The Penalties have to stop

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

101 penalties now still leads the league. 8 more today. We won't go very far in the post season if it continues.

[Setsuna]

Yall have Mahomes. What's the issue here again? What is there to be worried about? Really.

[Basileus777]

Yeah, it's actually one of the biggest issues this team has.

[TimBone]

Yall have Mahomes. What's the issue here again? What is there to be worried about? Really.Penalties.

[Pitt Gorilla]

Ok

[Imon Yourside]

On the bright side we won't have any until at least a week from tomorrow night.

[Kman34]

Mahomes has became the darling of the league.... they will slow down come playoff time....

[R Clark]

They ain't yet, some are bullshit, but they need to get it taken care of .normally you would think discipline issues but that doesn't really fit this team?

[KChiefs1]

On the bright side we won't have any until at least a week from tomorrow night.


When we will have 12/100 vs the Rams.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Chris Meck]

well, you could look at it this way: 101 means an average of 10.1 penalties per game. Today we had 8. It's IMPROVEMENT! LOL

[Maine]

yip

[JakeF]

101 penalties now still leads the league. 8 more today. We won't go very far in the post season if it continues.
we were 6th last year as well.

It's no longer an anomaly.

[In58men]

We need to eliminate bad football.

[bsroyals54]

Not to say many are bad calls due to the NFL trying to keep games competitive vs the Chiefs, higher ratings.

[A Salt Weapon]

Atleast half the penalties are blatant horseshit from the NFL trying to keep these games close. It’s been like that for a while, small market team competing in a league of large market media powerhouses. The one sided calls against the Chiefs have been atrocious for decades it’s just this offense is so good it’s able to overcome it. If Mahomes can stay healthy for a few years and break a bunch of records despite the horrible officiating, things may change for a while but unlikely.
The last thing the NFL business model wants is a nobody Midwest team winning anything when there’s huge markets to appease to.

[Mecca]

That is a ton of it, you see calls happen to keep the games from becoming blowouts.

[scho63]

I would love to know how many holding penalties our opponent's offensive line has in the last 5 years versus our OLine.

I have a feeling the ratio is severely skewed against us.

[Fire Me Boy!]

Chiefs just got called for false start in the Rams/Seahawks game.

[Eleazar]

Atleast half the penalties are blatant horseshit from the NFL trying to keep these games close. It’s been like that for a while, small market team competing in a league of large market media powerhouses. The one sided calls against the Chiefs have been atrocious for decades it’s just this offense is so good it’s able to overcome it. If Mahomes can stay healthy for a few years and break a bunch of records despite the horrible officiating, things may change for a while but unlikely.
The last thing the NFL business model wants is a nobody Midwest team winning anything when there’s huge markets to appease to.

What a bunch of nonsense. This is an undisciplined team that is heavily penalized and that's not new. Exactly how is the league fabricating all the pre-snap penalties on offense? How's the league forcing our linemen, and kelce, and harris, etc. to get called for holding? How are they causing people to false start every week?

They aren't BS holding calls. Yes, holding is missed sometimes, both on us and on our opponents, but they aren't throwing flags against our line for things that are not occurring.

I know, we Chiefs fans see a conspiracy behind every corner, but you can't look at things like Dumbasstrious or Fisher getting flagged today and say it's just made up.

:tinfoil:

[dj56dt58]

On the bright side we won't have any until at least a week from tomorrow night.

Nice jinx asshole fisher just got flagged for holding

[hometeam]

https://media.giphy.com/media/3oz8xQdtCbTyk6Sxq0/giphy.gif

[Chiefshrink]

Wait till this week when our o-line will be literally tackling the Rams d-line to prevent Mahomes from getting hurt.:rolleyes:

[notorious]

I want them to commit more penalties!!!

[cdcox]

Honestly, I’m not worried about offensive penalties. Mahomes seems to easily overcome penalties that would normally be drive killers. Yes, we need to reduce drive extending defensive penalties.

[GloryDayz]

Remember, the NFL calls everything they see, but only sees what they want. We will continue to lose the ticky-tack call battle until Clark steps up and plays hardball with the league.

It's a process...

[wheeler08]

Remember when Denver was crying about us having O-lineman down the field to far and thats supposed to be a penalty and it never gets called? Yea we're still doing it, and the homer Arians called us out during a play yesterday

[Red Dawg]

Remember when Denver was crying about us having O-lineman down the field to far and thats supposed to be a penalty and it never gets called? Yea we're still doing it, and the homer Arians called us out during a play yesterday

How did Arians get on TV? He has zero personality.

[InChiefsHeaven]

Remember when Denver was crying about us having O-lineman down the field to far and thats supposed to be a penalty and it never gets called? Yea we're still doing it, and the homer Arians called us out during a play yesterday

Arians literally made my ears bleed yesterday. I've never been so annoyed with an announcer. I mean, some of them drive me nuts, but this guy has elevated the suck to astronomical levels. I can't stand listening to him. He was as actively rooting against the Chiefs as you could possibly do in a broadcast. Yech...

[wheeler08]

Arians literally made my ears bleed yesterday. I've never been so annoyed with an announcer. I mean, some of them drive me nuts, but this guy has elevated the suck to astronomical levels. I can't stand listening to him. He was as actively rooting against the Chiefs as you could possibly do in a broadcast. Yech...

Yea this week was way worse than last week

"If I was (Arizona Coach, don't remember name) I'd be really upset that the Chiefs got a timeout allowed so late because now they have to come up with a new goal line play" -Arians

Wow could he suck them off any more?? I hope he gets the Browns coaching job just to get him out of the booth, and he spends the rest of his days in purgatory

[wheeler08]

And for Arians to say that the Browns should really hire former Colts coach Chuck Pagano, just shows how stupid he is. The only thing Pagano can beat is leukemia

[notorious]

Seattle committed so many penalties they got away with murder on a lot of plays since the officials got tired of calling them.

I think KC is doing the same thing.

[notorious]

And for Arians to say that the Browns should really hire former Colts coach Chuck Pagano, just shows how stupid he is. The only thing Pagano can beat is leukemia

Gat dam

[Donger]

Can someone explain the roughing the passer penalty on Ford or Houston (don't remember who it was)? He barely touched the Cardinals' QBs helmet.

[wheeler08]

Can someone explain the roughing the passer penalty on Ford or Houston (don't remember who it was)? He barely touched the Cardinals' QBs helmet.

It was Ford, and its an automatic penalty this year. I've seen it in several non chiefs games

[Eleazar]

The Chiefs are the most penalized team in the league, at the moment, having had 84 penalties accepted against them. Cleveland is in second place with 76 penalties accepted, but the Browns have had 140 fewer snaps than the Chiefs have.

The Chiefs are also in first (or last) place in the number of penalties flagged in total, with 101. (17 penalties were declined or offsetting).

(Fun fact for conspiracy theorists - Pittsburgh is the third most penalized team in the league)

28 of our 84 penalties have been pre-snap penalties.

Here is a list of the penalties we've had accepted against us more than once, how many times we've been flagged for that, and what the league average is.

False Start - 16 (league average 9.84)
Offensive Holding - 15 (11.78)
Defensive Holding - 11 (3.81)
Defensive Pass Interference - 6 (4.09)
Defensive Offside - 4 (2.88)
Defensive Too Many Men on the Field - 4 (0.81)
Unsportsmanlike Conduct - 4 (1.28)
Encroachment - 3 (0.72)
Illegal block above the waist - 3 (3.09)
Illegal use of the hands - 3 (1.34)
Intentional grounding - 2 (0.59)
Neutral zone infraction - 2 (2.66)
Offensive pass interference - 2 (1.38)
Roughing the passer - 2 (2.06)

So, obviously anyone can see that we're way over the league average in almost every type of penalty, especially False Start and Defensive Holding.

The penalties are out of control.

[notorious]

I am surprised that our D Holding and D PI are that low. (even though we are way higher than the average).

[Eleazar]

Chiefs' current penalty standings:

Fisher - 6
Erving - 5
Nelson - 5
Scandrick - 5
Kelce - 5
Ford - 5
Jones - 4
LDT - 4
Schwartz - 3

Those names account for half the accepted penalties on the team this year - the other 44 players have been flagged a total of 42 times.

The player with the most of any one type of penalty is Scandrick, with 6 defensive holding calls. The next is Erving with 5 offensive holding calls.

[Donger]

It was Ford, and its an automatic penalty this year. I've seen it in several non chiefs games

That's nice.

[htismaqe]

The Chiefs are the most penalized team in the league, at the moment, having had 84 penalties accepted against them. Cleveland is in second place with 76 penalties accepted, but the Browns have had 140 fewer snaps than the Chiefs have.

The Chiefs are also in first (or last) place in the number of penalties flagged in total, with 101. (17 penalties were declined or offsetting).

(Fun fact for conspiracy theorists - Pittsburgh is the third most penalized team in the league)

28 of our 84 penalties have been pre-snap penalties.

Here is a list of the penalties we've had accepted against us more than once, how many times we've been flagged for that, and what the league average is.

False Start - 16 (league average 9.84)
Offensive Holding - 15 (11.78)
Defensive Holding - 11 (3.81)
Defensive Pass Interference - 6 (4.09)
Defensive Offside - 4 (2.88)
Defensive Too Many Men on the Field - 4 (0.81)
Unsportsmanlike Conduct - 4 (1.28)
Encroachment - 3 (0.72)
Illegal block above the waist - 3 (3.09)
Illegal use of the hands - 3 (1.34)
Intentional grounding - 2 (0.59)
Neutral zone infraction - 2 (2.66)
Offensive pass interference - 2 (1.38)
Roughing the passer - 2 (2.06)

So, obviously anyone can see that we're way over the league average in almost every type of penalty, especially False Start and Defensive Holding.

The penalties are out of control.

Undisciplined. The line has had a ton of injuries and the defensive backfield has been trying to overcome a gaping hole at safety.

I'd love to think it's going to get better but Fisher was terrible yesterday and for all of his flashy good plays, Nelson is still a DPI waiting to happen on nearly every play.

[htismaqe]

Can someone explain the roughing the passer penalty on Ford or Houston (don't remember who it was)? He barely touched the Cardinals' QBs helmet.

Forearm touched helmet. Blow to the head is ALWAYS roughing. Even in previous years - it's not new.

[MahiMike]

Yall have Mahomes. What's the issue here again? What is there to be worried about? Really.

This. Penalties are our handicap gift to the rest of the league to make things fair. We're an 8 handicap right now.

[Eleazar]

I wish there were a way to see how many drives were effectively killed by an offensive holding call. It would be interesting to see a breakdown of the game situations, what down and distance the holding call created, what it called back, some evaluation of whether the holding call affected the play or not, and if we converted for a first down or if the drive ended there. It seems like an outsized number of our drives get killed by offensive penalties.

Perhaps it's not any greater than any other undisciplined team that leads the league in flags but it seems like it is.

[htismaqe]

Fisher has been penalized for holding only 3 times this year. TWO of them happened yesterday. :eek:

[Eleazar]

Fisher's penalties so far

Week 1 - nothing
Week 2 - False Start (1)
Week 3 - nothing
Week 4 - False Start (2)
Week 5 - Holding (1)
Week 6 - Illegal use of the hands (1)
Week 7 - nothing
Week 8 - nothing
Week 9 - nothing
Week 10 - Holding (2) (one was declined)

[Eleazar]

We are currently the league's biggest offender at Defensive Holding. No surprise, bad personnel in the secondary. We're also the worst offender in unsportsmanlike conduct and 12 men on the field... silly needless discipline issues.

We're near the top in offensive holding as well, but in a surprise for the CP conspiracy theorists, Pittsburgh - who we perceive as getting away with holding constantly - has been penalized for holding more times than the Chiefs have. Pittsburgh has had more flags thrown against them for offensive holding and more holding penalties accepted than the Chiefs.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

And here we FUCKIN go again . 5 penalties and in the 1st fucking QTR

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

7 and counting ,1st fucking qtr

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

8 , 1st qtr

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

9 , wait they took it back . good job Andy with a challenge

[Sofa King]

This shit is outrageous.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Penalty count is 10-1. we shut that shit down ,mahomes will lead us to victory.

[Reerun_KC]

When you coach is undisciplined with his weight. The team will be undisciplined.

[GloryDayz]

When you coach is undisciplined with his weight. The team will be undisciplined.When you have an owner who rolls with punches.....

Sent from my 9+ using Tapatalk

[Eleazar]

Another week in the books and another slew of penalties to analyze.

Chiefs had 16 penalties called last night (13 accepted). Rams had 10 called (8 accepted)

vs Rams:
Scandrick - 2 (DPI, holding)
Murray - 2 (un. roughness, holding)
Erving - 2 (false start, holding)
Nelson - 2 (illegal use of hands, DPI)
Ford - neutral zone
Nnadi - neutral zone
Lucas - illegal block
Harris - illegal block
Ware - illegal block
Hitchens - holding
Sherman - un. roughness
Hill - taunting


The Chiefs are still leading the league in penalties. We've had 97 penalties accepted against us (117 called) so far. Pittsburgh is second, with 78 accepted penalties. (we've played 1 more game than they have)

31 (32%) of our penalties are pre-snap penalties.
23 (24%) have been committed by offensive linemen
22 (23%) have been committed by defensive backs


All the penalties we've had called more than 2 times: (league average)
17 - False Start (10.69)
16 - Offensive Holding (12.75)
11 - Defensive Holding (4.28)
8 - DPI (4.38)
6 - Illegal Block (3.47)
4 - Offside (3)
4 - 12 men on the field (0.81)
4 - Encroachment (0.84)
4 - Illegal use of the hands (1.5)
4 - Unsportsmanlike conduct (1.47)
3 - Neutral zone (2.84)


Chiefs Penalty Leaders - number accepted (all penalties called)

Erving - 7 (6 holding, 3 false start, 1 unnecessary roughness)
Nelson - 7 (4 DPI, 3 holding, 1 illegal use of hands, 1 offside)
Scandrick - 6 (7 holding, 2 DPI)
Fisher - 6 (3 false start, 3 holding, 1 illegal use of hands)
Ford - 6 (2 offside, 1 neutral zone, 1 roughing passer, 1 unsportsmanlike, 1 taunting)
Kelce - 5 (3 false start, 2 OPI, 1 illegal block)

[UK_Chief]

The taunting and unsportsmanlike BS has to go. Seriously do that once a season then fine players if it keeps happening, it’s BS

[scho63]

Who got called for that bullshit block in the back on either a punt or kickoff where all he did was touch the guy's back with his one hand. Not even a block! He gave a love tap that never changed the direction or momentum of the Ram's player.

[Mecca]

If you want them to get less penalties you should probably hope they move the team then. Andy's teams never got a ton of penalties in Philly as they do here..it's not him, it's market size.

[Mile High Mania]

If you want them to get less penalties you should probably hope they move the team then. Andy's teams never got a ton of penalties in Philly as they do here..it's not him, it's market size.

Yeah, you totally nailed this one.

Ranks from least to most penalties per game:
2012 - PHI ranked 12th in PEN PG
2011 - PHI ranked 23rd
2010 - PHI ranked 29th
2009 - PHI ranked 31st
2008 - PHI ranked 9th
2007 - PHI ranked 12th
2006 - PHI ranked 29th
2005 - PHI ranked 27th
2004 - PHI ranked 24th
2003 - PHI ranked 8th

[Eleazar]

Who got called for that bullshit block in the back on either a punt or kickoff where all he did was touch the guy's back with his one hand. Not even a block! He gave a love tap that never changed the direction or momentum of the Ram's player.

That was Lucas I think? Tough call against him, yeah - it looked like he had his hand on the guy when he dove at the ball carrier so it looked like a push from a distance.

[GloryDayz]

If you want them to get less penalties you should probably hope they move the team then. Andy's teams never got a ton of penalties in Philly as they do here..it's not him, it's market size.

It can't be that, I've been told Chunt is one of the most respected owners in the league. You don't suppose that it's not so much respect as an appreciation that he doesn't demand to be treated equally?

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

11 moar against the Raiders

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Erving commits a dumbass penalty every week

[Reerun_KC]

Team can’t be disciplined when the HC isn’t.

[In58men]

Team can’t be disciplined when the HC isn’t.

Da faq


ROFL

[ModSocks]

Da faq


ROFL

I'm sad that the line between Reerun and RunKC is starting to get blurred to the point where i can't tell their bad posts apart from each other anymore.

[Frazod]

At one point yesterday Fisher got a false start penalty for basically moving his ass up about three inches. Was it noticeable? Sure. I saw it.

Was it as noticeable as when offensive linemen who play for LA teams dance all over the place? Not even close.

This team isn't undisciplined. It's just not from a big market.

[Reerun_KC]

Da faq


ROFL

Golden Corral disputes your da faq....

[NJChiefsFan]

Chiefs are taking a penalty every 20 plays. LA every 23. Steelers are actually 3rd most. I'm sure a number of factors play into this but are we really saying none of this is KC's fault? It's all the refs? We are 4th in pre-snap penalties. While last night is a great example of how it can be screwed up, in general pre-snap penalties are pretty black and white.

[Eleazar]

After 12 games, we still lead the NFL in penalties. We've had 108 penalties accepted against us. #2 is Buffalo with 100 and #3 is Pittsburgh with 90.

The gap between the Chiefs and the league average, which would be about 80, is wide.

This was the 6th game out of 12 that the Chiefs were assessed more than 10 penalties, and was tied for the third most penalized game this season

---


Against Oakland:

13 penalties called (11 were accepted)

Erving (2) - Unnecessary Roughness, False Start
Mahomes - Illegal Forward Pass
Ford - Neutral Zone
Murray - Unsportsmanlike Conduct
Fuller - DPI
Dieter - Holding
Parker - Defensive Holding
Niemann - Holding
Conley - Holding
Scandrick - DPI
Morse - Holding
Jones - Offside

(Oakland had 12 penalties called, and 9 accepted)

---

Chiefs Penalty Leaderboard through Week 13

Erving - 9
Scandrick - 7
Nelson - 7
Ford - 7
Fisher - 6


Pre-Snap Penalty Leaderboard

Jones - 6
Erving - 4
Ford - 4
Fisher, Kelce, Conley, Nnadi - 3


Most common penalties called against the Chiefs:

Offensive Holding - 20
False Start - 18
Defensive Holding - 11
DPI - 10
Illegal block in the back - 6

[GloryDayz]

At one point yesterday Fisher got a false start penalty for basically moving his ass up about three inches. Was it noticeable? Sure. I saw it.

Was it as noticeable as when offensive linemen who play for LA teams dance all over the place? Not even close.

This team isn't undisciplined. It's just not from a big market.

I've gotta admit, this BULLSHIT where the guard is allowed to twerk and give the center a reach-around before the snap is total crap!

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Its a joke how much this team is flagged. Meanwhile NE is allowed to get away with murder on both sides of the ball. They call what they WANT to see. Discipline!!

[GloryDayz]

Its a joke how much this team is flagged. Meanwhile NE is allowed to get away with murder on both sides of the ball. They call what they WANT to see. Discipline!!Home league advantage....

Sent from my 9+ using Tapatalk

[scho63]

At one point yesterday Fisher got a false start penalty for basically moving his ass up about three inches. Was it noticeable? Sure. I saw it.

Was it as noticeable as when offensive linemen who play for LA teams dance all over the place? Not even close.

This team isn't undisciplined. It's just not from a big market.

Fisher must talk to that San Diego lineman who false starts 10x's a game and gets called zero......he must have photos of the officials wives or something. :hmmm:

[UK_Chief]

Arians literally made my ears bleed yesterday. I've never been so annoyed with an announcer. I mean, some of them drive me nuts, but this guy has elevated the suck to astronomical levels. I can't stand listening to him. He was as actively rooting against the Chiefs as you could possibly do in a broadcast. Yech...

Literally?! Shit man!

[UK_Chief]

At one point yesterday Fisher got a false start penalty for basically moving his ass up about three inches. Was it noticeable? Sure. I saw it.

Was it as noticeable as when offensive linemen who play for LA teams dance all over the place? Not even close.

This team isn't undisciplined. It's just not from a big market.

If I was bent over in front on Mahomes I’d damn sure move my ass up 3 inches. Probably back up on it too

[stevieray]

If I was bent over in front on Mahomes I’d damn sure move my ass up 3 inches. Probably back up on it too

STFU

[scho63]

Fisher must talk to that San Diego lineman who false starts 10x's a game and gets called zero......he must have photos of the officials wives or something. :hmmm:

That guy had another blatant false start against the Steelers that wasn't called and San Diego scored a TD.

He was two seconds ahead of the snap. WTF???

[Eleazar]

Its a joke how much this team is flagged. Meanwhile NE is allowed to get away with murder on both sides of the ball. They call what they WANT to see. Discipline!!

Yes, clearly it's that legendary love affair between Roger Goodell and Tom Brady...

[Pasta Little Brioni]

You've gone loon cochise. Never watch a Patriot game? Their entire game plan is to grab away in the secondary. Never get called cause "discipline" or some shit

[Fish]

Its a joke how much this team is flagged. Meanwhile NE is allowed to get away with murder on both sides of the ball. They call what they WANT to see. Discipline!!

Or maybe some teams are just more disciplined than others.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

ROFL we already knew Vincent Kennedy Goodell hooked you, Fish

[Eleazar]

Or maybe some teams are just more disciplined than others.

Impossible. Anything that goes against the Chiefs means that the world is out to get us.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Cochise and Fish: "It's still real to me damnit"

[Mecca]

You've gone loon cochise. Never watch a Patriot game? Their entire game plan is to grab away in the secondary. Never get called cause "discipline" or some shit

They were raping Minnesota's WR's....to the point that Adam Theilen wanted to beat down Belichick..it's not everyday you see a player and the other teams coach scream at each other.

[stevieray]

They were raping Minnesota's WR's....to the point that Adam Theilen wanted to beat down Belichick..it's not everyday you see a player and the other teams coach scream at each other.

I caught a glimpse of that and wondered what it was...good for Theilen.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

They were raping Minnesota's WR's....to the point that Adam Theilen wanted to beat down Belichick..it's not everyday you see a player and the other teams coach scream at each other.

But but but Fish says those are legal for them because Collinsworth tells him they are allowed to get by with it

[NJChiefsFan]

They were raping Minnesota's WR's....to the point that Adam Theilen wanted to beat down Belichick..it's not everyday you see a player and the other teams coach scream at each other.

From what a student said to me the issue was theilen thought they were faking an injury to stop their momentum. Not sure if true considering the source.

[Fish]

But but but Fish says those are legal for them because Collinsworth tells him they are allowed to get by with it

https://i.imgur.com/MQbmNNw.gif

[JakeF]

The penalties won't stop until Andy Reid makes them stop. As long as Andy is lazy about discipline all the penalties and sloppy stuff will continue.

[GloryDayz]

The penalties won't stop until Andy Reid makes them stop. As long as Andy is lazy about discipline all the penalties and sloppy stuff will continue.Andy ending silly penalties (no matter what their root cause is) is day-to-day..

Sent from my 9+ using Tapatalk

[Reerun_KC]

Andy ending silly penalties (no matter what their root cause is) is day-to-day..

Sent from my 9+ using Tapatalk

/thread

[Eleazar]

From what a student said to me the issue was theilen thought they were faking an injury to stop their momentum. Not sure if true considering the source.

That's correct. Theilen was angry that Patrick Chung conveniently collapsed with an injury right when the Pats needed to see a replay and decide if Murray had converted on 4th down or if they should challenge the spot. Theilen himself said so.

Had nothing to do with "raping the WRs" as Mecca, guru of all things, thinks.

No word on whether they were using a toilet brush on the Vikings' WRs.

[crayzkirk]

In order to stop the penalties, the Chiefs are going to have to play extra clean. Once your team gets the reputation of committing lots of penalties, the zebras will be looking for a reason to call them.

Of course, being slow and having to grab the other player on defense or never turning your head to look for the ball doesn't help much either.

[Eleazar]

In order to stop the penalties, the Chiefs are going to have to play extra clean. Once your team gets the reputation of committing lots of penalties, the zebras will be looking for a reason to call them.

Of course, being slow and having to grab the other player on defense or never turning your head to look for the ball doesn't help much either.

The top offenders are players who just aren't very good. Erving, Scandrick, Nelson, etc. They're being asked to do more than they are capable of, and penalties are the result.

[WhiteWhale]

I always break penalties down into two categories.

1. Aggressive penalties. Good defenses are usually penalized a bit more than average with false starts and a bit of over-aggressive DB play. You don't like them, but they're tolerable.

2. Stupid sloppy penalties - These are the ones that kill you. 3rd down holding (offense and defense) false starts, delay of game, and personal fouls.

KC has too many of both.

[highBOLTage]

That's correct. Theilen was angry that Patrick Chung conveniently collapsed with an injury right when the Pats needed to see a replay and decide if Murray had converted on 4th down or if they should challenge the spot. Theilen himself said so.

Had nothing to do with "raping the WRs" as Mecca, guru of all things, thinks.

No word on whether they were using a toilet brush on the Vikings' WRs.

Yep, it was a terrible spot by the refs. Belichick challenged but lost. Gave the Vikings a first down.