Need some advice from a LEO or social service person please

[Coochie liquor]

Very long story...
My oldest daughter has a friend who is her same age (20), her friend has a 4 year old that stayed with us for about a year and a half. She went back with her mom to Alabama when her father passed away. She within the last week has gotten arrested on possession charges. She is out on bond, is going to have to go thru a court drug program, and wants us to take Spencer again while she attempts to straighten her life out.
Melinda (Spencer's mom) got pregnant with Spencer when she was 15, the guy who is the father was 24. That should be stat rape if I understand the law. She is just attempting to get child support from him now. She dropped Spencer off with him (which was a horrible idea on many levels) on Wednesday. She stayed a couple nights. We were going to go pick Spencer up from Alabama today, but her father has her and won't give her back to Melinda so we can get her. He is not on the birth certificate. The police told her that if she willingly dropped her off there then they can't take her from the home unless she is in danger.
My only concern is Spencer and her well being. She is now in a home with her father who is basically a pedophile in my book. What can Melinda do to get Spencer from him. She is going to go file stat rape charges on him, but police say they have to give it to DA before they can do anything.
Please give me some advise. I'm very frustrated, and worries for Spencer. The pics I have seen posted she looks bad, big bags under her eyes etc. I need to get her out of this situation. Her mom is going o sign papers giving us temp custody so we can get her back to Florida. Please any help is greatly appreciated. PM me if you want.

Thanks in advance!

[J Diddy]

If there is an immediate danger hotline him. Otherwise the courts will have to run their course.

Have you tried talking to him?

[Bufkin]

You could always call and ask. If you don't have the number, I think Saccopoo does.

[Fish]

Tell the cops the kid might be in danger. The mother has all the power in the situation, despite where the kid is currently at. Take advantage of that.

[Coochie liquor]

Tell the cops the kid might be in danger. The mother has all the power in the situation, despite where the kid is currently at. Take advantage of that.

I haven't personally talked to him. Her mother has. The police went over there last night to do a welfare check to make sure she is ok. It's very bassackwards there I guess. I just don't understand how they can say he can have her when it's clear by just checking birth dates that he was 11-12 years older than her when she got pregnant at 15. He should not be able to have custody o her, right?

[J Diddy]

Tell the cops the kid might be in danger. The mother has all the power in the situation, despite where the kid is currently at. Take advantage of that.

To a degree.

She left said child at presumed father's house and is not available to pick him up.

[J Diddy]

I haven't personally talked to him. Her mother has. The police went over there last night to do a welfare check to make sure she is ok. It's very bassackwards there I guess. I just don't understand how they can say he can have her when it's clear by just checking birth dates that he was 11-12 years older than her when she got pregnant at 15. He should not be able to have custody o her, right?

Is it right? No
Does it have bearing on the current situation? Not at all.

If you continue to intertwine the two issues you are in for a mountain of frustration.

[Katipan]

Age of consent in Alabama is 16 and she's going after child support...

Good luck.

[Coochie liquor]

To a degree.

She left said child at presumed father's house and is not available to pick him up.

She is available to pick up Spencer, but he is refusing to give her back. Spencer is a girl BTW.

[Coochie liquor]

Age of consent in Alabama is 16 and she's going after child support...

Good luck.

Yeah, idk how that works not do I really care. That part doesn't affect me. I just want to get her into a safe place.

[Katipan]

Yeah, idk how that works not do I really care. That part doesn't affect me. I just want to get her into a safe place.

If that part doesn't matter to you then what is your reasoning for taking a kid from it's father?

[J Diddy]

She is available to pick up Spencer, but he is refusing to give her back. Spencer is a girl BTW.

Has she shown up to pick her up?

[Coochie liquor]

If that part doesn't matter to you then what is your reasoning for taking a kid from it's father?

Because she is not in a good place. I understand it's his daughter, but there are also drugs much heavier than weed being done in that house. And the fact that he is a predator in my eyes. Used drugs, alcohol, money etcetera to coerce a 15 year old into sex. The money part has nothing to do with me. I raised her for a year and half and never once asked for a penny. If she was in a stable environment then I wouldn't be as concerned, but getting tweaked out and not really keeping track of what the 4 year old is doing isn't a good situation!

[Katipan]

Because she is not in a good place. I understand it's his daughter, but there are also drugs much heavier than weed being done in that house. And the fact that he is a predator in my eyes. Used drugs, alcohol, money etcetera to coerce a 15 year old into sex. The money part has nothing to do with me. I raised her for a year and half and never once asked for a penny. If she was in a stable environment then I wouldn't be as concerned, but getting tweaked out and not really keeping track of what the 4 year old is doing isn't a good situation!

Cops went and found nothing?

[Fish]

I haven't personally talked to him. Her mother has. The police went over there last night to do a welfare check to make sure she is ok. It's very bassackwards there I guess. I just don't understand how they can say he can have her when it's clear by just checking birth dates that he was 11-12 years older than her when she got pregnant at 15. He should not be able to have custody o her, right?

Well if that's the case, and the cops have already been there, then you might as well have a beer and hope for the best in the time being. He won't be able to keep her for long though, cops will eventually get the kid back to the mom. Focus on the father not wanting to return the kid, and make your concerns of kidnapping known.

Social Services usually chooses what they feel is best for the kid. In doing so, they can often overlook things like the statutory rape angle, in hopes that a 2 parent family will be better for the child despite how that relationship started.

Best of luck. Tough situation..

[Coochie liquor]

Has she shown up to pick her up?

She didn't go there to get her. He told her via text he wasn't giving her back. I'm telling her now she needs to call the police and have them meet her there to get her. Is that what she needs to do?

[Katipan]

She didn't go there to get her. He told her via text he wasn't giving her back. I'm telling her now she needs to call the police and have them meet her there to get her. Is that what she needs to do?

I don't see how she gets the kid back without a court order if the dad shes asking for child support from wants her.

She can get a temporary order of custody.

Telling you right now the last thing kids need are the sirens and pounding of cops at their door as parents scream at eachother.

[J Diddy]

She didn't go there to get her. He told her via text he wasn't giving her back. I'm telling her now she needs to call the police and have them meet her there to get her. Is that what she needs to do?

yes

I don't know what the law is in that state but in MO, OR, and KS custody can't be assumed. It is the mothers to have until she either loses it or gives it away.

[Coochie liquor]

Cops went and found nothing?

He knew the cops were coming so he likely put away anything incriminating.

[J Diddy]

I don't see how she gets the kid back without a court order if the dad shes asking for child support from wants her.

She can get a temporary order of custody.

Telling you right now the last thing kids need are the sirens and pounding of cops at their door as parents scream at eachother.

Father never had custody. Friend of mine went down this road a couple of years back.

Agreed that the last thing needed is a continuous state of cop's knuckles pounding on doors.

[Coochie liquor]

It's a tough situation. I love this girl like she's my own. I just want her in a safe place, whether that's with me or someone else. But knowing some of what's going on in that house I know that's not a safe place for a 4 year old. Not that it matters at this point but he has a pretty long record also.

[Katipan]

He knew the cops were coming so he likely put away anything incriminating.

yeah I feel the pain. My crazy ex was popping pills like crazy but I couldn't prove it until he died.

It in no way took away his rights to his kids.

Tho if wishing made it so.

[Katipan]

Father never had custody. Friend of mine went down this road a couple of years back.

Agreed that the last thing needed is a continuous state of cop's knuckles pounding on doors.

But she handed the kid to the dad. Probably said heres daddy. Then asked for child support.

I think theres enough for the man to claim bitches are crazy.

[J Diddy]

It's a tough situation. I love this girl like she's my own. I just want her in a safe place, whether that's with me or someone else. But knowing some of what's going on in that house I know that's not a safe place for a 4 year old. Not that it matters at this point but he has a pretty long record also.

He can't just say I'm not giving her back.
A list of things he could do: file for custody (and temporary custody), work for what's in the best interest of the minor, or give her back

Those are her options.

[Coochie liquor]

yes

I don't know what the law is in that state but in MO, OR, and KS custody can't be assumed. It is the mothers to have until she either loses it or gives it away.

Thanks, I just told her she needs to go there. Call the police and have them meet her there.

[J Diddy]

But she handed the kid to the dad. Probably said heres daddy. Then asked for child support.

I think theres enough for the man to claim bitches are crazy.

Depends how she did it.




Coochie did she state when she was picking her up?

[Katipan]

Who cares if she did? He would just lie and say she didn't.

[Katipan]

For that matter he could say this chick ABANDONED the baby with him.

[Coochie liquor]

Depends how she did it.




Coochie did she state when she was picking her up?

She dropped he off for the nigh on Wed, she called and wanted to stay the night again Thu, and last night she wanted to get her but he text her first that he was dropping her off at her moms (which he didn't do) then text her he wasn't giving her back because she wasn't sending his girl out of state. So I think it was originally just one night she was gonna stay.

[Coochie liquor]

For that matter he could say this chick ABANDONED the baby with him.

Maybe, but there is a bit of a text trail to prove otherwise I believe.

[Katipan]

Well dad has a point. Mom doesn't want dad to raise the kid, she wants people he doesn't even know and who are no relation to raise her.

And then she wants child support from the dad that doesn't get to help raise her.

What the **** is wrong with people? My parents had the most successful breakup in the history of time and I've never seen another one since.

[J Diddy]

She dropped he off for the nigh on Wed, she called and wanted to stay the night again Thu, and last night she wanted to get her but he text her first that he was dropping her off at her moms (which he didn't do) then text her he wasn't giving her back because she wasn't sending his girl out of state. So I think it was originally just one night she was gonna stay.

Yeah she needs to go get her. ASAP.

[Coochie liquor]

Well dad has a point. Mom doesn't want dad to raise the kid, she wants people he doesn't even know and who are no relation to raise her.

And then she wants child support from the dad that doesn't get to help raise her.

What the **** is wrong with people? My parents had the most successful breakup in the history of time and I've never seen another one since.

True, but I'm pretty sure he wants her so he can get the benefits of having her like food stamps etc, and so he doesn't get the child support hit. He never cared enough to check on her before it was gonna be a benefit to him.

[J Diddy]

Well dad has a point. Mom doesn't want dad to raise the kid, she wants people he doesn't even know and who are no relation to raise her.

And then she wants child support from the dad that doesn't get to help raise her.

What the **** is wrong with people? My parents had the most successful breakup in the history of time and I've never seen another one since.

I've got the advantage of being on both sides of that argument. 1 kid who lives with me that I've virtually got to fight the mother to spend time with him, doesn't pay child support and I can't get her involved. The other kid, mother has custody, if I'm a day late on child support the national guard's getting called and it takes a court hearing to take her out for ice cream.

[Katipan]

True, but I'm pretty sure he wants her so he can get the benefits of having her like food stamps etc, and so he doesn't get the child support hit. He never cared enough to check on her before it was gonna be a benefit to him.

I can't answer to that obviously, I don't know him. But wouldn't the end goal be a healthy mom and dad? If mom gets to change her life why can't dad?

[J Diddy]

True, but I'm pretty sure he wants her so he can get the benefits of having her like food stamps etc, and so he doesn't get the child support hit. He never cared enough to check on her before it was gonna be a benefit to him.

To which I must add what the fuck was she doing leaving her there with him then?

I understand that there are issues going on with the mother but she needs a solid kick in the ass and the message to get across that this is a little girl's life: there are no do overs and her actions count.

[Coochie liquor]

I can't answer to that obviously, I don't know him. But wouldn't the end goal be a healthy mom and dad? If mom gets to change her life why can't dad?

I'm not saying he can't change. But she is currently trying, even if it's just because she got arrested. He is doing drugs still. They're both wrong, I just want what's best for Spencer.
I don't know what she was thinking dropping her off there. She said she didn't want to always drag us into it again. But I woul have gladly driven the 20+ hours round trip to ensure she is in a safe place. But she has gone thru a lot in the last year, and as a single mom with a 4 year old at 20, she is gonna make some bad decisions.

[J Diddy]

I'm not saying he can't change. But she is currently trying, even if it's just because she got arrested. He is doing drugs still. They're both wrong, I just want what's best for Spencer.
I don't know what she was thinking dropping her off there. She said she didn't want to always drag us into it again. But I woul have gladly driven the 20+ hours round trip to ensure she is in a safe place. But she has gone thru a lot in the last year, and as a single mom with a 4 year old at 20, she is gonna make some bad decisions.

Just out of curiosity, where are her parents? Has she no other supports?

[Coochie liquor]

Just out of curiosity, where are her parents? Has she no other supports?

Her mom is close to her in Alabama, but they don't get along most ofthe time. Her father passes away about 6 months ago from cancer.

[J Diddy]

It is commendable that you are willing to help.

Good man.

[Coochie liquor]

It is commendable that you are willing to help.

Good man.

Thanks for the advise. I'm just trying to do the right thing and help out someone in need. As I would hope most others would do.

[notorious]

Good work, Cooch. If only she cared about her kid as much as you do.

[J Diddy]

Thanks for the advise. I'm just trying to do the right thing and help out someone in need. As I would hope most others would do.

Hope it helps. That being said my area is not children's division. I work with people who have disabilities.

[Coochie liquor]

Good work, Cooch. If only she cared about her kid as much as you do.

Exactly what I want to change. I want her to get her life on track and treat Spencer like the gift that she is. I hope this is her wake up call, but addiction is a mofo!!

[MTG#10]

The only advice I have is if you do get her back dont take her to any Chuck E Cheese locations around the Springfield, MO area.

[GloucesterChief]

Another marvelous effect of the war on drugs.

[Rausch]

Another marvelous effect of the war on drugs.

LMAO

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

We were foster parents 15 years ago . We had received a new born baby boy. His name was Christian. the mother was a convicted prostitute/druggy. The father was in prison. After 10 weeks we were really hoping we could adopt him. Out of no where the grandmother shows up and the judge gives her custody. The grandmothers children (3) were all in prison for various things. Yet the judge wanted the child to be with the birth family. Sometimes life is just not fair and the laws ignore common sense.

That being said , if you want the child then grab your shotgun and go get her.

[TimBone]

That being said , if you want the child then grab your shotgun and go get her.

I'm fairly certain this is not the right answer.

[J Diddy]

I'm fairly certain this is not the right answer.

Oh it's the right answer alright. Might not be the right question, but that answer will take care of quite a few questions.

[Rukdafaidas]

If he's not on the birth certificate, or any other documents, as the father of the baby. Couldn't the mother just say that he's kidnapping the girl?

[J Diddy]

If he's not on the birth certificate, or any other documents, as the father of the baby. Couldn't the mother just say that he's kidnapping the girl?

Exactly. This is why I suggested her meet the cops there.

[TomBarndtsTwin]

If he's not on the birth certificate, or any other documents, as the father of the baby. Couldn't the mother just say that he's kidnapping the girl?

Not really.

The fact that there is a child support order in place establishes dad's legal paternity of the child. While it doesn't necessarily grant him custodial rights, it does give him some legal standing.

Add to the mix that the mom dropped the child off to another legal parent and said 'here ya go' pretty much eliminates the kidnapping angle. No prosecutor would grant a warrant for that, nor would any LE officer make a criminal arrest under those circumstances.

Now, all that being said, if mom showed up at his house demanding the child and called LE, 9 out of 10 times LE will give physical custody to the mom if the dad cannot prove he has custodial rights.

Legalities aside, from what has been reported about mom in this thread, I fail to see how the child is better off with her than the father. Just my .02

[threebag]

True that. Mom needs a wake up call long before now.

[cabletech94]

We were foster parents 15 years ago . We had received a new born baby boy. His name was Christian. the mother was a convicted prostitute/druggy. The father was in prison. After 10 weeks we were really hoping we could adopt him. Out of no where the grandmother shows up and the judge gives her custody. The grandmothers children (3) were all in prison for various things. Yet the judge wanted the child to be with the birth family. Sometimes life is just not fair and the laws ignore common sense.

That being said , if you want the child then grab your shotgun and go get her.

dear god,
I lived this life almost exactly.
minus the shotgun. and I don't jack off pigs. for a living.

[Katipan]

Not really.

The fact that there is a child support order in place establishes dad's legal paternity of the child. While it doesn't necessarily grant him custodial rights, it does give him some legal standing.

Add to the mix that the mom dropped the child off to another legal parent and said 'here ya go' pretty much eliminates the kidnapping angle. No prosecutor would grant a warrant for that, nor would any LE officer make a criminal arrest under those circumstances.

Now, all that being said, if mom showed up at his house demanding the child and called LE, 9 out of 10 times LE will give physical custody to the mom if the dad cannot prove he has custodial rights.

Legalities aside, from what has been reported about mom in this thread, I fail to see how the child is better off with her than the father. Just my .02

Make that .04

[ChiliConCarnage]

True, but I'm pretty sure he wants her so he can get the benefits of having her like food stamps etc, and so he doesn't get the child support hit. He never cared enough to check on her before it was gonna be a benefit to him.

The guy would have to go to court and become legal guardian for any of that to happen I'd think.

[J Diddy]

dear god,
I lived this life almost exactly.
minus the shotgun. and I don't jack off pigs. for a living.

Sometimes a man just has to jack off a pig.

[J Diddy]

The guy would have to go to court and become legal guardian for any of that to happen I'd think.

Not at all.

I got all sort of benefits when my exwife's daughter was living with me. I could receive foodstamps, medicaid and was able to claim her on my taxes all without a single court order.

[go bo]

Not at all.

I got all sort of benefits when my exwife's daughter was living with me. I could receive foodstamps, medicaid and was able to claim her on my taxes all without a single court order.

see, there's your problem...

you live in the same state as your exes...

[Chief Pote]

We were foster parents 15 years ago . We had received a new born baby boy. His name was Christian. the mother was a convicted prostitute/druggy. The father was in prison. After 10 weeks we were really hoping we could adopt him. Out of no where the grandmother shows up and the judge gives her custody. The grandmothers children (3) were all in prison for various things. Yet the judge wanted the child to be with the birth family. Sometimes life is just not fair and the laws ignore common sense.

That being said , if you want the child then grab your shotgun and go get her.

Stop....don't follow Hog's :bang:advice. ROFL

[Coochie liquor]

Hoping that tomorrow she is able to go get her. The cops in her little town won't even go with her to try to get Spencer back. She is going to the courthouse first thing in the morning. I she can get her, we will be making the trip to Alabama to get her. She needs away from all sides of that situation.

[Katipan]

Weren't you the one that had a very public orgy on the steps of a hotel that involved drugs and alcohol while your daughter and her friends hung out in the room?

[stumppy]

Weren't you the one that had a very public orgy on the steps of a hotel that involved drugs and alcohol while your daughter and her friends hung out in the room?

RotRoh Shaggy

[Katipan]

RotRoh Shaggy

It's not my story. :shrug: