Spagnuolo -He's fielded some terrible defenses?

[BlackOp]

I'm not trying to shit in anyone's pillowcase here...but I decided to take a quick look into his history. It's kind of frightening...

Obviously, he has the infamous ring from beating the 16-0 Patriots. This deserves props for sure...but...

He also was the DC for the 2012 Saints that fielded the worst defense in modern NFL history...Yikes. He was fired after only one season.

As a HC, he had 1-15 and 2-14 seasons with the Rams.

In 2015 he became the DC for the Giants again...and they finished dead last in defense that year. The next year they finished 3-13 and was fired again...

Umm...not sure what to make of this...other than he's not Sutton.

He's been the DC for two different teams that ranked dead last in defense. One was the worst in history...

Thoughts?

[TwistedChief]

Uhm, we know?

This was frequently cited when we hired the guy and why the vast majority of this board was very 'meh' on him overall.

Since then though, we've made some solid assistant coach hires and re-tooled the defense, and given how miserable the defense was last season, I think most of us feel pretty optimistic that there will at least be *some* improvement. And that's really all that's standing in the way of this team and a Super Bowl.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

For how shitty our defense was last year, we weren’t the worst. We were 31st. Only the Bengals were somehow worse than us

[T-post Tom]

Read the backstory.

[BlackOp]

For how shitty our defense was last year, we weren’t the worst. We were 31st. Only the Bengals were somehow worse than us

I think it deserves to be acknowledged that Sutton never fielded a last place defense. Spagnuolo fielded the worst in history...even Greg Robinson didn't achieve that dubious honor.

I know the Saints were in turmoil that year with Payton being suspended...but he also had the 32nd defense with the Giants in 2015.

He did win a SB with a decent Giants defense...so there's that. I dont know...*shrugs*

[New World Order]

He has a pretty good track record of taking DC or HC jobs and improving defenses:

-First stint in NY they went from 24th in defensive ppg to 5th

-HC with the Rams they went from 31st in defensive ppg to 19th in ppg

-Second stint with NY Giants they went from 30th in defensive ppg to 2nd in ppg

The two bad seasons he had at coordinator were throwaway years where the team quit on Mcadoo (their offense averaged 15 frickin' points) and the other was Bountygate suspensions year with NO.

[BlackOp]

Uhm, we know?

This was frequently cited when we hired the guy and why the vast majority of this board was very 'meh' on him overall.

Since then though, we've made some solid assistant coach hires and re-tooled the defense, and given how miserable the defense was last season, I think most of us feel pretty optimistic that there will at least be *some* improvement. And that's really all that's standing in the way of this team and a Super Bowl.

I didn't follow the hiring that closely...just assumed with Reid's insider connections that he was, at least, an improvement.

I was just kind of shocked by his history...I was like "wait a second."

KC was a few late defensive stops from being undefeated and SB bound. They dont need to improve that much...here's to hoping.

[carcosa]

Is Spags a Jesuit?????

[xztop123]

It’s weird he seems to interview really well and his hires thus far have been very good for assistants.

I don’t know how devoid of talent his teams were. The pats always have a decent d with good coaching no matter the roster turnover

Good defensive coaches always seem to field decent defenses

[xztop123]

I think there is major potential for this to hurt us.

You have to remember that our defense suffered because we scored so many points. Teams were opening up their offenses right away. (Also the reason why we had so many sacks despite not that great of a pass rush)

we only look at the loses and view the defense as “can’t get worse”—- however the d did some good things in a few of our wins.

Run d in the pats game was pathetic and inexcusable so ultimately the right choice was made. It’s just that the choice comes with risk, don’t think it’s a risk free no-brainer

The only defense area I would say is objectively improved without risk for regression is the safety spot.

[BlackOp]

Is Spags a Jesuit?????

Josh McDaniels is (John Carroll University)...interesting that Kraft has been involved in donations to The College of the Holy Cross and Boston College...both Jesuit. This is not normal for someone that is Jewish...make of it what you want. I see a strange cross-pollination of interests.

It's all the same shit..elites controlling the mouth-breathers. They dont believe any of the religious connotations..that's a front.

Anyway..

Non-profit rejects Kraft's $100k donation...funny how this didn't make the news. The national media has gone dark on Kraft's prostitution bust...good to have powerful friends in high places...especially those inside the Cleveland police.

“The last thing I wanted was a donation from Robert Kraft,” Moynihan told The Globe. “I could not be silent. I had to stand up.”

https://www.masslive.com/patriots/2019/05/non-profit-rejects-robert-krafts-100000-donation-due-to-new-england-patriots-owners-prostitution-allegations-report.html

[Nickhead]

it all depends on whom you inherit from the previous regime:thumb:

where as five years after sutton arrived his defense got worse and worse :D

[BlackOp]

it all depends on whom you inherit from the previous regime:thumb:

where as five years after sutton arrived his defense got worse and worse :D

There is some truth to that...once Poe left, DJ blew his Achilles, Houston got punked by Parker...Berry being Berry and Hali getting old. This defense fell apart....it was top 10 before.

[007]

Do you really think he will be worse than last years defense? If they move up to 20-25, I'll be thrilled.

[penchief]

I think his hire is about more than whether or not he's consistently fielded good defenses. He brings positive energy and good coaching. Sutton's defense was all about scheme. There was no fire. And when the defense failed, it failed miserably because there was nothing else to hang your hat on.

Spagnuolo is going to at least coach them up and make sure they play with sound technique and fundamentals. He also brings a fire that all good defenses have and need. The position coaches bring a similar approach to teaching and accountability.

Defense is about attitude as much as anything. Spagnuolo's coaching style suited the culture change the defense desperately needed.

[Nickhead]

Do you really think he will be worse than last years defense? If they move up to 20-25, I'll be thrilled.

i predict no worse than 18th worst :D

[Nickhead]

There is some truth to that...once Poe left, DJ blew his Achilles, Houston got punked by Parker...Berry being Berry and Hali getting old. This defense fell apart....it was top 10 before.

dont get me started on head coaches that rode the coat tails of previous captains...

gruden
switzer
that 9er's coach
yada yada yada... :D

[staylor26]

When Spags has had a good situation with talent, he’s been successful. When he hasn’t, he has not been successful.

It’s really that simple. He’s probably in the best situation he’s ever been when you consider who his HC is, the staff he has around him, and the front offices ability to aggressively add talent.

[farmerchief]

When Spags has had a good situation with talent, he’s been successful. When he hasn’t, he has not been successful.

It’s really that simple. He’s probably in the best situation he’s ever been when you consider who his HC is, the staff he has around him, and the front offices ability to aggressively add talent.

Plus, the year or so he was away from coaching, recently, according to him, he studied a lot on the changing offenses in the NFL/College, seeing what he might do different. Seems like he was just not out fishing when he was away from coaching. Hopefully, he did attain some new ideas, but I think the key is the coaching staff he has assembled. No way to go but up with this defense.

[Jimmya]

I didn't like his hire, but really liked the defensive assistants hired so hopefully it works out.

[LoneWolf]

Maybe if BlackOp didn’t have his head so far up his ass with all of his NFL conspiracy bullshit that he drags into almost every thread, he would have realized this has already been discussed thoroughly when Spags was hired.

[tredadda]

I'm not trying to shit in anyone's pillowcase here...but I decided to take a quick look into his history. It's kind of frightening...

Obviously, he has the infamous ring from beating the 16-0 Patriots. This deserves props for sure...but...

He also was the DC for the 2012 Saints that fielded the worst defense in modern NFL history...Yikes. He was fired after only one season.

As a HC, he had 1-15 and 2-14 seasons with the Rams.

In 2015 he became the DC for the Giants again...and they finished dead last in defense that year. The next year they finished 3-13 and was fired again...

Umm...not sure what to make of this...other than he's not Sutton.

He's been the DC for two different teams that ranked dead last in defense. One was the worst in history...

Thoughts?

Thing is no one expects him to turn this defense into the 1985 Bears or 2000 Ravens. We just need to field at best a middle of the pack defense and not give up three straight 3rd and 10s when it matters most at home in the AFCCG. We also need a defense good enough to allow us to win when we score 40+ points in a game.

[dirk digler]

When Spags has had a good situation with talent, he’s been successful. When he hasn’t, he has not been successful.

It’s really that simple. He’s probably in the best situation he’s ever been when you consider who his HC is, the staff he has around him, and the front offices ability to aggressively add talent.


That probably applies to every coach ever. Talent ultimately is the decider most of the time when it comes to having a successful team.

[Chris Meck]

I'm not trying to shit in anyone's pillowcase here...but I decided to take a quick look into his history. It's kind of frightening...

Obviously, he has the infamous ring from beating the 16-0 Patriots. This deserves props for sure...but...

He also was the DC for the 2012 Saints that fielded the worst defense in modern NFL history...Yikes. He was fired after only one season.

As a HC, he had 1-15 and 2-14 seasons with the Rams.

In 2015 he became the DC for the Giants again...and they finished dead last in defense that year. The next year they finished 3-13 and was fired again...

Umm...not sure what to make of this...other than he's not Sutton.

He's been the DC for two different teams that ranked dead last in defense. One was the worst in history...

Thoughts?

Really? You just now discovered this?

There's about 100 pages of us all discussing this the week he got hired.

[tyton75]

Regardless of whether you like Spags or not.. you really can't hate on the staff that he's put together. So I'm at.. "so far, so good"

[O.city]

Talent is def important but with limited practice time and such of today’s nfl, coaching is right up there as well

There’s just too many factors into these things to know or be able to say it’s this or that

They’ve given him talent and a great staff of assistants so we’ll see what happens

[dirk digler]

Regardless of whether you like Spags or not.. you really can't hate on the staff that he's put together. So I'm at.. "so far, so good"


Yep I am really excited about the addition of Daly. That was a huge get

[neech]

As bad as we were last year if we move to the 20th overall and below it will be a major victory and beyond expectations on defensive improvement.

And dare I say a probable spot in the SB.

[Titty Meat]

It was a shit hire

[Reerun_KC]

Spagot is god fucking awful.

He’s a JR Sutton.

But he’s new and different so the excuses with fly on CP.

[staylor26]

It was a shit hire

Who would you have hired Billay?

[staylor26]

Spagot is god fucking awful.

He’s a JR Sutton.

But he’s new and different so the excuses with fly on CP.

Idiot.

[O.city]

I mean, it's possible he's bad. He's shown to be bad in the past.

[Reerun_KC]

I mean, it's possible he's bad. He's shown to be bad in the past.

History has a way of repeating itself.

[Chris Meck]

History has a way of repeating itself.

He also shut the undefeated Brady to Moss led Patriots the fuck down in the Super Bowl.

So maybe that part of history will repeat itself too, huh?

[CasselGotPeedOn]

Spagot is god ****ing awful.

He’s a JR Sutton.

But he’s new and different so the excuses with fly on CP.

Damn, I was hoping you died in a plane crash.

[staylor26]

I mean, it's possible he's bad. He's shown to be bad in the past.

Without Spags, you don’t get Daly and House.

There’s no question that was the hire to make now that we’ve seen the staff he’s put together.

It’s not just about Spags. It’s about the defensive staff in general which finally gives the offensive staff a run for their money.

[rabblerouser]

Defense is directly correlative to the talent on the field.

Gunther looked like a genius when he had DT. Neil Smith, Dan Williams, Dan Saleamua, James Hasty, Dale Carter, Mark Collins, and Brian Washington on defense.

He looked like shit in 2004 when he had the same crew that Greg Robinson had, and those same guys looked like shit under Robinson...because they were shit.

It's not complicated. Bob Sutton had the #1 defense in like 2014 because he had way better talent. The 2018 defense had dogshit in the secondary, and outside of Chris Jones, dogshit on the line.

[burt]

Defense is directly correlative to the talent on the field.



I feel very optimistic looking at the player upgrades on D. And as far as Spags....some folks actually learn from their failures. As I said, I am very optimistic....

[Titty Meat]

Who would you have hired Billay?

Bowles or Chris Hewitt

[staylor26]

Bowles or Chris Hewitt

Bowles wasn’t an option. He was going with BA to TB no matter what.

So you provide one other option with no DC experience that likely wouldn’t have been able to put together the staff that Spags did.

Hewitt sounded good on paper, but I’ll take the experience with a better all around staff now that we have hindsight.

[Reerun_KC]

He also shut the undefeated Brady to Moss led Patriots the **** down in the Super Bowl.

So maybe that part of history will repeat itself too, huh?

Maybe. He’s wearing chiefs red and gold now.

[DJ's left nut]

I think it deserves to be acknowledged that Sutton never fielded a last place defense. Spagnuolo fielded the worst in history...even Greg Robinson didn't achieve that dubious honor.

I know the Saints were in turmoil that year with Payton being suspended...but he also had the 32nd defense with the Giants in 2015.

He did win a SB with a decent Giants defense...so there's that. I dont know...*shrugs*

Yeah, Imma recommend you re-visit the Spags hiring thread.

He is not a universally lauded hire here on CP. Personally I hated the hire but with the additions to the staff around him, I'm willing to let it play out.

But there is far more excuse-making for Spagnuolo than I am comfortable with, excuses that would've never flied had they been used on Sutton or G-Rob, guys who's bad defenses weren't even as bad as a couple of Spags more ignoble squads.

Spagnuolo isn't a panacea and he isn't a truly brilliant defensive mind. If this defense is going to take a big step forward it will be due to the talent infusion (which is really pretty impressive when you write it all down) and the change in attitudes. Spags isn't gonna come in here and do what Reid has done for the offense.

[Reerun_KC]

Yeah, Imma recommend you re-visit the Spags hiring thread.

He is not a universally lauded hire here on CP. Personally I hated the hire but with the additions to the staff around him, I'm willing to let it play out.

But there is far more excuse-making for Spagnuolo than I am comfortable with, excuses that would've never flied had they been used on Sutton or G-Rob, guys who's bad defenses weren't even as bad as a couple of Spags more ignoble squads.

Spagnuolo isn't a panacea and he isn't a truly brilliant defensive mind. If this defense is going to take a big step forward it will be due to the talent infusion (which is really pretty impressive when you write it all down) and the change in attitudes. Spags isn't gonna come in here and do what Reid has done for the offense.


Solid post regarding Spagot

[Skyy God]

Yeah, Imma recommend you re-visit the Spags hiring thread.

He is not a universally lauded hire here on CP. Personally I hated the hire but with the additions to the staff around him, I'm willing to let it play out.

But there is far more excuse-making for Spagnuolo than I am comfortable with, excuses that would've never flied had they been used on Sutton or G-Rob, guys who's bad defenses weren't even as bad as a couple of Spags more ignoble squads.

Spagnuolo isn't a panacea and he isn't a truly brilliant defensive mind. If this defense is going to take a big step forward it will be due to the talent infusion (which is really pretty impressive when you write it all down) and the change in attitudes. Spags isn't gonna come in here and do what Reid has done for the offense.

I doubt any truly brilliant DCs would want to coach with Andy and MVPat. Quick scoring drives put a ton of pressure on the D to be stout with limited rest.

Spags seems to be energetic, teach fundamentals, and way more likely to make quality 2nd half adjustments. He wasn’t my dream candidate, but I’m ok with the hire.

[DJ's left nut]

I doubt any truly brilliant DCs would want to coach with Andy and MVPat. Quick scoring drives put a ton of pressure on the D to be stout with limited rest.

Spags seems to be energetic, teach fundamentals, and way more likely to make quality 2nd half adjustments. He wasn’t my dream candidate, but I’m ok with the hire.

That's my first instinct, yes.

But then you steal Daley from Belichick for a lateral move when that guy's defensive staff is churning out HCs. And then you get House as a mere position coach when he was an incredibly hot commodity throughout CFB and had the look of a guy on the rise to a big time NCAA DC role as a stepping stone to an NFL DC gig.

These are two guys that had a slew of great jobs to choose from and they chose this one.

That means something and it's why I am willing to chill a bit on the Spags hire. The guys that came in here to work with him are telling.

[O.city]

Kinda wonder if House is the DC in waiting?

[kysirsoze]

If I hadn't seen him spamming every Tyreek thread, I'd think Black Op just awoke from a coma. Weird thread.

[O.city]

That's my first instinct, yes.

But then you steal Daley from Belichick for a lateral move when that guy's defensive staff is churning out HCs. And then you get House as a mere position coach when he was an incredibly hot commodity throughout CFB and had the look of a guy on the rise to a big time NCAA DC role as a stepping stone to an NFL DC gig.

These are two guys that had a slew of great jobs to choose from and they chose this one.

That means something and it's why I am willing to chill a bit on the Spags hire. The guys that came in here to work with him are telling.

I get why they did what they did. Cleaning house pretty much had to be done. It just sucks it had to happen now when they're really ready to push and win.

I wish they'd have just pulled the bandaid last year and got it started but it is what it is.

[ModSocks]

Cleaning house pretty much had to be done.

Great. :rolleyes: Hire a new coach, pay him well AND we have to bathe him too?

[BlackOp]

If I hadn't seen him spamming every Tyreek thread, I'd think Black Op just awoke from a coma. Weird thread.

Spamming?...I was one of like 3 people that called bullshit the moment the news broke. Said it was money related.. I was definitely the first one that suggested Crystal might be crazy...

Were you one of those that voted he should be kicked off the team?

Anyway...I wasn't paying much attention when Spags was hired. Dont remember why...think I was burned out after all the 4th quarter calls benefited the Patriots (again) and NO got hosed.

I didn't watch the SB...figured Kraft controls the NFL so what's the point.

[bowener]

All that will matter is points per game. If he drops the Chiefs 5 ppg this season, that is a huge change. Last year the Chiefs would have been 15-1 if they allowed 5 fewer points per game.

That is exactly what I expect the Chiefs record to be this year if the defense ranks in the low 20s. Anything in the teens to low teens and I think they Chiefs have a chance to go undefeated.

edit: Dropping the Chiefs 5ppg is not likely, btw. That would have ranked them at #9 last season. I think shaving 3pts off could be likely if Spags gets pressure from his DL. That would rank low 20s last season.

[Mecca]

90% of being a great DC is knowing talent, no d is good without high level talent.

[BWillie]

Yes it's a pretty scary hire. The thing that scares me is on paper, he's one of the worst coaches in the NFL as far as history. But head coaches and personnel in the league love him. I don't quite get it. I equate it as a hire of someone in real life who just gets their job because people like them.

[Reerun_KC]

Yes it's a pretty scary hire. The thing that scares me is on paper, he's one of the worst coaches in the NFL as far as history. But head coaches and personnel in the league love him. I don't quite get it. I equate it as a hire of someone in real life who just gets their job because people like them.

People loves Herm and Roleo.

Herm is the worse coach In The history of the NFL and he was loved by many here and the fan base as a whole.

[staylor26]

Yes it's a pretty scary hire. The thing that scares me is on paper, he's one of the worst coaches in the NFL as far as history. But head coaches and personnel in the league love him. I don't quite get it. I equate it as a hire of someone in real life who just gets their job because people like them.

Lol I love how some of you only acknowledge the bad with Spags. How the fuck is he one of the worst coaches in the NFL when he has a SB ring as a DC against one of the greatest offenses in NFL history?

You can say he’s been inconsistent, but to pretend like it’s been all bad with no good is either being disingenuous or ignorant.

[raidersnumber1]

Here's the scoop on Spags. He's still living off his glory from Pats/Giants SB. That was a decade ago. Since that time, NFL offenses have evolved and clearly his defensive strategy has not.

[KC Hawks]

Here's the scoop on Spags. He's still living off his glory from Pats/Giants SB. That was a decade ago. Since that time, NFL offenses have evolved and clearly his defensive strategy has not.

Sounds like Jon Gruden.

[staylor26]

Here's the scoop on Spags. He's still living off his glory from Pats/Giants SB. That was a decade ago. Since that time, NFL offenses have evolved and clearly his defensive strategy has not.

What is Paul Guenther living off? What exactly has he accomplished?

[Lprechaun]

Spags has one job at minimum..... make ONE more stop per game than Suttons defense.
Thats the bare bottom of improvement we need.
Getting this teams defense to 12-15 rank would be spectacular.

[keg in kc]

Yeah this wasn't talked about ad nauseum when he was hired. Not at all.

[PAChiefsGuy]

He obviously has had his ups and downs as a DC but I dont think he is bad. Seems like it is a hit or a miss w this guys Ds. Hopefully here it is a hit or at least average

[htismaqe]

A lot of guys like Spags have spotty records. You have one or two good years and then you’re the savior of the Bengals or Rams or something. These guys have success and then get hired by some team that is impossible to win with.

[raidersnumber1]

Sounds like Jon Gruden.


DELET THIS!!!

[chiefzilla1501]

I'm careful not to overhype the guy. I know the goal is to be better than bad. I dont know if spags is great. But I feel he's better than bad and he's one of those coaches that has actual reasons (not excuses).

Bountygate and mcadoo-gate are legit reasons, not excuses. Bountygate wasn't just about suspensions... It was also the bizarre circumstance of promoting his defense assistant (Joe vitt) to be interim coach. With the giants, mcadoo lost the locker room to such a point that multiple star defense players were fist fighting each other and getting multiple suspensions... From the giants.

In st Louis, he's not cut out to be a head coach.

He definitely hasn't given much reason to have much confidence in him. But there's still a chance he's a decent coach with some really really bad luck.

[chiefzilla1501]

Some potential reasons to be optimistic
-Hired fantastic assistants
-We're already seeing night & day differences in coaching fundamentals
-House in particular can innovate from the college ranks
-Brandon Daly, by the way, will be terrific not just for our Defense but for Mahomes too
-Has incredible track record with DBs, our biggest weakness
-Even if we give up yards & points, we WILL stop the run. Teams will force to pass heavily which plays into Mahomes' hands

But most of all, we might have incredibly lucky timing with Spags' arrival. 2 years ago, the trend was Jim Johnson or wide 9 defense & moving away from Tampa 2 and soft zones. Last year we saw the amoeba front which Daly brings & fits nicely with Spags' style. Our defense is on trend and it might actually be pretty different from what Spags has done in the past.

[jjchieffan]

Defense is directly correlative to the talent on the field.

Gunther looked like a genius when he had DT. Neil Smith, Dan Williams, Dan Saleamua, James Hasty, Dale Carter, Mark Collins, and Brian Washington on defense.

He looked like shit in 2004 when he had the same crew that Greg Robinson had, and those same guys looked like shit under Robinson...because they were shit.

It's not complicated. Bob Sutton had the #1 defense in like 2014 because he had way better talent. The 2018 defense had dogshit in the secondary, and outside of Chris Jones, dogshit on the line.

We drastically changed the defensive talent this year. Do you think that if we had brought in all of this talent and kept Sutton, that the team would have similar or better results that we will get from Spags and his assistants?

[-King-]

I'm not trying to shit in anyone's pillowcase here...but I decided to take a quick look into his history. It's kind of frightening...

Obviously, he has the infamous ring from beating the 16-0 Patriots. This deserves props for sure...but...

He also was the DC for the 2012 Saints that fielded the worst defense in modern NFL history...Yikes. He was fired after only one season.

As a HC, he had 1-15 and 2-14 seasons with the Rams.

In 2015 he became the DC for the Giants again...and they finished dead last in defense that year. The next year they finished 3-13 and was fired again...

Umm...not sure what to make of this...other than he's not Sutton.

He's been the DC for two different teams that ranked dead last in defense. One was the worst in history...

Thoughts?

The NFL paid him off to be a bad DC those seasons. Look at Vegas predictions. It's clear he was paid off.

[ThyKingdomCome15]

He will be better than Sutton. That 3-4ish scheme had guys playing on their heels. This defense will have a noticable edge to it. QB's will be intimidated.

[Easy 6]

Spags defense is going to surprise a great many people

His energy and attitude is going to rub off quickly on these guys, watched a great interview with him from camp in the TC thread... he is dialed in and preaching fundamentals

[mcaj22]

That's my first instinct, yes.

But then you steal Daley from Belichick for a lateral move when that guy's defensive staff is churning out HCs. And then you get House as a mere position coach when he was an incredibly hot commodity throughout CFB and had the look of a guy on the rise to a big time NCAA DC role as a stepping stone to an NFL DC gig.

These are two guys that had a slew of great jobs to choose from and they chose this one.

That means something and it's why I am willing to chill a bit on the Spags hire. The guys that came in here to work with him are telling.

Any hint of succuss on the defensive side probably means a lot of these coaches might only be here one year. House and Daley will easily get plucked for promotions elsewhere.

Also maybe Spags jumps ship to a HC role but no team would be stupid to give him another chance. Hes a terrible HC.

[FAX]

Spagnuololo doesn't have an objectively great track record as a DC ... just certain years when he was able to catch lightning in the bottle that kept him relevant. Which ... when you think about it ... is fine and better than a lot of guys. He also knows Wally which is key, of course.

To me, this all comes down to his ability to bring in the kind of position coaches who actually can make a difference. He's done that and that's cool ...

Apparently, he's also brought more (and a different type of) energy to the club which was desperately needed. That's cool too ...

The main hope lies in the fact that we've retained a few good players and added a few more. Is that enough to be great? Probably not. But if it's good enough to be middle of the pack, we're still the SB favorites in 2019.

On the other hand, maybe the stars will align for Spaggy again and he'll deliver a top 5 unit. Could happen. As a Certified Class-A Homer, I expect that it will.

FAX

[WhiteWhale]

Not a spags fan.

I like the staff.

I like the moves, but our CB's suck.

[BlackOp]

I was, obviously, out of the "loop" when they hired him...I guess watching the Patriots getting all the 4th quarter calls made me tune out...and not really give a shit about the NFL "product".

If he can get one more stop a game than Sutton...Chiefs should be in good shape.

It's going to come down to how long the NFL wants to perpetuate Brady's career...and keep giving them key breaks. Judging by the lowest SB ratings in 10 years...people are sick of it. Little "Bobby" getting snared in a sex trafficking bust didn't really help his cause ...he may rule the NFL but that's a bad optic that will certainly get drummed up SB week. If he wants a 7th ring...he'll get one though.

Brady's 42...so this is really his last season. IMO. I dont care if your diet only consists of Jesus tears and infant blood. Gronk/Hogan are gone....and they have a bunch of inexperienced skill position players they are working in. It's going to take a herculean gymnastic effort by the officials to manufacture another SB birth.

Jets are going to be a better team this year...I'm kind of expecting them to put some heat on NE. We'll see...Bell and Darnold's 2nd season.

[TwistedChief]

To me, this all comes down to his ability to bring in the kind of position coaches who actually can make a difference. He's done that and that's cool ...


I agree with you here but I also think we're all dealing with some serious revisionist history. Maybe I'm alone, but I don't think I've ever gauged or even considered the competency of a coordinator by the defensive line or linebackers coaches that he brought in. Maybe this situation is different as it seems like our players were just so lacking in basic fundamentals? Or maybe we were just happy that Spags surrounded himself with people whom we probably would've been more excited about had they actually gotten the job of DC themselves?

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Oh my god let's just play football already. I swear to God, living in this room full of sports psychologist is enough to make a person want to slit their fucking wrist from time to time.

And no, I'm not going to indulge you so fuck off thanks.

[staylor26]

I agree with you here but I also think we're all dealing with some serious revisionist history. Maybe I'm alone, but I don't think I've ever gauged or even considered the competency of a coordinator by the defensive line or linebackers coaches that he brought in. Maybe this situation is different as it seems like our players were just so lacking in basic fundamentals? Or maybe we were just happy that Spags surrounded himself with people whom we probably would've been more excited about had they actually gotten the job of DC themselves?

No, it’s simply because putting this kind of staff together is rare and nobody expected it.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

No, it’s simply because putting this kind of staff together is rare and nobody expected it.

VERY rare. Everything about defense is the sum of its parts, and that includes the coaching staff as well. We're finishing in the top 10.

[staylor26]

Any hint of succuss on the defensive side probably means a lot of these coaches might only be here one year. House and Daley will easily get plucked for promotions elsewhere.

Also maybe Spags jumps ship to a HC role but no team would be stupid to give him another chance. Hes a terrible HC.

This is just flat out not true and silly. If Daly and House get DC jobs after one year, that likely means our defense was fucking amazing and we won the SB.

If all it takes is a “hint of success”, both of those guys would already have NFL DC jobs. Hewitt would have a DC job after the Ravens success last year. Daly is coming off a SB win where his DL greatly overachieved and shined throughout the post season. The truth is, HC’s usually go with experienced former NFL DC’s over position coaches (unless they’re hiring from within to replace a DC that’s leaving and have continuity, or the DC gets a HC job and brings one of his assistant to be a DC).

A typical stupid/pessimistic take from you I’d say.

[Mecca]

If we're being 100% honest, when Spags fielded a good D it was all about the line and the Chiefs DL talent is high, just go down the list of starters and backups and look and the production and where all those guys were drafted.

Daly's good at his job if he unlocks the talent of some of these guys this line has top tier potential.

[chiefzilla1501]

I agree with you here but I also think we're all dealing with some serious revisionist history. Maybe I'm alone, but I don't think I've ever gauged or even considered the competency of a coordinator by the defensive line or linebackers coaches that he brought in. Maybe this situation is different as it seems like our players were just so lacking in basic fundamentals? Or maybe we were just happy that Spags surrounded himself with people whom we probably would've been more excited about had they actually gotten the job of DC themselves?

When Reid first came to KC he talked about how he had white board sessions with Nagy and Childress. He asked Nagy to scout the pros and Childress to scout high school and college. He told them to throw at him every single look they've seen. I don't think spags is married to a specific scheme. Daly has a creative look for the front 7 that will help evolve spags' scheme. House brings a ton of insights from college. If I'm being honest... Yeah, I agree they could be better DCs than spags himself. But I also see the possibility that they might be just the guys to tweak spags' scheme just enough to make it really effective. I'm really intrigued what his scheme looks like throwing in a bellichick front.

[mcaj22]

This is just flat out not true and silly. If Daly and House get DC jobs after one year, that likely means our defense was ****ing amazing and we won the SB.

If all it takes is a “hint of success”, both of those guys would already have NFL DC jobs. Hewitt would have a DC job after the Ravens success last year. Daly is coming off a SB win where his DL greatly overachieved and shined throughout the post season. The truth is, HC’s usually go with experienced former NFL DC’s over position coaches (unless they’re hiring from within to replace a DC that’s leaving and have continuity, or the DC gets a HC job and brings one of his assistant to be a DC).

A typical stupid/pessimistic take from you I’d say.

Chiefs were fielding first round playoff exits with Alex Smith and coaches were getting plucked and promoted to other teams.

So yea, hint of success. If that defense even looks like it has a pulse this year teams will take notice.

[RaidersOftheCellar]

Reid and Veach have given me no reason not to trust their judgment. I don't think they're taking a casual approach to this, especially after their golden boy threw a tantrum following the AFCC. As someone said, Spagnuolo supposedly has spent time studying the game and the new trends. They must be convinced that he has some tricks up his sleeve. That and the fact that it's clear that we needed someone fiery to do this job. If we had someone who got in their faces and held them accountable the last few years, that alone might have bumped them up several rankings.

But the position coaches are definitely something to be excited about. I think there are plenty of reasons to expect at least a decent defense.

[RealSNR]

Chiefs were fielding first round playoff exits with Alex Smith and coaches were getting plucked and promoted to other teams.



So yea, hint of success. If that defense even looks like it has a pulse this year teams will take notice.


Wish they would have taken notice when Bob Sutton fielded an okay defense his first year in KC. Would have saved us a LOOOOT of heartache and trouble

[staylor26]

Chiefs were fielding first round playoff exits with Alex Smith and coaches were getting plucked and promoted to other teams.

So yea, hint of success. If that defense even looks like it has a pulse this year teams will take notice.

:facepalm:

Yea two, Nagy and Pederson, offensive coaches/play callers. Even when our defense was good, nobody was getting “plucked and promoted”.