Is Aaron Rodgers GROSSLY overrated?

[Hootie]

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/skeptical-football-manning-vs-messi-and-andrew-luck-experiment/

I watched the entire GB/Det game and I must say...Rodgers has not gotten better at getting rid of the ball. He's got a lot of Alex Smith in him in that regard. He takes a TON of unnecessary sacks. It's bothersome. He also missed a wide open Jordy Nelson when trying to come back on 4th and 5 with a terrible pass 3 yards behind him in a clean pocket...

He's had 1 good playoff run. So has Joe Flacco.

Why does everyone think he's the best QB in the NFL?

I think he's top 5, certainly. But I also don't understand how Tony Romo is a choker, but Aaron Rodgers is not?

I have been grossly unimpressed with Rodgers this year...and in all honesty, the last few postseasons...super meh.

I've said this for a few years now, but...I'd take Russell Wilson over Aaron Rodgers and at this point, I don't even think it's close.

Also, Rodgers is nowhere near Peyton Manning (obvi) or IN HIS PRIME Tom Brady, let's be honest.

[Dante84]

I feel like his O-line has been plagued with injuries and has been generally shitty the last 2 years.

[Discuss Thrower]

Hasn't been the same since it was alleged that he like to double-check his live-in personal assistant's sausage.

[Dante84]

Also - Romo chokes often and always.

[Jewish Rabbi]

Romo has the most 4th quarter comebacks of any quarterback over the last 4 or 5 years. Don't remember for sure the stat. I'll try to find it.

[Gadzooks]

Fuck ya, he is.

[Jewish Rabbi]

On the topic of Rodgers... How many of that fuckers' touchdowns are 60 yards or more? I feel like it happens a lot, which is more luck than anything.

[tk13]

It's like anything else. Give him the Niners or Seahawks defense, and watch what happens.

[tk13]

On the topic of Rodgers... How many of that ****ers' touchdowns are 60 yards or more? I feel like it happens a lot, which is more luck than anything.

I wouldn't go that far. There aren't many guys out there with his ability, which is why I hate when people compare other QBs to him. You could find posts comparing Geno to him, which is ridiculous. His release his off the charts fast, and his throw velocity is ridiculous. Just the mechanics of his ability are amazing. The ball comes out of his hand different than other guys. I still don't think there's been any QB the last 25 years play better than he did during that Super Bowl run, and then that following season where they went 15-1 or whatever it was.

[Titty Meat]

Rogers has a ring Romo doesnt


/thread

[KChiefer]

It's like anything else. Give him the Niners or Seahawks defense, and watch what happens.

+GB hasn't had a run game in over a decade

[Simply Red]

He gay.

[ModSocks]

Yes, i agree that he's over rated. But i wouldn't take Russel Wilson over him. Russel is slightly better, glorified Alex Smith.

[TripleThreat]

Hasn't been the same since it was alleged that he like to double-check his live-in personal assistant's sausage.

lol foreal was thinking the same thing today. LMAO

[Hammock Parties]

Russel is slightly better, glorified Alex Smith.

https://media0.giphy.com/media/5xtDarC0cvqUXAAxAkw/giphy.gif?t=1

[Jewish Rabbi]

I wouldn't go that far. There aren't many guys out there with his ability, which is why I hate when people compare other QBs to him. You could find posts comparing Geno to him, which is ridiculous. His release his off the charts fast, and his throw velocity is ridiculous. Just the mechanics of his ability are amazing. The ball comes out of his hand different than other guys. I still don't think there's been any QB the last 25 years play better than he did during that Super Bowl run, and then that following season where they went 15-1 or whatever it was.

You're telling me those 30 yard jump balls to Jordy where the defender ends up on his ass aren't luck? Okay.

[Valiant]

You're telling me those 30 yard jump balls to Jordy where the defender ends up on his ass aren't luck? Okay.

So he has been lucky 10x more than any other QB in that time frame? That is weird luck. I guess Peyton should thank his stars for him being so lucky so often when it comes to completion percentage and deep throws also.

[ModSocks]

https://media0.giphy.com/media/5xtDarC0cvqUXAAxAkw/giphy.gif?t=1

You can gif up a pretty throw for nearly every QB in the NFL. He's a game manager with a good running game and the league's best Defense.

[Hammock Parties]

You can gif up a pretty throw for nearly every QB in the NFL. He's a game manager with a good running game and the league's best Defense.

There's a huge difference in being #4 in YPA and #29.

That is the difference between Russell and Alex.

Russell Wilson had a higher percentage of his passes completed over 20 yards than anyone else in the NFL last year.

Alex...well...ha!

[splatbass]

https://media0.giphy.com/media/5xtDarC0cvqUXAAxAkw/giphy.gif?t=1

You post that one, but you won't post the long TD pass from Alex Smith to Avery in the playoff game. A little disingenuous, don't you think?

[Hammock Parties]

You post that one, but you won't post the long TD pass from Alex Smith to Avery in the playoff game. A little disingenuous, don't you think?


bro, read.

There's a huge difference in being #4 in YPA and #29.

That is the difference between Russell and Alex.

Russell Wilson had a higher percentage of his passes completed over 20 yards than anyone else in the NFL last year.

Alex...well...ha!

[splatbass]

bro, read.

And as I have pointed out to you repeatedly, YPA is a useless way to judge a QB, especially one in the West Coast offense. But you know that, you would just rather deceive.

[Hammock Parties]

Find a guy ranked #29 in YPA that also won a Super Bowl that year. I'll wait.

[OldSchool]

Rodgers was considered one of the best because he threw the best deep ball and back shoulder passes of any QB in the league. That being said, he always had a stable full of very capable WRs from the day he started to now.

But, like any QB, Rodgers can have a stinker every now and then but he is generally on point. It does seem like he is having more poor games than usual lately though, which is odd because his run game is better now.

[Rausch]

+GB hasn't had a run game in over a decade

Are we ignoring last year?...

[OldSchool]

+GB hasn't had a run game in over a decade

Rodgers played better when he didn't have a run game.

[Eleazar]

:rolleyes:

[BigMeatballDave]

LMAO Overated.

Well, then, so is Peyton. 2 SB losses? (suck it, hoot! LOL)

2010 post-season is all you need to know about Aaron Rodgers.

[BigMeatballDave]

Romo has the most 4th quarter comebacks of any quarterback over the last 4 or 5 years. Don't remember for sure the stat. I'll try to find it.

And how many play-off wins?

[The_Hound]

LMAO, yeah Rodgers has been gifted with some great receivers. I put him in the tier 2 of QB's, once that can do a lot with some but can't create something from nothing like brady.

[BigMeatballDave]

Tier 2 is fucking laughable.

So much dumbassery in this thread.

[BigMeatballDave]

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/skeptical-football-manning-vs-messi-and-andrew-luck-experiment/

I watched the entire GB/Det game and I must say...Rodgers has not gotten better at getting rid of the ball. He's got a lot of Alex Smith in him in that regard. He takes a TON of unnecessary sacks. It's bothersome. He also missed a wide open Jordy Nelson when trying to come back on 4th and 5 with a terrible pass 3 yards behind him in a clean pocket...

He's had 1 good playoff run. So has Joe Flacco.

Why does everyone think he's the best QB in the NFL?

I think he's top 5, certainly. But I also don't understand how Tony Romo is a choker, but Aaron Rodgers is not?

I have been grossly unimpressed with Rodgers this year...and in all honesty, the last few postseasons...super meh.

I've said this for a few years now, but...I'd take Russell Wilson over Aaron Rodgers and at this point, I don't even think it's close.

Also, Rodgers is nowhere near Peyton Manning (obvi) or IN HIS PRIME Tom Brady, let's be honest.LMAO Nice troll attempt, Hoot.

You fail miserably.

[Mav]

They have done to Rodgers what seems to be the theme in the league. Pay your qb, and lose play makers. The packers have no tight end. Aaron misses james Jones. Neither adams, nor boykins have earned Rodgers trust.

[Sandy Vagina]

LMAO, yeah Rodgers has been gifted with some great receivers. I put him in the tier 2 of QB's, once that can do a lot with some but can't create something from nothing like brady.

I wouldn't go that far... but yes, Rodgers is overrated. Many top QBs are overrated.

Rodgers is a good QB. He's had a silver spoon shoved up his ass since the day he was drafted. GB did everything right with him. Time to sit and learn.. consistent and good coaching.. excellent pass weapons.. good RB.

I think the disconnect is that some fans bought into this idea that "all top QBs can always overcome team deficiencies around them." At times, maybe so.. other times, the deficiencies can drag them down pretty far.

So far, Aaron has had one good game.. and two "meh" games. He's ranked 21st in pressure %... think about that for a moment.

[Deberg_1990]

He's rated about right. Every QB has flaws.

You can't win them all

[MotherfuckerJones]

Alex Smith wishes he was Wilson. Wilson's a boss.

[MotherfuckerJones]

LMAO, yeah Rodgers has been gifted with some great receivers. I put him in the tier 2 of QB's, once that can do a lot with some but can't create something from nothing like brady.

ROFL fucking stupid bastard

[Eleazar]

This is either epicly stupid or a lame troll, I'm not sure which, The funniest part is how many people agree

[The_Hound]

This is either epicly stupid or a lame troll, I'm not sure which, The funniest part is how many people agree

Because there is a bit of truth to it. Green Bay doesn't have the awesome skills guys around him anymore & he's struggling a bit. Don't be blinded by the past or fandimonium, just sit back and watch the games. He's still good & I'd take him over the guy we got any day.

[chiefzilla1501]

As of 2013, 5 - 24 record in close games. He is a great qb. He is overrated because everyone says he's one of the best. Gotta close games consistently to be considered the best.

[jd1020]

I wonder if the Packers will trade Rodgers for Alex straight up.

[TLO]

I need to see what PFF says before I make a decision.

[Eleazar]

Because there is a bit of truth to it. Green Bay doesn't have the awesome skills guys around him anymore & he's struggling a bit. Don't be blinded by the past or fandimonium, just sit back and watch the games. He's still good & I'd take him over the guy we got any day.

Right...

Chiefsplanet has removed Aaron Rodgers from the list of mythical "elite" quarterbacks.

We can just let that statement stand on its own as to what the football IQ is around here..

[The_Hound]

Man the level of butthurt is high around here the minute you begin to question "established truths". Relax mijo we just offering opinions.

[Hootie]

I just think his 2010 postseason happened 4 years ago....

and I'm not quite sure why he is still getting to hang his hat on that

[PunkinDrublic]

He has a long way to go before he matches Peyton Mannings record of choking in the post season.

[BigMeatballDave]

I just think his 2010 postseason happened 4 years ago....

and I'm not quite sure why he is still getting to hang his hat on that

Well, Peyton's was 4 years before that, correct?

And PeyPey would not have won shit without the D kicking ass in the playoffs.

[BigMeatballDave]

LMAO Some epic retard going on in here.

[GoChargers]

Yes, i agree that he's over rated. But i wouldn't take Russel Wilson over him. Russel is slightly better, glorified Alex Smith.

LOL no.

[GoChargers]

I just think his 2010 postseason happened 4 years ago....

and I'm not quite sure why he is still getting to hang his hat on that

Your boy Fivehead is still living off the defense and Rex Grossman carrying his choking ass to a ring 8 years ago, so I don't see a problem with Rodgers still living off 2010.

I'm just amazed Dom Capers still has a job.... he's more responsible than anyone else for their lack of playoff success since 2010.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Alex Smith wishes he was Wilson. Wilson's a boss.

This.

[Marcellus]

Romo has the most 4th quarter comebacks of any quarterback over the last 4 or 5 years. Don't remember for sure the stat. I'll try to find it.

I wonder why they are behind in the 4th quarter so much?

I would venture he also has a metric shit ton of 4th quarter losses as well. More than his comebacks.

They are basically a .500 team his entire career so why does it matter he has so many 4th quarter comebacks when he has so many losses and contributes to the hole they are in anyway?

The number one goal should be to not get behind in the 4th quarter because you are going to lose more than you win, even if you do pull it out of your ass on occasion.

[Hootie]

If you take away Rodgers' 2010 postseason...is he even better than Phillip Rivers? I'm being serious. Rodgers is really, really good...when he throws the ball it's magnificent...but he's nowhere near Peyton or Tom. He's closer to Phillip Rivers then he's ever been to Peyton Manning. Time to face the facts.

[Three7s]

I wonder why they are behind in the 4th quarter so much?

I would venture he also has a metric shit ton of 4th quarter losses as well. More than his comebacks.

They are basically a .500 team his entire career so why does it matter he has so many 4th quarter comebacks when he has so many losses and contributes to the hole they are in anyway?

The number one goal should be to not get behind in the 4th quarter because you are going to lose more than you win, even if you do pull it out of your ass on occasion.
To extend on this point, Romo threw a pick 6 against the Rams and put them in an early hole, when clearly, he had another option available right over the middle of the field. Romo, somehow, was able to overcome that and beat the Rams, but fact of the matter is, if he would just stop being brain-dead at certain points of the game, he and his team would fare a lot better. Hell, that game against the Rams was kind of microcosm of Romo's entire career with the Cowboys.

[Mennonite]

2010 post-season is all you need to know about Aaron Rodgers.


The Packers were very good on both sides of the ball that year.


The Packers offense ranked ninth in yards per game, tenth in total points, & fifth in passing yards. The defense ranked fifth in yards allowed and finished second in least amount of points allowed (240, second best in team history), sacks (47), and interceptions (24).

The Packers never lost a game by more than four points, and never trailed by more than seven the entire season, becoming the only team since the AFL-NFL merger in 1970 to accomplish this. All six of their regular season losses were by a combined 20 points.


http://i.imgur.com/CIm2aXl.png

http://i.imgur.com/JE1ZfuR.png




I still think Rodgers is one of the best qbs in the league.

[L.A. Chieffan]

Peyton Manning might be the most overrated QB of all time

[lcarus]

I feel like Aaron Rodgers isn't the same guy now that he doesn't have Driver, Jennings, and Finley. He's still good obviously

[the Talking Can]

no


/end thread

[Titty Meat]

There's a huge difference in being #4 in YPA and #29.

That is the difference between Russell and Alex.

Russell Wilson had a higher percentage of his passes completed over 20 yards than anyone else in the NFL last year.

Alex...well...ha!

If Alex Smith had an arm he would be Russell Wilson.

[Hammock Parties]

If Alex Smith had an arm he would be Russell Wilson.

And if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a wagon.

[In58men]

JFC at the people trying to make a case for Alex Smith being similar to Russell Wilson.


Please just stop. Just makes our fan base look stupid.

[the Talking Can]

chiefs hate QBs that win superbowls


and love broke dick cast off never was accomplished nothing vets to death

[Setsuna]

I wouldn't say grossly but a bit overrated yes.

[jd1020]

If you take away Rodgers' 2010 postseason...is he even better than Phillip Rivers? I'm being serious. Rodgers is really, really good...when he throws the ball it's magnificent...but he's nowhere near Peyton or Tom. He's closer to Phillip Rivers then he's ever been to Peyton Manning. Time to face the facts.

Solid argument.

"If you take everything away from someone that makes them superior, are they still superior to someone that is currently inferior?"

[saphojunkie]

Stupid OP attracts stupid replies. Color me shocked.

Rodgers is beast.

/thread.

[BigMeatballDave]

And if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a wagon.

LMAO

[saphojunkie]

If you take away her flawless figure, perfect face and glorious tits, is that model really that much hotter than my girlfriend?

[Mennonite]

Peyton Manning might be the most overrated QB of all time


Just so we are clear here: you are saying that Denver getting Peyton Manning guarantees that KC will win the West for the next 3 years?

matt cassell says what?


before this i was actually a little worried about tebow being in the west. now with this charade i can definitively say Cassell is the best starting QB in the division


........

[Hootie]

People have watched Rodgers this year and have concluded he's played well?

[BigMeatballDave]

If you take away Rodgers' 2010 postseason...is he even better than Phillip Rivers? I'm being serious. Rodgers is really, really good...when he throws the ball it's magnificent...but he's nowhere near Peyton or Tom. He's closer to Phillip Rivers then he's ever been to Peyton Manning. Time to face the facts.Okay, let's take away Peyton's only SB win. :)

[BigMeatballDave]

People have watched Rodgers this year and have concluded he's played well?

So far, his numbers are similar to Peyton's this season.

[jd1020]

People have watched Rodgers this year and have concluded he's played well?

Career numbers for Rodgers and Rivers in games they've started:

yrds/game:

251 vs 273

tds/game:

1.74 vs 2.13

ints/game:

.8 vs .58

Which column would you rather have?

[cosmo20002]

Every QB ever is overrated and/or sucks. Any QB considered good is just lucky or the refs have rigged the game for him.

/most of CP

[In58men]

chiefs hate QBs that win superbowls


and love broke dick cast off never was accomplished nothing vets to death

It's really sad.

[MagicHef]

Here are the QBs that have been mentioned so far in this thread, points allowed by defense is the X axis, win % is the Y axis:

http://i.imgbox.com/R1Ns83oB.png

[Hammock Parties]

Dan Marino only had one great playoff run. Other than that he never won more than a single playoff game.

In fact, when Marino was Rodgers' age he had five playoff wins to Rodgers' six.

DAN MARINO IS GROSSLY OVERRATED.

[MagicHef]

Here are the QBs that have been mentioned so far in this thread, points allowed by defense is the X axis, win % is the Y axis:

http://i.imgbox.com/R1Ns83oB.png

Most QBs are contained in the same band, Peyton consitantly at the top, Alex solely occupying the bottom.

Wilson is at the top with Peyton until he hits a wall at 24 points.

Rivers and Manning both get weird bumps at the end where they've won shootouts.

[Mennonite]

And if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a wagon.


http://i.imgur.com/4MnjQAm.jpg

[Saul Good]

Colin Cowherd is discussing this exact topic right now.

[Hammock Parties]

Colin Cowherd is discussing this exact topic right now.

Just tweeted the Marino info to him.:)

[Hootie]

Look, I like Rodgers. He's very good. I'm just not sure he's hall of fame good...and I'm not quite sure how he's THAT much better than Tony Romo. I do think he's a bit better, no doubt...but he's closer to Romo than he is to Manning and that's without question.

[Hootie]

I did say this before the season, as well...and I also pointed out his tendency to hold the ball to long and the too many sacks...Which he's been especially bad at this year...

And that 4th and 5 pass to Jordy was awful.

The packers need to be a no huddle, 90% of the time type of team...that's on McCarthy, though

[Hammock Parties]

Look, I like Rodgers. He's very good. I'm just not sure he's hall of fame good...and I'm not quite sure how he's THAT much better than Tony Romo. I do think he's a bit better, no doubt...but he's closer to Romo than he is to Manning and that's without question.

When Manning was Rodgers' age, he had seven playoff wins and one great playoff run.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Rodgers is about 10-20% overrated. He's still one of the top guys you'd want to build a franchise around, though, and he's significantly better than Tony Romo. I agree that he gets too much of a benefit of the doubt for the first five playoff games of his career, but he's still a great player.

Also, for as much as people praise his weapons, what have they done once they left GB?

I would bet that Rodgers would trade his OL, Nelson, Cobb and Eddie Lacy for Dez Bryant, Witten, Dallas' OL, and DeMarco Murray in a heartbeat

[Hootie]

I think great QBs make adequate to below average lines look just fine. Peyton did it his whole career.

Rodgers is a CP darling, and gets every excuse. His statistic in close games is atrocious, and the sample size suggests it's just not some simple anomaly.

He's a top 5 NFL QB, imo...but honestly, he's closer to the Rivers/Romo tier than the Brady/Manning tier (and I'm talking Brady in his prime)

2010 was a long time ago.

[Hootie]

When Manning was Rodgers' age, he had seven playoff wins and one great playoff run.
and Peyton Manning gets all the grief in the world...

Aaron Rodgers is, and has proven to be, a much bigger "choker" than Peyton Manning yet no one wants to say it...

I'm here to ask why?

[BigMeatballDave]

2010 was a long time ago.

When did Peyton win that SB again?

[BigMeatballDave]

MAYBE, you could argue overrated, but GROSSLY?

LMAO

[MagicHef]

When Manning was Rodgers' age, he had seven playoff wins and one great playoff run.

When Brees was Rodgers' age, he had one playoff win.

[Hootie]

When did Peyton win that SB again?
Rodgers last won a playoff game when ... ?

[Mennonite]

MAYBE, you could argue overrated, but GROSSLY?

LMAO


How about "ᵍʳᵒˢˢᶫʸ"?

[Mr. Laz]

I feel like his O-line has been plagued with injuries and has been generally shitty the last 2 years.

It's like anything else. Give him the Niners or Seahawks defense, and watch what happens.

+GB hasn't had a run game in over a decade

Wait a minute ... Oline,Defense and Running game are ABSOLUTE no excuse for less than stellar QB play. That's is a CP commandment along with anytime a WR drops the ball it's the QB's fault.

[Hammock Parties]

When Brees was Rodgers' age, he had one playoff win.

Game, set, match.

Shut the fuck up Hootie.

[Hammock Parties]

DREW BREES IS GROSSLY OVERRATED

[Mennonite]

I think Brees is a bit overrated. He has a ring and great stats, but his teams missed the playoffs entirely several times. Other than the SB run I don't think his teams have made much noise when they actually make the playoffs either. He's made it to the NFC Championship game just once in 13 years. By comparison, Brady has been to 8 AFC Championship games and 5 SBs in a similar number of seasons.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

You know who's rated right about where he belongs?

That's right.

[Hootie]

DREW BREES IS GROSSLY OVERRATED
I think Brees, indeed, is overrated. I think he's really good, but definitely, again, not in the elite Manning/Brady tier.

[Hootie]

...and let's not forget, Rodgers took over a team Favre was one freaking Favre away from taking to the Super Bowl

[Mennonite]

I wonder what would have happened if the Packers had gotten Randy Moss like Favre wanted.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2869070

If the Packers hadn't spent the first round pick on Rodgers, and had picked up Randy Moss in 07 - would they have won more Super Bowls with Favre?

[Red Dawg]

Brees and Rogers overrated? Hell no.

[O.city]

Overrated? Sure a little.

Not much

[Discuss Thrower]

Rodgers transforms pretty much any time in the NFL into a playoff contender.

Except maybe Tampa Bay.

[Pepe Silvia]

2 reasons for the decline:

1. Putrid O-line

2. Dana Carvey and Kevin Nealon.

[Marcellus]

Rodgers transforms pretty much any time in the NFL into a playoff contender.

Except maybe Tampa Bay.

Or the Packers this year.

[Halfcan]

I think Brees, indeed, is overrated. I think he's really good, but definitely, again, not in the elite Manning/Brady tier.

Brees has more 5000 yard seasons than either of them. He is hardly over rated.

[Kaepernick]

Aaron Rodgers is the best Quarterback in football. Put him on the Seahawks and watch what would happen.

You sound like casual fans do, giving the QB too much credit for wins and too much blame for losses.

An elite QB can put the team on his back and make a difference turning some losses to wins. He can't turn water into wine. I thought you knew the difference.

[sedated]

...and let's not forget, Rodgers took over a team Favre was one freaking Favre away from taking to the Super Bowl

Lol, yeah just missing that arguably greatest QB ever.

[sedated]

Aaron Rodgers is the best Quarterback in football. Put him on the Seahawks and watch what would happen.

Win the super bowl?

The lowly Seahawks?

[Kaepernick]

Win the super bowl?

The lowly Seahawks?

Well he is the one who said he would take Wilson over Rodgers, not me.

[Kaepernick]

+GB hasn't had a run game in over a decade



Bad running game and worse defense.

Green Bay has the 28th ranked scoring defense in the NFL and are dead last at stopping the run.


http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/team-stat/scoring-defense-category


Maybe Rodgers should play nose guard since that is where the problem lies.

[Sandy Vagina]

Aaron Rodgers is the best Quarterback in football. Put him on the Seahawks and watch what would happen.

You sound like casual fans do, giving the QB too much credit for wins and too much blame for losses.

An elite QB can put the team on his back and make a difference turning some losses to wins. He can't turn water into wine. I thought you knew the difference.

That's just it though. You could put about 20 QBs on that Seahawks team and watch excellent results. Rodgers is a very good QB, no doubt. I don't think anyone should heavily debate that. But is he so great that he can overcome multiple team aspects of sucktitude? He can keep them looking respectable more times than not... but he can't make them great all by his lonesome.

This sounds familiar.

[DeathByArrows]

I think Brees, indeed, is overrated. I think he's really good, but definitely, again, not in the elite Manning/Brady tier.

Really, Hootie? I think the numbers tell a different story. Drew Brees is literally unstoppable throwing the football, his numbers are astronomical. He's obviously had the benefit of good receivers and a fantastic receiving tight end, but so have all the other great QBs in this league.

The only knock I have on Brees, and his ability compared to Rodgers/Manning/Brady are that he is pretty crappy on the road. His home numbers vs. his road numbers are pretty telling. I do think the dome has helped him tremendously.

[Hootie]

Lmao

I said Rodgers was overrated before the season started.

I actually watch the games...

He's really good...but I'd take Russell Wilson every time

[Deberg_1990]

Id still take him over Derrick Johnson

[Mav]

Lmao

I said Rodgers was overrated before the season started.

I actually watch the games...

He's really good...but I'd take Russell Wilson every time
I can agree with that. I think Russell Wilson is a top 5 qb right now.

[Baby Lee]

Rodgers amazes people [me included] with insanely accurate passes. This blinds people a bit to the metrics of his decision making and pressure performance.

Now if someone could do a Reeses Peanut Butter Cup commercial with Rodgers and Smith, you'd have another Montana.

You put your passing ability in my game management!!

[Deberg_1990]

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/skeptical-football-manning-vs-messi-and-andrew-luck-experiment/

I watched the entire GB/Det game and I must say...Rodgers has not gotten better at getting rid of the ball. He's got a lot of Alex Smith in him in that regard. He takes a TON of unnecessary sacks. It's bothersome. He also missed a wide open Jordy Nelson when trying to come back on 4th and 5 with a terrible pass 3 yards behind him in a clean pocket...

He's had 1 good playoff run. So has Joe Flacco.

Why does everyone think he's the best QB in the NFL?

I think he's top 5, certainly. But I also don't understand how Tony Romo is a choker, but Aaron Rodgers is not?

I have been grossly unimpressed with Rodgers this year...and in all honesty, the last few postseasons...super meh.

I've said this for a few years now, but...I'd take Russell Wilson over Aaron Rodgers and at this point, I don't even think it's close.

Also, Rodgers is nowhere near Peyton Manning (obvi) or IN HIS PRIME Tom Brady, let's be honest.

I can agree with that. I think Russell Wilson is a top 5 qb right now.


I sort of go back and forth on Wilson. He's a lot like Joe Montana. Meaning he's sneaky good. His stats don't blow you our of the water but his intangibles are off the charts. Rarely makes a bad play.

[splatbass]

2 reasons for the decline:

1. Putrid O-line

2. Dana Carvey and Kevin Nealon.

ROFL

[mcaj22]

that GB team is putrid, and Dorsey comes from that tree like a fraud no different than Pioli with the Pats

Rodgers props up a really really bad roster, just like Brady does.

[jd1020]

Well he is the one who said he would take Wilson over Rodgers, not me.

I probably would too, given the whole age thing.

[MagicHef]

I like Wilson, I just can't get over the fact that his team is loaded at literally every position.

He's playing great, but I wouldn't be surprised if his play declines if talent leaves the Seahawks over the next few years.

[Hootie]

I think his play, numbers wise (which apparently is really all that matters to CP) will vastly improve, in all honesty

[Mennonite]

I like Wilson, I just can't get over the fact that his team is loaded at literally every position.

He's playing great, but I wouldn't be surprised if his play declines if talent leaves the Seahawks over the next few years.

You would really have to be awful to fuck up with all of the advantages he has. Historic defense, good coach, Lynch as his running back, Percy Harvin, best home field advantage in the NFL - hell even their punter is good.

[Hootie]

Lmao

I'm not in the mood to even argue tonight

[SAUTO]

And if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a wagon.

Or a roller skate.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Chiefshrink]

I feel like his O-line has been plagued with injuries and has been generally shitty the last 2 years.

No absolutely not and this.

[MagicHef]

Lmao

I'm not in the mood to even argue tonight

Argue what? That the Seahawks aren't extremely talented?

[BigMeatballDave]

that GB team is putrid, and Dorsey comes from that tree like a fraud no different than Pioli with the Pats

Rodgers props up a really really bad roster, just like Brady does.

LMAO Absolutely horseshit.

Why can't you fuckers talk about football without pushing your agenda.

Dorsey is a rather large question mark for the Chiefs right now, but let's not pretend he was the sole reason for whatever issues GB may have with their roster.

You just cannot move past Pioli, can you?

And comparing Dorsey to Pioli at this point is fucking stupid.

[OldSchool]

that GB team is putrid, and Dorsey comes from that tree like a fraud no different than Pioli with the Pats

Rodgers props up a really really bad roster, just like Brady does.

GB is not a bad roster.

They are better than us everywhere offensively except for the RB position, though Lacy is a very good young back, and TE, Kelce gives us the advantage.

They are an above average roster offensively and should have more than enough weapons for a top QB like Rodgers to put up a lot of points on a consistent basis.

Defensively, they are no worse off than we are and actually have a superior secondary to us. It just seems like the time has passed Capers by.

[Easy 6]

There probably isnt one personnel man in the NFL who'd take Wilson over Rodgers, mentality/football IQ wise he's just as good IMO... but the physical talent puts Rodgers over the top.

[beach tribe]

This is the QB that the consensus of this board used as a prime example of how a QB makes an O-line look good.
Not the other way around.

QBs have good Games and Bad games.

Nobody was dreaming up this thread after week 2 were they?



And No. Rodgers is not the least bot overrated.

[beach tribe]

There probably isnt one personnel man in the NFL who'd take Wilson over Rodgers, mentality/football IQ wise he's just as good IMO... but the physical talent puts Rodgers over the top.

Not a Single one.

And Neither would I.

[beach tribe]

Brees has more 5000 yard seasons than either of them. He is hardly over rated.

Now Brees is overrated??

Jesus Facepalming Chrysler.

You put Brees, or Rodgers in Seattle they may not lose a game till 2017.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

that GB team is putrid, and Dorsey comes from that tree like a fraud no different than Pioli with the Pats

Rodgers props up a really really bad roster, just like Brady does.

Ooh! I like this angle!

[BigMeatballDave]

Ooh! I like this angle!

It's so easy to see who the weak are around this place.

Boo fucking hoo.

Things don't go my way, so I become a Snarky bitch and a fucking wet Blanket for the entire forum.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

It's so easy to see who the weak are around this place.

Boo fucking hoo.

Things don't go my way, so I become a Snarky bitch and a fucking wet Blanket for the entire forum.

Oooh! LC's claws are out! RRREAOW!

[WhiteWhale]

and Peyton Manning gets all the grief in the world...

Aaron Rodgers is, and has proven to be, a much bigger "choker" than Peyton Manning yet no one wants to say it...

I'm here to ask why?

The reason Manning is considered a choker is because most of the PO losses result directly from him being a worse player in the playoffs than he is in the regular season.

Aaron Rogers has never led his offense to less than 20 points in a playoff game.

Of Peyton Manning's 12 playoff losses the offense has failed to score 20 points in 10 of those games. Three of those the offenses failed to score 10 points. One time he got his ass shut out. In almost every case the offense was loaded with talent at every offensive position.

That's why he's considered a 'choker'. Most playoff losses suffered by Manning's teams are a direct result of sub-par performances from the offense and Manning himself. It's not that he's a terrible playoff QB, it's that one can demonstrate that he's simply worse in the post season than he is in the regular season.

[BigMeatballDave]

Oooh! LC's claws are out! RRREAOW!

You're an infant

[Kaepernick]

Now Brees is overrated??

Jesus Facepalming Chrysler.

You put Brees, or Rodgers in Seattle they may not lose a game till 2017.

Seriously?

Who are these mental cases saying Brees and Rodgers are overrated. What's next? Calvin Johnson and Jamaal Charles are overrated?

[Kaepernick]

The reason Manning is considered a choker is because most of the PO losses result directly from him being a worse player in the playoffs than he is in the regular season.

Aaron Rogers has never led his offense to less than 20 points in a playoff game.

Of Peyton Manning's 12 playoff losses the offense has failed to score 20 points in 10 of those games. Three of those the offenses failed to score 10 points. One time he got his ass shut out. In almost every case the offense was loaded with talent at every offensive position.

That's why he's considered a 'choker'. Most playoff losses suffered by Manning's teams are a direct result of sub-par performances from the offense and Manning himself. It's not that he's a terrible playoff QB, it's that one can demonstrate that he's simply worse in the post season than he is in the regular season.

Man, this myth of Brady and Manning being chokers in the playoffs is just absurd.

You are generally playing some of the best defenses in football in the playoffs. It is often an entirely different level of defense than you've seen all season and in the Super Bowl, it may be the best defense you've played all year.

As usual, people giving too much credit to the QB for wins and assigning too much blame for the QB for losses.

These elite QBs can put teams on their backs relative to the mere mortals like Alex. It doesn't mean they can turn water to wine.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Now Brees is overrated??

Jesus Facepalming Chrysler.

You put Brees, or Rodgers in Seattle they may not lose a game till 2017.

ROFL That is GLORIOUS.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

It's so easy to see who the weak are around this place.

Boo fucking hoo.

Things don't go my way, so I become a Snarky bitch and a fucking wet Blanket for the entire forum.

Now, now. Your team is the Chiefs. I'd develop an even broader sense of humor and hang on to that bitch.

You WILL need it.

[Mennonite]

It doesn't mean they can turn water to wine.

O ye of little faith

http://i.imgur.com/rWByWjL.jpg

[milkman]

Man, this myth of Brady and Manning being chokers in the playoffs is just absurd.

You are generally playing some of the best defenses in football in the playoffs. It is often an entirely different level of defense than you've seen all season and in the Super Bowl, it may be the best defense you've played all year.

As usual, people giving too much credit to the QB for wins and assigning too much blame for the QB for losses.

These elite QBs can put teams on their backs relative to the mere mortals like Alex. It doesn't mean they can turn water to wine.

There isn't a single great QB who has failed to deliver when it matters most than Peyton Manning.

That, my dumbass friend, is choking

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

There isn't a single great QB who has failed to deliver when it matters most than Peyton Manning.

That, my dumbass friend, is choking

LMAO

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/attachment.php?attachmentid=108041&stc=1&d=1411607202

[chiefzilla1501]

JFC, why does every single QB evaluation have to bring it back to Alex Smith?

I don't think Hootie talking about Rodgers has ANYTHING to do with Alex Smith. Saying Aaron Rodgers is overrated doesn't somehow put Alex Smith on even close to the same level. Even if Aaron Rodgers is overrated, think everyone would agree he's still in the elite tier whereas Alex Smith is in a lower tier (I'd put him as third tier, and his fans would put him in the second tier). In either case, Rodgers is still in a higher tier than Smith.

No matter how accurate he is and how strong his arm is, his record of closing games is still unbelievably stunningly low in comparison to other elite QBs.

[OldSchool]

JFC, why does every single QB evaluation have to bring it back to Alex Smith?

I don't think Hootie talking about Rodgers has ANYTHING to do with Alex Smith. Saying Aaron Rodgers is overrated doesn't somehow put Alex Smith on even close to the same level. Even if Aaron Rodgers is overrated, think everyone would agree he's still in the elite tier whereas Alex Smith is in a lower tier (I'd put him as third tier, and his fans would put him in the second tier). In either case, Rodgers is still in a higher tier than Smith.

No matter how accurate he is and how strong his arm is, his record of closing games is still unbelievably stunningly low in comparison to other elite QBs.
Translation: Aaron Rodgers is great for Fantasy Football, not the best when you actually need to win a game.

To be honest, ever since he got paid, games where he looks erratic as a passer have increased in number. I haven't seen him consistently make the same throws to Jordy Nelson that he used to be money on before he turned 30 (going to be 31 this year).

In back to back playoff appearances, Rodgers has missed multiple throws that he would typically make during the regular season. He used to be able to routinely drop the ball into the hands of his receiver on back-shoulder passes, even with a DB playing pretty tight coverage. I haven't seen him making those throws anywhere near as consistently as he did just a couple of years ago.

[DaNewGuy]

He pretty overrated, Packers should just cut the dead weight now, Maybe we can trade Chase Daniel for Rodgers?

[Jimmya]

Its still a long season. Plenty of time for all quarterbacks to show their value.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Its still a long season. Plenty of time for all quarterbacks to show their value.

And in some cases, the complete lack thereof.

[chiefzilla1501]

Translation: Aaron Rodgers is great for Fantasy Football, not the best when you actually need to win a game.

To be honest, ever since he got paid, games where he looks erratic as a passer have increased in number. I haven't seen him consistently make the same throws to Jordy Nelson that he used to be money on before he turned 30 (going to be 31 this year).

In back to back playoff appearances, Rodgers has missed multiple throws that he would typically make during the regular season. He used to be able to routinely drop the ball into the hands of his receiver on back-shoulder passes, even with a DB playing pretty tight coverage. I haven't seen him making those throws anywhere near as consistently as he did just a couple of years ago.
Agree he's not as effective but still really damn good and still in that elite bucket.

But if we are talking about the best... I'm tough on Peyton because he hasn't been a great playoff closer, but Rodgers has been bad at closing both in the regular season and the playoffs. If I'm comparing the best to the best, that's where I see Rodgers as being overrated. He's among the best but until he can consistently play well in close games, he shouldn't be considered the best which many think he is.

[Molitoth]

WINS AND LOSSES ARE A TEAM STAT


Is Barry Sanders NOT a top 3 RB of all time because he never got a ring?

Peyton Manning changed the game. No matter how much people hate him due to rivalry, over-endorsement, playoff record, or whatever the case... he is still one of the top 3 QB's of ALL TIME.

[Mama Hip Rockets]

Bump

[Rausch]

Peyton Manning changed the game. No matter how much people hate him due to rivalry, over-endorsement, playoff record, or whatever the case... he is still one of the top 3 QB's of ALL TIME.

No, he's not.

While you can argue guys like Barry Sanders or Terrel Davis or Kurt Warner deserve consideration they all upped their game.

Manning's numbers in the post season are ALL down. He plays worse when the games matter most.

His TD's, Int's, yardage, completion percentage, all are below his regular season averages. He sucks, hard, in big games...

[Just Passin' By]

Peyton Manning changed the game. No matter how much people hate him due to rivalry, over-endorsement, playoff record, or whatever the case... he is still one of the top 3 QB's of ALL TIME.


Manning's borderline top 10. There's no way in hell he's in the top 3.

[vailpass]

Manning's borderline top 10. There's no way in hell he's in the top 3.

Montana, Elway, then the rest. So hard to say who's top ten. Manning is as cerebral as any though...

[Rausch]

Montana, Elway, then the rest. So hard to say who's top ten. Manning is as cerebral as any though...

Until the playoffs.

His own brother is a better playoff QB and he's no HOF player...

[vailpass]

Until the playoffs.

His own brother is a better playoff QB and he's no HOF player...

Valid critique. Would be more damning if he didn't have a ring.

[Rausch]

Valid critique. Would be more damning if he didn't have a ring.

How many passing attempts did Manning have vs the Bears in that SB?...

[Eleazar]

22/28 300 yards 4 TD 0 INT for Mr. Overrated today

[vailpass]

How many passing attempts did Manning have vs the Bears in that SB?...

I hear you but it cuts both ways. If a qb is blamed for losing a playoff game he gets credit for winning one...

[BigMeatballDave]

Peyton is the Schottenheimer of regular season.

[Rasputin]

Rodgers > Manning if I was to pick for my team.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Rodgers > Manning if I was to pick for my team.

Can't argue it. When it's go-time, he goes.

[Hootie]

I never said Rodgers wasn't a good QB...he's definitely a top 5 NFL QB. My point was I didn't understand why he gets a free pass for having such a terrible record in close games. Isn't that how CP defines how good a QB is? Because that's why Peyton Manning, according to someone a few posts ago, isn't a top 10 NFL QB of all-time (hysterical, by the way).

I mean, Rodgers' record is MISERABLE in close games. Really, really, really bad. I don't feel like looking it up, but the sample size is alarming. It's not some coincidental stat.

And as for Peyton Manning and his 1 Super Bowl...

It's really quite hilarious that he doesn't get credit for how well he played in that Super Bowl.

First off, the Bears made the Super Bowl, with Rex Grossman...because why? Because, outside of the 2000 Ravens, that was the best defense of the last 15 fucking years. It was amazing. It was unbelievable. It literally led them to a Super Bowl with Rex fucking Grossman.

Peyton Manning literally kept the Colts on the field for 39 minutes that game and was very efficient...you know, against the 2nd best defense of the last two decades.

Not only that...

But in that postseason...he beat Tom Brady in the AFC Championship Game after his team was trailing 21-3.

21-3.

Against Tom Brady.

NOT QUITE SURE HOW THAT'S CHOKING

...

and then he beat the vaunted Bears defense after, again, quickly falling down 10-0 in that game...

and he literally had a fantastic game against a fantastic defense

so you guys are simply a bunch of fucking morons when it comes to Peyton Manning

Peyton Manning is certainly a top 3 NFL QB of all time. He's certainly higher than Tom Brady (probably top 5 as well).

and, again...

HE IS NOT ANY MORE CLUTCH OR LESS CLUTCH THAN TOM BRADY. THE SAME TOM BRADY EVERYONE ON THIS BOARD PARADES AS A CLUTCH QB.

and both Tom Brady and Peyton Manning have had more clutch postseason wins than Aaron Rodgers to this date.

and I still think the best game Aaron Rodgers ever played in the postseason was the first one he played, which he lost, to Arizona and Kurt Warner.

[Hootie]

I mean, it's HYSTERICAL how people on CHIEFSPLANET.COM view Peyton Manning. All of the envy and hate clouds judgment to the point of people posting he's not a top 10 NFL QB of all-time.

It's HILARIOUS.

[Hootie]

and everyone always talks about INTERCEPTIONS taken by QBs

but no one ever brings up sacks...and, honestly speaking, sacks, while not as bad as an INT, are literal DRIVE KILLERS.

Aaron Rodgers has ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS held the ball too long and thus, has always taken FAR TOO MANY sacks. His greatest asset (big plays) is also his biggest weakness (always looking for big plays)...and it hurts his team.

I think it's really funny when everyone says "Green Bay has a terrible line!" Well, he'd make a really good line look a lot fucking worse because he has a terrible habit of holding the ball FAR too long. It's a flaw. He's a great QB with a bad flaw. Most QB's are going to have flaws...Rodgers has a lot fewer than many.

Peyton Manning, since 2003, has taken anywhere between 10 - 21 sacks total, all year long...

AARON RODGERS HAS TAKEN OVER 50 FUCKING SACKS TWICE, TWICE...AND LED THE LEAGUE BOTH TIMES.

Ok, I'm sorry. That doesn't show up on the amazing stat sheet...but it KILLS drives.

You can't sit here and say, "oh!! that's because his line sucked!"

Bull fucking shit. Peyton Manning hasn't had ALL-PRO LINES for the last 12 years of his career. He makes his lines look good because he is decisive, makes quick reads, and makes the right football play 9 times out of 10. They lost Clady last year, had an UDFA take over, and he took less sacks in 2013 than he did in 2012.

Sacks are drive killers. Rodgers will never be on Peyton's level until he stops taking sacks at that high of a rate.

[SAUTO]

Sacks show up on the stat page, you just have to look in their column.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Sacks show up on the stat page, you just have to look in their column.

You just HAD to do that, didn't you.

[SAUTO]

You just HAD to do that, didn't you.

It's my job around here, ask george

[Hootie]

In comparison, Brady takes about 30 per year. To Manning's 15. And Rodgers' 40.

I mean, people are going to scoff at it...but how many times do you see teams convert 2nd and 20? Or 3rd and 15?

How many drives per game does an offense get?

Rodgers, from a mechanics standpoint, is UNBELIEVABLE. Best ever. He'll never TRULY BE ELITE until he stops taking THAT MANY sacks.

I think he can take that step...but he has to take it before I'll stop considering him to be overrated.

Again, he's great. He's just not as great as CP thinks he is.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

It's my job around here, ask george

LMAO

[-King-]

Manning during his superbowl run:

61% completion
259 yards per game
0.75 TDs per game
1.75 INTs per game
68.1 passer rating


I mean, that post season run was average AT BEST. He got out of the first two games by pure luck. He was flat out TERRIBLE in those games.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Manning during his superbowl run:

61% completion
259 yards per game
0.75 TDs per game
1.75 INTs per game
68.1 passer rating


I mean, that post season run was average AT BEST. He got out of the first two games by pure luck. He was flat out TERRIBLE in those games.

The bright lights don't agree with him.

[Baby Lee]

In comparison, Brady takes about 30 per year. To Manning's 15. And Rodgers' 40.

I mean, people are going to scoff at it...but how many times do you see teams convert 2nd and 20? Or 3rd and 15?

How many drives per game does an offense get?

Rodgers, from a mechanics standpoint, is UNBELIEVABLE. Best ever. He'll never TRULY BE ELITE until he stops taking THAT MANY sacks.

I think he can take that step...but he has to take it before I'll stop considering him to be overrated.

Again, he's great. He's just not as great as CP thinks he is.

Hootie's Rodgers thread is stealth Manning slurping thread.

Color me surprised.

[Hootie]

Manning during his superbowl run:

61% completion
259 yards per game
0.75 TDs per game
1.75 INTs per game
68.1 passer rating


I mean, that post season run was average AT BEST. He got out of the first two games by pure luck. He was flat out TERRIBLE in those games.

Unfortunately, King...I watch the games.

He brought them back down 21-3 against the Patriots and TOM BRADY in that AFC Championship Game (the same game that ended on a Tom Brady INT, how clutch!!)

and he played a very good game against the Bears and a truly elite Bears defense. Tremendously efficient.

I don't give a flying fuck about numbers...I watch the games. It's why I don't watch Russell Wilson and then think, "oh gee...he's not that good because his numbers aren't super flashy!"

any football fan that truly thinks Aaron Rodgers is better than Peyton Manning is a fool. That is fact. It's not up for debate.

[GoChargers]

Fivehead is a choker and a loser, get over it.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Manning won't be going back to the Super Bowl this year.

[Hootie]

hmm

Rivers, who I defend, is thought of in the same manner...

but, of course, he's never been good enough to put them in a situation big enough to really show off his choking and losing abilities

[Hootie]

Manning won't be going back to the Super Bowl this year.

Ha

who exactly in the AFC is going to beat him?

Denver is still going to win a minimum of 13 games this year.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Ha

who exactly in the AFC is going to beat him?

Denver is still going to win a minimum of 13 games this year.

John Fox.

He's like Colt 45. Works every time.

[milkman]

Unfortunately, King...I watch the games.

He brought them back down 21-3 against the Patriots and TOM BRADY in that AFC Championship Game (the same game that ended on a Tom Brady INT, how clutch!!)

and he played a very good game against the Bears and a truly elite Bears defense. Tremendously efficient.

I don't give a flying **** about numbers...I watch the games. It's why I don't watch Russell Wilson and then think, "oh gee...he's not that good because his numbers aren't super flashy!"

any football fan that truly thinks Aaron Rodgers is better than Peyton Manning is a fool. That is fact. It's not up for debate.

Like you, numbers mean jackc to me.

Peyton Manning had a horrible two games in the playoffs in that SB run.

He, for once in his post season career, finally engineered a comeback against a declining Patriot defense, a group that he couldn't perform against when they were at the top of their games.

His SB was efficient.

But the fact is, that Colt defense and running game stepped up like never before and carried Manning to that SB.

Manniing is the worst all time great in the clutch when it matters most, and that is the one fact that is really not up for debate.

[Hootie]

and that's been Manning's biggest problem in his career

his coaches have always fucking sucked

conservative fucking pussies

[milkman]

Ha

who exactly in the AFC is going to beat him?

Denver is still going to win a minimum of 13 games this year.

I think it depends on Andy Dalton.

[milkman]

and that's been Manning's biggest problem in his career

his coaches have always ****ing sucked

conservative ****ing pussies

Yeah, like Manning didn't dictate things on the field.

Tony Dungy was a fucking puppet.

[GoChargers]

hmm

Rivers, who I defend, is thought of in the same manner...

but, of course, he's never been good enough to put them in a situation big enough to really show off his choking and losing abilities

Rivers isn't slurped as the greatest of all time every single year and actually gets criticized for his playoff resume (unlike Fivehead, who gets every excuse made for him). Rivers is also responsible for two of Fivehead's biggest chokes.

[Hootie]

Like you, numbers mean jackc to me.

Peyton Manning had a horrible two games in the playoffs in that SB run.

He, for once in his post season career, finally engineered a comeback against a declining Patriot defense, a group that he couldn't perform against when they were at the top of their games.

His SB was efficient.

But the fact is, that Colt defense and running game stepped up like never before and carried Manning to that SB.

Manniing is the worst all time great in the clutch when it matters most, and that is the one fact that is really not up for debate.

I think there are a lot of factors that go into winning and losing football games...and when a team loses, I don't go all CP and just simply blame the QB.

Peyton has made some bad plays to lose important games, no doubt. No freaking doubt.

But he's not been any worse or any better than Tom Brady in the same situations...so I'm not sure why Peyton is a "choking loser" but Tom Brady is a "winner!"

It will never make any sense to me.

Thank God for Tom Terrific his kicker was Vinatieri and not Vanderjagt.

[milkman]

Rivers isn't slurped as the greatest of all time every single year and actually gets criticized for his playoff resume (unlike Fivehead, who gets every excuse made for him). Rivers is also responsible for two of Fivehead's biggest chokes.

Chargers defense, not Rivers.

[GoChargers]

and that's been Manning's biggest problem in his career

his coaches have always fucking sucked

conservative fucking pussies

Except Fivehead is a control freak who insists on calling all the plays from the LOS, so it's on him. Even then, he isn't the only QB to have to put up with shitty coaches.

[milkman]

I think there are a lot of factors that go into winning and losing football games...and when a team loses, I don't go all CP and just simply blame the QB.

Peyton has made some bad plays to lose important games, no doubt. No freaking doubt.

But he's not been any worse or any better than Tom Brady in the same situations...so I'm not sure why Peyton is a "choking loser" but Tom Brady is a "winner!"

It will never make any sense to me.

Thank God for Tom Terrific his kicker was Vinatieri and not Vanderjagt.

Tom Brady has gotten the Pats in FG range when they needed, but you're right, when they've needed TDs, he has failed deliver, always.

He, like Manning is overrated.

Just a question which is more overrated.

That's Manning.

[Hootie]

Peyton lost to the Chargers what...38-35? And you expect me to think he choked in a game where his team scored 35 points and he threw like 4 TDs? Yeah, ok.

Or like it was Peyton's fault when Rahim Moore made the worst defensive play I'll ever see in my life after Peyton engineered a go ahead TD drive late in that 4th quarter? Yeah, ok.

Not buying it. His pick in that OT was terrible, but it should have never gotten that far.

It's a game of inches. It really is. Peyton has been incredibly UNLUCKY in the postseason...which has contributed to his not so good playoff record much more than his "clutch" or "anti-clutch" factor.

[-King-]

Unfortunately, King...I watch the games.

He brought them back down 21-3 against the Patriots and TOM BRADY in that AFC Championship Game (the same game that ended on a Tom Brady INT, how clutch!!)

and he played a very good game against the Bears and a truly elite Bears defense. Tremendously efficient.

I don't give a flying fuck about numbers...I watch the games. It's why I don't watch Russell Wilson and then think, "oh gee...he's not that good because his numbers aren't super flashy!"

any football fan that truly thinks Aaron Rodgers is better than Peyton Manning is a fool. That is fact. It's not up for debate.
You can't compare Wilsons numbers which are good to those numbers I posted. There's literally no way to flip those numbers into "He was better than those numbers". What? Was he not throwing more picks than touchdowns? Was he not barely completing passes at a respectable percentage?

Yes, I agree with you. Numbers don't tell the whole story. But they do mean something. Manning threw a pick in every single game he played that post season. He completed less that 60% of his passes twice. There's no way to flip that. With Wilson, you can say that he's playing within an offense that asks him to be conservative and not try to do too much. Was Manning being asked to play terrible?

[Hootie]

I'm 29 years old. I can't comment on Joe Montana or Terry Bradshaw etc etc etc

but there is no way I'm ever going to buy that Tom Brady is a better QB than Peyton Manning

They are 1 and 2, no doubt. There is a GIGANTIC gap between those 2 and #3. Peyton is certainly the best I've ever seen and I just don't understand how anyone could think, honestly, that Tom Brady is a better QB than Peyton Manning.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Peyton lost to the Chargers what...38-35? And you expect me to think he choked in a game where his team scored 35 points and he threw like 4 TDs? Yeah, ok.

Or like it was Peyton's fault when Rahim Moore made the worst defensive play I'll ever see in my life after Peyton engineered a go ahead TD drive late in that 4th quarter? Yeah, ok.

Not buying it. His pick in that OT was terrible, but it should have never gotten that far.

It's a game of inches. It really is. Peyton has been incredibly UNLUCKY in the postseason...which has contributed to his not so good playoff record much more than his "clutch" or "anti-clutch" factor.

Hootie just nailed the entire NFL cliche -thread in one fell swoop!

[milkman]

Peyton lost to the Chargers what...38-35? And you expect me to think he choked in a game where his team scored 35 points and he threw like 4 TDs? Yeah, ok.

Or like it was Peyton's fault when Rahim Moore made the worst defensive play I'll ever see in my life after Peyton engineered a go ahead TD drive late in that 4th quarter? Yeah, ok.

Not buying it. His pick in that OT was terrible, but it should have never gotten that far.

It's a game of inches. It really is. Peyton has been incredibly UNLUCKY in the postseason...which has contributed to his not so good playoff record much more than his "clutch" or "anti-clutch" factor.

There's always a little luck involved, but when you consistently choke, luck is just an excuse to fall back on for consistently failing.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

People have said that Alex Smith is "good enough to break your heart". What does that make Manning?

[GoChargers]

There's always a little luck involved, but when you consistently choke, luck is just an excuse to fall back on for consistently failing.

Additionally, Fivehead falls apart mentally and starts throwing ducks and picks the minute things don't go exactly the way he planned, which is not a good quality to have in a sport where randomness plays a significant role in winning and losing.

[Hootie]

what does throwing TDs have to do with anything?

So Peyton is a better QB when he throws a 1 yard TD pass instead of letting Joseph Addai run it in?

Peyton played bad against KC in a game that, AND BE HONEST WITH YOURSELF, there was never a point where it looked like KC was ever going to win...

he threw a few lousy picks to Ty Law...but that game was literally played by Indy like a team protecting a 4th quarter lead the entire time...we didn't pick up a 1st down for almost 3 fucking quarters...

Numbers don't really mean shit when you're QB'ing a team that was literally never in position to lose that game. Not once.

I'd have to go look at who he played next (Jacksonville?) but I don't really care enough right now...

He put them in a hole against New England and THE GREATEST CLUTCH QB EVER!!!!!!!! and then he dug them out of said hole and then played an AMAZINGLY EFFICIENT SUPER BOWL GAME AGAINST AN AMAZING DEFENSE THAT WAS SO GOOD REX GROSSMAN WAS THEIR QB.

You can't fucking say things like "oh Peyton only won a Super Bowl because his teammates played super good!"

because it's a lie

[Ming the Merciless]

No.

[Rasputin]

Ha

who exactly in the AFC is going to beat him?

Denver is still going to win a minimum of 13 games this year.


I can see Bengals being a strong contender this year. I know I know it's the Bengals.

[Hootie]

There's always a little luck involved, but when you consistently choke, luck is just an excuse to fall back on for consistently failing.

Maybe.

But if this is the case, then Aaron Rodgers is GROSSLY overrated, no?

He loses close games at a historically bad clip. Why does no one notice and/or care?

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

I can see Bengals being a strong contender this year. I know I know it's the Bengals.

I never thought I'd see the day that Cincinnati could quietly put together a roster and make KC look irrelevant. Sad.

Browns are probably next.

[GoChargers]

I think there are a lot of factors that go into winning and losing football games...and when a team loses, I don't go all CP and just simply blame the QB.

Peyton has made some bad plays to lose important games, no doubt. No freaking doubt.

But he's not been any worse or any better than Tom Brady in the same situations...so I'm not sure why Peyton is a "choking loser" but Tom Brady is a "winner!"

It will never make any sense to me.

Thank God for Tom Terrific his kicker was Vinatieri and not Vanderjagt.
Why do Fivehead stans always deflect to Brady when cornered? It's such a poor argument for two reasons:

- There are other quarterbacks widely perceived to be on their level (Brees and Rodgers).

- A lot of Fivehead critics also feel that Brady has been extremely overrated post-Spygate (for instance, the 18-1 choke is even worse than anything Fivehead has ever pulled in his career). Personally, I would much rather have Rodgers than Brady or Fivehead. So bringing up Brady really doesn't have any effect on most people you're arguing with and is completely irrelevant.

[Hammock Parties]

How many QBs can do this? Ffffffuuuuuuuu overrated

http://i.imgur.com/MUbEpU7.gif

[Hootie]

so if Manning is a choker

Brady is a choker

then who is good? ChargersFan...who is a good NFL QB?

[Hootie]

How many QBs can do this? Ffffffuuuuuuuu overrated

http://i.imgur.com/MUbEpU7.gif

1.

Aaron Rodgers.

But that .gif is his biggest flaw. 8.5 times out of 10 that results in a sack. There is no reason for him to not throw that ball away, or make a quick read, or anything other than what he just did...

It just proves my point. He takes 40+ sacks per 16 games.

Peyton takes about 15.

So while Peyton can't make that play and score that TD...he'll just score it 8 plays later instead while making the right football plays instead of the wrong football plays (as pictured in said .gif)

[GoChargers]

Maybe.

But if this is the case, then Aaron Rodgers is GROSSLY overrated, no?

He loses close games at a historically bad clip. Why does no one notice and/or care?

He was pretty damn good in close games back in the 2010 playoffs, you know, the games that count the most.

[Hootie]

and not only that...but judging by the flag...it looks like the play didn't even count due to holding

He puts his lineman in terrible positions

and on top of that, he takes a nasty hit at the end...and the Packers aren't winning shit if he's not in the lineup

that's the film I bring up in the meeting room and tell him to stop doing

[Hootie]

He was pretty damn good in close games back in the 2010 playoffs, you know, the games that count the most.

so Joe Flacco is a good QB because he had 1 good postseason?

Joe Flacco = Aaron Rodgers

right?

[GoChargers]

So while Peyton can't make that play and score that TD...he'll just score it 8 plays later instead while making the right football plays instead of the wrong football plays (as pictured in said .gif)

Unless it's a playoff game, then he'll just do this:

http://www.refinedguy.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/amazing-chargers-interception.gif

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/000/266/024/TracyPorterSuperBowl_display_image.jpg?1277128063

http://usatthebiglead.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/manning-ot-pick-1-12-13.gif?w=600

http://cdn1.sbnation.com/assets/3948365/thebroncosaregoingtolosethesuperbowl.gif

[Rasputin]

I never thought I'd see the day that Cincinnati could quietly put together a roster and make KC look irrelevant. Sad.

Browns are probably next.


I'm not that surprised Marvin Lewis got things turned around. He had an agenda. One year he was bout to get fired and he stormed into the FO demanding new facilities and work out programs for his team to build strength and conditioning. He had balls to do that and they listened to the Coach.


I got more respect for Marvin Lewis in the league than a lot of coaches.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

LMAO at that last gif.

[-King-]

The colts were playing the game like they were protecting a 4th quarter lead, so it doesn't matter that Manning threw 3 picks. bootie logic.

And let's not forget that it was still a one score game going into the 4th quarter.
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[Sweet Daddy Hate]

I'm not that surprised Marvin Lewis got things turned around. He had an agenda. One year he was bout to get fired and he stormed into the FO demanding new facilities and work out programs for his team to build strength and conditioning. He had balls to do that and they listened to the Coach.


I got more respect for Marvin Lewis in the league than a lot of coaches.

I completely underestimated him.

[milkman]

I wonder about Rodgers in close games.

I am, as stated before, and many times previously not a numbers man, which is why I love Russel Wilson.

He's not a numbers guy.

He just makes plays when plays need to be made.

Not every single time, but on a consistent enough basis that I have confidence that he will make those plays.

[kcxiv]

Them Gif's of Manning were Terrible holy crap they were bad. lol

[Hootie]

so Peyton Manning shouldn't get any credit for the Super Bowl his team won because he played poorly in a game against the Chiefs in the postseason where his team was never really pressured by said opposition

ok

cool

GOT IT

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

so Peyton Manning shouldn't get any credit for the Super Bowl his team won because he played poorly in a game against the Chiefs in the postseason where his team was never really pressured by said opposition

ok

cool

GOT IT

Of course he should get some credit for winning a SB.

1500 years ago.

[Hootie]

Them Gif's of Manning were Terrible holy crap they were bad. lol

Yep.

Terrible.

Think you could probably find a few of those for any great NFL QB, though...don't you think?

Not to mention that one of those .gifs was directly from the Rahim Moore game...you know, the same game that he had won with a TD pass late in the 4th quarter

[Hootie]

Of course he should get some credit for winning a SB.

1500 years ago.

Ok so right now the only good QB's in the NFL are Russell Wilson and Joe Flacco.

Correct?

[milkman]

so Peyton Manning shouldn't get any credit for the Super Bowl his team won because he played poorly in a game against the Chiefs in the postseason where his team was never really pressured by said opposition

ok

cool

GOT IT

Regardless of your perception, he played a shitty fucking game against a shitty fucking team.

[Hootie]

the Chiefs haven't been to a Super Bowl in 40+ years

but Peyton Manning (been to 3) is terrible and Tom Brady (been to 5) isn't all that good, either

got it!

JOE FLACCO!!!!

[SAUTO]

Yep.

Terrible.

Think you could probably find a few of those for any great NFL QB, though...don't you think?

Not to mention that one of those .gifs was directly from the Rahim Moore game...you know, the same game that he had won with a TD pass late in the 4th quarter

You think every great qb has a few of those in playoff games? Late in playoff games mostly?

[milkman]

the Chiefs haven't been to a Super Bowl in 40+ years

but Peyton Manning (been to 3) is terrible and Tom Brady (been to 5) isn't all that good, either

got it!

JOE FLACCO!!!!

And here's that 7 year old girl twisting things and crying because she can't get her way.

[SAUTO]

And I think flacco sucks

[Hootie]

Regardless of your perception, he played a shitty ****ing game against a shitty ****ing team.

He ABSOLUTELY did.

Couldn't agree more.

Still not sure how that means he was bad against the Bears, or the Patriots the week before...

But if that means he doesn't get credit for winning a Super Bowl because of the Chiefs game then Tom Brady has won -1 Super Bowls because he didn't play the AFC Championship game the first one and I am not giving him credit for the other 2 because of Spygate.

So Tom has -1 Super Bowl wins to Peyton's 0.

Peyton still > Tom.

[Hootie]

I just want to know who a good QB is if Tom Brady and Peyton Manning are both choking losers.

[milkman]

He ABSOLUTELY did.

Couldn't agree more.

Still not sure how that means he was bad against the Bears, or the Patriots the week before...

But if that means he doesn't get credit for winning a Super Bowl because of the Chiefs game then Tom Brady has won -1 Super Bowls because he didn't play the AFC Championship game the first one and I am not giving him credit for the other 2 because of Spygate.

So Tom has -1 Super Bowl wins to Peyton's 0.

Peyton still > Tom.

You overrate his postseason efforts.

Calling the Bears defense one of the best 2 in the last 2 decades is either disingenuous or sheer stupidity.

He played a good game against a declining Pats defense and a solid Bears defense that played a scheme he eats alive.

[Hootie]

that Bears defense was the 2nd best defense since 2000

[milkman]

that Bears defense was the 2nd best defense since 2000

You're fucking high.

[Baby Lee]

He ABSOLUTELY did.

Couldn't agree more.

Still not sure how that means he was bad against the Bears, or the Patriots the week before...

But if that means he doesn't get credit for winning a Super Bowl because of the Chiefs game then Tom Brady has won -1 Super Bowls because he didn't play the AFC Championship game the first one and I am not giving him credit for the other 2 because of Spygate.

So Tom has -1 Super Bowl wins to Peyton's 0.

Peyton still > Tom.

Manning Manbag Pho now on the menu

http://ramenrun.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/img_9197.jpg

[GoChargers]

I just want to know who a good QB is if Tom Brady and Peyton Manning are both choking losers.

I just want to know how a QB with a sub-.500 playoff record is "clutch" and the GOAT.

[Hootie]

where have I said Manning is clutch?

Manning is just so good that envy turns into hate.

[GoChargers]

Not to mention that one of those .gifs was directly from the Rahim Moore game...you know, the same game that he had won with a TD pass late in the 4th quarter
Obviously he hadn't won it, because he lost the game.

[GoChargers]

where have I said Manning is clutch?

Manning is just so good that envy turns into hate.

Yes, we're all just so envious of his under .500 playoff record.

[Hootie]

I'm super envious of a guy who's played in 23 playoff games and 3 Super Bowls...

sure wish the chiefs had a choker like that

[Just Passin' By]

You overrate his postseason efforts.

Calling the Bears defense one of the best 2 in the last 2 decades is either disingenuous or sheer stupidity.

He played a good game against a declining Pats defense and a solid Bears defense that played a scheme he eats alive.

The Patriots defenders were all sick, which is why they faded so badly in the second half, and the officials had a huge impact on the game by calling a PI on Hobbs for face quarding, which was not illegal. Manning then faced Rex Grossman (Rex ****ing Grossman ROFL ) in the SB, which was clearly just the coronation game for either NE or IND after the AFCCG.

Manning's only SB win was practically gifted to him. It's not his fault that it broke that way, but it's the way it is.

[milkman]

The Patriots defenders were all sick, which is why they faded so badly in the second half, and the officials had a huge impact on the game by calling a PI on Hobbs for face quarding, which was not illegal. Manning then faced Rex Grossman (Rex ****ing Grossman ROFL ) in the SB, which was clearly just the coronation game for either NE or IND after the AFCCG.

Manning's only SB win was practically gifted to him.

Regardless of the QB on the other side, the Bears defense, while not nearly as good as Hootie paints them, were still pretty good.

He played a good, efficient game against them, and the Bears offense couldn't generate anything against a Colt defense that played better than they had ever played before, or since, that playoff run.

[Hootie]

The Patriots defenders were all sick, which is why they faded so badly in the second half, and the officials had a huge impact on the game by calling a PI on Hobbs for face quarding, which was not illegal. Manning then faced Rex Grossman (Rex ****ing Grossman ROFL ) in the SB, which was clearly just the coronation game for either NE or IND after the AFCCG.

Manning's only SB win was practically gifted to him. It's not his fault that it broke that way, but it's the way it is.

they were sick LMAO

good god

[Just Passin' By]

Regardless of the QB on the other side, the Bears defense, while not nearly as good as Hootie paints them, were still pretty good.

He played a good, efficient game against them, and the Bears offense couldn't generate anything against a Colt defense that played better than they had ever played before, or since, that playoff run.

He won a Lombardi. I'm not trying to take that away from him, but he did it in a year where he never cracked an 82 QB rating. I doubt that bothers him when he's looking at his ring, but it undercuts a lot of Hootie's bullshit.

[Just Passin' By]

they were sick LMAO

good god

Yes. It happens. Sometimes players can be more focused (Jordan '97 comes to mind). Sometimes it has a significant negative impact (Manning's 6 points in 1st half, 32 points in 2nd half comes to mind).

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

If the goal here, and I'm assuming that there is a point to this, is to make Chiefs fans acknowledge/respect Manning, then a greater tree I never seen pissed up.

[vailpass]

Obviously he hadn't won it, because he lost the game.

Charger fan running super bowl smack. Love it...

[-King-]

The Bears defense that year was 3rd in points allowed that year and allowed 100+ more points than the 2000 Ravens. But yeah, they were the 2nd best defense since 2000. :rolleyes:
Posted via Mobile Device

[vailpass]

The Bears defense that year was 3rd in points allowed that year and allowed 100+ more points than the 2000 Ravens. But yeah, they were the 2nd best defense since 2000. :rolleyes:
Posted via Mobile Device

Hear you but it was a very solid D...

[Hootie]

Yes. It happens. Sometimes players can be more focused (Jordan '97 comes to mind). Sometimes it has a significant negative impact (Manning's 6 points in 1st half, 32 points in 2nd half comes to mind).
Patriots were sick lmao lmao lmao

J
F
C

[GoChargers]

Charger fan running super bowl smack. Love it...

Pretty sure the Donks/Ravens playoff game was NOT the Super Bowl, dumbass.

[Just Passin' By]

Patriots were sick lmao lmao lmao

J
F
C

The flu was going through the locker room.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs06/news/story?id=2735176

The Patriots were forced to have Alexander make the first start of his career. Manning exploited that, which was a smart thing for him to do under the circumstances. Like I said, Manning got his ring, but it was pretty much gifted to him.

[CallMeSquidwad]

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/skeptical-football-manning-vs-messi-and-andrew-luck-experiment/

I watched the entire GB/Det game and I must say...Rodgers has not gotten better at getting rid of the ball. He's got a lot of Alex Smith in him in that regard. He takes a TON of unnecessary sacks. It's bothersome. He also missed a wide open Jordy Nelson when trying to come back on 4th and 5 with a terrible pass 3 yards behind him in a clean pocket...

He's had 1 good playoff run. So has Joe Flacco.

Why does everyone think he's the best QB in the NFL?

I think he's top 5, certainly. But I also don't understand how Tony Romo is a choker, but Aaron Rodgers is not?

I have been grossly unimpressed with Rodgers this year...and in all honesty, the last few postseasons...super meh.

I've said this for a few years now, but...I'd take Russell Wilson over Aaron Rodgers and at this point, I don't even think it's close.

Also, Rodgers is nowhere near Peyton Manning (obvi) or IN HIS PRIME Tom Brady, let's be honest.

I cannot believe someone is this dumb :facepalm:

[vailpass]

Pretty sure the Donks/Ravens playoff game was NOT the Super Bowl, dumbass.

Dude you show your bitter here on a regular basis. Keep running it, it's funny. While your posting pictures feel free to post the Charger super bowl trophy shots...