How are you feeling about the new extra point format after week 1?

[TLO]

Poll and discussion to follow.

[TLO]

I'm not sure i have a strong opinion one way or the other just yet. I know I'm going to be holding my breath every time Santos attempts a PAT.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

I don't see much difference at this point, but when the weather turns...

[BigMeatballDave]

I like it.

[BigMeatballDave]

I really like that if a PAT is blocked, the D can return it for 2. Same for 2-point conversions.

[DaFace]

They've successfully added excitement, albeit mild, to an otherwise boring play. I approve.

[Buzz]

I like it, I think the game today is proof it will not always be automatic.

[TLO]

They've successfully added excitement, albeit mild, to an otherwise boring play. I approve.

I'll really be interested to see how teams handle it when the weather turns to cold/snow. Could make for some interesting coaching decisions.

[DaFace]

I'll really be interested to see how teams handle it when the weather turns to cold/snow. Could make for some interesting coaching decisions.

My hope is that they 2-point conversion becomes a COMMON strategy used in games. The expected value of either option is essentially the same (for an average NFL team on both sides), so there's not even a solid reason to just kick it even early in the game. I'd love to see a team really specialize in converting 2's and using that a majority of the time.

But NFL coaches are slow and don't like math, so I doubt that'll happen.

[Mama Hip Rockets]

I love it. The extra point was the most boring, pointless waste of time in any sport. Now that it's not a total gimme it's a little more interesting.

[tk13]

I like that you can return them now, but I'm still not sure I'm a fan. Not sure if it's the best way to determine who the best team is. First time a playoff team loses a game 21-20 because their kicker missed an XP, will it have really determined who was the better team? I don't know. I think the general majority is wrong. Come at me.

http://i.imgur.com/L3VrXh9.gif

[alnorth]

I love the new extra point rule, and that won't change even when it inevitably costs the Chiefs a game.

We can argue about whether this new rule is perfect, but it sure as hell is an improvement over the old rule. The tension for the PAT was palpable, just looking at it, you can tell that this was a lot farther from the goal line then before and no gimme.

[tk13]

The Browns had two penalties on an extra point today and had to kick a 48 yard extra point. They made it, but it definitely makes it important to be smart on those plays.

[Buzz]

I like that you can return them now, but I'm still not sure I'm a fan. Not sure if it's the best way to determine who the best team is. First time a playoff team loses a game 21-20 because their kicker missed an XP, will it have really determined who was the better team? I don't know. I think the general majority is wrong. Come at me.

LOL, no one wants to argue or fight with dumb... How does a automatic chip shot determine the better Team? Moving it out determines the better kicker.

[notorious]

It is a lot more exciting than it used to be.


Good or bad, I call that success.

[alnorth]

The Browns had two penalties on an extra point today and had to kick a 48 yard extra point. They made it, but it definitely makes it important to be smart on those plays.

Why the hell wouldn't you just go for 2 after the first penalty? The only reason why I'd stubbornly insist on kicking is if it was tied late and 1 point meant everything but the second point meant nothing.

edit: never mind, I'm a moron. The penalty would have applied to the 2 pt conversion attempt also. *smacks forehead*

[-King-]

I like that you can return them now, but I'm still not sure I'm a fan. Not sure if it's the best way to determine who the best team is. First time a playoff team loses a game 21-20 because their kicker missed an XP, will it have really determined who was the better team? I don't know. I think the general majority is wrong. Come at me.



How's that any different from a team losing because their RB fumbled or Qb threw a pick? Kickers are still part of the team.

[LiveSteam]

Its gay

[kcxiv]

LOL, no one wants to argue or fight with dumb... How does a automatic chip shot determine the better Team? Moving it out determines the better kicker.

Exactly! Idiot kickers better not get liquored up! lol


Anyways, i like it. Not always a gimme, puts more strategy into the game. how can you not like that.

[DaFace]

The Browns had two penalties on an extra point today and had to kick a 48 yard extra point. They made it, but it definitely makes it important to be smart on those plays.

This has probably been discussed, but if you get a penalty on the XP try, do you still get to take your pick of whether you're going for 1 or 2?

In other words, here's the scenario:

1. Kicking team opts for the 1-point try at the 15 yard line.
2. Other team jumps early and is called for offsides.

Is it a 5-yard penalty, ball on the 10 no matter what? Or does the kicking team get the choice of a half-the-distance penalty from where the 2-point conversion would have been, making it 1 yard to get the 2 points?

[tk13]

Why the hell wouldn't you just go for 2 after the first penalty? The only reason why I'd stubbornly insist on kicking is if it was tied late and 1 point meant everything but the second point meant nothing.

I'm not sure what the rule on that is. Can you decide to go for 2 once you declare? At best you'd be going for 2 from the 17 yard line... if you can even choose to do that.

[RealSNR]

My OCD will go out of control when the number points scored by teams end up not being nice round multiples of 7 or 3

[alnorth]

Is it a 5-yard penalty, ball on the 10 no matter what? Or does the kicking team get the choice of a half-the-distance penalty from where the 2-point conversion would have been, making it 1 yard to get the 2 points?

I do not know for sure, but I assume you are not "locked in" with your first choice. I think you can choose for a shorter PAT or a shorter 2 pt conversion.

[Bearcat]

My hope is that they 2-point conversion becomes a COMMON strategy used in games. The expected value of either option is essentially the same (for an average NFL team on both sides), so there's not even a solid reason to just kick it even early in the game. I'd love to see a team really specialize in converting 2's and using that a majority of the time.

But NFL coaches are slow and don't like math, so I doubt that'll happen.

I think the EP was pointless before, but I don't know if evening up the odds of either choice is the right way to go, either... it seems gimmicky for a sport that already has plenty of scoring.

I've grown to like the shootout in hockey, but I'm sure as hell glad it's not part of the playoffs... and like it's been said, deciding a playoff game because of EP/2pt strategy and effectiveness seems cheap.

[Easy 6]

This is one of the few recent rule changes I've never had a single problem with, it was too automatic, too easy... making it a bit tougher can only be a good thing.

[tk13]

Looking it up, it appears you can change your decision after a penalty, with the yardage enforced.

So instead of trying a 48 yard PAT, the Browns could've chosen to go for two from the 17 yard line. I'm not sure how many coaches would take that risk though.

[tmax63]

It hasn't cost us a game yet so I'm still undecided.

[TigeRRUppeRRcut]

What used to be a mild confident booster will now create anxiety and ruin confidence at a position that is one of the hardest in the game. They should have moved it back just 5 yards and reevaluated before moving it as far as they did.

[DaFace]

What used to be a mild confident booster will now create anxiety and ruin confidence at a position that is one of the hardest in the game. They should have moved it back just 5 yards and reevaluated before moving it as far as they did.

:spock:

[alnorth]

What used to be a mild confident booster will now create anxiety and ruin confidence at a position that is one of the hardest in the game.

Fine, if you have a weak kicker, you should be punished for it.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

:spock:

ROFL

[Over Yonder]

My first reaction is I dont like it. But the more I think about it, I cant come up with a good reason why other than $. The NFL just made kickers almost as valuable as QBs. I dont want to pay any more for tickets!!:#

[notorious]

Santos gave me a few heart failures in the 1st half with his knuckle balls.

[lewdog]

A missed XP early could make for interesting decisions on the point after attempt for the rest of the game. It's a good change.

[Mr. Laz]

i'm fine with it.

[kcxiv]

What used to be a mild confident booster will now create anxiety and ruin confidence at a position that is one of the hardest in the game. They should have moved it back just 5 yards and reevaluated before moving it as far as they did.

you have to remove your tigeruppercut name for saying some bitch ass shit like this! The King (Sagat) is no pussy! lol

[-King-]

If a kicker needs to make 17 yard XPs for confidence, he doesn't need to be in the league.

[DaFace]

I think some of you are dramatically overstating the impact of this rule. At most this rule might make a 3 point swing in a game between a great kicker and a mediocre one. That's hardly comparable to the difference between a great QB and a mediocre one.

[TigeRRUppeRRcut]

:spock:

Kickers and QB's are pretty much the two toughest positions in terms of mental requirement. Just like golf and tennis.

[TigeRRUppeRRcut]

you have to remove your tigeruppercut name for saying some bitch ass shit like this! The King (Sagat) is no pussy! lol

You watch how quickly a golfer can build confidence by just hitting an 80 yard pitch shot 3-7 feet from the pin. Then they go up to the next tee box and they're a more confident striker.

[Gonzo]

Meh, I dunno. We have a fairly average kicker. If we had an excellent one, I would approve at the moment.

Santos will lose us a game this year.

[JoeyChuckles]

Its gay

So what you're telling me is the extra point in football prefers relationships with those of the same gender as itself, rather than those of the opposite gender?

Edit: This leads to the question, which plays in football are male and which are female? I just wanna know who the extra point can date.

[chiefzilla1501]

I think some of you are dramatically overstating the impact of this rule. At most this rule might make a 3 point swing in a game between a great kicker and a mediocre one. That's hardly comparable to the difference between a great QB and a mediocre one.

Yes and no.

But I think it adds a lot more drama so I love the rule. It had a big impact on the Chiefs/Texans. Had a huge impact on the Panthers/Jags game when it was 10-9 deep into the 3rd quarter. Very subtle, but your offensive outlook is completely different when you're playing from 8 behind vs. 9. And it most definitely changes when you're trying to break a tie vs. being 1 point behind.

But this rule will get really cool once we start hitting game winning PATs.

[TigeRRUppeRRcut]

Yes and no.

But I think it adds a lot more drama so I love the rule. It had a big impact on the Chiefs/Texans. Had a huge impact on the Panthers/Jags game when it was 10-9 deep into the 3rd quarter. Very subtle, but your offensive outlook is completely different when you're playing from 8 behind vs. 9. And it most definitely changes when you're trying to break a tie vs. being 1 point behind.

But this rule will get really cool once we start hitting game winning PATs.

I agree it will be significant. Especially when the weather changes and the season starts to wear on these kickers (Some will have their confidence wavering). Just in preseason (although small sample size) alone they saw a drop of over 6% in PATs made.

[-King-]

My first reaction is I dont like it. But the more I think about it, I cant come up with a good reason why other than $. The NFL just made kickers almost as valuable as QBs. I dont want to pay any more for tickets!!:#

Wut?

[DaFace]

I agree it will be significant. Especially when the weather changes and the season starts to wear on these kickers (Some will have their confidence wavering). Just in preseason (although small sample size) alone they saw a drop of over 6% in PATs made.

According to this site (http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/touchdowns-per-game/2014/), the median number of touchdowns per game for a team was 2.3 last year. So, the drop you are referring to would be worth about 0.14 points per game, on average.

[MahiMike]

I don't see much difference at this point, but when the weather turns...

It's already made a big difference. With good weather. Me no like.

[cosmo20002]

The new rule sucks.

/old people who are still griping about allowing the forward pass

[TLO]

The Chiefs should hire me as "two point conversion specialist coach". I'll do it for 50k a season.

[lcarus]

I like that you can return them now, but I'm still not sure I'm a fan. Not sure if it's the best way to determine who the best team is. First time a playoff team loses a game 21-20 because their kicker missed an XP, will it have really determined who was the better team? I don't know. I think the general majority is wrong. Come at me.

http://i.imgur.com/L3VrXh9.gif

I agree. 4 were missed today so far. Why make the game MORE about the kicker? It shouldn't come down to that more than it already does. If the play is so boring just allow teams to automatically tack on the point or go for 2. Let's bring Morten Andersen out of retirement for just these XPs lol

[Uncle_Ted]

I'm still undecided, but I'm not sure I like the idea of even more games decided by the kicker. The new rule also takes away the rare fake kick on the XP (for all practical purposes).

[alnorth]

If the end of the super bowl is decided by a botched PAT...

... I'll be happy about it. It'll be dramatic, shocking, and elicit laughter and shocking shouts of "Whaaaat?!?"

[DaFace]

If the end of the super bowl is decided by a botched PAT...

... I'll be happy about it. It'll be dramatic, shocking, and elicit laughter and shocking shouts of "Whaaaat?!?"

It won't bother me a bit. At the end of the day, this is a game with a ton of entirely made up rules that don't really have any sort of reason why any of them exist. People just made it up.

Kickers are kind of the randomizer. They keep the game interesting by varying the amount of points you get for different outcomes just a bit. They're like rolling the dice in a board game.

I personally think they add a lot of interest in terms of strategy.

[Demonpenz]

It won't bother me a bit. At the end of the day, this is a game with a ton of entirely made up rules that don't really have any sort of reason why any of them exist. People just made it up.

Kickers are kind of the randomizer. They keep the game interesting by varying the amount of points you get for different outcomes just a bit. They're like rolling the dice in a board game.

I personally think they add a lot of interest in terms of strategy.

The reason they exist is to be awesome. I am going to try to take this pig and run with it you try to tackle me...THAT IS AN AWESOME RULE.

Now I have to get over this line while Carrying this pig and if I get over it and you don't tackle I WIN. That is awesome, but the pig keeps running away so we should kill it first.
Dead pig over the line AWESOME RULE.

Now we are going to kick this dead pig through some laundry lines we have set up? Cause fuck this pig and fuck moms laundry lines. AWESOME RULE

[Buehler445]

DGAF. Poll fail.

[Fairplay]

Extra point kickers have to earn their money now.

Violin plays for them.

[Amnorix]

They've successfully added excitement, albeit mild, to an otherwise boring play. I approve.

This.

[AeroSquid]

I like it, I think the game today is proof it will not always be automatic.

I didn't look at it that way, but you're right. I want to change my vote from meh to + now haha.

[ILChief]

Everyone will like it until missing one screws their team over

[Amnorix]

Just saw that kickers missed 8 PATs all of last year. Opening weekend this year they missed 4 already.

No point having a non-competitive play in any sport, so any change is good.

[TigeRRUppeRRcut]

Yes and no.

But I think it adds a lot more drama so I love the rule. It had a big impact on the Chiefs/Texans. Had a huge impact on the Panthers/Jags game when it was 10-9 deep into the 3rd quarter. Very subtle, but your offensive outlook is completely different when you're playing from 8 behind vs. 9. And it most definitely changes when you're trying to break a tie vs. being 1 point behind.

But this rule will get really cool once we start hitting game winning PATs.

Called it :clap:

[TigeRRUppeRRcut]

More than 8 missed XP's today. 3 in our game alone. Seems field conditions make a difference along with the confidence of kickers starting to sway this late into the season

[Saul Good]

This rule is stupid. Do we really want games decided by missed extra points? It's beyond lame. Get rid of extra points. You should get to choose between just counting the score as seven and kicking off or counting it as six and going for two.

[kcpasco]

All I know is they better get this shit fixed in practice this week. Santos royally fucked that last xp up.

[cdcox]

They might as well have rule where if the game ends with the 2 teams within a point of each other, they roll a pair of dice and if it comes up snake eyes they reverse the score. It just adds another degree of luck to the game.

[TigeRRUppeRRcut]

They might as well have rule where if the game ends with the 2 teams within a point of each other, they roll a pair of dice and if it comes up snake eyes they reverse the score. It just adds another degree of luck to the game.

https://41.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m0ouyjtt4j1r3nsv6o1_540.jpg

[MotherfuckerJones]

Even though we had our fuckups the last two weeks, I love it. Adds more drama and makes it interesting.

[-King-]

This rule is stupid. Do we really want games decided by missed extra points? It's beyond lame. Get rid of extra points. You should get to choose between just counting the score as seven and kicking off or counting it as six and going for two.

Why not?

[-King-]

They might as well have rule where if the game ends with the 2 teams within a point of each other, they roll a pair of dice and if it comes up snake eyes they reverse the score. It just adds another degree of luck to the game.

How is it luck?

[TLO]

Is TigerUppercut a Li'l Smokey mult?

[cdcox]

How is it luck?

Because it happens randomly and non-reproducibly. The players who miss PATs this season will for the most part not be the players who miss PATs next year.

[TigeRRUppeRRcut]

Is TigerUppercut a Li'l Smokey mult?

:hmmm:

[tk13]

They might as well have rule where if the game ends with the 2 teams within a point of each other, they roll a pair of dice and if it comes up snake eyes they reverse the score. It just adds another degree of luck to the game.

I've thought this from the beginning. I think the same about 2 point conversions. It's adding a significant degree of randomness to the game. I'm not sure you're really determining who the best team is. It's certainly more exciting though. I wonder what happens the first time a good team loses a playoff game this way.

[DaFace]

This rule is stupid. Do we really want games decided by missed extra points? It's beyond lame. Get rid of extra points. You should get to choose between just counting the score as seven and kicking off or counting it as six and going for two.

Yes. Yes, we do.

Lame is having a play in the game that ends up the same way 99% of the time.

[DaFace]

They might as well have rule where if the game ends with the 2 teams within a point of each other, they roll a pair of dice and if it comes up snake eyes they reverse the score. It just adds another degree of luck to the game.

Then perhaps teams should go for two more often...

[-King-]

Because it happens randomly and non-reproducibly. The players who miss PATs this season will for the most part not be the players who miss PATs next year.

Why won't they be? The XP% won't jump back up to 99.9999% next year.

[-King-]

I've thought this from the beginning. I think the same about 2 point conversions. It's adding a significant degree of randomness to the game. I'm not sure you're really determining who the best team is. It's certainly more exciting though. I wonder what happens the first time a good team loses a playoff game this way.

Kickers are part of the team. I don't see how this is any different from any other position player fucking up. It might suck more, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be part of the game.

[notorious]

Love it or hate it, it makes the game more interesting.

[cdcox]

Then perhaps teams should go for two more often...

League wide the 2-point conversion success is 45%, so the expected value of an extra point is still higher.

However, Pittsburgh's approach is interesting. They have tried more 2-point conversions than any team in football and have a 67% success rate. Presumably the extra practice on 2-point plays also would be beneficial for red zone offense.

[bsroyals54]

Not that I'm one who cares about kicking records in the previous years but will recent kickers be able to keep up with all time leading scoring kicking leaders with this new change? Theres been quite a few extra points missed today.

[cdcox]

Why won't they be? The XP% won't jump back up to 99.9999% next year.

League wide FG rates from that range are like 95% or more. Many kickers are perfect during a given season. Any kicker who misses from that range on a consistent basis will be replaced. Yet every kicker will occasionally miss from that distance.

If the rare miss pops up when the game is close, your team gets screwed. That is luck.

[cdcox]

Not that I'm one who cares about kicking records in the previous years but will recent kickers be able to keep up with all time leading scoring kicking leaders with this new change? Theres been quite a few extra points missed today.

Conversion rates are 94% league-wide.

[GloryDayz]

I love it...

[DaneMcCloud]

I thought I'd hate it but I actually really like it.

Make this shit more competitive, not less.

[Saul Good]

Yes. Yes, we do.

Lame is having a play in the game that ends up the same way 99% of the time.

Gross. I don't watch football for extra points.

[GloryDayz]

Gross. I don't watch football for extra points.

Now that they actually matter (or aren't a given at least), you might want to hold-off on the bio-break and watch them.

[-King-]

League wide FG rates from that range are like 95% or more. Many kickers are perfect during a given season. Any kicker who misses from that range on a consistent basis will be replaced. Yet every kicker will occasionally miss from that distance.

If the rare miss pops up when the game is close, your team gets screwed. That is luck.

And most running back carries don't end with a fumble. If your team loses because the RB fumbled, do you say it's luck?

[cdcox]

And most running back carries don't end with a fumble. If your team loses because the RB fumbled, do you say it's luck?

I'm gonna blame the 2003 playoff loss on the defense that didn't force a punt and was bad all year and chalk up Priest's second fumble of the season to an untimely bad break.

[TLO]

Gaz - Gaz gobbles green grapes and grape Gatorade. LMAO

[-King-]

I'm gonna blame the 2003 playoff loss on the defense that didn't force a punt and was bad all year and chalk up Priest's second fumble of the season to an untimely bad break.

Couldn't the same be said for a missed XP?

[TLO]

I wish teams would just go for two more often.

[KChiefs1]

Playoff games in January in bad weather will make for some interesting decisions.

[Rausch]

As a Chiefs fan I'm not in favor of any rule that makes it harder on kickers...

[FloridaMan88]

An NFL caliber kicker still should have no problem kicking a 33 yard FG/Extra Point.

[BigMeatballDave]

An NFL caliber kicker still should have no problem kicking a 33 yard FG/Extra Point.

Yep, and yesterdays misses in Oakland were due to field conditions, mostly.

[BigMeatballDave]

As a Chiefs fan I'm not in favor of any rule that makes it harder on kickers...:D

I see what you did there...

[GloryDayz]

How did PATs play into a kicker's stats before? I know they usually said things like "hasn't missed a PAT for 3 years" and the likes, but in the stats were they given full credit as a field-goal, or were they separate? If full credit, while it should affect ll of them equally, I doubt it will and will be interesting.