Eric Berry

[Titty Meat]

We know what it's going to cost to keep him. Question is he worth the money? Has this defense missed him?

I think there's a noticeable difference without Berry against the run. The pass defense looks similar though.

For a team in cap trouble I don't think Berry is a must re-sign guy.

[kcjayhawks5]

At this point I would guess he will be the one that is left out

[Mr. Laz]

Abdullah has looked much better at a strong safety position than at FS.

When Berry comes back he needs to play FS/Single high.

If he can start breaking up passes,racking up ints and protecting the CBs then he's worth it.

If not ... bye.

[wazu]

Where the fuck does our cap go? Denver doesn't seem to have one.

[Iconic]

Where the **** does our cap go? Denver doesn't seem to have one.

To our elite QB/WR tandem obviously.

[Jimmya]

Berry has found his way of KC with this lingering injury.

[Cheater5]

Berry has found his way of KC with this lingering injury.

His way 'out' of?

[Hootie]

Meh. Disappointment, sadly. He's the player I was most excited for...ever

[Discuss Thrower]

He and DJ are as good as gone. And u think Houston will join them.

[WhiteWhale]

3 full seasons and only 3 probowls and 1 all pro nod.

Totally need to get rid of this guy.

This is why we can't have nice things.

[OldSchool]

They need to move him to FS and let him make plays on the backend. Abdullah is more than adequate in Berry's old role.

[MTG#10]

Cost to keep him? Didnt he just sign a long term deal a season or two ago?

[WhiteWhale]

Cost to keep him? Didnt he just sign a long term deal a season or two ago?

No, he's on his rookie contract.

[MTG#10]

No, he's on his rookie contract.

I know I read we made him the highest paid safety in the league a year or two ago.

[WhiteWhale]

I know I read we made him the highest paid safety in the league a year or two ago.

We made him the highest paid safety in the league when we drafted him at the top of the 1st round.

[MTG#10]

Oh well, we still have him locked up for next season at least. His is the only authentic jersey Ive ever purchased, I'll be slightly upset if he doesn't retire a Chief.

[ThaVirus]

We definitely miss his presence in the run game but id say our ineptness on that front has more to do with missing Devito and DJ than Berry. Plus, I don't want my All-Pro, 200 pound safety just signed to a healthy contract playing in the box.

Laz is right; he needs to go straight to FS when he gets back. Give him the opportunity to showcase his playmaking talents as a center fielder. If he shines, keep his ass and pay him a little less than what Earl Thomas just got (which would actually lower his cap hit if I'm not mistaken). If he doesn't do very well, he's got to be the odd man out with Houston and Poe needing new deals soon.

[Snapplez]

We made him the highest paid safety in the league when we drafted him at the top of the 1st round.

Yup. There's been speculation by posters that his salary and cap hits will actually go down if he's re-signed as he should be.

[TambaBerry]

His hit will be about the same. 7-9 million for his position and caliber of player.

[ModSocks]

They need to move him to FS and let him make plays on the backend. Abdullah is more than adequate in Berry's old role.

Our lack of run defense says otherwise. There's times when i thought, "man, Berry woulda shot that gap and blown that play up" like he's done so many times before.

I was all aboard the "Berry to FS" train, but then i realized that playing FS would completely remove him from a a lot of plays around the LoS, and for some plays, completely make him a non factor.

The more i think about it, the more i want him to play SS. His ability to play run defense, blitz, and fill a gap be might be too good to pass up.

I have a strong feeling that once Berry comes back and is moved to FS that he's going to to dissapear in games and the idiots here (such as yourself) will be claiming that he's "lost it" and isn't worth the contract.

The more i think about it, the more i think that the Chiefs had it right in keeping him at SS. It seems to be more suited for him, and moving him to FS essentially means that there will be games in which we hardly notice him since he'll be playing so far away from the LoS.

[the Talking Can]

3 full seasons and only 3 probowls and 1 all pro nod.

Totally need to get rid of this guy.

This is why we can't have nice things.

seriously


amazing...'build through the draft!'....'don't resign young multi-year probowl safety'

[RealSNR]

Poe and Houston are more important to keep around, I'd say.

If you can figure out a way to keep Berry too, then great. If not, it's a pretty big loss, but I'd say the other two players are just more important.

It's possible to move forward without Berry, assuming John Dorsey can be that talent evaluator everybody told us he is when we brought him aboard.

[ModSocks]

Think about it, if he's playing single high safety most of the time, then he's not going to be involved and around most plays that occur. We're not going to see him making hte plays that we're so use to seeing because he simply won't be there to make those plays.

Do we REALLY want that?

On top of that, imma have to listen to some of you morAns talk about how he doesn't have it anymore etc.

[ThaVirus]

Think about it, if he's playing single high safety most of the time, then he's not going to be involved and around most plays that occur. We're not going to see him making hte plays that we're so use to seeing because he simply won't be there to make those plays.

Do we REALLY want that?

On top of that, imma have to listen to some of you morAns talk about how he doesn't have it anymore etc.


You make a good point but what you'd hope for is an equal trade off of plays made in pass break ups, INTs, and deep balls that aren't even attempted because the QB sees him in prime position to make a play.

Know what I mean?

So what I'm thinking is you lose out on his 2 sacks and handful of tackles for loss but are rewarded with more INTs, incompletions, and a defense that gives up less big plays while also prolonging the career of a star player.

I love the plays he makes in the box but he's only like 205. I'm thinking we'd see a pretty sharp decline in his play around the time he turned 29 if we continue to play him in the physical role we have been..

[Sully]

Berry has found his way of KC with this lingering injury.

I found my way of KC before, but it wasn't due to injury.

[OldSchool]

If Berry is as instinctive as people think he is, he should still be able to help with run support while primarily playing deep in the secondary.

[ModSocks]

You make a good point but what you'd hope for is an equal trade off of plays made in pass break ups, INTs, and deep balls that aren't even attempted because the QB sees him in prime position to make a play.

Know what I mean?

So what I'm thinking is you lose out on his 2 sacks, and handful of tackles for loss but are rewarded with more INTs, incompletions, and a defense that gives up less big plays while also prolonging the career of a star player.

I love the plays he makes in the box but he's only like 205. I'm thinking we'd see a pretty sharp decline in his play around the time he turned 29 if we continue to play him in the physical role we have been..

I understand your concern about his weight, but i don't think we'll see an equal trade off. I think Berry brings far too much around the LoS and that there is no way we would see an equal trade. As it is, FS doesn't seem to be the gigantic hole that it use to be, so how much MORE production will we actually get, and do we even need more production at that position?

The interception numbers won't be there simply because if he's doing his job, the QB won't throw the ball.

Also, the loss of DJ makes Berry's play around the LoS that much more valuable. Our run defense is just plain awful at the moment simply because we're missing our two best ILB's.

Essentially, what we'd be doing is taking our most versatile and best players around the LoS and moving him as far away from the LoS as possible. That just doesn't sound like a good idea to me anymore.

[ModSocks]

If Berry is as instinctive as people think he is, he should still be able to help with run support while primarily playing deep in the secondary.

Instincts won't make him super man. Sure, im sure he can run from the back end of the D up to the front 7, but by the time he gets there the back will have already gained a few yards, negating the effectivness that Berry would've had if he were around the LoS.

He's an all pro player, not superman. It's not realistic to expect him to come from the deepest position on the D and still make the same kind of plays.

[RunKC]

He and DJ are as good as gone. And u think Houston will join them.

They are both gone, but I think they will keep Tamba on a 2 yr deal after an initial cut. JMJ looks solid at ILB. Keep him and draft another kid to compete next to him.

Abdullah is basically as good if not better than Berry and we haven't missed Berry at all.
Trading Berry for a 1st or 2nd wouldn't bother me.

This upcoming draft could help us out so much.

[ModSocks]

Abdullah is basically as good if not better than Berry

.

:facepalm:

[O.city]

Yeah, Abdullah is solid but not berry.

He does however allow you to put berry in Ron Parker's spot. You know, the spot that had it been berry probably picks Kaep off for a pick 6

[ThaVirus]

I understand your concern about his weight, but i don't think we'll see an equal trade off. I think Berry brings far too much around the LoS and that there is no way we would see an equal trade. As it is, FS doesn't seem to be the gigantic hole that it use to be, so how much MORE production will we actually get, and do we even need more production at that position?



The interception numbers won't be there simply because if he's doing his job, the QB won't throw the ball.



Also, the loss of DJ makes Berry's play around the LoS that much more valuable. Our run defense is just plain awful at the moment simply because we're missing our two best ILB's.



Essentially, what we'd be doing is taking our most versatile and best players around the LoS and moving him as far away from the LoS as possible. That just doesn't sound like a good idea to me anymore.


Legitimate concerns, for sure.

I think a switch would be pertinent but I don't think you could go wrong. Berry is a Swiss Army knife. He'll excel wherever we put him, seriously. His coverage woes from early on are far overblown on this site. He's excellent against the run and rushing the passer while his man coverage skills are actually above average to pretty good. What remains to be seen is whether he still has the instincts to play zone in the deep middle.

[Mr. Laz]

Think about it, if he's playing single high safety most of the time, then he's not going to be involved and around most plays that occur. We're not going to see him making hte plays that we're so use to seeing because he simply won't be there to make those plays.

Do we REALLY want that?

On top of that, imma have to listen to some of you morAns talk about how he doesn't have it anymore etc.
We all want to keep Berry, but you don't pay box SS 13 million a year. Imo.

[O.city]

Just put berry in the best spot to make plays on a game by game basis

[RealSNR]

Abdullah is basically as good if not better than Berry and we haven't missed Berry at all.

Uhhh....

[Dunerdr]

This is the part where Green Bay let's quality vets walk and keeps on drafting.

[ModSocks]

Just put berry in the best spot to make plays on a game by game basis

I like this.

And i think that's what we'll see when he gets back. He's probably going to be doing a lot of both, as will Abdullah.

[ModSocks]

This is the part where Green Bay let's quality vets walk and keeps on drafting.

Except that they actually keep their best.

You don't draft all pros just to replace them.

Green Bay lets players walk when it's TIME to let them walk.

[O.city]

I like this.

And i think that's what we'll see when he gets back. He's probably going to be doing a lot of both, as will Abdullah.

I think it would be a great situation to have berry Abdullah, Parker and that other dude (Coleman I think) at safety.

Lotta athleticism

[RunKC]

:facepalm:

Remind me again which safety came up big in the playoffs last year and which one got owned by Coby goddamn Fleener.

[OldSchool]

Instincts won't make him super man. Sure, im sure he can run from the back end of the D up to the front 7, but by the time he gets there the back will have already gained a few yards, negating the effectivness that Berry would've had if he were around the LoS.

He's an all pro player, not superman. It's not realistic to expect him to come from the deepest position on the D and still make the same kind of plays.

The run defense is hardly the result of Eric Berry being out. It's more the fact that we're missing two starting ILBs.

Abdullah has been very consistent both in coverage and in run support when asked to play near the LOS. He is rarely ever out of place and is a pretty good play maker in his own right around the LOS.

The team would really be better off with Berry playing deeper because, while Abdullah, Parker, and Coleman have been ok back there, Berry has the speed and athleticism to make some of the plays that they just can't reach (throw to Lloyd where Coleman was too late to help out Smith for example).

[RealSNR]

Remind me again which safety came up big in the playoffs last year and which one got owned by Coby goddamn Fleener.

I'm a fan of Abdullah. Huge fan. Don't get me wrong. But unless this weird ankle injury of Berry's is the beginning stages of Ebola, I'm taking him over Abdullah every time.

[ILChief]

If it comes down to berry or Houston, I'm keeping Houston

[ModSocks]

Remind me again which safety came up big in the playoffs last year and which one got owned by Coby goddamn Fleener.

5 catches for 46 yards 1 td. Oh man, he got clowned so so hard.

[The Franchise]

Remind me again which safety came up big in the playoffs last year and which one got owned by Coby goddamn Fleener.

And which one couldn't beat out Lewis for the starting job last year?

[OldSchool]

5 catches for 46 yards 1 td. Oh man, he got clowned so so hard.

He really did. Most of those catches were for a 1st down. Fleener just smoked him on the TD.

[O.city]

I do think berry plays undisplined at times, relying on his athleticism too much instead of just playing sound.

[ModSocks]

The run defense is hardly the result of Eric Berry being out. It's more the fact that we're missing two starting ILBs.

Abdullah has been very consistent both in coverage and in run support when asked to play near the LOS. He is rarely ever out of place and is a pretty good play maker in his own right around the LOS.

.

Right. But my point is that Berry would HELP in run defense.

And i agree that Abdullah is a good player.

The right answer is probably what O.City said, you don't stick him at either FS or SS, you move him around and play him where he needs to be played on a given play.

[OldSchool]

And which one couldn't beat out Lewis for the starting job last year?

Pretty sure now with the level of play that Abdullah has displayed, that was all on the coaching staff trusting in Lewis' ability to make calls on defense and the fact that Abdullah had been out of football for a year.

[ModSocks]

He really did. Most of those catches were for a 1st down. Fleener just smoked him on the TD.

5 catches for 46 yards isn't clowned, any way you slice it. Also Fleener is 6-6 260lbs. Yeah, Berry might lose some of those matchups. Stop acting like Fleener got loose and had a career day.

[The Franchise]

Pretty sure now with the level of play that Abdullah has displayed, that was all on the coaching staff trusting in Lewis' ability to make calls on defense and the fact that Abdullah had been out of football for a year.

Yet Abdullah is better than Berry?

[ModSocks]

Pretty sure now with the level of play that Abdullah has displayed, that was all on the coaching staff trusting in Lewis' ability to make calls on defense and the fact that Abdullah had been out of football for a year.

Or the fact that Abdullah is a SS, not a FS.

[RunKC]

I think it would be a great situation to have berry Abdullah, Parker and that other dude (Coleman I think) at safety.

Lotta athleticism

Yet Abdullah is better than Berry?

I would put Berry at single high when he returns. This defense needs and Earl Thomas to cover deep.

Abdullah does Berry's job about as well as him at SS. He's been a good run stuffer and his coverage has been solid. Is there really a huge difference between the two at SS?

We need that single high safety so bad. If Berry proves he can be that guy, then he's worth the money. If not, why have 2 good players at the same position when one is so much more?

[O.city]

Abdullah hasn't been as good as berry.

Good? Sure

All pro good like Eric? No

[ModSocks]

Abdullah does Berry's job about as well as him at SS.

Not even close.

Abduallah is a good player, i get that, but Berry is a play maker.

Abdullah has what, 2 TFL's this season and both came last week.

He is a good player, but you're crazy if you think he's Berry.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

He and DJ are as good as gone. And u think Houston will join them.

Yep, that's my call too.

Houston? No way in hell.

[ModSocks]

Yep, that's my call too.

Houston? No way in hell.

There's really no reason to lose DJ, so i don't know why you guys are just jumping to that conclusion. He's an all pro, Pro bowler set to only make 5 mill next season.

[Discuss Thrower]

There's really no reason to lose DJ, so i don't know why you guys are just jumping to that conclusion. He's an all pro, Pro bowler set to only make 5 mill next season.

No sense paying a 10 year veteran that will likely lose most of his speed and agility on a rebuilding roster.

The Chiefs need to be setting themselves up for winning 10+ games in 2017. Keeping DJ around means they're playing for 7 to 9 wins in a year.

It's time to let DJ go.

[jd1020]

There's really no reason to lose DJ, so i don't know why you guys are just jumping to that conclusion. He's an all pro, Pro bowler set to only make 5 mill next season.

If the team doesn't let go of DJ then who the fuck is Dorsey going to use his first pick on to replace?

[ModSocks]

The Chiefs need to be setting themselves up for winning 10+ games in 2017. Keeping DJ around means they're playing for 7 to 9 wins in a year.



Dafuq?

5mill isn't shit for a player of his caliber. That's hardly a dent in the cap. Paying him doesn't mean dick about the direction the Chiefs are headed.

[OldSchool]

Yet Abdullah is better than Berry?

Athletically, there's no question that Berry is in a class or two above him and has the physical potential to make more big plays than Abdullah has made.

However, when you just look at their performance on the field, they aren't that far apart and certainly not $7+ million a year apart, and I think that's the main argument to be made. Abdullah makes up for his lack of elite athleticism with his technical discipline, football intelligence, and instincts in coverage and run support.

Let's put it this way.

If both were to get close to the same contract, no question that I would take Eric Berry over Abdullah. I prefer highly athletic safeties simply because they have more range and have a better chance to recover if they take a misstep or get fooled a bit by misdirection.

But if we're paying them like we are now, Abdullah at roughly $1.1 mil a year and Berry at roughly $8.4 mil a year, the product on the field from Berry just isn't worth $7+ mil more than what Abdullah brings to the table. I'd rather take that money and put it in a starting caliber CB, impact DE, etc.

That's what it really boils down to for me. Others may think differently.

[ThaVirus]

He really did. Most of those catches were for a 1st down. Fleener just smoked him on the TD.


Do you have a gif of said play?

I could have sworn we were in zone on that TD.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

Another waste of a top 5 pick. He's no Earl Thomas.

[jd1020]

Do you have a gif of said play?

I could have sworn we were in zone on that TD.

Are we talking about Fleeners TD in the playoffs? If that's the case then they were in a zone and Berry wasn't even playing on the same hashes.

Would it surprise you that OldSchool is a dumbass?

[The Franchise]

Another waste of a top 5 pick. He's no Earl Thomas.

Earl Thomas is overrated.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Another waste of a top 5 pick. He's no Earl Thomas.

He was a great pick under shitty coaching and management. Still is.

[Sorter]

Or the fact that Abdullah is a SS, not a FS.

It's pretty silly for people to try and describe KC's safeties as simply either Free or Strong Safeties.



On the first SF drive last week, you can watch Abdullah play ILB, deep 1/3, quarters, and as the force player in cover 3.

[ThaVirus]

Are we talking about Fleeners TD in the playoffs? If that's the case then they were in a zone and Berry wasn't even playing on the same hashes.



Would it surprise you that OldSchool is a dumbass?


Heh.

Yep. Thank you.

[jd1020]

Heh.

Yep. Thank you.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/indianapolis-colts/0ap2000000309087/Luck-connects-with-Fleener-for-a-12-yard-touchdown

The safety that was playing in the area of the catch was none other than Kendrick Lewis.

[OldSchool]

Do you have a gif of said play?

I could have sworn we were in zone on that TD.

It was zone, Berry took a really shitty angle and Lewis was on Hilton.

http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_images/2014/01/05/FleenerTd.gif

[O.city]

It's pretty silly for people to try and describe KC's safeties as simply either Free or Strong Safeties.



On the first SF drive last week, you can watch Abdullah play ILB, deep 1/3, quarters, and as the force player in cover 3.

Hence why it wold behoove s to have a multitude of athletic safeties

[OldSchool]

Are we talking about Fleeners TD in the playoffs? If that's the case then they were in a zone and Berry wasn't even playing on the same hashes.

Would it surprise you that OldSchool is a dumbass?

Berry was playing deep thirds and was in position to make a play, the pass was right down the seam. He didn't fuck up by taking a poor angle?

Ok. :rolleyes:

[jd1020]

Berry was playing deep thirds and was in position to make a play, the pass was right down the seam. He didn't **** up by taking a poor angle?

Ok. :rolleyes:

Watch the link you dumb ****.

Berry has NO chance at making a play. The safety in the area was Lewis and he has no fucking clue about whats going on.

[O.city]

Berry was playing deep thirds and was in position to make a play, the pass was right down the seam. He didn't **** up by taking a poor angle?

Ok. :rolleyes:

There are two deep safeties. Not deep thirds

[beach tribe]

It's pretty silly for people to try and describe KC's safeties as simply either Free or Strong Safeties.



On the first SF drive last week, you can watch Abdullah play ILB, deep 1/3, quarters, and as the force player in cover 3.

95% of the people on this board have no idea what they are looking at.

Clueless about gap responsibilities, coverages, and most certainly blocking schemes.

They would make excellent PFF analysts.

[ThaVirus]

Berry was playing deep thirds and was in position to make a play, the pass was right down the seam. He didn't fuck up by taking a poor angle?



Ok. :rolleyes:


I'm not going to pretend to know people's zone responsibilities but jd is right about Berry being on the opposite hash. You can see Lewis is in deep coverage as well so im guessing it was some variation of cover 2.

Either way, you can't expect anyone to maintain their coverage responsibilities while also defending the opposite hash on a 15 yard pass. There simply isn't enough time to recover.

[OldSchool]

Watch the link you dumb ****.

They split the safeties, draw Lewis away with Hilton, DJ didn't drop deep enough, and Berry didn't close fast enough or take a proper angle to make the play in the first place. Wasn't all on him but he was part of the ****-up.

He still gave up multiple 1st down catches to Fleener in man coverage as well.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

Earl Thomas is overrated.

I was being sarcastic. I'm surrounded by (L)ots (O)f (B)andwagon fans.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

He was a great pick under shitty coaching and management. Still is.

See above post. This whole thread is nonsense. Eric has already said he wanted to retire here. We're going to find out if that's true come contract time, because I don't think he expects a Brinks truck to pull up, and I don't think anyone expects us to deliver one for him.

[Rudy tossed tigger's salad]

Earl Thomas is overrated.

Nope. Best safety in the last 20 years

[beach tribe]

They split the safeties, draw Lewis away with Hilton, DJ didn't drop deep enough, and Berry didn't close fast enough or take a proper angle to make the play in the first place. Wasn't all on him but he was part of the ****-up.

He still gave up multiple 1st down catches to Fleener in man coverage as well.

He was also the highest rated S in the league against TEs.

[ThaVirus]

They split the safeties, draw Lewis away with Hilton, DJ didn't drop deep enough, and Berry didn't close fast enough or take a proper angle to make the play in the first place. Wasn't all on him but he was part of the ****-up.

He still gave up multiple 1st down catches to Fleener in man coverage as well.


There are holes in any and every zone coverage scheme.

[ThaVirus]

Nope. Best safety in the last 20 years


Not a fucking chance. He's good but doesn't even touch Reed and Polamalu in their primes. Shit, maybe not even Brian Dawkins.

He's a horrible open field tackler, that much is certain.

[beach tribe]

Nope. Best safety in the last 20 years

He is extremely good at what he is asked to do..

Which is very little compared to most S in the league.

None of Seattle's DBs are asked to do a lot. They are solid at every position, and probably play fewer packages than almost every other team.

The scheme takes advantage of the fact that there really aren't any weaknesses anywhere so they do not have to get exotic to hide weaknesses or confuse the offense.

[Sorter]

Berry was playing deep thirds and was in position to make a play, the pass was right down the seam. He didn't fuck up by taking a poor angle?

Ok. :rolleyes:

Berry is not playing deep 1/3.




Please shut the fuck up. You are one of the most uninformed people on here that continously spouts off fucking inaccurate bullshit. It's like penbook on meth.

[OldSchool]

Way too much separation allowed for a guy who's supposed to be and getting paid like a top coverage safety in the league.

http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/blogs/afr-sb48-thom1-4.jpg

[beach tribe]

Not a ****ing chance. He's good but doesn't even touch Reed and Polamalu in their primes. Shit, maybe not even Brian Dawkins.

He's a horrible open field tackler, that much is certain.

I wouldn't put him in the top 10. That unit is great and scheme is simple.

If he played here he would be the 2nd best S on the field any time Berry was on it, and it wouldn't be close.

[beach tribe]

Way too much separation allowed for a guy who's supposed to be and getting paid like a top coverage safety in the league.

http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/blogs/afr-sb48-thom1-4.jpg

Again, he was the highest rated S in the league against TEs.

[Sorter]

95% of the people on this board have no idea what they are looking at.

Clueless about gap responsibilities, coverages, and most certainly blocking schemes.

They would make excellent PFF analysts.
Fucking direckshun turned down a job with them. Poor bastard didn't even know what "power" was and was going to be compensated for evaluating and grading football. LMAO.


No offense meant Direckshun. I really do enjoy your threads and the time you put into them.

[Sorter]

Way too much separation allowed for a guy who's supposed to be and getting paid like a top coverage safety in the league.

http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/blogs/afr-sb48-thom1-4.jpg

Congratulations on posting a solitary still with no context.




Exceptional argument and support indeed.

[beach tribe]

****ing direckshun turned down a job with them. Poor bastard didn't even know what "power" was and was going to be compensated for evaluating and grading football. LMAO.


No offense meant Direckshun. I really do enjoy your threads and the time you put into them.

I knew a guy who was doing it. We were looking over some plays, and he gave the LT a negative grade on a play because he didn't pickup a nickle DB on a fire blitz..lol.

[Sorter]

The scheme takes advantage of the fact that there really aren't any weaknesses anywhere so they do not have to get exotic to hide weaknesses or confuse the offense.

Both SD and Denver have done some pretty cool things to attack that C3 this year. I'll probably do a post on it before our game with Seattle.

[beach tribe]

Congratulations on posting a solitary still with no context.




Exceptional argument and support indeed.

A picture is worth a thousand useless uninformed words.

[Sandy Vagina]

Exceptional argument and support indeed.

... and you, for all of your strutting arrogance.. are offering... what exactly? You have a knack for insulting someone's football intelligence.. but you don't seem to try to educate them instead of leaving it at empty insults.

Anyone have a better gif at the backend of that Fleener TD?

What exactly was the defensive call and Berry's role in it, Sorter... genius of all football forum discussion... Do tell. And enlighten on how you became so well learned on football...

[The Franchise]

Nope. Best safety in the last 20 years

ROFL

No.

[ModSocks]

... and you, for all of your strutting arrogance.. are offering... what exactly? You have a knack for insulting someone's football intelligence.. but you don't seem to try to educate them instead of leaving it at empty insults.

Anyone have a better gif at the backend of that Fleener TD?

What exactly was the defensive call and Berry's role in it, Sorter... genius of all football forum discussion... Do tell. And enlighten on how you became so well learned on football...

Wait, another blackbob mult?

[Sandy Vagina]

Wait, another blackbob mult?

not at all, why?

[ModSocks]

not at all, why?

oh nvm

[Sorter]

... and you, for all of your strutting arrogance.. are offering... what exactly? You have a knack for insulting someone's football intelligence.. but you don't seem to try to educate them instead of leaving it at empty insults. that's not my job. I shouldn't have to correct every fucking incorrect thing you and this dumbass post.

Anyone have a better gif at the backend of that Fleener TD?

What exactly was the defensive call and Berry's role in it, Sorter... Okay. I'll do it but I'd like for you to leave this message board permanently. Besides, I'm probably just wrong because I clearly dont understand coverages and you'll get to stay anyways. No risk mano, it's a win win for you!

genius of all football forum discussionMy ego appreciates this.... Do tell. And enlighten on how you became so well learned on football...Would you like my SSN as well?


I'll break down the play if you agree to being Perma banned.


Put your account where your Alex Smith dick-sucking mouth is.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

I'll break down the play if you agree to being Perma banned.


Put your account where your Alex Smith dick-sucking mouth is.

ROFL

[OldSchool]

Congratulations on posting a solitary still with no context.




Exceptional argument and support indeed.

He is in man coverage with safety help over the top. Shots are from CBS.

http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/blogs/afr-sb48-thom1-1.jpg

http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/blogs/afr-sb48-thom1-2.jpg

Thomas easily beat Berry to the inside for an easy 20 yard completion. Berry has given up a TD to Thomas every time that he has faced him.

[Sandy Vagina]

I'll break down the play if you agree to being Perma banned.

Put your account where your Alex Smith dick-sucking mouth is.

see, why be so childishly nasty? If you can correct someone's inaccurate take, then by all means... No one is saying you can not. But why insult instead of enlighten? Are you an adult or is this the limits of your communication skill?

[scho63]

Who's this Eric Berry fellow you speak of?

Only kidding-he helps a lot on run defense but his coverage skills have been getting very exploited in man-to-man due to his size and speed. Too slow in man but one of the best tackling safeties in football. Also good instincts in zone.

[beach tribe]

Both SD and Denver have done some pretty cool things to attack that C3 this year. I'll probably do a post on it before our game with them.

Looking forward to it.
Always educational. I always learn something from your breakdowns.

Your knowledge well beyond your average informed football fan, and you have a great eye for wrinkles.

[Sorter]

see, why be so childishly nasty? If you can correct someone's inaccurate take, then by all means... No one is saying you can not. But why insult instead of enlighten? Are you an adult or is this the limits of your communication skill?

Because I don't like you.


Are you going to accept my offer or not?

[Sandy Vagina]

Because I don't like you.

Are you going to accept my offer or not?

nah..

[Sorter]

nah..

Hilarious coming from the 49ers fan who tells all of the Chiefs fans on this board they're cowards.




I won't lie, I'm just a teensy bit disappointed in you.

[Sorter]

He is in man coverage with safety help over the top. Shots are from CBS.

http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/blogs/afr-sb48-thom1-1.jpg

http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/blogs/afr-sb48-thom1-2.jpg

Thomas easily beat Berry to the inside for an easy 20 yard completion. Berry has given up a TD to Thomas every time that he has faced him.

Hooray. You found a play in which Berry is likely playing trail (your .jpgs suck, tell me the time stamp and I'll watch it on A22) and gets beat against a top 5 TE and Peyton Manning.



Is this supposed to mean something? It's not like Berry gets raped every fucking play against Thomas. L

[beach tribe]

Hooray. You found a play in which Berry is likely playing trail (your .jpgs suck, tell me the time stamp and I'll watch it on A22) and gets beat against a top 5 TE and Peyton Manning.



Is this supposed to mean something? It's not like Berry gets raped every ****ing play against Thomas. L

It's basically impossible to defend without generating hard core pressure on the QB

[Sorter]

It's basically impossible to defend without generating hard core pressure on the QB

I mean, your MOFC player could help out.


That'd be a start.

[Urc Burry]

No safety in the league can cover the elite tight ends one on one. I thought Crennels experiment would of taught you that.

Berry went from maybe being slightly overrated his rookie year to very under appreciated. He is still probably the best SS in the league. Kam has an argument but he benefits from that secondary and scheme

[Sandy Vagina]

Hilarious coming from the 49ers fan who tells all of the Chiefs fans on this board they're cowards.




I won't lie, I'm just a teensy bit disappointed in you.

Seriously? How dumb are you that you expect me to bet on something that I expect to "lose" on?

Why not just ask me to bet my house on whether you can add 32 + 40?

My only point in this enthralling conversation is this... I believe you CAN elaborate on why oldschool is wrong... but instead of doing so.. useless insults.

Be better than that. Be an adult and have an adult conversation.

[OldSchool]

How much would you pay to keep Eric Berry at this point?

[jd1020]

How much would you pay to keep Eric Berry at this point?

Considerably more than I would pay Abdullah. Berry is the best safety in the league at what he does.

[MTG#10]

How much would you pay to keep Eric Berry at this point?

All of it

[Deberg_1990]

Berry is why you don't draft safety's top 5.

He's a solid player, but an IMPACT player??

If we absolutely had to have a safety, Pioli should have traded down and snagged Earl Thomas.

[jd1020]

He's a solid player, but an IMPACT player??

Are you trying to say that one of the most disruptive safeties in the league is not an impact player?

Holy fuck!

Keep using that hindsight to say that Pioli should have drafted the one guy that people would take over Berry.

[Urc Burry]

Berry is why you don't draft safety's top 5.

He's a solid player, but an IMPACT player??

If we absolutely had to have a safety, Pioli should have traded down and snagged Earl Thomas.

Berry was the best safety prospect since Sean Taylor. You make that pick 10 out of 10 times

[Sandy Vagina]

How much would you pay to keep Eric Berry at this point?

I'm glad there's more season to go to decide.. but for now, I'd play him out on his final year, unless he will take an extension for 5 mil per. Fair or not, I'm not happy with him missing all of these games. Has me wondering if he's going to be worth keeping around much longer.

[jd1020]

Berry's an All-Pro safety but he's not impactful enough for the likes of the DeBergs and the Alex Smith/Chandler Jones loving mother ****ers.

[The Franchise]

I'm glad there's more season to go to decide.. but for now, I'd play him out on his final year, unless he will take an extension for 5 mil per. Fair or not, I'm not happy with him missing all of these games. Has me wondering if he's going to be worth keeping around much longer.

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs/hutx1a/picture2525339/alternates/FREE_960/CHIEFS49ERS2%20SP%20100514%20DRE%200539f.jpg

[beach tribe]

How much would you pay to keep Eric Berry at this point?

Franchise tag for Ss is 8.4M, So I'd start there.

There is plenty of $$ that can be freed up on this team to keep Berry and Houston. You don't let home grown talent like them walk at their age.... no matter what it takes.

Bowe needs to be restructured, and I think he'll go for it unless he starts performing the way I thought he would this season.
I just don't see it now that there so many targets on this team, at positions that Alex has a history of looking toward ahead of WR.
Especially considering it's not exactly irrational for him to have trust issues when looking Bowe's direction. he has continually let him down over the past two seasons.

[WhiteWhale]

Berry's an All-Pro safety but he's not impactful enough for the likes of the DeBergs and the Alex Smith/Chandler Jones loving mother ****ers.

You don't really take count of who says what do you?

They're not the same people.

[srvy]

Remind me again which safety came up big in the playoffs last year and which one got owned by Coby goddamn Fleener.

So true. Not to mention his go around with old man Gates.
But around this place Berry be beasting. Honestly he just doesnt have the coverage instincts for free safety. Play him as box safety and he cant stay healthy. I know the Chiefs have kinda labeled him a hybrid who can get back in coverage or play up on the line in run support. I think this is the Chiefs not knowing what place to put him. I do know he isnt living up to his hype or contract he was payed. This is why he IMHO wont see another contract with the chiefs and will be odd man out.

[WhiteWhale]

So true. Not to mention his go around with old man Gates.
But around this place Berry be beasting. Honestly he just doesnt have the coverage instincts for free safety. Play him as box safety and he cant stay healthy. I know the Chiefs have kinda labeled him a hybrid who can get back in coverage or play up on the line in run support. I think this is the Chiefs not knowing what place to put him. I do know he isnt living up to his hype or contract he was payed. This is why he IMHO wont see another contract with the chiefs and will be odd man out.

What were the expectations people had?

He's made the probowl every season and was an all pro last year.

He had 80+ tackles, 3 picks, 2 fumble recoveries, and two defensive TD's. What the hell are the expectations? Realistic ones might help.

[Direckshun]

Sadly, I think we've replaced Berry with Abdullah. Abdullah is doing everything you'd ask Berry to do.

I say sadly, because I love Eric Berry. But he's on the outside looking in.

[OldSchool]

Franchise tag for Ss is 8.4M, So I'd start there.

There is plenty of $$ that can be freed up on this team to keep Berry and Houston. You don't let home grown talent like them walk at their age.... no matter what it takes.

Bowe needs to be restructured, and I think he'll go for it unless he starts performing the way I thought he would this season.
I just don't see it now that there so many targets on this team, at positions that Alex has a history of looking toward ahead of WR.
Especially considering it's not exactly irrational for him to have trust issues when looking Bowe's direction. he has continually let him down over the past two seasons.
So you think he deserves Byrd-type money instead of Ward's deal?

You think that can be accomplished while keeping Houston as well and leaving room for Poe's extension?

Will the salary cap increase fast enough to allow for that to happen?

What about improvements at CB, which is absolutely necessary if Reid and Sutton are going to keep sticking to their man-coverage scheme?

Can you do it while leaving enough room to bring in at least 1 impact FA?

The 2015 draft/off-season is going to be huge for this current regime and it will make or break them.

They have to come up with a potential #1 WR. That's not just for the current offensive success with Smith, but for any QB that might come afterwards as well.

They have to find a replacement for DJ, his time is nearing its end with that achilles injury that he suffered. The thing that sucks is, while there are a few prospects who look like they'll be solid pros, none of them are exceptional.

Stop the musical chairs along the OL. Solidify that crap because Reid's schemes largely relies upon the OL's ability to work together and execute blocks. His 2012 season was an offensive shit-fest because his OL fell apart due to injuries.

They have to upgrade at corner, Cooper is allowing far too many receptions when he is targeted and too much yardage. He needs to be challenged for his starting job by either a high draft pick or an established vet, not guys like Parker.

Need an upgrade at 5-tech/replacement for Devito and although I like Catapano's potential, I'm not holding my breath for him. The best 3-4 defenses in the league have at least 1 dominant 5-tech who does well against the pass and in the run game.

I hope that Dorsey can pull it all off.

[the Talking Can]

Berry's been pretty much excellent since he first stepped foot on an nfl field...his rookie season was as good as any safeties in a long damn time and i'd like to know who was better...he was one of only 3 people that even showed up for our playoff loss ass kicking by baltimore

guy is the best safety in the league against the run, no one maneuvers in traffic like him...no one...so all he does is go to fucking probowls

but he gave up a td once so Chiefs fans want to get rid of him

meanwhile, Alex Smith, has sucked ass for 80% of his career...threw 3 ints in a loss to the titans, threw a horrific game losing int against the 49ers..and is the leader of a 2-3 squad...and people line up to suck his donkey

apparently Berry needs to suck for 6 years and people will love him...or something

Eric Fisher...most embarrassing rookie season of a OL on record..people love him

it will never make sense

[the Talking Can]

i like how we're 2-3 and staring at 2-4 after getting raped by Rivers


but we don't need our all-pro safety...how's that equation work again?

[jd1020]

i like how we're 2-3 and staring at 2-4 after getting raped by Rivers


but we don't need our all-pro safety...how's that equation work again?

Great teams are built from shitty teams getting rid of their best players.

[the Talking Can]

Great teams are built from shitty teams getting rid of their best players.

correct

apparently


we have our Brady/Rodgers in Smith, so we can let Berry walk is what i hear

[The Bad Guy]

I'm not letting the 25-year old safety walk.

I doubt the Chiefs will either.

[srvy]

Great teams are built from shitty teams getting rid of their best players.

Berry is not our best player.

[jd1020]

Berry is not our best player.

I said players, as in more than one. Learn to read.

[Direckshun]

I agree the Chiefs will retain him.

I hope it's at the going rate of $8-9m/year and not something ridiculous.

[OldSchool]

I'm not letting the 25-year old safety walk.

I doubt the Chiefs will either.

But if it came down to keeping only 2 of 3 players: Berry, Poe, or Houston.

Who would you let walk?

The cheapest of the three would be Berry, probably something like 5 years $45-55 mil.

Next would be Houston, probably asking somewhere around 5 years $65-75 mil judging from the fact that Dorsey hasn't given him an offer that he likes yet.

After that, I wonder what Poe would ask for. Guys with his size and athleticism are extremely rare, in fact he and Ngata are the only guys in the league who weigh 340+ and have incredible motors, explosiveness, power, and athleticism. What do you pay someone who has that kind of talent and ability? Poe isn't quite on Ngata's level but he certainly has the physical potential to get there. If he continues to rack in the sacks this year, it's not a stretch to say that he might be the next $90+ mil DL player in this league.

That's a lot of money that we're talking about here.

[srvy]

I said players, as in more than one. Learn to read.

I know what you wrote. You include him in our best players. Well he is good so is Abdullah who we haven't missed a beat since he has been in. Berry is expendable. Life would go on without him. Now if he is willing to renegotiate into a favorable contract per what he is asked to do then sign him by all means. If he expected top safety in the league money? Well he isn't and he can walk. Season is young maybe Berry will come back and play lights out and we keep him. It will mean Bye bye Houston most likely.

[jd1020]

I know what you wrote. You include him in our best players. Well he is good so is Abdullah who we haven't missed a beat since he has been in. Berry is expendable. Life would go on without him. Now if he is willing to renegotiate into a favorable contract per what he is asked to do then sign him by all means. If he expected top safety in the league money? Well he isn't and he can walk. Season is young maybe Berry will come back and play lights out and we keep him. It will mean Bye bye Houston most likely.

LMAO

Chiefs are just too good. They aren't missing the services of their perennial pro-bowl and All-Pro safety.

[SAUTO]

I know what you wrote. You include him in our best players. Well he is good so is Abdullah who we haven't missed a beat since he has been in. Berry is expendable. Life would go on without him. Now if he is willing to renegotiate into a favorable contract per what he is asked to do then sign him by all means. If he expected top safety in the league money? Well he isn't and he can walk. Season is young maybe Berry will come back and play lights out and we keep him. It will mean Bye bye Houston most likely.

Why? The cap is going to explode in the next few years.

Iirc like to 160 million in a couple years?


Looked at the projections at yep, 140 next year at least and 150-160 he year after.
Then another ten the year after.


Enough to sign all three for sure

[ModSocks]

I know what you wrote. You include him in our best players. Well he is good so is Abdullah who we haven't missed a beat since he has been in. Berry is expendable. Life would go on without him. Now if he is willing to renegotiate into a favorable contract per what he is asked to do then sign him by all means. If he expected top safety in the league money? Well he isn't and he can walk. Season is young maybe Berry will come back and play lights out and we keep him. It will mean Bye bye Houston most likely.

LMAO

I see. So Berry has been playing lights out up this point, but of course THIS is the year he has to play lights out or he's not worth it.

Abdullah is soooo good that teams were just clamoring for his services this offseason.

Abdullah is a good player. Berry is a star player. Abdullah does his job, but Berry is a damn playmaker.

[ModSocks]

LMAO

Chiefs are just too good. They aren't missing the services of their perennial pro-bowl and All-Pro safety.

It's amazing how people devlaue guys like Charles, Berry and DJ and then prop up guys like Alex Smith, Catapano and every other Training camp hero.

This thread reeks like last season's "Cooper is better than Flowers" bullshit.

I swear, sometimes i think this fanbase deserves a fail ass franchise.

[BossChief]

If he wants top dollar, he needs to take the ball away and stay on the field.

I now he is great against the run, but in today's nfl that's not saying much. Especially when we are talking about big time money.

I'd like to see hi stay healthy and become the turnover machine he was at Tennesee before Monte Kiffen took away his playmaker card and every coach since followed Kiffens approach.

[BossChief]

I mean...Dawkins, Polamalu and Reed were good run defenders, too...but they were also ballhawks.

[ThaVirus]

If he wants top dollar, he needs to take the ball away and stay on the field.

I now he is great against the run, but in today's nfl that's not saying much. Especially when we are talking about big time money.

I'd like to see hi stay healthy and become the turnover machine he was at Tennesee before Monte Kiffen took away his playmaker card and every coach since followed Kiffens approach.


We had this argument months ago and I thought we put it to rest.

I don't remember the exact stats but Earl Thomas only averaged like 1.2 more INTs per season than Berry while Berry has notched FAR more sacks and tackles for loss.

[OldSchool]

We had this argument months ago and I thought we put it to rest.

I don't remember the exact stats but Earl Thomas only averaged like 1.2 more INTs per season than Berry while Berry has notched FAR more sacks and tackles for loss.

Wild guess here but Berry has had far more opportunities to do so. Thomas is typically in the center-fielder role for the Seahawks and doesn't play in the box nearly as often as Berry does.

[Urc Burry]

I mean...Dawkins, Polamalu and Reed were good run defenders, too...but they were also ballhawks.

Berry compares to Polamalu the most. And Polamalu was hardly a ball hawk. 10 int's in his first 5 years. Ed Reed got a lot of picks, but he also got burnt a lot which is overlooked.

[OldSchool]

Berry compares to Polamalu the most. And Polamalu was hardly a ball hawk. 10 int's in his first 5 years. Ed Reed got a lot of picks, but he also got burnt a lot which is overlooked.

Probably because Reed gambled all of the time for the INT and loved to bait QBs into throws. Sometimes it got him into trouble.

[The Bad Guy]

Sadly, I think we've replaced Berry with Abdullah. Abdullah is doing everything you'd ask Berry to do.

I say sadly, because I love Eric Berry. But he's on the outside looking in.

You're crazy. Abdullah isn't a force in the run game, so no, he's not doing everything.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

I agree the Chiefs will retain him.

I hope it's at the going rate of $8-9m/year and not something ridiculous.

We'll get him for that. He wants to be here. He's not going to pull a Houston on us. And no one can really blame Houston for not wanting to be here. It's been fairly fucked up around here long before he showed up, and I doubt the dude is satisfied with Mosaic every weekend.

[Dragonocho]

Eric Berry was not worth a number 3 overall pick nor is he worth resigning to a big contract. He is a great safety.

[BossChief]

Earl Thomas is overrated.

We had this argument months ago and I thought we put it to rest.

I don't remember the exact stats but Earl Thomas only averaged like 1.2 more INTs per season than Berry while Berry has notched FAR more sacks and tackles for loss.

Thomas has 15 picks

Berry has 8

[OldSchool]

We'll get him for that. He wants to be here. He's not going to pull a Houston on us. And no one can really blame Houston for not wanting to be here. It's been fairly ****ed up around here long before he showed up, and I doubt the dude is satisfied with Mosaic every weekend.

Wouldn't be surprised one bit if Houston decides to pull an Albert.

"Overpay me or I walk."

Dorsey's response: "Oh, so franchise tag?"

[BossChief]

We'll get him for that. He wants to be here. He's not going to pull a Houston on us. And no one can really blame Houston for not wanting to be here. It's been fairly ****ed up around here long before he showed up, and I doubt the dude is satisfied with Mosaic every weekend.

Berry is already filthy Rich...Houston is still very hungry.

Also, Houston is a FAR BETTER OLB than Berry is a safety.

Jmo

[Urc Burry]

Thomas has 15 picks

Berry has 8

15 in 4 years

8 in 3 years

One of them plays centerfield and the other spends a lot of time in the box. I'm not arguing who's better in coverage.. It's obviously Thomas. But berry brings a lot more to the table

[BossChief]

Berry:

5.5 sacks
8 ints
3 forced fumbles

For him to be worthy of something over 9-10 per year, he should have a season with those stats...not those being his career stats for a guy in his 5th year and being hurt.

I love watching him play and it would suck to lose him, but it wouldn't be the end of the world if the money was used appropriately...not like giving it all to a backup QB, JAG TE and a punter...know what I'm saying

[BossChief]

15 in 4 years

8 in 3 years

One of them plays centerfield and the other spends a lot of time in the box. I'm not arguing who's better in coverage.. It's obviously Thomas. But berry brings a lot more to the table

They were drafted the same year...trying to throw out years Berry has lost/is losing to injury is just silly.

I'd pay Thomas 10 a year without blinking while I'd be reluctant to offer Berry 8.

This is a passing league and in this division, playmakers in the secondary are worth far more than box safeties.

Just trying to be objective and leave the emotions out of it.

[jd1020]

They were drafted the same year...trying to throw out years Berry has lost/is losing to injury is just silly.

I'd pay Thomas 10 a year without blinking while I'd be reluctant to offer Berry 8.

It's silly to not count the year Stevie Johnson decided to **** Berry's knee up against him? Ok...

[OldSchool]

15 in 4 years

8 in 3 years

One of them plays centerfield and the other spends a lot of time in the box. I'm not arguing who's better in coverage.. It's obviously Thomas. But berry brings a lot more to the table

Thomas can do a lot of the same things that Berry does. But can Berry play CF as effectively as Thomas can?

[BossChief]

It's silly to not count the year Stevie Johnson decided to **** Berry's knee up against him? Ok...

If we are talking about giving a big contract to a player...missing as many games to injury as Berry has should be a major factor.

Would you give Berry 10/yr?

I wouldn't unless he is taking the ball away...sorry, but he doesn't do that enough.

[Urc Burry]

Thomas can do a lot of the same things that Berry does. But can Berry play CF as effectively as Thomas can?

Seriously? You think Thomas could jump in the box and we wouldn't miss a beat? And no, Berry can't touch Thomas in the centerfield. No one in the league can. But that doesn't mean Berry wouldn't be worth the contract. He is the best SS in the league.

[Urc Burry]

If we are talking about giving a big contract to a player...missing as many games to injury as Berry has should be a major factor.

Would you give Berry 10/yr?

I wouldn't unless he is taking the ball away...sorry, but he doesn't do that.

You act like Thomas averages 7 picks a year. It's literally one more per year than Berry

[jd1020]

If we are talking about giving a big contract to a player...missing as many games to injury as Berry has should be a major factor.

I don't think any rational person would count the Stevie Johnson year against him, especially after he came back and was an All-Pro.

I'd give him 9/yr and not think twice about it. There's a fucking reason he's 2nd behind Earl Thomas on damn near every list of Safeties.

[BossChief]

You act like Thomas averages 7 picks a year. It's literally one more per year than Berry

Thomas has 15 and Berry has 8. Try to do math on earth...ok?

[OldSchool]

Seriously? You think Thomas could jump in the box and we wouldn't miss a beat? And no, Berry can't touch Thomas in the centerfield. No one in the league can. But that doesn't mean Berry wouldn't be worth the contract. He is the best SS in the league.

Yes. Thomas has phenomenal instincts, is a great tackler, and his athleticism is more than on par with Berry's.

[BossChief]

I don't think any rational person would count the Stevie Johnson year against him, especially after he came back and was an All-Pro.

I'd give him 9/yr and not think twice about it. There's a ****ing reason he's 2nd behind Earl Thomas on damn near every list of Safeties.

I wouldn't be mad if they gave him 9/yr...I just don't think he's worth that much.

He is a box safety that is bordering on injury prone.

[Hootie]

oh good grief guys

Eric Berry is the background on my phone and currently my favorite Chiefs player

but he's not been as good as Earl Thomas

[Urc Burry]

Thomas has 15 and Berry has 8. Try to do math on earth...ok?

:banghead: I am not counting a full season Berry missed because of a cheap shot against him. You are bending these stats so they help your argument

[BossChief]

:banghead: I am not counting a full season Berry missed because of a cheap shot against him. You are bending these stats so they help your argument

I'm not bending anything. I'm not gonna just act like the guy has been reliable, either. Where's he now?

[Urc Burry]

oh good grief guys

Eric Berry is the background on my phone and currently my favorite Chiefs player

but he's not been as good as Earl Thomas

I don't think he is either. But he is #2 in my book. He has gotten to be very under appreciated around here

[Hootie]

well he needs to be on the field

no doubt

he's been good, sometimes great

but I expected elite

[OldSchool]

well he needs to be on the field

no doubt

he's been good, sometimes great

but I expected elite

Being drafted so high and watching him play in college, I expected the next HOF safety.

[BossChief]

Exactly. I thought he would be the sophomore Eric Berry from Tennessee the BIGTIME playmaking...thrilling to watch and scary to have to face player they made music videos about...nope...he's been Kiffens box safety.

[Mr. Laz]

I'm not letting the 25-year old safety walk.

I doubt the Chiefs will either.
7 years, 70 million?


I mean you are not letting him walk so back the truck up.


Houston another 100 million because nobody is 'letting him walk' either.


Just how much of the salary cap is everyone willing to use to keep Berry?

[WhiteWhale]

Yeah, well I'm done with this thread. Little substance other than 'he hasn't met my unrealistic expectations"

IMO, this thread is full retard. Folks bitched around here that we needed an elite safety and when we get one they want to let him walk. Go figure.

Again, this is why we can't have nice things. Sometimes I forget this is the same fanbase that wanted to trade Derrick Thomas half of his career in KC.

[Mr. Laz]

Yeah, well I'm done with this thread. Little substance other than 'he hasn't met my unrealistic expectations"

IMO, this thread is full retard. Folks bitched around here that we needed an elite safety and when we get one they want to let him walk. Go figure.

Again, this is why we can't have nice things. Sometimes I forget this is the same fanbase that wanted to trade Derrick Thomas half of his career in KC.
Eric Berry's first contract was 50 million.

He isn't going to want a paycut. How much are you willing to pay?

The more you give Berry the less you have for Houston.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

Yeah, I said I was being sarcastic because I was. I'd wager if you flipped these two players teams they play for, Berry would be the all star everyone thought he was going too be when he came into the league. I don't think Earl is better. I think he's coached better, and has better personnel around him. JMO.

[Deberg_1990]

Who's greater....Eric Berry or Jerome Woods?

[ThaVirus]

Wild guess here but Berry has had far more opportunities to do so. Thomas is typically in the center-fielder role for the Seahawks and doesn't play in the box nearly as often as Berry does.


Yeah, that's the point. Any time BossChief talks about Berry he compares him to Jairus Byrd and Earl Thomas, claiming he should be getting more INTs.

A more apt comparison would be Kam Chancellor and TJ Ward. Guess what? Berry has more a impactful stat sheet than both of them.

SURPRISE, MOTHERFUCKER!

Thomas has 15 picks



Berry has 8


Others have already answered for me but you're really going to count the year he went out with an ACL injury in week 1? LMAO

Earl Thomas averages barely over 1 more INT than Berry per year while being put in position to do so.

Meanwhile, do you want to know how many more sacks, QB hits, and hurries Berry averages over Thomas? Because Berry led all safeties in the league in those categories last season. Plus he makes more plays behind the line of scrimmage.

Yes. Thomas has phenomenal instincts, is a great tackler, and his athleticism is more than on par with Berry's.


He's also 5'10" 185 pounds and a horrendous open field tackler.

Don't let the LOB hype train fool you. Thomas has flaws as well.

Exactly. I thought he would be the sophomore Eric Berry from Tennessee the BIGTIME playmaking...thrilling to watch and scary to have to face player they made music videos about...nope...he's been Kiffens box safety.


So we're blaming Berry for scheme now?

[Direckshun]

I think Berry is a critical element of the defense. I know the Chiefs will keep him.

[kcxiv]

Being drafted so high and watching him play in college, I expected the next HOF safety.

Well he's also had some shitty ass coaches got his knee took out. What can you do. sometimes it doesnt work out the way it should

[Johnny Vegas]

didn't read all 12 pages but does anyone here regret the Chiefs didn't select Earl Thomas instead?

[jonzie04]

Berry is the best box safety on the NFL. the guy had more tackles for a loss than ****ing Patrick Willis last year.... more than Justin smith, ndomukung suh, demarcus ware, von miller, vontaze Burfict, the list goes on and on and on... no way in hell you let that kind of talent walk... and no way you minimize his effectiveness by forcing him to play fs.. making him play fs or letting him walk would be nearly as dumb as forcing Jamaal Charles to play full back or letting him walk.

Berry also had 1 less tackle for a loss than NFL defensive MVP Luke kuechly... a lot of you guys just dont fully grasp how deadly berry is at, and behind the line of scrimmage...

[The Bad Guy]

7 years, 70 million?


I mean you are not letting him walk so back the truck up.


Houston another 100 million because nobody is 'letting him walk' either.


Just how much of the salary cap is everyone willing to use to keep Berry?

Berry's not getting 10 million a year. Nor is Houston hitting the 100 million dollar mark.

Berry will be around 4 years, 33 million. Houston around 5 years, 63 million.

[chiefzilla1501]

It's really impossible to explain...
Berry is much better than Abdullah
DJ is much better than JMJ

Yet somehow this defense is playing better without these 2 guys. I like Berry a lot. But it doesn't make much sense that this team has played so much better without him. Why is it?

Also, given Abdullah's success at SS, I think the Chiefs need to permanently prep Berry to play FS.

[Exoter175]

We know what it's going to cost to keep him. Question is he worth the money? Has this defense missed him?

I think there's a noticeable difference without Berry against the run. The pass defense looks similar though.

For a team in cap trouble I don't think Berry is a must re-sign guy.

1. We aren't in cap trouble, and we're not GOING to be in cap trouble, you guys need to ease off all this "Cut everybody" cap talk lately. We're carrying excess money into next years' cap, plus the added cap ceiling, plus a lot of ground work in contracts this season and this off-season that are going to give us a shit ton of room.

2. I want Berry to stay, but if he remains to be injured, then he's just not worth the money. We can pay a ton of guys 1.5-3.5M/year to come in and do the same job he's doing right now (Sitting on the bench) and have the same defense, and its going to be a FUCK TON cheaper. However, Berry's probably the biggest playmaker on defense, the problem is, how long has it been since he made a play?

3. Unless he comes back and plays with his ass on fire, I'm betting he's gone, or possibly even traded here in the next week or two if Dorsey doesn't like what he sees.

For Reference, Berry has played in 50 games out of a possible 69 so far in his career, however, 1 of those games (week 17 SD) he was rested so really he's 50/68 possible games, or 73.5% of possible starts.

Also, in 4 previous seasons, he's had 3 full seasons, of which all 3 full seasons he made the pro-bowl. Though this year he is injured and seemingly unproductive in his games he has played, so he'll likely go down as 3/5 seasons in the pro bowl, 2/5 seasons injured, 1/5 seasons on IR.

Also, I should put extreme emphasis on here that I am EXTREMELY perplexed in this situation with Berry because the combination of DJ and Berry are the heart and soul of this defensive unit, both of them are injured this year, both of them have question marks on their tenure here, and I've never been more excited about a tandem of talent on this Chiefs Defense since the days of DT56 and Neil Smith, so the situations really vexes me.

[SAUTO]

Traded in the next week or 2? what the fuck are you on?

[Marcellus]

1. We aren't in cap trouble, and we're not GOING to be in cap trouble, you guys need to ease off all this "Cut everybody" cap talk lately. We're carrying excess money into next years' cap, plus the added cap ceiling, plus a lot of ground work in contracts this season and this off-season that are going to give us a shit ton of room.

We have $3MM in space right now out of $137.5MM cap. What is all this $ we are carrying over?

We won't have much cap space without making room.

[the Talking Can]

7 years, 70 million?


I mean you are not letting him walk so back the truck up.


Houston another 100 million because nobody is 'letting him walk' either.


Just how much of the salary cap is everyone willing to use to keep Berry?

where do you come up with these retarded numbers?

remember when Bowe was going to get $100 million?

earl thomas - who people here bizarrely think is much better than berry - got 5 years at $45 mill, with $27 guaranteed

but Berry is getting 7 and $70 mill?

LMAO
---------------

changing subjects:

Berry's numbers are totally skewed by his injury...

his rookie year: 90 tackles, 2sacks, 4ints, 1int for td return (truly one of the great rookie seasons ever by a safety)
2nd : blown knee
3rd: average...0sacks, 1int
4th: 73 tackles, 3.5sacks, 3ints, 2ints for td return, 2 fumble recovery

clearly, when fully healthy, he's an impact player...you want to ding him for being injured, fine...you want to claim he isn't an all-pro safety or an impact player

go jump off a bridge

[The Bad Guy]

We have $3MM in space right now out of $137.5MM cap. What is all this $ we are carrying over?

We won't have much cap space without making room.

I think right now they have 10 million in space. They can roll over that number I believe and then they'll have to restructure Tamba.

They'll have space.

[The Bad Guy]

where do you come up with these retarded numbers?

remember when Bowe was going to get $100 million?

earl thomas - who people here bizarrely think is much better than berry - got 5 years at $45 mill, with $27 guaranteed

but Berry is getting 7 and $70 mill?

LMAO
---------------

changing subjects:

Berry's numbers are totally skewed by his injury...

his rookie year: 90 tackles, 2sacks, 4ints, 1int for td return (truly one of the great rookie seasons ever by a safety)
2nd : blown knee
3rd: average...0sacks, 1int
4th: 73 tackles, 3.5sacks, 3ints, 2ints for td return, 2 fumble recovery

clearly, when fully healthy, he's an impact player...you want to ding him for being injured, fine...you want to claim he isn't an all-pro safety or an impact player

go jump off a bridge

Bravo. Bravo.

[Exoter175]

We have $3MM in space right now out of $137.5MM cap. What is all this $ we are carrying over?

We won't have much cap space without making room.

Uhhh, noooooooo scott.

We've got 4.9MM right now, with a 134.6M Cap, with 121.5M in Active Cap Spending, and 8.3M in Dead Money.

Allow me to "School" you on a little bit about the "cap" for a moment.

The "cap carryover" something that's been in place for a very long time, is a pooling of the "Unspent" money from the "official" cap, and carried over to the next season as a buffer to allow a team to sign draft picks, important players, candy machines, whatever you want.

Example, if a team spendds 130M in a 133M Cap Season on their "official" cap, then the next season they get 130M+3M+Cap Increase to spend.

Did you know the Broncos in 2013 had a 2M larger team cap than we did? And in 2014, 8M larger than we do.

However, the cap carryover and following years cap is not only determined by the league "cap" but also by number of contracts, dead money, etc. So while we might not get to keep 20M of our cap if we underspent one year, we'll likely get a large portion of it, like this years Cleveland Browns with a Cap space of over 155M!!!!!! 21M more than we do!

Cap numbers also provide a very good indicator of a number of things. 1: Good GM's. If you have a team in the bottom 10-16 of the cap spending, but put themselves in the playoffs the year prior? Good job! Even more kudos for repeated success.

On top of that, cap numbers are really good indicators of team age and talent, as an older, more veteran team is likely to have less cap space based on the CBA's mandated minimum value contracts, and also smaller team cap totals based on lack of carry over and conversely dead money/penalties against cap.

The Rams, Jaguars, Chiefs, and Cowboys are the 4 youngest teams in the NFL. They rank 27th, 5th, 18th, and 19th in Total team salary cap. The Raiders, Giants, Bears, and Colts rank 30th, 26th, 21st, and 32nd in total team Salary cap, they have the 4 oldest teams.

Now, of course, there's a lot of back and forth to the numbers. While younger teams on average have a larger team cap than older teams, a bad owner or genius owner with a good or bad GM could heavily influence team cap space as well as total team cap based on transactions such as not signing big name free agents, cultivating their own youth, or even overpaying and cutting talent, etc. etc. etc.

But at the end of the day, a team like Kansas City is going to sit in that 15-25 range almost indefinitely, unless we clear house, like we've done many times in the past to "warrant" more cap space. We will "always" have 5-10M per season to play with based on how this team has operated over the last 20 years or so. Hell, at the start of the season we had like 11.5M in cap room before having to make some roster moves and promoting guys up from the practice squad (which costs us cap space) and signing guys to the practice squad (which counts against our team spending towards the CBA mandated 90%).

All in all, next season the cap is rumored to be an arbitrary 140M, but if roger goodell is still in business, I expect that number to be 142/143M, and the Chiefs carrying over 3M in cap room (low estimate) with 8M in dead money should net a team cap of about 145.5M next season, not counting any "unusual" transactions and cuts in this off season. Obviously we'll let guys go and that cap space is going to significantly clear out.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Whatever transpires, I do know this:

It will be dumb on multiple levels.

[Exoter175]

Traded in the next week or 2? what the fuck are you on?

The trade deadline you dumb redneck, you know, the last day of the team season where we can trade players to avoid huge cap issues later on down the road?:banghead:

I'm not saying we "should" do it, but if this team's braintrust decides Berry is a guy we could cut, we certainly need to entertain for the next two weeks, the possibility of getting some draft picks for him if we don't have a plan for him moving forward.

[Exoter175]

And while we're talking about the cap for a moment, let me explain to the Cooper Boo-birds, how amazing that guy is.

He is under contract through 2016, right?

His 2014 cap number? 495k, no bonuses, no nothing. His 2015 number? 585k, no bonuses, no nothing. 2016 cap number? 675k no bonuses, no nothing.

A grand total of 1.755M from 2014 through the 2016 seasons, against the cap with basically ZERO dead money if we cut him, but why would he? He's actually a pretty decent man cover corner, young, and learning. And Did I mention he is costing us 30% of Sean Smith's 2014 salary, but for 3 years!!!!!!!

[mcaj22]

I think right now they have 10 million in space. They can roll over that number I believe and then they'll have to restructure Tamba.

They'll have space.

So you think Tamba stays?

thats a minority opinion around here

[Exoter175]

So you think Tamba stays?

thats a minority opinion around here

Not really. There's a number of us who believe he's going to sign a team "friendly" deal and stay with us, he doesn't seem the "type" to take the big money from the Lions and leave KC which has been kind to him and made it his home.

[beach tribe]

It's really impossible to explain...
Berry is much better than Abdullah
DJ is much better than JMJ

Yet somehow this defense is playing better without these 2 guys. I like Berry a lot. But it doesn't make much sense that this team has played so much better without him. Why is it?

Also, given Abdullah's success at SS, I think the Chiefs need to permanently prep Berry to play FS.

Since you have no way of knowing what this defense would look like with the two of them b healthy your point is moot.
Do you remember what this d looked like at this point in the season last year.....yeah.

[Chiefnj2]

Didn't San Fran just pound the ball down KCs throats late in the last game to get the win?

I'm not sure the D is better, especially the run D.

[beach tribe]

Berry is the best box safety on the NFL. the guy had more tackles for a loss than ****ing Patrick Willis last year.... more than Justin smith, ndomukung suh, demarcus ware, von miller, vontaze Burfict, the list goes on and on and on... no way in hell you let that kind of talent walk... and no way you minimize his effectiveness by forcing him to play fs.. making him play fs or letting him walk would be nearly as dumb as forcing Jamaal Charles to play full back or letting him walk.

Berry also had 1 less tackle for a loss than NFL defensive MVP Luke kuechly... a lot of you guys just dont fully grasp how deadly berry is at, and behind the line of scrimmage...

I like how the naysayers have ignored O' jonzie here.
He pretty much stuck a fork in their argument against his performance.

[Exoter175]

Didn't San Fran just pound the ball down KCs throats late in the last game to get the win?

I'm not sure the D is better, especially the run D.

Lets not attribute all of that to the absence of Berry, while he makes much flashier plays than anyone else on this defense, and certainly accounts for more tackles at the line or behind it than anybody except maybe Poe, DJ is the reason this run D was good, and his absence is far, far worse than Berry's. He's the captain, the guy calling adjustments, and probably the best non Dline on this team at limiting yardage at first contact.

[Titty Meat]

I think Berry is a critical element of the defense. I know the Chiefs will keep him.

They were the 11th overall defense without him and have played good this year. I'm not saying he's a bad player, i'm saying given the teams cap space and performance he's an expendable player. Guys they can't lose on defense: Houston, Hali, and Poe. Those are the guys you can't let go.

[Titty Meat]

So you think Tamba stays?

thats a minority opinion around here

I agree with Frank. They will atleast try to re-do his deal. No way they cut a guy who has a few good years left at the most important position on defense.

[SAUTO]

The trade deadline you dumb redneck, you know, the last day of the team season where we can trade players to avoid huge cap issues later on down the road?:banghead:

I'm not saying we "should" do it, but if this team's braintrust decides Berry is a guy we could cut, we certainly need to entertain for the next two weeks, the possibility of getting some draft picks for him if we don't have a plan for him moving forward.

yeah i understand why you said it but that doesnt make it any less stupid.

and calling me a fucking redneck is ROFL

[Mr. Laz]

And while we're talking about the cap for a moment, let me explain to the Cooper Boo-birds, how amazing that guy is.

He is under contract through 2016, right?

His 2014 cap number? 495k, no bonuses, no nothing. His 2015 number? 585k, no bonuses, no nothing. 2016 cap number? 675k no bonuses, no nothing.

A grand total of 1.755M from 2014 through the 2016 seasons, against the cap with basically ZERO dead money if we cut him, but why would he? He's actually a pretty decent man cover corner, young, and learning. And Did I mention he is costing us 30% of Sean Smith's 2014 salary, but for 3 years!!!!!!!
Cooper is a great guy to have on the team, he just shouldn't be starting yet.

He would be perfect as a nickle/ST type guy.

probably a great gunner

[The Franchise]

Exactly. I thought he would be the sophomore Eric Berry from Tennessee the BIGTIME playmaking...thrilling to watch and scary to have to face player they made music videos about...nope...he's been Kiffens box safety.

Thank Romeo Crennel for that fuck up.

[Eleazar]

Is this guy ever going to be completely healthy? :huh:

[Mr. Laz]

Berry's not getting 10 million a year. Nor is Houston hitting the 100 million dollar mark.

Berry will be around 4 years, 33 million. Houston around 5 years, 63 million.
so Berry is basically going to take a paycut?

4 years,33 million is less than his rookie deal.


Players almost never take less with their current team. They leave and get less with another team, some sort of pride thing.

[The Franchise]

so Berry is basically going to take a paycut?

4 years,33 million is less than his rookie deal.


Players almost never take less with their current team. They leave and get less with another team, some sort of pride thing.

I could see him taking a little less than what he's making now.

Ward only got a 4 year $22 million dollar deal. Obviously his rookie contract wasn't as high as Berry's but I'm sure Berry is going to realize that he's not going to hit that rookie deal again.

[the Talking Can]

Berry's rookie contract is a relic of a market that no longer exists


he'll get paid what the current market is paying for his position and talent

[The Franchise]

That would be like Sam Bradford not signing a new deal with the Rams and then getting pissed because he's not getting $70 million dollar offers.

[Demonpenz]

Berry hasn't wowed me at all.

[Mr. Laz]

I could see him taking a little less than what he's making now.

Ward only got a 4 year $22 million dollar deal. Obviously his rookie contract wasn't as high as Berry's but I'm sure Berry is going to realize that he's not going to hit that rookie deal again.
Players tend to get pissed off when their current team offers less.

Then they go to another team and get less ... happens all the time.

[Jimmya]

Totally agree with Mr. Laz...but i feel that KC doesn't owe Berry that much because he has been hurt quite a bit lately.

[Titty Meat]

Anytime you have a guy who plays the way Berry plays you'll have some injuries. That's not the reason why I asked the question though. Team performance without him + salary cap is a pretty valid argument.

[BossChief]

"We shouldn't compare him to Earl Thomas and Jarius Byrd..we need to compare him to Kam Chancellor and TJ Ward"

Funny how that's the response to me saying that unless he provides more impact, he shouldn't get 10/yr type money...when those guys are getting/will get around 5/yr.

Like I've said over and over, he deserves 7-8 per year...anything more is like paying for a Lexus but getting a Toyota Avalon. You still got a good car, but you should probably stop planning the vacation to Vegas because you overspent.

[ThaVirus]

"We shouldn't compare him to Earl Thomas and Jarius Byrd..we need to compare him to Kam Chancellor and TJ Ward"



Funny how that's the response to me saying that unless he provides more impact, he shouldn't get 10/yr type money...when those guys are getting/will get around 5/yr.



Like I've said over and over, he deserves 7-8 per year...anything more is like paying for a Lexus but getting a Toyota Avalon. You still got a good car, but you should probably stop planning the vacation to Vegas because you overspent.


I actually agree that he's worth around $7-8 mil a year, but whenever we discuss this, you generally stick to riding on him for "lack of production" compared to Thomas and Byrd.

You ALWAYS say he needs to force more turnovers, particularly INTs, while claiming he's nowhere near as good at it as Thomas and Byrd. Well, I'm telling you: NO FUCKING SHIT. He plays an entirely different position and scheme. He's not often put in position to sit back in center field and read the QBs eyes like those other guys so it makes sense that his INT totals would reflect it. But he makes up for it in other areas like rushing the passer, generating tackles for loss, neutralizing TEs, and filling holes in the run game (where, surprise surprise, he's FAR superior to guys like Thomas and Byrd). And for all the dick riding you do of Earl Thomas, he only averages just over 1 INT more than Berry per year.

He's better than Ward and Chancellor. You could make an argument for him being better than Byrd and Thomas as well. It just depends on what you find important in terms of production from your safety.

[Demonpenz]

neutralizing the tight end hehe

[ThaVirus]

neutralizing the tight end hehe


That was his main responsibility in our scheme last season and the only team that limited TE production as well as us was the Bills.

Check the stats.

[RealSNR]

I really like Berry.

I just like Justin Houston more.

I hope we keep both.

[BlackOp]

That was his main responsibility in our scheme last season and the only team that limited TE production as well as us was the Bills.

Check the stats.

KC played a lot of trash QBs last season too...

I would say of all the star players on defense, Berry is the most expendable. Houston and Poe are way more important. I would actually say Poe is the most important player on defense..he's a rare dude. There is a reason safeties are rarely taken in the top ten. I would rather have a good 6-2 CB across from Smith and a healthy DJ.

Keeping Berry depends on what he is asking...if he is expecting 10+ mil..he can leave.

[ThaVirus]

KC played a lot of trash QBs last season too...

I would say of all the star players on defense, Berry is the most expendable. Houston and Poe are way more important. I would actually say Poe is the most important player on defense..he's a rare dude. There is a reason safeties are rarely taken in the top ten.

Keeping Berry depends on what he is asking...if he is expecting 10+ mil..he can leave.


We also played some great QB-TE combos in Peyton/J Thomas x2, Rivers/Gates, Luck/Fleener x2. Romo/Witten.

Jordan Cameron and the Celek/Ertz combo are pretty good too.

Agreed on everything else though. He's easily the least important of the big 3.

[The Bad Guy]

so Berry is basically going to take a paycut?

4 years,33 million is less than his rookie deal.


Players almost never take less with their current team. They leave and get less with another team, some sort of pride thing.

What he's making now has zero barring on what he'll make on his next deal.

The market was set with Thomas's deal - not Berry's out of whack rookie wage deal.

Do you think Sam Bradford is taking less in his next deal?

[BossChief]

I don't think Thomas' deal set the market for all safeties. TJ Ward was an all pro iirc and he got about half of what Earl got.

[Easy 6]

I love this kid and the potential he represents (he's still plenty young), but we need him healthy and its starting to seem like he's going to have nagging issues from here out.

If this continues I wont be crushed if they let him go in a year or two... Houston and Poe are the two defensive must haves.

[rabblerouser]

I actually agree that he's worth around $7-8 mil a year, but whenever we discuss this, you generally stick to riding on him for "lack of production" compared to Thomas and Byrd.

You ALWAYS say he needs to force more turnovers, particularly INTs, while claiming he's nowhere near as good at it as Thomas and Byrd. Well, I'm telling you: NO ****ING SHIT. He plays an entirely different position and scheme. He's not often put in position to sit back in center field and read the QBs eyes like those other guys so it makes sense that his INT totals would reflect it. But he makes up for it in other areas like rushing the passer, generating tackles for loss, neutralizing TEs, and filling holes in the run game (where, surprise surprise, he's FAR superior to guys like Thomas and Byrd). And for all the dick riding you do of Earl Thomas, he only averages just over 1 INT more than Berry per year.

He's better than Ward and Chancellor. You could make an argument for him being better than Byrd and Thomas as well. It just depends on what you find important in terms of production from your safety.

Ahhh, I see you actually watch football..

Berry is a game-changer.

[Mav]

Ahhh, I see you actually watch football..

Berry is a game-changer.

He is a game changer. He is, but, his physical style leads to short careers. Just see Bob Sanders.

[Deberg_1990]

Berry hasn't wowed me at all.

Pretty much how I feel.

Solid, but not spectacular


He's basically Jerome Woods II

[lcarus]

well he needs to be on the field

no doubt

he's been good, sometimes great

but I expected elite

It's like he's always been on the brink of becoming elite, but then he gets hurt or something. That rookie year, he really looked like a rookie SS that would be elite soon. I just hope the nagging injuries don't stop him from realizing his true potential.

[Easy 6]

Ahhh, I see you actually watch football..

Berry is a game-changer.

Game changers, by definition, are in the game to change it.

Not saying Eric cant still be that guy, but you get my point.

[rabblerouser]

Game changers, by definition, are in the game to change it.

Not saying Eric cant still be that guy, but you get my point.

That ACL was NOT his fault. That was Stevie Johnson.

Fuck the Buffalo Bills, btw.

[BossChief]

Nobody is saying Eric Berry isn't good or that we shouldn't re-sign him after next year...some of us just don't think he is worth elite type money.

[ThaVirus]

Pretty much how I feel.



Solid, but not spectacular





He's basically Jerome Woods II



It's like he's always been on the brink of becoming elite, but then he gets hurt or something. That rookie year, he really looked like a rookie SS that would be elite soon. I just hope the nagging injuries don't stop him from realizing his true potential.


He is elite. All-Pro last season.

You could really only make an argument that Chancellor is a better SS and look at the position he's in. He has All-Pros on either side of him, probably the best coverage LBs in the league in front of him, and one of the fiercest pass rushes in the league.

[Easy 6]

That ACL was NOT his fault. That was Stevie Johnson.

**** the Buffalo Bills, btw.

Not even talking about that cheap bitch shot by Johnson.

Its this sore foot business that has me worried.

[OldSchool]

He is elite. All-Pro last season.

You could really only make an argument that Chancellor is a better SS and look at the position he's in. He has All-Pros on either side of him, probably the best coverage LBs in the league in front of him, and one of the fiercest pass rushes in the league.

Chancellor is the only safety left in the league that truly puts the fear of getting destroyed while going over the middle into opposing receivers. Crazy thing is he does it while avoiding hits that might draw a flag.

[The Bad Guy]

So you think Tamba stays?

thats a minority opinion around here

I think they'll at least attempt to retain him. He's not declining much, and I think he still has another 2-3 good years in him.

Try to restructure first, and if you can't get that number to a solid number, then cut him, but this defense would suffer massively without him next year.

[The Bad Guy]

Pretty much how I feel.

Solid, but not spectacular


He's basically Jerome Woods II

Jesus.

[The Bad Guy]

I don't think Thomas' deal set the market for all safeties. TJ Ward was an all pro iirc and he got about half of what Earl got.

I think it set the absolute ceiling.

[BossChief]

I think it set the absolute ceiling.

Agreed.

I think Berry will need to take a team friendly deal to stay. Something like 5/40 max with 25 guaranteed.

[WhiteWhale]

I think they'll at least attempt to retain him. He's not declining much, and I think he still has another 2-3 good years in him.

Try to restructure first, and if you can't get that number to a solid number, then cut him, but this defense would suffer massively without him next year.

Tamba does most of his work with technique rather than great athletic ability. If he can stay healthy, he'll likely remain productive.

He's just really good at disengaging pass blockers with his hands.

[Easy 6]

... this defense would suffer massively without him next year.

Yes, yes it would.

[Mr. Laz]

What he's making now has zero barring on what he'll make on his next deal.

bullshit

"we really want you to stay with us but your paycheck is going to drop 1/3 from now on"

umm .. yea

[Easy 6]

Chancellor is the only safety left in the league that truly puts the fear of getting destroyed while going over the middle into opposing receivers. Crazy thing is he does it while avoiding hits that might draw a flag.

This is definitely true, its his size and strength, he doesnt need a cheap shot to put stars in someones eyes.

Someones getting hurt.

[ThaVirus]

Chancellor is the only safety left in the league that truly puts the fear of getting destroyed while going over the middle into opposing receivers. Crazy thing is he does it while avoiding hits that might draw a flag.


Of course. He's 6'3" 230 and they play primarily zone so he can sit back and wait for guys to come across the middle and lay wood.

[BossChief]

bullshit

"we really want you to stay with us but your paycheck is going to drop 1/3 from now on"

umm .. yea

You can't be serious.

I guarantee you that Berry realizes that his previous contract has nothing to do with his next deal.

If he wants to get paid, he needs to get his ass on the field and play at a high level because it's not what you've done as much as whet you will be able to do.

[The Bad Guy]

bullshit

"we really want you to stay with us but your paycheck is going to drop 1/3 from now on"

umm .. yea

A 4 year, 33 million dollar deal actually isn't a paycut for Berry considering his deal on average nets him 8.3 million a year.

That's not 1/3rd of his current pay. That's straight in line what he's getting paid right now. He's not getting 10 million a year when Earl Thomas didn't.

[chiefzilla1501]

I don't think Thomas' deal set the market for all safeties. TJ Ward was an all pro iirc and he got about half of what Earl got.
Not sure why you keep bringing up ward. Ward is okay. Solid but unspectacular. The Browns didn't pass on him because they couldn't afford him. They passed on him to pay Whitner more money. Whitner sets berry's floor. Berry is younger and better and Whitner got paid 7 mil.

I'm stuck. I really like berry. But it's puzzling why it feels like we barely even notice he's missing. Credit to Abdullah but he's not that good. Maybe Parker is better than I give him credit for and berry could be downright nasty next to safety who doesn't have his head up his ass.

[Easy 6]

Not sure why you keep bringing up ward. Ward is okay. Solid but unspectacular. The Browns didn't pass on him because they couldn't afford him. They passed on him to pay Whitner more money. Whitner sets berry's floor. Berry is younger and better and Whitner got paid 7 mil.

I'm stuck. I really like berry. But it's puzzling why it feels like we barely even notice he's missing. Credit to Abdullah but he's not that good. Maybe Parker is better than I give him credit for and berry could be downright nasty next to safety who doesn't have his head up his ass.

We're noticing his absence against the run more than anything IMO, which is kind of a backhanded compliment... we need Eric in the deep backfield doing some ballhawking, period.

When/if Sutton ever gets him back healthy... how he uses Berry will determine how I feel about him as a coordinator going forward. I'm more than willing to give up some of his blitzing, run tackling skills in exchange for some deep ball intercepting and swatting skills.

[chiefzilla1501]

We're noticing his absence against the run more than anything IMO, which is kind of a backhanded compliment... we need Eric in the deep backfield doing some ballhawking, period.

When/if Sutton ever gets him back healthy... how he uses Berry will determine how I feel about him as a coordinator going forward. I'm more than willing to give up some of his blitzing, run tackling skills in exchange for some deep ball intercepting and swatting skills.
I think so but I think the much bigger difference there is not having dj. And Mauga is decent depth but it stops there. I wonder if Abdullah with dj and mays would be just fine.

The bigger difference was supposed to be his pass rush. But that hasn't been hurting either. And his leadership and football iq but I wonder if maybe we're overrating those things?

[The Bad Guy]

I think Mays will help a lot in run support. He's a thumper and I think JMJ will play much better when he's back.

[BlackOp]

I think so but I think the much bigger difference there is not having dj. And Mauga is decent depth but it stops there. I wonder if Abdullah with dj and mays would be just fine.

The bigger difference was supposed to be his pass rush. But that hasn't been hurting either. And his leadership and football iq but I wonder if maybe we're overrating those things?

I'm wondering if Mays and DJ were still playing...if Berry's absence would be noticed. KC is playing without Devito too..have to give Dorsey props that the backups are doing what backups should do. They arent totally sucking...

In today's NFL..it's a number$ game. Berry has always come off as much hype as production to me. I haven't seen him take over a game. I think that money could be allocated more effectively to other critical positions...