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View Full Version : Chiefs Do you think we had more gains than losses?


BossChief
09-01-2016, 11:39 AM
I'm going to attempt to evaluate how I see each position group going from last year to this year. I'm sure there will be plenty in agreement and disagreement with the way I see things, but I'm going to try to be as realistic as I can.

Get ready for a long read.

Ok?...lets get going with the QBs.

Starting with Alex Smith, I think we've seen a player over the last 3 seasons that has steadily improved and grown in the offense. He has looked as sharp as he ever has during this preseason (I know, preseason, but he has gotten the ball out with more zip and accuracy IMO) and upgrading the OL is going to pay huge dividends in allowing him to use more of his "gigabytes" at the line and after the ball is snapped. It's not only the OL, either...the upgrades at WR (we'll get to that in a little bit) are giving Alex more options on where to go with the ball. It seems that all these additions will have a good chance to open this offense up more and more and I expect Alex to have another career year. I see a slight improvement from Alex and I can see a big improvement from him by years end.

Moving on to the primary backup, KC went from Chse Daniel to the newly acquired Nick Foles who has a big upside and comes with a year of seasoning in the offense under Andy. We take a step back in experience in the offense from Chase at 3 years to Nick at 1, but the physical upside is a sizable upgrade. Foles has a little mobility, but has a big arm. He can make throws with a lot of zip that Chase simply couldn't. He has also shown that when coached correctly, he can be very productive and effecient. I see this as a slight improvement.

At the third QB spot, it's almost a certainty that KC releases Murray and Bray unless one does enough to have some trade value. I know some don't think so, but the writing is on the wall. Neither guy will be on the 53 man roster, maybe they get to sneak one of them onto IR...but they haven't done enough to earn a roster spot on such a deep roster that will probably cut much better players than them at other positions. Kevin Hogan will probably be the developmental guy.

I'm really excited about this teams offensive line, so let's talk about them.

The group is as deep as it gets in today's NFL. We will probably cut at least one guy from this position group that starts on another team. Crazy to think, but watch how it plays out.

Let's start with Eric Fisher, being he is so polarizing to us as a fanbase. Towards the end of last season and into the playoffs, Fisher started to resemble a very good LT after a couple of very unimpressive years and has carried that into this preseason. He looks stronger, more confident and his technique has improved. That has lead to him not needing to lunge as much to prevent defenders from turning the corner on him and thats a good sign. He's also starting to show some of that nastiness some of us really liked during senior bowl week. He seems like a guy that has gotten his strength where it needs to be at this level and doesn't need to overcompensate with his athleticism and it's helping him reach the next level at his position. His backup is rookie Zach Sterup and he's a rookie that's 11 feet tall, but plays with good technique and balance. Hopefully, Fisher doesn't have an early injury while the kid is suspended.

Next up is the rookie Parker Ehinger that has very impressive technique and intelligence. He already identifies different blitzes and makes the correct switch to get his mitts on the right guy. He does lack the brute strength you'd like to see from a starting guard, but once the strength and conditioning program does its job with this kid, he's gonna have a real chance to be the total package...but that's gonna take time. He's an upgrade over the revolving door at LG KC fielded last year, for sure. The primary backup is Jerrod Pughsley who is a sleeper guy that just hasn't been given a chance to play much because of the quality of the teams OL as a unit...but has played very well when given the opportunity and shows a lot of promise.

At center, KC has its center position locked down for the next 10 years with Mitch Morse. He's highly intelligent, gritty, thinks quickly on his feet, moves very well and is a leader in the locker room and the weight room. I see the kid as a top 5 center already and has a chance to be a pro bowler if he continues to improve and stays healthy (the concussions are a concern). His primary backup, Fulton, might be the best backup center in the game and would start for a dozen or more teams. When called upon, he has been impressive with the 1s. I see center as slightly improved due to attrition and cohesiveness.

At RG, LDT has looked much improved and has flashed more and more as the guy we hope he develops into. A guy with elite measurables that is as smart as they come. He showed that upside against the best DT combo in the league of the Rams and held his own against them. Fulton has a year of starting experience at RG if LDT gets dinged up. I see the improvement from LDT as a BIGTIME plus for this OL and offense as a whole from last year, especially when the guys on either side of him are very good.

Last but not least we have a huge upgrade at RT, going from Donald Stephenson and Jah Reid to Mitchell Schwartz. Possibly the best RT in the league and at minimum top 5. He finishes off a line from left to right that is very solid and as they develop cohesion as a unit, has the potential to be a top 5 OL in the NFL and be in consideration for the best line in football, including Dallas.

I think it's very arguable that the OL has been upgraded by player addition and player development at every position, including the backups. This group is going to open huge holes for the four headed monster we have at RB (more on this in a minute...) and give Alex enough protection to be able to find that second receiver and TE more, instead of needing to dump it off so much. That's gonna be important because of the speed we have at receiver...they are going to have more time to get open and that's gonna make the offense fun to watch.

Ok, enough talking about the fatties.

Let's get to the skill position guys.

On to the RBs

I know normally we would be getting excited to watch another year of Jamaal Charles highlight reel runs and while I am sold he will be the old Jamaal, he's not the RB I'm excited to watch....lets get to it, shall we?

Spencer Ware is going to be an absolute MONSTER in this offense. What this kid was able to do last year behind a craptastic OL was beyond impressive. He has enough speed to break deep runs, he's good in pass pro, has good hands and is a straight up BULLDOZER with rare physical core strength. With the line being upgraded, this kid is going to break big plays and brings a physical element to the offense that it desperately needs. His running style combined with this OL is going to wear down even the best front 7s in football and open up everything for the deep passing game, Travis Kelce...and even for Jamaal Charles as a change of pace back (that's crazy to type that out. Jamaal Charles as a change of pace back). Defensive coordinators are going to need to devote a lot of "field resources" to stopping the running game of the Chiefs and that's gonna mean a lot of 1on1 opportunities for the playmakers on the perimeter.

Jamaal Charles as a change of pace back. That feels weird, but depending on opposing defenses weaknesses that's gonna be a reality. One of my favorite players ever that does things the right way and has just as good vision, quickness and speed as anyone, pre injury. He has also never had a OL like this one. Charles might average 6.5 per carry in his role. That's probably a realistic goal.

Charcandrick West and Darrin Reaves are both guys with starter qualities that should also shine in their opportunities, but those opportunities might be very limited with the overall talent KC has st RB this year. Reid will be wise to rotate all 4 guys to keep them all fresh, but to give the majority of the carries to Ware. JMO.

This group will be vastly improved due to getting Charles back, but more so with the improvements they made to the OL. KC should be able to control the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball and that's gonna give the backs open running lanes and lots of opportunities for big plays.


On to the WRs...another very exciting group to talk about.


Jeremy Maclin is Jeremy Maclin. The guy has great hands, runs crisp routes and is one of the BIGTIME leaders of this team. Invaluable to the success of the 2016 Chiefs. I don't see a lot of change in how Maclin plays, but the attention he demands is going to do wonders for the other guys...and vice versa. The upgrades they've made on the OL are going to help everybody...and the WRs might have the biggest advantage.

The next guy I want to talk about is Chris Conley. What he did to one of the better corners in the league (Trumaine Johnson of the Rams) was impressive. He beat him with speed, quickness and ability to fight for the ball. He put in the work living at Maclins house this offseason and learning what it takes to be a successful NFL receiver and it's showing up in games. Conley is going to be the guy I'd say is going to get an advantage because of guys around him the most on offense because Alex should have more time to find him and coversges are going to be focusing on how to stop Maclin/Kelce/the running game. As the #2 WR, Conley has a chance to have a big year. I don't see a way Conley isn't an upgrade over Albert Wilson from last year and I think we're starting to see his crazy "upside" start to get realized.

Which brings me to one of the hot button topics around here. Tyreek Hill. I can't say enough about how impressed I was seeing this kid in person. He has "next level" type speed. That has translated to the field in PS and I don't see how it won't translate to Sunday's. His speed, route running, quickness, hands, vision and ability to "go get the ball" instead of letting it get to him are all high level skills and some are already elite level. The best part about him is that defenses won't be able to double him AT ALL. He's going to be the guy you MUST account for, but can't do anything about without giving up on stopping the ground game. I'm not going to be one bit surprised if he has a rookie year like Desean Jackson did. He has that level of talent. Hopefully the kid learned from his mistake and never goes down that road again, because he's gonna be a star.

Albert Wilson is dead to me. He never extends to make the catch, he gives up on routes, he's an inconsistent hands catcher and he doesn't deserve to have much playing time unless KC has injuries. Hopefully Dorsey trades him.

I've got to be honest...Deanthony Thomas lost me last year. We needed playmakers in the postseason and Thomas sat down. That said, I don't know everything about his situation...just that the team said he passed the tests and he made a decision NOT to play. Moving forward, the kid can get open and make plays so hopefully we can get something for him or find a way to showcase his talent even with all the playmakers the offense already has.

Rod Streater is a guy I have high hopes for, too...but he looks like solid depth at this point...if we need him, I'm sure he will produce.

All in all, I see the WRs as vastly improved from top to bottom. The fact we haven't even seen much of Robinson says a lot about the depth of talent at the position.

On to the defense

Where better to start off than the trenches?

To the DL

If we're gonna talk about the trenches...where better to start than with what might be our best defensive linemen. Chris Jones has been an absolute monster and has disrupted almost every play and has shut down runs and gotten to qbs. Extremely rare player that looks like an immediate hit.

Next up is Dontari Poe and I've got to say he doesn't look like a guy that looks to demand a huge FA deal after this year. Maybe the back is bothering him. Maybe he's just waiting to turn that switch on, but outside of a couple plays, he just doesn't look like a guy that's going to change games and gets washed out by the double.

Howard looks ready to build on what he did last year and force his way onto the field as much as possible.

Bailey seems the same as last year, which was impressive.

Roches looks improved.

King looks ready and deserving of an increased role.

This DL is going to be improved by the impact Chris Jones will make...no doubt...with other guys also stepping up, this unit has a good chance to be one of, if not the best DLs in the league.

Next group were gonna talk about is very hard to evaluate due to uncertainty of injuries...but I'll give it a shot.

Next up are the LBs

It all starts with Derrick Johnson in the middle and he looks like he's ready for another great year, but is close to the age where the end is near. I'm sure that won't happen this year, though.

Starting next to him will be a very talented second year guy in Justin March...huge question mark. Dorsey LOVES this kid, but who knows how he will respond to the situation. If he performs to his hype level, the defense should benefit from an upgrade from Mauga, but that's yet to be seen.

Can't say much about Houston or Hali. So those spots are a downgrade till proven otherwise.

Dadi looks like a good talent, but is probably a year out.

Can't look at the LBers without seeing them taking 2 steps back, unfortunately.

On to the secondary...

We return a quality secondary that will have some new faces, but for the most part is intact.

The unit is headlines by 2 all pro players in Marcus Peters and Eric Berry.

Let's start with Marcus Peters...this kid is just nasty and has otherworldly instincts, vision, ball skills and preparation...very fun to watch. I'm a little worried that he might have a sophomore slump with the possible lack of pass rush and his gambling personality. Should be fun to watch him match up, though.

Eric Berry and Ron Parker look to be as effective as years past, no real surprises.

Then we get to a bunch of question marks with the rookies and the kid we got from SF.

Losing a player like Sean Smith is going to hurt and therefore I need to look at the secondary as taking a step back without him, but with Gaines looking impressive and a very talented group of rookies stepping in, I can see us cushioning the blow.

As a defense, everything depends on the health of the edge guys.

If they return to being highly disruptive guys, the defense should be flat out nasty...if Houston and Hali don't return to form, we're gonna struggle and have a lot of high scoring games. That's not really our style as a team, but it should be fun to see how it all plays out.

The Franchise
09-01-2016, 11:41 AM
Break that shit up and put position headings or something.

Marcellus
09-01-2016, 11:42 AM
Why would have lost Hali? He isn't even on the PUP list.

O.city
09-01-2016, 11:46 AM
Holy wall of text batman.

O.city
09-01-2016, 11:47 AM
Offense should be much improved, especially if Charles is healthy.

Defense will be worse, until we get Houston back and get some experience on the backend.

Frosty
09-01-2016, 11:54 AM
http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/h4yt6.gif

Bowser
09-01-2016, 11:55 AM
http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/aa/aaa02f88b536d20d202daa670ba57825ec192818caff3539f01113b74c43acc5.jpg

Bowser
09-01-2016, 11:59 AM
To the poll question - I'm undecided. I think our offense is going to be vastly improved with the line playing the way it looks like it can, but the defense is a concern. No pass rush and a young secondary = QB's feasting on us. All in all, I feel like we are going to take a slight step back, at least early in the season before the bye. Hopefully the secondary holds, Dee Ford shows up, and I'm proven wrong.

KCUnited
09-01-2016, 12:00 PM
I'm going to attempt to evaluate how I see each position group going from last year to this year. I'm sure there will be plenty in agreement and disagreement with the way I see things, but I'm going to try to be as realistic as I can.

Get ready for a long read.

Ok?...lets get going with the QBs.

Starting with Alex Smith, I think we've seen a player over the last 3 seasons that has steadily improved and grown in the offense. He has looked as sharp as he ever has during this preseason (I know, preseason, but he has gotten the ball out with more zip and accuracy IMO) and upgrading the OL is going to pay huge dividends in allowing him to use more of his "gigabytes" at the line and after the ball is snapped. It's not only the OL, either...the upgrades at WR (we'll get to that in a little bit) are giving Alex more options on where to go with the ball. It seems that all these additions will have a good chance to open this offense up more and more and I expect Alex to have another career year. I see a slight improvement from Alex and I can see a big improvement from him by years end.

Moving on to the primary backup, KC went from Chse Daniel to the newly acquired Nick Foles who has a big upside and comes with a year of seasoning in the offense under Andy. We take a step back in experience in the offense from Chase at 3 years to Nick at 1, but the physical upside is a sizable upgrade. Foles has a little mobility, but has a big arm. He can make throws with a lot of zip that Chase simply couldn't. He has also shown that when coached correctly, he can be very productive and effecient. I see this as a slight improvement.

At the third QB spot, it's almost a certainty that KC releases Murray and Bray unless one does enough to have some trade value. I know some don't think so, but the writing is on the wall. Neither guy will be on the 53 man roster, maybe they get to sneak one of them onto IR...but they haven't done enough to earn a roster spot on such a deep roster that will probably cut much better players than them at other positions. Kevin Hogan will probably be the developmental guy.

I'm really excited about this teams offensive line, so let's talk about them. The group is as deep as it gets in today's NFL. We will probably cut at least one guy from this position group that starts on another team. Crazy to think, but watch how it plays out.

Let's start with Eric Fisher, being he is so polarizing to us as a fanbase. Towards the end of last season and into the playoffs, Fisher started to resemble a very good LT after a couple of very unimpressive years and has carried that into this preseason. He looks stronger, more confident and his technique has improved. That has lead to him not needing to lunge as much to prevent defenders from turning the corner on him and thats a good sign. He's also starting to show some of that nastiness some of us really liked during senior bowl week. He seems like a guy that has gotten his strength where it needs to be at this level and doesn't need to overcompensate with his athleticism and it's helping him reach the next level at his position. His backup is rookie Zach Sterup and he's a rookie that's 11 feet tall, but plays with good technique and balance. Hopefully, Fisher doesn't have an early injury while the kid is suspended.

Next up is the rookie Parker Ehinger that has very impressive technique and intelligence. He already identifies different blitzes and makes the correct switch to get his mitts on the right guy. He does lack the brute strength you'd like to see from a starting guard, but once the strength and conditioning program does its job with this kid, he's gonna have a real chance to be the total package...but that's gonna take time. He's an upgrade over the revolving door at LG KC fielded last year, for sure. The primary backup is Jerrod Pughsley who is a sleeper guy that just hasn't been given a chance to play much because of the quality of the teams OL as a unit...but has played very well when given the opportunity and shows a lot of promise.

At center, KC has its center position locked down for the next 10 years with Mitch Morse. He's highly intelligent, gritty, thinks quickly on his feet, moves very well and is a leader in the locker room and the weight room. I see the kid as a top 5 center already and has a chance to be a pro bowler if he continues to improve and stays healthy (the concussions are a concern). His primary backup, Fulton, might be the best backup center in the game and would start for a dozen or more teams. When called upon, he has been impressive with the 1s. I see center as slightly improved due to attrition and cohesiveness.

At RG, LDT has looked much improved and has flashed more and more as the guy we hope he develops into. A guy with elite measurables that is as smart as they come. He showed that upside against the best DT combo in the league of the Rams and held his own against them. Fulton has a year of starting experience at RG if LDT gets dinged up. I see the improvement from LDT as a BIGTIME plus for this OL and offense as a whole from last year, especially when the guys on either side of him are very good.

Last but not least we have a huge upgrade at RT, going from Donald Stephenson and Jah Reid to Mitchell Schwartz. Possibly the best RT in the league and at minimum top 5. He finishes off a line from left to right that is very solid and as they develop cohesion as a unit, has the potential to be a top 5 OL in the NFL and be in consideration for the best line in football, including Dallas.

I think it's very arguable that the OL has been upgraded by player addition and player development at every position, including the backups. This group is going to open huge holes for the four headed monster we have at RB (more on this in a minute...) and give Alex enough protection to be able to find that second receiver and TE more, instead of needing to dump it off so much. That's gonna be important because of the speed we have at receiver...they are going to have more time to get open and that's gonna make the offense fun to watch.

Ok, enough talking about the fatties.

Let's get to the skill position guys.

I know normally we would be getting excited to watch another year of Jamaal Charles highlight reel runs and while I am sold he will be the old Jamaal, he's not the RB I'm excited to watch....lets get to it, shall we?

Spencer Ware is going to be an absolute MONSTER in this offense. What this kid was able to do last year behind a craptastic OL was beyond impressive. He has enough speed to break deep runs, he's good in pass pro, has good hands and is a straight up BULLDOZER with rare physical core strength. With the line being upgraded, this kid is going to break big plays and brings a physical element to the offense that it desperately needs. His running style combined with this OL is going to wear down even the best front 7s in football and open up everything for the deep passing game, Travis Kelce...and even for Jamaal Charles as a change of pace back (that's crazy to type that out. Jamaal Charles as a change of pace back). Defensive coordinators are going to need to devote a lot of "field resources" to stopping the running game of the Chiefs and that's gonna mean a lot of 1on1 opportunities for the playmakers on the perimeter.

Jamaal Charles as a change of pace back. That feels weird, but depending on opposing defenses weaknesses that's gonna be a reality. One of my favorite players ever that does things the right way and has just as good vision, quickness and speed as anyone, pre injury. He has also never had a OL like this one. Charles might average 6.5 per carry in his role. That's probably a realistic goal.

Charcandrick West and Darrin Reaves are both guys with starter qualities that should also shine in their opportunities, but those opportunities might be very limited with the overall talent KC has st RB this year. Reid will be wise to rotate all 4 guys to keep them all fresh, but to give the majority of the carries to Ware. JMO.

This group will be vastly improved due to getting Charles back, but more so with the improvements they made to the OL. KC should be able to control the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball and that's gonna give the backs open running lanes and lots of opportunities for big plays.


On to the WRs...another very exciting group to talk about.


Jeremy Maclin is Jeremy Maclin. The guy has great hands, runs crisp routes and is one of the BIGTIME leaders of this team. Invaluable to the success of the 2016 Chiefs. I don't see a lot of change in how Maclin plays, but the attention he demands is going to do wonders for the other guys...and vice versa. The upgrades they've made on the OL are going to help everybody...and the WRs might have the biggest advantage.

The next guy I want to talk about is Chris Conley. What he did to one of the better corners in the league (Trumaine Johnson of the Rams) was impressive. He beat him with speed, quickness and ability to fight for the ball. He put in the work living at Maclins house this offseason and learning what it takes to be a successful NFL receiver and it's showing up in games. Conley is going to be the guy I'd say is going to get an advantage because of guys around him the most on offense because Alex should have more time to find him and coversges are going to be focusing on how to stop Maclin/Kelce/the running game. As the #2 WR, Conley has a chance to have a big year. I don't see a way Conley isn't an upgrade over Albert Wilson from last year and I think we're starting to see his crazy "upside" start to get realized.

Which brings me to one of the hot button topics around here. Tyreek Hill. I can't say enough about how impressed I was seeing this kid in person. He has "next level" type speed. That has translated to the field in PS and I don't see how it won't translate to Sunday's. His speed, route running, quickness, hands, vision and ability to "go get the ball" instead of letting it get to him are all high level skills and some are already elite level. The best part about him is that defenses won't be able to double him AT ALL. He's going to be the guy you MUST account for, but can't do anything about without giving up on stopping the ground game. I'm not going to be one bit surprised if he has a rookie year like Desean Jackson did. He has that level of talent. Hopefully the kid learned from his mistake and never goes down that road again, because he's gonna be a star.

Albert Wilson is dead to me. He never extends to make the catch, he gives up on routes, he's an inconsistent hands catcher and he doesn't deserve to have much playing time unless KC has injuries. Hopefully Dorsey trades him.

I've got to be honest...Deanthony Thomas lost me last year. We needed playmakers in the postseason and Thomas sat down. That said, I don't know everything about his situation...just that the team said he passed the tests and he made a decision NOT to play. Moving forward, the kid can get open and make plays so hopefully we can get something for him or find a way to showcase his talent even with all the playmakers the offense already has.

Rod Streater is a guy I have high hopes for, too...but he looks like solid depth at this point...if we need him, I'm sure he will produce.

All in all, I see the WRs as vastly improved from top to bottom. The fact we haven't even seen much of Robinson says a lot about the depth of talent at the position.

On to the defense

Where better to start off than the trenches?

If we're gonna talk about the trenches...where better to start than with what might be our best defensive linemen. Chris Jones has been an absolute monster and has disrupted almost every play and has shut down runs and gotten to qbs. Extremely rare player that looks like an immediate hit.

Next up is Dontari Poe and I've got to say he doesn't look like a guy that looks to demand a huge FA deal after this year. Maybe the back is bothering him. Maybe he's just waiting to turn that switch on, but outside of a couple plays, he just doesn't look like a guy that's going to change games and gets washed out by the double.

Howard looks ready to build on what he did last year and force his way onto the field as much as possible.

Bailey seems the same as last year, which was impressive.

Roches looks improved.

King looks ready and deserving of an increased role.

This DL is going to be improved by the impact Chris Jones will make...no doubt...with other guys also stepping up, this unit has a good chance to be one of, if not the best DLs in the league.

Next group were gonna talk about is very hard to evaluate due to uncertainty of injuries...but I'll give it a shot.

It all starts with Derrick Johnson in the middle and he looks like he's ready for another great year, but is close to the age where the end is near. I'm sure that won't happen this year, though.

Starting next to him will be a very talented second year guy in Justin March...huge question mark. Dorsey LOVES this kid, but who knows how he will respond to the situation. If he performs to his hype level, the defense should benefit from an upgrade from Mauga, but that's yet to be seen.

Can't say much about Houston or Hali. So those spots are a downgrade till proven otherwise.

Dadi looks like a good talent, but is probably a year out.

Can't look at the LBers without seeing them taking 2 steps back, unfortunately.

On to the secondary...

We return a quality secondary that will have some new faces, but for the most part is intact.

The unit is headlines by 2 all pro players in Marcus Peters and Eric Berry.

Let's start with Marcus Peters...this kid is just nasty and has otherworldly instincts, vision, ball skills and preparation...very fun to watch. I'm a little worried that he might have a sophomore slump with the possible lack of pass rush and his gambling personality. Should be fun to watch him match up, though.

Eric Berry and Ron Parker look to be as effective as years past, no real surprises.

Then we get to a bunch of question marks with the rookies and the kid we got from SF.

Losing a player like Sean Smith is going to hurt and therefore I need to look at the secondary as taking a step back without him, but with Gaines looking impressive and a very talented group of rookies stepping in, I can see us cushioning the blow.

As a defense, everything depends on the health of the edge guys.

If they return to being highly disruptive guys, the defense should be flat out nasty...if Houston and Hali don't return to form, we're gonna struggle and have a lot of high scoring games. That's not really our style as a team, but it should be fun to see how it all plays out.
<img src="http://i1290.photobucket.com/albums/b539/KCUnited1/Hetriedtobreakthe4thwallandfailed_c5df67_3959118_zps0iu2xu7l.gif" border="0" alt=" photo Hetriedtobreakthe4thwallandfailed_c5df67_3959118_zps0iu2xu7l.gif"/>

ct
09-01-2016, 12:00 PM
you lost me at blah blah blah yada yada yada

Sandy Vagina
09-01-2016, 12:03 PM
Offense should be much improved, especially if Charles is healthy.

Defense will be worse, until we get Houston back and get some experience on the backend.

This sums it up nicely.

So long as the defense isn't bottom tier, the Chiefs will roll through these months, and into the playoffs with 10+ wins.

Hammock Parties
09-01-2016, 12:07 PM
Lost a lot.

Gained a lot of inexperienced players.

Mr. Laz
09-01-2016, 12:37 PM
We definitely lost more than we gained.


BUT ... the guys we already have may improve to offset that.

DC.chief
09-01-2016, 12:41 PM
Well we lost some football players and then added a few football players

if my math is correct...

where X = players we lost, Y = players we gained, Z = original roster

( Z - X ) + Y = football

I think we're in store for some football boys

wazu
09-01-2016, 12:58 PM
Need a "balances ou" option. I'm expecting better offense, worse defense. Similar level of competitiveness.

Direckshun
09-01-2016, 01:03 PM
We gained a bit at QB (Smith/Foles > Smith/Daniel).

Gained a good deal at RB (Charles/Ware/West > Charles/Davis).

Gained a good deal at WR (Maclin/Conley/Wilson > Maclin/Wilson/Avant)

Stayed the same at TE (could be argued as a gain, since Harris is another year more experienced?).

Gained a bit at OL (Fisher/Ehringer/Morse/Duvarney-Tardif/Schwartz > Fisher/Grubbs/Morse/Duvarney-Tardif/Stephenson)

The same at DL (Howard/Poe/Bailey with Jones = DeVito/Poe/Bailey with Howard)

Got waaaay worse at OLB (Hali/Ford with Zombo < Hali/Houston with Ford)

The same at ILB (Johnson/March = Johnson/Mauga)

Got way worse at CB (Peters/Gaines with Nelson < Smith/Peters with Gaines)

Got a little worse at S (Berry/Parker with Sorenson < Berry/Parker with Abdullah)

We made improvement, but the two losses of Sean Smith and Justin Houston (for now) will be felt all season long.

Easy 6
09-01-2016, 01:03 PM
If Gaines stays healthy, and when Houston gets back... it will be a net gain

We'll be better than last year on both sides of the ball

RunKC
09-01-2016, 01:06 PM
We gained a bit at QB (Smith/Foles > Smith/Daniel).

Gained a good deal at RB (Charles/Ware/West > Charles/Davis).

Gained a good deal at WR (Maclin/Conley/Wilson > Maclin/Wilson/Avant)

Stayed the same at TE (could be argued as a gain, since Harris is another year more experienced?).

Gained a bit at OL (Fisher/Ehringer/Morse/Duvarney-Tardif/Schwartz > Fisher/Grubbs/Morse/Duvarney-Tardif/Stephenson)

The same at DL (Howard/Poe/Bailey with Jones = DeVito/Poe/Bailey with Howard)

Got waaaay worse at OLB (Hali/Ford with Zombo < Hali/Houston with Ford)

The same at ILB (Johnson/March = Johnson/Mauga)

Got way worse at CB (Peters/Gaines with Nelson < Smith/Peters with Gaines)

Got a little worse at S (Berry/Parker with Sorenson < Berry/Parker with Abdullah)

We made improvement, but the two losses of Sean Smith and Justin Houston (for now) will be felt all season long.


Agree here except WR could be a lot better if Conley keeps looking good.

We are literally banking on the 2014 draft to develop to counter the losses of Houston/Smith.

Hammock Parties
09-01-2016, 01:06 PM
We'll be better than last year on both sides of the ball

There's no way Phil Gaines > Sean Smith

If you're saying this defense is going to be better than it was a year ago you're basically saying Chris Jones is going to be a beast as a rookie and we won't have any dropoff at Mauga's vacated ILB spot.

Tall order.

Easy 6
09-01-2016, 01:14 PM
There's no way Phil Gaines > Sean Smith

If you're saying this defense is going to be better than it was a year ago you're basically saying Chris Jones is going to be a beast as a rookie and we won't have any dropoff at Mauga's vacated ILB spot.

Tall order.

There is no valid reason to think Gaines (if healthy) cant be as effective as Smith

Smith was rock solid, used his length well... but his lack of speed and quickness was often exploited, that wont be the case with a healthy Gaines, at his best he can completely blanket even the quickest receivers

Jones IS going to beast as a rookie, which will offset most forthcoming suck from Ford

And lets not act like losing Mauga is some kind of death blow, March can grow into those shoes

DaneMcCloud
09-01-2016, 01:19 PM
There's no way Phil Gaines > Sean Smith

Complete speculation

If you're saying this defense is going to be better than it was a year ago you're basically saying Chris Jones is going to be a beast as a rookie and we won't have any dropoff at Mauga's vacated ILB spot.

Tall order.

This defense should be nearly as good without Houston and better when Houston returns after Week 6.

Don't underestimate the addition of a guy like Chris Jones to the defensive line rotation or the sideline-to-sideline ability of Justin March.

I think that it's highly like that Ford and Hali combine for at least 10.5 sacks this year.

Mr. Laz
09-01-2016, 01:28 PM
There is no valid reason to think Gaines (if healthy) cant be as effective as Smith
So you're saying that that a guy coming off a year long injury who has only played a single year at a decent level is just as good as a veteran who proved on our team, in our system for several years.

No valid reason all ... no brainer

Gaines = Smith

pass the crack pipe, you've had too much


COULD Gaines turn out to be that good ... yes.

Saying there is no question about it is absurd.

Hammock Parties
09-01-2016, 01:32 PM
If Gaines and March are as good as the guys they're replacing Dorsey is some kind of genius. LMAO

Mr. Laz
09-01-2016, 01:33 PM
Jones IS going to beast as a rookie, which will offset most forthcoming suck from FordMore almost complete baseless conjecture.

How may preseason studs have gone to do nothing in the regular season?

Tons

You are confusing what you WANT to happen with what MIGHT happen.


A sucking Ford is going to hard to offset regardless because he is playing a key position in our defensive scheme. Some people say it's THE key position in our scheme. LOLB has to be able rush the passer,drop in coverage,set the edge all on any given play or our defense has a gaping hole that teams can exploit.

BossChief
09-01-2016, 01:33 PM
If Gaines and March are as good as the guys they're replacing Dorsey is some kind of genius. LMAO

Who brought in the guys he's replacing?

Easy 6
09-01-2016, 01:33 PM
So you're saying that that a guy coming off a year long injury who has only played a single year at a decent level is just as good as a veteran who proved on our team, in our system for several years.

No valid reason all ... no brainer

Gaines = Smith

pass the crack pipe, you've had too much


COULD Gaines turn out to be that good ... yes.

Saying there is no question about it is absurd.

The sample size is obviously small... but when he has played he looked like a genuine lockdown corner, able to go cut for cut and stride for stride with agile and fast receivers

If he can stay healthy, yes... just as good and even better in some ways

Hammock Parties
09-01-2016, 01:34 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong but...has Gaines even started a preseason game at outside corner this year?

Mr. Laz
09-01-2016, 01:35 PM
The sample size is obviously small... but when he has played he looked like a genuine lockdown corner, able to go cut for cut and stride for stride with agile and fast receivers

If he can stay healthy, yes... just as good and even better in some ways
"sample size is small ... "

so then there is a valid question.

BossChief
09-01-2016, 01:36 PM
More almost complete baseless conjecture.

How may preseason studs have gone to do nothing in the regular season?

Tons

You are confusing what you WANT to happen with what MIGHT happen.


A sucking Ford is going to hard to offset regardless because he is playing a key position out our defensive scheme. Some people say it's THE key position in our scheme. LOLB has to be able rush the passer,drop in coverage,set the edge all on any given play or our defense has a gaping hole that teams can exploit.

You act like Dee Ford hasnt ever played.

The defense didn't get destroyed after Houston went down last year with Dee Ford starting.

In fact, he played quite well.

Now he's had a whole offseason as the starter and enters the season as such.

I still have hope that he will turn it up and impress us all.

Mr. Laz
09-01-2016, 01:37 PM
You act like Dee Ford hasnt ever played.

The defense didn't get destroyed after Houston went down last year with Dee Ford starting.

In fact, he played quite well.

Now he's had a whole offseason as the starter and enters the season as such.

I still have hope that he will turn it up and impress us all.
We all certainly hope he turns it up. We need him badly.

RunKC
09-01-2016, 01:46 PM
Hoping a rookie can fill Josh Mauga's vacant spot LMAO

Mauga was a good take on LB who could stop runs in the middle of the field. The guy was slow as hell and couldn't go sideline-to-sideline at all. Sweep runs always worked against him on his side.
He was also a complete liability in pass defense. The Pats targeted his area of the field on the Edelman crossing routes bc Mauga couldn't pass defend and read the QB.

Saying March is an overall upgrade isn't being a homer. It's acknowledging just how bad Mauga was last year.

Hammock Parties
09-01-2016, 01:46 PM
Starters at CB this preseason:

SEA: Peters, Nelson, Cooper
LA: Peters, Murray, White
CHI: Peters, Gaines, Nelson

You're telling me that our "lockdown" corner has only started one game this preseason?

That doesn't even sound like he's locked down a starting position, let alone a status as one of the best CBs in the league.

Pump the brakes.

Mr. Laz
09-01-2016, 01:49 PM
Hoping a rookie can fill Josh Mauga's vacant spot LMAO

Mauga was a good take on LB who could stop runs in the middle of the field. The guy was slow as hell and couldn't go sideline-to-sideline at all. Sweep runs always worked against him on his side.
He was also a complete liability in pass defense. The Pats targeted his area of the field on the Edelman crossing routes bc Mauga couldn't pass defend and read the QB.

Saying March is an overall upgrade isn't being a homer. It's acknowledging just how bad Mauga was last year.
You are referring to the potential of March being an upgrade. He still has a learning curve. Having Ford out there in the flat is going to something teams exploit every week if he doesn't step the fuck up as well.

Having March and Ford next to each other could be a freaking disaster.


Not 'will' but 'could'

BossChief
09-01-2016, 01:50 PM
Starters at CB this preseason:

SEA: Peters, Nelson, Cooper
LA: Peters, Murray, White
CHI: Peterson, Gaines, Nelson

You're telling me that our "lockdown" corner has only started one game this preseason?

That doesn't even sound like he's locked down a starting position, let alone a status as one of the best CBs in the league.

Pump the brakes.

I'm not sure anybody is saying he's one of the best CBs in the league, just that he's pretty good and has shown the ability to play well against good receivers, like Alshon Jeffrey and Emmanuel Sanders.

Also, the fact he has only started 1 PS game means nothing.

Andy Reid has said all along that Gaines will start and that they are bringing him along slowly.

BossChief
09-01-2016, 01:52 PM
You are referring to the potential of March being an upgrade. He still has a learning curve. Having Ford out there in the flat is going to something teams exploit every week if he doesn't step the **** up as well.

Having March and Ford next to each other could be a freaking disaster.


Not 'will' but 'could'

Why do you always play the Debbie downer role nowadays?

If Ford builds on what he did last year and March plays as well as Dorsey thinks he can, the defense will be pretty good.

R Clark
09-01-2016, 01:52 PM
Isn't peters the lock down cornor on this team? I don't know who Peterson is ,do they have a cornor on the team named Peterson

BossChief
09-01-2016, 01:54 PM
Cornor?

Really?

Hammock Parties
09-01-2016, 01:55 PM
I'm not sure anybody is saying he's one of the best CBs in the league

That's exactly what Easy 6 is saying. He said he could be BETTER than Sean Smith. LMAO

Also, the fact he has only started 1 PS game means nothing.


Really? Because it would seem to me if you were starting an inexperienced player at corner you would want him to play there as MUCH as possible.

They don't seem to care about that. I think CB2 isn't even decided and people around here have massively overrated Phil Gaines.

BossChief
09-01-2016, 02:00 PM
Gaines is better than Smith in a few ways. He has better quickness, ball skills and deep speed.

I think Gaines is going to play very well.

RunKC
09-01-2016, 02:01 PM
Gaines is the starter across from Peters. This has been decided for months.

They are bringing him back slowly from an ACL surgery. He'll start next week.

Mr. Laz
09-01-2016, 02:01 PM
Why do you always play the Debbie downer role nowadays?

If Ford builds on what he did last year and March plays as well as Dorsey thinks he can, the defense will be pretty good.
I'm not trying to be debbiedowner at all.

I'm not trolling either

I'm just stubborn about dealing with the reality of the situation.

The reality is that we have several serious questions on our defense. Ignoring those questions don't make them go away.

Easy 6
09-01-2016, 02:01 PM
That's exactly what Easy 6 is saying. He said he could be BETTER than Sean Smith. LMAO

You're right, I am saying that

I realize there are some ifs involved with my take about a net gain, but I usually lean to the positive

The bottom line at this point is that no one wins this argument, the season hasnt begun yet so who knows, lotta things still to be determined... we'll know more after the Chargers game

Beef Supreme
09-01-2016, 02:02 PM
I'm betting we still have 53 guys on the active roster.

Frosty
09-01-2016, 02:04 PM
Wait - I thought Sean Smith was a huge fraud and totally overrated.

But, now he's irreplaceable.

I'm going to get whiplash. :eek:

Hammock Parties
09-01-2016, 02:05 PM
Gaines is the starter across from Peters. This has been decided for months.

They are bringing him back slowly from an ACL surgery. He'll start next week.

He's not even listed as a starter on KcChiefs.com. Nelson is. For that matter, neither is Justin March.

I think Phil Gaines may end up being the bigfoot of NFL cornerbacks. A myth.

BossChief
09-01-2016, 02:12 PM
I'm not trying to be debbiedowner at all.

I'm not trolling either

I'm just stubborn about dealing with the reality of the situation.

The reality is that we have several serious questions on our defense. Ignoring those questions don't make them go away.

The reality is that we return 3/4 starters in the secondary and replaced the 4th guy with an in house veteran, a traded for third year player that graded out positively on PFF, a third and a fourth round pick and will adjust the scheme accordingly.

As far as the LBers go, I'm concerned...but even at worst case scenario, it's a solid front 7...if Dee Ford and March/Wilson/Alexander step up, the front 7 might be pretty damn good, even without Justin Houston.

notorious
09-01-2016, 02:13 PM
Better, but with a more difficult schedule.

BossChief
09-01-2016, 02:13 PM
He's not even listed as a starter on KcChiefs.com. Nelson is. For that matter, neither is Justin March.

I think Phil Gaines may end up being the bigfoot of NFL cornerbacks. A myth.

Have you even listened to Andy Reid all offseason?

Hammock Parties
09-01-2016, 02:17 PM
Have you even listened to Andy Reid all offseason?

No, but I will never forget what Eagles fans told us: don't listen to any of Reid's press conferences because nothing he says matters.

DaneMcCloud
09-01-2016, 02:19 PM
Better, but with a more difficult schedule.

This is the easiest schedule that I can even recall for the Chiefs.

They play three home games in December and 4 out of their final 7 games are at home.

They have two tough out of division road games, Pittsburgh on October 2 and Carolina on November 15th, with the Texans, Colts and Falcons all looking to be manageable road games.

MTG#10
09-01-2016, 02:20 PM
I'm shocked by Clay's vote

Sandy Vagina
09-01-2016, 05:36 PM
I think Phil Gaines may end up being the bigfoot of NFL cornerbacks. A myth.



Didn't you think Sean Smith was shit for years?!?

Uhm.. yeah.. opinion discarded. :harumph:


It's fair to think Gaines.. if healthy.. will make losing Sean a minor thing. Now, what's at CB3-5? That could be the problem, sure.

Sandy Vagina
09-01-2016, 05:38 PM
I'm not trying to be debbiedowner at all.

I'm not trolling either

I'm just stubborn about dealing with the reality of the situation.

The reality is that we have several serious questions on our defense. Ignoring those questions don't make them go away.

It's not about ignoring them. It's about judging what could be there, and electing to have a positive or negative expectation of it.

ThaVirus
09-01-2016, 05:50 PM
DIt's fair to think Gaines.. if healthy.. will make losing Sean a minor thing.


I wouldn't say so

Mr. Laz
09-01-2016, 06:02 PM
It's not about ignoring them. It's about judging what could be there, and electing to have a positive or negative expectation of it.
and i say it COULD be positive or it COULD be negative

It's funny, when i say something positive i don't get labored a homer but when i even hint a the possibility of something negative, i'm debbie downer.

Offense - looks to be better (WR and Oline)
ST - looks to be better (Colquitt seems healthy again, Hill > DaT)
Defense - looks to be worse

2 out of 3 positive yet people just can't let it go.

:rolleyes:

Sandy Vagina
09-01-2016, 06:06 PM
and i say it COULD be positive or it COULD be negative

It's funny, when i say something positive i don't get labored a homer but when i even hint a the possibility of something negative, i'm debbie downer.

Offense - looks to be better (WR and Oline)
ST - looks to be better (Colquitt seems healthy again, Hill > DaT)
Defense - looks to be worse

2 out of 3 positive yet people just can't let it go.

:rolleyes:

You know the CP way. I'm not calling you names, and being a dick. Others will, no matter what.

I just took minor exception to you stating the part about "ignoring the questionable spots." Everyone plainly sees that some positions have changed.. and could be worse.