PDA

View Full Version : Chiefs Let's take a CLOSER look at the defense


UChieffyBugger
08-27-2018, 04:28 PM
So many are in panic mode, so many are searching for someone to talk them off of the ledge, so I figured we might as well take a closer look at our potential starting defense come opening day.

Secondary

Nelson (CB)
Fuller (CB)
Berry (S)
Murray (S)


Front seven

Ragland (ILB)
Hitchens (ILB)
Houston (OLB)
Ford/Kpass (OLB)
Bailey (DE)
Jones (DE)
Williams (DT)


Now, there is still time for acquisitions but as we stand right now that is the defense. Is it THAT bad yall? We're all going nuts about it and even Nick Wright was saying "it's the worse defense in the NFL", but hold on, this defense hasn't even played together yet so how can anyone come to that conclusion? :rolleyes: IF we're judging the defense solely on what we've seen in preseason then I think we're being naive. Fuller is a stud, Berry is proven when healthy, Ragland impressed last season, Hitchens is a workhorse, Jones is a rising star and Houston is one of the best in the game.

We have plenty of talent on this defense. We just have to see them all on the field at the same damn time and then pray that they stay healthy. Because man for man I don't think those eleven players are bad at all.

Molitoth
08-27-2018, 04:33 PM
Well...

Yes. They are going to suck.

Fuller is a stud. (really? May be a little too early to judge don't you think)

Berry is proven when healthy. (He is rarely healthy)

Houston is one of the best in the game. (At coverage? He isn't getting sacks anymore)

Rausch
08-27-2018, 04:34 PM
I think it's time to panic when Chicago schreds you with a b/u QB and HB.

Yes, I agree, Daniel is likely the best b/u in the league at present.

That said they moved the ball on us at will and really didn't run much...

UChieffyBugger
08-27-2018, 04:34 PM
Well...

Yes. They are going to suck.

Why do you think they will suck?

UChieffyBugger
08-27-2018, 04:35 PM
I think it's time to panic when Chicago schreds you with a b/u QB and HB.

Yes, I agree, Daniel is likely the best b/u in the league at present.

That said they moved the ball on us at will and really didn't run much...

Against a back-up defense though.

TLO
08-27-2018, 04:36 PM
MOAR THREADS!!!1!

Three7s
08-27-2018, 04:37 PM
Yes, it is THAT bad. Will Berry actually play and play for an extended period? I doubt that.

You're also heavily assuming that the defense won't run much in the way of nickel and dime defenses, which require extra DBs. Whenever Nelson returns, that will still be an ongoing issue because beyond Nelson, who is still unproven in my book beyond the slot, there is next to nothing.

Everyone likes bashing the 2003 Chiefs defense, and rightfully so, but this secondary looks worse than that abomination.

Molitoth
08-27-2018, 04:37 PM
Why do you think they will suck?

Bob Sutton

3rd and 12? Align your CB's with a 14 yard pad....

Without Marcus Peters here to bail him out with a lot of turnovers, it's going to get nasty, or Bob will have to adjust.
We all have seen how well Bob is at adjusting.

UChieffyBugger
08-27-2018, 04:38 PM
MOAR THREADS!!!1!

:deevee:ROFL

New World Order
08-27-2018, 04:39 PM
On paper it's not bad

But we've sure looked bad.

UChieffyBugger
08-27-2018, 04:41 PM
Yes, it is THAT bad. Will Berry actually play and play for an extended period? I doubt that.

You're also heavily assuming that the defense won't run much in the way of nickel and dime defenses, which require extra DBs. Whenever Nelson returns, that will still be an ongoing issue because beyond Nelson, who is still unproven in my book beyond the slot, there is next to nothing.

Everyone likes bashing the 2003 Chiefs defense, and rightfully so, but this secondary looks worse than that abomination.

Didn't Nelson play on the outside when we totally shut down the Raiders for near enough three-quarters last season? And it's all very well picking on the secondary, but what about the front seven? You've said nothing about that. I also don't think the 2003 team had as much talent as this defense does.

ModSocks
08-27-2018, 04:43 PM
On paper it's not bad

But we've sure looked bad.

They played way worse than they look on paper, that's for sure.

Rausch
08-27-2018, 04:44 PM
Against a back-up defense though.

Those first two drives we rotated.

Yes, it wasn't our "pure" starters.

We'll never see our "pure starters" because we disguise our sub packages to look like single high.

Hell, based on our D talent I'll go out on a limb and say the only upset (by Vegas) will be Pitt all year. Yes, I think we'll shoot our whad on the Pitt game.

If they employ that cloud and squat zone shit to hide their lack of talent this year PM will burn them. He isn't Alex, he isn't afraid to make them pay, and my guess is we'll be down early and it'll be a track meet...

UChieffyBugger
08-27-2018, 04:44 PM
On paper it's not bad

But we've sure looked bad.

I'm glad someone is finally able to be objective instead of the tired "it's bad" comments with no reasoning behind it. On paper it is good imo, and we haven't seen them on the pitch together yet so we don't even know how good they can be.

Three7s
08-27-2018, 04:45 PM
Didn't Nelson play on the outside when we totally shut down the Raiders for near enough three-quarters last season? And it's all very well picking on the secondary, but what about the front seven? You've said nothing about that. I also don't think the 2003 team had as much talent as this defense does.
I'm not worried about the front seven, but it won't matter when Amerson gets roasted within 2 seconds.

TLO
08-27-2018, 04:46 PM
Is this a penbrook mult?

UChieffyBugger
08-27-2018, 04:49 PM
I'm not worried about the front seven, but it won't matter when Amerson gets roasted within 2 seconds.

Not if Breeland finally rolls into town my brother :D

Easy 6
08-27-2018, 04:56 PM
You ****ed the thread title up, its supposed to read...

LETS TAKE A CLOSER LOOK AT THE DEFENSE

UChieffyBugger
08-27-2018, 04:57 PM
You ****ed the thread title up, its supposed to read...

LETS TAKE A CLOSER LOOK AT THE DEFENSE

Too many cry babies kept moaning, so I toned it down a little :D

Deberg_1990
08-27-2018, 04:58 PM
Let’s take a closer look at Clays anus.

Buckweath
08-27-2018, 05:00 PM
It's all about finding a solid #2/#3 after Fuller and Nelson. For the rest, this defense could be a borderline top 10 D. Call me crazy.

You have to find that CB though.

Rausch
08-27-2018, 05:09 PM
Let’s take a closer look at Clays anus.

How many ways can you say "wart?"

smithandrew051
08-27-2018, 05:22 PM
I'm not worried about the front seven, but it won't matter when Amerson gets roasted within 2 seconds.

Pretty much my thoughts on this D as well. We had damn well better hit on that second round pick we got for Peters.

pugsnotdrugs19
08-27-2018, 05:25 PM
Need to find 2-3 players after final roster cuts who can come in and play meaningful snaps.

I will say, however, that I think Sutton has kept a lot of his more creative blitzes under wraps and they also haven't pressed in man coverage nearly as much as I suspect they will. So we'll see.

Part of me watches them play this preseason and thinks, it sure looks like they're running a bunch of stuff that they haven't been practicing much. They look too lost for it not to be the case.

They've looked fucking atrocious these past three games. But, would anyone be that surprised if September 9th rolls around and they pick Rivers off a couple times while holding the Chargers to say, 20 points? I know I wouldn't based on recent history...

I want Veach to bring in some players, but I also think we need to see them play a true game before we judge too harshly..

smithandrew051
08-27-2018, 05:28 PM
I like this year’s front 7 the best of any year since Houston was playing at his highest level.

Ford will inevitably get hurt or be unproductive and, for once, that’s okay. I really do like Speaks and Kpassagnon. It won’t just be Zombo backing up Ford.

The DL gives me optimism, because this should be Jones’s best year. Xavier Williams has looked good. Nnadi seems to get good penetration (giggity).

I think this is also the strongest pair of inside backers we’ve seen in a long time. DJ made the occasional play last year, but was a liability for the most part.

The secondary is just...sooo bad so far. I normally don’t believe one player changes things that much, but Peters would make me feel a ton better. He would upgrade every corner position. He would take the 1 spot, Fuller would slide to 2 and upgrade that slot, etc. Then, safety would be our only question. We could probably even pick up a vet to help out.

Red Dawg
08-27-2018, 05:32 PM
3 back up QBs killed our secondary. That's bad and it will only look better if our pass rush starts getting home. So far they haven't played together damn near at all except in practice so maybe there is a glimmer that we can stop somebody. Not much hope seeing how we have 6 straight good QBs to start the year. Rivers may throw for 500 yards on us.

pugsnotdrugs19
08-27-2018, 05:32 PM
I'm down with a Jones-Nnadi-Williams base defensive line. I think they'd keep our ILBs clean all day.

Rain Man
08-27-2018, 05:33 PM
We really need Houston to be a star this year. I do think that he's finally getting back into top form, but we need that.

Eleazar
08-27-2018, 05:33 PM
Need to find 2-3 players after final roster cuts who can come in and play meaningful snaps.

The fact that we're hanging our hopes on 2-3 people who were cut by other teams becoming difference-makers for us - just to perhaps be able to field a mediocre defense - really says a lot

Rain Man
08-27-2018, 05:34 PM
3 back up QBs killed our secondary. That's bad and it will only look better if our pass rush starts getting home. So far they haven't played together damn near at all except in practice so maybe there is a glimmer that we can stop somebody. Not much hope seeing how we have 6 straight good QBs to start the year. Rivers may throw for 500 yards on us.

We're going to need a ferocious pass rush to protect the secondary. Fortunately we haven't seen Houston and Jones much yet. And of course, I think T.Y. McGill is going to become a star for us in that regard.

pugsnotdrugs19
08-27-2018, 05:44 PM
We really need Houston to be a star this year. I do think that he's finally getting back into top form, but we need that.

He and Ford combined for like 50 snaps in the preseason. Definitely didn't help the pass rush look as good, one would think.

Coochie liquor
08-27-2018, 05:44 PM
I'm down with a Jones-Nnadi-Williams base defensive line. I think they'd keep our ILBs clean all day.

I’m pretty pumped for Nnadi. I think he’s gonna be special and will be a big contributor by seasons end.

pugsnotdrugs19
08-27-2018, 05:46 PM
The fact that we're hanging our hopes on 2-3 people who were cut by other teams becoming difference-makers for us - just to perhaps be able to field a mediocre defense - really says a lot

I don't think those 2-3 players make them mediocre, or good, or bad necessarily. I think that those players though could be better than what we have at say CB3 or safety, and so if you can acquire upgrades, why not?

It is my personal belief that the defense will look better week one because they will actually 'show their cards', so to speak. Press coverage, blitzes, etc. All starters playing, ideally, for a full game.

If those things don't happen, well... it'll be a shit show. All season.

Simply Red
08-27-2018, 06:00 PM
seems we always panic in P/S - this year more so - but for what seems to be good reasons.

Chiefshrink
08-27-2018, 06:11 PM
Hell, based on our D talent I'll go out on a limb and say the only upset (by Vegas) will be Pitt all year. Yes, I think we'll shoot our whad on the Pitt game.


Pitt has our number and Mahomes won't get any time to pass regardless of Shazier's absence. Pitt's D-line owns our o-line period.

Chiefshrink
08-27-2018, 06:16 PM
- but for what seems to be good reasons.

Definition of insanity. Expecting different results when nothing has changed and has actually gotten worse. You are correct.

Chief Roundup
08-27-2018, 06:17 PM
Secondary

Nelson (CB)
Fuller (CB)
Berry (S)
Murray (S)


Front seven

Ragland (ILB)
Hitchens (ILB)
Houston (OLB)
Ford(OLB)
Bailey (DE)
Jones (DE)
Williams (DT)


That is our base defense. We will spend most of our time in Nickel which will be more like.
Secondary

Nelson (CB)
Fuller (CB)
Amerson (CB)
Berry (S)
Murray (S)

Front seven

Hitchens (ILB)
Houston (OLB)
Ford/Kpass (OLB)
Bailey (DE)
Jones (DE)
Williams (DT)

Now how do you feel about the starting defense?

O.city
08-27-2018, 06:36 PM
The fact that we're hanging our hopes on 2-3 people who were cut by other teams becoming difference-makers for us - just to perhaps be able to field a mediocre defense - really says a lot

Meaningful snaps doesn’t equal difference maker

TEX
08-27-2018, 07:01 PM
The fact that we're hanging our hopes on 2-3 people who were cut by other teams becoming difference-makers for us - just to perhaps be able to field a mediocre defense - really says a lot

We have that now if you think about it.

UChieffyBugger
08-27-2018, 07:44 PM
That is our base defense. We will spend most of our time in Nickel which will be more like.
Secondary

Nelson (CB)
Fuller (CB)
Amerson (CB)
Berry (S)
Murray (S)

Front seven

Hitchens (ILB)
Houston (OLB)
Ford/Kpass (OLB)
Bailey (DE)
Jones (DE)
Williams (DT)

Now how do you feel about the starting defense?

Amerson is the fourth cb according to reports from practice today, feel better? :D

ILChief
08-27-2018, 07:59 PM
Imagine replacing Amerson with Peters. Oh wait, we had that

Chief Roundup
08-27-2018, 08:00 PM
Amerson is the fourth cb according to reports from practice today, feel better? :D

No Scandrick is no better in reality.

NJChiefsFan
08-27-2018, 08:26 PM
Too many cry babies kept moaning, so I toned it down a little :D

The reason to point that out isn't to complain. It's to keep a conversation about the defense in 1 thread instead of breaking it apart. It waters down the conversation. Now a great point about the defense needs to be repeated 3 times in each thread.

There is nothing wrong with your point. Whether I agree or not you at least backed it up with something. But your need to have the thought be seen by everyone is breaking up the conversion that was already happening in another thread.

NJChiefsFan
08-27-2018, 08:33 PM
One problem with this particular on paper argument is that it only shows 2 corners. In today's NFL we all know you better be looking at 3 corners minimum to judge your secondary with how often they will be out there. Really need to look at 4.

Pasta Little Brioni
08-27-2018, 09:34 PM
ROFL at freaking out over preseason. It's stupid.

tmax63
08-28-2018, 06:35 AM
Preseason is for playing some snaps together, getting some chemistry and rubbing off the rust from last year. When 1/3 to 1/2 of the D hasn't played together yet I don't see a big red switch to suddenly turn them on and have them playing at a quality level come week 1. And if they aren't doing the things that they plan on during the season I see it even more problematic. The Chiefs starting schedule is such that they need to be rolling out of the gate, not doing all the things that preseason is designed to prepare them for.

TEX
08-28-2018, 06:56 AM
The Defense:

Secondary
Nelson - JAG
Fuller - Up and coming young talent
Amerson - JAG- (One of the worst CB's in the league)
Berry - Overpaid former Pro Bowler (worth every penny IF healthy)
Murray - JAG
Scandrick - JAG

Front Seven

Hitchens (ILB) - JAG (paid too much for what he brings)
Houston (OLB) - Overpaid former Pro Bowler (Often missing when most needed)
Ford/Kpass (OLB) - Ford = BUST / Kpass - Up & Coming Talent
Bailey (DE) - JAG
Jones (DE) - Up and coming Talent
Williams (DT) - JAG
Ragland - JAG (Until he proves he can stay healthy)

SO - we have 2 former overpaid Pro Bowlers who are not living up to their contracts. 3 young guys with talent. 6 / 7 JAGS at any given time with Amerison needing to be cut yesterday

Not good is how I see it. :shrug:

bricks
08-28-2018, 07:11 AM
The Defense:

Secondary
Nelson - JAG
Fuller - Up and coming young talent
Amerson - JAG- (One of the worst CB's in the league)
Berry - Overpaid former Pro Bowler (worth every penny IF healthy)
Murray - JAG
Scandrick - JAG

Front Seven

Hitchens (ILB) - JAG (paid too much for what he brings)
Houston (OLB) - Overpaid former Pro Bowler (Often missing when most needed)
Ford/Kpass (OLB) - Ford = BUST / Kpass - Up & Coming Talent
Bailey (DE) - JAG
Jones (DE) - Up and coming Talent
Williams (DT) - JAG
Ragland - JAG (Until he proves he can stay healthy)

SO - we have 2 former overpaid Pro Bowlers who are not living up to their contracts. 3 young guys with talent. 6 / 7 JAGS at any given time with Amerison needing to be cut yesterday

Not good is how I see it. :shrug:

I would add Derrick Nnadi to the list of young, up and coming talent. I think he is gonna be a starter one day.

TEX
08-28-2018, 07:16 AM
I would add Derrick Nnadi to the list of young, up and coming talent. I think he is gonna be a starter one day.

Agreed. He's showing he's better than those usually lined up in front of him. My list was just a play on what / who was listed (mostly the starters). But yes, the Chiefs may have something in Nnadi.

Plus - Dude has this CRAZY stare when looking at you. It's like he looks right through you. I like those "CRAZY STARE" guys! LMAO

RunKC
08-28-2018, 07:32 AM
Starting defense from that disaster

Bailey-didn’t play
Williams-didn’t play
Jones-barely played..6 snaps
Houston-barely played..11 snaps
Ford-barely played..11 snaps
Berry-didn’t play
Nelson-didn’t play
Ragland-first game action of the year
Hitchens-first game action of the year

As said before, they looked like a defense filled with rust from the vets and a bunch of young inexperienced players.

oldman
08-28-2018, 08:43 AM
Starting defense from that disaster

Bailey-didn’t play
Williams-didn’t play
Jones-barely played..6 snaps
Houston-barely played..11 snaps
Ford-barely played..11 snaps
Berry-didn’t play
Nelson-didn’t play
Ragland-first game action of the year
Hitchens-first game action of the year

As said before, they looked like a defense filled with rust from the vets and a bunch of young inexperienced players.

Exactly. There was a whole lot of miscommunication and guys sucking wind. Even if Berry isn't the Berry of old, he's a coach on the field for the secondary. I see no reason to have Ford out there unless it's a passing down. He can't contain the run and he sure can't cover anyone.

Eleazar
08-28-2018, 08:43 AM
Of course, everyone slows down to take a CLOSER look at a traffic accident too

The Franchise
08-28-2018, 09:39 AM
Will our defense be as bad as they were in Chicago? No. But what it does show is that if ONE of our starting CBs go down.....we're absolutely fucked. Amerson becomes a starter and gets targeted like Gaines from last season.

RunKC
08-28-2018, 09:42 AM
FYI Amerson was moved to 3rd CB yesterday with Nelson back and is rotating with Scandrick. Sounds like he is moving to the 4th corner spot.

Just cut him and move Tremon Smith to the 4th corner. Get that guy on the field so he can learn. He gets burned? Oh well like it wouldn’t be any different than Amerson.

O.city
08-28-2018, 09:43 AM
They'll cut Amerson.

ROYC75
08-28-2018, 09:44 AM
ROFL at freaking out over preseason. It's stupid.

Maybe they are thinking it's better to freak in preseason than regular season when it's almost too late to fix it?

Maybe?


Could just be a bunch of FREAKS!

Marcellus
08-28-2018, 09:44 AM
They played way worse than they look on paper, that's for sure.

No doubt.

The biggest thing I find interesting is that weird stat I read that the starting defense has lined up exactly 1 time in preseason in the dime defense which they ran 60% of the time last season.

I'm not sure what that tells me other than we haven't seen the personnel packages on the field together we will see the majority of the season I guess.

That doesn't absolve them of poor tackling and losing 1 on 1 matches but its interesting none the less.

O.city
08-28-2018, 09:45 AM
No doubt.

The biggest thing I find interesting is that weird stat I read that the starting defense has lined up exactly 1 time in preseason in the dime defense which they ran 60% of the time last season.

I'm not sure what that tells me other than we haven't seen the personnel packages on the field together we will see the majority of the season I guess.

That doesn't absolve them of poor tackling and losing 1 on 1 matches but its interesting none the less.

Maybe means they aren't planning to play the dime defense as much as they did last season, seeing as how they got gauged when they did it

Marcellus
08-28-2018, 09:46 AM
Maybe means they aren't planning to play the dime defense as much as they did last season, seeing as how they got gauged when they did it

I don't think that's the case as usually the offensive personnel will dictate that, but maybe you are correct.

ROYC75
08-28-2018, 09:48 AM
They'll cut Amerson.

NOPE, too young and they will roll the dice coaching up a cheaper player.

O.city
08-28-2018, 09:48 AM
I don't think that's the case as usually the offensive personnel will dictate that, but maybe you are correct.

Seems a lot more likely they're gonna suck for whatever reason. Maybe coaching, maybe talent, maybe both.

The Franchise
08-28-2018, 09:52 AM
They'll cut Amerson.

I honestly could see that. If he had shown flashes....then I think they would look at keeping him because they could claim that he's just getting used to the defense. But dude has flat out sucked every play he's been on the field. Veach is going to want to show that he's not afraid to own up to his mistakes and get rid of players that aren't working out. I think that's why they signed Scandrick.

O.city
08-28-2018, 09:54 AM
Yeah, look at the numbers they usually keep.

They aren't cutting Fuller, Nelson, or Scandrick. Smith has played the most special teams snaps and is a returner so they'll keep him.

That's 4. They seem high on Springs so that would be 5. I think they normally are at 6 so he may make it.

O.city
08-28-2018, 09:56 AM
Maybe Reaser?

The Franchise
08-28-2018, 09:56 AM
Maybe Reaser?

Redmond?

O.city
08-28-2018, 09:57 AM
Redmond?

Possibly. It's very possible I mixed up the 2. Likely even.

RaidersOftheCellar
08-28-2018, 01:10 PM
ROFL at freaking out over preseason. It's stupid.

I'll admit I'm concerned that they won't be as strong as I thought (on either side of the ball), but I don't understand how anyone can be so sure they're terrible. More than half the D either hasn't played or hasn't been game-ready yet. Others have played limited snaps. I mean, we can safely conclude that David Amerson is exploitable and safety depth isn't a strength. Not sure we can conclude anything past that.

Reid and the front office seemed very confident, even cocky, before training camp. They certainly didn't give the impression that they're working with a 6-10 type roster.

O.city
08-28-2018, 02:05 PM
The d hasn't played together or isn't game ready, yet we are to expect that to just what.....happen?

This is why practice and the preseason are important.

ModSocks
08-28-2018, 02:06 PM
I honestly could see that. If he had shown flashes....then I think they would look at keeping him because they could claim that he's just getting used to the defense. But dude has flat out sucked every play he's been on the field. Veach is going to want to show that he's not afraid to own up to his mistakes and get rid of players that aren't working out. I think that's why they signed Scandrick.

The only way i see Amerson sticking is if he's some press coverage savant in practice, and they plan on playing a shit ton of press like they said they were.

So far in preseason i can't recall seeing any "bump n run" coverage from the Chiefs.

And you remember the pre-Dorsey years? Everyone hated the fact that neither Peterson or Pioli would own up to their overpaid mistakes.

Dorsey was a breath of fresh air who had no problem cutting his F/A mistakes.

Well...that resulted in a shit ton of dead cap money and him getting fired. Then, the fans completely flipped on him after being a "balla ass GM" just months before.

So it'll be interesting to see how Veach goes about this.

It's not like Amerson is an expensive cut though, unlike say, Maclin.

Mecca
08-28-2018, 02:07 PM
The d hasn't played together or isn't game ready, yet we are to expect that to just what.....happen?

This is why practice and the preseason are important.

They probably won't play together, Houston and Berry have had a possible 80 games together here, they've suited up together 34 times.

kccrow
08-28-2018, 02:15 PM
I think the front 7 is much better than it was last season, but I'm incredibly concerned about the secondary. Fuller hasn't spent much time playing on the outside in the league, so he's got a task ahead of him. Nelson has traditionally been shitty matching up on the outside, but solid yet unspectacular in the slot. There are literally no other corners on the roster worth a shit. I'm not so sure Berry makes it through the year with a gimp heel once again. Sorensen being out is a dagger back there because what's behind him is much worse. Murray has proven to be more of a liability than an asset at safety and he's too slow to play this scheme as a CB. He's a zone corner best suited for cover 2. Watts appears to have a ways to go yet and McQuay just looks lost.

Veach has to be on top of the waiver wire during cuts or this could be a long season for this defense. It's a passing league and I don't think the Chiefs have the tools to defend it.

O.city
08-28-2018, 02:21 PM
I think the front 7 is much better than it was last season, but I'm incredibly concerned about the secondary. Fuller hasn't spent much time playing on the outside in the league, so he's got a task ahead of him. Nelson has traditionally been shitty matching up on the outside, but solid yet unspectacular in the slot. There are literally no other corners on the roster worth a shit. I'm not so sure Berry makes it through the year with a gimp heel once again. Sorensen being out is a dagger back there because what's behind him is much worse. Murray has proven to be more of a liability than an asset at safety and he's too slow to play this scheme as a CB. He's a zone corner best suited for cover 2. Watts appears to have a ways to go yet and McQuay just looks lost.

Veach has to be on top of the waiver wire during cuts or this could be a long season for this defense. It's a passing league and I don't think the Chiefs have the tools to defend it.

That's why I'd prefer he looks for some guys on other teams that may not be in their long term plans and flip a pick for them.

oldman
08-28-2018, 02:24 PM
Possibly. It's very possible I mixed up the 2. Likely even.

The depth chart shows Reaser ahead of Redmond, but according to the roster, Reaser is 27 and Redmond 24. I don't know how much that means to the long term plans.
The other thing that struck me is O'Daniel is shown as an ILB but he's wearing a DB number. Wasn't he supposed to be a hybrid S/LB? Maybe they have plans for him that they haven't shown.

Mecca
08-28-2018, 02:25 PM
The depth chart shows Reaser ahead of Redmond, but according to the roster, Reaser is 27 and Redmond 24. I don't know how much that means to the long term plans.
The other thing that struck me is O'Daniel is shown as an ILB but he's wearing a DB number. Wasn't he supposed to be a hybrid S/LB? Maybe they have plans for him that they haven't shown.

LB's wear 40 numbers all the time, Eligwe has a 40's number.

Chief Pagan
08-28-2018, 02:42 PM
Yes, it is THAT bad. Will Berry actually play and play for an extended period? I doubt that.

You're also heavily assuming that the defense won't run much in the way of nickel and dime defenses, which require extra DBs. Whenever Nelson returns, that will still be an ongoing issue because beyond Nelson, who is still unproven in my book beyond the slot, there is next to nothing.

Everyone likes bashing the 2003 Chiefs defense, and rightfully so, but this secondary looks worse than that abomination.

When this defense makes it through an entire game without forcing a single punt, get back to me.

:harumph:

Until then, [insert you choice of expletive here]

TEX
08-28-2018, 03:36 PM
I think the front 7 is much better than it was last season, but I'm incredibly concerned about the secondary. Fuller hasn't spent much time playing on the outside in the league, so he's got a task ahead of him. Nelson has traditionally been shitty matching up on the outside, but solid yet unspectacular in the slot. There are literally no other corners on the roster worth a shit. I'm not so sure Berry makes it through the year with a gimp heel once again. Sorensen being out is a dagger back there because what's behind him is much worse. Murray has proven to be more of a liability than an asset at safety and he's too slow to play this scheme as a CB. He's a zone corner best suited for cover 2. Watts appears to have a ways to go yet and McQuay just looks lost.

Veach has to be on top of the waiver wire during cuts or this could be a long season for this defense. It's a passing league and I don't think the Chiefs have the tools to defend it.


No worries - It's just August 28. We still have 11 whole days before the season starts. Plus, it's a 3pm kickoff so we even have a few extra hours longer than we normally would.

Red Dawg
08-28-2018, 03:42 PM
WHY HASN'T HE DONE ANYTHING? WHY IS OUR SECONDARY DOG SHIT!

UChieffyBugger
08-28-2018, 03:50 PM
The Defense:

Secondary
Nelson - JAG
Fuller - Up and coming young talent
Amerson - JAG- (One of the worst CB's in the league)
Berry - Overpaid former Pro Bowler (worth every penny IF healthy)
Murray - JAG
Scandrick - JAG

Front Seven

Hitchens (ILB) - JAG (paid too much for what he brings)
Houston (OLB) - Overpaid former Pro Bowler (Often missing when most needed)
Ford/Kpass (OLB) - Ford = BUST / Kpass - Up & Coming Talent
Bailey (DE) - JAG
Jones (DE) - Up and coming Talent
Williams (DT) - JAG
Ragland - JAG (Until he proves he can stay healthy)

SO - we have 2 former overpaid Pro Bowlers who are not living up to their contracts. 3 young guys with talent. 6 / 7 JAGS at any given time with Amerison needing to be cut yesterday

Not good is how I see it. :shrug:

Well imo "up and coming talent" doesn't mean they aren't TOP CLASS players, does it? Deshaun Watson was an up and coming player and look what he was doing before he got injured? What about Wentz? No need to downplay a guy just to make a point. Jones, Fuller and Ragland have the potential to be very good players I think.

TEX
08-28-2018, 04:13 PM
Well imo "up and coming talent" doesn't mean they aren't TOP CLASS players, does it? Deshaun Watson was an up and coming player and look what he was doing before he got injured? What about Wentz? No need to downplay a guy just to make a point. Jones, Fuller and Ragland have the potential to be very good players I think.

What are you even talking about? Downplaying what? Watson and Wentz were 1st rounders.

All the guys I listed as "up and coming talent" means that I think they can be good players. I have a different opinion of Ragland - I think he's injured goods and will not reach his potential because of it. We'll know soon enough.

UChieffyBugger
08-28-2018, 04:16 PM
What are you even talking about? Downplaying what? Watson and Wentz were 1st rounders.

All the guys I listed as "up and coming talent" means that I think they can be good players. I have a different opinion of Ragland - I think he's injured goods and will not reach his potential because of it.

Er an "up and coming talent" is YOUNG TALENT!!...regardless of where they were drafted. That phrase is a complete cop-out. They are either good enough, or they aren't, it's that simple. Stop trying to muddy the waters because all it does is render your argument feeble.

kccrow
08-28-2018, 04:25 PM
Edit... Wrong thread

BlackOp
08-28-2018, 04:36 PM
One thing that cant be denied is Veach definitely is attempting to "fix" the defense. He allocated the entire draft to it and picked up Hitchens and Fuller. Signed Amerson and Scandrick too...not saying they will all work out. He also cut all the dead weight from last year...

I think they will be better than 2017...by how much, who knows.

I'm surprised they haven't addressed the Safety market....both Berry and Sorenson are injured. Very strange...but Chunts not going to contest the NFLs blackball agenda thats going on.

TEX
08-29-2018, 06:53 AM
Er an "up and coming talent" is YOUNG TALENT!!...regardless of where they were drafted. That phrase is a complete cop-out. They are either good enough, or they aren't, it's that simple. Stop trying to muddy the waters because all it does is render your argument feeble.

You're completely off here with your "cop out" take friend... I gave my opinion. My opinion has my meaning, NOT yours. I listed players who I felt had a chance to become something and assigned them the term, "Up and coming" to indicate they could be something some day. The end... YOU mentioned two #1 draft picks and interjected YOUR meaning (TOP CLASS) to what I was saying. I'm not making any "argument", but you obviously are. I think we're talking about the same thing anyway... Nobody, other than yourself "is muddying waters" here. Do you have comprehension issues or something? :shrug:

Rausch
08-29-2018, 07:03 AM
I'm surprised they haven't addressed the Safety market....both Berry and Sorenson are injured. Very strange...but Chunts not going to contest the NFLs blackball agenda thats going on.

Did our rookie (S) play last game? I didn't watch hardly any of the 2nd half...