Reason #1 I'll miss John Dorsey: the 2015 draft

[Direckshun]

This is all via the Star:

2015

Marcus Peters, CB, Washington (1st): Two years, two Pro Bowls.**

Mitch Morse, C, Missouri (2nd): Two-year starter.**

Chris Conley, WR, Georgia (3rd): Number of receptions jumped from 17 as rookie to 44 this season.**

Steven Nelson, CB, Oregon State (3rd): Worked way into starter in base defense.**

Ramik Wilson, LB, Georgia (4th): Importance increased with every game.**

D.J. Alexander, LB, Oregon State (5th): Special-teams coverage specialist.*

James O’Shaughnessy, TE, Illinois State (5th): Third tight end for offense that loves tight ends.*

Rakeem Nunez-Roches, DL, Southern Mississippi (6th): Terrific progress from first to second year.*

Da’Ron Brown, WR, Northern Illinois (7th): On practice squad last year

I simply cannot believe Clark couldn't find a way to work it out with John Dorsey.

Brett Veach has done well so far with what little he could do.

But he better be a damn ace in the hole. This is just insanely good.

[RealSNR]

Up until the Chiefs took Mahomes, I think Marcus Peters was the most ecstatic I've ever been with a Chiefs 1st round draft pick. I got pretty rowdy for Glenn Dorsey and Eric Berry as well, but unless your GM blows a top 5 pick on a fucking Tyson Jackson, it's hard to not be pleased with those picks.

Peters was a guy I had pegged as the best CB in that draft even above Xavier Rhodes (who was the favorite by just about every draftnik out there). I took him in the CP Mock. I compared him to Justin Houston as a guy that teams were going to let drop for a ridiculous and stupid reason.

Their fucking loss. Our fucking win. That one felt good as a fan but also felt good as a giant attention whore who got to say "I WAS RIGHT!" :D

[Hammock Parties]

Is his head off the chopping block?

[yeti]

Looks like 5 starters in one draft if Nelson is considered the starter over Mitchell.

[JakeF]

Arguably the best judge of talent the Chiefs have ever had at GM.

[PAChiefsGuy]

Great GM. He will be missed.

I can't think of one bad draft we have had since he was with us.

[Marcellus]

Get back to me when we know it has actually hurt us to lose him and dont forget the shitty Hali, JC, and Howard contracts to boot.

[Easy 6]

Get back to me when we know it has actually hurt us to lose him and dont forget the shitty Hali, JC, and Howard contracts to boot.

Eh, you're being a bit too harsh here IMO

Until Veach nails a draft or two, the rumors about Dorsey not being the primary architect remain just that... rumors

I really like Veach' style so far, but the man has much to prove to dispel the notion that we lost one helluva draft guru

[penbrook]

Eh, you're being a bit too harsh here IMO

Until Veach nails a draft or two, the rumors about Dorsey not being the primary architect remain just that... rumors

I really like Veach' style so far, but the man has much to prove to dispel the notion that we lost one helluva draft guru

We will see after Veachs first draft. At least Veach knows what a cap is

[Easy 6]

We will see after Veachs first draft. At least Veach knows what a cap is

Right, I'm not arguing cap wizardry, strictly the eye for raw talent

[Willie Lanier]

Looks like 5 starters in one draft if Nelson is considered the starter over Mitchell.

He is (in reference to Nelson)

[pugsnotdrugs19]

Dorsey had strengths and weaknesses like all GMs, he obviously nailed some draft picks... but by all accounts, Veach was the guy who identified the 3 studs in Philly, and Mahomes here... who knows who else he banged the table for that we just don't know about.

I think we'll be okay. I already love his aggressive approach with the trades.

[jaa1025]

It's a team effort

[JakeF]

Get back to me when we know it has actually hurt us to lose him and dont forget the shitty Hali, JC, and Howard contracts to boot.So Veach was the real talent guy behind the scenes? I bet you weren't saying that before Dorsey got fired? So who is the real talent guy for Veach? Just want to get it on the record in case he gets fired.

The Howard's contract wasn't bad, he got hurt and hasn't ever been the same. As for JC, all the fans wanted the Chiefs to extend him and now they are blaming Dorsey for it. The Hali contract was terrible and didn't make much sense.

[jonzie04]

Up until the Chiefs took Mahomes, I think Marcus Peters was the most ecstatic I've ever been with a Chiefs 1st round draft pick. I got pretty rowdy for Glenn Dorsey and Eric Berry as well, but unless your GM blows a top 5 pick on a ****ing Tyson Jackson, it's hard to not be pleased with those picks.

Peters was a guy I had pegged as the best CB in that draft even above Xavier Rhodes (who was the favorite by just about every draftnik out there). I took him in the CP Mock. I compared him to Justin Houston as a guy that teams were going to let drop for a ridiculous and stupid reason.

Their ****ing loss. Our ****ing win. That one felt good as a fan but also felt good as a giant attention whore who got to say "I WAS RIGHT!" :D

Xavier Rhodes wasn't in that draft class.

[penbrook]

So Veach was the real talent guy behind the scenes? I bet you weren't saying that before Dorsey got fired? So who is the real talent guy for Veach? Just want to get it on the record in case he gets fired.

The Howard's contract wasn't bad, he got hurt and hasn't ever been the same. As for JC, all the fans wanted the Chiefs to extend him and now they are blaming Dorsey for it. The Hali contract was terrible and didn't make much sense.

Dwayne Bowe also says hi

[TambaBerry]

Up until the Chiefs took Mahomes, I think Marcus Peters was the most ecstatic I've ever been with a Chiefs 1st round draft pick. I got pretty rowdy for Glenn Dorsey and Eric Berry as well, but unless your GM blows a top 5 pick on a ****ing Tyson Jackson, it's hard to not be pleased with those picks.

Peters was a guy I had pegged as the best CB in that draft even above Xavier Rhodes (who was the favorite by just about every draftnik out there). I took him in the CP Mock. I compared him to Justin Houston as a guy that teams were going to let drop for a ridiculous and stupid reason.

Their ****ing loss. Our ****ing win. That one felt good as a fan but also felt good as a giant attention whore who got to say "I WAS RIGHT!" :D

Um Xavier Rhodes was like 2 or 3 years before Peters

[CrossCheck]

Um Xavier Rhodes was like 2 or 3 years before Peters

I'd bet he meant Trae Waynes (the other Viking CB)

[RealSNR]

I'd bet he meant Trae Waynes (the other Viking CB)

Doi. Yes. My bad. Vikings corners are all the same to me.

[Titty Meat]

His firing was stupid

[BlackOp]

Hunt was all Dorsey...KC ****ed up....been saying that since he was fired.

C. Jones, Hill and Hunt...off the charts stellar.

He's had two consecutive rookies break or match all-time records...and did it from the 3rd and 5th rounds.

[penbrook]

Hunt was all Dorsey...KC ****ed up....been saying that since he was fired.

C. Jones, Hill and Hunt...off the charts stellar.

He's had two consecutive rookies break or match all-time records...and did it from the 3rd and 5th rounds.

Yes but people also say that Veach and Ballard were the ones who found these players. Whether we know that for a fact or not? We will find out soon wnough

[WhiteWhale]

it seems some fans still think that GM's have 'Carl Peterson' pull.

Get real kids. A lot of cooks are in that kitchen.

[RealSNR]

We will see after Veachs first draft. At least Veach knows what a cap is

Veach hasn't been in power long enough to prove that he knows the first fucking thing about managing an NFL salary cap.

What's his background? Scouting, scouting, and more scouting. Just like Dorsey. We still have zero evidence that he'll be any better at the cap than Dorsey.

[KCrockaholic]

Dwayne Bowe also says hi

At the time re-signing Bowe was THE correct move to make.

[RealSNR]

And while everybody was super impressed with his opening press conference, I honestly didn't get anything out of it. I wasn't expecting to, necessarily. It's not like Veach can reveal all his master plans and secrets or anything, but I was kind of hoping for a real answer to the question asked, "How are you different from Dorsey?"

He gave a vague, rambley answer that didn't answer the question nor make me feel confident he WILL be any different. It was the ultimate politician answer.

I assume he'll be better at massaging Clark's ego, I guess. That's different. And I think he'll be decent at drafts. But managing the cap? Why do we have reason to think he knows what the fuck he's doing?

[KCrockaholic]

And while everybody was super impressed with his opening press conference, I honestly didn't get anything out of it. I wasn't expecting to, necessarily. It's not like Veach can reveal all his master plans and secrets or anything, but I was kind of hoping for a real answer to the question asked, "How are you different from Dorsey?"

He gave a vague, rambley answer that didn't answer the question nor make me feel confident he WILL be any different. It was the ultimate politician answer.

I assume he'll be better at massaging Clark's ego, I guess. That's different. And I think he'll be decent at drafts. But managing the cap? Why do we have reason to think he knows what the **** he's doing?

Because of hearsay. That's really it. I still hate the Dorsey firing, and it may not come back to haunt them for a while because the QBOTF is here, but this is without a doubt Dorseys team for the next 2 years unless Veach blows up half the roster.

[Rasputin]

I'd like to know how much Veech was involvement in those picks? What kind of input & influence did he have?

[Direckshun]

Doi. Yes. My bad. Vikings corners are all the same to me.

Racist.

[chiefzilla1501]

Talent evaluation is one thing. Someone has to pull the trigger on a pick and own the decision. Dorsey's picks had cajones. Took Peters and tyreek even though they were labeled character issues. Traded up for mahomes. Took dee ford when most labeled him a reach. Even Chris Jones was a little surprising of a pick.

After years of taking safe picks, Dorsey had the balls to go after high positional value players every single year.

But I agree with everyone else... I haven't seen reason to believe veech will be worse, so I'll give him that shot.

[Rasputin]

My judgment on Veech is going be what he does with Alex Smith and if they let Mahomes be the starter next year with all first string reps during OTAs. He doesn't need to sit another year after this season. Mahomes has done everything right and then some for learning the job.


I don't see any reason to hold Mahomes back or this team chemistry with him going forward.

This is Alex Smith fifth year in Carl Petersons five year plan so its on him to get the Super Bowl. We can do better with Mahomes long term with success and open up opportunities for even multiple Super Bowls and possible dynasty.

They trust Mahomes to be backup that means they trust him to go into games at any given moment if injury to Alex Smith. No reason not to trust him being the starter next year if he doesn't get the opportunity this year.

[Marcellus]

Eh, you're being a bit too harsh here IMO

Until Veach nails a draft or two, the rumors about Dorsey not being the primary architect remain just that... rumors

I really like Veach' style so far, but the man has much to prove to dispel the notion that we lost one helluva draft guru

I didn't claim Dorsey wasn't key to any of it, I am saying until we know Veach cant draft or there is a huge drop off in drafted talent I'm not going to be concerned about it.

All good organizations are set up where the loss of one person shouldn't cripple you.

Im not talking coach or QB here as those positions are unique but I am talking organization structure.

I do not know if the Chiefs were set up that well but we are about to find out. Its early but so far so good.

[LoneWolf]

It is very, very early in John Dorsey's tenure here, but unless the talent he's acquired magically turns it around by midpoint of the season, I believe we should be shopping for a new GM by the end of the season.


I simply cannot believe Clark couldn't find a way to work it out with John Dorsey.

JFC Direckshun, you're like a teenage girl. "I hate Dorsey....I love Dorsey." ROFL

[penchief]

Talent evaluation is one thing. Someone has to pull the trigger on a pick and own the decision. Dorsey's picks had cajones. Took Peters and tyreek even though they were labeled character issues. Traded up for mahomes. Took dee ford when most labeled him a reach. Even Chris Jones was a little surprising of a pick.

After years of taking safe picks, Dorsey had the balls to go after high positional value players every single year.

But I agree with everyone else... I haven't seen reason to believe veech will be worse, so I'll give him that shot.

I have no doubt trading up to get Mahomes was a team decision from Hunt on down. However, I know this sounds crazy, but what if there was internal strife over how Dorsey went about it?

This is all speculation on my part but we all saw the awkward exchange between Dorsey and Hunt in the war room after the Mahomes pick. Dorsey was victorious as he had just pulled off an amazing trade. We got Mahomes very cheap by most standards.

But we also heard the stories about a deal being in place to move up to 5 to pick Mahomes. What if everyone else wanted Dorsey to make the pick at 5 because they didn't want to mess around and have somebody jump in front of them.

Again, I know this is crazy, but what if Hunt, Reid, and everyone else thought picks 6 through 9 were too much of a risk and didn't appreciate the river boat gambler mode Dorsey was in. Maybe the level of anxiety caused between picks 6 and 10 caused a bit too much consternation. Could it have pissed Hunt and Reid off enough to contribute to his firing if they thought he was getting too cute with their QBOTF?

[BossChief]

Dorsey will end up the GM of the chargers.

The NFL wants that team to draw crowds.

[Hoover]

Its going to be difficult to judge Veach on how he drafts for a few years as we don't have a first round pick next year, and we are going to be drafting at the bottom of each round. Still, for some reason I feel that the Chiefs have the right guy in place with Veach. As I've mentioned before, I didn't like how Ballard handled the Andrew Luck mess in Indy, and now has a real mess on his hands. He also has a fan base that believes they are Super Bowl contenders each year, hard to be successful in that environment.

I like Veach's youth and willingness to take a chance (shown by the Ragland and Erving deals).

[RunKC]

Rumors are rumors but so far I'm really pleased with Veach and the work he's done. It's a small sample size but it's been nothing but quality so far.

Saving money at swing tackle and then turning a weak ILB core with questions into a solid, deep unit.

It's going to be interesting to see what happens on the financial side of the house. Ideally you'd like one of Logan, Morse or Ford to get an extension in season. All three need to have new deals by next spring.

[TimeForWasp]

Next man up.

[Hammock Parties]

Dorsey will end up the GM of the chargers.

The NFL wants that team to draw crowds.

A Dorsey run Chargers team with Sam Darnold at QB would make for a formidable AFC West...

[KChiefs1]

I miss Dorse. I just hope Veach has the best part of Dorse in him.

[KChiefs1]

Get back to me when we know it has actually hurt us to lose him and dont forget the shitty Hali, JC, and Howard contracts to boot.



Dorse & contracts didn't mix well but he knew talent when he saw it. The team that hires him(Colts?) will be much better.

[Rausch]

Peters makes that draft.

Morse was a very good pick but taken at the expense of more talented guys still available.

Dorsey's greatest contributions were in the UDFA's/FA areas...

[DaneMcCloud]

Dorsey will end up the GM of the chargers.

The NFL wants that team to draw crowds.

Dorsey would be an absolute disaster as the face of a Los Angeles franchise

[Direckshun]

JFC Direckshun, you're like a teenage girl. "I hate Dorsey....I love Dorsey." ROFL

I went from wait and see in 2013, to furious in 2014. By the end of 2014, I had changed my tune and became generally happy with him.

By 2015 and 2016, I was really happy with Dorsey and I believe he's the best GM we've ever had.

I'm allowed to change my mind, I've been honest about it from the start -- if you read my replies through that thread I explain my changes of heart as they occur.

[Discuss Thrower]

Veach hasn't been in power long enough to prove that he knows the first fucking thing about managing an NFL salary cap.

What's his background? Scouting, scouting, and more scouting. Just like Dorsey. We still have zero evidence that he'll be any better at the cap than Dorsey.

We also don't know how much input the former foot-shuffler for Pioli had in mismanaging the cap.

[DaneMcCloud]

By 2015 and 2016, I was really happy with Dorsey and I believe he's the best GM we've ever had.

The Chiefs best GM was the guy that acquired Len Dawson, Jim Tyrer, Bobby Bell, Buck Buchanon, Emmitt Thomas, Jan Stenerud, Curly Culp, Jim Lynch and Otis Taylor.

Dorsey's not even close to being in that stratosphere.

[Buckweath]

I won't lie I was and am a huge John Dorsey fan.

I thought he was one of the very best GMs in the league.

The thing is Veach might be very good too.

We all know how important drafting is for a franchise and I dare anyone to name me three teams, or even one, who drafted better than the Chiefs whilst Dorsey was our GM, taking into consideration how high the picks were taken.

Go ahead! Which teams?

[Prison Bitch]

Is his head off the chopping block?

That will always be Direckshuns scarlet letter