2015 Prof Football Hall of Fame Semifinalists

[Rain Man]

First-time nominees are in bold, and Chiefs-related nominees are in red.

Two "contributor" nominees still need to be named. Also, Mick Tinglehoff is the sole senior nominee. The last time we saw him, the Chiefs defensive tackles were destroying him in the Super Bowl, but he was still pretty good.

My takes on the list will be posted in the thread. And boy, do I have opinions.

Quarterbacks: (4) – Randall Cunningham, Rich Gannon, Phil Simms, Kurt Warner

Wide Receivers: (9) – *Tim Brown (also KR), Isaac Bruce, Gary Clark, Henry Ellard (also PR), *Marvin Harrison, Torry Holt, Sterling Sharpe, Jimmy Smith, Rod Smith

Tight End: (1) – Mark Bavaro

Running Backs: (14) – Shaun Alexander, Ottis Anderson, Tiki Barber, *Jerome Bettis, Roger Craig, Stephen Davis, Terrell Davis, Eddie George, Priest Holmes, Edgerrin James, Daryl Johnston, Jamal Lewis, Herschel Walker (also KR), Ricky Watters

Offensive Linemen: (23) – Willie Anderson (T), Tony Boselli (T), Jeff Bostic (C), Lomas Brown (T), Jim Covert (T), Bill Fralic (G/T), Jay Hilgenberg (C), Chris Hinton (G/T), Kent Hull (C), Joe Jacoby (T), Jon Jansen (T), Mike Kenn (T), Jim Lachey (T), Kevin Mawae (C/G), Mark May (G/T/C),Tom Nalen (C), Nate Newton (G), Orlando Pace (T), Chris Samuels (T), Mark Schlereth (G), *Will Shields (G), Tra Thomas (T), Steve Wisniewski (G)

Defensive Linemen: (12) – Al “Bubba” Baker (DE), Jerome Brown (DT), Carl Hairston (DE/DT), *Charles Haley (also LB), Jevon Kearse (DE), Dexter Manley (DE), Charles Mann (DE), Steve McMichael (DT/NT), Fred Smerlas (NT), Greg Townsend (DE), Ted Washington (DT/NT), Bryant Young (DE)

Linebackers: (13) – Cornelius Bennett, Tedy Bruschi, *Kevin Greene (also DE), Ken Harvey, Clay Matthews, Willie McGinest (also DE), Karl Mecklenburg, Matt Millen, Sam Mills, Junior Seau, Chris Spielman, Darryl Talley, Zach Thomas

Defensive Backs: (16) – Eric Allen (CB), Steve Atwater (S), Joey Browner (S), LeRoy Butler (S), Thomas Everett (S), Rodney Harrison (S), Ty Law (CB), Albert Lewis (CB), *John Lynch (S), Terry McDaniel (CB), Tim McDonald (S), Frank Minnifield (CB), Shawn Springs (CB), Troy Vincent (CB/S), Everson Walls (CB), Darren Woodson (S)

Kickers/Punters: (5) – *Morten Andersen (K), Gary Anderson (K), Jason Elam (K), Sean Landeta (P), Nick Lowery (K)

Special Teams/Position Players: (2) – Brian Mitchell (RB/PR/KR), Steve Tasker (also WR)

Coaches: (14) –Don Coryell, Bill Cowher, *Tony Dungy, Tom Flores, Mike Holmgren, Jimmy Johnson, Chuck Knox, Buddy Parker, Richie Petitbon, Dan Reeves, Lou Saban, Marty Schottenheimer, Clark Shaughnessy, Dick Vermeil

[The Franchise]

How come Priest Holmes isnt red?

[In58men]

Where's Albert Haynesworth

[Ming the Merciless]

Isaac Bruce, Marvin Harrison, Roger Craig, Will Shields, Orlando Pace, Zach Thomas & Seau , No real opinion on the CB's ...(Albert Lewis would be cool because Chiefs), No opinion on kicker....no real opinion on coaches

[ILChief]

Ahhh the annual will shields gets screwed thread

[Gadzooks]

How come Priest Holmes isnt red?

He's going in as a Raven.

[TribalElder]

This voting system is fucked

What's that douches name from KC who votes on the committee

[Rain Man]

When I look at the nominees, I see the following players as being the most deserving:

QB - Kurt Warner clearly should be a first-ballot guy. While I loved watching Cunningham, he's a borderline candidate at best. None of the others should be in.

WR - There are lots of good receivers on this list. I'd probably lean toward Torry Holt, Isaac Bruce, and Rod Smith being the top three, despite the fact that Smith's team cheated rampantly. I'm indifferent about Marvin Harrison and Tim Brown, though I figure they'll eventually get in. Sterling Sharpe was great but didn't play long enough. Otis Taylor clearly should be ranked #1 or #2 on this list.

TE - I'm not averse to Bavaro getting in, but he's borderline.

RB - Roger Craig is probably #1, but Priest Holmes and Terrell Davis are close behind. All are borderline candidates at best. Watters has the stats, but his attitude will keep him out. Alexander may be borderline in an exceptionally weak year.

OL - Shield obviously should be first in line, but I suspect that they'll give his ring to Orlando Pace this year in their annual stupid snub. The three most deserving are Shields, Joe Jacoby, and Pace, in that order. Mike Kenn is a borderline candidate. There are a lot of dirty players on this list who should be banned, not honored: Nalen, Wisniewski, Schlereth, etc.

DL - Haley is a borderline candidate. No one else is close.

LB - Kevin Greene is way overdue and should be in. Clay Matthews and Karl Mecklenburg are borderline candidates. Seau will get in, and whatever. He's equivalent to Sam Mills who won't get in, but Seau had more media value and that's what's important these days.

DB - Albert Lewis and Everson Walls are clearly the top two on this list. Walls should be #1 with Lewis a close #2. Woodson is a borderline candidate and maybe if everything goes right Browner or Lynch could get in. No one else is close. Deron Cherry and Kenny Easley should be in the top four finalists but have been snubbed.

K/P - Morten Andersen is clearly #1 and needs to be in. Gary Anderson and Nick Lowery are borderline candidates.

ST - Neither of those guys should be in.

Coaches - Marty and Dick are extremely borderline candidates. No one else is close.


If I was naming 15 finalists from the above list, they would be:

Kurt Warner
Torry Holt
Isaac Bruce
Rod Smith
Will Shields
Joe Jacoby
Orlando Pace
Charles Haley
Kevin Greene
Clay Matthews
Karl Mecklenburg
Albert Lewis
Everson Walls
Morten Andersen
Gary Anderson

The five that I would put in would be (in order):

Kurt Warner
Will Shields
Joe Jacoby
Kevin Greene
Everson Walls

Morten Andersen should be #6 if they add another slot.


That's what it should be. The truth is that it depends on who's marketable now, so the finalists will be:

Kurt Warner
Torry Holt
Isaac Bruce
Marvin Harrison
Tim Brown
Jerome Bettis
Orlando Pace
Will Shields
Charles Haley
Junior Seau
Albert Lewis
John Lynch
Morten Andersen
Tony Dungy (because ... Manning)
Jimmy Johnson

It will be great marketing to stack the field with the Greatest Show On Turf, but I suspect the writers will block that a little. I think the five that actually get in will be:

Kurt Warner
Orlando Pace
Junior Seau
Will Shields
Tim Brown

They might put Jimmy Johnson in, depending on which network wants him for TV specials.

[Rain Man]

How come Priest Holmes isnt red?


Oh, you're right. He did play for the Chiefs for a while. Corrected.

[cosmo20002]

How is Tim Brown not in? I know he's a Raider and we hate him, but he should be in.

[gblowfish]

Where is Otis Taylor?

[Mojo Jojo]

Where is Otis Taylor?

Veterans , or whatever they call it, ballot...for old timers that have been passed over.

[TribalElder]

This voting system is ****ed

What's that douches name from KC who votes on the committee

Bob Gretz

[carcosa]

That's what it should be. The truth is that it depends on who's marketable now, so the finalists will be:

Kurt Warner
Torry Holt
Isaac Bruce
Marvin Harrison
Tim Brown
Jerome Bettis
Orlando Pace
Will Shields
Charles Haley
Junior Seau
Albert Lewis
John Lynch
Morten Andersen
Tony Dungy (because ... Manning)
Jimmy Johnson



Is Seau more marketable because he's dead?

[Rain Man]

Is Seau more marketable because he's dead?

It doesn't hurt. they can be relatively certain that he will not get into a fight with his wife.

[ViperVisor]

Ricky Watters
Despite the short career, Watters rushed for over 10,000 yards and added another 4,000 as a receiver, with 91 touchdowns. Here's the list of players in the 10,000/4,000/90 Club: Walter Payton, LaDainian Tomlinson, Marshall Faulk, Marcus Allen, Thurman Thomas, Ricky Watters. That's three of the greatest RBs in history, two more Hall of Famers, and Watters.

[Kaepernick]

How come Priest Holmes isnt red?


I think of Priest as a Chief, not a Raven. But he was on the 2000 Ravens super bowl team and was drafted by the Ravens.

I don't see Priest getting into the Hall of fame. He is barely in the top 50 for rushing yards, and out of the top 100 for all purpose yards.

The only place he shines is 15th in career rushing TDs, and I don't think that is enough for an RB to rank the Hall of Fame today.

[Kaepernick]

It is a travesty that Charles Haley is not in the Hall of Fame and may never be.

He is the only player in NFL history with 5 super bowl rings, and it is not as if he skated. He was invaluable in each of those 5 super bowls. In fact, the balance of power in the NFC shifted from the 49ers to the Cowboys with that trade. Charles Haley was the missing link necessary for the 1990s Dallas Dynasty.

That he is not in the Hall of Fame is nothing but politics. From a performance standpoint, there is absolutely no doubt he should have been a first ballot HoFer.

[Ebolapox]

I think of Priest as a Chief, not a Raven. But he was on the 2000 Ravens super bowl team and was drafted by the Ravens.

I don't see Priest getting into the Hall of fame. He is barely in the top 50 for rushing yards, and out of the top 100 for all purpose yards.

The only place he shines is 15th in career rushing TDs, and I don't think that is enough for an RB to rank the Hall of Fame today.

Wrong. Udfa

[Gadzooks]

It doesn't hurt. they can be relatively certain that he will not get into a fight with his wife.

Did Junior Seau do something awful to you or a family member?
If that were the case, I would understand you're consistent disdain for him.

[Rain Man]

Did Junior Seau do something awful to you or a family member?
If that were the case, I would understand you're consistent disdain for him.

He annoyed me by getting all jiggy and fist-pumpy when he would make a meaningless stop five yards downfield on second and three. I don't hate him, but your word 'disdain' is pretty accurate. He was the equivalent of that guy at the concert behind you who sings along loudly with the songs and then does that screeching whistle.

[Gadzooks]

He annoyed me by getting all jiggy and fist-pumpy when he would make a meaningless stop five yards downfield on second and three. I don't hate him, but your word 'disdain' is pretty accurate. He was the equivalent of that guy at the concert behind you who sings along loudly with the songs and then does that screeching whistle.

Ah, I see. Your annoyance mixed with a hatred towards AFC West rivals led you to pick Karl Mecklenburg over Seau out of spite. That must have been painful.

[TimBone]

He annoyed me by getting all jiggy and fist-pumpy when he would make a meaningless stop five yards downfield on second and three. I don't hate him, but your word 'disdain' is pretty accurate. He was the equivalent of that guy at the concert behind you who sings along loudly with the songs and then does that screeching whistle.

Hahahahaha....that's the perfect explanation. it's what I remember from him as well.

[Why Not?]

It doesn't hurt. they can be relatively certain that he will not get into a fight with his wife.

This is a good point

[Rain Man]

Ah, I see. Your annoyance mixed with a hatred towards AFC West rivals led you to pick Karl Mecklenburg over Seau out of spite. That must have been painful.

I hated Karl Mecklenburg. Hated him. But if I have to be completely honest, I hated him because he was a really, really good player. Same with Rod Smith. Neither of them really did anything that annoyed me, so 20 years later I have no choice but reluctantly acknowledge that they were good players.

Seau was a fine player, but I think his reputation was bigger than his performance, in part because he was a camera hound. No offense.

[Gadzooks]

I hated Karl Mecklenburg. Hated him. But if I have to be completely honest, I hated him because he was a really, really good player. Same with Rod Smith. Neither of them really did anything that annoyed me, so 20 years later I have no choice but reluctantly acknowledge that they were good players.

Seau was a fine player, but I think his reputation was bigger than his performance, in part because he was a camera hound. No offense.

No offense taken. I can see where Seau's antics could rub people the wrong way. It's hard to convince those that didn't follow the team that he was an "impact" player who was always around the ball, however, I'd be interested to hear any argument to support Karl Mecklenberg being in the Hall at all, let alone, over Seau.

BTW - The HOF's a joke. Kevin Greene should've been elected in his first year of eligibility yet he sits and waits. Charles Haley still waits? Pffft...
Year after year the selection process becomes more political and thus more malevolent.
There is no justice in the NFL. Only pain.

[Buck]

Sam Mills and Junior Seau could be the dead LB HOF class.

But on a serious note I don't get why being a camera hound should devalue a players HOF credentials In your guys minds. Seau was a beast and one of the best MLB of all time.

[Rain Man]

No offense taken. I can see where Seau's antics could rub people the wrong way. It's hard to convince those that didn't follow the team that he was an "impact" player who was always around the ball, however, I'd be interested to hear any argument to support Karl Mecklenberg being in the Hall at all, let alone, over Seau.

BTW - The HOF's a joke. Kevin Greene should've been elected in his first year of eligibility yet he sits and waits. Charles Haley still waits? Pffft...
Year after year the selection process becomes more political and thus more malevolent.
There is no justice in the NFL. Only pain.


It's possible that the Chiefs were simply a worse team during the Mecklenburg years, but it seems like Mecklenburg was more disruptive to the Chiefs than Seau was. It seemed like he was often blowing plays up.

I agree about the Hall of Fame losing credibility in recent years. It completely bugs me how skewed the recent selections have been toward certain positions, and how media presence seems to impact a person's likelihood of getting in.

[Rain Man]

Sam Mills and Junior Seau could be the dead LB HOF class.

But on a serious note I don't get why being a camera hound should devalue a players HOF credentials In your guys minds. Seau was a beast and one of the best MLB of all time.

Sam Mills is dead? Man, I'd forgotten about that.

I think that being a camera hound helps a player's chances, because they just end up on camera more. If Deion Sanders didn't high-step, he'd still be in the Hall of Fame, but it might not have been so automatic. But the cameras spent more time on him, so the voters remember him more.

[Gadzooks]

it seems like Mecklenburg was more disruptive to the Chiefs than Seau was. It seemed like he was often blowing plays up.


:hmmm: This does not seem to be a valid argument for Mecklenberg over Seau but data doesn't seem to be a factor in the HOF selections.

BTW - Leslie O'Neal is tied for sacks with Lawrence Taylor with 132 1⁄2 yet he's not even under consideration, (Karl "****in'" Mecklenberg is though...)

[Rain Man]

:hmmm: This does not seem to be a valid argument for Mecklenberg over Seau but data doesn't seem to be a factor in the HOF selections.

BTW - Leslie O'Neal is tied for sacks with Lawrence Taylor with 132 1⁄2 yet he's not even under consideration, (Karl "****in'" Mecklenberg is though...)


If he hadn't had that knee injury early in his career, I'm convinced that Leslie O'Neal would've been one of the top two or three pass rushers ever. He was scary as a rookie. Even with the knee injury he was very, very good.

My favorite Chargers ever are:

1. James Brooks
2. John Jefferson
3. Leslie O'Neal

I think Brooks should be a borderline HoF candidate, but he's never even gotten a whiff. He was one of those guys that scared me to play against.

The same is true for Jefferson and O'Neal. Jefferson's career just wasn't long enough for serious consideration, and I think O'Neal is more deserving than many of the DL semifinalists this year.

[Gadzooks]

I'm afraid that following the HOF inductions will only increase your overall disappointment in the NFL.
Although, if we were to leave it up to you, Karl Mecklenberg would be giving a speech about all of the crap he's been doing with kids to promote literacy.:rolleyes:

[Rain Man]

I'm afraid that following the HOF inductions will only increase your overall disappointment in the NFL.
Although, if we were to leave it up to you, Karl Mecklenberg would be giving a speech about all of the crap he's been doing with kids to promote literacy.:rolleyes:

Oh, I would never vote for him no matter how much he deserved it. He was a Bronco.

[Gadzooks]

Oh, I would never vote for him no matter how much he deserved it. He was a Bronco.

Agreed. He wasn't a great player, however, his literacy training may help some future HOF speeches:
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/cx7XM78vCSs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[tk13]

Pretty good list. Although I'd probably disagree on the WR position. I think I'd take Tim Brown and Marvin Harrison over Bruce, Holt and Rod Smith. Harrison is top ten if not top 5 in almost every category... and the only WR with more receptions is Jerry Rice. The only guys with more all purpose yards than Tim Brown are Rice, Walter Payton, Emmitt Smith and Brian Mitchell. The other three guys deserve to get in too though... they may all end up hurting each other, too much competition. Plus Harrison might get docked for his off the field stuff.

[TomBarndtsTwin]

Guys that deserve to be in:

Charles Haley
Tim Brown
Kevin Greene
Orlando Pace
Kurt Warner
Joe Jacoby
Wil Shields
Phil Simms
Roger Craig
Karl Mecklenberg
Morty



That is all.

[milkman]

Karl Mecklinberg was about the most overrarted piece of shit in the league when he was playing.

Junior Seau, for all of his antics, and his tendency to overrun plays at times, was a great player who impacted games in much the same way as Ray Lewis did.

[Rain Man]

Ricky Watters

My suspicion is that Ricky Watters will never get in as long as a majority of voters were alive to hear him interviewed after games. And I'm not joking about that.

[Rain Man]

Karl Mecklinberg was about the most overrarted piece of shit in the league when he was playing.

Junior Seau, for all of his antics, and his tendency to overrun plays at times, was a great player who impacted games in much the same way as Ray Lewis did.

Mecklenburg? Seau? Muderin' Ray? This whole conversation is making me feel dirty.

But I should say that Mecklenburg had far more sacks in 12 years than Seau in a 20-year career and produced more turnovers per year on average (interceptions plus forced fumbles).

If you look at the first 12 years of their careers as a comparison of peak performance, their stats are:

Mecklenburg: 1104 tackles, 79 sacks, 21 turnovers
Seau: 1227 tackles, 45.5 sacks, 24 turnovers

Seau padded his stats by hanging on for another eight years, but none of those years were strong. His best stats in those last eight years were 66 tackles, 3.5 sacks, and 3 turnovers (and none of those were in the same season).

Their top three seasons (as viewed by me) were:

Mecklenburg:

1991 - 130 tackles, 9.5 sacks, 1 turnover
1985 - 65 tackles, 13 sacks, 5 turnovers
1986 - 127 tackles, 9 sacks, 1 turnover

Seau:

1991 - 129 tackles, 7 sacks, 0 turnovers
1994 - 124 tackles, 5.5 sacks, 1 turnover
1993 - 129 tackles, 0 sacks, 3 turnovers

Unless you want to reward Seau for loitering on rosters for eight additional years, I think Mecklenburg is the better candidate.

[Demonpenz]

If Sanders runs the ball in for a touchdown normally he still gets in the hall of fame first ballot.

[Mama Hip Rockets]

It boggles my mind on an annual basis that Kevin Greene is not elected. He is number 3 all time in sacks. How can someone #3 in the NFL all time in any major category not be in the Hall of Fame?

[Rain Man]

It boggles my mind on an annual basis that Kevin Greene is not elected. He is number 3 all time in sacks. How can someone #3 in the NFL all time in any major category not be in the Hall of Fame?

And he is in coaching now, which usually means that he has teams' support.

I heard one theory once that since he split his career between two or three different teams, no individual sports writer will go to the wall for him. they all want to support a guy who played a decade or more on their own team.

[suzzer99]

Albert Lewis deserves to be in. He's getting screwed because he went to the Raiders so no one in KC will champion him.

[Ming the Merciless]

yah maybe i should add warner and brown and greene to my original list , then whittle it down to 5

damn this is hard

[EyePod]

I can't believe Morten Andersen doesn't make it first ballot.

Talk about one of those guys who was a league staple.

Here are his NFL records per Wiki:
Most games played (career) – 382
Most consecutive games played by a placekicker – 248
Most field goals attempted (career) – 709
Most field goals (career) – 565
Most points (career) – 2,544
Most seasons, 75 or more points (career) – 24
Most consecutive seasons, 75 or more points (career) – 23
Most seasons, 90 or more points (career) – 22
Most seasons, 98 or more points (career) – 18
Most game winning field goals (career) – 103
Games with 1+ field goals (career) – 299
Games with 2+ field goals (career) – 178
Oldest player to score 14 points in a game – 47 years, 133 days (for Atlanta Falcons vs. Seattle Seahawks, December 30, 2007)
Oldest player to kick 4 field goals in a game – 47 years, 42 days (for Atlanta Falcons vs. Houston Texans, September 30, 2007)
Oldest player to kick 5 field goals in a game – 46 years, 43 days
Most field goals attempted of 50 or more yards (total) – 84
Most field goals (50 or more yards) in a game – 3 (vs. New Orleans, December 10, 1995) (tied with Neil Rackers, Connor Barth, Kris Brown, Sebastian Janikowski, and Josh Scobee)
Most consecutive games scoring (career) – 360
Most games scoring (career) – 379
Most consecutive seasons scoring (career) – 23 – tied with Gary Anderson
Most consecutive calendar years scoring (career) – 26

He's also the highest scorer for both the Falcons and the Saints (Only player to hold career statistical franchise record for two NFL teams)

Honestly, if we decided to replace Santos, I couldn't be made if we got Andersen. Dude would kick 35 yard FGs in a walker.

[Iowanian]

I don't see very many players in the top half of that list that I think deserve consideration.

[Rain Man]

I can't believe Morten Andersen doesn't make it first ballot.


He certainly deserves it if the criteria is dominating at your position. As much as I'm loyal to Lowery and Stenerud, Morten Andersen is clearly the best kicker to ever play the game.

But a kicker getting in on the first ballot? No way. It'll never happen. Andersen is the test case for it, but if Will Shields couldn't get in first ballot then Andersen won't.