Forget E Thomas...Arizona crumbling...how about Patrick Peterson?

[arrowheadnation]

I believe he's in year 5 of a 7 year deal, but his cap hit would be massive. I'm sure we could make it work though. I wonder if Arizona would even answer the phone.

[Mecca]

This one is tricky, their coach is a D guy and has made all these statements that he's their cornerstone player..meanwhile he's benching everyone else and they are awful.

[smithandrew051]

Forget it. No one trades their star corner right after they draft their QB of the future.

[pugsnotdrugs19]

Honestly think that our team would benefit more from Thomas right now.

[T-post Tom]

Depends on his Madden 19 ratings. Are they higher than ET's?

[Simply Red]

Honestly think that our team would benefit more from Thomas right now.

yes.

[carcosa]

Why not both!

[RippedmyFlesh]

Depends on his Madden 19 ratings. Are they higher than ET's?

peterson 91 thomas 95

ps
don't even play was just curious

[T-post Tom]

peterson 91 thomas 95

ps
don't even play was just curious

Thank you! The die is cast.

[Coach]

I don't see a corner play as a major issue, compared to the safety play. The safety play is a much bigger problem than corners (other than the ILB's).

[arrowheadnation]

I don't see a corner play as a major issue, compared to the safety play. The safety play is a much bigger problem than corners (other than the ILB's).

On the whole, both positions ****ing suck. We should honestly do everything in our power to get both of them. Even if we're only renting Thomas for a year. That being said, even if we only go after one, at least we know that Veach isn't completely oblivious to what is going on.

[Coach]

On the whole, both positions ****ing suck. We should honestly do everything in our power to get both of them. Even if we're only renting Thomas for a year. That being said, even if we only go after one, at least we know that Veach isn't completely oblivious to what is going on.

Nelson and Scandrick are a liability, I'm not disagreeing, but the safety play has been much worse than CB's at this point. Murray and whoever else is not getting their coverages correct. Basically, their football IQ is low, for whatever reason and cannot stay disciplined.

LB play against the run is OK, but it's well known that they're not coverage LB's, so having an S can help shore up some of the issues, along with EB's return. That's a big IF on EB's return, and how effective he will be.

[CoMoChief]

Veach and Reid sure did a shitfuck of a job w/ this team's secondary over this past offseason.

[tmax63]

The ILB's haven't been able to cover a corpse to this point but they are definitely better against the run. Without seeing the stats it feels like the TE's and RB's are doing the most damage against them.

[wheeler08]

Our LBs are slow as molasses. Watch the Jimmy G play that he gets injured on, Speaks is running after him and I think my 3 yr old could run faster.

[htismaqe]

Nelson and Scandrick are a liability, I'm not disagreeing, but the safety play has been much worse than CB's at this point. Murray and whoever else is not getting their coverages correct. Basically, their football IQ is low, for whatever reason and cannot stay disciplined.

LB play against the run is OK, but it's well known that they're not coverage LB's, so having an S can help shore up some of the issues, along with EB's return. That's a big IF on EB's return, and how effective he will be.

Exactly. Fuller has struggled a bit but we expect him to improve. Scandrick has actually been pretty solid for the most part.

The middle of the field is a flaming dumpster fire. We need a rangy safety MUCH more than we need another CB right now.

[TLO]

I hear he's related to Carl -

SIGN HIM CARL!

[Mecca]

Speaks runs like a defensive end when he's running free...he looks like one too, what were they expecting?

[DJ's left nut]

I don't see a corner play as a major issue, compared to the safety play. The safety play is a much bigger problem than corners (other than the ILB's).

The funny thing is, against all odds, they're not a bad man coverage team.

But they are an ABYSMAL zone coverage squad. And that's just a mis-match for their game situations. When you're up by 2-3 scores, you want to be able to go into those zones, make them work slowly and eventually get a stop or 2. At least slow them in the red zone.

The game situations have unquestionably called for a bunch of Cover 3 kind of situations and this defense just can't do it.

I originally felt that the corner play was the biggest problem and yeah, they obviously have to be able to play in zone as well. But it's the safeties that are really really struggling with their responsibilities and the middle of that field is CONSTANTLY wide open because of it.

If they're gonna keep playing this much zone (and they will with this offense), they need to figure out their safety play.

[O.city]

The funny thing is, against all odds, they're not a bad man coverage team.

But they are an ABYSMAL zone coverage squad. And that's just a mis-match for their game situations. When you're up by 2-3 scores, you want to be able to go into those zones, make them work slowly and eventually get a stop or 2. At least slow them in the red zone.

The game situations have unquestionably called for a bunch of Cover 3 kind of situations and this defense just can't do it.

I originally felt that the corner play was the biggest problem and yeah, they obviously have to be able to play in zone as well. But it's the safeties that are really really struggling with their responsibilities and the middle of that field is CONSTANTLY wide open because of it.

If they're gonna keep playing this much zone (and they will with this offense), they need to figure out their safety play.

Well, theres a guy in Seattle that might help?

[DJ's left nut]

Well, theres a guy in Seattle that might help?

Who's pissed off because he doesn't have a contract.

I'm giving a 2nd for the privilege of giving another aging safety a long-term deal. Especially not another 'Fuck you, pay me' safety.

Even if you got him to just shut up and play for a season, I'd be damn reluctant to give up a 2nd round pick for a 13 games from a guy. This team has a LOT of money it needs to spend soon. It is gonna need those damn picks. "Oh, but it'll just be K-Pass again..."

Well that kind of fatalist shit is just saying "Screw it, we have 3 years to win a title and then it's all over". No, we can't just say our picks will suck anyway so trade them. If our picks will suck, fire Veach and find a way to ensure they won't. I don't think they will.

[htismaqe]

This team has won one playoff game in 30 years and people want to play the "we're trying to build a dynasty" card.

Screw that.

Go all in, win a Super Bowl. If it crumbles afterwards, so be it. My bucket list is already checked off, I'll be dead.

[New World Order]

Who's pissed off because he doesn't have a contract.

I'm giving a 2nd for the privilege of giving another aging safety a long-term deal. Especially not another '**** you, pay me' safety.

Even if you got him to just shut up and play for a season, I'd be damn reluctant to give up a 2nd round pick for a 13 games from a guy. This team has a LOT of money it needs to spend soon. It is gonna need those damn picks. "Oh, but it'll just be K-Pass again..."

Well that kind of fatalist shit is just saying "Screw it, we have 3 years to win a title and then it's all over". No, we can't just say our picks will suck anyway so trade them. If our picks will suck, fire Veach and find a way to ensure they won't. I don't think they will.

We would need to give him a new deal

[New World Order]

This team has won one playoff game in 30 years and people want to play the "we're trying to build a dynasty" card.

Screw that.

Go all in, win a Super Bowl. If it crumbles afterwards, so be it. My bucket list is already checked off, I'll be dead.

This

[DJ's left nut]

We would need to give him a new deal

No.

I wouldn't take him for a 5th if giving him a new deal was a requirement. I am absolutely 100% unwilling to plow any more guaranteed money into aging secondary players. Eric Berry has absolutely fisted us for the last 4 years and Thomas gets pissy and threatens to retire anytime he doesn't get paid.

The guy's been as bad or worse than Berry when it comes to putting his money ahead of everything. I'm not even a little bit interested in that.

[DJ's left nut]

This team has won one playoff game in 30 years and people want to play the "we're trying to build a dynasty" card.

Screw that.

Go all in, win a Super Bowl. If it crumbles afterwards, so be it. My bucket list is already checked off, I'll be dead.

Going all-in works about 1 time in 4. If you can promise me that giving up our next 3 years of 1st rounders would win us a SB this year - sure, I'd do it.

You can't. That's not how football works.

[Molitoth]

No.

I wouldn't take him for a 5th if giving him a new deal was a requirement. I am absolutely 100% unwilling to plow any more guaranteed money into aging secondary players. Eric Berry has absolutely fisted us for the last 4 years and Thomas gets pissy and threatens to retire anytime he doesn't get paid.

The guy's been as bad or worse than Berry when it comes to putting his money ahead of everything. I'm not even a little bit interested in that.

I agree with this.
As much fun as it looks on paper, I just can't see it as a smart move.

The Berry situation this year was my final straw.

ACL? Sure.
Cancer? Sure. (and much respect)
Torn Achilles? Sure... but now we start to worry about his body in general.

My heel hurts? Seriously? WTF.

[Jerok]

Going all-in works about 1 time in 4. If you can promise me that giving up our next 3 years of 1st rounders would win us a SB this year - sure, I'd do it.

You can't. That's not how football works.

Trading a 2nd and a 4th for Thomas isn't going all in. It's basically be trading Peter's picks for him. This team traded Peter's thinking we would be maybe 8 and 8 this year, but we are much better, so trading for Thomas is essentially reneging on the Peter's deal. I'll take it.

[DJ's left nut]

Trading a 2nd and a 4th for Thomas isn't going all in. It's basically be trading Peter's picks for him. This team traded Peter's thinking we would be maybe 8 and 8 this year, but we are much better, so trading for Thomas is essentially reneging on the Peter's deal. I'll take it.

If you give a 2nd and a 4 for Thomas, PLUS give him a contract, you're pushing a shitload of chips into the middle because at some point that contract absolutely costs you one of the young players on this team.

And it effectively costs you 2 with the draft pick you gave up as well.

I'm just not willing to do that. I mean you have things like the helmet catch blowing apart perfect seasons. Football is a lunatic, random sport and I'm not willing to take 2 fewer bites at the apple in exchange for a single bigger bite.

[Mecca]

Thomas hasn't had near the injury problems Berry has, matter of fact I expect him to play much longer than Berry.

[Mecca]

If you give a 2nd and a 4 for Thomas, PLUS give him a contract, you're pushing a shitload of chips into the middle because at some point that contract absolutely costs you one of the young players on this team.

And it effectively costs you 2 with the draft pick you gave up as well.

I'm just not willing to do that. I mean you have things like the helmet catch blowing apart perfect seasons. Football is a lunatic, random sport and I'm not willing to take 2 fewer bites at the apple in exchange for a single bigger bite.


Who exactly do you think it's going to cost them?

Hill and Mahomes will get paid and if you want to pay Kareem Hunt well that's worse than going for Thomas.

[Molitoth]

Who exactly do you think it's going to cost them?

Hill and Mahomes will get paid and if you want to pay Kareem Hunt well that's worse than going for Thomas.

As much as I like Hunt because he's a really hard runner... I do agree that you DON'T give a RB a big contract on this team, when it's predominately passing. (especially on an Andy Reid team)
Also, the other cheaper RB's on this team aren't so bad... it wouldn't be a complete drop off.

[Mecca]

I honestly want to know who it's going to cost the team, matter of fact the Chiefs are about to get some serious dead money back and also move on from other big contracts.

If you are moving on from big deals why do you care about adding a good player for a few more years?

Earl Thomas is going to be a productive player when Eric Berry is retired, you can mark that I said that.

[O.city]

Probably Jones or Fuller

[RunKC]

Who's pissed off because he doesn't have a contract.

I'm giving a 2nd for the privilege of giving another aging safety a long-term deal. Especially not another '**** you, pay me' safety.

Even if you got him to just shut up and play for a season, I'd be damn reluctant to give up a 2nd round pick for a 13 games from a guy. This team has a LOT of money it needs to spend soon. It is gonna need those damn picks. "Oh, but it'll just be K-Pass again..."

Well that kind of fatalist shit is just saying "Screw it, we have 3 years to win a title and then it's all over". No, we can't just say our picks will suck anyway so trade them. If our picks will suck, fire Veach and find a way to ensure they won't. I don't think they will.

DJ makes a good point.

We are about to pay Chris Jones and Tyreek Hill filthy money. Having 3 picks in the top 60 picks should go a long way to finding 3 cheap contracts for at least 4 years.

[Mecca]

Probably Jones or Fuller

Kendall Fuller is a solid player but if he left I wouldn't lose sleep...matter of fact if they replaced everyone on this defense right now I wouldn't get upset.

Obviously they aren't cornerstones or they'd make some kind of difference. I think Jones is a good player but he isn't someone I'd break a bank for.

[O.city]

Kendall Fuller is a solid player but if he left I wouldn't lose sleep...matter of fact if they replaced everyone on this defense right now I wouldn't get upset.

Obviously they aren't cornerstones or they'd make some kind of difference. I think Jones is a good player but he isn't someone I'd break a bank for.

You lose players like that AND the ability to draft a cheap rookie to replace them is where the problem lays.

[Mecca]

I'm gonna be real now, if you pay a 3-4 defensive end that honestly is kind of hit or miss with his production "filthy money" I may question your GM skills.

You should be able to find solid 3-4 ends in the draft without using high picks, truth right there.

[O.city]

I'm gonna be real now, if you pay a 3-4 defensive end that honestly is kind of hit or miss with his production "filthy money" I may question your GM skills.

You should be able to find solid 3-4 ends in the draft without using high picks, truth right there.

Jones doesn't play 34 end every snap though. They move him around.

I'm not really in disagreement on not paying him, but he's a good young player.

[Mecca]

You lose players like that AND the ability to draft a cheap rookie to replace them is where the problem lays.

Yes but you aren't losing them after this year...

I'm a believer in that yea most of the time you need a CB that's gonna be a 1st rounder but guess what, in this scheme you should be able to get quality DL outside of the 1st.

[Molitoth]

Kendall Fuller is a solid player but if he left I wouldn't lose sleep...matter of fact if they replaced everyone on this defense right now I wouldn't get upset.

Obviously they aren't cornerstones or they'd make some kind of difference. I think Jones is a good player but he isn't someone I'd break a bank for.

Yuuup. Everyone on this defense is replaceable.

[Mecca]

Lets also remember how many big contracts are going to be off this team in literally 2 years and the cap is always going up.

Anyway this window is open wide right now, sometimes you have to take your shot.

[DJ's left nut]

Who exactly do you think it's going to cost them?

Hill and Mahomes will get paid and if you want to pay Kareem Hunt well that's worse than going for Thomas.

My guess would be Chris Jones or perhaps Fuller.

I know Fuller's been a bit of a disappointment to this point but he's also the only guy on the roster I'd expect to have long-term asset ability out wide.

They can't just keep paying everyone. And I'm not interested in giving a paycheck player his 3rd deal. Those are ALWAYS the ones you regret.

[O.city]

Taking your shot is fine, but if you miss that turns a potential big window into a short one.

[O.city]

Plus, if the Seahawks are wanting a first or second for a safety that needs his third contract, I'd tell them to promply fuck right off.

I've gotta give the guy a new contract, we can talk a 3rd tops.

[DJ's left nut]

I honestly want to know who it's going to cost the team, matter of fact the Chiefs are about to get some serious dead money back and also move on from other big contracts.

If you are moving on from big deals why do you care about adding a good player for a few more years?

Earl Thomas is going to be a productive player when Eric Berry is retired, you can mark that I said that.

Earl Thomas is going to get paid, jake it for 2 years and then retire once his base salary goes down and the signing bonus is mostly paid up.

He's a pouty bitch that went to the Cowboys owner AFTER A GAME AGAINST THEM and told him to trade for him. And not because he was in a terrible situation but because he was mad that the Seahawks wouldn't just keep giving him raises until he was the highest paid safety in football - evidently in perpetuity.

Fuck no I don't want that guy.

[DJ's left nut]

Taking your shot is fine, but if you miss that turns a potential big window into a short one.

a 16-0 football team lost a championship because a dude that caught exactly zero passes for the rest of time trapped a ball against his helmet after the least mobile QB this side of Phillip Rivers evaded a rush (that should've been called in the grasp).

Bigger windows are a myth.

[bobbything]

I'm not sure whether anything would really help that much. When SF was just picking us apart for 8 yards a clip yesterday, guys were running wide the eff open. As in, nobody was even close. There is either a problem with our corners and safeties being too stupid to understand their assignment, or the scheme is dogshit.

It could be a combination of both but outside of us getting a good pass rush all of the sudden, I don't know that anything will really help.

[CoMoChief]

Our LBs are slow as molasses. Watch the Jimmy G play that he gets injured on, Speaks is running after him and I think my 3 yr old could run faster.

THIS X1000000

[Halfcan]

Sutton should be fired. Last ranked defense that can't close games out. Send a message Mr. Veech- fire his ass.

[RunKC]

Lets also remember how many big contracts are going to be off this team in literally 2 years and the cap is always going up.

Anyway this window is open wide right now, sometimes you have to take your shot.

But that money has to go somewhere.

Hill is going to take Watkins spot on the cap in 2021. They will most likely begin talking to Mahomes about a contract in 2019 and have it done by 2020.
Chris Jones needs to take Houston’s spot on the cap in 2 seasons. Someone will need to take Berry’s spot in 2 years.

Everybody wants to not sign Dee Ford, cut Eric Berry, cut Justin Houston, not extend Chris Jones and give a high pick for Earl Thomas.

Okay, what does that leave you with? Earl Thomas, more FA’s and draft picks that may or may not work.

[O.city]

Yeah, for god sakes just put Speaks on the DL and be done with this dumb OLB shit.

[bobbything]

Yeah, for god sakes just put Speaks on the DL and be done with this dumb OLB shit.
I'm not completely sure why we run a 3-4. Though, I've never really been a fan of it in general.

[CoMoChief]

If the Chiefs get on a serious role over the next 5 wks, look like the #1-2 seed in the AFC and beat DEN 2x, and are running away w/ the AFCW title, then I would expect the Chiefs to make some kind of trade for either S or CB.

It will be tough, but the gauntlet of the schedule is upon them, and they have the chance to do some real damage in the AFC as well in their own div. Wins over CIN, DEN(2x), NE, and JAX would do wonders for the Chiefs and where they sit in the standings...esp DEN. AFCW div looks like a shit show outside of KC, and Chiefs have their problems of their own on D. But if somehow they could run away w/ the div and have wks 16-17 off w/ a playoff bye, that'd help get them healthy and fresh, esp if Eric Berry is coming back.

I doubt Eric Berry plays at all this season to be honest. That's just how I feel. I think his heel is much worse than Chiefs are letting on to believe. JMO. I mean I only want him playing if he's totally 100% healthy. No need to have him play even at 85%. There's something wrong w/ his genetics or something, dude just has weak tendons down there, and/or they're always under huge amounts of stress and it's just only a matter of time.

[Mecca]

But that money has to go somewhere.

Hill is going to take Watkins spot on the cap in 2021. They will most likely begin talking to Mahomes about a contract in 2019 and have it done by 2020.
Chris Jones needs to take Houston’s spot on the cap in 2 seasons. Someone will need to take Berry’s spot in 2 years.

Everybody wants to not sign Dee Ford, cut Eric Berry, cut Justin Houston, not extend Chris Jones and give a high pick for Earl Thomas.

Okay, what does that leave you with? Earl Thomas, more FA’s and draft picks that may or may not work.

If you pay Chris Jones even half of Houstons money I am going to shake my head at you in disbelief.

[Mecca]

Sutton should be fired. Last ranked defense that can't close games out. Send a message Mr. Veech- fire his ass.

I'm already tired of blaming Bob Sutton for dudes without any talent or guys who don't understand where they are supposed to be.

[O.city]

If you're gonna make a move for a guy, do it now. Football isn't plug and play like baseball or basketball.

He needs to be in here as early as you can get.

[Mecca]

That whole defense needs to be completely redone, the Chiefs window is right fucking now. I'm honestly not sure how getting Thomas who is an elite player today is worse than drafting a DB and praying he works out.

If you are lamenting about losing a 3-4 end then you must think this team can't draft a good player at all.

[htismaqe]

Going all-in works about 1 time in 4. If you can promise me that giving up our next 3 years of 1st rounders would win us a SB this year - sure, I'd do it.

You can't. That's not how football works.

Playing for next year has work about ZERO times in 50 years. I'm ready for something different.

[htismaqe]

Kendall Fuller is a solid player but if he left I wouldn't lose sleep...matter of fact if they replaced everyone on this defense right now I wouldn't get upset.

Obviously they aren't cornerstones or they'd make some kind of difference. I think Jones is a good player but he isn't someone I'd break a bank for.

Exactly this. There isn't one player on the defense that is irreplaceable.

[DJ's left nut]

Playing for next year has work about ZERO times in 50 years. I'm ready for something different.

Playing with someone else's leftovers is what hasn't worked for 50 years.

Y'know - chasing old veterans to fill holes; that sorta thing.

You're wanting to try the same formula at a different position. This is Marty in the late 90s kind of thinking. Marty got desperate and pushed all in for that last season or 2 and everything fell to shit.

Even the Seahawks never pushed all-in. They won their championship from left field and then for the next 2 years kept trying to double down on it. Things got worse and worse and worse because they never focused on the long-term with their young QB. And now they're going to ruin at least 5 years of his prime.

Again - their title had nothing to do with any attempts to win now. That wasn't the mode they found themselves in. But the hellscape that franchise has now become absolutely IS because of those win-now efforts. You absolutely cannot be reckless with this franchise now. You can't thin this roster out to where we have a 5 year period of wandering the wilderness despite having one of the 3 most valuable commodities in the game on our roster (I mean, what 1-1 trades would you make with the kid?).

[DJ's left nut]

Exactly this. There isn't one player on the defense that is irreplaceable.

You can't rebuild the defense if you have no capital to do it with.

If you're giving money AND picks, you've locked yourself into this roster around Thomas for the foreseeable future. And frankly, it probably gets worse because again - money and picks have gone to securing Thomas.

And Thomas is going to be a punk once he gets paid.

[htismaqe]

Playing with someone else's leftovers is what hasn't worked for 50 years.

Y'know - chasing old veterans to fill holes; that sorta thing.

You're wanting to try the same formula at a different position. This is Marty in the late 90s kind of thinking. Marty got desperate and pushed all in for that last season or 2 and everything fell to shit.

Even the Seahawks never pushed all-in. They won their championship from left field and then for the next 2 years kept trying to double down on it. Things got worse and worse and worse because they never focused on the long-term with their young QB. And now they're going to ruin at least 5 years of his prime.

Again - their title had nothing to do with any attempts to win now. That wasn't the mode they found themselves in. But the hellscape that franchise has now become absolutely IS because of those win-now efforts. You absolutely cannot be reckless with this franchise now. You can't thin this roster out to where we have a 5 year period of wandering the wilderness despite having one of the 3 most valuable commodities in the game on our roster (I mean, what 1-1 trades would you make with the kid?).

It's all built around the QB. Marty's approach didn't work because he never had the young, good QB.

Seattle won a championship. That's the bottom line. I really don't care about anything beyond that. Do I care that the Royals are awful again? Nope, I don't even pay attention day to day. They won a World Series, my fandom is pretty much complete.

[DJ's left nut]

It's all built around the QB. Marty's approach didn't work because he never had the young, good QB.

Seattle won a championship. That's the bottom line. I really don't care about anything beyond that.

That makes zero sense.

Seattle didn't win a championship because of any 'win now' moves they made. They won a championship because they had the QB. The situations aren't even remotely analogous.

Seattle's 'dynasty' absolutely fell to shit because of win now moves that...didn't....though.

Seattles a perfect cautionary tale. It's a model of what you DON'T do.

[Chiefnj2]

How hungry is Thomas? At this point the guy is in it for the money. He has his ring. Is he really going to come in and be Ed Reed in his prime, or is he going to coast? He's actively trying to get Dallas to grab him and it doesn't look like Dallas is going anywhere this year. Is winning a title his priority? Doesn't seem like it.

[saphojunkie]

I'm not completely sure why we run a 3-4. Though, I've never really been a fan of it in general.

I wonder if they are willing to do a conversion. Speaks makes more sense a s a 4-3 DE.


LDE: Ford/Speaks
DT: Jones
DT: Nnadi
RDE : Houston/Kpass

ROLB: Hitchens
MLB: Ragland
LOLB: Nieman

LCB: Nelson
RCB: Fuller
SS: Berry
FS: Parker

When you go to nickel, you take Ragland off, bring Scandrick in, and move Fuller to the slot. All of this, obviously, changes after half these guys are replaced in the offseason.

[DJ's left nut]

How hungry is Thomas? At this point the guy is in it for the money. He has his ring. Is he really going to come in and be Ed Reed in his prime, or is he going to coast? He's actively trying to get Dallas to grab him and it doesn't look like Dallas is going anywhere this year. Is winning a title his priority? Doesn't seem like it.

He's hungry enough to go to the opposing lockerroom and tell them to trade for him because he wants to get paid more.

Exactly the kind of guy we want to add to the mix here...

[RunKC]

If you pay Chris Jones even half of Houstons money I am going to shake my head at you in disbelief.

Houston will be gone in 2 years, Berry could realistically be gone in 2 years, Ford will be gone. At this rate we will be paying nobody on defense but maybe FA’s, which is not a good overall plan.

You want to scrap the entire defense and rely solely on draft picks early in their career?

[htismaqe]

That makes zero sense.

Seattle didn't win a championship because of any 'win now' moves they made. They won a championship because they had the QB. The situations aren't even remotely analogous.

Seattle's 'dynasty' absolutely fell to shit because of win now moves that...didn't....though.

Seattles a perfect cautionary tale. It's a model of what you DON'T do.

Dude, they won a freaking Super Bowl. You're looking CLEAR past the fact that this team hasn't even BEEN THERE and worrying about a freaking dynasty.

THAT makes zero sense...

[Sassy Squatch]

I wonder if they are willing to do a conversion. Speaks makes more sense a s a 4-3 DE.


LDE: Speaks
DT: Jones
DT: Nnadi
RDE : Kpass

ROLB: Hitchens
MLB: Ragland
LOLB: Nieman

LCB: Nelson
RCB: Fuller
SS: Berry
FS: Parker

When you go to nickel, you take Ragland off, bring Scandrick in, and move Fuller to the slot. All of this, obviously, changes after half these guys are replaced in the offseason.
What do you do with Houston? Tell him to fuck off? He wasn't exactly useless yesterday and Speaks and Kpassagnon haven't shown shit yet.

[Couch-Potato]

What would you be willing to give for Peterson? I'm assuming at least a 1st.

Hell, if possible, I'd give our 1st for Peterson then turnaround and give a 2nd and 4th for Thomas. We'd be fairly set at that point, just need to work on the front 7 a bit.

[saphojunkie]

What do you do with Houston? Tell him to fuck off? He wasn't exactly useless yesterday and Speaks and Kpassagnon haven't shown shit yet.

Hadn't had coffee yet.

Editing now.

[htismaqe]

What do you do with Houston? Tell him to fuck off?

I would actually tell him exactly that. Take a pay cut or get out.

[Sassy Squatch]

I would actually tell him exactly that. Take a pay cut or get out.
I'm with you there only if Speaks or Kpassagnon show even a smidgen of potential. Thus far those 2 have been all but worthless.

[htismaqe]

I'm with you there only if Speaks or Kpassagnon show even a smidgen of potential. Thus far those 2 have been all but worthless.

Nah. If they don't develop, you cut them too. You don't keep underperformance around just because there's nothing to replace them with. Houston is overpaid and underperforming - get rid of him. And if the guys behind him aren't up to the task, get rid of them too.

[Chiefnj2]

Kpass is getting 5 snaps a game. Tough to judge someone when they aren't on the field. Sutton has always had issues about not rotating players enough.

[htismaqe]

Kpass is getting 5 snaps a game. Tough to judge someone when they aren't on the field. Sutton has always had issues about not rotating players enough.

Perhaps he's not getting on the field because he's not very good? Chris Jones was a full-time starter by the end of his first season and he was a 2nd round pick, just like KPass.

[O.city]

Houston looked pretty fricking good yesterday. Sure, he makes a lot of money. If he plays like he did yesterday, that's fine.

[CoMoChief]

What would you be willing to give for Peterson? I'm assuming at least a 1st.

Hell, if possible, I'd give our 1st for Peterson then turnaround and give a 2nd and 4th for Thomas. We'd be fairly set at that point, just need to work on the front 7 a bit.

That's a JIMP scenario, but unlikely.

Chiefs don't have the cap for both, and I'm not sure either Thomas or Peterson would be willing to take a reduction in pay to make things more Chiefs friendly per say, esp Thomas.

But more than anything...this team needs top (young) talent on the D side of the ball. They need to hit on top draft picks more than anything. Can't do that by trading away top picks, that's the downside. Trade for Thomas/Peterson and gamble on short term success/deep playoff run/possible SB scenario vs more of a long term defensive overhaul. AFC is crap. Steelers and Pats don't look like the teams of the past and their QB's are getting old. There's a change of the guard in the AFC, Chiefs/Mahomes could be breaking through at just the right time. We'll see within the next 5wks as this all plays out.

A lot will happen within next 5 wks, and depending on how the Chiefs play will determine ultimately how the front office brass will play this card. I don't think even the Chiefs thought Mahomes would put the Chiefs in this position this early into his era. Maybe they did I dunno, but their draft picks certainly don't indicate that. They drafted projects with 2 of their top 3 picks in the draft rather than guys that can start and produce immediately.

Probably thought this would be a soft rebuilding season while Mahomes learns the ropes of being a starter, with next season being the year they make splashes in FA and make a push to go deep in playoffs. I dont think they expected Mahomes to take the league by storm like he has scoring 40ppg. I mean when you do that, you have the chance to beat anyone in the league. Maybe they recognize that and will be tempted to make a big trade before Oct 30.

[htismaqe]

We can only hope!

That's a JIMP scenario, but unlikely.

Chiefs don't have the cap for both, and I'm not sure either Thomas or Peterson would be willing to take a reduction in pay to make things more Chiefs friendly per say, esp Thomas.

But more than anything...this team needs top (young) talent on the D side of the ball. They need to hit on top draft picks more than anything.

A lot will happen within next 5 wks, and depending on how the Chiefs play will determine ultimately how the front office brass will play this card. I don't think even the Chiefs thought Mahomes would put the Chiefs in this position this early into his era. Maybe they did I dunno, but their draft picks certainly don't indicate that. They drafted projects with 2 of their top 3 picks in the draft rather than guys that can start and produce immediately.

Probably thought this would be a soft rebuilding season while Mahomes learns the ropes of being a starter, with next season being the year they make splashes in FA and make a push to go deep in playoffs. I dont think they expected Mahomes to take the league by storm like he has scoring 40ppg. I mean when you do that, you have the chance to beat anyone in the league. Maybe they recognize that and will be tempted to make a big trade before Oct 30.

[Mecca]

I'm to the point where I think Eric Murray maybe should just be released, a guy who doesn't understand zone concepts at safety is a complete liability.

[CoMoChief]

I'm to the point where I think Eric Murray maybe should just be released, a guy who doesn't understand zone concepts at safety is a complete liability.

he's the worst player on the D.

[htismaqe]

Yep, just cut him.

[Eleazar]

Dead last in total defense, dead last against the pass, #30 in points allowed, went from #6 to #19 against the run (only that high because there's not much reason to run against them)

And most of the people who aren't performing are not new to the team or to poor performance. The snaps need to start going to other players. Accountability is the the only thing it seems they aren't willing to try.

[DJ's left nut]

Dude, they won a freaking Super Bowl. You're looking CLEAR past the fact that this team hasn't even BEEN THERE and worrying about a freaking dynasty.

THAT makes zero sense...

And?

When you're having a discussion like this, you're comparing processes and not outcomes. The Seahawks process for their SB team was to run with the team they had and let their cheap young QB win them a championship.

The Seahawks process for the subsequent collapse was to keep throwing short-term bandaids at things while their draft/cap capital dried up. Now they're going to have a competitive team for roughly 1/2 of Russell's prime.

Had they stuck with their system after they won that first title and not deviated, they could be chasing more rings now. But the first title isn't a part of the conversation because it WASN'T a result of the kind of decision-making you're pursuing.

So I'm not sure how you can use them as any sort of analogue.

[DJ's left nut]

Perhaps he's not getting on the field because he's not very good? Chris Jones was a full-time starter by the end of his first season and he was a 2nd round pick, just like KPass.

From what I've read/heard, the issue with K-Pass is that the coaching staff is trying to do the same thing with this pair that they did w/ Ford - they want to assign them a side.

So when Ford gets tired, his 'replacement' comes in and they have Speaks taking weak side reps. If Houston got tired, K-Pass would come in. It's not a completely 1-1 thing, but that seems to be the explanation right now.

Which suggests that if they hold true to their pattern, Speaks will (unfortunately) get the majority of the snaps in Fords stead next week. I can't see any way Dee is back in a week. A speed rusher dealing with a strained groin that's at least serious enough to need an MRI is gone for a week. And with Reid's relatively skittish handling of injuries in the past, I could see him out for 3-4.