Colts Hire Chiefs' Player Personal Chris Ballard

[Mr. Laz]

The #Colts have hired GM Chris Ballard, formerly of the #Chiefs.

— Ian Rapoport (@RapSheet) January 29, 2017



It's also been reported that Ballard might take the Chiefs' ST coach Dave Toub with him.




(I thought it deserved to have it's own thread for the people who aren't around much and will see it in the title.)

[Bowser]

Well, shit

[Easy 6]

It sucks, but I'm not surprised... cant keep' em all

[Bowser]

It sucks, but I'm not surprised... cant keep' em all

Yep, this.

And it's hard to not take over a team that already has the QB of the future in place. Not a bad place to be.

[Rasputin]

Ouch.


Taking Dave Toub with him would suck.

[el borracho]

As if we needed another reason to hate the Colts.

[Buehler445]

I hope he can put up with Irsay. Dude is nuttier than an almond joy.

[Rain Man]

As if we needed another reason to hate the Colts.

It's hard to imagine a point where the Colts could ever get off my franchise death list.

[Deberg_1990]

Congrats Chris!

[Bowser]

I hope he can put up with Irsay. Dude is nuttier than an almond joy.

You dick, now I've got that old Almond Joy TV commercial ditty going through my head! Son of a bitch!

[TambaBerry]

I hope he can put up with Irsay. Dude is nuttier than an almond joy.

probably won't have to for that much longer

[Easy 6]

Yep, this.

And it's hard to not take over a team that already has the QB of the future in place. Not a bad place to be.

One good draft and free agency period would do wonders for that team

Patch a decent O line together

Get a decent running back

Then load up on defense

[Chief Roundup]

Losing Toub will definitely affect our ST unit. That will then in turn hurt our W-L next season. This could be a bigger blow to our team than Ballard.

[Bowser]

Losing Toub will definitely affect our ST unit. That will then in turn hurt our W-L next season. This could be a bigger blow to our team than Ballard.

Pagano just signed a four year extension with the Colts a week or three ago.

[Chief Roundup]

Pagano just signed a four year extension with the Colts a week or three ago.
Yeah and the Rams extended Fisher about the same time frame before they fired him.

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[DaneMcCloud]

Pagano just signed a four year extension with the Colts a week or three ago.

It's actually a great situation for Ballard.

He goes to team that is talent depleted but with a coach is already in place.

If he provides talent but Pagano can't win, then Ballard can hire "his" guy and likely extend his stay by another 5 years or so.

[DaneMcCloud]

Personally, I'm glad he's gone now, as it was inevitable.

The Chiefs don't need this distraction every year, especially this late into the season, when they're preparing for The Combine and setting up their draft boards.

[Rasputin]

I'm going be so pissed if Colts get back to the Super Bowl before we get a whiff of it.


fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck



fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck



fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck


Just sayin

[bsp4444]

Can he take Toub with him?

[threebag]

Did anyone see Andy and Dave Toub having a little tiff late in the game vs Steelers? Look like they had a difference of opinion in play calls.

[RunKC]

Personally, I'm glad he's gone now, as it was inevitable.

The Chiefs don't need this distraction every year, especially this late into the season, when they're preparing for The Combine and setting up their draft boards.

I'm wondering if he will take a scout or two from us and promote them on his staff. I also wonder who is going to replace Ballard on our staff

[stumppy]

I'm going be so pissed if Colts get back to the Super Bowl before we get a whiff of it.


fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck



fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck



fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck


Just sayin
I'd just like to add fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck

[Rasputin]

Personally, I'm glad he's gone now, as it was inevitable.

The Chiefs don't need this distraction every year, especially this late into the season, when they're preparing for The Combine and setting up their draft boards.

Teams shouldn't be able to be aloud to ask for permission to speak to coaches that are still in the playoffs.

They should get draft picks taken away.

[MMXcalibur]

GODDAMNIT, FUCK YOU INDIANAPOLIS

[RunKC]

Looks like Veach is taking his spot:

Matt Miller

Next in line from Kansas City? Keep an eye on Brett Veach. Has been climbing the ladder there. Great reputation as a scout's scout

[Iconic]

Fuck us on the field and off it. Thanks Colts.

[DaneMcCloud]

Teams shouldn't be able to be aloud to ask for permission to speak to coaches that are still in the playoffs.

They should get draft picks taken away.

Teams are allowed to speak to coaches if there's a Bye Week or after teams have been eliminated. For example, the 49ers interviewed Kyle Shanahan during the Falcons Bye but hasn't been allowed to speak to them since, but he's expected to be the new head coach after the Super Bowl.

It would be a disaster to make teams wait until the last week of January to scramble to interview coaches because The Combines are just a few weeks away and teams need time to plan ahead, especially when there's a new offensive and defensive philosophy (not to mention, getting on board with the new owner, GM, etc.).

[Hoopsdoc]

Pagano just signed a four year extension with the Colts a week or three ago.

That was last year. He and Grigson were both extended at the end of last season when everyone thought they were gonna be fired.

[DaneMcCloud]

Can he take Toub with him?

The Colts could hire Toub if they gave him the Assistant Head Coach position.

But unless Pagano is fired, it would seem rather awkward to have Toub on staff because Pagano would be constantly looking over his shoulder.

[chiefscafan]

We will be fine stop panicking this happens to good teams

[Coochie liquor]

Yeah and the Rams extended Fisher about the same time frame before they fired him.

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Irsay is too cheap to just let him go and pay him.

[Mr_Tomahawk]

Looks like Veach is taking his spot:

Matt Miller

Next in line from Kansas City? Keep an eye on Brett Veach. Has been climbing the ladder there. Great reputation as a scout's scout



Tell me more.


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[RunKC]

Teams are allowed to speak to coaches if there's a Bye Week or after teams have been eliminated. For example, the 49ers interviewed Kyle Shanahan during the Falcons Bye but hasn't been allowed to speak to them since, but he's expected to be the new head coach after the Super Bowl.

It would be a disaster to make teams wait until the last week of January to scramble to interview coaches because The Combines are just a few weeks away and teams need time to plan ahead, especially when there's a new offensive and defensive philosophy (not to mention, getting on board with the new owner, GM, etc.).

Disagree.

Front office personnel guys work year round. Ballard has been taking notes on guys for this draft since last summer. I would imagine that a new staff would also have tons of info on a lot of prospects.

Toub's unit had by far their worst outing in the playoff game and it's not surprising considering he was a distraction by interviewing.

[Mr_Tomahawk]

Random....

https://twitter.com/delawarefb/status/759779453350346752


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[Mr. Laz]

We will be fine stop panicking this happens to good teams
fuck off


we sucked for 12 years, hardly a time to be cocky about shit

[DaneMcCloud]

Toub's unit had by far their worst outing in the playoff game and it's not surprising considering he was a distraction by interviewing.

It didn't affect Kyle Shanahan

[The Bad Guy]

The Colts could hire Toub if they gave him the Assistant Head Coach position.

But unless Pagano is fired, it would seem rather awkward to have Toub on staff because Pagano would be constantly looking over his shoulder.

Chiefs aren't going to grant permission for Toub to become an assistant HC. Teams can block any other team trying to take a coach for anything but HC.

[jspchief]

Pagano just signed a four year extension with the Colts a week or three ago.
Source?

[KChiefs1]

Damn


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[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Teams shouldn't be able to be aloud to ask for permission to speak to coaches that are still in the playoffs.

They should get draft picks taken away.


Dude , spelling 101

[RealSNR]

Chiefs aren't going to grant permission for Toub to become an assistant HC. Teams can block any other team trying to take a coach for anything but HC.

But it's really classless of them to do /Knowmo

[BigRedChief]

Wellllll they are better lock up Dorsey now.

[KChiefs1]

Tell me more.


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From Philly to Kansas City, One Chiefs Scout Shares His Journey:



Everything came together nicely for Kansas City Chiefs pro and college personnel analyst Brett Veach two years ago.

After spending the two previous seasons as the Philadelphia Eagles Southeast region college scout (2011-12), Veach was given an opportunity to reunite with Andy Reid in Kansas City.

Veach, who had worked as a summer intern with the Eagles after his playing career at the University of Delaware had ended, developed a love for scouting and the personnel side of football operations while working under Reid in Philadelphia.

"My first role with the Eagles was coach Reid's assistant," Veach explained of the position he held from 2007 to 2009. "Really, if you follow the track of that position, most of the time people in that position go on to a coaching career. I had luck on my side in that [Reid] was doing a lot of personnel at the time, so it was natural for him to give me assignments that were more personnel-based.


"So from there, I kind of grew a love for that side of things. It was just something I was instantly attracted to."

Veach, a converted receiver after being a standout running back at Mount Carmel High School in Pennsylvania, where he was named the 1996 Player of the Year, caught 99 passes for 1,470 yards and 12 touchdowns in his career at Delaware (1998-2001). He also ranks third all-time at the school in kickoff return yards.

Interestingly enough, Veach spent his collegiate career catching passes from Chiefs quarterbacks coach Matt Nagy, who played for the Blue Hens (1997-2000) before joining Reid and Veach in Philadelphia in 2008 as a coaching intern.

But for Veach, the opportunity to join Reid in Kansas City wasn't just about following a familiar face; the structure of the personnel department was something that piqued his interest.

"I think one thing that we do here which is really cool is we kind of cross-train," he said. "A lot of our pro guys help out on the college side, and then vice-versa, where a lot of our college guys will be asked for our input on the pro side. So there's constant communication and back-and-forth in regards to strengths and weaknesses of where we can improve the team.

"I have a dual role where I do some college and some pro, so it's kind of a unique opportunity. I help out during the free agency period and the cut-down days with the pro side and then hit the road during the fall for college."

Most fans see the NFL Draft as the culmination of an offseason of talking through mock drafts and analysts' projections and opinions.

But for scouts like Veach, the draft is the end of a journey that included a lot of hours on the road away from friends and family, evaluating players, who could potentially help the Chiefs, from all across the country.

"I think whatever you do in life, everything is a people business," Veach said. "It's all about establishing your relationships. I think the ability to go out on the road, meet new people, talk football, learn a little bit about the different areas and cultures and traditions, that's a really cool thing."

Photo Gallery: Working Together



Despite the hours and travel, the hook for Veach is trying to determine the trajectory and future of a player.

"Having the opportunity to see young men and their abilities at a certain stage and project in your mind what they could be for your team and how they fit in, I think that's the thing that draws you in the most."

After the collegiate and NFL seasons have ended, the scouts and personnel guys get together with the coaching staff to share what they've learned.

"It's exciting because of the trust we have with our staff," Veach said of this time. "It's exciting for us to come in, sit down with them and share everything we've logged from really June and July all the way up until where we are now.

"It's exciting to give them your spin on things, but then in turn, it's also exciting to hear their take on some of the things you may have missed on a report or evaluation.

"The communication is a thing you really look forward to."

Any decision on a player being drafted is obviously not one that's made with a singular voice, but certain players can stand out from the first time you watch them.

"The guys that really by the time you get to the seventh or eighth play on tape, you already want to watch more," Veach explained. "Most of the time, a scout will watch three to four games on a player and then go back and watch a later tape, but every now and then you'll get a player that you just want to watch every single game because they're so fun to watch.

"They just instantly jump out on tape."

While Veach had a history with Reid before he came to Kansas City, the opportunity to work for general manager John Dorsey, with his respected past and pedigree, was another reason Veach made the move.

"Obviously, having the opportunity to work for coach Reid is something that I don't think many people would pass on," he explained. "But I think what also made it even more attractive was the fact that he'd be working with John Dorsey.

"That was something that I had a strong desire to do. His reputation around the league was solid and everyone spoke very highly of him. The fact that John had that Green Bay pedigree was something that I think all the scouts on the road really aspire to work for."

He continued.

"You look at that track record and knowing that they really do it the blue-collar way, where you just roll the sleeves up, go to work, watch tape, not going to dabble a lot in free agency; it's really going to be all about the draft and creating your own culture. That was something that you're really excited about in regards to that opportunity."

The opportunity, derived from his own hard work, along with the serendipitous hiring of both Reid and Dorsey in Kansas City, put Veach in a position to learn from two of the most respected NFL minds in their respective positions.

That's why Veach decided to continue his career in Kansas City-to learn and develop in his own right-as he looks for prospects to bring to the Chiefs to learn and develop as players.

It's an amalgamation that will hopefully benefit everyone, including members of Chiefs Kingdom, who will see the result of Dorsey, Reid, Veach and company's hard work when the roster is set heading into 2015.



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[KChiefs1]

EAGLES LOSE TOP SCOUT BRETT VEACH TO CHIEFS:

With the start of free agency right around the corner and the NFL draft less than two months away, the Eagles have lost a significant member of their personnel department.

Brett Veach, who was entering his fourth season in the scouting department and third as the team’s Southeast region scout, left the team to reunite with Andy Reid in Kansas City for an undetermined scouting role for the Chiefs.

Veach first broke into the NFL as an intern with the Eagles in 2004 and was later hired as Reid’s assistant in 2007. He ascended quickly in the front office and was considered one of the team’s keenest scouts.

“Basically, an opportunity presented itself in Kansas City to be a part of Coach Reid’s staff again and [general manager] John Dorsey staff, and it was an opportunity I was excited about,” Veach, a native of Mount Carmel, Pa., and former University of Delaware standout, told CSNPhilly.com.

Veach said he left on great terms with the Eagles, calling his time there “six unbelieveable years” of learning under general manager Howie Roseman, former player personnel chief Ryan Grigson (now the Colts’ general manager) and director of college scouting Anthony Patch.

“Those guys taught me everything I know to this point,” Veach said. “You’re talking about three really sharp minds that I learned from every day.”

Veach left the Eagles shortly after the NFL Scouting Combine in late February and said Roseman graciously allowed him to go. The Eagles didn’t respond to comment and it’s unclear if they’ve filled Veach’s spot.

Ed Marynowitz, who joined the Eagles’ staff last May as assistant director of pro scouting, represented the Eagles at Miami’s and Florida International’s Pro Days on Thursday. Marynowitz had been the director of player personnel at the University of Alabama for four years before he joined the Eagles.

But Veach’s departure leaves the Eagles without one of their most prominent field scouts during the most critical time period for general managers and coaches to lean heavily on their personnel staff. Free agency starts 4 p.m. Tuesday and the draft starts April 25.

For the next seven weeks, personnel staffs will be hosting college prospects for interviews along with traveling the countryside to examine more prospects at Pro Days and private workouts. One league source said NFL teams rarely let scouts get away in the heart of the pre-draft process.

Several of the Eagles’ draft picks over the past few years have come from the prospect-rich Southeast region and from the prestigious Southeastern Conference, including last year’s first-round pick, former Mississippi State defensive tackle Fletcher Cox. The Eagles traded up to pluck Cox at 12th overall.

The Eagles also picked cornerback Brandon Boykin in the fourth round. Boykin edged incumbent Joselio Hanson for the nickelback job and played the position all year, along with returning kickoffs.

After his internship in 2004, Veach went back to work in Delaware’s athletic department until his second chance to work for Reid came in 2007, when he was named assistant to the head coach. He served that position for three years until his promotion to college and pro scout in 2010.

Veach was assigned to study wide receivers in 2008 leading up to the draft. That year, the Eagles picked DeSean Jackson in the second round. Jackson has made two Pro Bowls.

The Eagles promoted Veach to regional college scout in 2011 and assigned Veach to the country’s most fertile ground for college football standouts.

When the chance came to work again for Reid, who was fired by the Eagles at the end of last season and quickly hired by the Chiefs, Veach embraced the opportunity.

“Now I get a chance to work with John Dorsey,” Veach said. “It was just an exciting opportunity to learn from another great NFL mind.”


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[notorious]

I'm going be so pissed if Colts get back to the Super Bowl before we get a whiff of it.


**** **** **** **** **** ****



**** **** **** **** **** ****



**** **** **** **** **** ****


Just sayin

Probably will happen. They have the most important piece.

[KChiefs1]

https://twitter.com/lriddickespn/status/742723643730464768






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[KChiefs1]

Arguably the biggest move surrounds Chris Ballard, who was promoted from director of player personnel to director of football operations.

Ballard, who has 14 years of experience in NFL personnel, joined the Chiefs in 2013 and his name has surfaced around the league in the past two offseasons as a prime candidate for open general manager spots. The Chicago Bears interviewed Ballard in early January 2015 for the then-vacant general manager position.

Of note, Chiefs general manager John Dorsey served one year as the Green Bay Packers director of football operations in 2012 before being hired to his current position.

In other moves, the Chiefs promoted Mike Borgonzi and Brett Veach as co-directors of player personnel to replace Ballard.

Borgonzi, who has been with the Chiefs for six years, previously served as the director of pro scouting, and Veach held the position of pro and college personnel analyst the past two years after serving six years with coach Andy Reid in Philadelphia (2007-12).

Ryne Nutt, who joined the Chiefs staff in 2010, moves from Northeast area scout to Southeast area scout, an area former assistant director of college scouting Dom Green was responsible for. The New York Jets recently hired Green as its Southwest area scout.

Matt Donahoe, who has been with the Chiefs since 2013, moves from national scout to Nutt’s previous post as Northeast area scout. Donahoe spent the 2012 summer in Green Bay as a scouting intern.

The promotions affect titles and responsibilities, but not the reporting structure, as each man will still report to Dorsey.


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[T-post Tom]

Isray chose to keep Pagano when he fired Grigson. Pagano has 3 years left on his contract. Normally, I'd say those are signs that Pagano is staying. But as previous posters have stated: Isray is a bit of a wildcard. And the Colts have gone 8-8 two years in a row. So I guess anything is possible. I hope the Chiefs can find a way to keep Toub. Unless they talk Isray into trading Luck for Toub. :p Ballard was a great signing by the Colts.

[T-post Tom]

Arguably the biggest move surrounds Chris Ballard, who was promoted from director of player personnel to director of football operations.

Ballard, who has 14 years of experience in NFL personnel, joined the Chiefs in 2013 and his name has surfaced around the league in the past two offseasons as a prime candidate for open general manager spots. The Chicago Bears interviewed Ballard in early January 2015 for the then-vacant general manager position. Of note, Chiefs general manager John Dorsey served one year as the Green Bay Packers director of football operations in 2012 before being hired to his current position. In other moves, the Chiefs promoted Mike Borgonzi and Brett Veach as co-directors of player personnel to replace Ballard. Borgonzi, who has been with the Chiefs for six years, previously served as the director of pro scouting, and Veach held the position of pro and college personnel analyst the past two years after serving six years with coach Andy Reid in Philadelphia (2007-12). Ryne Nutt, who joined the Chiefs staff in 2010, moves from Northeast area scout to Southeast area scout, an area former assistant director of college scouting Dom Green was responsible for. The New York Jets recently hired Green as its Southwest area scout. Matt Donahoe, who has been with the Chiefs since 2013, moves from national scout to Nutt’s previous post as Northeast area scout. Donahoe spent the 2012 summer in Green Bay as a scouting intern. The promotions affect titles and responsibilities, but not the reporting structure, as each man will still report to Dorsey.


Sounds like the SE is a promotion over the NE. Wonder why we lost Green to N.Y. Doesn't sound like he was promoted. $$

[DaneMcCloud]

Sounds like the SE is a promotion over the NE. Wonder why we lost Green to N.Y. Doesn't sound like he was promoted. $$

Green left the Chiefs in the Spring of 2015

[RunKC]

Ballard has it so good as long as the deunken moron doesn't get involved with decisions

[Mr. Laz]

the eaglization of the Chiefs continues

[Quesadilla Joe]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Ballard is using a year 1 roster bonus to supplement the signing bonus to limit cap liability in the back end of the contract.</p>&mdash; TexansCap (@TexansCap) <a href="https://twitter.com/TexansCap/status/841706475865137157">March 14, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Very smart. Did this for years in philly. Excellent strategy. Everything going on in Indy says that they hired the right guy <a href="https://t.co/19hG11uFXS">https://t.co/19hG11uFXS</a></p>&mdash; Joe Banner (@JoeBanner13) <a href="https://twitter.com/JoeBanner13/status/841720575877869568">March 14, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Ballard didn't offer Poe a contract which is going to kill Poe's chances of anything good . Being cut by your home team and then turned away from the GM that knows you well from another team isn't a good sign. His price just went waaay down.

[KChiefs1]

As if we needed another reason to hate the Colts.



If you want a kick in the nuts again...the NFLN is showing the January 5, 2014 playoff game again on Wednesday at noon.




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[Quesadilla Joe]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Colts have requested permission to interview Patriots OC Josh McDaniels for their HC job, per league source.</p>&mdash; Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) <a href="https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/947877392051253249?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 1, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

If McD is Ballard's first choice and the Browns keep Hue, you guys might not have to worry about losing Nagy/Toub. Although Toub would make sense for Chicago.

[T-post Tom]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Colts have requested permission to interview Patriots OC Josh McDaniels for their HC job, per league source.</p>&mdash; Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) <a href="https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/947877392051253249?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 1, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

If McD is Ballard's first choice and the Browns keep Hue, you guys might not have to worry about losing Nagy/Toub. Although Toub would make sense for Chicago.

Hope the Colts hire him. That'll be one less good team in the AFC.

[Sassy Squatch]

Hope the Colts hire him. That'll be one less good team in the AFC.
One less?

[Rausch]

Hope the Colts hire him. That'll be one less good team in the AFC.

Less masturbation and more ingestion of protein...

[Bowser]

Ballard is sniffing around Nagy and Toub. Ballard can kick rock.

[T-post Tom]

One less?

As opposed to them hiring a good coach that knows what he's doing. They still have Luck.

[T-post Tom]

Less masturbation and more ingestion of protein...

https://images.dailykos.com/images/391102/story_image/no_idea_what_this_means.jpg?1492659782

[Rausch]

Ballard is sniffing around Nagy and Toub. Ballard can kick rock.

Naggy might be the one person Big Red has ever shown this much trust in.

Reid was clearly calling the plays for PM but I can't hate on that...

[Rausch]

https://images.dailykos.com/images/391102/story_image/no_idea_what_this_means.jpg?1492659782

Spend less time expelling protein and more time taking it in.


Or (es-plained) spend less time jerking off and more time on brain foods...

[T-post Tom]

Spend less time expelling protein and more time taking it in. Or (es-plained) spend less time jerking off and more time on brain foods...

Thank you esplaining, my angry German freund. But what I didn't understand is why you think Josh McDaniels would be a good HC after his performance with the Donks. Classic tale of "riding the coattails".

[Rausch]

But what I didn't understand is why you think Josh McDaniels would be a good HC after his performance with the Donks. Classic tale of "riding the coattails".

I never said that (and don't think he'll ever be more than a respectable OC.)

[Eleazar]

here we go with the talented assistants leaving and us still being stuck with Andy...

[The Bad Guy]

here we go with the talented assistants leaving and us still being stuck with Andy...

Yeah, I'm heartbroken about being stuck with Andy Reid. Get the fuck out of here with this take.

[T-post Tom]

I never said that (and don't think he'll ever be more than a respectable OC.)

Agree with that. Guess I need a German-English translator. Happy New Year.

[KChiefs1]

Ballard is GM of the year.


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[007]

Who cares

[OKchiefs]

Well it sucks that he's proven to actually be able to find talent in the draft. Veach, yet to be determined...

[CoMoChief]

From a draft standpoint, both Ballard and Dorsey are running laps around Veach. The Chiefs 2018 draft has looked like a big wet fart, while Dorsey has drafted what appears to be gems in Mayfield, Ward, Chubb, and Callaway...and Ballard has been able to draft gems such as Nelson, Leonard, Mack, Hooker over his couple yrs in Indy.

And Veach traded up for Breeland fucking Speaks...sigh. Wasn't a huge fan of the O'Daniel pick, but our LB's are so bad it almost makes him look good, and Nnadi looks like he's JAG. Liked the Watts pick, but of course, he got put onto IR. I mean I guess he hit on Tremon Smith as a KR, a position that no longer matters in the league...woohoo yippee.

Veach also didn't properly address Marcus Peters' departure when it was desperately needed. Amerson and Scandrick are major dumpster fires, and his high priced FA (Hitchens) has played like ass the whole season, the guy should decline his probowl invite...what a fucking joke.

However...Veach gets a pass this year, because he was a big part in the Chiefs drafting Mahomes, even though he technically wasn't GM, which may be the best Chiefs draft pick of all time, much more important than Derrick Thomas.

Mahomes gives Veach some credibility, and deservedly so, but if not for Mahomes, Veach gets a F in my book.

[Don Corlemahomes]

Dorsey had 4 out of the first 35 picks, including the 1st and 4th overall. the chiefs' first pick was at 46 overall. Only a dipshit would compare the two.

[Danguardace]

Dorsey had 4 out of the first 35 picks, including the 1st and 4th overall. the chiefs' first pick was at 46 overall. Only a dipshit would compare the two.

This

[Sofa King]

From a draft standpoint, both Ballard and Dorsey are running laps around Veach. The Chiefs 2018 draft has looked like a big wet fart, while Dorsey has drafted what appears to be gems in Mayfield, Ward, Chubb, and Callaway...and Ballard has been able to draft gems such as Nelson, Leonard, Mack, Hooker over his couple yrs in Indy.

And Veach traded up for Breeland fucking Speaks...sigh. Wasn't a huge fan of the O'Daniel pick, but our LB's are so bad it almost makes him look good, and Nnadi looks like he's JAG. Liked the Watts pick, but of course, he got put onto IR. I mean I guess he hit on Tremon Smith as a KR, a position that no longer matters in the league...woohoo yippee.

Veach also didn't properly address Marcus Peters' departure when it was desperately needed. Amerson and Scandrick are major dumpster fires, and his high priced FA (Hitchens) has played like ass the whole season, the guy should decline his probowl invite...what a fucking joke.

However...Veach gets a pass this year, because he was a big part in the Chiefs drafting Mahomes, even though he technically wasn't GM, which may be the best Chiefs draft pick of all time, much more important than Derrick Thomas.

Mahomes gives Veach some credibility, and deservedly so, but if not for Mahomes, Veach gets a F in my book.


Dorsey had 4 out of the first 35 picks, including the 1st and 4th overall. the chiefs' first pick was at 46 overall. Only a dipshit would compare the two.

That was a quick ass kicking. lol

[staylor26]

Yea completely ridiculous to expect Veach to match those guys drafts when he had a late pick and no 1st.

Veach’s draft wasn’t that bad all things considered. It’s his two big free agent signings that have been disappointing.

[Rasputin]

The guys Veach drafted 2018 just need to develop and get playing time. I didn't have high expectations we didn't have any high draft picks.


Dee Ford first year was a lost soul but he worked hard to learn the game and i think it was harder for him to "get it" but he finally "got it".



Veach is doing something right we have a bye week in the playoffs with HFA.

[htismaqe]

Yea completely ridiculous to expect Veach to match those guys drafts when he had a late pick and no 1st.

Veach’s draft wasn’t that bad all things considered. It’s his two big free agent signings that have been disappointing.

While comparing picks is pointless, as has already been pointed out, this team really needs its 2nd round picks to contribute more, especially when he traded picks to get Speaks.

Speaks is definitely a disappointment at this point. That being said, he really hit on Tremon Smith IMHO and the trade for Ward looks like it might pay out.

[BigRedChief]

It sucks, but I'm not surprised... cant keep' em all

Yep, this.

And it's hard to not take over a team that already has the QB of the future in place. Not a bad place to be.

Congrats Chris!NFL success breeds copycats. Poachers of your talent. Our guys getting significant promotions is just a part of that success.

If we are going on a 10 year "Bellicheck/NE" type of a run, we just need to keep the core. Is our core of Mahomes/Reid/Hill comparable to Bellicheck/Brady/Gronk, enough for that 10 year run?

[Skyy God]

Dorsey had 4 out of the first 35 picks, including the 1st and 4th overall. the chiefs' first pick was at 46 overall. Only a dipshit would compare the two.

The Colts got extra picks for trading with the Jets for what became Darnold.

Also, the Browns and Colts had tons of holes to fill. Dorsey/Ballard were just more likely to draft immediate contributors.

[staylor26]

While comparing picks is pointless, as has already been pointed out, this team really needs its 2nd round picks to contribute more, especially when he traded picks to get Speaks.

Speaks is definitely a disappointment at this point. That being said, he really hit on Tremon Smith IMHO and the trade for Ward looks like it might pay out.

Agreed on Speaks. Derrick Nnadi was also a hit though. He’s been damn good at a position where rookies are rarely that good.

[htismaqe]

Agreed on Speaks. Derrick Nnandi was also a hit though. He’s been damn good at a position where rookies are rarely that good.

Yep. Solid pick for sure.

[Skyy God]

While comparing picks is pointless, as has already been pointed out, this team really needs its 2nd round picks to contribute more, especially when he traded picks to get Speaks.

Speaks is definitely a disappointment at this point. That being said, he really hit on Tremon Smith IMHO and the trade for Ward looks like it might pay out.

Speaks has 2 good edge rushers preventing him from seeing serious snaps.

K-Pass, OTOH, is a bust in a 3-4 and needs to be traded if we keep the scheme.

[FAX]

It's pretty clear that we've been having difficulty finding edge players who can contribute right away (or possibly ever).

However, it has to be hard to be a "developmental" guy as an edge in a 3-4. That may be the most difficult position on a defense ... first to learn and then to execute. If a player isn't blessed with an elite get-off or some incredible combination of straight line speed and power, the technique required to beat pro tackles takes time to acquire. And of course, there's also the run- and coverage-defense aspects.

I try to remain patient with developmental players and just hope the damn coaches know what they're doing.

I admit that I have to laugh every time I see Speaks faceplant after getting his legs cut by the LT. I was specifically told he's never "on the ground".

FAX

[htismaqe]

I will say this about Speaks:

He's no KPass. SMH

[O.city]

They've also got 2 really good OLB's ahead of them.

Kpass has been a healthy scratch this year, so I'm guessing he's not a chief next year.

[OKchiefs]

The Colts got extra picks for trading with the Jets for what became Darnold.

Also, the Browns and Colts had tons of holes to fill. Dorsey/Ballard were just more likely to draft immediate contributors.

We also have tons of holes, Veach just failed to address most of them.

[OKchiefs]

They've also got 2 really good OLB's ahead of them.

Kpass has been a healthy scratch this year, so I'm guessing he's not a chief next year.

What a fucking waste those two are.

Kpass looks like Tarzan and plays like Jane.

Speaks looks like a 40 year old fatass Jane and plays like it too.

[OKchiefs]

It's pretty clear that we've been having difficulty finding edge players who can contribute right away (or possibly ever).

However, it has to be hard to be a "developmental" guy as an edge in a 3-4. That may be the most difficult position on a defense ... first to learn and then to execute. If a player isn't blessed with an elite get-off or some incredible combination of straight line speed and power, the technique required to beat pro tackles takes time to acquire. And of course, there's also the run- and coverage-defense aspects.

I try to remain patient with developmental players and just hope the damn coaches know what they're doing.

I admit that I have to laugh every time I see Speaks faceplant after getting his legs cut by the LT. I was specifically told he's never "on the ground".

FAX

The problem is the 2nd round isn't the spot to draft developmental players when starting types are almost always available around the same pick. We might as well trade away our second round picks because we almost always draft complete crap in that spot.

[Halfcan]

What's with all the fucking Colts threads?

Is this a Colts board now?

[RunKC]

While comparing picks is pointless, as has already been pointed out, this team really needs its 2nd round picks to contribute more, especially when he traded picks to get Speaks.

Speaks is definitely a disappointment at this point. That being said, he really hit on Tremon Smith IMHO and the trade for Ward looks like it might pay out.

Speaks just seems like the Dee Ford pick again. I mean I get it. Houston is our biggest cap anchor who turns 30 this month and Dee Ford has had questions about his health, plus his price tag combined with Houston’s potentially means one of these guys is out.

I think we’ll find more clarity on Speaks next year when he’s had a year to get his body ready. Interesting enough he is very similar body wise to Z’Darius Smith from then Ravens.

[htismaqe]

Speaks just seems like the Dee Ford pick again. I mean I get it. Houston is our biggest cap anchor who turns 30 this month and Dee Ford has had questions about his health, plus his price tag combined with Houston’s potentially means one of these guys is out.

I think we’ll find more clarity on Speaks next year when he’s had a year to get his body ready.

I get that but a 2nd round pick, especially one you targeted with multiple picks, shouldn't need a year to get his body ready.

As great as Ford is now, only hindsight suggests that was a good 1st round pick.

[OKchiefs]

Speaks just seems like the Dee Ford pick again. I mean I get it. Houston is our biggest cap anchor who turns 30 this month and Dee Ford has had questions about his health, plus his price tag combined with Houston’s potentially means one of these guys is out.

I think we’ll find more clarity on Speaks next year when he’s had a year to get his body ready. Interesting enough he is very similar body wise to Z’Darius Smith from then Ravens.

What potential do you see in Speaks? Even with an offseason of losing 20 pounds I still don't see him being wuick enough to be great at OLB. Add 20 pounds and I still don't see him as strong enough to hold up well at DL. He's a tweener that is fine as a 4th round pick. It's unfortunate we took him in the 2nd.

[rabblerouser]

What's with all the ****ing Colts threads?

Is this a Colts board now?

We're studying the Colts this week as the only possible Chiefs opponent that we have not yet faced this season .

Do you even Chief, bro??

[Titty Meat]

People are actually trying to defend Veach LMAO

[O.city]

After 1 year, I don't really know if you can defend or judge either way yet.

[Titty Meat]

After 1 year, I don't really know if you can defend or judge either way yet.

1.5 years and yea you can. You dont pay an injured player like Watkins that kind of money and hes found literally 0 talent in the secondary. How many years is it supposed to take a "stud" GM to find talent?

[htismaqe]

People are actually trying to defend Veach LMAO

Pointing out that Veach didn't have any first round picks while Dorsey had TWO isn't a "defense", it's a statement of fact.

[Sassy Squatch]

After 1 year, I don't really know if you can defend or judge either way yet.
As far as the draft goes, it's probably not fair considering the circumstances. There is room for improvement as far as his free agency signings, and that's about the nicest thing you can say.

[Sassy Squatch]

1.5 years and yea you can. You dont pay an injured player like Watkins that kind of money and hes found literally 0 talent in the secondary. How many years is it supposed to take a "stud" GM to find talent?
Kendall Fuller?

[staylor26]

Billay being a fucking moron

What else is new?

[Mecca]

Pointing out that Veach didn't have any first round picks while Dorsey had TWO isn't a "defense", it's a statement of fact.

Veach's issue has nothing to do with not having a 1, it's that he used high picks to draft guys that at best would see marginal playing time while having a dumpster fire of a secondary..

He also saw fit to pay Anthony Hitchens like a all pro.

[Hoopsdoc]

The Colts got extra picks for trading with the Jets for what became Darnold.

Also, the Browns and Colts had tons of holes to fill. Dorsey/Ballard were just more likely to draft immediate contributors.

Plus the 2nd round pick this year will at the very top of the 2nd round.

[O.city]

Veach's issue has nothing to do with not having a 1, it's that he used high picks to draft guys that at best would see marginal playing time while having a dumpster fire of a secondary..

He also saw fit to pay Anthony Hitchens like a all pro.

It's also that he didn't really use a high pick because he didn't have one.

[O.city]

1.5 years and yea you can. You dont pay an injured player like Watkins that kind of money and hes found literally 0 talent in the secondary. How many years is it supposed to take a "stud" GM to find talent?

If Dorsey was or is as good as you contend, why did Veach need to find all this talent in the secondary? shouldn't it already be here?

[Titty Meat]

Billay being a ****ing moron

What else is new?

The myth that Steven Nelson sucks!!!!!

[Titty Meat]

If Dorsey was or is as good as you contend, why did Veach need to find all this talent in the secondary? shouldn't it already be here?

Because Berry is aging and they traded away their best corner.

[Mecca]

It's also that he didn't really use a high pick because he didn't have one.

You should be able to find guys that can start in the 2nd round...

[Titty Meat]

Kendall Fuller?

Hes been a meh player this year.

[O.city]

Because Berry is aging and they traded away their best corner.

So after what, 4 years of being the GM he couldn't have added anymore players? What about the others he added that are here? You mentioned Nelson, etc.

How long did Dorsey need to retool the secondary?

[Mecca]

That's another thing, Fuller and Hitchens look like good players...they come here and they don't.

[O.city]

You should be able to find guys that can start in the 2nd round...

Sure.

But you aren't going to consistently find difference makers there.

[Titty Meat]

So after what, 4 years of being the GM he couldn't have added anymore players? What about the others he added that are here? You mentioned Nelson, etc.

How long did Dorsey need to retool the secondary?

Are you purposely being obtuse? Ron Parker was a good player for 3-4 years, Abdullah good player, Peter's good player, Sean Smith good player.

He added plenty of good players in the secondary. Guys dont play forever thats not his fault.

[CasselGotPeedOn]

Billay being a ****ing moron

What else is new?

He's inbred, what do you expect?

[O.city]

That's another thing, Fuller and Hitchens look like good players...they come here and they don't.

I think Hitchens has been hurt. He's been better as of late as he's gotten healthier.

[Mecca]

Sure.

But you aren't going to consistently find difference makers there.

You don't even have to be a difference maker in this secondary, not shitting your pants would be a start.

Issues come in the trade up for a player who doesn't play much while the secondary is horrible.

Oh and telling us the run D would be better when it's not.

[O.city]

Are you purposely being obtuse? Ron Parker was a good player for 3-4 years, Abdullah good player, Peter's good player, Sean Smith good player.

He added plenty of good players in the secondary. Guys dont play forever thats not his fault.

So it's not his fault that he didn't bring in better replacements when guys got older?

[O.city]

You don't even have to be a difference maker in this secondary, not shitting your pants would be a start.

Issues come in the trade up for a player who doesn't play much while the secondary is horrible.

Oh and telling us the run D would be better when it's not.

Did you think the run d would be better to start the season?

[Titty Meat]

So it's not his fault that he didn't bring in better replacements when guys got older?

Bruh he was gone LMAO

[Titty Meat]

Veachs replacements:
Scandrick
Fuller
Revis

[Sassy Squatch]

Lucas, Watts, and Ward, too.

[RunKC]

What potential do you see in Speaks? Even with an offseason of losing 20 pounds I still don't see him being wuick enough to be great at OLB. Add 20 pounds and I still don't see him as strong enough to hold up well at DL. He's a tweener that is fine as a 4th round pick. It's unfortunate we took him in the 2nd.

Speaks and Nnandi were pro ready to stop the run. Veach wasn’t bullshitting us about that. Here’s proof from last Sunday:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">It won’t show up in the stat sheet but Nnadi blows up this run so Speaks and Hitchens can make the tackle. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JacobsEyeInTheSky?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JacobsEyeInTheSky</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Chiefs?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Chiefs</a> <a href="https://t.co/oRFHAltX5E">pic.twitter.com/oRFHAltX5E</a></p>&mdash; Nick Jacobs (@Jacobs71) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jacobs71/status/1080210659416178689?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 1, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

And as much as I didn’t like Speaks in September, he flashed some pass rush in the month Houston was out.

I actually think Speaks could be a decent player with time. The truth that nobody wants to admit is that a position like pass rusher isn’t going to have rookies ready year 1 unless you are a high draft pick like Bradley Chubb (most of the time).

[Titty Meat]

Lucas, Watts, and Ward, too.

Those guys have played like 2 games.

[Sassy Squatch]

Those guys have played like 2 games.
Whose fault is that?

[Titty Meat]

Whose fault is that?

Probably the guy who brought in parker and scandrick to start.

[RunKC]

So it's not his fault that he didn't bring in better replacements when guys got older?

Billay will ignore Dorsey’s 2016 draft disaster he failed miserably to retool the secondary with Eric Murray, KeiVarae Russell and DJ White.

[staylor26]

It’s worth noting that Ward looks like he could be a steal too

Veach hasn’t been perfect by any means, but it’s not nearly as bad as CP’s retards pretend it is.

Besides, the guy brought us fucking Mahomes. If that doesn’t give you faith that he will have better off seasons down the line then I don’t know what to tell you.

[Titty Meat]

Oh I forgot to add David Amerson to that list of talent Veach has brought in.

[O.city]

Bruh he was gone LMAO

How was that secondary and defense last year?

[Titty Meat]

Billay will ignore Dorsey’s 2016 draft disaster he failed miserably to retool the secondary with Eric Murray, KeiVarae Russell and DJ White.

The disaster that landed us Chris Jones and Tyreek Hill?

[Titty Meat]

How was that secondary and defense last year?

Better than this years without Ford for alot of it or a healthy Houston and no Berry.

[O.city]

Billay will ignore Dorsey’s 2016 draft disaster he failed miserably to retool the secondary with Eric Murray, KeiVarae Russell and DJ White.

Dorsey likes to get good value on low character guys. Sometimes that goes good and sometimes bad.

Like most GM's, he's good when he gets to pick high and it's tough when he doesnt'.

[O.city]

Better than this years without Ford for alot of it or a healthy Houston and no Berry.

According to which metric?


Pretty sure Houston played 16 games last year, they had about the same amount of Berry as this year as well.

[Sassy Squatch]

Probably the guy who brought in parker and scandrick to start.
Brought in to start? Good lord, they're making 2.5 million between the 2 of them. Thats vet minimum backup money.

[Titty Meat]

According to which metric?

..........



This was the 2nd worst defense in franchise history.

[RunKC]

The disaster that landed us Chris Jones and Tyreek Hill?

That’s not the secondary.

Dorsey couldn’t find ILB’s or secondary players in the draft outside of Peters who was a failure by Dorsey.

Phillip Gaines and Terrance Mitchell were also disasters last year. Do you remember who brought them in?

[O.city]

..........



This was the 2nd worst defense in franchise history.

Yards wise? Points?

What are we using here?

[Titty Meat]

Yards wise? Points?

What are we using here?

Points. Yards dont matter.

[Titty Meat]

That’s not the secondary.

Dorsey couldn’t find ILB’s or secondary players in the draft outside of Peters who was a failure by Dorsey.

Phillip Gaines and Terrance Mitchell were also disasters last year. Do you remember who brought them in?

Mitchell was a good corner for a year. Infact if you bump old threads you will see S Taylor couldnt stop raving about the guy. He found talent in the secondary early on it aged needed to be replaced and the problem is the current GM replaced those aging players with other aging players.

[O.city]

Points. Yards dont matter.

Got it.

[O.city]

Mitchell was a good corner for a year. Infact if you bump old threads you will see S Taylor couldnt stop raving about the guy. He found talent in the secondary early on it aged needed to be replaced and the problem is the current GM replaced those aging players with other aging players.

So the whole secondary aged and needed replaced in one season and we're upset it wasn't replaced in one offseason?

That's fine, it definitely needed addressed. But so did the whole damn defense.

It needed to be burned down and started over.

[O.city]

I also think they viewed this season as a rebuild or reset with a new starting QB etc.

I'm not really a fan of the Watkins signing, but I liked Hitchens. He was good in Dallas, i'm hopeful he's just been hurt or something here and improves back to where he was.

We'll see what they do this offseason. This and next year are the years they really need to push.

[Buckweath]

Criticizing Dorsey, as for drafting, is just silly, silly.

He was outstanding at drafting during his Chiefs tenure and guess what, he has been great with the Browns again this past draft.

He is very much part of the reason why this team is a top 3 In the league and potential great team for years to come.

As usual, some fans have totally unrealistic expectations when it comes to the draft.

I trust Veach to be good too. He just better do well this offseason because I am expecting next year's team to be possibly the best of all the years to come, including this year.

Mahomes in his second year starting. Some star players getting older but still in their prime. Star players on contract years. Yeah, Veach better not miss.

[Titty Meat]

So the whole secondary aged and needed replaced in one season and we're upset it wasn't replaced in one offseason?

That's fine, it definitely needed addressed. But so did the whole damn defense.

It needed to be burned down and started over.

I'm not sure it needs to be torn down it can definitely get after the QB. It's missing 1 probably 2 ball hawks in the secondary and a ILB. It worked pretty well when Berry was healthy.

[O.city]

I'm not sure it needs to be torn down it can definitely get after the QB. It's missing 1 probably 2 ball hawks in the secondary and a ILB. It worked pretty well when Berry was healthy.

I just don't think we'll see that again here, so they're gonna have to go look elsewhere.

[RunKC]

Mitchell was a good corner for a year. Infact if you bump old threads you will see S Taylor couldnt stop raving about the guy. He found talent in the secondary early on it aged needed to be replaced and the problem is the current GM replaced those aging players with other aging players.

Dorsey knew this defense needed new players and it didn’t work out. This defense is bad bc Dorsey nuked draft picks.

Kpassagnon and Russell were terrible picks in the top 100. Ask yourself what this defense would look like if those picks were used decent players?

Also ask yourself where this team would be right now if Marcus Peters and Kareem Hunt weren’t wasted picks on lunatics?

Calling Veach a shit GM for having no 1st rd pick to fix a horrible defense in little time doesn’t make sense. It’s even more asinine to absolve the previous general manager of 5 years from blame since he handed this mess over to the current general manager.

[Titty Meat]

I also think they viewed this season as a rebuild or reset with a new starting QB etc.

I'm not really a fan of the Watkins signing, but I liked Hitchens. He was good in Dallas, i'm hopeful he's just been hurt or something here and improves back to where he was.

We'll see what they do this offseason. This and next year are the years they really need to push.

I think you are right about a reset but he still spent like an idiot and didnt draft well. He HAS to have a good draft this time around or he can leave.

[Sassy Squatch]

I just don't think we'll see that again here, so they're gonna have to go look elsewhere.
He played in a game and a half after having 4 months worth of rest before his body couldn't handle it. If there isn't surgery that can be done to fix the issue he's done.

[Buckweath]

I challenge anyone who criticizes Dorsey's drafting to name a single team who drafted better during his Chiefs tenure.

Go ahead!

[Mecca]

Dorsey knew this defense needed new players and it didn’t work out. This defense is bad bc Dorsey nuked draft picks.

Kpassagnon and Russell were terrible picks in the top 100. Ask yourself what this defense would look like if those picks were used decent players?

Also ask yourself where this team would be right now if Marcus Peters and Kareem Hunt weren’t wasted picks on lunatics?

Calling Veach a shit GM for having no 1st rd pick to fix a horrible defense in little time doesn’t make sense. It’s even more asinine to absolve the previous general manager of 5 years from blame since he handed this mess over to the current general manager.

How would it not have made more sense to trade up for Josh Jackson? Or just take Justin Reid in your pick and keep the pick you traded?

My problem with what they did was they used their 1st pick to take an OLB when they're ok there yet nothing on secondary till 4th round when that thing was a dumpster fire.

[Titty Meat]

Dorsey knew this defense needed new players and it didn’t work out. This defense is bad bc Dorsey nuked draft picks.

Kpassagnon and Russell were terrible picks in the top 100. Ask yourself what this defense would look like if those picks were used decent players?

Also ask yourself where this team would be right now if Marcus Peters and Kareem Hunt weren’t wasted picks on lunatics?

Calling Veach a shit GM for having no 1st rd pick to fix a horrible defense in little time doesn’t make sense. It’s even more asinine to absolve the previous general manager of 5 years from blame since he handed this mess over to the current general manager.

Guys miss on picks it happens. Hunt and Peters are extremely talented players.

Enough with the Veach didnt have a first pick nonsense. He had plenty of cap space with nothing to show for. Jones, Kelce, Hill, etc weren't first round picks. You can find talent outside the first round.

[Mecca]

I challenge anyone who criticizes Dorsey's drafting to name a single team who drafted better during his Chiefs tenure.

Go ahead!

Pretty sure he found more pro bowl players in his time here than any other GM did.

[Sassy Squatch]

Guys miss on picks it happens. Hunt and Peters are extremely talented players.

Enough with the Veach didnt have a first pick nonsense. He had plenty of cap space with nothing to show for. Jones, Kelce, Hill, etc weren't first round picks. You can find talent outside the first round.
Veach did find talent outside of the first, though. Nnadi has been a pretty damn good pickup for a rookie mid-late 3rd rounder.

[O.city]

How would it not have made more sense to trade up for Josh Jackson? Or just take Justin Reid in your pick and keep the pick you traded?

My problem with what they did was they used their 1st pick to take an OLB when they're ok there yet nothing on secondary till 4th round when that thing was a dumpster fire.

The olb's they had coming back had just missed most of last season and had back surgery and the other apparently wasn't fully healed from knee surgery and is a prime cut candidate.

Plus you all have always said pass rushers are so important, so why not stack that position?

[Mecca]

Veach did find talent outside of the first, though. Nnadi has been a pretty damn good pickup for a rookie mid-late 3rd rounder.

That's fine but in a year that he spent 100 million dollars and traded around in the draft a bunch he needed to hit on more than 1.

[O.city]

Guys miss on picks it happens. Hunt and Peters are extremely talented players.

Enough with the Veach didnt have a first pick nonsense. He had plenty of cap space with nothing to show for. Jones, Kelce, Hill, etc weren't first round picks. You can find talent outside the first round.

Sure, they definitely weren't. But lets eval them after 1 year in the league.

Are they all pro's like they are now?

[Mecca]

The olb's they had coming back had just missed most of last season and had back surgery and the other apparently wasn't fully healed from knee surgery and is a prime cut candidate.

Plus you all have always said pass rushers are so important, so why not stack that position?

Speaks is a fat shitty pass rusher? It wasn't like they moved up for Harold Landry.

Also if you bought into Houston and Ford both sucking then this was a lost year anyway.

[O.city]

Nnadi and O'Daniel have been fine players for rookie mid rounders.

Speaks is the miss at this point.

[O.city]

Speaks is a fat shitty pass rusher? It wasn't like they moved up for Harold Landry.

Also if you bought into Houston and Ford both sucking then this was a lost year anyway.

And if they thought this was a rebuild year, they're going to be looking into a more long term type draft.

Which they did.

[Buckweath]

I am not concerned with Veach's last draft. If next year this past draft class and the upcoming draft class don't contribute much, I will definitly be concerned. I don't necessarily expect him to draft as well as Dorsey did here though. Dorsey was just outstanding.

[Sassy Squatch]

That's fine but in a year that he spent 100 million dollars and traded around in the draft a bunch he needed to hit on more than 1.
Who says the other guys will never contribute? Kelce was on IR his rookie season. Took Jones 2 full seasons to become the monster he is now. Hill was drafted way lower than his talent level because of his domestic abuse history.

[OKchiefs]

Criticizing Dorsey, as for drafting, is just silly, silly.

He was outstanding at drafting during his Chiefs tenure and guess what, he has been great with the Browns again this past draft.

He is very much part of the reason why this team is a top 3 In the league and potential great team for years to come.

As usual, some fans have totally unrealistic expectations when it comes to the draft.

I trust Veach to be good too. He just better do well this offseason because I am expecting next year's team to be possibly the best of all the years to come, including this year.

Mahomes in his second year starting. Some star players getting older but still in their prime. Star players on contract years. Yeah, Veach better not miss.

I don't see how it's so hard to acknowledge that Dorsey drafted very well on offense but overall was awful at finding defensive talent.

[staylor26]

Who says the other guys will never contribute? Kelce was on IR his rookie season. Took Jones 2 full seasons to become the monster he is now. Hill was drafted way lower than his talent level because of his domestic abuse history.

THIS

[OKchiefs]

I am not concerned with Veach's last draft. If next year this past draft class and the upcoming draft class don't contribute much, I will definitly be concerned. I don't necessarily expect him to draft as well as Dorsey did here though. Dorsey was just outstanding at drafting offense.

FYP

[O.city]

Dorsey's drafts look better on offense because of the offensive coaching staff the Chiefs have/have had.

That's another reason i'd like to see and imagine they will end up moving on from this d staff.

[dirk digler]

I don't see how it's so hard to acknowledge that Dorsey drafted very well on offense but overall was awful at finding defensive talent.


Makes you wonder who is actually the person that is deciding such things. :)

[Mecca]

This team drafting better on offense probably says what everyone already knew...Andy Reid is making a lot of these calls.

[Sassy Squatch]

So if Andy Reid is making the calls about who we draft then that leaves the GM to contract negotiating duty. Which Dorsey was absolutely fucking awful at.

[Buckweath]

I don't see how it's so hard to acknowledge that Dorsey drafted very well on offense but overall was awful at finding defensive talent.

Dorsey was outstanding at drafting overall. If he had found more star players on defense and less on offense, you would be complaining about both offense and defense so it doesn't make any difference.

Dorsey definitly had more hits on offense but Jones, Ford, Peters, Nelson were all solid picks.

[OKchiefs]

Dorsey was outstanding at drafting overall. If he had found more star players on defense and less on offense, you would be complaining about both offense and defense so it doesn't make any difference.

Dorsey definitly had more hits on offense but Jones, Ford, Peters, Nelson were all solid picks.

Peters is a head case and no longer here, and Steven Nelson is a JAG. The two defensive picks worth anything are Jones and Ford. 2 players in 5 or so years is not good. The current status of the secondary and the inside linebackers is due to constant scouting failures by the Chiefs on defense.Kpass, Russell, Gaines, etc. were awful draft picks. We actually found steals late in the draft on offense like Hill and LDT. We struck out on just about every single draft pick on defense outside of the first 2 rounds. The last late round find we had on defense was probably Brandon Carr in 2008. You can't go an entire decade without a single pick panning out from day 3.

By comparison, look at the LAC-
Jatavis Brown, 5th Rd 2016
Desmond King, 5th Rd 2017
Darius Philon, 6th Rd 2015

That's not necessarily a huge difference at first glance, but it helps immensely when coupled with early round picks like Ingram, Bosa, James, etc. We've found jack shit with our late round picks on defense.

[RunKC]

My problem with what they did was they used their 1st pick to take an OLB when they're ok there yet nothing on secondary till 4th round when that thing was a dumpster fire.

We were not okay at OLB. Not by any means.

Dee Ford just had a season on IR bc of his back and nobody knew what he was going to do. Justin Houston didn’t look completely right and it was known that we needed someone to develop behind him.

There were holes everywhere on this defense. Literally.

[RunKC]

Dorsey was outstanding at drafting overall. If he had found more star players on defense and less on offense, you would be complaining about both offense and defense so it doesn't make any difference.

Dorsey definitly had more hits on offense but Jones, Ford, Peters, Nelson were all solid picks.

Dorsey doesn’t get credit for Peters. He was 100% wrong about him on his character evaluation.

And as much as you won’t admit this, Andy Reid most likely played more of a part of finding our offensive players than Dorsey.

Andy was finding elite players in the draft in Philly without Dorsey.

[staylor26]

We were not okay at OLB. Not by any means.

Dee Ford just had a season on IR bc of his back and nobody knew what he was going to do. Justin Houston didn’t look completely right and it was known that we needed someone to develop behind him.

There were holes everywhere on this defense. Literally.

It’s amazing that people don’t understand this. We had no idea that Ford would stay healthy and take the next step as well as Houston playing the best football he’s played since he got his second contract. Not to mention Ford’s pending free agency.

OLB was a huge need going into the offseason.

[Marcellus]

Nadi, Speaks, Ward, Smith (as a returner), Watts, have all shown the ability to be starters.

Methinks thou dost protest too much in such a short time frame to judge.

[RunKC]

Nadi, Speaks, Ward, Smith (as a returner), Watts, have all shown the ability to be starters.

Methinks thou dost protest too much in such a short time frame to judge.

Anytime people shit on Veach and praise Dorsey I always ask them the same question.

“What did Dorsey’s first draft produce on this day in his first year?”

[Buckweath]

You guys can keep criticizing Dorsey when it comes to drafting but just watch, he is turning the Browns into a top team for years to come with again excellent drafting.

Just take a seat and watch!

That's just what he does.

[Sassy Squatch]

Anytime people shit on Veach and praise Dorsey I always ask them the same question.

“What did Dorsey’s first draft produce on this day in his first year?”
The first big contract Dorsey gave out was a 5 year 56 million deal to Dwayne Bowe. Yikes. He made damn good use of the waiver wire and mid tier free agent signings, but even then he was botching the cap.

[OKchiefs]

You guys can keep criticizing Dorsey when it comes to drafting but just watch, he is turning the Browns into a top team for years to come with again excellent drafting.

Just take a seat and watch!

That's just what he does.

Cleveland had 4 picks in the first 35 including 2 in the top 5. Anyone on this site could nail a draft with those picks. Are you going to praise Mike Mayock as an amazing GM when he finds excellent talent with 3 first round picks?

The 2008 Chiefs had an amazing draft with Glenn Dorsey, Branden Albert, Brandon Flowers, Jamaal Charles, and Brandon Carr. Does that mean Carl Peterson was an excellent GM?

It's not hard to nail a draft with multiple high draft picks.

[Mecca]

Cleveland had 4 picks in the first 35 including 2 in the top 5. Anyone on this site could nail a draft with those picks. Are you going to praise Mike Mayock as an amazing GM when he finds excellent talent with 3 first round picks?

The 2008 Chiefs had an amazing draft with Glenn Dorsey, Branden Albert, Brandon Flowers, Jamaal Charles, and Brandon Carr. Does that mean Carl Peterson was an excellent GM?

It's not hard to nail a draft with multiple high draft picks.

Not really the Dorsey picked ended up sucking and Carr was a late pick that turned out great, you get credit for that one.

The 3rd and 5th rounders you listed there were better than the 1's.

[Titty Meat]

So if Andy Reid is making the calls about who we draft then that leaves the GM to contract negotiating duty. Which Dorsey was absolutely ****ing awful at.

How so? Other than Hudson we lost nobody and were able to sign top guys like Schwartz and Maclin

[Titty Meat]

This team drafting better on offense probably says what everyone already knew...Andy Reid is making a lot of these calls.

Now he has his yes man from philly and if you look at all the guys who came from philly aroubd his time they all suck.

[Buckweath]

I am still waiting for someone to name one team which drafted better than the Chiefs during Dorsey's tenure.

[Sassy Squatch]

How so? Other than Hudson we lost nobody and were able to sign top guys like Schwartz and Maclin
You do realize that if Bowe doesn't get suspended 1 game for pot we can't void his guaranteed money and cut him in 2015. If that money was still on the books there's no way we can sign Jeremy Maclin. Dorsey was pretty damn lucky to get bailed out of that one.

[RunKC]

I am still waiting for someone to name one team which drafted better than the Chiefs during Dorsey's tenure.

He can thank Andy for finding the offensive players we drafted.

I still can’t believe Dorsey was dumb enough to draft a midget CB over Bradley Chubb. That was a big mistake.

[O.city]

Now he has his yes man from philly and if you look at all the guys who came from philly aroubd his time they all suck.

Andy has always made the decisions I'd imagine, or atleast had his hand in them.

If you listen to Middlekauf's pod, apparently Dorsey has a pretty big ego.

[Sassy Squatch]

I am still waiting for someone to name one team which drafted better than the Chiefs during Dorsey's tenure.
Chiefs won 1 playoff game in his tenure. Not exactly something to be jumping up and down wetting your pants over.

[Chiefnj2]

How so? Other than Hudson we lost nobody and were able to sign top guys like Schwartz and Maclin

He left the Chiefs in cap hell. With a better GM they could have given Watkins a bigger contract.

[NJChiefsFan]

So if Andy Reid is making the calls about who we draft then that leaves the GM to contract negotiating duty. Which Dorsey was absolutely ****ing awful at.

In this hypothetical that's a logical line of thought. However Veach has also not exactly been thrifty himself with contracts.

[Sassy Squatch]

In this hypothetical that's a logical line of thought. However Veach has also not exactly been thrifty himself with contracts.
No, he hasn't. Dorsey never learned from his errors. Let's see if Veach will. He's got potential extensions coming up with the likes of Ford, Hill, Jones, and Fuller and another free agency.

[NJChiefsFan]

He can thank Andy for finding the offensive players we drafted.



That's an assumption. Hell the greatest offensive player this team has been able to aquire isn't even attributed to Andy. I'm not saying your point doesn't have any logic to it but to list it as a fact and just strike that credit out of Dorseys ledger is too much.

[NJChiefsFan]

No, he hasn't. Dorsey never learned from his errors. Let's see if Veach will. He's got potential extensions coming up with the likes of Ford, Hill, Jones, and Fuller and another free agency.

I'm not a Veach hater. I do think some people, not necessarily you, take credit away from Dorsey too easily. Veach doesn't get that microscope and I think it's in part because he is our current gm. Dorsey didn't get this microscope outside of the contracts until he was fired.

[Sassy Squatch]

I'm not a Veach hater. I do think some people, not necessarily you, take credit away from Dorsey too easily. Veach doesn't get that microscope and I think it's in part because he is our current gm. Dorsey didn't get this microscope outside of the contracts until he was fired.
It's still too early to really judge anything that Veach has done aside from his contracts. We can look back now and see how Dorsey did cumulatively over the course of his career here with drafting, free agency, and contract extensions since enough time has passed.

[Chiefshrink]

It's still too early to really judge anything that Veach has done aside from his contracts. We can look back now and see

Ragland is a bust.:shrug:

[chiefforlife]

I'm not sure why we cant say Dorsey was damn good a drafting players and building this team. Who here wasn't shocked when he was fired? Thats right, we ALL were.

While also realizing Veach hasnt had near enough time to even evaluate yet. It doesnt have to be one or the other.

We are the BEST team in the AFC. We are about to find out if we are the best team in the NFL!!

We are in a pretty good situation guys and both of these men had a hand in it.

GO CHIEFS!!!

[Titty Meat]

Andy has always made the decisions I'd imagine, or atleast had his hand in them.

If you listen to Middlekauf's pod, apparently Dorsey has a pretty big ego.

I have no doubts he had a big ego and so does Andy. I get why Clark made the decision he did and I get were using hindsight as an argument to say there were atleast 3 guys who were plenty capable of replacing Reid on this staff. It just seems odd given the timing and letting Ballard take another job. I mean Clark had to have made this decision before the contract extension right? Oh well my critique of Veach aside I absolutely will admit to being wrong if he nails the next draft and at the end of the day results speak for themselves. 2 division titles since Clark's decision.

[Hoopsdoc]

This past draft by Ballard was just outstanding. Two rookie first team all pros in Leonard and Nelson for the first time since the Bears drafted Butkus and Sayers.

Braden Smith starting and doing very well at right tackle on the best OLine in the league.

Kemoko Turay had four sacks in spot duty.

Tyquan Lewis has 2 and has cracked the starting lineup in only 6 games.

4th rounder Nyheim Hines is the third down back and averaging 4.5 yards per carry.

5th rounder Darice Fountain has been the one slight disappointment. Cut out of training camp, currently on the practice squad.

6th rounder Deon Cain was the star of training camp before blowing out his knee.

7th rounders Zhaire Franklin and Matthew Adams have played some in the base defense and a lot on special teams.

Ballard really hit a home run with this draft.

[KChiefs1]

Ballard is a bright guy.

[rabblerouser]

Chiefs won 1 playoff game in his tenure. Not exactly something to be jumping up and down wetting your pants over.

Colts have also won 1 playoff game in his tenure.

We need to keep it that way.

[KChiefs1]

Should be the Chiefs GM.

[KChiefs1]

Great read.


https://twitter.com/theathleticind/status/1189166340659130368?s=21

[RealSNR]

Mods please lock this thread.

Thank you.

[rabblerouser]

Mods please lock this thread.

Thank you.

WHY?

[Imon Yourside]

Everything is just Veachy here.

[rabblerouser]

Everything is just Veachy here.

Veachy keen.

[Imon Yourside]

Veachy keen.

Son of a VEATCH!

[Hoopsdoc]

Great read.


https://twitter.com/theathleticind/status/1189166340659130368?s=21

Awesome read. :thumb:

[Hoopsdoc]

Mods please lock this thread.

Thank you.

:spock::rolleyes:

[RealSNR]

:spock::rolleyes:

Chris Ballard isn't my GM.

He's also the GM of an organization I have precisely zero respect for. I don't care if they're winning.

Fuck the Colts. Fuck Ballard.

Sorry if that offends you.

[Hoopsdoc]

Chris Ballard isn't my GM.

He's also the GM of an organization I have precisely zero respect for. I don't care if they're winning.

**** the Colts. **** Ballard.

Sorry if that offends you.

It doesn’t offend me. I just found it interesting that you responded to THAT story with a lock this thread request. :shrug:

[Sassy Squatch]

LMAO Crying about getting cancelled for being a bad GM

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Colts GM Chris Ballard: We live in a[n NFL] world where failure&#39;s not allowed. When you fail in this world you get canceled and everybody wants your head. And rightfully so in some cases. But if you&#39;re able to go through it and learn from it, you can reach your greatest heights.&quot;</p>&mdash; Jonathan Jones (@jjones9) <a href="https://twitter.com/jjones9/status/1612838124467675137?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 10, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Gravedigger]

LMAO Crying about getting cancelled for being a bad GM

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Colts GM Chris Ballard: We live in a[n NFL] world where failure&#39;s not allowed. When you fail in this world you get canceled and everybody wants your head. And rightfully so in some cases. But if you&#39;re able to go through it and learn from it, you can reach your greatest heights.&quot;</p>&mdash; Jonathan Jones (@jjones9) <a href="https://twitter.com/jjones9/status/1612838124467675137?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 10, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Yeah, I think the decision to go with whatever washed up QB of the month was the downfall more so than anything. Whoever decided Philip Rivers and Matt Ryan were the best avenues for success should probably be the ones getting fired. If that was Irsay, then so be it, but Ballard is supposed to be where the buck stops in that regard.

[Skyy God]

Ballard has plenty of pussy ass quotes about the risk of an unknown QB.

Dude is on borrowed time.

[RunKC]

The only good QB he could have drafted was Jalen Hurts. He probably is kicking himself bc of passing on Josh Allen for a G. But to be fair Luck was still on the team and planning on playing at that time

[Dunerdr]

The line sucks, they punt at qb, high picks are low value posistions and hes had several recievers hes drafted and for the most part they are average or kind of shit.

[O.city]

Trade up, draft a QB. Give him the best resources to succeed via coaching and players and such.

If he fails you get fired.

That's your only option to win in the NFL though long term

[notorious]

Ballard has plenty of pussy ass quotes about the risk of an unknown QB.

Dude is on borrowed time.

If Irsay's dealer is late but only for 5 minutes Ballard's ass is grass.