Late night bullshit: Gonna be real honest here.

[Direckshun]

I just have a bad feeling about this draft about a month and a half away.

The reasons:

1. The Chiefs reportedly want to go guard in the 1st.

2. Dorsey's first draft wasn't that great.

3. I don't think the Chiefs can trade down for any bounty of picks.

4. Whatever trade down we can get will be in the midroumds or by giving away future picks.

5. We will be sporting an offensive line that we built with two 1sts, two 2nds, and a 3rd, but still can't protect or block adequately.

6. We have too many holes, especially when you consider this team will be moving on from Hali and Flowers in a year.

Ultimately, I don't know. My enthusiasm is deflating.

[RealSNR]

"Reportedly"

Says who? The guy who runs Walter Football?

That dude fucking hates the Chiefs and will find every excuse to project fatties to us in all his mock drafts. Never fails.

[Jamie]

"Reportedly"

Says who?

I was going to post the same thing. I can't imagine spending another 1st rounder on OL. Even if we go with what we have now 4 out of the 5 starters will have been drafted in the first 3 rounds.

[Sannyasi]

Chin up big guy. The off-season is a marathon, not a sprint. You'll get your second wind as we get closer to the draft.

[Direckshun]

"Reportedly"

Says who? The guy who runs Walter Football?

That dude ****ing hates the Chiefs and will find every excuse to project fatties to us in all his mock drafts. Never fails.

I was going to post the same thing. I can't imagine spending another 1st rounder on OL. Even if we go with what we have now 4 out of the 5 starters will have been drafted in the first 3 rounds.

Denial.

[TimBone]

Are you not honest in your other threads?

[TripleThreat]

I just want a 6 foot 5 WR, or a 6 7 Tight end. Im tired of all these "speedster" guys that just get manhandled on the field. Its great that they look good in the combine and that there speed lets them look great against college crap. but its the NFL, speed kills but.. its the NFL everyones fast.

[J Diddy]

Are you not honest in your other threads?

They are bullshit threads. Just saying.

[T-post Tom]

I just have a bad feeling about this draft about a month and a half away.

The reasons:

1. The Chiefs reportedly want to go guard in the 1st.

2. Dorsey's first draft wasn't that great.

3. I don't think the Chiefs can trade down for any bounty of picks.

4. Whatever trade down we can get will be in the midroumds or by giving away future picks.

5. We will be sporting an offensive line that we built with two 1sts, two 2nds, and a 3rd, but still can't protect or block adequately.

6. We have too many holes, especially when you consider this team will be moving on from Hali and Flowers in a year.

Ultimately, I don't know. My enthusiasm is deflating.

Man, we love you but....

http://www.cbs.com/base/files/2nd-slap.gif

[Tacoman]

I can understand the frustration due to so many glaring needs on O, not too mention safety and pass rusher, but the idea of drafting a Guard does make SOME sense to me (albeit not that much tbh) for one reason. Smith is a cerebral guy who flourishes by taking advantage of a system and taking advantage of a defenses mistakes in coverage. If he is hitting 7 different receivers in a game, he is in a position to succeed. He becomes very average when he has to run for his life out there (as do most QB's, but I think more so for him).

So, in short... I think Smith can succeed with less than spectacular receivers given solid protection, but will have a difficult time with even spectacular receivers if he is not able to have the time to dissect the defense. If teams are able to get to him quickly without blitzing additional receivers his style of play is probably going to struggle. If protection is adequate he can make defenses pay and find the open man better than most of the qb's in the league imo.

[Easy 6]

I'm gonna be real honest here... **** this thread.

[Discuss Thrower]

If KC is not taking a skill position, then the only defensible choice is a pass rusher.

[Tacoman]

I hope to god they find a safety who can hold his own, 1st round, 2nd round, Commings... whatever! All I'm saying is that even though I would rather they spend their 1st in other areas, I wouldn't be THAT upset if they did draft a guard.

[Dayze]

as long as we get a first round OL prospect.
We could be very fortunate since that is the key to success.

teams who draft skill positions in the first are doomed to fail. It's science.

[T-post Tom]

I hope to god they find a safety who can hold his own, 1st round, 2nd round, Commings... whatever! All I'm saying is that even though I would rather they spend their 1st in other areas, I wouldn't be THAT upset if they did draft a guard.

No offense intended, but if this thread is on the front page when everyone wakes up in a few hours........you're going to need a big barrel of this:

http://c1.soap.com/images/products/p/abm/abm-001_1z.jpg

[Tribal Warfare]

IMO, Dorsey Reid will be looking for WR/TE or a DB with the 1st round pick

[splatbass]

Denial.

Pure speculation. No one outside of the Chiefs FO knows what they are planning. As you well know, teams keep things very close to the vest before the draft, even putting out false information to mask their plans. There is no way anyone can say they know what the Chiefs will do.

[Tacoman]

No offense intended, but if this thread is on the front page when everyone wakes up in a few hours........you're going to need a big barrel of this:


LMAO!!!

yeah, like I said... If they drafted a guard it wouldn't be my first choice, or second, or third. I guess I was just trying to see the logic in where the Chiefs might be coming from? I followed the Niners for a long time and fans were pretty upset they kept drafting O Line first round, but that turned out pretty well for them. If we could get someone along the lines of Iupati would people really be that pissed?

Oh, and astro glide wouldn't be my first choice, can we get some coconut oil or something? with as little friction as astro glide gives that could take an excruciating situation and add an extra half hour or so lol.

[T-post Tom]

IMO, Dorsey Reid will be looking for WR/TE or a DB with the 1st round pick

I suspect this as well. Could also see them taking Clinton-Dix or Pryor at FS if they're still available at the 23rd pick. Most likely they'll be gone.

[Tribal Warfare]

I suspect this as well. Could also see them taking Clinton-Dix or Pryor at FS if they're still available at the 23rd pick. Most likely they'll be gone.

My dark horse pick is Dee Ford, because this is Houston's contract year and Tamba isn't getting any younger.

[keg in kc]

Reportedly...according to no reporter anywhere.

Now, I've thought for months we were drafting a guard, but it's because I always expect the worst, knowing this front office has a decades long history of doing stupid shit, not because of anything that's in print anywhere.

[T-post Tom]

LMAO!!!
...with as little friction as astro glide gives that could take an excruciating situation and add an extra half hour or so lol.

Normally, that'd be brilliant thinking. But with this group, you're looking at 45 seconds...tops. The bad news (from what I've read here) is that everyone at CP is insanely endowed. So you'll be needing some sort of lubrication, regardless of the duration.

[RippedmyFlesh]

Reportedly...according to no reporter anywhere.

Now, I've thought for months we were drafting a guard, but it's because I always expect the worst, knowing this front office has a decades long history of doing stupid shit, not because of anything that's in print anywhere.

Don't punish reid/dorsey for the sins of the past. They are just trying to clean up the mess.

[T-post Tom]

My dark horse pick is Dee Ford, because this is Houston's contract year and Tamba isn't getting any younger.

I could see that. Or maybe Kony Ealy, even though he's currently not so good in coverage. Personally, I'd perfer that they lock up Houston on a long term deal and focus on WR/CB/FS.

[RippedmyFlesh]

No offense intended, but if this thread is on the front page when everyone wakes up in a few hours........you're going to need a big barrel of this:



Anyone suggesting a guard doesn't deserve lube.

[T-post Tom]

Anyone suggesting a guard doesn't deserve lube.

like a boss. boom goes the dynamite.

[Dayze]

Anyone suggesting a guard doesn't deserve lube.

Gentlemen and a scholar. Guard in the 1st is fucking insane

[keg in kc]

Don't punish reid/dorsey for the sins of the past. They are just trying to clean up the mess.They brought in Alex Smith and drafted Eric Fisher. Plenty of sins of their own already.

[MotherfuckerJones]

If anyone believes in taking a guard in round 1, they should be permabanned

[rico]

God why did we have to spend TWO 2nd round picks on Smith?

Spending one 2nd rounder was ENOUGH.

http://replygif.net/i/347.gif

[CoMoChief]

My fucking head will explode if we take an Oline first rd again, over taking a WR...which is CLEARLY this team's biggest need right now.

We don't have ANYONE outside Bowe that's worthy of starting....ZERO.

We need depth on the Oline, and we could use another starter on the Oline for sure, but it's def not the necessity like WR is. If we don't get another WR, we don't have a passing game next season. You can't just ignore that position thinking Kelce is going to come back strong and we'll just increase Charles workload more.

Have to be able to stretch the field.

I would also love for Dri Archer to replace Dexter McCluster.

[Dunerdr]

Attention whore thread.

[RealSNR]

Denial.

Then say "you've got a feeling."

When you say "reportedly" that means you have a source or have heard rumors somewhere. And you haven't. Nobody has.

[Baby Lee]

Anyone suggesting a guard doesn't deserve lube.

Direkshun ah-be hangin' from a tree
with no vaseline
just a match and a little bit ah gasoline

[J Diddy]

God why did we have to spend TWO 2nd round picks on Smith?

Spending one 2nd rounder was ENOUGH.

http://replygif.net/i/347.gif

From what I've heard it was a bidding war and they got who they wanted. You can fault their choice of who they wanted but certainly not going to get their guy.

[Baby Lee]

God why did we have to spend TWO 2nd round picks on Smith?

Spending one 2nd rounder was ENOUGH.

http://replygif.net/i/347.gif

Rain Man has the best sig in the inner tubes

In the final seven games of the 2013 season, the Chiefs averaged 34.6 points per game, scored 38 points or more 4 times, and went 2-5. The NFL has ruined the sport.

[OnTheWarpath15]

"Reportedly"

Says who? The guy who runs Walter Football?

That dude fucking hates the Chiefs and will find every excuse to project fatties to us in all his mock drafts. Never fails.

We've taken 5 OL in the first three rounds over the last four years.

5 early picks on fatties.

The stereotype is true, folks. Of course people are going to mock linemen to us early - it's what we do.

[RealSNR]

We've taken 5 OL in the first three rounds over the last four years.

5 early picks on fatties.

The stereotype is true, folks. Of course people are going to mock linemen to us early - it's what we do.

In Walter's 2015 mock draft, he has the Browns taking a RB (Tori Gurley) at #5 overall.

The dude is a sadistic son of a bitch.

[Simply Red]

http://i.imgur.com/Pv3N6bJ.jpg

[htismaqe]

My dark horse pick is Dee Ford, because this is Houston's contract year and Tamba isn't getting any younger.

Watch them let Houston walk, like they did Albert.

[OldSchool]

Watch them let Houston walk, like they did Albert.

I think they would cut Hali in order to re-sign Houston next season.

[htismaqe]

From what I've heard it was a bidding war and they got who they wanted. You can fault their choice of who they wanted but certainly not going to get their guy.

There was no bidding war.

The 49ers wanted a 2nd rounder and we doubled it to prevent a bidding war.

They got a good QB out of the deal but they paid WAY more than they had to.

[htismaqe]

I think they would cut Hali in order to re-sign Houston next season.

It wouldn't surprise me if they let both of them go.

[OldSchool]

It wouldn't surprise me if they let both of them go.

If Houston leaves, that'll be because he didn't want to stay, not because they didn't want to keep him. I don't think that Dorsey would have a problem with paying a versatile OLB top money at his position, especially considering the fact that he's just entering his prime.

[RealSNR]

There was no bidding war.

The 49ers wanted a 2nd rounder and we doubled it to prevent a bidding war.

They got a good QB out of the deal but they paid WAY more than they had to.

Yep.

Say what you want about Carl and Pioli, but they both knew how to negotiate pretty frugally.

That's a skill that Dorsey lacks. Big time.

[Simply Red]

SOC get the banners ready.

Operation 'fire Dorsey' -- 'restore hope'

[Dave Lane]

If KC is not taking a skill position, then the only defensible choice is a pass rusher.

That is a skill position. One that would make sense.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Are there any fragile TE's we should be targeting? That selection is nearly as common as the early round OL.

[MahiMike]

Don't worry, be happy dude. Andy's got this.

[Halfcan]

So if it happens we get the Best Guard in the draft that secures the line the next 10 years and makes several Pro Bowls/ playoff wins-that would be a Bust draft?

O line is the biggest hole on the team. Not a sexy pick at all but much needed.

Filo and Fisher Forever!! lol

[htismaqe]

If Houston leaves, that'll be because he didn't want to stay, not because they didn't want to keep him. I don't think that Dorsey would have a problem with paying a versatile OLB top money at his position, especially considering the fact that he's just entering his prime.

I haven't really seen much from Dorsey yet that says he can handle these big-time situations.

[htismaqe]

So if it happens we get the Best Guard in the draft that secures the line the next 10 years and makes several Pro Bowls/ playoff wins-that would be a Bust draft?

O line is the biggest hole on the team. Not a sexy pick at all but much needed.

Filo and Fisher Forever!! lol

O-line is not the biggest hole on the team...

And a better o-line doesn't win that playoff game last year, let alone win multiple playoff games in the future.

[Dave Lane]

O-line is not the biggest hole on the team...

And a better o-line doesn't win that playoff game last year, let alone win multiple playoff games in the future.

Safety is about 600 steps above OL.

[htismaqe]

Safety is about 600 steps above OL.

We need bodies on the offensive line. We can't go into the season with what we have now.

When it comes to talent though, we need playmakers at safety, WR, and pass rusher WAY more than we need another 1st round offensive lineman.

[Halfcan]

O-line is not the biggest hole on the team...

And a better o-line doesn't win that playoff game last year, let alone win multiple playoff games in the future.

Letting half our O line walk in free agency sure seems to create a need. :doh!: I would love to get a top of the line weapon but I guess I have pretty much accepted the fact we will draft a "project" again. :banghead: Our drafts have been pretty poor except for a few gems here and there-especially compared to the Seahawks.

[htismaqe]

Letting half our O line walk in free agency sure seems to create a need. :doh!: I would love to get a top of the line weapon but I guess I have pretty much accepted the fact we will draft a "project" again. :banghead: Our drafts have been pretty poor except for a few gems here and there-especially compared to the Seahawks.

It's a need absolutely. See my previous post.

[HemiEd]

IMO, Dorsey Reid will be looking for WR/TE or a DB with the 1st round pick

We all hope.
So far, they have done what their predecessors have done, which indicates ownership to me.
The only thing we really know for a fact is that they won't be taking a QB in the first, no matter where they pick.

[patteeu]

So if it happens we get the Best Guard in the draft that secures the line the next 10 years and makes several Pro Bowls/ playoff wins-that would be a Bust draft?

O line is the biggest hole on the team. Not a sexy pick at all but much needed.

Filo and Fisher Forever!! lol

As long as he works out, I'm OK with it. I just want them to take a 1st rounder who ends up being a stud instead of just a guy, whatever position he plays.

[splatbass]

They brought in Alex Smith and drafted Eric Fisher. Plenty of sins of their own already.

Alex Smith has turned out pretty well. Eric Fisher showed continuous improvement last season, so he could break out this year. No sins there, you are just unhappy that they didn't do what you wanted them to do.

[Halfcan]

It's a need absolutely. See my previous post.

A need that could be filled 3rd round or later while we get one of the Playmakers in the first......... but this is the Chiefs-lol

[htismaqe]

As long as he works out, I'm OK with it. I just want them to take a 1st rounder who ends up being a stud instead of just a guy, whatever position he plays.

A stud guard isn't an impact player, even if he's a HoFer. Ask Will Shields about his Super Bowl rings.

[htismaqe]

No sins there, you are just unhappy that they didn't do what you wanted them to do.

Your analysis of the situation is, as always, wrong.

[patteeu]

A stud guard isn't an impact player, even if he's a HoFer. Ask Will Shields about his Super Bowl rings.

If there's a Will Shields in this draft, I'll be happy if they take him in the first round.

[htismaqe]

If there's a Will Shields in this draft, I'll be happy if they take him in the first round.

To each their own I guess. I'm really not interested in anything less than championship football at this point...

[BigMeatballDave]

If there's a Will Shields in this draft, I'll be happy if they take him in the first round.

Why? Shields was a 3rd round pick.

[MahiMike]

Safety is about 600 steps above OL.

This.

[OldSchool]

A stud guard isn't an impact player, even if he's a HoFer. Ask Will Shields about his Super Bowl rings.

Tell it to the Cowboys OLs of the 90s? Orlando Pace? Jonathan Ogden?

[MahiMike]

Let's just get a playmaker WR with 1st pick. After that, I don't care what order we go in.

[Chief Roundup]

My ****ing head will explode if we take an Oline first rd again, over taking a WR...which is CLEARLY this team's biggest need right now.

We don't have ANYONE outside Bowe that's worthy of starting....ZERO.

We need depth on the Oline, and we could use another starter on the Oline for sure, but it's def not the necessity like WR is. If we don't get another WR, we don't have a passing game next season. You can't just ignore that position thinking Kelce is going to come back strong and we'll just increase Charles workload more.

Have to be able to stretch the field.

I would also love for Dri Archer to replace Dexter McCluster.

WR is not our biggest need. FS is our biggest need. Alex Smith and the offense did pretty good with the weapons that he has. The defense did not and FS was the biggest reason for that.
McCluster has already been replaced with Weston Dressler.

[J Diddy]

Tell it to the Cowboys OLs of the 90s? Orlando Pace? Jonathan Ogden?
Those aren't stud guards.

[tatorhog]

A stud guard isn't an impact player, even if he's a HoFer. Ask Will Shields about his Super Bowl rings.

Ask Dan Marino about his

[J Diddy]

Let's just get a playmaker WR with 1st pick. After that, I don't care what order we go in.

I would be content with a playmaker at FS, WR, or TE in that order. I think a good wr can be had in later rounds and I don't know much about the te depth.

[Chief Roundup]

http://i.imgur.com/Pv3N6bJ.jpg

It is so stupid to wear the wrong uniform or colors to sporting events.

[OldSchool]

To each their own I guess. I'm really not interested in anything less than championship football at this point...

And championships are won and lost in the trenches.

You really think Eli Manning was a superior QB to Tom Brady? No, Manning just had the benefit of better protection compared to what Brady was dealing with in both of those Super Bowls.

Really think Wilson is superior to Peyton Manning? No, again, the difference was that the Seahawks were dominating in the trenches and the Broncos weren't.

There's a reason why OL and DL players get drafted high every year. They actually make a huge impact on the games.

[O.city]

The whole this great player that greet player didn't win a Super Bowl isn't a justification or sound argument for or for not taking a player.

Too many examples in each side.

[htismaqe]

Tell it to the Cowboys OLs of the 90s? Orlando Pace? Jonathan Ogden?

The Cowboys of the 90s were built prior to the advent of modern free agency. They had HoF talent at EVERY position, on both sides of the ball. But sure, let's pretend that the biggest part of their championship run was the interior of their offensive line. ROFL

Guess where Larry Allen was drafted? SECOND ROUND. Oops.

I won't even mention the rest of your post since it's irrelevant. We're talking about GUARDS.

[Pablo]

We'll take a guard.

And there will be months of rationalisation.

[htismaqe]

Ask Dan Marino about his

He's got an AFC Championship ring. Oops.

[HemiEd]

To each their own I guess. I'm really not interested in anything less than championship football at this point...

They have proven beyond a shadow a doubt they don't need to build a championship team to accomplish their mission.
The team has to be competitive and have a chance at a wild card. Arrowhead rocks.

[OldSchool]

Those aren't stud guards.

Larry Allen, Alan Faneca, etc.

[O.city]

And championships are won and lost in the trenches.

You really think Eli Manning was a superior QB to Tom Brady? No, Manning just had the benefit of better protection compared to what Brady was dealing with in both of those Super Bowls.

Really think Wilson is superior to Peyton Manning? No, again, the difference was that the Seahawks were dominating in the trenches and the Broncos weren't.

There's a reason why OL and DL players get drafted high every year. They actually make a huge impact on the games.

In some cases, sure. In others not so much.

Championships are own and lost in the trenches when said team dominating the trenches has players capable and skilled enough to take advantage.

[htismaqe]

And championships are won and lost in the trenches.

You really think Eli Manning was a superior QB to Tom Brady? No, Manning just had the benefit of better protection compared to what Brady was dealing with in both of those Super Bowls.

Really think Wilson is superior to Peyton Manning? No, again, the difference was that the Seahawks were dominating in the trenches and the Broncos weren't.

There's a reason why OL and DL players get drafted high every year. They actually make a huge impact on the games.

We're not talking about defensive linemen.

We're talking about OFFENSIVE GUARDS. Stop trying to move the goalposts.

[Simply Red]

It is so stupid to wear the wrong uniform or colors to sporting events.

I think this particular one was hilarious - he has a Baylor arm band on - i'm pretty sure he was chiefs chopping with it - but normally yes, I agree.

[OldSchool]

The Cowboys of the 90s were built prior to the advent of modern free agency. They had HoF talent at EVERY position, on both sides of the ball. But sure, let's pretend that the biggest part of their championship run was the interior of their offensive line. ROFL

Guess where Larry Allen was drafted? SECOND ROUND. Oops.

I won't even mention the rest of your post since it's irrelevant. We're talking about GUARDS.

Tell me how many rings Calvin Johnson and Matthew Stafford have won for the Lions.:doh!:

[htismaqe]

Larry Allen, Alan Faneca, etc.

Oh you found one!

[O.city]

Tell me how many rings Calvin Johnson and Matthew Stafford have won for the Lions.:doh!:

How many have joe Thomas and Mack won for the browns?

It's an exercise in futility

[Baby Lee]

Those aren't stud guards.

Larry Allen

http://www.dallascowboys.com/multimedia/videos/A-Tribute-To-Larry-Allen-HOF-Class-of-2013/8c34bdff-97e8-47ca-8b6e-77765d14efe0

[htismaqe]

Tell me how many rings Calvin Johnson and Matthew Stafford have won for the Lions.:doh!:

What does that have to do with anything?

[tatorhog]

The whole this great player that greet player didn't win a Super Bowl isn't a justification or sound argument for or for not taking a player.

Too many examples in each side.

exactly.

Fill the glaring holes and hope for some luck.

[Chief Roundup]

I think this particular one was hilarious - he has a Baylor arm band on - i'm pretty sure he was chiefs chopping with it - but normally yes, I agree.

Definitely hilarious. I was side-bar commenting is all.

[htismaqe]

How many have joe Thomas and Mack won for the browns?

It's an exercise in futility

He doesn't yet realize the rat hole he's jumped down.

[tatorhog]

He's got an AFC Championship ring. Oops.

because that's the end game, right?

[O.city]

exactly.

Fill the glaring holes and hope for some luck.

You don't fill glaring holes in the first round of the draft by reaching for position, you end up with Tyson Jackson.

[htismaqe]

because that's the end game, right?

He said Marino didn't have any rings, did he not?

You're reading WAY too much into this conversation.

[patteeu]

Why? Shields was a 3rd round pick.

Whose career was worthy of a second half of the 1st round pick, IMO.

Tom Brady was a 6th rounder that I'd be hard pressed to say wasn't worth 1.1 in his draft or any draft since then.

[Baby Lee]

The Cowboys of the 90s were built prior to the advent of modern free agency. They had HoF talent at EVERY position, on both sides of the ball. But sure, let's pretend that the biggest part of their championship run was the interior of their offensive line. ROFL

Guess where Larry Allen was drafted? SECOND ROUND. Oops.

I won't even mention the rest of your post since it's irrelevant. We're talking about GUARDS.

Rotator cuff injuries will do that.

[htismaqe]

Whose career was worthy of a second half of the 1st round pick, IMO.

Tom Brady was a 6th rounder that I'd be hard pressed to say wasn't worth 1.1 in his draft or any draft since then.

All this does is bolster the argument. He was WORTH a 1st rounder but we got him in the THIRD. Just further evidence that we don't NEED to spend a 1st-round on a guard to get a really, REALLY good one.

[htismaqe]

Rotator cuff injuries will do that.

Of course, but it doesn't change the fact that he wasn't draft in the 1st round.

[Eleazar]

http://www.coolgraphic.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/Congratulations-On-Your-Gay-Thread.jpg

[chiefzilla1501]

Tell it to the Cowboys OLs of the 90s? Orlando Pace? Jonathan Ogden?

Brady averaged about fifteen sacks a year. Cassel with that same line took almost fifty.

A good QB neutralizes a bad offensive line by getting rid of the ball quickly. It's irrelevant to compare olines today with an Era where corners could actually jam receivers and where power running was enough vogue. It's a passing league now. The big uglies are expendable and many successful teams shuffle these kinds of players around every year.

[tatorhog]

He said Marino didn't have any rings, did he not?

You're reading WAY too much into this conversation.

when "rings" are mentioned, we've got to be talking conference championships, right?

You just said you expected championship caliber football, and are now arguing towards an NIT performance.

Get the guy that fills this teams needs the most. I don't care if he's a G, a WR, or a FS. I'll leave that up to the scouts to make that determination.

But drafting a particular position in the 1st does not make or break a season. Drafting a fucktard in the 1st like Jon Baldwin or Ryan Sims does.

[J Diddy]

You don't fill glaring holes in the first round of the draft by reaching for position, you end up with Tyson Jackson.

I think Tyson Jackson's greatest attribute is yet to be discovered. It's obvious that he has some incriminating pictures of Pioli or something.

[patteeu]

All this does is bolster the argument. He was WORTH a 1st rounder but we got him in the THIRD. Just further evidence that we don't NEED to spend a 1st-round on a guard to get a really, REALLY good one.

What I'm hearing you say is that taking a guard in the first round is too risky.

[htismaqe]

when "rings" are mentioned, we've got to be talking conference championships, right?

This has LONG been a discussion here. I've always firmly maintained that I want to see this team win a LAMAR HUNT TROPHY. I'd take a Super Bowl loss, I just want to get there.

So if you want to infer what I was talking about, be my guest. I said "rings" and I meant just that. I did not mean "Super Bowl rings".

[tatorhog]

You don't fill glaring holes in the first round of the draft by reaching for position, you end up with Tyson Jackson.

Ok then, who was the pick that year? Tyson Jackson is dead to this team. Move the fuck on.

The obvious needs, by concensus here, are WR, FS, and maybe G. So, taking any of those positions in the 1st this year will sink the team because its needed?

Jump off a cliff mungflower. lol

[htismaqe]

What I'm hearing you say is that taking a guard in the first round is too risky.

Taking a guard in the 1st round is a complete waste of draft value. The antithesis of risky.

[htismaqe]

So, taking any of those positions in the 1st this year will sink the team because its needed?

Literally NOBODY has said that. ROFL

[J Diddy]

when "rings" are mentioned, we've got to be talking conference championships, right?

You just said you expected championship caliber football, and are now arguing towards an NIT performance.

Get the guy that fills this teams needs the most. I don't care if he's a G, a WR, or a FS. I'll leave that up to the scouts to make that determination.

But drafting a particular position in the 1st does not make or break a season. Drafting a ****tard in the 1st like Jon Baldwin or Ryan Sims does.

The funny thing about Sims is that if we were taken back in time to do the draft again and we made the same pick again, no knowing what we know, the majority would be happy with that pick. He was regarded as the number 1 DT without question in a draft full of DT talent. He was even so highly regarded, iirc, that they didn't debate who was the best but the second best.

Point is he didn't pan out. That happens. I don't fault them for trying.

However, Jonathon Baldwin is/was the biggest wtf pick in the history of wtf picks.

[tatorhog]

This has LONG been a discussion here. I've always firmly maintained that I want to see this team win a LAMAR HUNT TROPHY. I'd take a Super Bowl loss, I just want to get there.

So if you want to infer what I was talking about, be my guest. I said "rings" and I meant just that. I did not mean "Super Bowl rings".

I get your point. But to say Will Shields didn't win any rings is dumb as an argument against taking a G. He didn't make or break the team. He simply did his job and did a damn good job at it. To get his caliber of play at that position again, in my opinion is a no brainer at 1.23. Don't read into me thinking Yankey or anybody else is Will Shields. I'm just saying solid protection up the middle is a valuable commodity.

[htismaqe]

The funny thing about Sims is that if we were taken back in time to do the draft again and we made the same pick again, no knowing what we know, the majority would be happy with that pick. He was regarded as the number 1 DT without question in a draft full of DT talent. He was even so highly regarded, iirc, that they didn't debate who was the best but the second best.

Exchange Sims with Fisher and it's still true.

[The Franchise]

Matt Miller ‏@nfldraftscout 2h

With the 23rd pick in #3for3Draft the #Chiefs select Brandin Cooks, WR, Oregon State. @joshkatzowitz is on the clock.

[ThaVirus]

Watch them let Houston walk, like they did Albert.


You shut your fucking mouth!!!

[tatorhog]

Literally NOBODY has said that. ROFL

O.city took my statement out of context, so what the fuck, right? Its comparable logic.

[J Diddy]

Larry Allen

http://www.dallascowboys.com/multimedia/videos/A-Tribute-To-Larry-Allen-HOF-Class-of-2013/8c34bdff-97e8-47ca-8b6e-77765d14efe0

While Allen was good, let's not forget Emmit, Troy, Michael, Jay Novacek and even Moose. If you took LA out of the equation they still win. If you take any of the top 4 out then probably not.

[htismaqe]

To get his caliber of play at that position again, in my opinion is a no brainer at 1.23.

Why?

We've already proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that we can get Will Shields in the THIRD ROUND. If the dealer says he'll take $25K for that new car, are you going to give him $35K just because you think the car will be worth it later?

[htismaqe]

While Allen was good, let's not forget Emmit, Troy, Michael, Jay Novacek and even Moose. If you took LA out of the equation they still win. If you take any of the top 4 out then probably not.

They had pro-bowlers at nearly every position, on both sides of the ball.

[tatorhog]

Why?

We've already proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that we can get Will Shields in the THIRD ROUND. If the dealer says he'll take $25K for that new car, are you going to give him $35K just because you think the car will be worth it later?

And NE can get Tom Brady in the 6th? It happened once, right. Book it!!!

[Chief Roundup]

All this does is bolster the argument. He was WORTH a 1st rounder but we got him in the THIRD. Just further evidence that we don't NEED to spend a 1st-round on a guard to get a really, REALLY good one.

Now wait a minute you were the one telling me just the other day that a 3rd or 4th round G would not be good enough to start this year. That was the reason for needing to overpay for a guy like Evan Mathis.

[J Diddy]

They had pro-bowlers at nearly every position, on both sides of the ball.

I just wish the Herschel Walker trade would have worked out for Minnesota then maybe we could have gotten a lot more for Jared Allen.

[Direckshun]

Matt Miller ‏@nfldraftscout 2h

With the 23rd pick in #3for3Draft the #Chiefs select Brandin Cooks, WR, Oregon State. @joshkatzowitz is on the clock.

yaaaaaay

[patteeu]

Taking a guard in the 1st round is a complete waste of draft value. The antithesis of risky.

If you had a choice between Jon Baldwin, Josh Freeman, Tye Hill, Kalimba Edwards or Will Shields, which one would you take with your first round pick?

[The Franchise]

If you had a choice between Jon Baldwin, Josh Freeman, Tye Hill, Kalimba Edwards or Will Shields, which one would you take with your first round pick?

:rolleyes:

[htismaqe]

And NE can get Tom Brady in the 6th? It happened once, right. Book it!!!

Will Shields isn't an abberation. Tom Brady is.

[J Diddy]

If you had a choice between Jon Baldwin, Josh Freeman, Tye Hill, Kalimba Edwards or Will Shields, which one would you take with your first round pick?

Easily Josh Freeman

WE NEED TO DRAFT OUR OWN QB

[patteeu]

Why?

We've already proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that we can get Will Shields in the THIRD ROUND. If the dealer says he'll take $25K for that new car, are you going to give him $35K just because you think the car will be worth it later?

You mean in the same way it's proven we can get James Harrison quality linebackers as UDFAs so we should never draft one? (Just trying to change it up from the Tom Brady example that really exposes your argument as ridiculous).

[htismaqe]

Now wait a minute you were the one telling me just the other day that a 3rd or 4th round G would not be good enough to start this year. That was the reason for needing to overpay for a guy like Evan Mathis.

I don't remember saying anything about 3rd round. IIRC, the conversation was about taking a WR and FS with the 1st and 3rd round picks, leaving guards to be picked in the 4th or after.

[htismaqe]

You mean in the same way it's proven we can get James Harrison quality linebackers as UDFAs so we should never draft one? (Just trying to change it up from the Tom Brady example that really exposes your argument as ridiculous).

Another statistical outlier. I can find a bunch more Will Shields'. You go ahead and try to find a bunch more James Harrison's.

[O.city]

Ok then, who was the pick that year? Tyson Jackson is dead to this team. Move the **** on.

The obvious needs, by concensus here, are WR, FS, and maybe G. So, taking any of those positions in the 1st this year will sink the team because its needed?

Jump off a cliff mungflower. lol

Sink it? No

Hurt it in the long term? Sure

[Simply Red]

yaaaaaay



http://i.imgur.com/hYZrXLc.gif

[J Diddy]

You mean in the same way it's proven we can get James Harrison quality linebackers as UDFAs so we should never draft one? (Just trying to change it up from the Tom Brady example that really exposes your argument as ridiculous).

I'm not sure it exposes his argument as anything. All these examples are given the gift of hindsight. For crying out loud this is one of the draft reports on Brady prior to the draft.

Tom Brady Positives: Good height to see the field. Very poised and composed. Smart and alert. Can read coverages. Good accuracy and touch. Produces in big spots and in big games. Has some Brian Griese in him and is a gamer. Generally plays within himself. Team leader.

Negatives: Poor build. Very skinny and narrow. Ended the '99 season weighing 195 pounds and still looks like a rail at 211. Looks a little frail and lacks great physical stature and strength. Can get pushed down more easily than you'd like. Lacks mobility and ability to avoid the rush. Lacks a really strong arm. Can't drive the ball down the field and does not throw a really tight spiral. System-type player who can get exposed if he must ad-lib and do things on his own.

Summary: Is not what you're looking for in terms of physical stature, strength, arm strength and mobility, but he has the intangibles and production and showed great Griese-like improvement as a senior. Could make it in the right system but will not be for everyone.

http://boards.buffalobills.com/showthread.php?454262-Tom-Brady-s-2000-pre-draft-scouting-report-Sound-familiar

[tatorhog]

Will Shields isn't an abberation. Tom Brady is.

All I'm saying is, and o.city reinforced it, despite his attempt to discredit me.

If G is a need, and there is a damn good guard available, why not take him? Its not reaching. I agree, a lot of damn good Gs come out in the later rounds. The only way I would see it as a shit move is if we left comparable talent on the board at a bigger positional need.

I would prefer to see FS, and follow the pattern shown by Seattle in having 2 stud safeties, but by time we pick, there may not be a guy better than Comings or Abdullah.

[patteeu]

Another statistical outlier. I can find a bunch more Will Shields'. You go ahead and try to find a bunch more James Harrison's.

The problem is that you can't find them in this draft. Or maybe I should say there's no reason to have any confidence in your ability to do so.

[J Diddy]

Another statistical outlier. I can find a bunch more Will Shields'. You go ahead and try to find a bunch more James Harrison's.

Eric Hicks Tono Romo!!!!


Tyler Bray!!!!!!!

[tatorhog]

Sink it? No

Hurt it in the long term? Sure

That goes for any missed pick regardless of position.

[htismaqe]

If G is a need, and there is a damn good guard available, why not take him? Its not reaching. I agree, a lot of damn good Gs come out in the later rounds. The only way I would see it as a shit move is if we left comparable talent on the board at a bigger positional need.

As you go down through the rounds, your ability to get a quality player decreases. Some positions, like QB, decrease SHARPLY as you move out of the 1st round.

Other positions are more gradual.

And position like offensive guard, decline VERY slowly.

It's about trying to get the most value out of your 1st round pick.

Teams take guards in the 1st round when they're set at almost every other position and it remains as their only position of need. Even then, a lot of teams get better players in the later rounds.

[O.city]

All I'm saying is, and o.city reinforced it, despite his attempt to discredit me.

If G is a need, and there is a damn good guard available, why not take him? Its not reaching. I agree, a lot of damn good Gs come out in the later rounds. The only way I would see it as a shit move is if we left comparable talent on the board at a bigger positional need.

I would prefer to see FS, and follow the pattern shown by Seattle in having 2 stud safeties, but by time we pick, there may not be a guy better than Comings or Abdullah.

Because you don't draft for need. If need and ability and player match up, sure. But you don't go into year draft thinks "we have a hole at guard, gotta take 1 in the first round".

Guard is also of low positional value compared to say, a pass rusher or wide wr.

[htismaqe]

The problem is that you can't find them in this draft. Or maybe I should say there's no reason to have any confidence in your ability to do so.

You're certainly right, we don't have the ability to tell the future. We can only try to predict it based on the past. The past suggests that this team, with the holes they have, would be better served going with something other than a guard in the 1st round.

[patteeu]

I'm not sure it exposes his argument as anything. All these examples are given the gift of hindsight.

Let me reassure you that it did. But you bring up a crucial point of more interest. The gift of hindsight. I can understand why people think there's a better chance of getting a good guard in the 3rd than there is of getting another Tom Brady in the 6th when they have to project what the prospect's career will be like. But when you grant yourself hindsight as a given (as I did when I said what I said about Will Shields), the traditional ideas about when you should draft a player go out the window.

[Iconic]

Maybe this is a blessing in disguise and 2 years from now we will have the best O-Line in the history of O-Lines... I'm not a glass-half-full type of guy though.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Amazing that this fanbase STILL doesn't understand the concept of positional value.

[tatorhog]

As you go down through the rounds, your ability to get a quality player decreases. Some positions, like QB, decrease SHARPLY as you move out of the 1st round.

Other positions are more gradual.

And position like offensive guard, decline VERY slowly.

It's about trying to get the most value out of your 1st round pick.

Teams take guards in the 1st round when they're set at almost every other position and it remains as their only position of need. Even then, a lot of teams get better players in the later rounds.

I get your point, but I don't agree totally. Every position can be argued about value, but frankly at the end of the day, if the kid can play and make a significant contribution, he's valuable.

[O.city]

Significant contribution at guard, isn't as valuable as significant contribution at other more important positions.

That's why you don't take a guard in the first round

['Hamas' Jenkins]

A baseball player who plays average defense and hits 25 HRs and has a slash line of .270/.320/.475 is not universally excellent. If he plays 1st, he's pretty fungible. If he plays short, he's damn near irreplaceable. That's the difference between a guard and a wide receiver or pass rusher.

[patteeu]

You're certainly right, we don't have the ability to tell the future. We can only try to predict it based on the past. The past suggests that this team, with the holes they have, would be better served going with something other than a guard in the 1st round.

I don't have a problem with taking a guard in this years draft if he turns out to be a stud. That's essentially what I said when you started arguing with me. If they take a guard and he ends up not being a stud, it will be a failure. If they take one and he ends up being another Will Shields, it will be a success. That's my position. I'm not saying taking a guard is the best probability of success or that guard is at the top of my wish list.

[tatorhog]

Because you don't draft for need. If need and ability and player match up, sure. But you don't go into year draft thinks "we have a hole at guard, gotta take 1 in the first round".

Guard is also of low positional value compared to say, a pass rusher or wide wr.

Jesus tits man. Take the fucking blinders off. I'm not saying "take a guard and only a guard because we need a guard". I'm saying if we need a guard and a damn fine prospect is there, I see no reason in not taking him. I'm not saying to reach for it.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

If you take a guard with a pick that high he better be Will Shields. If you take a WR, he can be Dwayne Bowe and the pick will pay off. Will Shields is light years better than Dwayne Bowe, but his impact on the game is not.

[Baby Lee]

While Allen was good, let's not forget Emmit, Troy, Michael, Jay Novacek and even Moose. If you took LA out of the equation they still win. If you take any of the top 4 out then probably not.

While Emmitt is a quality player, the line made him more than he made the line. Dude had superfreeway lanes to run though.

I'd take Michael and Moose over Larry, but not much else. Especially if I had the rest of their line to work with him.

[O.city]

Jesus tits man. Take the ****ing blinders off. I'm not saying "take a guard and only a guard because we need a guard". I'm saying if we need a guard and a damn fine prospect is there, I see no reason in not taking him. I'm not saying to reach for it.

:drool:

[beach tribe]

I suspect this as well. Could also see them taking Clinton-Dix or Pryor at FS if they're still available at the 23rd pick. Most likely they'll be gone.

Fuckin wood.

Especially for Pryor. Dude is gonna beast.

[beach tribe]

Jesus tits man. Take the ****ing blinders off. I'm not saying "take a guard and only a guard because we need a guard". I'm saying if we need a guard and a damn fine prospect is there, I see no reason in not taking him. I'm not saying to reach for it.

The power of Christ compels you!!

[tatorhog]

:drool:

seems like the appropriate response

[O.city]

seems like the appropriate response

For all he useless gargle you've said this morning, I agree.

[temper11]

There was no bidding war.

The 49ers wanted a 2nd rounder and we doubled it to prevent a bidding war.

They got a good QB out of the deal but they paid WAY more than they had to.

source?

[O.city]

source?

I believe Schaffer and others reported it.

[htismaqe]

I get your point, but I don't agree totally. Every position can be argued about value, but frankly at the end of the day, if the kid can play and make a significant contribution, he's valuable.

A guard, by virtue of his position, can't make the same kind of contribution as a WR or FS.

[patteeu]

For all he useless gargle you've said this morning, I agree.

It really seems like you don't understand what he's saying.

[tatorhog]

For all he useless gargle you've said this morning, I agree.

So rather than actually stick to the topic of you misreading what I've said, you use an emoticon to change it up.

Got it.

[htismaqe]

Let me reassure you that it did. But you bring up a crucial point of more interest. The gift of hindsight. I can understand why people think there's a better chance of getting a good guard in the 3rd than there is of getting another Tom Brady in the 6th when they have to project what the prospect's career will be like. But when you grant yourself hindsight as a given (as I did when I said what I said about Will Shields), the traditional ideas about when you should draft a player go out the window.

The gift of hindsight tells us that there are many, many more Will Shields examples than Tom Brady examples. Make sure you get that in there, too.

[tatorhog]

A guard, by virtue of his position, can't make the same kind of contribution as a WR or FS.

Totally agree. My first choice, as I stated earlier is FS. But, given all the variables involved, if we end up with a G (or any other position for that matter), I'm not going to flip shit about it.

[patteeu]

The gift of hindsight tells us that there are many, many more Will Shields examples than Tom Brady examples. Make sure you get that in there, too.

Yes, I agree with that.

[O.city]

It really seems like you don't understand what he's saying.

Oh I get it, but using "damn good player" as a justification of taking a guard in te first round just because we have a hole isn't something that seems very intelligent.

[patteeu]

Oh I get it, but using "damn good player" as a justification of taking a guard in te first round just because we have a hole isn't something that seems very intelligent.

I'd rather have a damn good player at a position of need than another mediocre player or worse, even if it's at guard. We'd all rather have a damn good QB, WR, pass rusher, etc. than a damned good guard.

[temper11]

And championships are won and lost in the trenches.

You really think Eli Manning was a superior QB to Tom Brady? No, Manning just had the benefit of better protection compared to what Brady was dealing with in both of those Super Bowls.

Really think Wilson is superior to Peyton Manning? No, again, the difference was that the Seahawks were dominating in the trenches and the Broncos weren't.

There's a reason why OL and DL players get drafted high every year. They actually make a huge impact on the games.

Amen brother...

[htismaqe]

Totally agree. My first choice, as I stated earlier is FS. But, given all the variables involved, if we end up with a G (or any other position for that matter), I'm not going to flip shit about it.

I'm not going to "flip shit" about it either.

I'm going to watch them lose next year, like I have for the past 25 or so...

[Simply Red]

this last, 'newer' batch of n00bs seem really arrogant -

[tatorhog]

Oh I get it, but using "damn good player" as a justification of taking a guard in te first round just because we have a hole isn't something that seems very intelligent.

Because who would want a damn good player on their team anyway?

dumbass.

[rico]

A baseball player who plays average defense and hits 25 HRs and has a slash line of .270/.320/.475 is not universally excellent. If he plays 1st, he's pretty fungible. If he plays short, he's damn near irreplaceable. That's the difference between a guard and a wide receiver or pass rusher.

"Fungible." I love it.

[O.city]

Because who would want a damn good player on their team anyway?

dumbass.

Maybe the same team that just let a "damn good player" walk to create a hole at rg?

[htismaqe]

Maybe the same team that just let a "damn good player" walk to create a hole at rg?

TOO EXPENSIVE!

[patteeu]

Maybe the same team that just let a "damn good player" walk to create a hole at rg?

Are you talking about Albert, Asamoah, or Schwartz here?

[tatorhog]

Maybe the same team that just let a "damn good player" walk to create a hole at rg?

You're absolutely right. Asamoah was the key. Your point is ironclad.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Maybe the same team that just let a "damn good player" walk to create a hole at rg?

Don't forget LT.

[O.city]

You're absolutely right. Asamoah was the key. Your point is ironclad.

Define damn good player then. Does said player have to profile as an all pro? As an above average player? Adequate?

Because unless it's an all pro type player, te chiefs just let an above average guard walk (Schwartz and asamoah).

The ol seemed to play pretty well last year late with said players playing, so unless those guys are damn good players and we let them walk, or you don't need damn good players to be adequate/good, I don't see the use here

[O.city]

You're absolutely right. Asamoah was the key. Your point is ironclad.

Did asamoah cause the team to crater? Then he was successful right?

[tatorhog]

Define damn good player then. Does said player have to profile as an all pro? As an above average player? Adequate?

Because unless it's an all pro type player, te chiefs just let an above average guard walk (Schwartz and asamoah).

The ol seemed to play pretty well last year late with said players playing, so unless those guys are damn good players and we let them walk, or you don't need damn good players to be adequate/good, I don't see the use here

They also signed fairly substantial contracts that we weren't going to match. Frankly I'm looking forward to seeing what Rishaw can do, but I'm not sold on Allen. Again, please see above. I'm not advocating for us to draft G in the 1st round, I'm simply saying that if we did, its probably because the brass saw a damn good player available and it wouldn't be the end of the world.

[htismaqe]

They also signed fairly substantial contracts that we weren't going to match. Frankly I'm looking forward to seeing what Rishaw can do, but I'm not sold on Allen. Again, please see above. I'm not advocating for us to draft G in the 1st round, I'm simply saying that if we did, its probably because the brass saw a damn good player available and it wouldn't be the end of the world.

Good lord, it hasn't been the end of the world since like 2002.

Most people are pretty used to seeing this team spin its wheels.

[HemiEd]

I'm not going to "flip shit" about it either.

I'm going to watch them lose next year, like I have for the past 25 or so...

n00b.

[htismaqe]

n00b.

Sorry, I had to use 25 arbitrarily. I figured if I said anything larger, I'd get attacked by the "what about Joe Montana" people...

[temper11]

There was no bidding war.

The 49ers wanted a 2nd rounder and we doubled it to prevent a bidding war.

They got a good QB out of the deal but they paid WAY more than they had to.

I've been looking at news stories about the trade last year ever since I read this post. I can't find anyone, anywhere that reported the Chiefs "doubled the offer to prevent a bidding war".

Not saying it didn't happen, I've just been searching through everything I can find from SF and KC to ESPN and can't find anything like that. There are a number of media reports that were surprised that the deal was as high as that, but that doesn't surprise me at all, because the media have made a living for the last several years using Smith as their nightly whipping boy, so of course they aren't going to say that he was worth a second and a conditional.

I'm not saying you are wrong, again, I just looked pretty hard and couldn't find it.

The fact of the matter is, Smith was coming off of a year and a half of top quality football. Among the best in the league in a few categories and he was available in a year in which there were few QB's in FA or prospects coming out in the draft. It was the perfect situation for the niners to ask top dollar. And I'd be surprised if there wasn't some serious interest coming from a few different places. There are always plenty of teams looking for a QB when the season gets done every year.

Also, there is also the possibility that the niners would rather have just kept Smith for 2 more years than trade him for a single second round pick. Harbaugh said as much early on before the season was even over that they saw no need to move Smith. They had two "starting" capable QB's for Smith's modest contract and Kapernick's rookie contract for 2 more seasons. What better way to nurture your young franchise QB than with a solid, smart, veteran QB for a couple of years. One that you know can step in and perform well, if your very mobile QB, takes a huge hit? Furthermore, it's not as if the niners were hurting for picks or cap room. That first second round pick probably wasn't as necessary to them as was the QB combo I've just highlighted above. It's possible the Chiefs needed to sweeten' the deal just to get the niners to bite at it. They were in pretty good shape - after the trade, if Kap went down, their season was done.

I think those scenarios are far more likely than Dorsey casually throwing in a conditional second pick "just in case" other teams were interested. The niners were sitting in a position of power... QB rich, draft pick rich, crappy QB prospects in FA and the draft... The Chiefs paid what they NEEDED to pay to get him... and I think he's proven, and will continue to prove, worth the cost.

[Chief Roundup]

I don't remember saying anything about 3rd round. IIRC, the conversation was about taking a WR and FS with the 1st and 3rd round picks, leaving guards to be picked in the 4th or after.

Yeah I said 4th. A 4th in this years draft is as good or better than a 3rd most years.

[Mr. Laz]

Watch them let Houston walk, like they did Albert.
after this offseason, i wouldn't be surprised

It appears we might be a new 5-year plan where they let all the guys they didn't draft/sign leave through attrition and draft a replacement.

[Discuss Thrower]

I have no doubt that a story will surface before the year turns over that Houston is likely to demand a lot of money and will test free agency.

Teicher or another FO mouthpiece will try and justify the decision to let him walk and more naive Chiefs fans will buy it... totally ignorant of the fact the team did nothing to replace him through the draft when anyone with foresight saw it coming almost a year in advance.

[BlackHelicopters]

after this offseason, i wouldn't be surprised

It appears we might be a new 5-year plan where they let all the guys they didn't draft/sign leave through attrition and draft a replacement.

Great. Another 5 year plan.

[htismaqe]

Yeah I said 4th. A 4th in this years draft is as good or better than a 3rd most years.

I'd rather sign a FA than use picks in the draft. There's no guarantee a late-rounder is any better than Rishaw Johnson.

[Chief Roundup]

I'd rather sign a FA than use picks in the draft. There's no guarantee a late-rounder is any better than Rishaw Johnson.

3rd-4th is not a late round pick, especially in this draft.

[Iconic]

I doubt Dorsey will let Houston walk. He's been a cap Jew for this very reason.... however, if he doesn't manage to resign Houston I will personally consider him incompetent for the GM position. Letting Houston go would be the last straw for me.

[BlackHelicopters]

Racist

[RealSNR]

If you take a guard with a pick that high he better be Will Shields. If you take a WR, he can be Dwayne Bowe and the pick will pay off. Will Shields is light years better than Dwayne Bowe, but his impact on the game is not.

Fatality

[Iconic]

Racist

Technically Judaism is a religion not a race.

[Hammock Parties]

gettin' real tired of your bullshit, Direckshun

[BlackHelicopters]

Technically Judaism is a religion not a race.

My bad.

[BlackHelicopters]

Anti semite

[htismaqe]

3rd-4th is not a late round pick, especially in this draft.

A 4th rounder is a late round pick.

[BlackHelicopters]

Gonna be real honest here. I don't trust Dorsey

[Iconic]

Anti semite

No I think the correct word here is bigot.

[LoneWolf]

I just have a bad feeling about this draft about a month and a half away.

The reasons:

1. The Chiefs reportedly want to go guard in the 1st.

2. Dorsey's first draft wasn't that great.

3. I don't think the Chiefs can trade down for any bounty of picks.

4. Whatever trade down we can get will be in the midroumds or by giving away future picks.

5. We will be sporting an offensive line that we built with two 1sts, two 2nds, and a 3rd, but still can't protect or block adequately.

6. We have too many holes, especially when you consider this team will be moving on from Hali and Flowers in a year.

Ultimately, I don't know. My enthusiasm is deflating.

The bolded statements above are your stupid opinions supported by nothing. Man the fuck up pussywillow. The games are settled on the field not in free agency or a month before the draft.

[Chief Roundup]

A 4th rounder is a late round pick.

Not this year. With the overall and more specific OL depth in this draft it makes that 4th every bit as good as a 3rd in any other given year.

[O.city]

There's not that much ol depth in this draft

[Chief Roundup]

There's not that much ol depth in this draft

That is not what the pundits are saying.

[O.city]

That is not what the pundits are saying.

Outside of the 3/4 round, ol gets slim Pickens

[Dave Lane]

this last, 'newer' batch of n00bs seem really arrogant -

I think they are all Black Bob

[Contrarian]

I can understand the frustration due to so many glaring needs on O, not too mention safety and pass rusher, but the idea of drafting a Guard does make SOME sense to me (albeit not that much tbh) for one reason. Smith is a cerebral guy who flourishes by taking advantage of a system and taking advantage of a defenses mistakes in coverage. If he is hitting 7 different receivers in a game, he is in a position to succeed. He becomes very average when he has to run for his life out there (as do most QB's, but I think more so for him).

So, in short... I think Smith can succeed with less than spectacular receivers given solid protection, but will have a difficult time with even spectacular receivers if he is not able to have the time to dissect the defense. If teams are able to get to him quickly without blitzing additional receivers his style of play is probably going to struggle. If protection is adequate he can make defenses pay and find the open man better than most of the qb's in the league imo.

Uh... he's a running QB dude. I like Smith out of the pocket, he actually picks up first downs. Kept us alive many times this last season.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

I think they are all Black Bob

Some one give them the uncle test

[Dave Lane]

Some one give them the uncle test

No wonder they are all pissed off.

[RealSNR]

I hear a lot of "If you can get Will Shields, you take him no questions asked."

What are the odds that guy will play like Will Shields? There has seemingly been a "stud" guard in every single goddamn draft the past several years. They can't all be studs. And very few of them are. DeCastro? Pouncey? I see a lot of good-not-great guards.

Very few people liked the Jeff Allen pick. But if we follow the model of how some people make assumptions, Jeff Allen was selected pretty high for what he was asked to do in the league. Shouldn't he be close to Will Shields by now?

You can scream "stud" all you want, but the bottom line is that for every "stud" you claim deserves to be drafted in the 1st round, there's a Larry Warford who gets drafted in the middle rounds and dominates.

That's the nature of the guard position in this league. It's ridiculously fucking stupid to draft one in the 1st.

[patteeu]

I hear a lot of "If you can get Will Shields, you take him no questions asked."

What are the odds that guy will play like Will Shields? There has seemingly been a "stud" guard in every single goddamn draft the past several years. They can't all be studs. And very few of them are. DeCastro? Pouncey? I see a lot of good-not-great guards.

Very few people liked the Jeff Allen pick. But if we follow the model of how some people make assumptions, Jeff Allen was selected pretty high for what he was asked to do in the league. Shouldn't he be close to Will Shields by now?

You can scream "stud" all you want, but the bottom line is that for every "stud" you claim deserves to be drafted in the 1st round, there's a Larry Warford who gets drafted in the middle rounds and dominates.

That's the nature of the guard position in this league. It's ridiculously fucking stupid to draft one in the 1st.

Just out of curiousity, how often, in the past 20 years, have the Chiefs picked a player who outperformed Will Shields, in terms of value to the Chiefs, with their first round draft pick? How often with a first round draft pick at the 23rd pick or later? In your opinion, of course.

1995 31 Trezelle Jenkins, OT
1996 28 Jerome Woods, SS
1997 13 Tony Gonzalez, TE
1998 27 Victor Riley, OT
1999 14 John Tait, OT
2000 21 Sylvester Morris, WR
2001 — No pick —
2002 6 Ryan Sims, DT
2003 27 Larry Johnson, RB
2004 — No pick —
2005 15 Derrick Johnson, LB
2006 20 Tamba Hali, DE
2007 23 Dwayne Bowe, WR
2008 5 Glenn Dorsey, DT
2008 15 Branden Albert, G
2009 3 Tyson Jackson, DE
2010 5 Eric Berry, S
2011 26 Jonathan Baldwin, WR
2012 11 Dontari Poe, NT
2013 1 Eric Fisher, OT

[Chief Roundup]

I hear a lot of "If you can get Will Shields, you take him no questions asked."

What are the odds that guy will play like Will Shields? There has seemingly been a "stud" guard in every single goddamn draft the past several years. They can't all be studs. And very few of them are. DeCastro? Pouncey? I see a lot of good-not-great guards.

Very few people liked the Jeff Allen pick. But if we follow the model of how some people make assumptions, Jeff Allen was selected pretty high for what he was asked to do in the league. Shouldn't he be close to Will Shields by now?

You can scream "stud" all you want, but the bottom line is that for every "stud" you claim deserves to be drafted in the 1st round, there's a Larry Warford who gets drafted in the middle rounds and dominates.

That's the nature of the guard position in this league. It's ridiculously ****ing stupid to draft one in the 1st.

I believe that we should be able to get a starting G with our 4th this year with the draft being so deep. With the draft you never know how things will turn. Hope we don't have to use our 3rd to get a starting guard.

[BossChief]

THE ONLY WAY I'd be even somewhat ok with drafting an offensive linemen with our top pick is if we trade down and get 2 good linemen instead of just one.

If we stay at23 and draft a linemen (in a very deep class of OL) that will be just as bad as drafting Fisher at 1.

[Bewbies]

Just out of curiousity, how often, in the past 20 years, have the Chiefs picked a player who outperformed Will Shields, in terms of value to the Chiefs, with their first round draft pick? How often with a first round draft pick at the 23rd pick or later? In your opinion, of course.

1995 31 Trezelle Jenkins, OT
1996 28 Jerome Woods, SS
1997 13 Tony Gonzalez, TE
1998 27 Victor Riley, OT
1999 14 John Tait, OT
2000 21 Sylvester Morris, WR
2001 — No pick —
2002 6 Ryan Sims, DT
2003 27 Larry Johnson, RB
2004 — No pick —
2005 15 Derrick Johnson, LB
2006 20 Tamba Hali, DE
2007 23 Dwayne Bowe, WR
2008 5 Glenn Dorsey, DT
2008 15 Branden Albert, G
2009 3 Tyson Jackson, DE
2010 5 Eric Berry, S
2011 26 Jonathan Baldwin, WR
2012 11 Dontari Poe, NT
2013 1 Eric Fisher, OT

Because hall of famers grow on trees.

[patteeu]

Because hall of famers grow on trees.

?

[Easy 6]

I'd rather sign a FA than use picks in the draft. There's no guarantee a late-rounder is any better than Rishaw Johnson.

Agreed, I much prefer known commodities.

[Tacoman]

Uh... he's a running QB dude. I like Smith out of the pocket, he actually picks up first downs. Kept us alive many times this last season.

Yes I love the way he keeps the chains moving with his scramble ability, but from what I have seen he doesn't throw well in comparison to others (wilson, newton, kaep etc)when he us on the run.

[Bewbies]

?

How often has any team drafted a HOF player in the 1st round?

It's the same as saying late round QB's are where it's at cause Tom Brady.

[patteeu]

How often has any team drafted a HOF player in the 1st round?

Not very often at all. That's pretty much my point. We'd be foolish not to be happy with a Will Shields quality guard with this first round pick if that's how it turned out.

[Bewbies]

Not very often at all. That's pretty much my point. We'd be foolish not to be happy with a Will Shields quality guard with this first round pick if that's how it turned out.

What do you get out of a HOF guard that wins more games than an average guard?

[patteeu]

What do you get out of a HOF guard that wins more games than an average guard?

4

Edit: I don't know what kind of answer you're looking for. Do you want me to calculate the average win/loss ratio for HOF guards compared to the average win/loss ratio for all guards (which I assume is 1.00)? Whatever it is, it seems like too much work.

[BossChief]

HOF guard.

Hahaa are you guys fucking joking?

There isn't a single guard in this draft that is any more special than the top 2-3 guards from any of he last few drafts.

Cooper
Warmack
Decastro

The only guard I'd ever seen that was worth a late first was Mike Iupati.

[Bewbies]

4

Edit: I don't know what kind of answer you're looking for. Do you want me to calculate the average win/loss ratio for HOF guards compared to the average win/loss ratio for all guards (which I assume is 1.00)? Whatever it is, it seems like too much work.

How much does say a Will Shields help you compared to say Adrian Peterson, Michael Strahan, Peyton Manning type player does.

Guards don't mean shit. Even great ones.

[Saccopoo]

HOF guard.

Hahaa are you guys ****ing joking?

There isn't a single guard in this draft that is any more special than the top 2-3 guards from any of he last few drafts.

Cooper
Warmack
Decastro

The only guard I'd ever seen that was worth a late first was Mike Iupati.

Gabe Jackson.

[OldSchool]

How much does say a Will Shields help you compared to say Adrian Peterson, Michael Strahan, Peyton Manning type player does.

Guards don't mean shit. Even great ones.

Tell that to the QB or RB that has to play behind crap OLs.

Go ask Barry Sanders how it was trying to win playoff games with the Lions.

[Saccopoo]

Tell that to the QB or RB that has to play behind crap OLs.

Go ask Barry Sanders how it was trying to win playoff games with the Lions.

http://blog.chron.com/sciguy/wp-content/blogs.dir/1898/files/2013/08/hot_david_carr.jpg

[patteeu]

HOF guard.

Hahaa are you guys fucking joking?

There isn't a single guard in this draft that is any more special than the top 2-3 guards from any of he last few drafts.

Cooper
Warmack
Decastro

The only guard I'd ever seen that was worth a late first was Mike Iupati.

Haha, good one Mel Kiper.

[patteeu]

How much does say a Will Shields help you compared to say Adrian Peterson, Michael Strahan, Peyton Manning type player does.

Guards don't mean shit. Even great ones.

If you can get Peyton Manning or Will Shields, you should pick Peyton Manning. Fantastic insight.

[Sorter]

If you can get Peyton Manning or Will Shields, you should pick Peyton Manning. Fantastic insight.

LMAO

[KCinNY]

Go ask Barry Sanders how it was trying to win playoff games with the Lions.

Yeah...Barry Sanders' O lines were so awful that Kevin Glover and Lomas Brown each made multiple Pro Bowls.

[Chief Roundup]

Yeah...Barry Sanders' O lines were so awful that Kevin Glover and Lomas Brown each made multiple Pro Bowls.

Barry Sanders is a bad example when talking Oline. That dude didn't need any and even if they were doing their job perfect he wouldn't have ran through that lane anyway.
Barry was the best but that guy never ran the ball where he was suppose to.

[rico]

Barry Sanders is a bad example when talking Oline. That dude didn't need any and even if they were doing their job perfect he wouldn't have ran through that lane anyway.
Barry was the best but that guy never ran the ball where he was suppose to.

I loved how his "signature" TD celebration was simply running over to the official and handing him the ball.

[htismaqe]

Yeah...Barry Sanders' O lines were so awful that Kevin Glover and Lomas Brown each made multiple Pro Bowls.

That early line that Sanders ran behind ruined QB Chuck Long. They were AWFUL.

[Chiefnj2]

KC should draft the best available CB with the first pick. Sutton needs a stud CB.

[Dave Lane]

KC should draft the best available CB with the first pick. Sutton needs a stud CB.

No in KC we only draft offensive linemen NO impact players allowed.