Is Dorsey / Reid operating as if they're rebuilding?

[Discuss Thrower]

Poll forthcoming.

[Bewbies]

Rebuilding what?

[Dayze]

rebuilding a pile.


it's a process. Super Bowl 2016 or Bust!!!!

[Hammock Parties]

nah we're just gonna sell some tickets and shit

there's no goal

[InChiefsHeaven]

Looks like it to me. Replace Tamba, no free agents...build through the draft. Well, except for a QB...

Hope it works...

[BigMeatballDave]

Just playing GoFish

[petegz28]

By rebuilding do you mean drafting the replacement of an aging pass rusher who has had several nagging injuries the last few seasons?

[Prison Bitch]

By rebuilding do you mean drafting the replacement of an aging pass rusher who has had several nagging injuries the last few seasons?

But but he wears a really scary black face mask!

[jd1020]

By rebuilding do you mean drafting the replacement of an aging pass rusher who has had several nagging injuries the last few seasons?

Good thing we picked a rock like Dee Ford who's never injured.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

There's no obvious plan. They didn't move in FA to shore up weaknesses, and all they are doing is patching future holes in the draft while neglecting value or the stockpiling future assets.

Looks like the off-year of the Carl Peterson era.

[petegz28]

Good thing we picked a rock like Dee Ford who's never injured.

meh, rather have young injured than old injured if that's the case

[Hammock Parties]

There's no obvious plan. They didn't move in FA to shore up weaknesses, and all they are doing is patching future holes in the draft while neglecting value or the stockpiling future assets.

Looks like the off-year of the Carl Peterson era.

Yep. No reason to impress the fan base this offseason. We just went to the playoffs. That alone will guarantee plenty of season ticket renewals.

[Rasputin]

So in 2024 draft we will be drafting a DE to replace Dee Ford and still wont have drafted a quarterback in the first round.

[jd1020]

meh, rather have young injured than old injured if that's the case

Because it matters if they are young or old on the bench.

[Molitoth]

meh, rather have young injured than old injured if that's the case

Really? That's the best you can come up with? Lol

[petegz28]

Really? That's the best you can come up with? Lol

What do you want me to tell you? He hasn't played a down yet and people already have him on the DL

[BigRedChief]

Poll forthcoming.poll fail.

It's never only two choices.

[Tribal Warfare]

With Alex Smith nope, unless they plan on drafting a QB and developing him.

[Discuss Thrower]

poll fail.

It's never only two choices.

Gaz is gone man.

Let. It. Go.

[TribalElder]

We will rape faces by not signing free agents when compensatory picks are handed out next year won't we?

[Tribal Warfare]

Gaz is gone man.

Let. It. Go.

Not really

[Prison Bitch]

They're going to extend Smith and they're overpaying his garbage backup. With us having little money there's no way we were going to allocate more dollars to that position

[Rain Man]

The best-case explanation is this:

Andy believes that the offensive performance in the last seven games is indicative of the future, and that Alex Smith can maintain that performance. His middle of the pack stats are sufficient in the modern NFL because anybody can score 30+ points in this league, especially when they have Jamaal Charles in the backfield.

On defense, the problem was injuries, and we'll likely lose Tamba to free agency at some point. So get someone in there to replace Tamba going forward, and use this year to maintain the "adequacy" that the Chiefs achieved last year. Then in 2015 go for actual improvement.


I'm not saying that's my thinking. I'm saying that that's the most optimistic way to interpret the Chiefs' thinking.

[Dayze]

Looks like it to me. Replace Tamba, no free agents...build through the draft. Well, except for a QB...

Hope it works...

this

said it last year and people thought I was doing shots of herpes, but Hali is done. this is the last year both contractually and performance

[Rausch]

The best-case explanation is this:

Andy believes that the offensive performance in the last seven games is indicative of the future, and that Alex Smith can maintain that performance. His middle of the pack stats are sufficient in the modern NFL because anybody can score 30+ points in this league, especially when they have Jamaal Charles in the backfield.

On defense, the problem was injuries, and we'll likely lose Tamba to free agency at some point. So get someone in there to replace Tamba going forward, and use this year to maintain the "adequacy" that the Chiefs achieved last year. Then in 2015 go for actual improvement.


I'm not saying that's my thinking. I'm saying that that's the most optimistic way to interpret the Chiefs' thinking.

What I don't get is that they seem happy with Smith yet have done nothing to help the guy out. Have not signed/drafted playmakers for him to throw to and let 3 O lineman walk in the offseason.

[Rausch]

this

said it last year and people thought I was doing shots of herpes, but Hali is done. this is the last year both contractually and performance

It was clear last year he was a descending player. He was completely neutralized when Houston was injured...

[SDChiefs]

rebuilding a pile.


it's a process. Super Bowl 2016 or Bust!!!!

No. Playoff win 2055 or bust.

[Mr. Laz]

yep, with the way FA went it screams rebuild.

Bandaid last year per Hunt's request to get butts in the seat ... now rebuild.

[Discuss Thrower]

yep, with the way FA went it screams rebuild.

Bandaid last year per Hunt's request to get butts in the seat ... now rebuild.

I think what they do with Alex will be telling..

[Rain Man]

What I don't get is that they seem happy with Smith yet have done nothing to help the guy out. Have not signed/drafted playmakers for him to throw to and let 3 O lineman walk in the offseason.

Well, we averaged almost 35 points a game over the last half of the season, so maybe they think we're fine there. We lost our LT and RG, but maybe they think another year in the system will offset that. I can only shrug.

[threebag]

Are this the best thread yet???

[Discuss Thrower]

Are this the best thread yet???

Yeah, ADD spasm. Original title was "Is Dorsey operating as if he's rebuilding", went back and added Reid to the line and forgot to change a verb tense. Sue me.

[Easy 6]

I don't think so, rebuilding to me is mgmt saying "we're not really pushing for the postseason this year".

To hear those two talk, they really seem to think they can not only get something out of, but improve with, whats already here in guys like Commings, Kelce, Johnson, Kush etc.

Whether or not they're right remains to be seen, but I don't think they view themselves as rebuilding.

[TEX]

I don't think so, rebuilding to me is mgmt saying "we're not really pushing for the postseason this year".

To hear those two talk, they really seem to think they can not only get something out of, but improve with, whats already here in guys like Commings, Kelce, Johnson, Kush etc.

Whether or not they're right remains to be seen, but I don't think they view themselves as rebuilding.

Blowing smoke. Actions speak louder than words. They know the fan base would not accept yet another rebuild.

[Easy 6]

Blowing smoke. Actions speak louder than words. They know the fan base would not accept yet another rebuild.

Maybe you're right, idk... but the Packers were never big free agent spenders either, I think the spending spree last year was a one off for Dorsey and we wont see anything like it again.

He wants to stick with the Packers model.

[chiefzilla1501]

It depends on your definition of rebuilding. It sure sounds to me like if the chiefs don't stack up for a three year run, its rebuilding. Silly talk. The chiefs aren't going to sledgehammer the team. My guess is, they extend Alex Smith which is not something a rebuilding team does. Unless you are balls to the wall drafting to support Peyton or brady in one last super bowl run, sorry, but to me it is stupid to draft for need.

Drafting bpa is the smart thing to do. Ford better be a good pick, but without a doubt, if he ends up a good player it's a good pick. If he sucks, its a bad pick. His ability to contribute immediately should have no bearing whatsoever on the quality of the pick.

[Marcellus]

There is very little rebuilding in today's NFL.

If you are starting a rookie QB could make that case, otherwise, nope.

This is nothing like the 2008 Chiefs.

[Marcellus]

Maybe you're right, idk... but the Packers were never big free agent spenders either, I think the spending spree last year was a one off for Dorsey and we wont see anything like it again.

He wants to stick with the Packers model.

FA players are not the key to any teams success.

Our bigger issue is going to be resigning our own guys and if we are making sure that is possible by not spending dumb $ in FA then I am all for it.

We had too many holes last year to not sign a handful of FA starters.

We dont have that many holes now. We do lack depth though.

[MotherfuckerJones]

Constantly rebuilding because any really good players we get, we waste their careers.

[Bearcat]

Operating like they've been here 40 years.... don't worry though, if you don't like it, there will be a new group in a few years after this all goes south, who will promptly trade for a veteran QB who can get the team back to mediocrity.

[crossbow]

Herm was in charge of the rebuild process. It won't be long before all of those impact players he drafted will be gone. The team will be full of Eric Fisher and Dee Ford guys that are nothing special.

[chiefzilla1501]

Herm was in charge of the rebuild process. It won't be long before all of those impact players he drafted will be gone. The team will be full of Eric Fisher and Dee Ford guys that are nothing special.

This year is much more in line with how we should be doing things, assuming we re-sign Smith, Berry, and hopefully Houston. Don't overpay your low positional value guys, use the early draft aggressively instead of playing safe, and focus on keeping your best talent.

That's all good in theory. Execution is the key. We will see how Ford pans out and if we effectively resign our playmakers.

[FloridaMan88]

The Chiefs will always be "rebuilding" under Clark Hunt's ownership because he will never commit to going all in to win in the present.

It is absolutely mind-boggling that the Chiefs are deciding to step back and rebuild, rather than aggressively go all in now to win with a team that is coming off of 11 wins, 8 Pro Bowl players, etc.

[In58men]

I hope they're not operating like that. You don't rebuild with a 30 year old QB.

[TLO]

*are

not is.

[Discuss Thrower]

*are

not is.

Q

[Rausch]

FA players are not the key to any teams success.

Payed-a-Ton and Welker were key to Denver making a SB.

We had too many holes last year to not sign a handful of FA starters.

We dont have that many holes now. We do lack depth though.

We have more holes now than we did last year - it just doesn't look as bad because we have a capable QB now.

Still need help at CB, TE, ILB, WR, and O line. All positions we needed last year and didn't effectively fill.

On top of that we've now lost two G's, a LT, and FS.

[keg in kc]

They've never been "re-building". They've been "building" since the day they got here, because this franchise has been a disaster for 15 years. Nothing to "re-build" because nothing worthwhile has been built previously. The playoff appearance last year was essentially a fluke, and they're just continuing in 2013 what they began in 2014.

[Graystoke]

Being a Chief Fan makes me Hurty

[Dr. Van Halen]

They've never been "re-building". They've been "building" since the day they got here, because this franchise has been a disaster for 15 years. Nothing to "re-build" because nothing worthwhile has been built previously. The playoff appearance last year was essentially a fluke, and they're just continuing in 2013 what they began in 2014.

Disaster for 15 years? Come on, man.

I thought we all agreed to end the hyperbole and histrionics.

[Discuss Thrower]

Disaster for 15 years? Come on, man.

I thought we all agreed to end the hyperbole and histrionics.

Since 1999:

Six seasons with a winning record.
Four playoff appearances with no wins.
Have drafted #1 overall, #3 overall and #5 overall twice.

[keg in kc]

Disaster for 15 years? Come on, man.

I thought we all agreed to end the hyperbole and histrionics.I believe that 6 winning seasons (including two 9-7s) and 4 playoff appearances (all losses...) in 15 years qualifies as a disaster, especially when balanced against 5 seasons with 6 or fewer wins.

This is the last 15 years:

One 13-3 season
One 11-5 season
Two 10-6 seasons
Two 9-7 seasons
One 8-8 season
Three 7-9 seasons
One 6-10 season
Two 4-12 seasons
Two 2-14 seasons

That's 6 seasons above .500, one year at .500 and 8 seasons below .500.

109 wins versus 131 losses.

They won in consecutive seasons just once (10-6 in 2005, 9-7 in 2006).
The lost in consecutive seasons three times (2000-2001, 2007-2009, 2011-2012).

(Take it back one more year to Marty's last season, and you add another 7-9 season to the list.)

[Chief_For_Life58]

we are so good at losing

[Dr. Van Halen]

I think disaster is a strong word.

So the Priest Holmes years were a disaster.

The Dick Vermeil Era was a disaster.

I could it's just semantics, but calling it a disaster is just being dramatic. Were those positive years ultimately disappointing? Yes. Were they a crapload of fun? Yes.

[keg in kc]

Yeah, I do think they were as much a part of the disaster as any of the other years. Sure, the offensive production was fun. It was also irrelevant in any real sense, because they were torpedoed by one of the worst defenses in league history. In the end the team never won a meaningful game under Vermeil. In fact, I think I might even argue that that era may have been a greater disaster in a sense because of the fact that they wasted that championship level offense. It was a tragedy and a travesty (at least insofar as something like football can be...).

[the Talking Can]

Maybe you're right, idk... but the Packers were never big free agent spenders either, I think the spending spree last year was a one off for Dorsey and we wont see anything like it again.

He wants to stick with the Packers model.

the bret farve/aaron rodgers model?

[keg in kc]

the bret farve/aaron rodgers model?We can only hope.

[WhiteWhale]

No.

Pretty much all of the core players they inherited are still here.

They're building on what was here. That's it.

[htismaqe]

No.

Pretty much all of the core players they inherited are still here.

They're building on what was here. That's it.

They replaced one core player in the 1st round last year and this year's pick appears to be the replacement for another core player.

The first move they made was to change the QB position unequivocally.

They're reportedly shopping Flowers.

They let starters walk on the offensive line. They let starters walk in the defensive backfield.

Are they gutting the team? No.

This absolutely is a rebuild. They're turning over more than 50% of the starters in the first 3 years, it would appear.

[WhiteWhale]

They replaced one core player in the 1st round last year and this year's pick appears to be the replacement for another core player.

The first move they made was to change the QB position unequivocally.

They're reportedly shopping Flowers.

They let starters walk on the offensive line. They let starters walk in the defensive backfield.

Are they gutting the team? No.

This absolutely is a rebuild. They're turning over more than 50% of the starters in the first 3 years, it would appear.

The difference is in our interpretation of what rebuilding means.

In my eyes it requires a tear-down (think about what KC did prior to 2007) and then starting from scratch. KC has a lot of roster movement, but I don't feel they've let any vital players walk.

I also don't put a lot of stock in speculation. Tamba Hali is 31 years old and battled injuries most of last season that slowed his production. There are total valid reasons to be looking for a potential replacement at the most important defensive position (pass rusher) that have nothing to do with rebuilding.

They're dumping players who's value doesn't match their desired pay check.

Building and transitioning over a 3 year period that is done intelligently and strategically... it not a 'rebuild' in my eyes. Hell, even letting a few aging or injury prone vets isn't rebuilding.

This would be more of a remodel than a rebuild. It's going to look a lot different in 3 years (most teams do) but it's not like they took a bulldozer to the foundation. IF we unload Berry for draft picks... then I'll concede.

[keg in kc]

They replaced one core player in the 1st round last year and this year's pick appears to be the replacement for another core player.

The first move they made was to change the QB position unequivocally.

They're reportedly shopping Flowers.

They let starters walk on the offensive line. They let starters walk in the defensive backfield.

Are they gutting the team? No.

This absolutely is a rebuild. They're turning over more than 50% of the starters in the first 3 years, it would appear.You've just described what new front offices always do. If they didn't have to do that, the old front offices would still be there.

[htismaqe]

The difference is in our interpretation of what rebuilding means.

In my eyes it requires a tear-down (think about what KC did prior to 2007) and then starting from scratch. KC has a lot of roster movement, but I don't feel they've let any vital players walk.

I also don't put a lot of stock in speculation. Tamba Hali is 31 years old and battled injuries most of last season that slowed his production. There are total valid reasons to be looking for a potential replacement at the most important defensive position (pass rusher) that have nothing to do with rebuilding.

They're dumping players who's value doesn't match their desired pay check.

Building and transitioning over a 3 year period that is done intelligently and strategically... it not a 'rebuild' in my eyes. Hell, even letting a few aging or injury prone vets isn't rebuilding.

This would be more of a remodel than a rebuild. It's going to look a lot different in 3 years (most teams do) but it's not like they took a bulldozer to the foundation. IF we unload Berry for draft picks... then I'll concede.

Totally get what you are saying.

[htismaqe]

You've just described what new front offices always do. If they didn't have to do that, the old front offices would still be there.

Of course.

[mdchiefsfan]

What I don't get is that they seem happy with Smith yet have done nothing to help the guy out. Have not signed/drafted playmakers for him to throw to and let 3 O lineman walk in the offseason.

They tried to get Sanders and Jackson, and have only selected once in the Draft so far. I think we see a WR taken in the 3rd.

[Exoter175]

Didn't read through the thread but wanted to comment about a few things real quick.

Yes, I feel like its a rebuild, but in a much better fashion than most GM/Coaches go into when they land in a new spot.

When they got here, they gauged the talent, brought in the right coaches, and went to work setting up the process ahead of them. Like it or not, the Alex Smith trade worked, and I'd do it in a heartbeat time and time again, he played very well in the end of the season last year, and had we not had some key injuries or some terrible no calls late in some of those games, we'd have won a few more and maybe been in a better situation for the playoffs, who knows. That's all behind us.

This year we let a lot of guys walk, not because we couldn't pay them the money they were worth, we could definitely have kept Albert, but the thing is, we drafted his replacement for the LT spot, and he got some reps in at RT to get used to the speed of the NFL. Fisher's going to be a pretty good LT in this league, and I'm okay with that selection. We let just about everybody else from our line go because the money getting shelled out for those guys was probably a little on the higher end than we'd want to pay into them going into the 2014/2015 seasons where we will have to work the cap for a few years. I was let down we didn't figure out the FS, WR, or ILB situation in the off season (at least not to the standard I'd like), but Dorsey is playing mad scientist back there right now. He's saving us the cash we need to make a hard look at Hali next year, while setting up Smith as our Franchise guy with an extension likely to follow this draft (pay no attention to the cold talk rumors, no QB gets an extension prior to draft day unless You're "THE" QB on the block). I love the Baldwin/Jenkins trade, and I'm guessing Reid sees some potential in Jenkins if they passed up Benjamin and Lee to get another pass rusher, guy was a first round talent, and looked like once he got the system a bit, he could play in it. Looking forward to what he does this year.

On top of that, next year we are going to see, I believe, 3 compensatory selections, one in the 2nd round, and likely 2 in the 3rd round, at worst one with a selection in the 4th as well, coming in a year where we are finally done with the pick losses from Alex's trade.

So next years' draft will probably look like this, 1, 2,2,3,3,4,4,5,6,7, or at best , 1,2,2,3,3,3,4,5,6,7

Its going to be one hell of a draft next year having what should amount to 5-6 picks in the top 100, and 3 picks in the top 60, and the best part is, in the 2016 draft, we will likely land another 2nd round compensatory selection for Hali when we let him go since we can't afford both Hali and Houston after the 2014 season.

I like what we are doing, because so far, we are loading a lot of the big money positions up with rookie contracts, and a lot of those guys are playing in depth to get up to speed behind some solid talents, Fisher/Albert, Ford/Hali.

And we are still hearing talk about interest in Berry and Flowers trades on day 2, despite the fact that I'd like neither of them to go.

I Just hope that the 2015 draft has as much depth of talent as this 2014 draft does.

[Discuss Thrower]

Didn't read through the thread but wanted to comment about a few things real quick.

Yes, I feel like its a rebuild, but in a much better fashion than most GM/Coaches go into when they land in a new spot.

When they got here, they gauged the talent, brought in the right coaches, and went to work setting up the process ahead of them. Like it or not, the Alex Smith trade worked, and I'd do it in a heartbeat time and time again, he played very well in the end of the season last year, and had we not had some key injuries or some terrible no calls late in some of those games, we'd have won a few more and maybe been in a better situation for the playoffs, who knows. That's all behind us.

This year we let a lot of guys walk, not because we couldn't pay them the money they were worth, we could definitely have kept Albert, but the thing is, we drafted his replacement for the LT spot, and he got some reps in at RT to get used to the speed of the NFL. Fisher's going to be a pretty good LT in this league, and I'm okay with that selection. We let just about everybody else from our line go because the money getting shelled out for those guys was probably a little on the higher end than we'd want to pay into them going into the 2014/2015 seasons where we will have to work the cap for a few years. I was let down we didn't figure out the FS, WR, or ILB situation in the off season (at least not to the standard I'd like), but Dorsey is playing mad scientist back there right now. He's saving us the cash we need to make a hard look at Hali next year, while setting up Smith as our Franchise guy with an extension likely to follow this draft (pay no attention to the cold talk rumors, no QB gets an extension prior to draft day unless You're "THE" QB on the block). I love the Baldwin/Jenkins trade, and I'm guessing Reid sees some potential in Jenkins if they passed up Benjamin and Lee to get another pass rusher, guy was a first round talent, and looked like once he got the system a bit, he could play in it. Looking forward to what he does this year.

On top of that, next year we are going to see, I believe, 3 compensatory selections, one in the 2nd round, and likely 2 in the 3rd round, at worst one with a selection in the 4th as well, coming in a year where we are finally done with the pick losses from Alex's trade.

So next years' draft will probably look like this, 1, 2,2,3,3,4,4,5,6,7, or at best , 1,2,2,3,3,3,4,5,6,7

Its going to be one hell of a draft next year having what should amount to 5-6 picks in the top 100, and 3 picks in the top 60, and the best part is, in the 2016 draft, we will likely land another 2nd round compensatory selection for Hali when we let him go since we can't afford both Hali and Houston after the 2014 season.

I like what we are doing, because so far, we are loading a lot of the big money positions up with rookie contracts, and a lot of those guys are playing in depth to get up to speed behind some solid talents, Fisher/Albert, Ford/Hali.

And we are still hearing talk about interest in Berry and Flowers trades on day 2, despite the fact that I'd like neither of them to go.

I Just hope that the 2015 draft has as much depth of talent as this 2014 draft does.

No compensation picks handed out in the 2nd round...

[Exoter175]

No compensation picks handed out in the 2nd round...

For some reason I was thinking there was a unique clause in there for a 2nd round selection on Albert, mah bad.

So the potential for a fuckton of third rounders, I could buy into that. :p

[mdchiefsfan]

No compensation picks handed out in the 2nd round...

This and I dont think you get comp picks for releasing a player, only when you dont re-sign a player as a free agent.

[Exoter175]

This and I dont think you get comp picks for releasing a player, only when you dont re-sign a player as a free agent.

You don't for a release or trade, but FA/RFA if I recall correctly, which should apply towards Albert, Tjax, Schwartz, Asamoah, McCluster. We will end up capping out comp picks which I believe is 3 or 4 max. And I doubt we'll get any worse than a 4th rounder from those.

[mdchiefsfan]

Its going to be one hell of a draft next year having what should amount to 5-6 picks in the top 100, and 3 picks in the top 60, and the best part is, in the 2016 draft, we will likely land another 2nd round compensatory selection for Hali when we let him go since we can't afford both Hali and Houston after the 2014 season.


You don't for a release or trade, but FA/RFA if I recall correctly, which should apply towards Albert, Tjax, Schwartz, Asamoah, McCluster. We will end up capping out comp picks which I believe is 3 or 4 max. And I doubt we'll get any worse than a 4th rounder from those.

If we can't afford Hali and Houston after 2014, how are we going to have Hali until 2016?

[Rausch]

You don't for a release or trade, but FA/RFA if I recall correctly, which should apply towards Albert, Tjax, Schwartz, Asamoah, McCluster. We will end up capping out comp picks which I believe is 3 or 4 max. And I doubt we'll get any worse than a 4th rounder from those.

You don't get multiple comp picks in the same round.

This isn't even realistic...

[Exoter175]

Hali isn't a FA until 2016.

http://mobile.spotrac.com/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs/tamba-hali/

Then I've got Hali and Houston's contracts backwards, Houstons is up after this year then and hali's after next? Right?

[Exoter175]

You don't get multiple comp picks in the same round.

This isn't even realistic...

Is that a somewhat recent rule change?:hmmm:

[Rausch]

Is that a somewhat recent rule change?:hmmm:

No...

[mdchiefsfan]

Then I've got Hali and Houston's contracts backwards, Houstons is up after this year then and hali's after next? Right?

Got it. If Ford works out, Hali is a cap casualty next year, thus netting us 0 comp picks. But do I wish you were right.

[Exoter175]

No...

Didn't the Falcons of not too distant past get 2 third round selections in the late 80's or early 90s?

[Exoter175]

Got it.

Well, if we don't trade him, I"d be willing to bet he'd restructure to stay in KC, lord knows a Hali, Ford, Houston combo of pass rush would just dominate. LMAO

[Exoter175]

You don't get multiple comp picks in the same round.

This isn't even realistic...

Turns out you are wrong, look at this years compensatory selections. ROFL

Ravens (4 picks): Round Three (99), Round Four (134), Round Four (138), Round Five (175).

Jets (4 picks): Round Four (137), Round Six (209), Round Six (210), Round Six (213).

Steelers (3 picks): Round Three (97), Round Five (173), Round Six (215).

Texans (3 picks): Round Four (135), Round Six (211), Round Seven (256).

Falcons (3 picks): Round Four (139), Round Seven (253), Round Seven (255).

Rams (3 picks): Round Six (214), Round Seven (249), Round Seven (250)

Cowboys (3 picks): Round Seven (248), Round Seven (251), Round Seven (254).

Packers (2 picks): Round Three (98), Round Five (176).

Lions (2 picks): Round Four (133), Round Four (136).

Bengals (2 picks): Round Six (212), Round Seven (252).

49ers (1 pick): Round Three (100).

Patriots (1 pick): Round Four (140).

Giants (1 pick): Round Five (174).

[Mr. Laz]

Didn't read through the thread but wanted to comment about a few things real quick.
.............

Except for that fact that by the time we get all the stuff you talk about finished our best players will be retiring or suck and we will have replace the other half of the team which will take another 'couple of years'

sounds like a rebuild to me

[mdchiefsfan]

Well, if we don't trade him, I"d be willing to bet he'd restructure to stay in KC, lord knows a Hali, Ford, Houston combo of pass rush would just dominate. LMAO

Id love to see him restructure, but I don't think he would restructure to the point we feel worthy. We wouldn't be able to land a trade with the price tag he had attached to him. We'd be forced to cut him. Flowers is another one to look out for in this regard.

[Mr. Laz]

it's a rebuild or maintenance


rebuilding - team's core isn't good enough so they are not pushing for a super bowl window. They are recycling talent until they think the core is ready to go.

maintenance - making the playoffs is basically the goal, so we already 'MADE IT' Now we are just drafting to replace existing players and tweaking to maintain our playoff team.

[Discuss Thrower]

Gotta love the whole concept of comp picks.

NFL League Office: "Okay, so these teams got these bonus picks in these rounds."
Billy-Joe Jim Bob: "Why?"
NFL: "Because of free agency."
BJJB: "Can you explain further?"
NFL: "lol. No."

Then some guy takes the time to deduct how the compensatory picks are dealt out, to the point he's able to accurately predict who gets what with only a handful of picks he doesn't determine.

[mdchiefsfan]

Except for that fact that by the time we get all the stuff you talk about finished our best players will be retiring or suck and we will have replace the other have the team which will take another 'couple of years'

sounds like a rebuild to me

Rebuilding doesn't have to be as painful as it has been. Good GMs manage to rebuild quickly (see Baltimore and Pittsburg). Is Dorsey able to accomplish a seamless rebuild while rrmaining competitive? That is the question at hand.

[Exoter175]

Except for that fact that by the time we get all the stuff you talk about finished our best players will be retiring or suck and we will have replace the other have the team which will take another 'couple of years'

sounds like a rebuild to me

If by that you mean, literally next year when we are handed at least 3 comp picks, possibly 4, plus whatever else we wheel and deal next year, and possibly day 2 trade tonight with Flowers or Berry?

Because that all loads up to a 2015 draft to not only replenish talent and depth, but allow us the room to wiggle on those early picks. Guys like WR's, CB's, possibly even a QB.

And with the way the rookie payscale works nowadays, we should have no issue being able to hit free agency hard in 2015/2016 especially with a restructure to Hali if he will take it, and even after spending money on Houston and Smith.

Id love to see him restructure, but I don't think he would restructure to the point we feel worthy. We wouldn't be able to land a trade with the price tag he had attached to him. We'd be forced to cut him. Flowers is another one to look out for in this regard.

I don't see Hali wanting to move on that, from all reports...he loves KC, and we've been great to him. Short of working a trade out to a pass rush needy team (AFC South maybe), I think he'd restructure into a contract we could swallow. Flowers I feel is unique, because teams always need solid corners, and Flowers is pretty damned solid, we should have zero issues trading him if we can't figure out what to do with him and his contract here, he wont' have much leverage against us with Cooper coming up.

[In58men]

With Alex Smith nope, unless they plan on drafting a QB and developing him.

BOOM

[Exoter175]

it's a rebuild or maintenance


rebuilding - team's core isn't good enough so they are not pushing for a super bowl window. They are recycling talent until they think the core is ready to go.

maintenance - making the playoffs is basically the goal, so we already 'MADE IT' Now we are just drafting to replace existing players and tweaking to maintain our playoff team.

I like the idea of maintenance better, drafting Hali's replacement, trading for Smith, drafting Albert's replacement, adding depth and so forth doesn't feel like a gutting which most rebuilds tend to do, despite free agency feeling like that to our lines.

[Mr. Laz]

If by that you mean, literally next year when we are handed at least 3 comp picks, possibly 4, plus whatever else we wheel and deal next year, and possibly day 2 trade tonight with Flowers or Berry?

Because that all loads up to a 2015 draft to not only replenish talent and depth, but allow us the room to wiggle on those early picks. Guys like WR's, CB's, possibly even a QB.

And with the way the rookie payscale works nowadays, we should have no issue being able to hit free agency hard in 2015/2016 especially with a restructure to Hali if he will take it, and even after spending money on Houston and Smith.
and all those draft picks will be ready to go in year 1 or will they take a couple of year to get going?

A couple of years will means 2 or 3 yrs from now and that puts Charles,Hali,DJ,Flowers,Sean Smith,Bowe all pretty close to the end of the road.

The window for those guys was right now, and we passed.

[Mr. Laz]

Rebuilding doesn't have to be as painful as it has been. Good GMs manage to rebuild quickly (see Baltimore and Pittsburg). Is Dorsey able to accomplish a seamless rebuild while rrmaining competitive? That is the question at hand.
fair enough, but it's still a rebuild

Might as well trade Flowers,Charles etc because they won't still be prime by the time the rest of the team is rebuilt

[Exoter175]

and all those draft picks will be ready to go in year 1 or will they take a couple of year to get going?

A couple of years will means 2 or 3 yrs from now and that puts Charles,Hali,DJ,Flowers,Sean Smith,Bowe all pretty close to the end of the road.

The window for those guys was right now, and we passed.

What did we pass on? We got a QB who was actually worth a fuck, and lost some above average talent in the offensive line so we can load up next year on our depth at the line under rookie contracts, so we could spend serious money in 2015 on extending guys that have life left in their careers, and Free Agency.

Bowe isn't done anytime soon, neither is Flowers or DJ who just had an epic year, Sean Smith doesn't even count, and JC just had the best year of his career by all accounts, and he's what? 27? Hardly close to his end.

And no, I do not see all of those picks being starters on day 1, but I do see room to grab depth at the line in the late rounds, while being able to get sharp with our early picks on day 1 positional talents like a WR, QB, or a Man Cover Corner.

What's the other option?Dorsey and Reid have no idea what they are doing and just let the team get gutted this year because they couldn't sign everybody? You don't get to be the superstar GM that Dorsey is, following up "Executive of the year pioli" and do the same act lol. That's how people never find a job again in this field.

[Discuss Thrower]

Unless Charles is somehow Adrian Peterson's long-lost half brother, the numbers say he falls of a cliff production wise soon.

[Mr. Laz]

What did we pass on? We got a QB who was actually worth a fuck, and lost some above average talent in the offensive line so we can load up next year on our depth at the line under rookie contracts, so we could spend serious money in 2015 on extending guys that have life left in their careers, and Free Agency.

Bowe isn't done anytime soon, neither is Flowers or DJ who just had an epic year, Sean Smith doesn't even count, and JC just had the best year of his career by all accounts, and he's what? 27? Hardly close to his end.

And no, I do not see all of those picks being starters on day 1, but I do see room to grab depth at the line in the late rounds, while being able to get sharp with our early picks on day 1 positional talents like a WR, QB, or a Man Cover Corner.

What's the other option?Dorsey and Reid have no idea what they are doing and just let the team get gutted this year because they couldn't sign everybody? You don't get to be the superstar GM that Dorsey is, following up "Executive of the year pioli" and do the same act lol. That's how people never find a job again in this field.You have guzzled an entire gallon of the kool-aid. Enjoy.

[Mr. Laz]

Unless Charles is somehow Adrian Peterson's long-lost half brother, the numbers say he falls of a cliff production wise soon.
yep ... Flowers looks almost done already. Hali as well.

Dont' know about DJ but father time always wins.

[mdchiefsfan]

fair enough, but it's still a rebuild

Might as well trade Flowers,Charles etc because they won't still be prime by the time the rest of the team is rebuilt

Then you go into full on blow it up mode. Good GMs dont toss all of their good players either; you just begin the rotation of drafting their replacements. That is what makes the rebuild unnoticeable. Guys that will put you into a cap situation are the ones you ideally trade, but time will tell.

For the record, I do believe this is a rebuild, but I am hoping we're not being sold the 5 year plan. I want to be entertained while we get better. I still have no issue with the trade for Smith because Dorsey and Reid have shown a tendency to develop qbs behind the starters for at least a year. I think we are on the right track, just have to make very wise choices in the draft with our players aging

[Exoter175]

Unless Charles is somehow Adrian Peterson's long-lost half brother, the numbers say he falls of a cliff production wise soon.

If he does, its because Reid/Dorsey try to save his legs. Guy is in great shape, had a career year, still 27 years old, and a former track star. I doubt his production falls off half as bad as most guys and I bet it doesn't fall off until his 30's.

You have guzzled an entire gallon of the kool-aid. Enjoy.

Peterson is gone, Pioli is gone. You either get on the wagon with Reid/Dorsey, or you stand in the corner twiddling your thumbs talking to yourself waiting for the day we "get a real coach and GM to lead us", when we already have a HoF bound coach right here on this team lol.

[Exoter175]

Then you go into full on blow it up mode. Good GMs dont toss all of their good players either; you just begin the rotation of drafting their replacements. That is what makes the rebuild unnoticeable. Guys that will put you into a cap situation are the ones you ideally trade, but time will tell.

For the record, I do believe this is a rebuild, but I am hoping we're not being sokd the 5 yesr plan. I want to be entertained while we get better. I still have no issue with the trade for Smith becaude Dorsey and Reid have shown a tendency to develop qbs behind the starters for at least a year. I think we are on the right track, just have to make very wise choices in the draft with our players aging

Which is why that Cooper snag was so fucking epic, because next year when we decide to grab a cover corner in the 1st or 2nd round, we could totally roll out without Flowers or Smith and be fine. Partially why I wanted Dennard last night with our pick, but I'm okay with Ford.

[Mr. Laz]

Then you go into full on blow it up mode. Good GMs dont toss all of their good players either; you just begin the rotation of drafting their replacements. That is what makes the rebuild unnoticeable. Guys that will put you into a cap situation are the ones you ideally trade, but time will tell.
it also makes the rebuild longer

fair enough ... if the word rebuild bothers people so much, let's just say that we started our 3-year plan this year.

If we keep letting our vets walk then that will become a 5-year plan really quickly. If all the hurt guys we drafted stay hurt then it will become a 7-year plan and Dorsey will be fired before it ever happens.

[Discuss Thrower]

If he does, its because Reid/Dorsey try to save his legs. Guy is in great shape, had a career year, still 27 years old, and a former track star. I doubt his production falls off half as bad as most guys and I bet it doesn't fall off until his 30's.



Peterson is gone, Pioli is gone. You either get on the wagon with Reid/Dorsey, or you stand in the corner twiddling your thumbs talking to yourself waiting for the day we "get a real coach and GM to lead us", when we already have a HoF bound coach right here on this team lol.

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/chartbuilder/Age-vs-Production-Running-Backs-Receivers1396880190285.png

[Exoter175]

it also makes the rebuild longer

fair enough ... if the word rebuild bothers people so much, let's just say that we started our 3-year plan this year.

If we keep letting our vets walk then that will become a 5-year plan really quickly. If all the hurt guys we drafted stay hurt then it will become a 7-year plan and Dorsey will be fired before it ever happens.

Its safe to say you are still drinking from the Peterson/Pioli jug. ROFL

[MotherfuckerJones]

This is just it. We passed on QB or didn't trade up for the top QB because we have a decent one. This team doesn't dare to be great.

[Exoter175]

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/chartbuilder/Age-vs-Production-Running-Backs-Receivers1396880190285.png

You act as if I said the statistics lie, I'm speaking specifically in JC's case, I doubt he falls off in tangible production until he hits 30.

Also, this guy would like to have a word with you.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/curtis-martin.jpg

[mdchiefsfan]

it also makes the rebuild longer

fair enough ... if the word rebuild bothers people so much, let's just say that we started our 3-year plan this year.

If we keep letting our vets walk then that will become a 5-year plan really quickly. If all the hurt guys we drafted stay hurt then it will become a 7-year plan and Dorsey will be fired before it ever happens.

Its not so much the word, but the perception of the word that bothers me. And obviously if the wrong choices are made, the length of time until we compete extends. That is why we will see what Dorsey is made of shortly.

[Mr. Laz]

Its safe to say you are still drinking from the Peterson/Pioli jug. ROFL
bullshit ... has nothing to do with anything but this team, right now

I haven't seen anything that tells me Dorsey knows a god dam thing. He has barely drafted players that can even stay healthy.

Dorsey got the QB that Reid wanted and got raped in the process.

Dorsey got raped by Bowe in contract negotiations as well

picking up Cooper is about the best thing Dorsey has done so far ... knile davis and catapano are decent.

overpaid for Dunta Robinson and Chase Daniel


As soon as Dorsey shows me something, i will give him credit for it.

[Discuss Thrower]

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD CAN SOME MOD FIX MY GRAMMATICAL ERROR IN THE TITLE

[mdchiefsfan]

bullshit ... has nothing to do with anything but this team, right now

I haven't seen anything that tells me Dorsey knows a god dam thing. He has barely drafted players that can even stay healthy.

Dorsey got the QB that Reid wanted and got raped in the process.

Dorsey got raped by Bowe in contract negotiations as well

picking up Cooper is about the best thing Dorsey has done so far ... knile davis and catapano are decent.

overpaid for Dunta Robinson and Chase Daniel

As soon as Dorsey shows me something, i will give him credit for it.

I agree. Reid has shown his worth; im still waiting for Dorsey to contribute.

[Mr. Laz]

I agree. Reid has shown his worth; im still waiting for Dorsey to contribute.
exactly, and Dorsey didn't hire Reid so he doesn't get credit for that.

I don't dislike Dorsey but he still hasn't proven much of anything as a Chief.

[htismaqe]

exactly, and Dorsey didn't hire Reid so he doesn't get credit for that.

I don't dislike Dorsey but he still hasn't proven much of anything as a Chief.

I can agree with this. I'm not "down" on Dorsey but I'm not really impressed so far either.

[Mr. Laz]

34th and 56th pick(s) of the drafts for a QB sitting on their bench



absolutely raped :cuss:

[Exoter175]

bullshit ... has nothing to do with anything but this team, right now

I haven't seen anything that tells me Dorsey knows a god dam thing. He has barely drafted players that can even stay healthy.

Dorsey got the QB that Reid wanted and got raped in the process.

Dorsey got raped by Bowe in contract negotiations as well

picking up Cooper is about the best thing Dorsey has done so far ... knile davis and catapano are decent.

overpaid for Dunta Robinson and Chase Daniel


As soon as Dorsey shows me something, i will give him credit for it.

He got rid of McCluster, which felt like all of you except me, were happy about. Everyone on this forum was so anti-McCluster. He went and signed Bray which turned (again) all of you into homers for the kid lol. He got rid of Tjax and Dorsey, which everyone seemed excited about, despite better play prior to their lack of contract. Drafted Fisher which was and will be good for us, Cooper was a home run signing, Nabbed Kelce which this WHOLE forum is high on and everyone thinks is better than Moeaki ever was, despite the early on injury, picked up Knile Davis which despite my fumble reluctance, turned out fucking rock solid for a 3rd round pick on a depth/return guy, and it paid out immediately. Kush was a solid pick in the 6th and should see some time this year I'd think. Commings they seem to be pretty high on this forum too, and the FO seems to love that pick and think he will see solid time this year, so who knows how that 2013 draft will pan out, Catapano was a home run for a 7th round pick haha. Only true bust types coming into this year seem to be Nico or Braden. To be truthful, braden was a camp body pick IMO, and Nico has a little time to figure out if he can translate to the NFL or not.

So far he's doing pretty good IMO. I like how this draft has started, but hated the free agency slam, only time will tell how it all pans out, but so far I'm liking his first draft and like the start of this 2nd draft too. The only knock I can give the guy thus far is that he was noncommital in free agency and it showed.

[Exoter175]

And don't forget the swap of Baldwin for Jenkins, not only did we instantly win the second we made that trade, but I have a feeling we might actually see some tangible production out of it this year. And if that is even remotely true, it was a grand slam home run for this team because Baldwin was a god damned waste of space.

[chiefzilla1501]

it also makes the rebuild longer

fair enough ... if the word rebuild bothers people so much, let's just say that we started our 3-year plan this year.

If we keep letting our vets walk then that will become a 5-year plan really quickly. If all the hurt guys we drafted stay hurt then it will become a 7-year plan and Dorsey will be fired before it ever happens.

The big difference is that in a rebuild, you are expecting 3 years of misery and hoping the third year, you strike gold.

I know people want to see the Chiefs go all-in or blow it up. I don't see a problem with doing it in-between except that you don't get as many blue chip draft picks. The Chiefs right now have an outside chance at super bowl. It's a big longshot, but at least it's a shot. The Chiefs 2 years ago didn't have a shot in hell and everyone should have known that.

I don't have a problem with the approach. You're absolutely right that Dorsey has a shitload to prove in terms of actual execution.

[mdchiefsfan]

I can agree with this. I'm not "down" on Dorsey but I'm not really impressed so far either.

Pretty much my thoughts as well. This draft will really start my sway; one way or the other.

[Exoter175]

The big difference is that in a rebuild, you are expecting 3 years of misery and hoping the third year, you strike gold.

I know people want to see the Chiefs go all-in or blow it up. I don't see a problem with doing it in-between except that you don't get as many blue chip draft picks. The Chiefs right now have an outside chance at super bowl. It's a big longshot, but at least it's a shot. The Chiefs 2 years ago didn't have a shot in hell and everyone should have known that.

I don't have a problem with the approach. You're absolutely right that Dorsey has a shitload to prove in terms of actual execution.

All I'm saying is, look at what the Broncos have done. They decided to go all in and keep deciding to go all in. Yes, they went to the Superbowl, but they basically got embarassed like only 2 or 3 teams had ever seen before.

At the end of the day, its Super Bowl or bust, not "visit the super bowl and we are happy". They went all in on an EXTREMELY limited time frame to do it all in, and they've got nothing to show for it but a super bowl trip and a thinning salary cap year after year. When Peyton is gone, they are so royally fucked they will have to rebuild for 3-5 years under horseface.

[ModSocks]

Rebuilding vs Reloading. A matter of semantics.

[chiefzilla1501]

Pretty much my thoughts as well. This draft will really start my sway; one way or the other.

Agreed. I think him playing the free agency game is out of his comfort zone. They didn't do it very much in Green Bay and I hope he gets better at it, but it's not his bread and butter.

The draft is. I wasn't impressed with last year, but in fairness, he now has his own scouts and a better understanding of what Reid and Sutton want to do. Great comment from him about adjusting this year by wanting more of a 3-tech vs. a 5-tech. This pick to me felt like a scouting pick vs. conventional so even though I'm not wow'ed by this pick, I like it better than the picks I felt really lukewarm about last year. Let's hope that momentum continues.