone by Friday (no hill training in Florida) and then it's back to training for the Philadelphia Marathon Half in late November.
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[seclark]

I wonder if there'll be runners in Lincoln costumes. I hate it when I get passed by a runner in a costume.

ha...wouldn't surprise me. chicago marathon had jugglers and a guy dribbling a basketball the whole way. i saw a couple midg..err..small people running the boston.
sec

[DaKCMan AP]

ha...wouldn't surprise me. chicago marathon had jugglers and a guy dribbling a basketball the whole way. i saw a couple midg..err..small people running the boston.
sec

The dribbling guy (known as Dr. Dribble) goes to a lot of marathons.

At the Maine Marathon there was a guy wearing a moose costume who ran the half - and a pretty damn fast half at that.

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/l/t31.0-8/12139984_10206782554154889_7196873787510994295_o.jpg
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[OctoberFart]

You have done 50 half's and not one full?

[patteeu]

You have done 50 half's and not one full?

That's 25 fulls with breaks at the midpoint.

[OctoberFart]

That's 25 fulls with breaks at the midpoint.

True a long break that is.

[Rain Man]

True a long break that is.

I find that I'm much faster on the back half if I take a 30-day break in the middle.

[Mizzou_8541]

Limestone trail. Definitely not as bad as technical trail but slower than road.

He did a ridiculously tough 50k on single track technical trail averaged a little over 9:00 which seems almost inhuman since it's barely runnable to most people.

His Boston time last year was 2:43:30 or something like that.

Wow, that's crazy. Most ultra-marathoners I know will tell you that they wouldn't be able to run a marathon with a decent time at all (2:43 being way above decent in my book).

[kepp]

Wow, that's crazy. Most ultra-marathoners I know will tell you that they wouldn't be able to run a marathon with a decent time at all (2:43 being way above decent in my book).

That kind of cross-over is rare from what I've seen. Most trail ultras are run at much slower paces than road races. People who can do well in both types have some real natural talent. I know one guy who can do that. He ran a 3:20 marathon and a sub-5:00 50K two weeks later.

[kepp]

On a side note...I've decided to run the Kansas City marathon this weekend. I was going to run the Bass Pro Conservation marathon next month in Springfield, but I figured why wait? It's just two weeks after the end of my 50K training so I'm not worried about that, and I won't have to drive 3 hours the night before. Hilly course, but I'm not going for time. Sub-4:00 will be fine with me.

[Dallas Chief]

I'm back into the swing of things running-wise. Ran my first race in three years this past weekend. 5k in 22:47. Another this coming Saturday, wanting to break 22:30. Looking towards the Dallas Rock n Roll Half in March with 1:45 as the goal. Hopefully a full marathon by summer 2016.

[kepp]

I'm back into the swing of things running-wise. Ran my first race in three years this past weekend. 5k in 22:47. Another this coming Saturday, wanting to break 22:30. Looking towards the Dallas Rock n Roll Half in March with 1:45 as the goal. Hopefully a full marathon by summer 2016.

Do you have any particular full marathons in mind? My first was Chicago last year.

[Dallas Chief]

Do you have any particular full marathons in mind? My first was Chicago last year.

Yeah looking at this one in Southern California. Love the area so I figured it would be a great place to run my first full. Timing is perfect with a half in late March in Dallas.

http://www.ocmarathon.com

[Rain Man]

Yeah looking at this one in Southern California. Love the area so I figured it would be a great place to run my first full. Timing is perfect with a half in late March in Dallas.

http://www.ocmarathon.com


Just FYI, I ran the half last year and it was quite warm. I passed three people who went down on the course, one of whom was getting defibrillated.

[Dallas Chief]

Just FYI, I ran the half last year and it was quite warm. I passed three people who went down on the course, one of whom was getting defibrillated.

Thanks for the heads up. I ran a half in Dallas in 90+ weather a few years back and it wasn't very much fun. I may take your feedback into consideration.

[Rain Man]

Thanks for the heads up. I ran a half in Dallas in 90+ weather a few years back and it wasn't very much fun. I may take your feedback into consideration.


If you're from Dallas you may worry about it less. I don't do well in heat at all. The temperature was probably mid-70s with a lot of sun. I don't remember much shade on the front 13 miles.

[kepp]

So the KC marathon went fine. I set a PR by 2 minutes, which isn't much, except it was on a much tougher course. The person who devised that course is sadistic...hills, hills, hills.

[DaKCMan AP]

Ran the Philadelphia Half this morning. It went by so fast; a very fun race and a great course!

[Rain Man]

So how are we all doing?

I ran my 78th half yesterday in really warm weather. I'm usually terrible in warm weather, and my time certainly wasn't strong, but for some reason it must've hit other people worse. I managed to finish in the top half, which I don't often do in Denver races. Technically I got third place in my age group, but that's only because the fastest guy came in third overall and for some reason he then gets kicked out of the age group rankings. And since there were only six people in my group to start with, it feels a little odd to get a framed certificate for a third-place win when you really placed fourth out of six runners. Is that really bulletin board material?

[DaKCMan AP]

Running a half next weekend. Training has been tough this go around, expecting a slower time.

[Rain Man]

Running a half next weekend. Training has been tough this go around, expecting a slower time.

What's the course like? And is this Florida? I imagine I would not do well at all in a June race in Florida.

[DaKCMan AP]

What's the course like? And is this Florida? I imagine I would not do well at all in a June race in Florida.

A little hilly, not in FL. That would be crazy. We're running in MN.

[Rain Man]

A little hilly, not in FL. That would be crazy. We're running in MN.

Minnesota will be much better in June.

I'll be in Florida on a drive-by business trip next month and I looked for a race to see if I should extend my stay. Oddly, there are no half-marathons in Florida in July.

I've filled out my half-marathon calendar for the year.

July - Flat Denver metro race, so about 5,200 feet in elevation and straightforward.

August - Mountain Race. Starts around 9,500, climbs to 12,500 and then back down. Kind of wicked, but at least it's not hot.

September - Rural Colorado race. It's low, under 4,000 feet in elevation. It's Day 6 of one of those "6 half-marathons in 6 states in 6 days" deals, and I'm only running the Colorado leg. It's a tiny race and I should place relatively high since most people will be exhausted.

October - Flat Denver metro race, so about 5,200 feet in elevation and straightforward. It's a big race, which I don't usually like, but I can walk to the starting line from my house.

November - Flat race in New Hampshire. Nice cool sea-level race. I'm marking New Hampshire off my "race state" list and my "states visited" list since I've never been there.

December - Death Valley Trail Half Marathon. I'm in it solely for the t-shirt. Oddly, it's got a big hill in the middle so you go from about sea level to about 2,400 feet and then back down. However, it's December so the high temperature is typically only in the 60s - still warmer than I like but not brutal.

[DaKCMan AP]

Minnesota will be much better in June.

I'll be in Florida on a drive-by business trip next month and I looked for a race to see if I should extend my stay. Oddly, there are no half-marathons in Florida in July.

I've filled out my half-marathon calendar for the year.

July - Flat Denver metro race, so about 5,200 feet in elevation and straightforward.

August - Mountain Race. Starts around 9,500, climbs to 12,500 and then back down. Kind of wicked, but at least it's not hot.

September - Rural Colorado race. It's low, under 4,000 feet in elevation. It's Day 6 of one of those "6 half-marathons in 6 states in 6 days" deals, and I'm only running the Colorado leg. It's a tiny race and I should place relatively high since most people will be exhausted.

October - Flat Denver metro race, so about 5,200 feet in elevation and straightforward. It's a big race, which I don't usually like, but I can walk to the starting line from my house.

November - Flat race in New Hampshire. Nice cool sea-level race. I'm marking New Hampshire off my "race state" list and my "states visited" list since I've never been there.

December - Death Valley Trail Half Marathon. I'm in it solely for the t-shirt. Oddly, it's got a big hill in the middle so you go from about sea level to about 2,400 feet and then back down. However, it's December so the high temperature is typically only in the 60s - still warmer than I like but not brutal.

No Florida half or fulls in July makes sense. Only race currently on my calendar after Minnesota next week is a Ragnar trail relay in December.

[Marcellus]

Just did a full May 21st, sucked ass I went out too hard and almost PRd the front half so I burned down hard mile 18.Dumbest, hilliest, warmest, full I have ever done.

Have a half on July 3rd in Missouri. Going to be stupid hot.