Phillip Gaines

[Chiefshrink]

I haven't had a chance to thoroughly watch the first 3 pre-season games but did watch all of the GB game. Gaines played horrible against 2nd and 3rd string offenses of GB. Has he played this bad all pre-season ? What is your take on the kid so far ?

[Bowser]

Yes, he played that bad all preseason.

he has a long, long way to go.

[Silock]

My take is fuck Dorsey for putting us in a position to rely on this guy as a rookie.

He may come good, he may not. But fuck Dorsey.

[The Franchise]

He's raw but we already knew that when he was drafted.

[BlackHelicopters]

#fuckdorsey

[The Franchise]

My take is fuck Dorsey for putting us in a position to rely on this guy as a rookie.

He may come good, he may not. But fuck Dorsey.

Relying on him for what exactly? Cooper and Smith are your starters. Parker and Owens will more than likely be your NB and dime. Gaines won't see a lot of playing time except on STs.

[OldSchool]

He plays like he should have been picked on day 3, not day 2. He really has a long way to go before he can contribute on a regular basis. He has shown flashes, just terribly inconsistent and looks lost a lot of times.

[Silock]

Relying on him for what exactly? Cooper and Smith are your starters. Parker and Owens will more than likely be your NB and dime. Gaines won't see a lot of playing time except on STs.

I bet he sees the field on defense quite a lot. Because the others you listed all suck, as well.

[Mr. Laz]

He was drafted to replace Flowers to free up the money. That's why they played him so much in the preseason.

Doesn't look like he's ready

Fail on the draft?
Fail on the coaching?

[New World Order]

My take is **** Dorsey for putting us in a position to rely on this guy as a rookie.

He may come good, he may not. But **** Dorsey.


http://resources.news.com.au/files/2013/05/06/1226635/927648-jack-nicholson.gif

[Titty Meat]

He sucks

[Chiefshrink]

Yes, he played that bad all preseason.

he has a long, long way to go.

That's not good IF you are a 3rd pick IMO. 3rd CB's should be back up at minimum if not pushing for the starting job by mid-season of your rookie year IMO. To your point and Pest's he doesn't even play at a back up level yet.:doh!:

[Chiefshrink]

I bet he sees the field on defense quite a lot. Because the others you listed all suck, as well.

Manning is licking his chops and will probably set a new NFL record for TDs in one game in the 2nd week of this season I'm afraid.:banghead:

[Dave Lane]

He plays like he should have been a UDFA. He really has a long way to go before he can contribute on a regular basis. He has shown flashes, just terribly inconsistent and looks lost a lot of times.

FYP

[J Diddy]

No Mormon/ No Good

[BlackHelicopters]

Trust Dorsey

[jd1020]

At least he ran fast at the combine!

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.a/6a00d8341c630a53ef015435fc9804970c-600wi

[Chiefshrink]

At least he ran fast at the combine!

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.a/6a00d8341c630a53ef015435fc9804970c-600wi

:thumb:

[J Diddy]

He plays like he should have been picked on day 3, not day 2. He really has a long way to go before he can contribute on a regular basis. He has shown flashes, just terribly inconsistent and looks lost a lot of times.Sounds like the first girl who gave me head back in my teenage years.

Fret not, she picked it up relatively quickly so maybe the same will happen here.

[Icon]

I was thrilled to see Pioli be given the boot but Dorsey hasn't impressed me at all with his drafting skills.

[Chiefshrink]

I was thrilled to see Pioli be given the boot but Dorsey hasn't impressed me at all with his drafting skills.

As elusive stated 'Trust Dorsey' !!:thumb:

[New World Order]

It's okay guys. The true fans say give him at least 5-7 years to bloom. Then and only then we can judge accordingly.

[staylor26]

It's okay guys. The true fans say give him at least 5-7 years to bloom. Then and only then we can judge accordingly.

Waiting 5-7 years is just as fucking stupid as giving up on a guy before his rookie season even started.

[In58men]

It's okay guys. The true fans say give him at least 5-7 years to bloom. Then and only then we can judge accordingly.

ROFL


Where you at Dave?

[Deberg_1990]

I don't understand how fans think that every draft pick should be an automatic star from the start? This guy was considered raw by nearly everyone. It takes time for most lower round guys.

[RealSNR]

My take is fuck Dorsey for putting us in a position to rely on this guy as a rookie.

He may come good, he may not. But fuck Dorsey.

Barring injury, we're not going to rely on shit from this guy.

He'll be the 5th CB on the depth chart.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Everyone sucks/CP

[jd1020]

Everyone sucks/CP

Welcome to reality /PGM

[Mav]

Justin Gilbert had looked terrible as well. These rules have screwed these corners.

[OldSchool]

Justin Gilbert had looked terrible as well. These rules have screwed these corners.

Yup. Ironically, only the Seahawks still look good. I don't think that their starters got a single defensive holding, illegal contact, or PI called on them this pre-season.

[milkman]

I don't understand how fans think that every draft pick should be an automatic star from the start? This guy was considered raw by nearly everyone. It takes time for most lower round guys.

When did the third round become a lower round?

[milkman]

Yup. Ironically, only the Seahawks still look good. I don't think that their starters got a single defensive holding, illegal contact, or PI called on them this pre-season.

People just don't get it.

They aren't good because they play physical.
They are good because they solid fundamentallly, both in coverage and tackling.

[gblowfish]

Other teams will throw right at him when the need to Gaines some yards.




Heh....

[chiefzilla1501]

It's okay guys. The true fans say give him at least 5-7 years to bloom. Then and only then we can judge accordingly.

5-7 years?

Can we at least stop making judgments after a few preseason games? I think anybody who saw the pick after the draft thought Gaines would be at least a 1-year project. But for a high positional value guy, yeah, 1-2 years for a guy not drafted in the first round is fair.

[OldSchool]

People just don't get it.

They aren't good because they play physical.
They are good because they solid fundamentallly, both in coverage and tackling.

Yup, I love watching them play defense. It's the best that I've seen in a while. The only one on that team that really grabbed at WRs was Browner because of his stiff hips and slow feet, now he's gone. I really wish that we would use the same scheme that they have.

[staylor26]

I really think people are going to be eating crow on Gaines. He was my #4 CB and I loved the pick, but it was apparent he would need at least a year of NFL coaching and an offseason to get bigger/stronger to be ready to start. I tried to tell one of you about Kelce, but I was laughed at then too.

[chiefzilla1501]

He was drafted to replace Flowers to free up the money. That's why they played him so much in the preseason.

Doesn't look like he's ready

Fail on the draft?
Fail on the coaching?

Or maybe we need to just stop treating this year like our #1 goal is to win now. Cutting Flowers is a good move for the long-term. I can understand the argument that we should just rip the band-aid right off. But I also think this team can be competitive as soon as next year, if our picks pan out. Gaines won't be much worse than Cooper was last year and I think it was absolutely worth it to get Cooper some reps over there. Hopefully Gaines will show the same kind of growth, as I think Cooper will be okay this year.

[Sandy Vagina]

Gaines stood out the most in week 4 and not in a good way. Bottom line on him.. he has a few things working for him. He is tall, fast, and has a great work ethic.

In terms of technique and awareness, he is not ready to step in today, and I really hope he doesn't need to. No, this isn't an assessment you want to learn about your 3rd rd pick. However.. Gaines was selected for his potential in the near future. Very likely hand-picked to develop and then replace Sean Smith and his bloated contract for 2015.

[Mr. Laz]

Or maybe we need to just stop treating this year like our #1 goal is to win now. Cutting Flowers is a good move for the long-term. I can understand the argument that we should just rip the band-aid right off. But I also think this team can be competitive as soon as next year, if our picks pan out. Gaines won't be much worse than Cooper was last year and I think it was absolutely worth it to get Cooper some reps over there. Hopefully Gaines will show the same kind of growth, as I think Cooper will be okay this year.
I think it's safe to say that winning this year is not the priority.


we can agree on that.


You're just ok with that ... i'm not

[Saccopoo]

I really think people are going to be eating crow on Gaines. He was my #4 CB and I loved the pick, but it was apparent he would need at least a year of NFL coaching and an offseason to get bigger/stronger to be ready to start. I tried to tell one of you about Kelce, but I was laughed at then too.

I don't know man...there were a lot of solid CB prospect available when we picked Phil Gaines. Keith McGill, Dontae Johnson, Nevin Lawson, Marqueston Huff, Pierre Desir...all of whom ended up making the 53 man rosters of their respective teams. I hope you're right, but I think I would have much rather had Donte Moncrief in the third and then either Johnson or Lawson in the fourth (or David Yankey or Cyril Richardson for the sink hole OG spot that we continue to try to shovel asphalt into).

[staylor26]

I don't know man...there were a lot of solid CB prospect available when we picked Phil Gaines. Keith McGill, Dontae Johnson, Nevin Lawson, Marqueston Huff, Pierre Desir...all of whom ended up making the 53 man rosters of their respective teams. I hope you're right, but I think I would have much rather had Donte Moncrief in the third and then either Johnson or Lawson in the fourth (or David Yankey or Cyril Richardson for the sink hole OG spot that we continue to try to shovel asphalt into).

Gaines ceiling is higher than every one of those guys IMO.

[Direckshun]

Zilla, you're committing the same error here as you were with Eric Fisher.

I can speak for most fans when I say that we expect Phillip Gaines and Eric Fisher to take some time.

What's troubling is that they aren't looking like talented, raw athletes needing development (I.e. Dee Ford), they look like complete catastrophes (I.e. Turk McBride). There is a difference.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

He fucking sucks. Maybe he eventually learns to use his straight line speed, but right now he looks like a total scrub with no place on an NFL roster.

[Saccopoo]

Zilla, you're committing the same error here as you were with Eric Fisher.

I can speak for most fans when I say that we expect Phillip Gaines and Eric Fisher to take some time.

What's troubling is that they aren't looking like talented, raw athletes needing development (I.e. Dee Ford), they look like complete catastrophes (I.e. Turk McBride). There is a difference.

I'd argue that Ford has looked worse than either Fisher or Gaines at the same stage. Absolutely lost on defense.

Blind dog in a meat market to this point.

[OldSchool]

I'd argue that Ford has looked worse than either Fisher or Gaines at the same stage. Absolutely lost on defense.

Blind dog in a meat market to this point.

Ford does concern me. For all of his talk about how he tries to master technique and doesn't just rely on his physical skills, I sure didn't see it out there. Josh Martin looked just as good if not better out there.

[KCChiefsfan1234]

I really think people are going to be eating crow on Gaines. He was my #4 CB and I loved the pick, but it was apparent he would need at least a year of NFL coaching and an offseason to get bigger/stronger to be ready to start. I tried to tell one of you about Kelce, but I was laughed at then too.

I agree with you. He needs a year to develop. Mark my words, he will be a good corner in the future. Many of the first and second rounders have looked bad as well. This is new not only for the speed of the game but with the changes in the rules. Gaines played very well in the first game. Go watch the film. Yes he had a rough game against the Packers but you all really need to go look at the fact that he played more than anyone else that night and he played 2 special teams as well as both outside CBs and inside. Two of the penalties were total bull s### Give the kid a break.

[chiefzilla1501]

I think it's safe to say that winning this year is not the priority.


we can agree on that.


You're just ok with that ... i'm not
I am okay with the approach. The execution... We will see, but for a solution reliant on drafting and value pickups, Dorseys pickups better start shaping the fuck up.

We devalued the oline. Focused on high positional value guys in the draft this year. Shredded old veteran contracts. Cleaned up the cap. In theory this is a good way to do it. But so far his picks have been shit. But there's still time for the picks to shape up so we will see.

[Sandy Vagina]

Yeah, he really is like a Marcus Cooper.. just a year behind in development. Neither are remarkable yet, but both have the skills to develop into quality starters.

[Deberg_1990]

When did the third round become a lower round?

ok, a middle round then. Go look at how many 3rd rounder become stars. Id guess not many.


Point is, Chiefs fans expectations are set way too high. A team is lucky to hit on 2 or 3 guys each draft. Thats a good draft. 4 guys is exceptional. Not every player is going to be good,. and it expecting that is unrealistic.

[milkman]

ok, a middle round then. Go look at how many 3rd rounder become stars. Id guess not many.

Jamal Charles.

Will Shields.

That San Diego WR last year whose name escapes at the moment.

But we aren't talking about stars.

3rd round picks should be guys that can contribute now.

[Deberg_1990]

3rd round picks should be guys that can contribute now.

Should be? Who wrote this rule? It doesnt have to be that way.

[Deberg_1990]

even the most successful teams in the league have numerous failed draft picks.

[chiefzilla1501]

Zilla, you're committing the same error here as you were with Eric Fisher.

I can speak for most fans when I say that we expect Phillip Gaines and Eric Fisher to take some time.
At least on CP, you're wrong. There are people who have been calling these guys busts as soon as they took preseason snaps.

I hate the Fisher pick. Despised it from day 1. But I know he's limited right now by lack of experience and a hurt shoulder. Those aren't excuses. Those are legit reasons. But CP is so black and white sometimes, anything positive about a polarizing player is criticized as being an apologist. I don't think Fisher will be a great player but I know he needs time, bulk, and two shoulders. I don't know what we have in Gaines, but I sure as shit didn't expect him to be ready by game 1. Even with Sorensen... I don't think highly of him at all, but we have people calling him a disaster when he hasn't even breathed a single regular season second in the NFL. I've been really consistent about giving guys 1-2 years to really show what they have. And I refuse to dismiss someone as completely terrible if there are situational factors affecting their performance.

What's troubling is that they aren't looking like talented, raw athletes needing development (I.e. Dee Ford), they look like complete catastrophes (I.e. Turk McBride). There is a difference.
In fairness, Poe, Cooper, Dorsey, and Knile Davis looked like complete disasters early on. Even Tyson Jackson... turned into an adequate DE but he was a shit show his first season. It's even harder in the modern NFL where we have shortened offseasons for rookies. I'm really concerned about Ford. I worry about Fisher even being a starter 2 years from now. So yeah, I'm concerned about these guys, but I'm also going to give them time to work some stuff out. Now Ford? That feels a lot different. Guy came from a competitive college program -- I don't bring him up because as a first round pick who was drafted to be ready right away, he doesn't look the part. That's different.

[tecumseh]

That's great that Cooper and Gaines have the physical tools to be good CB's IN A YEAR OR TWO. Meanwhile, the Chiefs have a handful of guys that are potential probowlers. Another handful that are solid. The rest are succkage or in development. How about puting together a complete team.

[Mav]

I don't know man...there were a lot of solid CB prospect available when we picked Phil Gaines. Keith McGill, Dontae Johnson, Nevin Lawson, Marqueston Huff, Pierre Desir...all of whom ended up making the 53 man rosters of their respective teams. I hope you're right, but I think I would have much rather had Donte Moncrief in the third and then either Johnson or Lawson in the fourth (or David Yankey or Cyril Richardson for the sink hole OG spot that we continue to try to shovel asphalt into).
Pierre Desir has looked like absolute shit.

[chiefzilla1501]

That's great that Cooper and Gaines have the physical tools to be good CB's IN A YEAR OR TWO. Meanwhile, the Chiefs have a handful of guys that are potential probowlers. Another handful that are solid. The rest are succkage or in development. How about puting together a complete team.

That's the approach Scott Pioli took. He took a lot of layups. Way too many offensive linemen in the first 3 rounds. Nickel corners. 5-techniques. Safety in the top 10. These guys were ready to help out right away. They were safe picks who could contribute right away.

But safe picks only work if you're building around an elite QB. If you're building around another type of QB, you want to build your team around playmakers. I would rather have a few playmakers than a bunch of safe guys. Playmakers come with risk especially after the first round. What Dorsey did in 2013 was safe. And I hated it. The approach we took this year is the right one and I hope one we continue to make. But again, the approach only works if you execute. I'm really nervous about our draft picks the past 2 years.

[aturnis]

At least on CP, you're wrong. There are people who have been calling these guys busts as soon as they took preseason snaps.

I hate the Fisher pick. Despised it from day 1. But I know he's limited right now by lack of experience and a hurt shoulder. Those aren't excuses. Those are legit reasons. But CP is so black and white sometimes, anything positive about a polarizing player is criticized as being an apologist. I don't think Fisher will be a great player but I know he needs time, bulk, and two shoulders. I don't know what we have in Gaines, but I sure as shit didn't expect him to be ready by game 1. Even with Sorensen... I don't think highly of him at all, but we have people calling him a disaster when he hasn't even breathed a single regular season second in the NFL. I've been really consistent about giving guys 1-2 years to really show what they have. And I refuse to dismiss someone as completely terrible if there are situational factors affecting their performance.


In fairness, Poe, Cooper, Dorsey, and Knile Davis looked like complete disasters early on. Even Tyson Jackson... turned into an adequate DE but he was a shit show his first season. It's even harder in the modern NFL where we have shortened offseasons for rookies. I'm really concerned about Ford. I worry about Fisher even being a starter 2 years from now. So yeah, I'm concerned about these guys, but I'm also going to give them time to work some stuff out. Now Ford? That feels a lot different. Guy came from a competitive college program -- I don't bring him up because as a first round pick who was drafted to be ready right away, he doesn't look the part. That's different.

Ford was drafted to be ready right away? Did someone inform Hali and Houston one of them has got to go?

As for Sorensen, you're really defending the guy who provided more tape of himself chasing receivers into the endzone then doing anything else?

[Bowser]

Keenan Allen is the receiver you couldn't think of. Guy is a bad ass.

[chiefzilla1501]

Ford was drafted to be ready right away? Did someone inform Hali and Houston one of them has got to go?

As for Sorensen, you're really defending the guy who provided more tape of himself chasing receivers into the endzone then doing anything else?

As a first round pick from a major college program, he should be a lot more NFL ready. I get the concern there, but I'm not even close to ready to saying we know anything at all about him yet.

Sorensen... I'm not even defending the guy. We have people calling him completely terrible when he's a rookie who hasn't even seen (let alone played) a single snap of regular season football. And people flipping out about picking him over a guy who hasn't even been picked up by any other team.

[OldSchool]

Keenan Allen is the receiver you couldn't think of. Guy is a bad ass.

Yup, he was even better in the NFL than he was at Cal. I guess our crapfest QBs really were holding him back, lol.

[Dave Lane]

I really think people are going to be eating crow on Gaines. He was my #4 CB and I loved the pick, but it was apparent he would need at least a year of NFL coaching and an offseason to get bigger/stronger to be ready to start. I tried to tell one of you about Kelce, but I was laughed at then too.

Can I subscribe to your newsletter?

[OldSchool]

As a first round pick from a major college program, he should be a lot more NFL ready. I get the concern there, but I'm not even close to ready to saying we know anything at all about him yet.

Sorensen... I'm not even defending the guy. We have people calling him completely terrible when he's a rookie who hasn't even seen (let alone played) a single snap of regular season football. And people flipping out about picking him over a guy who hasn't even been picked up by any other team.

My problem with Ford is that he isn't very young for a rookie, he's already 23 years old and still looks really raw. He also wasn't very productive until his 5th year, and even then he wasn't an "out of this world" talent on the field. He looked phenomenal at the Senior Bowl because it was very easy to anticipate the snap count, so he always got a jump on his opponent.

[baitism]

Should have drafted EJ Gaines. Who drafts a scrub from Rice?

[aturnis]

As a first round pick from a major college program, he should be a lot more NFL ready. I get the concern there, but I'm not even close to ready to saying we know anything at all about him yet.

Sorensen... I'm not even defending the guy. We have people calling him completely terrible when he's a rookie who hasn't even seen (let alone played) a single snap of regular season football. And people flipping out about picking him over a guy who hasn't even been picked up by any other team.

Just saying, I think it was obvious to everyone we took Ford in the 1st based on his potential b/c we had the ability to allow him to develop.

As for Sorensen, what about getting BURNED by 2nd, 3rd stringers, and guys selling insurance starting tomorrow inspires you to his future against real NFL talent? As for bashing on Bronson, have any of the Chiefs cuts been picked up?

[chiefzilla1501]

Just saying, I think it was obvious to everyone we took Ford in the 1st based on his potential b/c we had the ability to allow him to develop.
Yes, every rookie deserves time. First rounders have less of a luxury, but they deserve time nonetheless.

As for Sorensen, what about getting BURNED by 2nd, 3rd stringers, and guys selling insurance starting tomorrow inspires you to his future against real NFL talent? As for bashing on Bronson, have any of the Chiefs cuts been picked up?
I have not even said Sorensen is that good. I have not bashed Bronson one bit. I am responding to the people outraged that the Chiefs passed on Bronson, a guy who easily cleared waivers. I certainly hope that a few meaningless preseason games aren't the only way we judge a rookie like Sorensen. I don't have high hopes for him. But he at least deserves a chance to at least learn and grow before we suggest he's already reached his ceiling.

[mikey23545]

Just saying, I think it was obvious to everyone we took Ford in the 1st based on his potential b/c we had the ability to allow him to develop.

As for Sorensen, what about getting BURNED by 2nd, 3rd stringers, and guys selling insurance starting tomorrow inspires you to his future against real NFL talent? As for bashing on Bronson, have any of the Chiefs cuts been picked up?

Oh, for fucks sake.

Sorenson and Bronson are both UDFAs...how far along were they supposed to be at this point?

[OldSchool]

Oh, for ****s sake.

Sorenson and Bronson are both UDFAs...how far along were they supposed to be at this point?

People are pissed about Sorensen because, while Bronson actually made plays, Sorensen looked like a complete waste of space out there.

[htismaqe]

People are pissed about Sorensen because, while Bronson actually made plays, Sorensen looked like a complete waste of space out there.

Sorenson actually has a pedigree that is worth investing in.

Bronson is a training camp hero. This fan base LOVES those...

[Chiefnj2]

That computer program that Dorsey uses over-values combine results and underwear olympics. Here was Gaines' breakdown from nfl.com

Analysis
StrengthsNice length. Terrific timed speed, blazing sub-4.4 times at the combine. Can be deployed in zone coverage. Plays the pocket. Good production on the ball, with 35 passes defended the last two seasons. Tough and competitive. Is hardworking and well respected by coaches and teammates. Recorded second-quickest three-cone drill among cornerbacks at the combine (6.62 seconds).

WeaknessesDurability is a concern. Has been dinged up. Underdeveloped and underpowered. Does not play to timed speed. Not equipped to handle man-to-man responsibility. Poor run supporter and tackler. Does not project as a core special-teams player. Tweener traits.


Draft ProjectionRounds 4-5
Bottom LineLean, active zone corner whose ball skills will have to carry him. Could earn a roster spot on pure measurables but lacks desirable functional speed, strength and physicality.

[Rausch]

I don't understand how fans think that every draft pick should be an automatic star from the start? This guy was considered raw by nearly everyone. It takes time for most lower round guys.

Early in Darqueze Dennard's first training camp, NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport noted that the Cincinnati Bengals' first-round cornerback has shown better than advertised ball skills.

Coach Marvin Lewis raised the stakes on Thursday, crediting the former Michigan State star as "the best rookie corner I've seen," per Dan Hoard, the radio voice of the Bengals.

That's high praise considering two of Lewis' teams drafted first-round cornerbacks in back-to-back years.

As Ravens defensive coordinator, Lewis coached Duane Starks (No. 10 overall, 1998) and Chris McAlister (No. 10 overall, 1999). As Bengals head coach, he tutored a pair of decorated corners in Johnathan Joseph (No. 24, 2006) and Leon Hall (No. 18, 2007).

"If he stays on this path," veteran cornerback Terence Newman said of Dennard, via ESPN.com, "the sky's the limit for him."

The Bengals don't plan to start Dennard "right off the bat," according to Hoard, but he will see plenty of snaps in nickel and dime packages.

That's right, that's the corner we passed on to take a b/u one dimensional pass rusher. He was gone the very next pick...

[ILChief]

My take is fuck Dorsey for putting us in a position to rely on this guy as a rookie.

He may come good, he may not. But fuck Dorsey.

I don't know how much we are relying on him as a 5th CB

[Chiefnj2]

Gaines will be the 4th or 5th CB (barring injury). Not a big deal, however, you'd expect he would have had better coverage on 3rd stringers in the preseason. He was losing battles to guys who are out of the NFL today.

[chiefzilla1501]

That computer program that Dorsey uses over-values combine results and underwear olympics. Here was Gaines' breakdown from nfl.com

Analysis
StrengthsNice length. Terrific timed speed, blazing sub-4.4 times at the combine. Can be deployed in zone coverage. Plays the pocket. Good production on the ball, with 35 passes defended the last two seasons. Tough and competitive. Is hardworking and well respected by coaches and teammates. Recorded second-quickest three-cone drill among cornerbacks at the combine (6.62 seconds).

WeaknessesDurability is a concern. Has been dinged up. Underdeveloped and underpowered. Does not play to timed speed. Not equipped to handle man-to-man responsibility. Poor run supporter and tackler. Does not project as a core special-teams player. Tweener traits.


Draft ProjectionRounds 4-5
Bottom LineLean, active zone corner whose ball skills will have to carry him. Could earn a roster spot on pure measurables but lacks desirable functional speed, strength and physicality.

In the third round, your option is to go for underwear champs or to go for either good players at less important positions or safe picks who are average but have no ceiling. I'm glad we're finally taking gambles. This was a good pick. I don't care if he pans out or not.

[Easy 6]

Sorenson actually has a pedigree that is worth investing in.

Bronson is a training camp hero. This fan base LOVES those...

You just dont get it, MAN... the dude is white, he cant POSSIBLY be any good.

[Mav]

That's right, that's the corner we passed on to take a b/u one dimensional pass rusher. He was gone the very next pick...
That's who I wanted.

[MahiMike]

He's a kid. Give him some time.

[Saccopoo]

In the third round, your option is to go for underwear champs or to go for either good players at less important positions or safe picks who are average but have no ceiling. I'm glad we're finally taking gambles. This was a good pick. I don't care if he pans out or not.

There was a lot of guys still on the board that could have been had with our fourth round pick that I personally felt were better than Gaines.

Dontae Johnson, Nevin Lawson, Pierre Desir.

I think it was a reach. Not a huge one, but there were a lot of guys who people had rated higher still on the board.

Revisionist history, but how the draft and our free agency ended up, I would have had the following as my draft picks:

1. Darqueze Dennard, CB; Michigan State
3. Donte Moncrief, WR; Ole Miss
4. Cyril Richardson, OL; Baylor
5. Ryan Carrethers, DT; Arkansas State
6. Jeff Janis, WR; Saginaw State
6. Trevor Reilly, LB; Utah

And Albert Wilson and Dan Sorensen would have been my priority UDFA's. So at least Dorsey and I agreed on that.

I never expected Dennard to be on the board when we picked as I felt he was actually the best shut down corner in the draft.

[Sandy Vagina]

There was a lot of guys still on the board that could have been had with our fourth round pick that I personally felt were better than Gaines.

Dontae Johnson, Nevin Lawson, Pierre Desir.

I think it was a reach. Not a huge one, but there were a lot of guys who people had rated higher still on the board.

Revisionist history, but how the draft and our free agency ended up, I would have had the following as my draft picks:

1. Darqueze Dennard, CB; Michigan State
3. Donte Moncrief, WR; Ole Miss
4. Cyril Richardson, OL; Baylor
5. Ryan Carrethers, DT; Arkansas State
6. Jeff Janis, WR; Saginaw State
6. Trevor Reilly, LB; Utah

And Albert Wilson and Dan Sorensen would have been my priority UDFA's. So at least Dorsey and I agreed on that.

I never expected Dennard to be on the board when we picked as I felt he was actually the best shut down corner in the draft.

I'd have really liked your draft... but I don't think those 3 above were as good as Gaines... and I'd be more worried about the pass rush if Hali and/or Houston got injured again.

[Direckshun]

The way the board fell, I would have taken Bridgewater at 23.

I would have thought reeeeeally hard about Ra'Shede Hageman.

In the third, I probably would have gone WR Donte Moncrief or WR Bruce Ellington. Maaaaaaaaybe a corner. But probably WR.

In the 4th, I would probably have taken OG Dakota Dozier or CB Pierre Desir.

In the 5th, I would have taken CB/S Antone Exum or WR Jared Abbrederis.

In the 6th, I would have taken DT Daniel McCullers and RB Marion Grice.

You tell me:

1. QB Teddy Bridgewater
3. WR Donte Moncrief
4. OG Dakota Dozier
5. CB/S Antone Exum
6. NT Daniel McCullers
6. RB Marion Grice

[RunKC]

There was a lot of guys still on the board that could have been had with our fourth round pick that I personally felt were better than Gaines.

Dontae Johnson, Nevin Lawson, Pierre Desir.

I think it was a reach. Not a huge one, but there were a lot of guys who people had rated higher still on the board.

Revisionist history, but how the draft and our free agency ended up, I would have had the following as my draft picks:

1. Darqueze Dennard, CB; Michigan State
3. Donte Moncrief, WR; Ole Miss
4. Cyril Richardson, OL; Baylor
5. Ryan Carrethers, DT; Arkansas State
6. Jeff Janis, WR; Saginaw State
6. Trevor Reilly, LB; Utah

And Albert Wilson and Dan Sorensen would have been my priority UDFA's. So at least Dorsey and I agreed on that.

I never expected Dennard to be on the board when we picked as I felt he was actually the best shut down corner in the draft.

Not a chance. In this new league I'm not taking slow CB's like Dennard and Desir. Gaines was among the fastest/quickest players at the draft.
He's got the long frame to help get his hands in the path of the ball and the athletic ability to stay with the fastest receivers.

Gaines struggled against the Packers bc of his size. He needs to add at least 10 lbs of strength next offseason. He's learning the position well, but needs that strength at the LOS.

[RunKC]

The way the board fell, I would have taken Bridgewater at 23.

I would have thought reeeeeally hard about Ra'Shede Hageman.

In the third, I probably would have gone WR Donte Moncrief or WR Bruce Ellington. Maaaaaaaaybe a corner. But probably WR.

In the 4th, I would probably have taken OG Dakota Dozier or CB Pierre Desir.

In the 5th, I would have taken CB/S Antone Exum or WR Jared Abbrederis.

In the 6th, I would have taken DT Daniel McCullers and RB Marion Grice.

You tell me:

1. QB Teddy Bridgewater
3. WR Donte Moncrief
4. OG Dakota Dozier
5. CB/S Antone Exum
6. NT Daniel McCullers
6. RB Marion Grice

I was thinking Avant and Cason in free agency then..

1. S Jimmie Ward
3. G Chris Watt
4. KR DAT
5. Trade our 6th to move up and get Aaron Lynch
6. LDT ( I like his potential)

[The Franchise]

There was a lot of guys still on the board that could have been had with our fourth round pick that I personally felt were better than Gaines.

Dontae Johnson, Nevin Lawson, Pierre Desir.

I think it was a reach. Not a huge one, but there were a lot of guys who people had rated higher still on the board.

Revisionist history, but how the draft and our free agency ended up, I would have had the following as my draft picks:

1. Darqueze Dennard, CB; Michigan State
3. Donte Moncrief, WR; Ole Miss
4. Cyril Richardson, OL; Baylor
5. Ryan Carrethers, DT; Arkansas State
6. Jeff Janis, WR; Saginaw State
6. Trevor Reilly, LB; Utah

And Albert Wilson and Dan Sorensen would have been my priority UDFA's. So at least Dorsey and I agreed on that.

I never expected Dennard to be on the board when we picked as I felt he was actually the best shut down corner in the draft.

I'll play.

1. Jimmie Ward, FS, Northern Illinois
3. Donte Moncrief, WR, Ole Miss
4. Dakota Dozier, OG/OT, Furman
5. Zach Mettenberger, QB, LSU
6. Jeff Janis, WR, Saginaw State
6. Dan McCullers, NT, Tennessee

[RunKC]

Seriously how much better would this secondary be right now with Cason and Ward in it? My God.

And Cason was very affordable for us.

[Sandy Vagina]

Some very nice drafts above, gents... Ward was definitely one of my favorite picks for KC....

[Direckshun]

You guys taking Dennard or Ward over Bridgewater are high on shrooms.

[The Franchise]

You guys taking Dennard or Ward over Bridgewater are high on shrooms.

To sit around for another 4 years behind Smith?

[Chiefnj2]

Andy is sticking with Smith. Drafting a QB in the first does nothing to help this team in the next three years. Heck, even if Alex gets hurt, no rookie is going to develop with this OL and limited receiving group.

[RunKC]

Direkshun have you been watching Hardknocks? I have and I'm glad we didn't take Hageman. He just doesn't seem like a first rd pick to me. He doesn't appear to be very tough either in his personality. More of a class clown type.

[Direckshun]

Direkshun have you been watching Hardknocks? I have and I'm glad we didn't take Hageman. He just doesn't seem like a first rd pick to me. He doesn't appear to be very tough either in his personality. More of a class clown type.

I made my selections in my post a few posts back ignoring hindsight.

I was hiiiiiiiiiiiiiiigh as a motherfucker on Hageman going into the Draft.

[Direckshun]

To sit around for another 4 years behind Smith?

Andy is sticking with Smith. Drafting a QB in the first does nothing to help this team in the next three years. Heck, even if Alex gets hurt, no rookie is going to develop with this OL and limited receiving group.

And yet, Andy Reid was almost certainly going to draft Johnny Football if he had lasted another pick.

[The Franchise]

And yet, Andy Reid was almost certainly going to draft Johnny Football if he had lasted another pick.

Yeah....before Smith got his contract. If Smith didn't have his contract right now....I'd take Bridgewater in the 1st.

[Direckshun]

Yeah....before Smith got his contract. If Smith didn't have his contract right now....I'd take Bridgewater in the 1st.

Oh, you're time traveling. My bad.

[Chiefnj2]

And yet, Andy Reid was almost certainly going to draft Johnny Football if he had lasted another pick.

Really? He was going to take the most undisciplined, free-wheeling QB in the draft, when he is in love with the ultra conservative, don't even think about making a mistake QB - Alex Smith.

I must have missed the Reid presser when he said "Damnabit, Cleveland took our player and we had to settle fo Ford."

[ThaVirus]

Sorenson actually has a pedigree that is worth investing in.



Bronson is a training camp hero. This fan base LOVES those...


Pedigree? They're both undrafted scrubs.

One showed the ability to play in game situations. The other looked like absolute dog shit... We kept the latter.

[aturnis]

Sorenson actually has a pedigree that is worth investing in.

Bronson is a training camp hero. This fan base LOVES those...

What the fuck are you talking about? Bronson is a training camp hero? Did he do a damned thing in training camp?

[PHOG]

Gaines sucks right now..patience

[Rausch]

You guys taking Dennard or Ward over Bridgewater are high on shrooms.

Dennard could help the D.

Bridgewater would do nothing for us this year without targets or an O line...

[chiefzilla1501]

Pedigree? They're both undrafted scrubs.

One showed the ability to play in game situations. The other looked like absolute dog shit... We kept the latter.

One has been here for a year
The other has been here for a very short few months

That's the HUGE difference to me.

[ThaVirus]

One has been here for a year

The other has been here for a very short few months



That's the HUGE difference to me.


One blew dicks and the other actually seemed decent.

That's the huge difference to me.

[OldSchool]

One blew dicks and the other actually seemed decent.

That's the huge difference to me.

Yup, one looked like he could play while the other looked like he could be a kicker, at best.

[chiefzilla1501]

One blew dicks and the other actually seemed decent.

That's the huge difference to me.

It's preseason games. I would hope that what's more important is your college scouting report, college game film, what you see on the practice field, and what you see potential-wise. If Bronson was a surefire gamer, that's fine. But nobody is picking him up off waivers even though he's young, cheap, and apparently flashed potential. This is just an example of people taking way too much stock in limited preseason snaps to evaluate young talent.

In the end, it's a JAG over a JAG. It's not even like we're talking about the regular season. We're talking about the preseason. I don't think Sorensen will amount to much but let's at least wait until the regular season to see what we have.

[ThaVirus]

I usually agree that preseason doesn't mean much... But in this case, whoever won that battle would likely see a significant amount of snaps this season.

They both played a significant amount of time with the starters, against other starters. Bronson appeared to be able to hold his own while Sorenson was involved in, and even directly responsible for, the two biggest plays our first team units allowed this preseason. It wasn't just those two plays either, he looked like burnt dog shit in coverage and against the run.

[milkman]

One has been here for a year
The other has been here for a very short few months

That's the HUGE difference to me.

So, let me see if I understand.

Malcolm Bronson is a FS with the ability to cover in nickel, but it was the right decision to release him and hang on to Sorensen, who is a strong safety with some potential, though no one here has actually any evidence of that potential.

On the other hand, we just signed a vet to play the role that Bronson would have played in this defense, and he Bronson actually displayed potential, and the vet has a history of suck.

Just love the consistency.

[OldSchool]

It's preseason games. I would hope that what's more important is your college scouting report, college game film, what you see on the practice field, and what you see potential-wise. If Bronson was a surefire gamer, that's fine. But nobody is picking him up off waivers even though he's young, cheap, and apparently flashed potential. This is just an example of people taking way too much stock in limited preseason snaps to evaluate young talent.

In the end, it's a JAG over a JAG. It's not even like we're talking about the regular season. We're talking about the preseason. I don't think Sorensen will amount to much but let's at least wait until the regular season to see what we have.

Since you're so hung up on college scouting reports, here is one on Bronson.



Meet His New Running Mate, Malcolm Bronson
Similar to the Honey Badger in many aspects, Malcolm Bronson exhibits the same type of violent, emotional, and physical style of play, while having a knack for coming up with big-time plays in crucial moments. An aggressive player that will take some chances in the secondary, Bronson similarly struggles in sustaining coverage downfield when the play breaks down. And much like Mathieu, he is best when facing the action. So how much of a prospect is Malcolm Bronson really?

First off, Malcolm Bronson possesses much better size measurables than his new McNeese State teammate, Tyrann Mathieu, as he holds a rock solid, 5’11 200 pound frame. Quicker than fast with a 4.5 estimated 40 time, Bronson shows out with his short area acceleration, explosive hitting power, and plus ball skills. Exceptional in run support, Bronson showcases the click and close athleticism to be a dynamic, alley defender. Flying downhill full speed, Bronson more importantly does an excellent job of breaking down on the ball carrier and wrapping up to secure the tackle.

A violent headhunter in the back half, Bronson led the team in total tackles, pass break ups, and forced fumbles, delivering vicious hits to separate the receiver from the football. Sitting into his pedal and type-writing his steps back into coverage, Bronson also displays the range to cover the deep middle third and deep outer half of the field; reading the eye level of the quarterback and reacting quickly to the ball in air, Bronson constantly gets his hands on the football, as evidenced by his two-year totals of 7 interceptions and 15 pass deflections.

He actually showed many of these traits during the pre-season games, which means that, unlike Sorensen, Bronson's game actually translates to the NFL and not just college; which is why him being cut in favor of Sorensen is very puzzling to me and many other people.

[ThaVirus]

Sorenson is the equivalent of a bag of smashed assholes. No one wants him.

[chiefzilla1501]

So, let me see if I understand.

Malcolm Bronson is a FS with the ability to cover in nickel, but it was the right decision to release him and hang on to Sorensen, who is a strong safety with some potential, though no one here has actually any evidence of that potential.
If the guy had potential then why is nobody else taking a crack at him?

I don't know who is better than the other. I think it's silly to compare apples to apples one guy who has had a full year to learn the defense and another guy who has been with the team for 2 months. And to suggest that preseason reps are the only thing important for showing potential. Maybe the team liked what they saw on college film, they liked what he showed in the film room, they liked what they saw in the countless hours of practice that we didn't see. When we're talking about rookies, those are hella more important than preseason snaps. Knile Davis was a complete disaster last year's preseason. Countless others were too.

On the other hand, we just signed a vet to play the role that Bronson would have played in this defense, and he Bronson actually displayed potential, and the vet has a history of suck.

Just love the consistency.
Different reasons. Just a few days ago, we complained that we don't have enough safeties who are NFL ready. Coleman is more NFL ready than both Sorensen and Bronson. We need a guy who can plug in and play right away. Despite how Bronson looked against scrubs, I would be surprised if he's going to play any better than a veteran like Coleman. Again, if we're talking about cutting a guy everyone is hyped about, great. The only people who seem to care are Chiefs' fans, most of whom probably never heard of or cared about the guy until he played in meaningless exhibition games.

[OldSchool]

Maybe they caught Bronson banging Clark Hunt's wife?

[milkman]

If the guy had potential then why is nobody else taking a crack at him?

I don't know who is better than the other. I think it's silly to compare apples to apples one guy who has had a full year to learn the defense and another guy who has been with the team for 2 months. And to suggest that preseason reps are the only thing important for showing potential. Maybe the team liked what they saw on college film, they liked what he showed in the film room, they liked what they saw in the countless hours of practice that we didn't see. When we're talking about rookies, those are hella more important than preseason snaps. Knile Davis was a complete disaster last year's preseason. Countless others were too.


Different reasons. Just a few days ago, we complained that we don't have enough safeties who are NFL ready. Coleman is more NFL ready than both Sorensen and Bronson. We need a guy who can plug in and play right away. Despite how Bronson looked against scrubs, I would be surprised if he's going to play any better than a veteran like Coleman. Again, if we're talking about cutting a guy everyone is hyped about, great. The only people who seem to care are Chiefs' fans, most of whom probably never heard of or cared about the guy until he played in meaningless exhibition games.

Jerrod McMillan is more NFL ready than Daniel Sorensen.

You can't sell shit both ways.

[chiefzilla1501]

Jerrod McMillan is more NFL ready than Daniel Sorensen.

You can't sell shit both ways.

Jerrod McMillan isn't ready to be in the starting lineup if the situation calls for it. Not ready to play the Demps role. Sorensen isn't. Bronson isn't. Coleman may not be good but he can do that right away and he costs nothing.

It's not like Coleman was picked over Bronson. Coleman was brought in as a guy they can plug in right away. Sorensen was competing with Bronson for the guy they thought they could develop. Maybe they could have kept two but you're talking about two guys at Safety who probably would never see the field this year.

[milkman]

Jerrod McMillan isn't ready to be in the starting lineup if the situation calls for it. Not ready to play the Demps role. Sorensen isn't. Bronson isn't. Coleman may not be good but he can do that right away and he costs nothing.

It's not like Coleman was picked over Bronson. Coleman was brought in as a guy they can plug in right away. Sorensen was competing with Bronson for the guy they thought they could develop. Maybe they could have kept two but you're talking about two guys at Safety who probably would never see the field this year.

You are one two sides of an ass talking motherfucker.

You have an answer for everything, and every fucking answer is wrong.

McMillan was competing for the same postion that Sorenson was, and he isn't good at it, but he's a damn sight better than Sorensen is right now, and he's a shit ton better than Coleman is at his job.

You just love the rainbows and lollipops the Chiefs just shove up your asshole.

[aturnis]

It's preseason games. I would hope that what's more important is your college scouting report, college game film, what you see on the practice field, and what you see potential-wise. If Bronson was a surefire gamer, that's fine. But nobody is picking him up off waivers even though he's young, cheap, and apparently flashed potential. This is just an example of people taking way too much stock in limited preseason snaps to evaluate young talent.

In the end, it's a JAG over a JAG. It's not even like we're talking about the regular season. We're talking about the preseason. I don't think Sorensen will amount to much but let's at least wait until the regular season to see what we have.

This is the dumbest argument and you keep making it.

NONE of our cuts have been picked up by other teams. Just b/c they aren't good enough for any other team doesn't mean they weren't good enough to make this shit show. There are players on or 53 who would be unemployed this year if it weren't for us. Sorensen was HORRENDOUS.

[Dave Lane]

You are one two sides of an ass talking mother****er.

You have an answer for everything, and every ****ing answer is wrong.

McMillan was competing for the same postion that Sorenson was, and he isn't good at it, but he's a damn sight better than Sorensen is right now, and he's a shit ton better than Coleman is at his job.

You just love the rainbows and lollipops the Chiefs just shove up your asshole.

Will lollipops fit up a total true fans asshole though? That's the real question here.

[RealSNR]

Sorenson is the equivalent of a bag of smashed assholes. No one wants him.

It's the internet. There's bound to be people who would want bags of smashed assholes.

[chiefzilla1501]

You are one two sides of an ass talking mother****er.

You have an answer for everything, and every ****ing answer is wrong.

McMillan was competing for the same postion that Sorenson was, and he isn't good at it, but he's a damn sight better than Sorensen is right now, and he's a shit ton better than Coleman is at his job.

You just love the rainbows and lollipops the Chiefs just shove up your asshole.

Holy fucking shit. I have never seen a bunch of people so riled up over signing and keeping guys who cost NOTHING. Who were picked over guys who aren't getting picked up and are probably terrible. Sorensen, Coleman, McCray, Bronson, McMillan... all these guys are scrubs.

Yet it's being hung up as the poster child of terrible moves made by the Chiefs.

It just shows that people want to bitch for the sake of bitching. Malcolm Bronson isn't signing anywhere. He easily cleared waivers. It's not like we're missing out on some magical player and 99% sure if he's any better than Sorensen or Coleman or McCray, it's because he sucks less but he still sucks. And it's just as funny hearing so many people riled up about Coleman when the majority of us have not paid attention to him for a single snap.

I am not farting sunshine. I have said repeatedly I don't think much of Sorensen. I don't see Coleman sticking around long. I'm just laughing at the pettiness that this board is so pissed off about keeping a guy who probably is going to suck instead of keeping a guy who is probably going to suck.

[chiefzilla1501]

This is the dumbest argument and you keep making it.

NONE of our cuts have been picked up by other teams. Just b/c they aren't good enough for any other team doesn't mean they weren't good enough to make this shit show. There are players on or 53 who would be unemployed this year if it weren't for us. Sorensen was HORRENDOUS.

Which would be fine, except that people are talking about keeping Bronson because of "potential."

[OldSchool]

Which would be fine, except that people are talking about keeping Bronson because of "potential."

No, we want to keep Bronson over Sorensen because Bronson actually made some plays and showed that his instincts and aggressiveness translated from his college game to the NFL.

Sorensen, on the other hand, only showed that he was very easy to pick on in coverage and also a complete non-factor against the run. He looked like he didn't belong on any NFL roster. He looked like a random guy who was picked up off of the streets who could run reasonably fast, played a lot of Madden, and was asked to sub in for a few games. That's not a good thing.

[milkman]

Holy ****ing shit. I have never seen a bunch of people so riled up over signing and keeping guys who cost NOTHING. Who were picked over guys who aren't getting picked up and are probably terrible. Sorensen, Coleman, McCray, Bronson, McMillan... all these guys are scrubs.

Yet it's being hung up as the poster child of terrible moves made by the Chiefs.

It just shows that people want to bitch for the sake of bitching. Malcolm Bronson isn't signing anywhere. He easily cleared waivers. It's not like we're missing out on some magical player and 99% sure if he's any better than Sorensen or Coleman or McCray, it's because he sucks less but he still sucks. And it's just as funny hearing so many people riled up about Coleman when the majority of us have not paid attention to him for a single snap.

I am not farting sunshine. I have said repeatedly I don't think much of Sorensen. I don't see Coleman sticking around long. I'm just laughing at the pettiness that this board is so pissed off about keeping a guy who probably is going to suck instead of keeping a guy who is probably going to suck.

It's not about Bronson v. Sorenson, McMillan v. Coleman.

It's about this brilliant fucking plan you think they are implementing v. an actual good plan.

You think they are making some smart decisions.

We think both they, and you, are completely fucked up dipshits.

This plan you think they have working will have them competing in 5 years, except it won't, because by that time they'll need a QB, and replacements for the players they think they're building around.

[ThaVirus]

I'm not bitching just to bitch. I'm actually a Titans loss away from tuning the whole season out.

I just really, really don't like Sorenson. He sucks.

[keg in kc]

Knew he was a project when we took him. And think that's fine for the range he was drafted. Still disappointed but not at all surprised by his performance so far, and expect a lot in the future. The draft is not for instant gratification, as much as we want it to be. Building for now and later both, and sometimes it's okay for now to take a back seat.

[chiefzilla1501]

It's not about Bronson v. Sorenson, McMillan v. Coleman.

It's about this brilliant fucking plan you think they are implementing v. an actual good plan.

You think they are making some smart decisions.

We think both they, and you, are completely fucked up dipshits.

This plan you think they have working will have them competing in 5 years, except it won't, because by that time they'll need a QB, and replacements for the players they think they're building around.
I have never said the plan was brilliant. I said they are taking the approach but Dorsey has a ton to prove with his draft picks and I'm skeptical about how they will turn out. But it starts by not placing such a ridiculous expectation on an undrafted rookie that we decide his ceiling in his first fucking preseason. As I said, I don't think Sorenson will amount to anything. I don't think Bronson will either.

I have said many times I think Dorsey whiffed on 2013 including the draft and that he needs to be nails with this year's and next year's draft picks to work out. I'm worried they won't. As I've said a million times, this year's approach was the right one. The execution is another thing. But if we are revolving around the draft, let's start first with cutting out this ridiculous ideas that all rookies have to be quality starters by game 1.

[Frosty]

Ok - ignorant fan question here:

Which safety positions did/do Sorenson and Bronson play? What about Coleman and McCray?

Thx

[RealSNR]

Ok - ignorant fan question here:

Which safety positions did/do Sorenson and Bronson play? What about Coleman and McCray?

Thx

I assume Sorensen will be a SS, but he's bad at everything. He can play either position because he doesn't have a strength.

Bronson was FS. I wanted him around because I saw the same ballhawking ability that Quinton Demps had last year as a 3rd safety on the field, and he wasn't as big of a pussy when he had to make a tackle.

McCray is a FS, so I'm going to assume Coleman is a SS. I know nothing about him, though.

[Frosty]

I assume Sorensen will be a SS, but he's bad at everything. He can play either position because he doesn't have a strength.

Bronson was FS. I wanted him around because I saw the same ballhawking ability that Quinton Demps had last year as a 3rd safety on the field, and he wasn't as big of a pussy when he had to make a tackle.

McCray is a FS, so I'm going to assume Coleman is a SS. I know nothing about him, though.

So it's possible that Bronson was let go in favor of McCray, not Sorenson?

[milkman]

So it's possible that Bronson was let go in favor of McCray, not Sorenson?

It's not that Bronson was let go in favor of Sorensen.

It's that, if you believe the bullshit being spouted by Chiefzilla, that their decisions are inconsistent.

Sorensen was kept in favor of Jerrod McMillan.
Bronson was let go and replaced by Coleman, essentially.

McMillen sucks.
Coleman sucks even harder.

But chiefzilla is talking out both sides of his ass, because that's apparently what you do with rainbows and lolipops up there.

[Frosty]

It's not that Bronson was let go in favor of Sorensen.

It's that, if you believe the bullshit being spouted by Chiefzilla, that their decisions are inconsistent.

Sorensen was kept in favor of Jerrod McMillan.
Bronson was let go and replaced by Coleman, essentially.

McMillen sucks.
Coleman sucks even harder.

But chiefzilla is talking out both sides of his ass, because that's apparently what you do with rainbows and lolipops up there.

I pretty much skipped over all that stuff between you and 'Zilla, but - ok.

[Rausch]

I assume Sorensen will be a SS, but he's bad at everything. He can play either position because he doesn't have a strength.


LMAO

[Easy 6]

As far as "Chris" Gaines, I'm not at all worried yet... everyone knew he was a raw measurables/skills guy going into this and CB's usually take a few years to develop, CB is truly a skill position and it takes a bit to acquire those skills for most.

[chiefzilla1501]

It's not that Bronson was let go in favor of Sorensen.

It's that, if you believe the bullshit being spouted by Chiefzilla, that their decisions are inconsistent.

Sorensen was kept in favor of Jerrod McMillan.
Bronson was let go and replaced by Coleman, essentially.

McMillen sucks.
Coleman sucks even harder.

But chiefzilla is talking out both sides of his ass, because that's apparently what you do with rainbows and lolipops up there.
That's really interesting that you call me out when this entire board is bitching about picking Sorenson over Bronson.

And I don't know what's so hard about this... Right now, Sorenson is a backup. Coleman is going to play a demps role which means he is going to see the field quite a bit. The Chiefs clearly wanted a guy that could immediately take snaps right away, which is Coleman, and they wanted a developmental guy who would probably see the field and that's Bronson vs. Sorenson. They went with Sorenson. He will probably rarely see the field unless someone gets hurt.

[milkman]

That's really interesting that you call me out when this entire board is bitching about picking Sorenson over Bronson.

And I don't know what's so hard about this... Right now, Sorenson is a backup. Coleman is going to play a demps role which means he is going to see the field quite a bit. The Chiefs clearly wanted a guy that could immediately take snaps right away, which is Coleman, and they wanted a developmental guy who would probably see the field and that's Bronson vs. Sorenson. They went with Sorenson. He will probably rarely see the field unless someone gets hurt.

Sorensen won't see the field unless Berry gets hurt, right?

No chance that happens.

I mean, it's not like Berry missed most of the preseason because he was hurt.

You're full of shit.
Don't try to sell it here, Rufus.

[chiefzilla1501]

I assume Sorensen will be a SS, but he's bad at everything. He can play either position because he doesn't have a strength.

Bronson was FS. I wanted him around because I saw the same ballhawking ability that Quinton Demps had last year as a 3rd safety on the field, and he wasn't as big of a pussy when he had to make a tackle.

McCray is a FS, so I'm going to assume Coleman is a SS. I know nothing about him, though.
Sorenson didn't have problems tackling in college. The strength listed for him was that he's an excellent student of the game. You do realize that strong safety in a Ryan defense is extremely complicated, right? Arguably the most challenging mental position on the defense.

As you said, he's not a physical freak so he has to make up for it by football smarts. There is no way you can expect him to do that in 2 months. He looked lost and tentative more than anything. Again, I don't think much of him but I certainly don't think he's nearly as bad as he looked in the preseason and think he needs a lot more time to figure his shit out. In the end, Sorenson and Bronson will probably both be garbage, as will McCray and Coleman, so the amount of outrage over which player is less garbagey is kind of amusing.

[Ebolapox]

Maybe they caught Bronson banging Clark Hunt's wife?

no, clark is into that

(/SNR)

[ModSocks]

Not sure why everyone is so hung up on Bronson. He made a few nice plays but he also blew some coverages. We have no idea why he was cut, maybe he couldn't fully grasp his assignments.

Hell, Michael Sam had 3 sacks this preseason and that didn't stop him from being cut.

Speaking of which, have the Chiefs announced their PS yet?

[milkman]

And ftr Rufus, the argument between you and I has never been about Sorensen v. Bronson.

It's been about the inconsistency these decisions demonstrate.

I don't give a rat's ass what anyone else is arguing.

[chiefzilla1501]

Sorensen won't see the field unless Berry gets hurt, right?

No chance that happens.

I mean, it's not like Berry missed most of the preseason because he was hurt.

You're full of shit.
Don't try to sell it here, Rufus.

You can swing Abdullah to Strong Safety and put Coleman or McCray at FS. Whoever doesn't play FS will play the Demps role. Basically, if the Chiefs ever find themselves in the spot where they have to rely on Sorenson, they're fucked anyway. Sorenson is the definition of last resort.

[chiefzilla1501]

And ftr Rufus, the argument between you and I has never been about Sorensen v. Bronson.

It's been about the inconsistency these decisions demonstrate.

I don't give a rat's ass what anyone else is arguing.

There is nothing inconsistent about what they are doing. When young guys aren't ready, they bring in cheap replacements to stopgap. That's better than a year ago when they were paying $2-5M for a stopgap.

This isn't hard. The Chiefs like to put 3 safeties on the field. Sorenson isn't ready to be a 2nd safety let alone a Demps safety. Much as people want to hype the bejeezus out of him, Bronson probably isn't either. They brought in a guy who could stopgap. If the Chiefs don't see any potential whatsoever in Bronson there is no reason to keep him around. If they saw potential, they would have put him on their practice squad and I don't think they did that.

We had absolute garbage at the the back end of the roster and were in danger of that garbage seeing the starting lineup. So we bought a guy for < $1M who isn't very good but has experience to step in right away.

[ModSocks]

You can swing Abdullah to Strong Safety and put Coleman or McCray at FS. Whoever doesn't play FS will play the Demps role. Basically, if the Chiefs ever find themselves in the spot where they have to rely on Sorenson, they're ****ed anyway. Sorenson is the definition of last resort.

Isn't Sorenson higher on the depth chart than McCray and Coleman?

[chiefzilla1501]

Isn't Sorenson higher on the depth chart than McCray and Coleman?

I mean, McCray is on the same level. They're both backups to the starter. I don't know where Coleman lands on the depth chart. But I would be shocked if Coleman or McCray wasn't the Demps guy. I would be even more shocked if they asked Sorenson to play that role.

[milkman]

Guys with potential flash that potential.

The shit you're trying to sell is that this guy has no business ever seeing the field, but deserves a roster spot because he showed potential in practice.

Next you're going to tell us how preseason doesn't matter.

The lie to that is that there isn't a coach who won't tell you that preseason does matter because it gives them the opportunity to see if that practice translates to real game situations.

Sorensen's practice didn't.

He has no business being on this roster, and the shit you're selling is still just shit.

[TEX]

Guys with potential flash that potential.

The shit you're trying to sell is that this guy has no business ever seeing the field, but deserves a roster spot because he showed potential in practice.

Next you're going to tell us how preseason doesn't matter.

The lie to that is that there isn't a coach who won't tell you that preseason does matter because it gives them the opportunity to see if that practice translates to real game situations.

Sorensen's practice didn't.

He has no business being on this roster, and the shit you're selling is still just shit.

At LEAST he's not spewing shit about the thinking that went into assembling the Chiefs JAG OL...Or selling Rishaw Johnson LMAO... However, this is JUST as retarded.

Damn Zilla, what's it like to be so wrong all the time about simple stuff???:bong:

[chiefzilla1501]

At LEAST he's not spewing shit about the thinking that went into assembling the Chiefs JAG OL...Or selling Rishaw Johnson LMAO... However, this is JUST as retarded.

Damn Zilla, what's it like to be so wrong all the time about simple stuff???:bong:

I'm not going to thread swerve. But you keep bringing up Rishaw Johnson:
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/bb/showthread.php?t=282425

You can go ahead and read my take on Rishaw Johnson and find me a single quote where I'm "selling" Rishaw Johnson as anything but cheap competition for an unimportant position.

[chief52]

I was thrilled to see Pioli be given the boot but Dorsey hasn't impressed me at all with his drafting skills.

Fire up the plane???

[chiefzilla1501]

Guys with potential flash that potential.

The shit you're trying to sell is that this guy has no business ever seeing the field, but deserves a roster spot because he showed potential in practice.

Next you're going to tell us how preseason doesn't matter.

The lie to that is that there isn't a coach who won't tell you that preseason does matter because it gives them the opportunity to see if that practice translates to real game situations.
He got a roster spot because we need safeties and they think he's the best we can do. He's on the roster because they compared him to shit and decided he was the better of the shit. Again, it's not like he's bumping off studs to get a roster spot. For crying out loud, people on this board are outraged because he got a roster spot over a guy who didn't make ANYBODY'S practice squad.

Preseason does matter but it matters a hell of a lot less for a rookie, especially given new rules of the CBA. Knile Davis looked like complete dog shit last year. Dontari Poe was a disaster his first year. Branden Albert was a disaster. I would hope that in the first preseason the evaluation has a shitload more to do with the overall picture than a few preseason games. Bronson on the other hand... he had a full year to learn the defense and to know what it takes to play in the NFL. It's not even close to a fair comparison.



Sorensen's practice didn't.

He has no business being on this roster, and the shit you're selling is still just shit.
Apparently most teams agree about Bronson too. I don't see you calling out people who are on here treating Bronson like he is some kind of high upside player. At least I'm realistic to know both Sorenson and Bronson are probably going to be shit.

[Easy 6]

Can Sorensen get even ONE ****ing real games worth of action before he's declared the worst damn decision of they year?

No?

Ok carry on, my crystal ball must be a bit cloudier than everyone elses.

This place I swear.

[milkman]

He got a roster spot because we need safeties and they think he's the best we can do. He's on the roster because they compared him to shit and decided he was the better of the shit. Again, it's not like he's bumping off studs to get a roster spot. For crying out loud, people on this board are outraged because he got a roster spot over a guy who didn't make ANYBODY'S practice squad.

Preseason does matter but it matters a hell of a lot less for a rookie, especially given new rules of the CBA. Knile Davis looked like complete dog shit last year. Dontari Poe was a disaster his first year. Branden Albert was a disaster. I would hope that in the first preseason the evaluation has a shitload more to do with the overall picture than a few preseason games. Bronson on the other hand... he had a full year to learn the defense and to know what it takes to play in the NFL. It's not even close to a fair comparison.




Apparently most teams agree about Bronson too. I don't see you calling out people who are on here treating Bronson like he is some kind of high upside player. At least I'm realistic to know both Sorenson and Bronson are probably going to be shit.

How many fucking times do I have to tell you this isn't about Sorenesen v. Bronson.

Let me say it slow.

I





don't







give




a





rat's





ass






about






Bronson.



This is about the stupid shit your useless dumb ass spews, dipshit.



And your shit about preseason and rookies is still shit.

If these preseason games were as meaningless as you try to spin it, then there would be no fucking preseason games.

And Knile Davis ain't all that, either.

He isn't nearly as good as some , like your dumb ass, want to believe.

[SAUTO]

Can Sorensen get even ONE ****ing real games worth of action before he's declared the worst damn decision of they year?

No?

Ok carry on, my crystal ball must be a bit cloudier than everyone elses.

This place I swear.

But he fucking sucks.

[OldSchool]

What's the excuse when Sorensen comes in as the 3rd safety and gets burned deep by the Titans? Oh, well he's just a UDFA, can't expect him to make that play. Bullshit, he made the 53, he should be able to make that play and stop the deep ball. Otherwise, why the hell would he even be on the roster?

[chiefzilla1501]

How many ****ing times do I have to tell you this isn't about Sorenesen v. Bronson.

Let me say it slow.

I





don't







give




a





rat's





ass






about






Bronson.



This is about the stupid shit your useless dumb ass spews, dipshit.



And your shit about preseason and rookies is still shit.

If these preseason games were as meaningless as you try to spin it, then there would be no ****ing preseason games.

And Knile Davis ain't all that, either.

He isn't nearly as good as some , like your dumb ass, want to believe.

You've been going on a tirade about "consistency." I said that Coleman was brought in to start in a Demps role, Sorenson was kept to back up and develop. You've yet to come up with anything resembling rebuttal for that except some dumb argument about... well, if Berry gets hurt which even that doesn't make sense.

Your other comment about consistency was that I should apparently be criticizing keeping Sorenson because it shows the Chiefs ignored the Safety position. That has nothing to ****ing to do with whether Sorenson should have gotten a roster spot. Complete red herring. As I've said repeatedly, Sorenson made the roster because they picked one shitty player over another shitty player. Period.

I didn't say Knile Davis was great. Just that he improved dramatically from last year where he was hot garbage in the preseason. Poe. Kelce. Albert. All garbage their first preseasons. The list goes on and on. It has gotten harder since the new CBA which doesn't allow rookies nearly as much practice time as 5 years ago. The leap to the NFL means learning a new playbook and adjusting to a totally different speed. A rookie can improve just by learning that playbook and getting used to the NFL. A second year player can't use that excuse anymore. So yes, it is idiotic to judge a rookie purely on immediate product and not based on potential. I am guessing the Chiefs have a lot of college film, endless scouting reports, and coaches who have watched him many, many times in practice before they made that decision. Again, it's not like they kept him and scrapped someone good.

[chiefzilla1501]

What's the excuse when Sorensen comes in as the 3rd safety and gets burned deep by the Titans? Oh, well he's just a UDFA, can't expect him to make that play. Bullshit, he made the 53, he should be able to make that play and stop the deep ball. Otherwise, why the hell would he even be on the roster?

If anyone here other than sac was arguing that this guy is a long-term option, then fine. The guy made the roster because it was either shit or shit. This conversation wouldn't even be taking place if not for all the hype around a player in Bronson who hasn't even made anybody's practice squad.

The Chiefs are very thin at lots of positions. Dorsey has got to be nails in the draft to improve that depth and so far, he hasn't been good. That has a lot more to do with the problem than this ridiculous argument about if the green shit is better than the brown shit. They're both shit.

[Saccopoo]

Can Sorensen get even ONE ****ing real games worth of action before he's declared the worst damn decision of they year?

No?

Ok carry on, my crystal ball must be a bit cloudier than everyone elses.

This place I swear.

No shit.

These guys are on Sorensen's jock like loose pubes and the guy was an UDFA who apparently did enough to impress the coaching staff to make him one of the 53 on roster.

Now, conversely, take Dee Ford, who has looked worse than anybody (other than possibly Phil Gaines), and it's all about "give him time, he's a rookie, blah, blah, blah..."

It's apparently alright to bash the shit out of a UDFA who makes the team, but first round draft picks are holy ground.

And Sorensen has received raves throughout the entire off-season/pre-season from the coaching staff. He's apparently been absolute balls in practice. But all these coach potato GM's on CP have apparently seen enough in a couple of preseason games that they have become judge, jury and executioner for one guy. A guy that was apparently, in the eyes of the coaching staff (who apparently are a bunch of fucking retards according to the CP geniuses) better than the other guy who everyone wanted because someone posted PFF numbers that got their dicks hard.

[ModSocks]

What's the excuse when Sorensen comes in as the 3rd safety and gets burned deep by the Titans? Oh, well he's just a UDFA, can't expect him to make that play. Bullshit, he made the 53, he should be able to make that play and stop the deep ball. Otherwise, why the hell would he even be on the roster?

Yes, because every player on the 53 will make every play every single time. With your logic, we might as well cut everyone not named Jamaal Charles.

[ModSocks]

This is most likely a very simply case of Sorenson knew where he was suppose to be and when to be there and Bronson didn't. We also don't know how many blown coverages Bronson was responsible for. It's a silly argument really.

[Easy 6]

No shit.

These guys are on Sorensen's jock like loose pubes and the guy was an UDFA who apparently did enough to impress the coaching staff to make him one of the 53 on roster.

Now, conversely, take Dee Ford, who has looked worse than anybody (other than possibly Phil Gaines), and it's all about "give him time, he's a rookie, blah, blah, blah..."

It's apparently alright to bash the shit out of a UDFA who makes the team, but first round draft picks are holy ground.

And Sorensen has received raves throughout the entire off-season/pre-season from the coaching staff. He's apparently been absolute balls in practice. But all these coach potato GM's on CP have apparently seen enough in a couple of preseason games that they have become judge, jury and executioner for one guy. A guy that was apparently, in the eyes of the coaching staff (who apparently are a bunch of ****ing retards according to the CP geniuses) better than the other guy who everyone wanted because someone posted PFF numbers that got their dicks hard.

LMAO I'm definitely with you here... all of the river barge deckhands and entry level accounting firm guys are almost certainly to be more trusted than the pro's, I mean seriously... why the hell are we being so stupid?

When Bronson starts knocking mfers dicks in the dirt on an NFL crew and Sorensen is cut, then let me know and rub it in good... until then, shut the **** UP and let the pro's do their job.

The only thing I'll grant every single "Pat Angerer" is that much of what I just said sounds a lot like what I said about certain players under Pioli... all I can say in defense is, look at the results from this groups first year.

Pioli never even approached this level of success here, he WAS a fraud... this new crew is NOT.

[aturnis]

I have never said the plan was brilliant. I said they are taking the approach but Dorsey has a ton to prove with his draft picks and I'm skeptical about how they will turn out. But it starts by not placing such a ridiculous expectation on an undrafted rookie that we decide his ceiling in his first fucking preseason. As I said, I don't think Sorenson will amount to anything. I don't think Bronson will either.

I have said many times I think Dorsey whiffed on 2013 including the draft and that he needs to be nails with this year's and next year's draft picks to work out. I'm worried they won't. As I've said a million times, this year's approach was the right one. The execution is another thing. But if we are revolving around the draft, let's start first with cutting out this ridiculous ideas that all rookies have to be quality starters by game 1.

Who said anything of the sort? Who placed expatriations on Sorensen or Bronson? Apparently only you. Nobody expects anything of either. Nobody. Do I think either will be a quality starter someday? Probably not.

The point is, and apparently you're missing it, who is the better player NOW? If by some crazy chance we end up having to go that far down on our depth chart for a starter, for multiple games, who do you trust more, Bronson, or Sorensen?

The answer is obvious...

[OldSchool]

The development of Philip Gaines is going to be absolutely crucial to this team this year. If he doesn't become good very quickly, our defense is going to be in a major shit hole all year long.

Our defensive line is going to have to play like the Giants' DL did during their recent Superbowl runs or like the Panthers' front 7 did last year.

[chiefzilla1501]

Who said anything of the sort? Who placed expatriations on Sorensen or Bronson? Apparently only you. Nobody expects anything of either. Nobody. Do I think either will be a quality starter someday? Probably not.

The point is, and apparently you're missing it, who is the better player NOW? If by some crazy chance we end up having to go that far down on our depth chart for a starter, for multiple games, who do you trust more, Bronson, or Sorensen?

The answer is obvious...

So if I'm going to get called out as contradictory, then if what you're saying is true, then those same people shouldn't complain about Kurt Coleman over Bronson because of all the three Coleman is the most ready by a mile. Second most ready is Kelcie McCray.

The Chiefs have several layers before it would ever get to the point of stooping to playing Sorensen or Bronson. So if that's the case, then why the focus on who's more ready now? Does that mean every rookie should always be cut from the roster because he didn't beat a veteran who had a year to learn the playbook? For a board that is so insistent on playing young guys, this argument doesn't make one damn bit of sense.

[RunKC]

Posted via Mobile Device

[RunKC]

This guy looked like our best CB in his first ever game today. I was very pleased with him today. Good job Phillip!
Posted via Mobile Device

[mdchiefsfan]

He definitely had some big plays, but he got lost in coverage a few times as well. He needs to be seasoned a bit more, but I am liking what I am seeing.

[beach tribe]

Has shown he has athletic ability in spades.

He's fast and he's long.

[BigMeatballDave]

Kid played well today.

[RealSNR]

No surprise that people had their periods prematurely about him.

He's far from doing what we need him to do yet, but it's not easy being a rookie corner. He's not exactly what I would call a piece of shit.

[GoShox]

He stepped up today. That's exactly what you want your rookies to do.

[Wallcrawler]

Huge play on the swat in the endzone on 3rd and goal.

[smith11]

so impressed with gaines today--though it looked like he could have tried to pick that pass that he knocked down in the end zone

[kcxiv]

he played really well. He was all over the WR's all day.

[KCChiefsfan1234]

I told you guys that you needed to give him a break! I know for a fact that he is and will be a great player some day!! So happy for him. He just needs some time.

[jonzie04]

Great game Gaines. He's made massive strides since the preseason. Guy is super athletic.

[smith11]

was cooper benched? fleming looked erratic but did some nice things--the pi call was bull

[GoShox]

was cooper benched? fleming looked erratic but did some nice things--the pi call was bull

Yes, he was benched for bad play. He switched to being a gunner on punts.

[BigCatDaddy]

I'm not sure if it's just this fan base or every fan base are complete dumbasses when it comes to expectations for rookie and 2nd year players. Shit takes time.

[mdchiefsfan]

I told you guys that you needed to give him a break! I know for a fact that he is and will be a great player some day!! So happy for him. He just needs some time.

Well you vouched and guaranteed.... It's official.

[OldSchool]

Gaines looked way better today than he did in the pre-season, really glad that he got better.

[OldSchool]

I'm not sure if it's just this fan base or every fan base are complete dumbasses when it comes to expectations for rookie and 2nd year players. Shit takes time.

If someone is going to start or play significant snaps, I expect them to play well and better than the guy on the bench. Disagree?

[Tribal Warfare]

I'm not sure if it's just this fan base or every fan base are complete dumbasses when it comes to expectations for rookie and 2nd year players. Shit takes time.

Average NFL career is 3.3 years

The 3rd year is the sweet spot if said player actually develops into something.

[BigCatDaddy]

If someone is going to start or play significant snaps, I expect them to play well and better than the guy on the bench. Disagree?

It depends on where the franchise is in development. If the franchise isn't going anywhere in the post season than I'm going with youth and upside over experienced mediocre vets that might be a hair better.

[BigCatDaddy]

Average NFL career is 3.3 years

The 3rd year is the sweet spot if said player actually develops into something.

Makes sense and you want to see improvement from year 1 to 2 to 3 regardless, but writing off rookies because they aren't heading the probowl as a rookie is stupid especially one like Gaines coming from a smaller program.

[RealSNR]

I told you guys that you needed to give him a break! I know for a fact that he is and will be a great player some day!! So happy for him. He just needs some time.

If a worthless waste of oxygen makes a post, and nobody reads it, did it really happen?

[ILChief]

Baller

[RINGLEADER]

Gaines had a couple of great defenses today and seemed tone mostly solid otherwise.

[OldSchool]

Gaines had a couple of great defenses today and seemed tone mostly solid otherwise.

Yeah, he played way better than I expected him to. He was the only one who had the speed to stick to Royal. Glad he improved.

[aturnis]

Dude was in his receivers hop pocket all day. Really good right coverage. Very pleased with him today.

[kcxiv]

at least we arent getting beat deep like we used too. I mean they had that one over the middle for a touchdown, but that had to do with luck as well as our guy even swatted the fucking ball. We used to always always give up that big ass 60-70 yard touch down play. Seems as if thats gone.

[Wallcrawler]

The Gates touchdown was just sickening. Two guys on him, the defender swats the football, and it still just floats into Gates' chest. Hard to ask the defenders to play it better, it just went Gates' way on that one.

[KCChiefsfan1234]

If a worthless waste of oxygen makes a post, and nobody reads it, did it really happen?

Oh well you can have your opinion. I'm sorry you are such an angry person that you can't respect another person's opinion.

[MahiMike]

I was wondering why the diss on this guy early on. He was a big reason why we won today.

[BigCatDaddy]

Oh well you can have your opinion. I'm sorry you are such an angry person that you can't respect another person's opinion.

You know or are related to him arent you?

[chiefzilla1501]

If someone is going to start or play significant snaps, I expect them to play well and better than the guy on the bench. Disagree?

Blake Bortles should start over Chad Henne. Period.

The massive improvements by Gaines, Kelce, Kniles Davis, and Eric Fisher show how ridiculously overreactionary CP has become in terms of patience with young players.

The program you're promoting is one where average veterans will almost always beat rookies for a starting spot, and that's just wrong.

Can we please finally get rid of this dumb position that preseasons are a good way to judge rookie talent? Good. Glad we can move on from that.

[KCChiefsfan1234]

You know or are related to him arent you?

:)

[Exoter175]

Gaines played VERY well tonight. I can't say I'm more impressed than I should be, after watching his growth on special teams this year and seeing a few of his defensive snaps so far, but he's doing a VERY good job at continuing to roll his improvements over from one game to the next.

[Mizzou_8541]

I told you guys that you needed to give him a break! I know for a fact that he is and will be a great player some day!! So happy for him. He just needs some time.

Go on...

[xztop123]

Yes, he was benched for bad play. He switched to being a gunner on punts.

I like that we have all no names and coaches arent afraid to let the BPA play

[xztop123]

I also like the fact that it didnt seem like Fasano was getting a ton of snaps today

[Fritz88]

at least we arent getting beat deep like we used too. I mean they had that one over the middle for a touchdown, but that had to do with luck as well as our guy even swatted the fucking ball. We used to always always give up that big ass 60-70 yard touch down play. Seems as if thats gone.

I sure hope so.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Made a big play today and we'll overall against a very good passing team. CP once again shows how horrible we are at evaluating young talent.

[BigCatDaddy]

Made a big play today and we'll overall against a very good passing team. CP once again shows how horrible we are at evaluating young talent.

Maybe, but there was some dude in the draft forum that said he would be the best CB in the class before we drafted him. I'm too lazy to go see who.

[OldSchool]

Made a big play today and we'll overall against a very good passing team. CP once again shows how horrible we are at evaluating young talent.

I and Direckshun were onto him during the draft period. I thought that he would be a 4th-5th rounder though because he was still raw and coming from a weak conference. Dorsey took him in the 3rd.

It was his play during the pre-season that made me think that he wasn't ready for the NFL and needed a ton of more work. He was getting abused by scrubs out there. Still believed that he had the physical talent to be great, just wondered how long and if he would ever get there after how poorly he played in the final pre-season games.

[BigCatDaddy]

Maybe, but there was some dude in the draft forum that said he would be the best CB in the class before we drafted him. I'm too lazy to go see who.

Ok. I didn't want OldDumbShit taking any credit so I looked it up. He could be dead wrong still, but PlanetDoc was all over the kid.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=10590601&postcount=2

[OldSchool]

Here is what I thought of him before the draft.

CB

Phillip Gaines, CB, Rice, Senior

Measurables: 6' .3", 193 lbs, 31 7/8" arms, 9 5/8" hands.

Bench Reps: 11

40 time: 4.35 unofficial, 4.38 official

3-cone: 6.62

Short Shuttle: 4.04

Background: Played CB at Rice. He was a dominant CB in his senior year. He was targeted 40 times in 2013 and allowed 13 receptions while making 4 INTs with 9 PBUs, 32.5% success rate. He has 38 PBUs in his career at Rice which is their career record. Gaines had legal troubles in 2011 when he was arrested for possession of 2 ounces or less of weed.

Positives: Aggressive defender in coverage, he plays fearlessly and isn't afraid to challenge receivers at the line. He's experienced as a press-corner and looks comfortable in the zone as well. He has great ball skills and broke up a ton of passes when playing at Rice. He has tremendous speed and quickness to mirror even the fastest WRs to go along with his good length, great closing speed. He was left on an island for most of his career and performed at a high level in that role; shows good awareness in coverage to fall off his man and make a play on the ball when it is thrown elsewhere. Very fluid athlete who is a willing tackler.

Negatives: Needs to improve his technique to in order to be more effective as a press corner (though he is fine in his trail technique). Struggles to get off of blocks in the run game; needs to add more strength to deal with WRs blocking him or improve his physicality at the point of attack. Needs to do a better job of catching the ball when he gets an opportunity.

Overview: Gaines is a confident, aggressive, and physical corner who has the potential to become a top cover corner in the NFL in either zone or press-man schemes. He has all of the tools to succeed but could stand to improve his strength, teams also have to check out his character. I would take him as soon as the 4th round in this draft in order to improve our pass coverage.

<iframe width="640" height="390" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/aY5uFG16O4E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


Looking at draft sites, they all say 7th round. His play is way above that of a 7th rounder, I would rate him as high as the 2nd for just his physical abilities alone; you're talking about a good sized corner at 6'1" and almost 200 pounds who has the movement skills of a 5'9" and under guy. The only reasons that I could think of why he would be rated so low are off the field issues and the fact that he didn't play against NFL level talent all of the time. However, his skill set translates very well to the NFL and he would immediately become a solid contributor for us.

His big problems: suspended for the Texas A&M game due to team rules violation; and arrested in 2011 for posession of 2 ounces or less of weed.

Again, it was his pre-season games that had me thinking that he was going to need a lot more work that I initially thought. Scrub WRs were running circles around him.

Today was very promising, he showed a bit of what he could potentially become. Stuck pretty close in coverage to a very fast and quick receiver in Eddie Royal. That was the CB that I thought we would be getting.

[chiefzilla1501]

I and Direckshun were onto him during the draft period. I thought that he would be a 4th-5th rounder though because he was still raw and coming from a weak conference. Dorsey took him in the 3rd.

It was his play during the pre-season that made me think that he wasn't ready for the NFL and needed a ton of more work. He was getting abused by scrubs out there. Still believed that he had the physical talent to be great, just wondered how long and if he would ever get there after how poorly he played in the final pre-season games.

But look at where that gets us...
It led us to give up on Eric Fisher, who's actually playing pretty well right now
It led us to trash Knile Davis and Travis Kelce last year
It led us to demand Santos get cut ASAP even though he's hit his last 6 (including a big one today)
It led to people asking if Gaines should be on the roster if not for his draft pick

In exchange, people were livid that Malcolm Bronson wasn't getting a shot.

Like I said before, the preseason is a TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE place to evaluate rookie talent these days. It's a reality we have to deal with until the players negotiate a new CBA.

[ThaVirus]

I liked Malcolm Bronson. Much better than Dan Sorenson at least..

[aturnis]

But look at where that gets us...
It led us to give up on Eric Fisher, who's actually playing pretty well right now
It led us to trash Knile Davis and Travis Kelce last year
It led us to demand Santos get cut ASAP even though he's hit his last 6 (including a big one today)
It led to people asking if Gaines should be on the roster if not for his draft pick

In exchange, people were livid that Malcolm Bronson wasn't getting a shot.

Like I said before, the preseason is a TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE place to evaluate rookie talent these days. It's a reality we have to deal with until the players negotiate a new CBA.

Fisher whiffed a lot today. Very bad. Only games he played well in, he had lots of help.

[chiefzilla1501]

I liked Malcolm Bronson. Much better than Dan Sorenson at least..

I was never high on Sorenson but I defended him anyway. And this is exactly the reason why.

Bronson was in year 2. Sorenson was a rookie during a shortened training camp. We just don't know what he would have done. Considering how terrible Eric Fisher and Gaines were in the preseason, who's to say he wouldn't have improved with coaching. It's not as much about Sorenson as much as it is the new CP mentality to give up on any rookie who doesn't flash in his first preseason action.

[Direckshun]

I'll say this: I am shocked that the Chiefs have turned shitstain preseason performances like Eric Fisher, Demetrius Harris, and Phillip Gaines and magically made them turn the corner once the season began.

[OldSchool]

I was never high on Sorenson but I defended him anyway. And this is exactly the reason why.

Bronson was in year 2. Sorenson was a rookie during a shortened training camp. We just don't know what he would have done. Considering how terrible Eric Fisher and Gaines were in the preseason, who's to say he wouldn't have improved with coaching. It's not as much about Sorenson as much as it is the new CP mentality to give up on any rookie who doesn't flash in his first preseason action.

New era of instant gratification.

[chiefzilla1501]

I'll say this: I am shocked that the Chiefs have turned shitstain preseason performances like Eric Fisher, Demetrius Harris, and Phillip Gaines and magically made them turn the corner once the season began.

5 less OTAs and restrictions on 2 a days
Coaches unable to even talk to players until months later than usual
No contact drills until months into the offseason

Rookies got a really shitty deal in the new CBA. Rookies are going to struggle a lot more until these ridiculous CBA rules get lifted.

[Mr. Arrowhead]

I was wondering why the diss on this guy early on. He was a big reason why we won today.

because he wasnt all pro corner coming out of the 3rd round

[MotherfuckerJones]

He did a really good job. It's nice to see a corner of ours looking for the ball and getting his head around. I'm happy for him. Hope he turns into a stud.

[rabblerouser]

Fisher whiffed a lot today. Very bad. Only games he played well in, he had lots of help.

Eric Fisher is still a steaming dog dune.

[Exoter175]

I'll say this: I am shocked that the Chiefs have turned shitstain preseason performances like Eric Fisher, Demetrius Harris, and Phillip Gaines and magically made them turn the corner once the season began.

What game are you guys watching where Demetrius Harris has done ANYTHING?

That guy in the pre-season and the regular season has been dog shit.

In fact, It was like game 3 or game 4 of the pre-season that we targeted this guy like 95 times and he ended up with like 2 catches and 46 drops, and 13 out of position "get the fuck on that side of the line"'s.

You want to give Fisher credit? Sure. You want to give Gaines credit? Fuck yeah, he's on fire for the few snaps he's seen, but Demetrius Harris?

CMON MAN

[jonzie04]

Gaines pff grade is solid. 0 allowed completions on 5 targets is very impressive.

"Phillip Gaines, CB: +2.7

Breakdown: After seeing just three snaps prior to this week, the rookie from Rice got his first start and produced a game to be proud of. Targeted five times, none of the balls his way were completed and he got his hands in to knock one away.

Signature Stat: Gaines was the only corner this week to give up no catches when targeted more than once."


Also if anyone cares Hudson and Sherman made there all star team of the week by turning in the highest grades at their respective positions.

[J Diddy]

What game are you guys watching where Demetrius Harris has done ANYTHING?

That guy in the pre-season and the regular season has been dog shit.

In fact, It was like game 3 or game 4 of the pre-season that we targeted this guy like 95 times and he ended up with like 2 catches and 46 drops, and 13 out of position "get the fuck on that side of the line"'s.

You want to give Fisher credit? Sure. You want to give Gaines credit? Fuck yeah, he's on fire for the few snaps he's seen, but Demetrius Harris?

CMON MAN

#KEEP DOUBTING DEMETRIUS HARRIS

[Exoter175]

Gaines pff grade is solid. 0 allowed completions on 5 targets is very impressive.

"Phillip Gaines, CB: +2.7

Breakdown: After seeing just three snaps prior to this week, the rookie from Rice got his first start and produced a game to be proud of. Targeted five times, none of the balls his way were completed and he got his hands in to knock one away.

Signature Stat: Gaines was the only corner this week to give up no catches when targeted more than once."


Also if anyone cares Hudson and Sherman made there all star team of the week by turning in the highest grades at their respective positions.

God damned right they did. If Colquitt weren't the MVP in KC, I'd have half a mind to vote for Sherman, I love that little bowling ball of a fullback.

[Exoter175]

#KEEP DOUBTING DEMETRIUS HARRIS

KAYY:clap:

[chiefzilla1501]

Fisher whiffed a lot today. Very bad. Only games he played well in, he had lots of help.

Fisher was supposed to be an outright disaster. I don't think he had a "very bad game." Could have and should have been better. And he's proven he's at least an adequate starter by now. I think most realize that his big improvement will come if he can get a whole offseason of strength training in.

[Rausch]

Also if anyone cares Hudson and Sherman made there all star team of the week by turning in the highest grades at their respective positions.

Thank God we didn't move him to G.

And what's the deal with Stephenson?...

[aturnis]

Thank God we didn't move him to G.

And what's the deal with Stephenson?...

They're making him earn it. That coupled with Cooper, and players earning more time for good play means the age of accountability has begun.

[bobhill]

Can stevenson play guard? Put his ass in at left guard

[chiefzilla1501]

They're making him earn it. That coupled with Cooper, and players earning more time for good play means the age of accountability has begun.

That's not a bad thing. I think the Chiefs might have bargained their way into getting a really cheap contract out of a swing lineman. I am okay with Stephenson starting, but his ability to play multiple positions especially for as cheap as he'll re-sign for is awesome.

[Exoter175]

Can stevenson play guard? Put his ass in at left guard

You'll have to ask Direkshun about that, but if I remember right, he had some kind of metric or footwork issue that prevented him from being a viable option at Left Guard.

[milkman]

God damned right they did. If Colquitt weren't the MVP in KC, I'd have half a mind to vote for Sherman, I love that little bowling ball of a fullback.

Sherman is big reason this team started the season with 9 wins last year.

[Exoter175]

Sherman is big reason this team started the season with 9 wins last year.

Absolutely and that trade ended up being stellar, and I'll even admit I questioned it at first, but I've come around to be very appreciative for it! :D