Chris Jones threatens to Hold Out

[Dante84]

Well shit.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Or I won’t play. <a href="https://twitter.com/LeVeonBell?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@LeVeonBell</a> told me about this</p>&mdash; Chris Jones (@StoneColdJones) <a href="https://twitter.com/StoneColdJones/status/1278139847623028739?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 1, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


UPDATE 7/12/20: Things are looking good!


<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I&#39;m not saying this means anything, but I&#39;m also not here to tell <a href="https://twitter.com/RealMNchiefsfan?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@RealMNchiefsfan</a> he can&#39;t choose to believe. <a href="https://t.co/I93PzdsUNm">pic.twitter.com/I93PzdsUNm</a></p>&mdash; Joshua Brisco (@jbbrisco) <a href="https://twitter.com/jbbrisco/status/1282298216592150529?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 12, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>



UPDATE 7/14: Looks Done!

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Breaking: <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Chiefs?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Chiefs</a> and DT Chris Jones have reached agreement on a contract extension, per <a href="https://twitter.com/mortreport?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@mortreport</a>.</p>&mdash; NFL Update (@MySportsUpdate) <a href="https://twitter.com/MySportsUpdate/status/1283090133173121025?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 14, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[suzzer99]

I wonder what happens to his franchise tag if there's no season? Does it just carry over to the next year?

Because it sure looks like they're all going to be sitting out. We're going in the exact wrong direction right now.

Supposedly MLB was going to cancel the season today but I guess it didn't happen.

[kcclone]

It’s a tough situation made worse by Covid revenue uncertainty.

I can’t really blame him but I seriously doubt he walks on $16m.

I don’t see any reason why he’d go to training camp though

[wazu]

I can't hate on the guy. Showed up in the Super Bowl and was a big part of why we won. I don't think we have anywhere near the cap room, though. Nothing can be allowed to jeopardize our ability to sign Mahomes. Nothing.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

If he wants to be that greedy . fuck him. I have no sympathy for anybody that will bitch about making more money in one year than I'll make in my lifetime. Fuck him and trade him to the Bengals and let him rot.

[Dante84]

If he wants to be that greedy . **** him. I have no sympathy for anybody that will bitch about making more money in one year than I'll make in my lifetime. **** him and trade him to the Bengals and let him rot.

Know the difference between 16 Million & 20 Million?

4 Million. That’s a Lot to leave on the table. It’s all relative.

[Pablo]

Know the difference between 16 Million & 20 Million?

4 Million. That’s a Lot to leave on the table. It’s all relative.

Do it in increments he understands. Imagine you've got to stroke 20 hogs off but you only get to keep the juice from 16. Still feel like jacking those last four?

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Know the difference between 16 Million & 20 Million?

4 Million. That’s a Lot to leave on the table. It’s all relative.

Sure is if you're a greedy mother fucker! Be a team player and make 120 million over the next ten years. Think you can feed your great, great, great, great grandkids on that???

[HayWire]

Do it in increments he understands. Imagine you've got to stroke 20 hogs off but you only get to keep the juice from 16. Still feel like jacking those last four?

Wrong Hog

[Coogs]

Know the difference between 16 Million & 20 Million?

4 Million. That’s a Lot to leave on the table. It’s all relative.

Not playing and leaving 16 Million on the table is a lot too.

[Chief Northman]

Methinks the Chiefs are not for long for Chris.

The locker room basketball story I think is a tip of the iceberg situation about this guy.

[srvy]

Dammit, Chris bad timing in this uncertainty. If there is a season play your ass off prove they would be fools to move you. Either way, you get a king's ransom.

[CervezaChill]

If the chiefs had lost that Texans playoff game with Jones injured, his value would be through the roof. But the fact that the chiefs won playoff games this season without him makes his bargaining value slightly lower.

I also think Taco Charlton is going to surprise this season. Not based on anything, just a hunch.

[BigRedChief]

Didn’t he say he was going to play under the franchise tag?

Did Levon Bell get a big contract by sitting out a year? He lost $20 Million by sitting out a year. Did he make that up?

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Chris Jones is easily replaceable. In fact with Pennel ,Saunders and Nadi we don't need him.

[Dartgod]

Dammit, Chris bad timing in this uncertainty. If there is a season play your ass off prove they would be fools to move you. Either way, you get a king's ransom.

And if he blows his knee out playing under the tag?

[wazu]

And if he blows his knee out playing under the tag?

He'll be filthy rich and still sign a massive contract.

[BigRedChief]

And if he blows his knee out playing under the tag?The $20 million he’s made in the NFL should provide a soft landing for him and his family.

Knees on defense are not career ending anyway.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Chris Jones is easily replaceable. In fact with Pennel ,Saunders and Nadi we don't need him.

This is a joke right?

[OKchiefs]

Sure missed a damn good opportunity to trade him and get a decent pick... Now no pick and potentially no Jones.

[RunKC]

Don’t blame him one bit. He’s proven His value for 2 years now. If I was him I wouldn’t play one down this year until I had a long term deal.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Jones is definitely worth 21 mil a year. Veach get it done!!

[srvy]

And if he blows his knee out playing under the tag?

That can happen sure but he can also get a contract play like Houston and blow out.
There is a risk for both sides and there is an improvement in surgery and rehab every year. I don't want to lose him but Pat is priority so who do you piss off.

[RINGLEADER]

Nothing is happening with Jones until they know how they’re handling Mahomes. Those deals either get done together or he waits.

[BigRedChief]

Sure missed a damn good opportunity to trade him and get a decent pick... Now no pick and potentially no Jones.worst case he holds out all year. We still own his rights next year, correct? Could still trade next off season.

[Dante84]

Methinks the Chiefs are not for long for Chris.

The locker room basketball story I think is a tip of the iceberg situation about this guy.

I must have missed that... what’s the basketball story? His injury last year?

[staylor26]

Sure missed a damn good opportunity to trade him and get a decent pick... Now no pick and potentially no Jones.

If only you were in charge of things!

:facepalm:

[BigRedChief]

Jones is definitely worth 21 mil a year. Veach get it done!!
Come on man the day we gave up a 1st rounder and paid Clark $20 million a year, Jones was odd man out not because of Clark but Mahomes looming contract.

[RunKC]

Damn

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">“[Chris Jones] always viewed himself as a 20-million-dollar-plus-per-year guy. The Chiefs frankly never did.” <a href="https://t.co/Gmfe63SdPM">https://t.co/Gmfe63SdPM</a></p>&mdash; Arrowhead Pride (@ArrowheadPride) <a href="https://twitter.com/ArrowheadPride/status/1278129422579765251?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 1, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Flying High D]

Sure is if you're a greedy mother fucker! Be a team player and make 120 million over the next ten years. Think you can feed your great, great, great, great grandkids on that???

Bets I would take for $10,000 Alex.

Based on his current decision making he won’t have any money for own kids. Bell lost so much money that he will never ever be able to recoup.

[RealSNR]

The Khalil Mack trade happened just days before the start of the regular season. I could see the same kind of situation occurring here.

A team with a fuckton of cap space like the Giants wants to quit being terrible, and they run a new 3-4/4-3 hybrid under Pat Graham. Jones would give them a sneaky great DL, and that might just be the worst division in the NFL. That's kind of what the Bears did a few years ago, and it at least got them back into the playoffs. If Daniel Jones isn't as bad as Trubisky (he's not) that could be an outstanding move for them.

[SuperChief]

Wow, some real dipshit takes here. He's the best player we have on defense - can take over games. He's a massive part of winning the Super Bowl, and people are all like "He needs to earn it" and "Be a team player." Give me a break. The dude's been the epitome of a team player and has done all the right things. Pay. Him.

[RealSNR]

Also, why is there a deadline for getting an extension done with a tagged player? That's idiotic. Dudes who are on the last year of their contracts during the regular season sign extensions all the time. Why can't guys playing on the one-year franchise tag sign extensions?

[srvy]

Wow, some real dipshit takes here. He's the best player we have on defense - can take over games. He's a massive part of winning the Super Bowl, and people are all like "He needs to earn it" and "Be a team player." Give me a break. The dude's been the epitome of a team player and has done all the right things. Pay. Him.

Maybe the Chiefs coaches don't value him as much as you. I kinda think he gets signed after Pat unless he lays down to much pain.

[kc rush]

I can't hate on the guy. Showed up in the Super Bowl and was a big part of why we won. I don't think we have anywhere near the cap room, though. Nothing can be allowed to jeopardize our ability to sign Mahomes. Nothing.

All of this. Would love to keep him but don't see how it's possible.

[TribalElder]

With the salary cap potentially going down I don't see how we can pay Chris unfortunately

Chris Jones is a very disruptive force in the middle of the line.

Mahomes is a savage though, so even if CJ ends up on another team playing against us I'm not concerned

[Oxford]

Chris, is it worth 16 million and a legit chance to return to the Super bowl to play on a one year contract? Your choice, if its not worth that to you then sit out and potentially be traded somewhere you dont want to go, or tell us where you want to go and we'll try to make a trade. There is no wrong answer here. its your choice

[TribalElder]

I don't hate on CJ for wanting to get every dollar possible, especially now that he already is a world champion and has the ring to prove it.

Now its time to get the money, it just probably wont happen in KC

all the best CJ, thanks for helping win the Super Bowl

[KurtCobain]

He got a super bowl now he just wants his money. I'm cool with that get it however you got to get it.

[HonestChieffan]

Fuck him

[dlphg9]

It's threads like this that show how absolutely retarded a good chunk of posters are here. Fucking retards.

[Rain Man]

I feel bad for the guy. He's a legitimate major star in the league, and he's been great on the team. He's just in a tough position because of the Mahomes contract.

This is a situation where everyone is right and there's just not an obvious solution.

[Chief Pagan]

Bets I would take for $10,000 Alex.

Based on his current decision making he won’t have any money for own kids. Bell lost so much money that he will never ever be able to recoup.

Bell was franchised a second time and it was clear Pittsburgh planned on running him into ground and getting rid of him. IIRC, the long term contract they offered didn't have that much guaranteed. I would have sat out if I was Bell.

I think the league should get rid of the franchise tag. Teams have to use it to not be at a disadvantage, but it causes so much bad blood. Get rid of it and its still a level playing field.

RBs in particular get screwed by the tag.

[TomBarndtsTwin]

If he wants to sit out the season and forfeit 16 million dollars that’s on him.

Oh well.

Life will go on w/o Chris Jones. The Texans playoff game proved that.

[arrowheadnation]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">What’s understood don’t have to be explained... <a href="https://t.co/4IBh0ZvNrU">https://t.co/4IBh0ZvNrU</a></p>&mdash; Chris Jones (@StoneColdJones) <a href="https://twitter.com/StoneColdJones/status/1278150814423560192?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 1, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Dante84]

Ya know, I don’t find it surprising that on the last day of the final month, he puts public pressure on. 15 days to bang as many pots and pans to try and spur movement from the Chiefs.

I think this tweet and it’s timing were very calculated. The only person that benefits from no noise is the Chiefs. Now they’re in the public eye, dealing with questions and will have to fight a two front war - one at the negotiation table, and one in the media.

[PunkinDrublic]

I would hope Veach would learn from the previous regimes mistakes with Tamba, Justin Houston and Eric Berry. Losing Chris Jones will hurt no doubt about it, but if we want the Chiefs to be a dynasty we’ve got to be able to make the tough decisions and not let ourselves get tied down by these contracts for defensive players. Let the Jerrahs and other incompetent GM’s of the world do what bad organizations do. I love Chris Jones but we need to prepare for life without him.

[srvy]

I would hope Veach would learn from the previous regimes mistakes with Tamba, Justin Houston and Eric Berry. Losing Chris Jones will hurt no doubt about it, but if we want the Chiefs to be a dynasty we’ve got to be able to make the tough decisions and not let ourselves get tied down by these contracts for defensive players. Let the Jerrahs and other incompetent GM’s of the world do what bad organizations do. I love Chris Jones but we need to prepare for life without him.

Careful people like dlphg9 will paint you a moron. Because he thinks money grows in an orchard and there is no limit to spending. The rules can be shit on that's how you become NE.

[RealSNR]

True story. I first heard about Le'Veon Bell watching a random Michigan State game years ago. Bell was having a stellar game, and the announcers were excitedly saying his name with every big play he made, but I had never heard of him or seen his name in writing. And I swear to God... it was the announcer who was doing the game and some sort of weird accent he had... I thought for the entire game this guy's name was Labia.

Anyway... I wouldn't be listening to Labia's labia, Chris. Dude fucked away a year's worth of solid money all so he could make less than his asking price that he wanted from the Steelers. And the worst part is because he priced himself out like that, not only did he miss out on an entire season of good money, but his stats took a huge beating playing for that shitfuck franchise led by a bottom 5 NFL head coach, which means he'll likely not see the end of that Jets contract and the next one he earns from another team is going to be "prove it" money.

It was a bold strategy, but for being all about thinking about total money in the longterm, Labia is going to lose compared to what he could have made had he compromised with the Steelers.

If you want your money, don't listen to Labia fucking Bell.

[patteeu]

Bell was franchised a second time and it was clear Pittsburgh planned on running him into ground and getting rid of him. IIRC, the long term contract they offered didn't have that much guaranteed. I would have sat out if I was Bell.

I think the league should get rid of the franchise tag. Teams have to use it to not be at a disadvantage, but it causes so much bad blood. Get rid of it and its still a level playing field.

RBs in particular get screwed by the tag.

The tag helps the majority of players who aren’t franchise quality because it helps keep the stars from eating up all the cap.

[patteeu]

I would hope Veach would learn from the previous regimes mistakes with Tamba, Justin Houston and Eric Berry. Losing Chris Jones will hurt no doubt about it, but if we want the Chiefs to be a dynasty we’ve got to be able to make the tough decisions and not let ourselves get tied down by these contracts for defensive players. Let the Jerrahs and other incompetent GM’s of the world do what bad organizations do. I love Chris Jones but we need to prepare for life without him.

I’m with you on this.

[tx4chiefs]

If he wants to be that greedy . **** him. I have no sympathy for anybody that will bitch about making more money in one year than I'll make in my lifetime. **** him and trade him to the Bengals and let him rot.

More money then 10 of us in our lifetimes. Prima Donna's really. Pro sports money is ridiculous anymore.

[PunkinDrublic]

Careful people like dlphg9 will paint you a moron. Because he thinks money grows in an orchard and there is no limit to spending. The rules can be shit on that's how you become NE.

We’ve got to be able to fall back on our organizations ability to draft and develop players. That doesn’t mean we become Green Bay and not spend money via free agency. We can spend money wisely to fill holes but I think Veach is smart to realize that you can’t let yourself get anchored down by bad contracts. Go get paid Chris nobody blames you.

[Halfcan]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">What’s understood don’t have to be explained... <a href="https://t.co/4IBh0ZvNrU">https://t.co/4IBh0ZvNrU</a></p>&mdash; Chris Jones (@StoneColdJones) <a href="https://twitter.com/StoneColdJones/status/1278150814423560192?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 1, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


Taking contract advice from Bell is probably not a great idea. :rolleyes::rolleyes:

[bringbackmarty]

Doesn't matter if he holds out or not. There will not be any nfl this season.

[TwistedChief]

I don't hate on CJ for wanting to get every dollar possible, especially now that he already is a world champion and has the ring to prove it.

Now its time to get the money, it just probably wont happen in KC

all the best CJ, thanks for helping win the Super Bowl

Exactly. The guy showed up huge in the biggest game of his lifetime. He has to do what's best for himself now. Good luck to him.

Having said that, big loss for our defense if he's gone.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Exactly. The guy showed up huge in the biggest game of his lifetime. He has to do what's best for himself now. Good luck to him.

Having said that, big loss for our defense if he's gone.

100% agree

[Redbled]

So if Jones sits out aren’t we right back in this same spot next year?

[KChiefs1]

Should have traded him.

[crazycoffey]

If he wants to be that greedy . fuck him. I have no sympathy for anybody that will bitch about making more money in one year than I'll make in my lifetime. Fuck him and trade him to the Bengals and let him rot.

Know the difference between 16 Million & 20 Million?

4 Million. That’s a Lot to leave on the table. It’s all relative.

Do it in increments he understands. Imagine you've got to stroke 20 hogs off but you only get to keep the juice from 16. Still feel like jacking those last four?

Or imagine making 4 million more and not getting another Super Bowl, possibly dampening the hall of fame chances..... everything is relative. Works both ways

[OrtonsPiercedTaint]

Imagine

[MMXcalibur]

I'm not going to knee-jerkingly say "fuck him" and move on.

Jones has been awesome for us. Regardless of whether these hold-outs happen to the Broncos or the Chiefs, I'm always on the side of players getting their money. The sport is ruthless both on the field and on the business side, and with the majority of players having a minuscule window on when to cash-in: I'm all for these hold-out tactics.

That said, Mahomes comes first, second, and third while everything else comes afterwards.
I don't think the deal Jones' wants is going to be fulfilled by the Chiefs.

Thanks for the ring and good luck elsewhere, Chris.

[Sassy Squatch]

See ya later. We were going to have to do some cap finangling before COVID, now it's all but impossible.

[Red Dawg]

Called it long ago. He won't play on the tag. Won't get the deal he wants either. Nobody is giving him 21 mil per year. Colts ****ed this up for us wasting big money on Buckner.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Wow, some real dipshit takes here. He's the best player we have on defense - can take over games. He's a massive part of winning the Super Bowl, and people are all like "He needs to earn it" and "Be a team player." Give me a break. The dude's been the epitome of a team player and has done all the right things. Pay. Him.

Dan Sorenson did more postseason to help the team than Chris Jones did.

[Red Dawg]

Joned turns out to be another greedy athlete. Would you or anyone you know turn down 15 mil for 6 months of work? Greedy like the rest of them.

[digger]

has holding out ever worked out?

[Red Dawg]

He's one player. He can walk.

[Dante84]

Or imagine making 4 million more and not getting another Super Bowl, possibly dampening the hall of fame chances..... everything is relative. Works both ways

To clarify, it’s $4 Million per year.

So we are talking about $12-20 Million total.

[tmax63]

Joned turns out to be another greedy athlete. Would you or anyone you know turn down 15 mil for 6 months of work? Greedy like the rest of them.

Being a pro athlete is a full time job but I wouldn't mind making 1.25 million per month either. That's still pretty a pretty good paycheck either way.

[KChiefs1]

To clarify, it’s $4 Million per year.

So we are talking about $12-20 Million total.


Nobody is paying him that.

[PunkinDrublic]

If he wants to be that greedy . **** him. I have no sympathy for anybody that will bitch about making more money in one year than I'll make in my lifetime. **** him and trade him to the Bengals and let him rot.

You’re telling me that when you were in your prime of jacking off hogs for a living that you never held out until the right hog farm was willing to pay you top dollar for your skills. I don’t believe it!

[nychief]

There is a real chance the season - if there is one - is retarded by the virus...the cap certainly will be. I think these guys w/o contracts are in a strange position.

[PunkinDrublic]

I'm not going to knee-jerkingly say "**** him" and move on.

Jones has been awesome for us. Regardless of whether these hold-outs happen to the Broncos or the Chiefs, I'm always on the side of players getting their money. The sport is ruthless both on the field and on the business side, and with the majority of players having a minuscule window on when to cash-in: I'm all for these hold-out tactics.

That said, Mahomes comes first, second, and third while everything else comes afterwards.
I don't think the deal Jones' wants is going to be fulfilled by the Chiefs.

Thanks for the ring and good luck elsewhere, Chris.

I’m confident Veach will do his due diligence but I don’t think he’ll get suckered into a bad contract that anchors the team down.

[Skyy God]

Sucks, but hopefully we can time a trade with a splash signing like Clowney.

[R Clark]

I’d think having a good chance to play in a super bowl or four would be worth a slight discount. Don’t get me wrong he’s worth the money, but damn if your going to work your ass off I’d want to have as good of a chance as I could to go to the big dance

[OKchiefs]

I’m confident Veach will do his due diligence but I don’t think he’ll get suckered into a bad contract that anchors the team down.

Anthony Hitchens has a pretty bad contract, although I guess you can say his $11 million a year or whatever he makes isn't as bad as the Houston/Berry level of bad contracts.

Frank Clark absolutely needs to turn into a top 5 DE, because he's making borderline QB money after 2020. His cap numbers goes from $25.8 million in 2021, to $26.3 million in 2022, and finally $27.8 million in 2023. Clark is likely gone after 2022, because that $27.8 cap number is insane and we can get out of the contract with $21 million in savings and a $6.8 million cap hit in dead money. Overall, not the most ideal contract for someone who doesn't appear to perform to the same level of similarly paid pass rushers like Khalil Mack.

[Skyy God]

I’d think having a good chance to play in a super bowl or four would be worth a slight discount. Don’t get me wrong he’s worth the money, but damn if your going to work your ass off I’d want to have as good of a chance as I could to go to the big dance

I talked to Chris Jones Sr. for a bit* at the AFCCG tailgate, and my distinct impression was Jones was uninterested in a hometown discount.

*he asked whether I was a reporter, lol

[Wisconsin_Chief]

The Kansas City Chiefs circa 2010-2016 would have to bend over backwards for a guy like Chris Jones.

However, this is a different time in the life of a Chiefs' fan. We have (arguably) the best head coach in the league, the best QB on planet Earth, and one of the best defensive coaching staffs in football. We have the two leaders and anchors of the defense already in Mathieu and Clark. We have a GM who has proven time and again he can find impact players.

I want to keep Chris Jones, but the fact is that we probably can't, and it's not going to cost us any Super Bowls if we don't. As was mentioned earlier in the thread, we mounted the most epic playoff comeback in NFL history without him on the field. It's a different world for us now. We have the new Michael Jordan playing QB for us.

We'll be fine.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Anthony Hitchens has a pretty bad contract, although I guess you can say his $11 million a year or whatever he makes isn't as bad as the Houston/Berry level of bad contracts.

Frank Clark absolutely needs to turn into a top 5 DE, because he's making borderline QB money after 2020. His cap numbers goes from $25.8 million in 2021, to $26.3 million in 2022, and finally $27.8 million in 2023. Clark is likely gone after 2022, because that $27.8 cap number is insane and we can get out of the contract with $21 million in savings and a $6.8 million cap hit in dead money. Overall, not the most ideal contract for someone who doesn't appear to perform to the same level of similarly paid pass rushers like Khalil Mack.

We don't win a title without the Clark deal, so piss off

[O.city]

Jones has made about 5 mil in his career but is gonna sit out of 16 mil gtd?


I’m skeptical

[Dante84]

Nobody is paying him that.

The Colts are paying Buckner $21M per. I think Jones is fair to ask for at least $20M per, and there are absolutely teams who would pay him that.

We just aren't one of them, it seems.

[OKchiefs]

We don't win a title without the Clark deal, so piss off

I don't disagree, but that doesn't mean the contract isn't still an issue. His contract is likely keeping us from extending Jones, and we likely don't win a title without Jones. I don't blame Jones for being upset, because if I'm in that scenario I'd be pissed if I were in KC from day 1 and see an outsider come in and get the money I was looking for.

[ChiefBlueCFC]

Go get your bag Chris. Hopefully it's with the Chiefs but the man's play has earned a pay day

[PAChiefsGuy]

Chris Jones is easily replaceable. In fact with Pennel ,Saunders and Nadi we don't need him.

Man you are on a roll today.

[PunkinDrublic]

The other factor is we have plenty of young defensive players who will be coming into their second year playing in our coordinators scheme. Hopefully a lot of things will start clicking for them and some real studs develop. I’m not saying that’s enough to nullify losing Chris Jones but with our offense all we have to be is good enough on the other side.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

You’re telling me that when you were in your prime of jacking off hogs for a living that you never held out until the right hog farm was willing to pay you top dollar for your skills. I don’t believe it!

I was paid pretty good and like Jones I was probably in the top five talent wise. I could have held out for more but I liked my team and we were good. Anyway money can't buy happiness but it bought me a boat. And the boat makes me happy! Jones could buy a yacht with 16 million. I had to settle for an 18' Triton

If Jones really does hold out I won't like him anymore just like I didn't like Laveon Bell after he pulled his shit.

[tredadda]

Jones has every right to hold out. He has earned what he is asking for. If the Chiefs are unwilling or unable to pay him that then they should trade him to someone who will. I know the franchise tag is good money for one year, but that’s it. After that same thing all over again. He wants to get paid what he feels he’s worth along with having long term financial stability. I imagine everyone else here would want the same thing if they were in his situation. One bad injury while playing on the tag and he will be dropped like an UDFA. That’s why players hate the tag so much. He also was franchised last year and still performed at a high level and was a professional about it.

I got it that Mahomes is and should be the priority. If the team doesn’t feel like they can afford him and Jones then let Jones go to a team that can afford him.

[King_Chief_Fan]

The Kansas City Chiefs circa 2010-2016 would have to bend over backwards for a guy like Chris Jones.

However, this is a different time in the life of a Chiefs' fan. We have (arguably) the best head coach in the league, the best QB on planet Earth, and one of the best defensive coaching staffs in football. We have the two leaders and anchors of the defense already in Mathieu and Clark. We have a GM who has proven time and again he can find impact players.

I want to keep Chris Jones, but the fact is that we probably can't, and it's not going to cost us any Super Bowls if we don't. As was mentioned earlier in the thread, we mounted the most epic playoff comeback in NFL history without him on the field. It's a different world for us now. We have the new Michael Jordan playing QB for us.

We'll be fine.

we are a qb sneak away from not being fine

[FloridaMan88]

we are a qb sneak away from not being fine

If Mahomes goes down, it doesn't matter if the Chiefs keep Chris Jones because they aren't winning jack shit.

[Warpaint69]

Chris Jones is easily replaceable. In fact with Pennel ,Saunders and Nadi we don't need him.

He's easily replaceable in the run game. Nnadi and the others covered Jones butt quite a few times when Chris vacated his gap assignment. As far as a pass rusher, that's where its not so easy to replace him. In my opinion he's still not a complete player because of his hot and cold playing the run.

[redfan]

Jones will get paid, just not by KC. Thanks for the memories...dude is a baller.
Is it wise to hold out in a season that isn't?

[FloridaMan88]

I never thought the Chiefs could realistically pay Chris Jones what he wants (and probably deserves).

Is trading him for decent value still an option?

[O.city]

I never thought the Chiefs could realistically pay Chris Jones what he wants (and probably deserves).

Is trading him for decent value still an option?

Shoulda done that before draft

Hell either play on tag or sit

[Mecca]

I wish him luck, the new CBA makes holding out a serious problem for players.

[tatorhog]

That sucks he's getting contract advice from Bell. Might as well take a firearms class from Plaxico Burress while he's at it.

Its pretty apparent that the season very well could be on hold this year, and going forward there is a very real chance of the salary cap not inflating like they think. Some of these guys are trying to eek out every last cent, when the reality of it is, they may be leaving a TON of money on the table when its all said and done. At some point, they need to keep things in perspective. Sure the team owners are next level rich. But even with the peanut salary of $16 million, he could be doing a hell of a lot worse for himself. Kind of hard to legitimately scoff at that number if you ask me. Seems like a risky, and dumb angle to take with the current climate.

[Iowanian]

Player: "Fans should give players undying, never ending support, even if we're 0-16"

Also Players: "If I don't get a billion dollars, I'm outta this shithole"

I've liked Chris Jones and if they can make it work to keep him at a contract that doesn't hold back the team, great. If not....Mahomes needs paid worse than the Chiefs need Jones.

[Mecca]

Players have limited earning time, I don't begrudge anyone for trying to get paid.

[DJ's left nut]

If the chiefs had lost that Texans playoff game with Jones injured, his value would be through the roof. But the fact that the chiefs won playoff games this season without him makes his bargaining value slightly lower.

I also think Taco Charlton is going to surprise this season. Not based on anything, just a hunch.

The Texans game demonstrated his importance, though.

There was a MASSIVE drop off in push up the middle in that game.

[DJ's left nut]

Players have limited earning time, I don't begrudge anyone for trying to get paid.

The only guys who I think should be willing to take a little less are actually the ones who can easily demand the most - quarterbacks.

Their earnings window is so much longer than anyone else's. For someone like Mahomes, he'll have at least 3 'major' contracts. For the vast majority of his teammates, they'll get 1 - if they're lucky.

So if you're Mahomes and over the course of 15 years of 'big' contracts you can make, say, $600 million instead of $750, you've significantly improved the odds of your team putting a competitive product around you. Yes, you took a ton less than you could have, but you're still set up for 3-4 generations in terms of wealth.

But if you're Jones - get while the gettin's good because it's likely the best shot you'll ever have at getting big money.

[DJ's left nut]

I wish him luck, the new CBA makes holding out a serious problem for players.

Has he signed his Franchise tender?

If not, he isn't 'holding out' under the terms of the CBA. He's not technically under a contract yet.

[The Franchise]

Has he signed his Franchise tender?

If not, he isn't 'holding out' under the terms of the CBA. He's not technically under a contract yet.

No.

And you’re correct. This doesn’t harm him any other way than him missing out on a years worth of money.

[Mecca]

Has he signed his Franchise tender?

If not, he isn't 'holding out' under the terms of the CBA. He's not technically under a contract yet.

Well that's a good point. I'll say this, I dunno if he has the stones to really hold out, 16 million is a lot more than he's made for his entire career at this point.

[gblowfish]

Welp, I'd trade him to the NFC for draft picks.

[BigRedChief]

Has he signed his Franchise tender?

If not, he isn't 'holding out' under the terms of the CBA. He's not technically under a contract yet.Has till July 15th to sign the tender.

[BigRedChief]

Well that's a good point. I'll say this, I dunno if he has the stones to really hold out, 16 million is a lot more than he's made for his entire career at this point.He's made $5 million so far. He did grow up in extreme poverty.

[DJ's left nut]

Has till July 15th to sign the tender.

I thought the window to sign the tender was essentially open-ended.

The parties have until July 15th to reach a multi-year agreement in LIEU of the tender.

That's how guys like Bell have been able to refuse to sign the tender until about week 9, then go ahead and sign it and secure a year towards UFA status.

[penguinz]

Players have limited earning time, I don't begrudge anyone for trying to get paid.

You don't maximize your career earnings by sitting out and leaving 16M on the table.

[Marcellus]

Jones has made about 5 mil in his career but is gonna sit out of 16 mil gtd?


I’m skeptical

If he is dumb enough to take advice from Leveon Bell who lost money doing this shit....

[Mecca]

Bell played on the tender 1 year. I don't blame him either for being pissed.

[duncan_idaho]

Jones is a valuable player and deserves to be paid equivalent to Deforrest Buckner, who is a slightly worse player the past 2 years.

That's a tough ask for the Chiefs, though, if the salary cap goes down in 2021 as is now expected/projected. If things had stayed on track, I don't think it's an issue to get Jones done and Mahomes done.

Tough spot for the player and the team. I respect Jones' willingness to do what is necessary to "get the bag" and won't ever blame a player for seeking to maximize his profits.

But it looks like a trade is inevitable at this point. The Lions, Eagles, and Washington all have huge amounts of cap space, and the Giants and Packers have enough to make a deal happen for this season.

If you can swing a trade to one of those squads and get a first or second-round pick in 2021 out of it, it makes sense to me. The team has to be willing to commit to paying him the moneys, though.

Washington already has pretty hefty investments along its DL with Young and Sweat, so not sure they'd step up with an offer. I could see Detroit or Philly taking a stab, and the Giants and Packers both would make a ton of sense and have a need.

I also still think the Jets are a good potential landing spot IF they can swing Jamal Adams' involvement. Even if there is no pick compensation involved, a Jones for Adams swap might make sense for both.

[Marcellus]

Bell played on the tender 1 year. I don't blame him either for being pissed.

He also turned down a deal and sat a year and lost money over the deal he turned down, and went to a shittier team to boot.

He had a deal in place and lost money in the long run, there was no "win" in it.

[PAChiefsGuy]

I'd love to keep him but he isn't in a position to demand anything from the Chiefs. We have Mahomes and a ton of other talent. Worse comes to worse we just trade him.

[Kman34]

Jones is a valuable player and deserves to be paid equivalent to Deforrest Buckner, who is a slightly worse player the past 2 years.

That's a tough ask for the Chiefs, though, if the salary cap goes down in 2021 as is now expected/projected. If things had stayed on track, I don't think it's an issue to get Jones done and Mahomes done.

Tough spot for the player and the team. I respect Jones' willingness to do what is necessary to "get the bag" and won't ever blame a player for seeking to maximize his profits.

But it looks like a trade is inevitable at this point. The Lions, Eagles, and Washington all have huge amounts of cap space, and the Giants and Packers have enough to make a deal happen for this season.

If you can swing a trade to one of those squads and get a first or second-round pick in 2021 out of it, it makes sense to me. The team has to be willing to commit to paying him the moneys, though.

Washington already has pretty hefty investments along its DL with Young and Sweat, so not sure they'd step up with an offer. I could see Detroit or Philly taking a stab, and the Giants and Packers both would make a ton of sense and have a need.

I also still think the Jets are a good potential landing spot IF they can swing Jamal Adams' involvement. Even if there is no pick compensation involved, a Jones for Adams swap might make sense for both.

I don’t see any team trading for anyone due to the uncertain future of the season and the risk of a reduced cap in 2021..

[Kiimo]

The Steelers offer trash contracts to all their players. I'm actually surprised more players don't hold out. They're guaranteed one year and they were gonna run Bell into the ground.

Bell ended up on a worse team and lost money holding out but did get a contract with guaranteed money in the end.

Running backs should have their own contract language, they're getting screwed and meanwhile the ones that do get huge contracts end up not living up to them. There has to be some middle ground. It should have been worked into the CBA

[OKchiefs]

Jones is a valuable player and deserves to be paid equivalent to Deforrest Buckner, who is a slightly worse player the past 2 years.

That's a tough ask for the Chiefs, though, if the salary cap goes down in 2021 as is now expected/projected. If things had stayed on track, I don't think it's an issue to get Jones done and Mahomes done.

Tough spot for the player and the team. I respect Jones' willingness to do what is necessary to "get the bag" and won't ever blame a player for seeking to maximize his profits.

But it looks like a trade is inevitable at this point. The Lions, Eagles, and Washington all have huge amounts of cap space, and the Giants and Packers have enough to make a deal happen for this season.

If you can swing a trade to one of those squads and get a first or second-round pick in 2021 out of it, it makes sense to me. The team has to be willing to commit to paying him the moneys, though.

Washington already has pretty hefty investments along its DL with Young and Sweat, so not sure they'd step up with an offer. I could see Detroit or Philly taking a stab, and the Giants and Packers both would make a ton of sense and have a need.

I also still think the Jets are a good potential landing spot IF they can swing Jamal Adams' involvement. Even if there is no pick compensation involved, a Jones for Adams swap might make sense for both.

Are you suggesting they would trade him now or after the season? Because if they trade him now it makes zero sense why they wouldn't have done it before the draft when they could have gotten a 2020 pick to help them this year when they're trying to run it back. If they can somehow get him to play in 2020 and then tag and trade him in 2021 then that's fine, as his contribution this season will be important.

[DJ's left nut]

Jones is a valuable player and deserves to be paid equivalent to Deforrest Buckner, who is a slightly worse player the past 2 years.

That's a tough ask for the Chiefs, though, if the salary cap goes down in 2021 as is now expected/projected. If things had stayed on track, I don't think it's an issue to get Jones done and Mahomes done.

Tough spot for the player and the team. I respect Jones' willingness to do what is necessary to "get the bag" and won't ever blame a player for seeking to maximize his profits.

But it looks like a trade is inevitable at this point. The Lions, Eagles, and Washington all have huge amounts of cap space, and the Giants and Packers have enough to make a deal happen for this season.

If you can swing a trade to one of those squads and get a first or second-round pick in 2021 out of it, it makes sense to me. The team has to be willing to commit to paying him the moneys, though.

Washington already has pretty hefty investments along its DL with Young and Sweat, so not sure they'd step up with an offer. I could see Detroit or Philly taking a stab, and the Giants and Packers both would make a ton of sense and have a need.

I also still think the Jets are a good potential landing spot IF they can swing Jamal Adams' involvement. Even if there is no pick compensation involved, a Jones for Adams swap might make sense for both.

If they have to take a 2nd when the 9ers were able to get a high 1st for a lesser player, that's a pretty shitty look for Veach.

They needed to have a better feel for how close they were on this one, IMO. I had identified the Colts as a great landing spot for him before the Buckner deal, though I preferred getting their 2 second rounders.

If the Chiefs weren't damn close to having a deal done, they really needed to outflank SF on that trade. Failing to do so will have significant long-term consequences for KC.

[The Franchise]

If they have to take a 2nd when the 9ers were able to get a high 1st for a lesser player, that's a pretty shitty look for Veach.

They needed to have a better feel for how close they were on this one, IMO. I had identified the Colts as a great landing spot for him before the Buckner deal, though I preferred getting their 2 second rounders.

If the Chiefs weren't damn close to having a deal done, they really needed to outflank SF on that trade. Failing to do so will have significant long-term consequences for KC.

I’m thinking that Veach thought he was going to have the money to pay Jones. Then the whole lesser salary cap shit hit because of COVID.

[Chiefshrink]

More often than not DL disappear after they get their $$. As always this is a QB driven league. Chris will eventually get his $$ but IF he wants his cake($$) and be able to eat it(more SB rings) he would be wise to wait. IF not then I assure he will disappear with some other team after he gets his $$.

[RealSNR]

I mean, if we're looking at getting max value out of Jones in a trade, I know of a team that would apparently rape their own grandmothers to get him.

https://www.raidersbeat.com/tafur-raiders-will-definitely-pursue-chiefs-dt-chris-jones-in-free-agency/

I'm trying to find the link where they visited Raiders facilities this offseason and Gruden and Mayock were both like, "Look, we're not going to be secretive. We will move heaven and earth to get Chris Jones here if it's possible."

I know that's asking for trouble trading him to a division rival, but keep in mind that Andy Reid once traded his first-born QB to a division rival back when he was in Philly.

If the Raiders got desperate and offered a Frank Clark haul like a 2021 1st and a 2022 2nd? Without the 3rd round toss back we got in the deal? Man, that's tempting, especially since we still have Mahomes and they're still the fucking Raiders

[Chiefshrink]

I know that's asking for trouble trading him to a division rival,

Pissing off Jones not paying him only to go to a division rival in which he would eat our interior line for lunch along with Mahomes ?? Because that IS our achilles heal on offense IMHO and allowing CJ to be motivated to boot. Yes DL usually disappear after they get their $$ BUT CJ would be motivated at least 2wice a year and I am not allowing any kind of situation where my HOF QB is going to get hit even more this year. There is no haul of draft picks worth getting Mahomey hurt IMHO.

[tyecopeland]

Yay chiefs news!

Shit, it's bad news.

[OKchiefs]

I’m thinking that Veach thought he was going to have the money to pay Jones. Then the whole lesser salary cap shit hit because of COVID.

Covid was around before the draft, so that should have already been seen as a possibility.

[duncan_idaho]

If they have to take a 2nd when the 9ers were able to get a high 1st for a lesser player, that's a pretty shitty look for Veach.

They needed to have a better feel for how close they were on this one, IMO. I had identified the Colts as a great landing spot for him before the Buckner deal, though I preferred getting their 2 second rounders.

If the Chiefs weren't damn close to having a deal done, they really needed to outflank SF on that trade. Failing to do so will have significant long-term consequences for KC.


I’m thinking a high second there and probably paired with another pick (4th? Swap of thirds? Future 2nd). Didn’t say that but was just thinking about the headliner piece.

I think you can place most of the blame here on the pandemic and the projected dip in salary cap. With a projected increase, Jones is extendable even with Mahomes’ new deal and you still have some maneuverability in the cap.

Without it? Man, playing around with some extensions to Kelce, mathieu and Fisher I can see a way to free up the year 2 cap room you’d need, but that puts you in place for a precipitous talent drain in 2022/23 as those guys hit the portions of those extensions where you probably cut them and take some dead cap hits.

Getting the Buckner deal done before salary cap implications of the pandemic were evident AND with no hint of problems between Buckner and the 49ers were factors, plus you had the 5th year player option for Buckner, which changed the dynamic a bit (since it wasn’t a tag year).

I think it’s a hindsight situation.

HAD Veach known the cap situation was going to get messy, torpedo his plans to extend Jones, and lead to media fallout, I’m sure it would have been played differently...

[Easy 6]

I have much faith in Veach getting this worked out

But if not, it’s not like the cupboard is bare along the front line... and of course we DO still have #15, so we’ll be fine

[Hoover]

My thoughts, not that they matter.

1. This fucking COVID BS sucks. How it is messing with the Salary cap just sucks. No way anyone could have seen this coming. So it's not like Veach could prepare for it. We knew it was going to be tight the way it is to pay both Pat and Chris.

2. With the advantage of hindsight, I wonder if the Chiefs knowing what they do now would have given Watkins his walking papers. Now I'm not sure that fixes the Jones situation, but it couldn't hurt. And hell the Chiefs would still have Hill, Hardman, and D-Rob.

3. Despite all of that, Chris Jones was always going to threaten a holdout. Thats how these things work. Chris isn't being disrespected, but he isn't getting what he wants.

4. Holding out could force a trade, but I'm not sure that's in Jones' best interest. Its not like he's going to go to a better situation for him. Sure, if you want to force your way on to the NY Giants and get a big payday then yeah, that's possible.

5. Not sure why the NFL and Players Association can't figure out a way to give teams some sort of relief with next year's salary cap. It's a one year issue, I'm sure a creative solution can be found, like valuing contracts at 90% for cap purposes or something. I don't know.

While the Chiefs have a problem with Jones, I think ultimately its a problem for the entire NFL, the Chiefs due to their upcoming free agents are just having to deal with it sooner than the rest of the league.

[OKchiefs]

My thoughts, not that they matter.

1. This ****ing COVID BS sucks. How it is messing with the Salary cap just sucks. No way anyone could have seen this coming. So it's not like Veach could prepare for it. We knew it was going to be tight the way it is to pay both Pat and Chris.

2. With the advantage of hindsight, I wonder if the Chiefs knowing what they do now would have given Watkins his walking papers. Now I'm not sure that fixes the Jones situation, but it couldn't hurt. And hell the Chiefs would still have Hill, Hardman, and D-Rob.

3. Despite all of that, Chris Jones was always going to threaten a holdout. Thats how these things work. Chris isn't being disrespected, but he isn't getting what he wants.

4. Holding out could force a trade, but I'm not sure that's in Jones' best interest. Its not like he's going to go to a better situation for him. Sure, if you want to force your way on to the NY Giants and get a big payday then yeah, that's possible.

5. Not sure why the NFL and Players Association can't figure out a way to give teams some sort of relief with next year's salary cap. It's a one year issue, I'm sure a creative solution can be found, like valuing contracts at 90% for cap purposes or something. I don't know.

While the Chiefs have a problem with Jones, I think ultimately its a problem for the entire NFL, the Chiefs due to their upcoming free agents are just having to deal with it sooner than the rest of the league.

Adam Schefter was speculating BEFORE THE DRAFT that the salary cap could decrease in 2021. So we're supposed to believe an NFL reporter is more aware of the implications of Covid-19 on the salary cap than an NFL GM?

[Hoover]

Adam Schefter was speculating BEFORE THE DRAFT that the salary cap could decrease in 2021. So we're supposed to believe an NFL reporter is more aware of the implications of Covid-19 on the salary cap than an NFL GM?
The Chiefs are in this spot because they finally have an all world QB that they can now extend. Its really that simple. The problem has been compounded by COVID

[OKchiefs]

The Chiefs are in this spot because they finally have an all world QB that they can now extend. Its really that simple. The problem has been compounded by COVID

I'm not debating that. But you said there's no way they could have known the effect Covid-19 would have on the 2021 cap, when Adam Schefter was already speculating before the 2020 draft that the cap could decrease. So either the decrease in the cap has nothing to do with the offer being given to Chris Jones, or it does have an effect and Brett Veach was not prepared as he should have been for all possible scenarios.

Patrick Mahomes and his upcoming contract extension has been known for a while, that's not a new variable by any means. In my completely unqualified opinion, the only logical scenario that makes sense is you somehow convince Chris Jones to play on the tag in 2020. After the season you tag him again and either extend his contract or trade him BEFORE the 2021 draft.

Trading him now/before the 2020 season makes zero sense, because doing so doesn't help the 2020 team at all in a season in which the mantra has been "run it back" with the same group.

If he sits out the season then they still fucked up, because they should have done a better job of making damn sure they could extend him before the season to avoid the holdout or of trading him for a 2020 pick that could help this year.

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out, to say the least.

[RunKC]

Adam Schefter was speculating BEFORE THE DRAFT that the salary cap could decrease in 2021. So we're supposed to believe an NFL reporter is more aware of the implications of Covid-19 on the salary cap than an NFL GM?

Why do you always act like Veach is retarded? I mean the man has slam dunked all over your bitchass again and again and you still pull this shit.

Let it play out and see what happens. FFS

[crazycoffey]

To clarify, it’s $4 Million per year.

So we are talking about $12-20 Million total.

And what’s he leaving in the table by holding out and not taking his franchise tag money?

[Mecca]

I'm not going to get be upset either way, as good as Jones is, a defensive tackle is not the difference in us being a bowl team and not.

If anything this staff has shown me we should trust they can replace him if need be.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Heh, we lost Justin Houston, Eric Berry and Tamba Hali as well as Dumbass Dee Ford and kicked everybodys ass all the way to the SB. Hiring Steve Spagnolia made the difference along with Clark and Mathieu. If you don't think we can't live without Jones you're dead wrong.

Don't get me wrong. I love CJ and want him here but I don't want ANY player that puts himself before team and holding out is THAT.

[Shields68]

Adam Schefter was speculating BEFORE THE DRAFT that the salary cap could decrease in 2021. So we're supposed to believe an NFL reporter is more aware of the implications of Covid-19 on the salary cap than an NFL GM?

Sure he was guessing. But other teams also were aware of implications so the market probably tanked as well. Do you take a 2nd or third? Not sure who would have been offering a 1.

I still bet with adding a game, increase in TV revenue ... The NFL worse case decides not to reduce the cap in 2021 even if it should go down under a calculations. Now that being said I think Veech bet prior to covid that there would be a huge increase.

But he can not sign Jones and gamble with not having the money to pay Patrick.

Jones is sort of in the grey area does he sign or hold out. Not sure the Chiefs really have a good option at this point.

[DJ's left nut]

I'm not going to get be upset either way, as good as Jones is, a defensive tackle is not the difference in us being a bowl team and not.

If anything this staff has shown me we should trust they can replace him if need be.

We lose the Super Bowl but/for the efforts of Chris Jones in the 4th quarter of that game.

Seriously - watch it again. The batted pass saved the game - full stop. Without it there's a good chance we simply don't get the ball back. And Jones was a force in that entire 4th quarter.

Yes, Jones is a MASSIVE difference for this team.

[The Franchise]

Should have gotten rid of Watkins, LDT and Sorenson....and paid Jones.

[RunKC]

We lose the Super Bowl but/for the efforts of Chris Jones in the 4th quarter of that game.

Seriously - watch it again. The batted pass saved the game - full stop. Without it there's a good chance we simply don't get the ball back. And Jones was a force in that entire 4th quarter.

Yes, Jones is a MASSIVE difference for this team.

Hate this argument.

Without Eric Fisher’s excellent block on Bosa, Wasp never happens. Without Sammy’s excellent route on Sherman, that big gain never happens. Without Matheiu’s excellent tackle in the first drive, Deebo Samuel gets a TD (he actually had 2 TD saving tackles). Without Breeland’s awesome play beating Kittle’s block for a big TFL, SF gets a 1st down and maybe gets a TD instead of a FG. I didn’t even mention Damien Williams either.

So many examples here. It’s a team game. So many guys played a big part.

[Easy 6]

Should have gotten rid of Watkins, LDT and Sorenson....and paid Jones.

.

[RINGLEADER]

5. Not sure why the NFL and Players Association can't figure out a way to give teams some sort of relief with next year's salary cap. It's a one year issue, I'm sure a creative solution can be found, like valuing contracts at 90% for cap purposes or something. I don't know.

They can. And they have in the past.

https://www.si.com/johnwallstreet/sports-business/nfl-smooth-salary-cap

[RINGLEADER]

Should have gotten rid of Watkins, LDT and Sorenson....and paid Jones.

You can argue this — but I’d rather have Mahomes with weapons and average defense then Mahomes with fewer weapons and average defense + Jones. But I respect others who feel differently and wish there was a way to keep everyone but I’ll be okay with picks and keeping other pieces that are going to start coming due next season.

[Red Dawg]

Should have gotten rid of Watkins, LDT and Sorenson....and paid Jones.

No we shouldn't.

[Shields68]

Should have gotten rid of Watkins, LDT and Sorenson....and paid Jones.

Those guys are all on 1 year deals. 2020 is not the problem. We have enough to fit Jones and those guys under this years cap. It is the 5 year deal that he wants, that brings in the uncertainty of what the 2021 and 2022 cap will be and how you fit him and Patrick as well as the contracts you have currently have for those years, if the cap decreases.

[DJ's left nut]

Hate this argument.

Without Eric Fisher’s excellent block on Bosa, Wasp never happens. Without Sammy’s excellent route on Sherman, that big gain never happens. Without Matheiu’s excellent tackle in the first drive, Deebo Samuel gets a TD (he actually had 2 TD saving tackles). Without Breeland’s awesome play beating Kittle’s block for a big TFL, SF gets a 1st down and maybe gets a TD instead of a FG. I didn’t even mention Damien Williams either.

So many examples here. It’s a team game. So many guys played a big part.

Sure.

Which is why the idea that a losing a 'mere defensive tackle' falls apart upon any reasonable scrutiny. We have a guy who does his job better than all but ONE defensive tackle in football and in the process of doing that job he made at least 3 crucial individual plays. Without those plays, we don't win a championship.

And because of his overall excellence, it's fair to presume that his replacement would not have made those plays or enough other excellent individual plays to offset them.

Khalen Saunders isn't going to make those plays. Nor is he going to be able to make the impact on the other snaps of the game to overcome the fact that he's a less dynamic player than Jones. Had Jones gone out on the first snap of that game - we lose.

I recognize that doesn't close the book on whether or not keeping Jones is feasible, but the idea that the team is a Super Bowl champion with or without him is just folly. Without him, and with his replacement taking his snaps, the 2019 Chiefs aren't NFL champions.

[RealSNR]

Random Vikings fan seems nice. At least he's realistic about compensation. He's not trying to do some stupid Madden bullshit like, "How about a 3rd and a 4th for Jones????"

Would two Minnesota 1st rounders do it for you if we couldn't keep Jones and had to trade him?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/RegGo1URLJw" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[DJ's left nut]

Those guys are all on 1 year deals. 2020 is not the problem. We have enough to fit Jones and those guys under this years cap. It is the 5 year deal that he wants, that brings in the uncertainty of what the 2021 and 2022 cap will be and how you fit him and Patrick as well as the contracts you have currently have for those years, if the cap decreases.

You know how you make 2021 and 2022 more palatable?

Through creating roughly $24 million in cap rollover by walking away from Watkins, LDT and Sorensen.

You're right - we don't need them off the books to fit Jones this season. We needed them off the books to create enough rollover to fit Jones under the cap NEXT season.

Its honestly the same thing that should've been considered with Hitchens. You bite the bullet, take his cap hit this season, and clean $11 million off the books for next season.

Veach went all in on the 'run it back' campaign and I think it was extremely shortsighted. I think he should've used the good will created by the championship, not to mention the final relatively cheap year of Mahomes deal, to use this season to clean the books of some lousy contracts, create substantial rollover for next season and then have a leaned out, more cost effective roster for 2021 and beyond when Mahomes starts to get more expensive.

[Pitt Gorilla]

You know how you make 2021 and 2022 more palatable?

Through creating roughly $24 million in cap rollover by walking away from Watkins, LDT and Sorensen.

You're right - we don't need them off the books to fit Jones this season. We needed them off the books to create enough rollover to fit Jones under the cap NEXT season.

Its honestly the same thing that should've been considered with Hitchens. You bite the bullet, take his cap hit this season, and clean $11 million off the books for next season.

Veach went all in on the 'run it back' campaign and I think it was extremely shortsighted. I think he should've used the good will created by the championship, not to mention the final relatively cheap year of Mahomes deal, to use this season to clean the books of some lousy contracts, create substantial rollover for next season and then have a leaned out, more cost effective roster for 2021 and beyond when Mahomes starts to get more expensive.Great points across the board here. Need the NBA's amnesty clause for Hitchens.

[oldman]

I like Jones and would love to see him in a Chiefs uniform for years to come. While I understand his time to make money is limited, I think his stance right now is a little foolish. Let's face it, $16M is better than $0. Even if he has to play under the tag while things get sorted out, he'll still be a rich man.

[Halfcan]

I like Jones and would love to see him in a Chiefs uniform for years to come. While I understand his time to make money is limited, I think his stance right now is a little foolish. Let's face it, $16M is better than $0. Even if he has to play under the tag while things get sorted out, he'll still be a rich man.

I highly doubt CJ will miss out on that kind of check while also skipping a chance at a second SB ring.

A second ring will do more for his career than sitting out and wasting a season of his career.

[The Franchise]

Random Vikings fan seems nice. At least he's realistic about compensation. He's not trying to do some stupid Madden bullshit like, "How about a 3rd and a 4th for Jones????"

Would two Minnesota 1st rounders do it for you if we couldn't keep Jones and had to trade him?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/RegGo1URLJw" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Yeah. It would for me. And I’d love to keep Jones on this team. I just don’t see how we’re pulling it off.

[The Franchise]

Those guys are all on 1 year deals. 2020 is not the problem. We have enough to fit Jones and those guys under this years cap. It is the 5 year deal that he wants, that brings in the uncertainty of what the 2021 and 2022 cap will be and how you fit him and Patrick as well as the contracts you have currently have for those years, if the cap decreases.

LDT is not. Watkins could have easily been cut and Sorenson can be replaced. I get the uncertainty though.

[Halfcan]

You know how you make 2021 and 2022 more palatable?

Through creating roughly $24 million in cap rollover by walking away from Watkins, LDT and Sorensen.

You're right - we don't need them off the books to fit Jones this season. We needed them off the books to create enough rollover to fit Jones under the cap NEXT season.

Its honestly the same thing that should've been considered with Hitchens. You bite the bullet, take his cap hit this season, and clean $11 million off the books for next season.

Veach went all in on the 'run it back' campaign and I think it was extremely shortsighted. I think he should've used the good will created by the championship, not to mention the final relatively cheap year of Mahomes deal, to use this season to clean the books of some lousy contracts, create substantial rollover for next season and then have a leaned out, more cost effective roster for 2021 and beyond when Mahomes starts to get more expensive.

It took 50 years since our last championship to win and now we are favored to go back-to-back. We have a great team- why get rid of guys that contributed to winning just for cap space?

You strike while the iron is hot. This year is different, teams will not have much time to gel and we will be bringing back a championship team mostly intact. I like the strategy.

[DJ's left nut]

It took 50 years since our last championship to win and now we are favored to go back-to-back. We have a great team- why get rid of guys that contributed to winning just for cap space?

You strike while the iron is hot. This year is different, teams will not have much time to gel and we will be bringing back a championship team mostly intact. I like the strategy.

Because 'cap space' = talent. The former is required to retain the latter.

It's not 'just for cap space' it's for 'Chris Jones'.

Chris Jones will be more important to this team over the next 1-5 years than Watkins, Sorensen and LDT combined.

[The Franchise]

You have a better chance of running it back having Jones instead of Watkins, LDT and Sorenson.

[Halfcan]

Because 'cap space' = talent. The former is required to retain the latter.

It's not 'just for cap space' it's for 'Chris Jones'.

Chris Jones will be more important to this team over the next 1-5 years than Watkins, Sorensen and LDT combined.

I am sure if the Chiefs felt they had a good replacements for Hitchens, LDT, Sorensen and Sammy- they would have swallowed the cap hit, but they didn't. These guys are over-paid but not scrubs.

The way it stands, we still have them and also Jones if he will lower himself to play for another ring for a measly 16 million bucks. This team is loaded.

[DJ's left nut]

I am sure if the Chiefs felt they had a good replacements for Hitchens, LDT, Sorensen and Sammy- they would have swallowed the cap hit, but they didn't. These guys are over-paid but not scrubs.

The way it stands, we still have them and also Jones if he will lower himself to play for another ring for a measly 16 million bucks. This team is loaded.

Hitchens would be the toughest pill, IMO.

Your position is that the Chiefs should continue to pay 4 different guys more than they're worth so that Chris Jones can take 75% of what HE'S worth on the open market?

You're essentially calling Chris Jones greedy for being unwilling to subsidize his teammates paychecks. In effect, JONES is the one that is overpaying for those guys because it's money he'd be getting but/for their inflated deals.

And that's...okay? You're cool with calling Jones greedy because he sees this team keeping guys around who aren't worth their checks while simultaneously telling him they aren't going to pay him what he'd otherwise be capable of earning?

That's odd...

[Dante84]

I love Chris.

If either Miami or Jacksonville are willing to offer both of their 2 1st rounders in the 2021 draft, you'd have to listen.

Imagine Veach having a draft with THREE 1st rounders, with 1 likely being top 10. Like, dear God.

That's the kind of move that sets us up (more than we already are) to be a 5 year dynasty with Pat at QB.

[Halfcan]

Hitchens would be the toughest pill, IMO.

Your position is that the Chiefs should continue to pay 4 different guys more than they're worth so that Chris Jones can take 75% of what HE'S worth on the open market?

You're essentially calling Chris Jones greedy for being unwilling to subsidize his teammates paychecks. In effect, JONES is the one that is overpaying for those guys because it's money he'd be getting but/for their inflated deals.

And that's...okay? You're cool with calling Jones greedy because he sees this team keeping guys around who aren't worth their checks while simultaneously telling him they aren't going to pay him what he'd otherwise be capable of earning?

That's odd...



When did I say Jones was greedy?

First, you say- I am "essentially" calling him greedy- then you double down on that and say I am "cool with it" . :spock:

It is not My position- this is what the Chiefs have decided to do. I only disagreed when you said Veech is shortsighted wanting to win another SB with this loaded team that has great chemistry instead of breaking them up for cap relief.

BTW I have always been on the Keep Jones bandwagon- but think it would be a horrible move if he holds out.

[Sassy Squatch]

Hopefully he starts rapping like Bell.

[penguinz]

You have a better chance of running it back having Jones instead of Watkins, LDT and Sorenson.

Every year everyone wants to dump Sorenson yet every year the guy plays a big part in big games.

[PAChiefsGuy]

You have a better chance of running it back having Jones instead of Watkins, LDT and Sorenson.

I don't know about that. I'm not a huge Watkins guy but he always shows up in the playoffs and the offense is noticeably better w him on the field even when he isn't putting up big stats.

LDT and Sorenson are good role players.

[Halfcan]

Every year everyone wants to dump Sorenson yet every year the guy plays a big part in big games.

:LOL:

Yep, I was one of them until he balled out this year in huge games. He is a gamer and I will never say a bad word about him again. The guy gets it and is a tough, badass player.

[The Franchise]

I love Chris.

If either Miami or Jacksonville are willing to offer both of their 2 1st rounders in the 2021 draft, you'd have to listen.

Imagine Veach having a draft with THREE 1st rounders, with 1 likely being top 10. Like, dear God.

That's the kind of move that sets us up (more than we already are) to be a 5 year dynasty with Pat at QB.

That’s not happening.

[RealSNR]

It took 50 years since our last championship to win and now we are favored to go back-to-back. We have a great team- why get rid of guys that contributed to winning just for cap space?

You strike while the iron is hot. This year is different, teams will not have much time to gel and we will be bringing back a championship team mostly intact. I like the strategy.

I disagree, and I've been disagreeing with this mindset all offseason. Hell, probably before this offseason.

If healthy, Mahomes will get you in the playoffs. Every. Single. Year. Shitty defense? If he has enough weapons he'll still take you to the AFC Championship and just about win the fucking thing. No running game? Still won a Super Bowl. Month-plus injuries to his top speed WR, LT, all while the defense had a billion new starters attempting to work through a new defense and new coaches? 12-4 and a 2 seed (and an eventual Super Bowl).

We're not the Kansas City Royals. We don't play baseball. We don't need to stock up and sell the farm once every 8-10 years and be mired in mediocrity the rest of the time. Our "down" years are still playoff years, and even in some of those "down" years we can't be counted out to make a magical run if things gel just right.

The idea of striking while the iron is hot is a bit irresponsible, because I'd rather have a decent chance at winning a Super Bowl into the extension years of Mahomes' career than trying to go all in now but have to look like the Seattle Seahawks after Russell's big money deal.

Going for all the marbles in a particular year is great and all, but if you miss on that opportunity (and it does happen-- it's the NFL) THAT'S how guys like Aaron Rodgers get their careers wasted.

[Dante84]

That’s not happening.

Yeah, Jax is likely going to be picking top 3, and probably have their hearts set on Trevor Lawrence.

Miami, on the other hand, has an extra 2nd in 2021.

Round 1: Their own pick
Round 1: From Houston
Round 2: Own
Round 2: From Houston

I doubt we'd be eager to move him in the conference, and while I also doubt they'd part with both 1sts, I can envision a scenario where we get the earliest 1st and the earliest 2nd, which is less exciting.

[DJ's left nut]

I disagree, and I've been disagreeing with this mindset all offseason. Hell, probably before this offseason.

If healthy, Mahomes will get you in the playoffs. Every. Single. Year. Shitty defense? If he has enough weapons he'll still take you to the AFC Championship and just about win the fucking thing. No running game? Still won a Super Bowl. Month-plus injuries to his top speed WR, LT, all while the defense had a billion new starters attempting to work through a new defense and new coaches? 12-4 and a 2 seed (and an eventual Super Bowl).

We're not the Kansas City Royals. We don't play baseball. We don't need to stock up and sell the farm once every 8-10 years and be mired in mediocrity the rest of the time. Our "down" years are still playoff years, and even in some of those "down" years we can't be counted out to make a magical run if things gel just right.

The idea of striking while the iron is hot is a bit irresponsible, because I'd rather have a decent chance at winning a Super Bowl into the extension years of Mahomes' career than trying to go all in now but have to look like the Seattle Seahawks after Russell's big money deal.

Going for all the marbles in a particular year is great and all, but if you miss on that opportunity (and it does happen-- it's the NFL) THAT'S how guys like Aaron Rodgers get their careers wasted.

Greatest coach/QB combination in history failed to win the Super Bowl more than half the time they were together.

Having the best team or talent STILL doesn't guarantee dick.

I'll trade a year w/ a 50% shot at a SB for 2 years w/ a 40% shot at the SB every time. Gimme more bites at the apple over fewer larger bites. Sure, there's a bit of a gambler's fallacy issue there, but we have the ultimate force multiplier under center. By any reasonable measure the Chiefs should've lost that SB but then Mahomes did Mahomes shit and that was all she wrote.

That possibility will be there. So I don't feel any desperate need to push my chips into the center.

[RealSNR]

Meh. It's time we stop being scared of moving guys around in the conference.

All NFL teams have to occasionally let guys walk or release/cut them. Sometimes they wind up with our own division rivals. Sometimes their cuts wind up on our rosters. It's nothing new.

We're not even talking in-division, here. We're talking in-conference. If we traded LDT to the Dolphins is it that much worse than him signing with the Dolphins after we cut him?

[Halfcan]

I disagree, and I've been disagreeing with this mindset all offseason. Hell, probably before this offseason.

If healthy, Mahomes will get you in the playoffs. Every. Single. Year. Shitty defense? If he has enough weapons he'll still take you to the AFC Championship and just about win the ****ing thing. No running game? Still won a Super Bowl. Month-plus injuries to his top speed WR, LT, all while the defense had a billion new starters attempting to work through a new defense and new coaches? 12-4 and a 2 seed (and an eventual Super Bowl).

We're not the Kansas City Royals. We don't play baseball. We don't need to stock up and sell the farm once every 8-10 years and be mired in mediocrity the rest of the time. Our "down" years are still playoff years, and even in some of those "down" years we can't be counted out to make a magical run if things gel just right.

The idea of striking while the iron is hot is a bit irresponsible, because I'd rather have a decent chance at winning a Super Bowl into the extension years of Mahomes' career than trying to go all in now but have to look like the Seattle Seahawks after Russell's big money deal.

Going for all the marbles in a particular year is great and all, but if you miss on that opportunity (and it does happen-- it's the NFL) THAT'S how guys like Aaron Rodgers get their careers wasted.

So you would rather substantially lower our odds to repeat This year- to hopefully, increase our odds down the road? not me- I think we will win it again this year.

A lot of the guys came back on 1 year deals with Sammy taking a pay cut. So it is not like Veech pushed all of his chips in and completely mortgaged our future this offseason. Plus he brought in a lot of cheap talent- that will replace older / overpaid players in the coming seasons.

You can say he did that to some degree with bringing in Clark and Honey Badger. But would you rather be loaded in cap space not having these guys or a SB ring? In 10 years nobody cares how much cap space we had the last year-but will remember our SB forever.

[DJ's left nut]

So you would rather substantially lower our odds to repeat This year- to hopefully, increase our odds down the road? not me- I think we will win it again this year.

A lot of the guys came back on 1 year deals with Sammy taking a pay cut. So it is not like Veech pushed all of his chips in and completely mortgaged our future this offseason. Plus he brought in a lot of cheap talent- that will replace older / overpaid players in the coming seasons.

You can say he did that to some degree with bringing in Clark and Honey Badger. But would you rather be loaded in cap space not having these guys or a SB ring? In 10 years nobody cares how much cap space we had the last year-but will remember our SB forever.

If Jones chooses to hold out and we've swapped Jones for LDT, Watkins and Sorensen, we will have 'substantially lowered our odds' THIS season, IMO.

And definitely in subsequent seasons.

[RealSNR]

Greatest coach/QB combination in history failed to win the Super Bowl more than half the time they were together.

Having the best team or talent STILL doesn't guarantee dick.

I'll trade a year w/ a 50% shot at a SB for 2 years w/ a 40% shot at the SB every time. Gimme more bites at the apple over fewer larger bites. Sure, there's a bit of a gambler's fallacy issue there, but we have the ultimate force multiplier under center. By any reasonable measure the Chiefs should've lost that SB but then Mahomes did Mahomes shit and that was all she wrote.

That possibility will be there. So I don't feel any desperate need to push my chips into the center.

But that strategy was exactly what Veach tried to do. Keep everybody so the team would have one 50% shot instead of two 40% shots. And you said it was a bit of a shortsighted strategy.

[DJ's left nut]

But that strategy was exactly what Veach tried to do. Keep everybody so the team would have one 50% shot instead of two 40% shots. And you said it was a bit of a shortsighted strategy.

I agree?

Again - I don't LIKE what Veach did here. My point is that I'd take multiple shots over a single more likely shot every time.

I'm not arguing with you. I'm saying that the NFL is so beholden to random chance that over any meaningful timeline, your outcomes will be better if you pursue a more balanced approach.

Now as to last season - I kinda get that one and I'll defend it. The Chiefs hadn't won a SB in 5 decades and seemed to be cursed. They'd knocked on the door the year before and it was time to kick that fucker in. Go ahead and make some aggressive moves then.

But now it's done. The championship is won, the curse is lifted and any potential of the "Can't win the big one" for Mahomes is gone, as is the 'greatest coach without a title' crap for Andy. All of that pressure is gone.

So with that being lifted, it was time to take a more measured long-term approach rather than continue to keep the pedal down, IMO.

The 'run it back' drive is admirable and defensible. Going back to back puts you in a different, special tier. But ultimately even THAT is hindered by the fact that Jones now appears to be unwilling to play on the tag.

Which gets back to where I was on the Buckner trade thing - I just feel like perhaps Veach mis-read the room w/r/t Jones here.

[Halfcan]

If Jones chooses to hold out and we've swapped Jones for LDT, Watkins and Sorensen, we will have 'substantially lowered our odds' THIS season, IMO.

And definitely in subsequent seasons.

It seems this is a chicken and egg scenario.

If we would have cut LDT, Watkins and Sorensen- all solid guys - we would have taken a cap hit and possibly not have replacements this year. This Lowers our odds this year.

You sign Jones- who you stated before- misses his run assignments- to one of the highest contracts in chiefs history. It Helps our odds this year, while also eliminating cap flexibility in the future- which could Lower our odds.

Isn't going all in on Jones with a Mega contract- going "all In'?

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">&quot;Chris Jones is everything to that [Kansas City] defense. He is more important than Honey Badger, more important, big picture, than Tyreek Hill or Travis Kelce.&quot; <a href="https://twitter.com/AdamSchein?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@AdamSchein</a> believes that the Chiefs understand Jones&#39; importance and will get everything figured out. <a href="https://t.co/yO2pJM3MBC">pic.twitter.com/yO2pJM3MBC</a></p>&mdash; CBS Sports Network (@CBSSportsNet) <a href="https://twitter.com/CBSSportsNet/status/1278452884116512768?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 1, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">&quot;Chris Jones is everything to that [Kansas City] defense. He is more important than Honey Badger, more important, big picture, than Tyreek Hill or Travis Kelce.&quot; <a href="https://twitter.com/AdamSchein?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@AdamSchein</a> believes that the Chiefs understand Jones&#39; importance and will get everything figured out. <a href="https://t.co/yO2pJM3MBC">pic.twitter.com/yO2pJM3MBC</a></p>&mdash; CBS Sports Network (@CBSSportsNet) <a href="https://twitter.com/CBSSportsNet/status/1278452884116512768?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 1, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

WHAT A MORAN!

[RealSNR]

Again, I’m being a homer, but people are writing off the massive leap that Khalen Saunders could see in productivity this year. He’s gonna be a hell of a good player. Maybe not as good as Jones, but still a pretty good starter

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

People here seriously undervalue Jones. We don’t win the Super Bowl Without him. He is the ever player on this defense. He makes everything work. He is definitely worth 20 mil a year.

[Redbled]

WHAT A MORAN!

moran
Noun
(plural morans)

An unmarried Maasai or Samburu warrior.


Dude needs to get hitched.

[crazycoffey]

People here seriously undervalue Jones. We don’t win the Super Bowl Without him. He is the ever player on this defense. He makes everything work. He is definitely worth 20 mil a year.

Jones was also great in the playoffs against the Texans and helping come back from being behind 24 points.................................


..............................


.................

..........

.....

..

.

[hometeam]

Bottom line is we cant keep everyone.

I think that Chris Jones is going to be the first of many going forward.

[O.city]

Jones isn’t gonna sit out

He’ll eventually show up

[tmax63]

Keeping over 20 starters in this screwed up off season where draft picks and newly added players are getting "virtual" reps instead of real practice time sets them up for this fall better than any other team. It takes a lot less time to knock off the rust than to learn a whole new system. If CJ wants to increase his earnings the smart thing is to play his ass off for 16mil this year and bank 22-25mil per next year. A 2nd ring and a great year and he might be the #1 interior DL in people's eyes after next year.

[PAChiefsGuy]

Bottom line is we cant keep everyone.

I think that Chris Jones is going to be the first of many going forward.

Yeah that's just the reality of the Mahomes contract that is coming.

[wazu]

It feels like this will be the biggest “nobody gives a shit” holdout by a franchise tag player ever.

[kcjayhawks5]

I like Chris Jones. I want keep Chris Jones. Hope keep Chris Jones.

[Shields68]

Jones isn’t gonna sit out

He’ll eventually show up

Yeah my understanding is the new CBA makes it difficult for a player to hold out. I think it is more bluster prior to July 15th. Probably some disappointment in that I believe Veech was going to pay him prior to the covid thing now a potential decrease in the cap makes it hard.

But if he plays or does not play on the tag you can still deal him for a pick or two in the off season. Just will be hard to trade him and him getting paid, what he wants, in a year the cap decreases.

[kcclone]

Jones isn’t gonna sit out

He’ll eventually show up



100%. $16m is nothing to sneeze at for a guy who hasn't made a lot in his career.

He'll play. And honestly, I don't blame him one bit for sitting out camp. He has nothing to prove in camp and doesn't need to risk the injury.

[Chiefspants]

I am equally baffled by the overwhelming amount of twitter commenters saying Jones' performance in the Super Bowl was "overrated" as I am by those saying we have to lock up 200m in our defensive line. I remember we talked about the writing on the wall about this situation being there when we traded for Clark. I love Jones. He brings an atypical skillset to the position and has a mentality on that defensive line that comes up clutch when the lights are brightest.

If Andy and the coaching staff aren't willing to pay him 20m/year (his market price), that should tell us something. I think I've grown a bit more accepting of Jones going elsewhere after watching Kollman's breakdowns of Jones' run defense. Jones run D never stopped being a liability through the end of the season. He was often out of position or missed run assignments and had to be bailed out by other players. He came up huge in the playoffs/Super Bowl, no doubt, but it makes me wonder if that's why the Chiefs are more hesitant to make a deal than previously indicated.

If he ends up going elsewhere, I wish him the best. The dude had a straight up legendary performance in the Super Bowl and we don't win a title without him. He should never have to pay for a meal in KC ever again.

[RealSNR]

People here seriously undervalue Jones. We don’t win the Super Bowl Without him. He is the ever player on this defense. He makes everything work. He is definitely worth 20 mil a year.

Things that are worth what they cost are nice and all, but that's irrelevant if you can't afford them.

The Chiefs can't afford Jones at $20 million. It fucking sucks that we're giving Jones' money to Frank fucking Clark instead, but that's the reality.

(Note: Yes, Frank Clark finally showed up. But right now would you rather keep Frank Clark for the long term or Chris Jones for the long term? I'd much rather keep Jones)

[YayMike]

I am equally baffled by the overwhelming amount of twitter commenters saying Jones' performance in the Super Bowl was "overrated" as I am by those saying we have to lock up 200m in our defensive line. I remember we talked about the writing on the wall about this situation being there when we traded for Clark. I love Jones. He brings an atypical skillset to the position and has a mentality on that defensive line that comes up clutch when the lights are brightest.

If Andy and the coaching staff aren't willing to pay him 20m/year (his market price), that should tell us something. I think I've grown a bit more accepting of Jones going elsewhere after watching Kollman's breakdowns of Jones' run defense. Jones run D never stopped being a liability through the end of the season. He was often out of position or missed run assignments and had to be bailed out by other players. He came up huge in the playoffs/Super Bowl, no doubt, but it makes me wonder if that's why the Chiefs are more hesitant to make a deal than previously indicated.

If he ends up going elsewhere, I wish him the best. The dude had a straight up legendary performance in the Super Bowl and we don't win a title without him. He should never have to pay for a meal in KC ever again.

Perfectly stated!

[Demonpenz]

this is why veach is on the hotseat because of shit like this

[Demonpenz]

100%. $16m is nothing to sneeze at for a guy who hasn't made a lot in his career.

He'll play. And honestly, I don't blame him one bit for sitting out camp. He has nothing to prove in camp and doesn't need to risk the injury.

please wear a mask

[FloridaMan88]

Bottom line is Mahomes gives the Chiefs the luxury/buffer of not needing to be great (and pay for top level talent) at every position.

Chris Jones and probably any non-PMIII player is not worth $20 million/year with this new reality.

[Bill Brasky]

Random Vikings fan seems nice. At least he's realistic about compensation. He's not trying to do some stupid Madden bullshit like, "How about a 3rd and a 4th for Jones????"

Would two Minnesota 1st rounders do it for you if we couldn't keep Jones and had to trade him?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/RegGo1URLJw" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I don't see any chance we get two firsts. I would take that in a heartbeat.

Let's talk more realistic. How about a first and a third?

[Bill Brasky]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">&quot;Chris Jones is everything to that [Kansas City] defense. He is more important than Honey Badger, more important, big picture, than Tyreek Hill or Travis Kelce.&quot; <a href="https://twitter.com/AdamSchein?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@AdamSchein</a> believes that the Chiefs understand Jones&#39; importance and will get everything figured out. <a href="https://t.co/yO2pJM3MBC">pic.twitter.com/yO2pJM3MBC</a></p>&mdash; CBS Sports Network (@CBSSportsNet) <a href="https://twitter.com/CBSSportsNet/status/1278452884116512768?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 1, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

That's the dumbest thing I've read on this board. Hill and Kelce are the cornerstones of the most explosive offense in the NFL.

[RunKC]

Regardless of what happens to Jones, I think we need to focus our efforts on WR and pass rusher.

If we lose out on Chris Jones, I’d like to try to get Taco extended for a fair price. I think that guy is going to get at least 6 sacks this season. Wouldn’t surprise me if he got 10.

Ogbah got a 2 year $15 million deal, so a potential $10 to 12 million AAV for Taco is half of what Jones wants. Could make that work.

[RealSNR]

I don't see any chance we get two firsts. I would take that in a heartbeat.

Let's talk more realistic. How about a first and a third?

I know this guy is just a fan and not a GM, but he's not only open to two 1st round picks for Jones, but he's pounding the table and advocating it.

In the end, I don't think Spielman would go for that, but I think we could see a 1st and a 2nd, perhaps.

[Shields68]

I don't see any chance we get two firsts. I would take that in a heartbeat.

Let's talk more realistic. How about a first and a third?

There is a huge difference in a high first or a low first. Mid to low first is probably what your looking at from Minnesota so you would want at least something close to what we gave up for Clark. (throw in a 2nd or 3rd) Edit- He is under a nonexclusive tag so the Vikings fan might be saying two firsts automatically gets him, if you agree to a contract with Jones and why bother negotiating with the Chiefs.

But that assumes you believe the holdout rumors and that his market will be worse in the off season. I would roll the dice that he plays this year under the tag and deal him before next years draft. Might as well go for the ring.

[RunKC]

I think Veach might be able to make this work.

Obviously offload players like LDT and Okafor.

Push the can down the road by extending Landlord and Kelce and creating money (Justified)

Big key for us is Niang. If he can be a solid replacement for Fisher in 2021, then that would go a long way for us to have $13 million to put towards Chris.

[Chiefshrink]

Bottom line is Mahomes gives the Chiefs the luxury/buffer of not needing to be great (and pay for top level talent) at every position.

Chris Jones and probably any non-PMIII player is not worth $20 million/year with this new reality.

Logic rules.:thumb:

[Chiefspants]

Sorry for this comparison non-royals fans, but Chris Jones has always felt like the Eric Hosmer of the Chiefs 2019-2020 team.

He brings an uncharacteristic skillset to his position and the team and is just, unbelievably clutch in the biggest moments. I mean three knockdowns in the 4th quarter? Two that prevent sure completions to Kittle - one of which would have extended the Niners drive when we were down 20-17 and conceivably could have ended the game for us. Not only that, the Niners were so worried about Jones on passing plays that they triple teamed him and he still managed a knockdown. I mean holy ****. That is legendary stuff right there, just like Eric Hosmer going 0-3 with 3 lazy groundouts before becoming Babe Ruth in the bottom of the 9th inning down 2 runs.

Like Hosmer, Chris Jones struggles at the fundamentals of the position. There are two schools of thought about this. Keysor, for example, believes Jones more than makes up for it with his pass rushing, and that because of the Chiefs high powered offense, this more than makes up for Jones' struggles on running D. Kollmann, OTOH, disagrees, specifically because Jones is such a liability on running defense that other players have to compensate for Jones' weaknesses. This is especially a problem if the Chiefs have so much money locked up in Jones that they can't afford to lock up talent in other positions on the defense. Similar to Hosmer, some have suggested that Jones' strengths won't age well, and that the moment he loses a step his pass rushing will take a major hit, and that his lack of fundamentals on rushing defense would make him a complete liability on defense. We saw this happen with Hosmer the instant he got his new contract, as once his raw talent lost a step he took major steps back at the plate and on defense.

Now, there's always the chance that Jones will continue to be an absolute pass rushing force, and if that's the case, whoever gives him 5/105 money will be in good shape for a long time - but there's always a chance that the cynics will prove to be right (like they were with Hosmer) and that a contract like that will prove to be an albatross quite quickly. Like Hosmer, I'll forever love Jones and what he did to get us a title, but I think I'm going to be supportive of whatever the Chiefs decide to do in this case. Jones even has that Hosmer like swag on the D, getting in Brady's face was the stuff of champions in Foxboro this year, as was him arising at the best possible moment in the SB (and forcing that early INT off of Jimmy G).

[Dante84]

Sorry for this comparison non-royals fans, but Chris Jones has always felt like the Eric Hosmer of the Chiefs 2020 team.

He brings an uncharacteristic skillset to the team and is just, unbelievably clutch in the biggest moments. I mean three knockdowns in the 4th quarter? Two that prevent sure completions to Kittle - one of which would have extended the Niners drive when we were down 20-17 and conceivably could have ended the game for us. Not only that, the Niners were so worried about Jones on passing plays that they triple teamed him and he still managed a knockdown. I mean holy ****. That is legendary stuff right there, just like Eric Hosmer going 0-3 with 3 lazy groundouts before becoming Babe Ruth in the bottom of the 9th inning down 2 runs.

Like Hosmer, Chris Jones struggles at the fundamentals of the position. There are two schools of thought about this. Keysor, for example, believes Jones more than makes up for it with his pass rushing, and that because of the Chiefs high powered offense, this more than makes up for Jones' struggles on running D. Kollmann, OTOH, disagrees, specifically because Jones is such a liability on running defense that other players have to compensate for Jones' weaknesses. This is especially a problem if the Chiefs have so much money locked up in Jones that they can't afford to lock up talent in other positions on the defense. Similar to Hosmer, some have suggested that Jones' strengths won't age well, and that the moment he loses a step his pass rushing will take a major hit, and that his lack of fundamentals on rushing defense would make him a complete liability on defense.

Now, there's always the chance that Jones will continue to be an absolute pass rushing force, and if that's the case, whoever gives him 5/105 money will be in good shape for a long time - but there's always a chance that the cynics will prove to be right (like they were with Hosmer) and that a contract like that will prove to be an albatross quite quickly. Like Hosmer, I'll forever love Jones and what he did to get us a title, but I think I'm going to be supportive of whatever the Chiefs decide to do in this case. Jones even has that Hosmer like swag on the D, getting in Brady's face was the stuff of legends in Foxboro this year, as was him arising at the best possible moment in the SB (and forcing that early INT off of Jimmy G).

Great post. Thanks for that.

The 3 options are:

1. Force him to play on Franchise tag (if he plays), but risk team morale and also have diminished leverage in 2021

2. Trade him while his value will never be higher, but lose a critical star player

3. Sign him to a long-term and deal, but have cap limitations for future years


What's your preference?

[Halfcan]

Great post. Thanks for that.

The 3 options are:

1. Force him to play on Franchise tag (if he plays), but risk team morale and also have diminished leverage in 2021

2. Trade him while his value will never be higher, but lose a critical star player

3. Sign him to a long-term and deal, but have cap limitations for future years


What's your preference?

:clap:

I think the Chiefs make him play on the tag this year.

[Chiefspants]

Great post. Thanks for that.

The 3 options are:

1. Force him to play on Franchise tag (if he plays), but risk team morale and also have diminished leverage in 2021

2. Trade him while his value will never be higher, but lose a critical star player
What's your preference?

That’s a tough one, for me it all depends on what’s being offered in return. I honestly think the DeForest Buckner trade kneecapped the Chiefs leverage in multiple ways. I'm guessing the Chiefs would have never sent Jones to an ascending AFC competitor like the Colts for obvious reason (which never made the Colts a viable trading partner) But the move also locked in Jones price at 21m/year (which the Chiefs seem against spending) and it also may have ended the Chiefs hopes of other teams getting into a bidding war for Jones’ services. I worry that the compensation for a trade at this point will be in the Marcus Peters range (2nd and a 4th) rather than in the Buckner range.

If the Chiefs DO get a 1st round offer from an NFC team, I wonder if the Chiefs would take it. For one, it prevents Jones from going to an AFC rival and gives Chiefs some control over where he goes, but if the Chiefs are only getting marginal offers for Jones, I think the Chiefs should go with the tag and maybe offer a 1/22 deal as an olive branch to max out his year compensation. This gives them the option to reassess their cap space after locking up Mahomes and if the NFL adds significantly more room after next season. My biggest fear with this scenario is that it could allow Jones to become the 2020's Neil Smith and go straight to the Raiders or another AFC heavy hitter, and with our weaknesses on the IOL that is straight up nightmare fuel to imagine Jones going after Pat 2-3 times a year. Luckily, we now have the star QB on our roster who can over come taking that type of pressure in high stakes situations, but it's still not a scenario that's fun to think about.

But, if the Chiefs surprise everyone with a 5/105 deal, I won’t be against that either. I have complete faith in the Chiefs FO at this point.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Dominique Foxworth made a great point. With Jones on the field opposing QBs QBR are 32 which is basically Mason Rudolph. With Jones off the field QBs are 64 which is Carson Wentz. He single handedly changes this defense

[Dante84]

Is it possible to restructure the contract so that:

- it's the exact same scenario as the tag and retains the ability to retag next year
- but pays him 21-22million this year?

If so, that could be a win-win. He gets more money immediately, can get to his next contract and still cash in within 1-2 years, and we can double-tag him next year, extend him, or trade him.

[GoHuge]

I'm perfectly fine with him sitting out this year or whatever. I have been against giving him a big money deal from the start. Does he get to the QB and cause havoc in passing situations...yes. Is he absolutely terrible against the run...a much bigger yes. I don't know if he just doesn't like playing against the run, but if you watch him on tape he looks like Lenny from "Of Mice and Men." Just completely lost and never gap sound. Ends up in the backfield as the RB is already past the line of scrimmage. Frank Clark is a complete player. He is as good against the run as he is pressuring the QB. I don't care if we get nothing for him either if it means not signing him long-term. We've seen enough of these big money signings that we should have learned our lesson by now. I like the guy and he is entertaining, we might not have won the Super Bowl without the batted balls in the 4th, but I think we would have still found a way. Just watch the tape and if you disagree with my take on him that's your right, but there is no denying he is a liability against the run. I don't know why I think this about the man, but he just seems like a guy who's performance falls off a cliff once he gets paid. Or maybe I have watched the Chiefs (pre-Veach) make signings that were all disasters. There's the paying Pat factor, but I don't think the Chiefs are seriously considering signing him long-term. Think they are saying one more year and we're done. If CJ wants to pass on $16 million for one year then I am fine with him being a moron. Either way I hope that they don't sign him long-term. No right or wrong opinions on this deal just like there is no obvious correct solution.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

FYI Jones has a better run stop rate than Fletcher Cox

[Wallcrawler]

Trade him to the Jets in a deal for Jamal Adams. Adams replacess Sorensen in the box. Speaks/Charlton/Pennel replace Jones.

We came back from down 24 without the guy on the field. Hes a luxury, not a neccessity.

[Kiimo]

We exhausted that argument but most agree. If we could get Adams in a trade I'd do it in a second.

[BossChief]

Here’s the business end of it.

Chiefs re-sign Jones to 5/106 with a 20m signing bonus...and no football is played due to this virus. That’s a real possibility. The first part of any contract is fully guaranteed...then the cap hits gradually go up. We will have lost that advantage.

At the same time, if the salary cap stays flat from this thing...Mahomes comes first. Period.

Can’t sign Chris and chance making negotiations with Mahomes difficult.

Bad timing for Chris. If I’m him, I sign that tender and go to work before they possibly cancel the season and KC pulls the tag.

[kccrow]

Trade him. Should have traded him in the spring.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Dominique Foxworth made a great point. With Jones on the field opposing QBs QBR are 32 which is basically Mason Rudolph. With Jones off the field QBs are 64 which is Carson Wentz. He single handedly changes this defense

Yet I have to read dumbass Hosmer comparisons

[Dante84]

Why isn’t the cap assigned 2 years in advance?

Serious question.

[Chiefspants]

Yet I have to read dumbass Hosmer comparisons

Love you, PGM :)

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Yet I have to read dumbass Hosmer comparisons

It’s fucking retarded!! Jones is the most crucial player on this defense

[srvy]

I think Veach might be able to make this work.

Obviously offload players like LDT and Okafor.

Push the can down the road by extending Landlord and Kelce and creating money (Justified)

Big key for us is Niang. If he can be a solid replacement for Fisher in 2021, then that would go a long way for us to have $13 million to put towards Chris.

Hw will have to convince Clark Mark Donovan and Jones. That's a lot of convincing.

[suzzer99]

People here seriously undervalue Jones. We don’t win the Super Bowl Without him. He is the ever player on this defense. He makes everything work. He is definitely worth 20 mil a year.

He was absolute nails on those last few drives in the SB - when we had to have a stop.

I still have Matthieu over Jones though in terms of indispensable value. But Jones over Clark.

[Chiefspants]

It’s ****ing retarded!! Jones is the most crucial player on this defense

I don’t disagree with his importance and have sung his praises this entire thread, homie. Signing Jones will most likely put us in a “stars and scraps” situation (think I borrowed that phrase from Duncan). Jones may be so important to our front office that they make the signing anyway - but maybe not.

As Chiefs fans, I can’t recall the last time we let go of a player as dominant and as young as Jones. Marcus Peters was great, but his trade made sense, especially if his rumored beef with Patrick was legit.

In the past, our decent QB’s made only decent money, allowing the Chiefs to pretty much keep their talent at other positions. Now that we have the best QB in the NFL, we may have to get used to difficult partings with star players every once in a while.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

I don’t disagree with his importance and have sung his praises this entire thread, homie. Signing Jones will most likely put us in a “stars and scraps” situation. Jones may be so important to our front office that they make the signing anyway - but maybe not.

As Chiefs fans, I can’t recall the last time we let go of a player as dominant and as young as Jones. Marcus Peters was great, but his trade made sense, especially if his rumored beef with Patrick was legit.

In the past, our decent QB’s made only decent money, allowing the Chiefs to pretty much keep their talent at other positions. Now that we have the best QB in the NFL, we may have to get used to difficult partings with star players every once in a while.

We could’ve used Watkins money for Jones....

[RINGLEADER]

We could’ve used Watkins money for Jones....

While I’ve argued that you need to equip Mahomes with all the talent possible, it will indeed suck if Jones isn’t signed because of a layer that won’t be with the team after this season.

It’s a tough situation all around but I think it has less to do with a desire to keep Jones and more to do with Covid uncertainty and getting Mahomes signed long-term.

[Direckshun]

I think it’s increasingly clear they aren’t going to keep Jones.

You don’t offer Andrus Peat $45m this offseason if you have ntendes to keep Jones.

[duncan_idaho]

We could’ve used Watkins money for Jones....


Nonfactor.

Jones’ cap hit in year 1 of an extension is 99 percent certain to be less than his cap hit on the franchise tag.

One-year moves like Watkins aren’t the issue here. Fitting him into the plans long-term and in 2021 IF the cap drops is the key factor.

[Shields68]

Nonfactor.

Jones’ cap hit in year 1 of an extension is 99 percent certain to be less than his cap hit on the franchise tag.

One-year moves like Watkins aren’t the issue here. Fitting him into the plans long-term and in 2021 IF the cap drops is the key factor.

That and Watkins restructured his contract. He was going to have a cap hit if we cut him. There was not a lot of cap room difference between his restructured deal and the cap hit.

[RealSNR]

I think it’s increasingly clear they aren’t going to keep Jones.

You don’t offer Andrus Peat $45m this offseason if you have ntendes to keep Jones.

Wait, we were trying to acquire Andrus Peat? Not doubting it, but it's just the first I've heard of it.

[penguinz]

Wait, we were trying to acquire Andrus Peat? Not doubting it, but it's just the first I've heard of it.

Yep, Saints outbid to keep him.

[RunKC]

Pretty telling that per that report Veach and co never saw Jones as a $20 million player and did not ask for it. Just seems like they are so far apart here that neither want a deal at this point, which syncs up with the “they aren’t even discussing this deal” report.

As much as I think we can keep him, it’s hard to think Jones will be here long term.

I will say that Veach was absolutely right to pay Frank Clark last year, even with Chris wanting a deal. If this is a choice we have to make between Frank and Chris, then I think the right move was made to pay Frank.

[RealSNR]

Do you think Jones would be satisfied with only like a 2-year extension as long as the numbers were close to averaging out at $20 million/yr? That at least buys the Chiefs some time when the actual big money of Mahomes' new deal is really going to take effect (we still have the 4th year and the 5th year option to play out). At that point if we want Jones to continue being the focal point, we can do the shift arounds. Bad deals like the Hitchens and LDT contracts will be over and done with. We'll finally be done giving money to Eric Berry. Watkins will be gone. And as we're figuring out our future extensions, we may decide we can still keep Jones, or we might be satisfied enough with the other interior DL. Right now we're quite deep at that spot, but a lot can change in that time.

Also, we've been kind of lean on the draft picks the past couple years (in terms of numbers of players we're drafting). As we let go of players, we're going to get more picks to replace them. We have options.

Just thinking out loud. Not saying that's the answer, but it could be a place to start. It would show some greater faith on the organization's part towards Jones, and he'd get what he deserves.

[TEX]

Do you think Jones would be satisfied with only like a 2-year extension as long as the numbers were close to averaging out at $20 million/yr? That at least buys the Chiefs some time when the actual big money of Mahomes' new deal is really going to take effect (we still have the 4th year and the 5th year option to play out). At that point if we want Jones to continue being the focal point, we can do the shift arounds. Bad deals like the Hitchens and LDT contracts will be over and done with. We'll finally be done giving money to Eric Berry. Watkins will be gone. And as we're figuring out our future extensions, we may decide we can still keep Jones, or we might be satisfied enough with the other interior DL. Right now we're quite deep at that spot, but a lot can change in that time.

Also, we've been kind of lean on the draft picks the past couple years (in terms of numbers of players we're drafting). As we let go of players, we're going to get more picks to replace them. We have options.

Just thinking out loud. Not saying that's the answer, but it could be a place to start. It would show some greater faith on the organization's part towards Jones, and he'd get what he deserves.

I think you raised an excellent point. I was thinking about that when all this went down. He counts $16M now - KC can find another $4M for the upcoming season. Can also make it work for the next one. Watkins? LDT? Dan? Etc.. The $$$ would virtually be all guaranteed...After that, then decisions will need to be made. So, he can have his $20M per NOW and 2021, but someone else may be paying it year 3. Chris will still be young at 28 so he just may be willing to do it b/c he will be young enough to warrant another big contract. This may very well be the way deals more readily go in the future.

[BossChief]

Jones did a telling interview with Colon Cowherd (iirc it was him) before the new CBA was signed talking about his contract situation and the CBA where he made a couple comments that I think we’re telling.

1) Colin asked him if the owners came to the players with a fair deal, would he agree to it and Chris went into talking about other things that would need addressed before he would agree to it. That interview changed my perception of him a bit. It made him seem unreasonable and not willing to take a fair deal.

2) He talked about Veach and his conversation being around “who the team can let walk and who they can’t (in terms of depth)” and it made me think of Veaches choices since he became GM. Drafting Nnadi and Saunders with significant picks.

[DaneMcCloud]

If it wasn't for that complete freak of nature, Aaron Donald, Chris Jones would be viewed as the best interior lineman in the NFL and his numbers back that up.

There is also absolutely no doubt that Jones has earned a $20 million dollar per year contract because he's a game changer who's relentless and a force of nature when healthy.

If I was Jones or his agent, I'd advise him to holdout, too, and there's no way I'd play on the Franchise Tag, either. What if he's injured or tears an ACL mid-season? There's no way a team would offer him a $100 million dollar deal coming off of injury, while missing prime years.

With all of the uncertainty about this season and without new TV contracts in place, I don't think that any team can compete for a Super Bowl title when they're paying three players in excess of $20 million per year.

Had COVID not wrecked this year for sports, maybe the NFL's new TV contracts would have allowed the Chiefs to sign Jones to the type of contract he's earned but with so much uncertainty, not only in 2020 but for future years as well, I believe the best course of action for both parties is a sign and trade deal.

It's an unfortunate reality but I think it's more likely than not that he'll be on another roster once the season begins.

[BossChief]

Why isn’t the cap assigned 2 years in advance?

Serious question.
Because it’s based on income.
If it wasn't for that complete freak of nature, Aaron Donald, Chris Jones would be viewed as the best interior lineman in the NFL and his numbers back that up.

There is also absolutely no doubt that Jones has earned a $20 million dollar per year contract because he's a game changer who's relentless and a force of nature when healthy.

If I was Jones or his agent, I'd advise him to holdout, too, and there's no way I'd play on the Franchise Tag, either. What if he's injured or tears an ACL mid-season? There's no way a team would offer him a $100 million dollar deal coming off of injury, while missing prime years.

With all of the uncertainty about this season and without new TV contracts in place, I don't think that any team can compete for a Super Bowl title when they're paying three players in excess of $20 million per year.

Had COVID not wrecked this year for sports, maybe the NFL's new TV contracts would have allowed the Chiefs to sign Jones to the type of contract he's earned but with so much uncertainty, not only in 2020 but for future years as well, I believe the best course of action for both parties is a sign and trade deal.

It's an unfortunate reality but I think it's more likely than not that he'll be on another roster once the season begins.

Exactly.

[DaneMcCloud]

Why isn’t the cap assigned 2 years in advance?

Serious question.

The salary cap changes each and every year due to new deals made by the NFL, whether it's licensing, advertising, additional corporate sponsors or changes to their broadcasting deals.

In 2018, Fox began broadcasting games on Thursday nights, something that wasn't in affect in prior years. Amazon began broadcasting Thursday night games as well on Prime, while the NFL made changes to the playoff schedule to allow more games to be seen in Prime Time, which increases their rates while the networks can charge more for advertising as well.

If there's a season this year, there's no doubt that the NFL's revenues will slip due to empty stadiums. While some predict it could be as much as $100 million in total revenues to per team, others say it could be less.

The bottom line is that the NFL's revenues are always changing and while they've never actually decreased, that could happen in 2020, which is just another reason why it's basically impossible for them to set a Salary Cap number years in advance when the cap itself is based on expected total revenue.

[JakeF]

"Chris Jones is everything to that [Kansas City] defense. He is more important than Honey Badger, more important, big picture, than Tyreek Hill or Travis Kelce."

@AdamSchein believes that the Chiefs understand Jones' importance and will get everything figured out.
Total bullshit, even Mathieu is more important than Jones. If Clark stays healthy he should show a better game too.

We should have traded Jones for draft picks in the 2020 draft. A couple of 1st round picks this year would have been handy.

[Dante84]

I get how it’s currently set up. What I want to know is why they can’t push the cap adjustments out just one year and recognize the lift/decrease the following year?

Having the next years cap number in hand while negotiating the majority of your contracts would seem to be very helpful. Plus, the owners get to keep the dollars an extra year.

[RunKC]

If it wasn't for that complete freak of nature, Aaron Donald, Chris Jones would be viewed as the best interior lineman in the NFL and his numbers back that up.

There is also absolutely no doubt that Jones has earned a $20 million dollar per year contract because he's a game changer who's relentless and a force of nature when healthy.

If I was Jones or his agent, I'd advise him to holdout, too, and there's no way I'd play on the Franchise Tag, either. What if he's injured or tears an ACL mid-season? There's no way a team would offer him a $100 million dollar deal coming off of injury, while missing prime years.

With all of the uncertainty about this season and without new TV contracts in place, I don't think that any team can compete for a Super Bowl title when they're paying three players in excess of $20 million per year.

Had COVID not wrecked this year for sports, maybe the NFL's new TV contracts would have allowed the Chiefs to sign Jones to the type of contract he's earned but with so much uncertainty, not only in 2020 but for future years as well, I believe the best course of action for both parties is a sign and trade deal.

It's an unfortunate reality but I think it's more likely than not that he'll be on another roster once the season begins.

Per Garafalo the Chiefs don’t and apparently have never viewed him as a $20 million asset. That’s the big question.

Garafalo was obviously told that from KC. He’s got no reason to make that up, rifht?

If true, I wonder why that is? It’s been well documented that Chris Jones is not great on first down, so it leads me to believe that they might think Chris is not complete player.
The other elephant in the room is availability. Chris was injured in 2017 and 2018 playoff games, so Chris being unavailable in the playoffs for a 3rd straight season might have really supported their decision, especially if it was due to a basketball locker room incident (not sure I buy that).

I agree with you that it seems like Chris Jones is not going to be here long term. I think that if that report is true that they don’t view him like he views himself, the ideal situation is keeping him on the tag this year and then trading him for assets to use in the draft next spring.

[Redbled]

Per Garafalo the Chiefs don’t and apparently have never viewed him as a $20 million asset. That’s the big question.

Garafalo was obviously told that from KC. He’s got no reason to make that up, rifht?

If true, I wonder why that is? It’s been well documented that Chris Jones is not great on first down, so it leads me to believe that they might think Chris is not complete player.
The other elephant in the room is availability. Chris was injured in 2017 and 2018 playoff games, so Chris being unavailable in the playoffs for a 3rd straight season might have really supported their decision, especially if it was due to a basketball locker room incident (not sure I buy that).

I agree with you that it seems like Chris Jones is not going to be here long term. I think that if that report is true that they don’t view him like he views himself, the ideal situation is keeping him on the tag this year and then trading him for assets to use in the draft next spring.

Does anyone believe he’s worth Donald money? He’s great sure but not a game by game wrecker.

[TomBarndtsTwin]

Does anyone believe he’s worth Donald money? He’s great sure but not a game by game wrecker.

No, he’s not.

I like Jones and wish he could remain a Chief, but at the price he’s asking? No thanks.

For all his greatness in the 4th quarter of the Super Bowl, he was largely invisible (or not playing) in every other playoff game of his Chiefs career. You don’t pay Aaron Donald money for someone like that. No matter how thankful you may be to them for helping you win your first Super Bowl in 50 years.

You thank them, wish them the best, and move right the fuck along.

[RealSNR]

I entertained trading Jones for the right price early in the offseason, and I'm open to that now, but come on, people. Chris Jones is a more valuable cog to this defense than Frank fucking Clark.

Frank Clark is a DE. Chris Jones plays primarily on the interior, but he's demonstrated he can play a 5-technique and still get 15 sacks! You can play him anywhere. Getting INTERIOR pressure is worth its weight in gold. You need pressure from the ends, yes, that's not to minimize the important role that Clark plays, but when you do what Jones is able to do, and you ask, "Which one is better to have on your defense?" the answer is CLEARLY Chris Jones.

We could probably be fine without Jones, but that's only because Nnadi, Pennel, and Saunders are pretty good as an interior trio. We could lose Clark, and yeah, we'd be screwed at DE, but we'd still be able to get pressure with Jones.

That's the difference between the two.

[keg in kc]

I'm not sure that's necessarily true, Jones being more valuable than Clark. At least not at a time where Jones still struggles to play within the designed structure of the defense and freelances himself out of plays multiple times a game. Which is not to diminish how special a player he is in terms of pure ability, just that he can giveth and he can taketh away, so to speak, often from one play to the next.

[BryanBusby]

I think if CJ wants an avg of 20, you find a way to make it work and just backfill the contract.

I'd venture he wants to be paid more than AD to reset the market and wants a large chunk of guaranteed $$$$$ early on and that's what's going to keep a contract from getting done.

[R Clark]

[QUOTE=RealSNR;15051742]I entertained trading Jones for the right price early in the offseason, and I'm open to that now, but come on, people. Chris Jones is a more valuable cog to this defense than Frank ****ing Clark.

Frank Clark is a DE. Chris Jones plays primarily on the interior, but he's demonstrated he can play a 5-technique and still get 15 sacks! You can play him anywhere. Getting INTERIOR pressure is worth its weight in gold. You need pressure from the ends, yes, that's not to minimize the important role that Clark plays, but when you do what Jones is able to do, and you ask, "Which one is better to have on your defense?" the answer is CLEARLY Chris Jones.

We could probably be fine without Jones, but that's only because Nnadi, Pennel, and Saunders are pretty good as an interior trio. We could lose Clark, and yeah, we'd be screwed at DE, but we'd still be able to get pressure with Jones.

That's the difference between the two.[ I’d take clark anytime over Jones, but I’d love to have them both.

[DaneMcCloud]

I get how it’s currently set up. What I want to know is why they can’t push the cap adjustments out just one year and recognize the lift/decrease the following year?

Having the next years cap number in hand while negotiating the majority of your contracts would seem to be very helpful. Plus, the owners get to keep the dollars an extra year.

What you're suggesting would fundamentally change the entire league and how business is conducted.

Teams wouldn't sign many, if any, players to long term contracts because of uncertainty with their various revenue streams. And like this offseason, teams would be unwilling to commit to any free agents long term, regardless of whether or not it's an extension or a pure free agent, because of the uncertainty of would the cap would be in two, three or four years from now.

Sure, the Chiefs could sign Mahomes to a large extension but under this scenario, many teams would either be way under the cap or way over, especially if the expected increases, which have occurred over the past 10 years of the current CBA, actually turns out to be a decrease in revenue.

In that scenario, teams would be struggling to fit their players under the cap, which would likely result in higher paid players being shown the door, making those teams less competitive.

The bottom line is that it's just impossible for the NFL and its teams to plan 2 years in advance, especially at this juncture, due to expiring broadcasting rights in 2021.

[BossChief]

I entertained trading Jones for the right price early in the offseason, and I'm open to that now, but come on, people. Chris Jones is a more valuable cog to this defense than Frank fucking Clark.

Frank Clark is a DE. Chris Jones plays primarily on the interior, but he's demonstrated he can play a 5-technique and still get 15 sacks! You can play him anywhere. Getting INTERIOR pressure is worth its weight in gold. You need pressure from the ends, yes, that's not to minimize the important role that Clark plays, but when you do what Jones is able to do, and you ask, "Which one is better to have on your defense?" the answer is CLEARLY Chris Jones.

We could probably be fine without Jones, but that's only because Nnadi, Pennel, and Saunders are pretty good as an interior trio. We could lose Clark, and yeah, we'd be screwed at DE, but we'd still be able to get pressure with Jones.

That's the difference between the two.

I think Jones is a unicorn. Said it for quite some time now. I think he has rare talents that if harnessed with hard work throughout his career will end up in the HOF. I compared his body style and the way he plays to Reggie White and still think that’s accurate.

But Clark brings a mentality this DL didn’t have without him...even though they had Houston and Ford on the edges and Jones in the middle. They were soft.

I’d love to see Veach find a way to keep Jones long term and for him to continue to be coached up to continue to improve, but it appears the situation with the cap won’t allow that...or maybe it will and we see extensions for Mahomes and Jones on July 15th.

[RunKC]

I entertained trading Jones for the right price early in the offseason, and I'm open to that now, but come on, people. Chris Jones is a more valuable cog to this defense than Frank ****ing Clark.

Frank Clark is a DE. Chris Jones plays primarily on the interior, but he's demonstrated he can play a 5-technique and still get 15 sacks! You can play him anywhere. Getting INTERIOR pressure is worth its weight in gold. You need pressure from the ends, yes, that's not to minimize the important role that Clark plays, but when you do what Jones is able to do, and you ask, "Which one is better to have on your defense?" the answer is CLEARLY Chris Jones.

We could probably be fine without Jones, but that's only because Nnadi, Pennel, and Saunders are pretty good as an interior trio. We could lose Clark, and yeah, we'd be screwed at DE, but we'd still be able to get pressure with Jones.

That's the difference between the two.

Sorry man Frank is far more valuable than Chris and that was proven last season.

[JakeF]

I think Jones is a unicorn. Said it for quite some time now. I think he has rare talents that if harnessed with hard work throughout his career will end up in the HOF. I compared his body style and the way he plays to Reggie White and still think that’s accurate.

But Clark brings a mentality this DL didn’t have without him...even though they had Houston and Ford on the edges and Jones in the middle. They were soft.

I’d love to see Veach find a way to keep Jones long term and for him to continue to be coached up to continue to improve, but it appears the situation with the cap won’t allow that...or maybe it will and we see extensions for Mahomes and Jones on July 15th.If Jones is such a Unicorn then why aren't teams lining up to get him away from KC during this contract situation?

[BossChief]

If Jones is such a Unicorn then why aren't teams lining up to get him away from KC during this contract situation?

Nobody would know if they already were or not.

[tk13]

I would imagine Jones is more valuable to most teams just because finding interior guys who can get pressure like that aren't very common, and most GMs and coaches want that more than anything these days.

[PAChiefsGuy]

Sorry man Frank is far more valuable than Chris and that was proven last season.

'Far more valuable' is a bit of a stretch. Clark brought a much needed attitude change to the D and he is better against the run than Jones but Jones is much more of a force to be reckoned with when it comes to pass rushing. Jones didn't have a ton of sacks this year but he is without a question our main pass rushing threat.

i'd say it's about even. Both great players with different strengths and weaknesses. They complement each other well too.

I think signing Jones to a huge deal isn't worth it for Chiefs since we have Reid/Mahomes and are already paying a ton to Frank Clark. But he deserves to get paid a lot by another team who needs a good pass rushing DT to help get their defense and team to the next level. He's a good player but if I'm Veach I'd let him go.

[DaneMcCloud]

Nobody would know if they already were or not.

Yep.

The Colts just gave up #13 overall to the 49ers for DeForest Buckner, a defensive tackle with similar numbers to Chris Jones in the past 4 four seasons, then gave him an extension worth $21 million per season.

If/When Veach decides to trade Jones, he'll definitely get at least a 1st rounder for Jones and maybe more, depending on the slot.

And just like Buckner, fans may not know that a trade is or has been in the works until it's announced.

[WhiteWhale]

Why do you care?

The main reason I bailed on this site was most of this board insisting he was a liability and the main problem with our defense.

That position didn't get less stupid. Y'all should be happy to trade this "terrible" player while people think hes good.

[Chiefspants]

Why do you care?

The main reason I bailed on this site was most of this board insisting he was a liability and the main problem with our defense.

That position didn't get less stupid. Y'all should be happy to trade this "terrible" player while people think hes good.

Out of all the stupidity that’s been shared on this board over the last decade, this stupidity seems like a rather run of the mill reason to bail.