How can our O Line improve?

[lewdog]

These guys are dumpster fires!!!!

[comochiefsfan]

Draft better players.

[CasselGotPeedOn]

Wylie retires from football

[LoneWolf]

Get healthy.

[smithandrew051]

I get that it’s bad, but the fix isn’t coming this year. Very hard for any organization to lose so many players at one position.

Even with this issue, we did just put up 30+ on the road against the best defense in the league.

[OKchiefs]

Draft better players.

literally draft any players at all besides an injured OL who was never going to contribute this year

[kcxiv]

Well 4 of the 5 are 2nd and 3rd stringers. Its not going to get better this year. lol

[frozenchief]

1. Be healthy.

2. Make drafting interior OL a priority.

[RealSNR]

Allegretti is playing well, and I really liked what Wisniewski did at RG.

Keep those two, hope Remmers (or we get a miracle from Schwartz).

I'd also start Kilgore over Reiter.

That's also me being a reactionary fan, though.

[Peter Gibbons]

Need to get a couple quality tackles for next season. We have been lucky for a while but it doesn’t look good for Schwartz and Fisher. I very much hope I am proven wrong.

[JakeF]

Andy Heck sucks

[displacedinMN]

too many injuries


LDT

[Chief Roundup]

Have Schwartz come back at RT and play Kilgore at C.

[RunKC]

Andy Heck sucks

Again. Are you retarded?

[Chief Roundup]

Again. Are you retarded?

Why do people keep asking him this question? He has answered it time and time again.

[Gary Cooper]

Entering the season, they had two solid tackles and a question mark everywhere else. They were asking for trouble if injuries happened.

As others pointed out, draft better. Maybe get lucky with a FA acquisition.

[Sassy Squatch]

Pretty much have to do what Mahomes did today. Just drop back so far you can see the entire pass rush and adjust accordingly. It's fucking sad to watch but it's what we'll have to do.

[DaFace]

We're missing a starter in LDT and a promising prospect in Niang. We'll need to draft OL, but we're not as far off as it seems.

[displacedinMN]

The saints have a good D.

Which game did PM have 3-4 passes knocked at the line, Was it Denver?

[smithandrew051]

We're missing a starter in LDT and a promising prospect in Niang. We'll need to draft OL, but we're not as far off as it seems.

And Osemele (but we wouldn’t have had him anyway if LDT didn’t opt out), Schwartz, and Remmers

[Megatron96]

Nothing they can do right now. The OL is populated by subs. Fisher is obviously hurt. Wiz is the only guy in there right now that is both healthy (mostly) and starter quality. Everyone else is meh. And Wylie had a few good snaps at RT, but he also whiffed a bunch of blocks. So moving him outside didn't help him there at all. We need to get Rankin on the field if only to see where he's at physically.

[JakeF]

Again. Are you retarded?
Fuck you.

Our offensive line has never been particularly polished under Heck. We've always struggled with stunts and twists. Often we don't know what to do when a defense does something new.

Andy Heck has been here the entire time under Reid. Time for him to go.


Not that Andy Reid will change anything though.

[Bwana]

The Draft.

[scho63]

They are Swiss cheese and band-aid right now. It's ugly.

We need fatties, lots and lots of fatties.

[MahomesMagic]

Good news is we get some rest if we secure the bye to get guys healthy


We need two healthy tackles to run our offense, today was .5 a tackle and a 3rd stringer.

[smithandrew051]

Nothing they can do right now. The OL is populated by subs. Fisher is obviously hurt. Wiz is the only guy in there right now that is both healthy (mostly) and starter quality. Everyone else is meh. And Wylie had a few good snaps at RT, but he also whiffed a bunch of blocks. So moving him outside didn't help him there at all. We need to get Rankin on the field if only to see where he's at physically.

And let’s not disregard that the Saints do have one of the best defenses in the league by practically every metric.

[TomBarndtsTwin]

Get healthy?

But seriously, we need to start investing some more draft capital in the O-Line. Luckily, we should have plenty of draft picks to work with in April. Should add at least 4 more mid-round picks with 2 comp and 2 for the inevitable Bienemy hire.

[RunKC]

**** you.

Our offensive line has never been particularly polished under Heck. We've always struggled with stunts and twists. Often we don't know what to do when a defense does something new.

Andy Heck has been here the entire time under Reid. Time for him to go.


Not that Andy Reid will change anything though.

We’ve lost 3 starters and our 6th best OL this week you gigantic mongoloid.

Yeah it’s the coaches fault we’re playing backups. You are seriously one retarder motherfucker

[O.city]

They struggled but some of it is Mahomes dropping out the back of the pocket

Saints are good too

[srvy]

Need to get a couple quality tackles for next season. We have been lucky for a while but it doesn’t look good for Schwartz and Fisher. I very much hope I am proven wrong.

Pretty sure Fisher played hurt today.

[wazu]

We're missing a starter in LDT and a promising prospect in Niang. We'll need to draft OL, but we're not as far off as it seems.

I know LDT has been a starter, but we could use an upgrade there.

[mnchiefsguy]

Have not really seen Kilgore since the Buffalo game...perhaps getting him on the field might help.

And Fisher was hurt today.

[Titty Meat]

They let me suck their cocks

[Chief Roundup]

You know Wylie has not played a single snap since he was a senior in college. All 33 of his games in the NFL has been at G. Wisniewski played a few placement snaps for the Steelers early in the season. They both had to play the entire game at either a new position or not playing an entire game all year.
Let us not forget that this Saints front is one of the best front 4 in the game.
We need Schwartz back badly. Fisher needs to get healthy.

[Molitoth]

We need to draft some mean dudes.
Iowa corn kids with alcoholic father's.

Our Oline is soft. A bunch of dudes getting whipped by second and third stringers.

[srvy]

I know LDT has been a starter, but we could use an upgrade there.

Yeah, we have had turds at left guard so long that we didn't notice the turdle head waiting to drop at right guard. LDT is easily replaceable. I hope he permanently opts out.

I really had hoped we had solved LG with Osemele then he went out and destroyed both knees.

[lewdog]

We need to draft some mean dudes.
Iowa corn kids with alcoholic father's.

Our Oline is soft. A bunch of dudes getting whipped by second and third stringers.

Niemann is the biggest pussy on the roster.

Fuck Iowa.

[Boxer_Chief]

JakeF is one of those guys in the bathroom at halftime of the chiefs game so drunk they can’t stand and make the most insane ridiculously stupid statements that everyone in the restroom just stops and lets a collective sigh out. The difference is he isn’t drunk and does it every single day on this message board. Just lurk dude, give up posting.

[DaneMcCloud]

1. Be healthy.

2. Make drafting interior OL a priority.

If by priority, you mean 3rd round, I'd agree. :D

I would not draft an offensive lineman with a 1st or 2nd because it's a waste of draft capital.

The Chiefs will be much healthier next year AND they'll have solid depth. The return of LTD and Schwartz, along with the improvement of Allegretti and depth including Rankin, Niang and others will definitely make a huge difference.

The Chiefs started the season behind the 8 Ball with Niang and LDT opting out. That shouldn't be an issue next eyar.

[DaneMcCloud]

Have Schwartz come back at RT and play Kilgore at C.

I'd also start Kilgore over Reiter.



Kilgore sucks in Pass Pro, which is why Andy is going with Reiter because the Chiefs are a passing offense, not a running offense.

[DaneMcCloud]

Need to get a couple quality tackles for next season. We have been lucky for a while but it doesn’t look good for Schwartz and Fisher. I very much hope I am proven wrong.

wut

[Chief Roundup]

Kilgore sucks in Pass Pro, which is why Andy is going with Reiter because the Chiefs are a passing offense, not a running offense.True but in the one game he looked serviceable and the OL as a unit looked better.
We could at least use him down in the red zone area.

Sent from my SM-G973U1 using Tapatalk

[Chris Meck]

Nothing they can do right now. The OL is populated by subs. Fisher is obviously hurt. Wiz is the only guy in there right now that is both healthy (mostly) and starter quality. Everyone else is meh. And Wylie had a few good snaps at RT, but he also whiffed a bunch of blocks. So moving him outside didn't help him there at all. We need to get Rankin on the field if only to see where he's at physically.

I kind of think Alegretti's alright.

[Coach]

If by priority, you mean 3rd round, I'd agree. :D

I would not draft an offensive lineman with a 1st or 2nd because it's a waste of draft capital.

The Chiefs will be much healthier next year AND they'll have solid depth. The return of LTD and Schwartz, along with the improvement of Allegretti and depth including Rankin, Niang and others will definitely make a huge difference.

The Chiefs started the season behind the 8 Ball with Niang and LDT opting out. That shouldn't be an issue next eyar.

I respectfully disagree, because if you have a half a billion dollar investment back there, you kind of need to make some investments in the line to hold up. Andrew Wylie is a liability. Fisher is starting to get a little long on the tooth here, on top of that he's fighting a back injury. Who know what is going to happen to Schwartz. Back injuries is a really crappy situation.

While Rankin, Niang, and LTD are there for next season, it's no guarantee they may be a solution to the problem. I personally would feel better if they would invest one of their picks at the end of R1 or R2, assuming if a O-Lineman player is available worthy of that slot.

[DaFace]

wut

I think he's referring to long-term health. Back issues usually don't go away.

[Chris Meck]

I think he's referring to long-term health. Back issues usually don't go away.

not with the big boys they don't.

I mean they MIGHT.

But usually it's the beginning of the end.

[DaneMcCloud]

I respectfully disagree, because if you have a half a billion dollar investment back there, you kind of need to make some investments in the line to hold up. .

No offense but that's a terrible argument. There are very few offensive lineman taken in the 1st and 2nd rounds that can start on Day 1 be extremely successful because they're not asked to do the same things in college as they are in the NFL. It's also much easier to find high end skill position talent such as DE, WR, Safety early than it is late in the draft.

The Chiefs have won a minimum of 12 games in the past three years, even with Fisher out for 8 games, LDT out, Schwartz out, 4 freaking Left Guards this year and so on.

Andy know exactly what skillset he wants in a young lineman which is why he's been able to take 6th rounders like Jason Kelce, LDT and Zach Fulton in the 6th and turn them into viable starters at minimum. Reiter was a 7th and so was Allegretti.

[Chris Meck]

No offense but that's a terrible argument. There are very few offensive lineman taken in the 1st and 2nd rounds that can start on Day 1 be extremely successful because they're not asked to do the same things in college as they are in the NFL. It's also much easier to find high end skill position talent such as DE, WR, Safety early than it is late in the draft.

The Chiefs have won a minimum of 12 games in the past three years, even with Fisher out for 8 games, LDT out, Schwartz out, 4 freaking Left Guards this year and so on.

Andy know exactly what skillset he wants in a young lineman which is why he's been able to take 6th rounders like Jason Kelce, LDT and Zach Fulton in the 6th and turn them into viable starters at minimum. Reiter was a 7th and so was Allegretti.

plenty of good OL talent in the middle rounds. Elite LT's tend to come in the first, and that's about it. And not at #32. It IS probably time to move it up the priority chain; we don't really have the cash to sign quality FA's or the time to develop UDFA's/7th rounders. We need to find some guys that can be ready sooner than later.

[DaneMcCloud]

I think he's referring to long-term health. Back issues usually don't go away.

I think it depends on the issue.

I went from barely being able to walk in 2018 due to Spinal Stenosis in my L2/L3, L3/L4 and L4/L5, to being able to walk 15 minutes three days after surgery and able to walk for an hour within 4 weeks.

Laser spinal surgery is amazing.

[Easy 6]

Gimme one of our 3rd's on C or G, then identify and sign another IOL at the top of Veach's wish list within cap constraints

Not in the mood to be @'ed over it either, its time to invest up front and if you dont like it... thats too damn bad

[DaneMcCloud]

plenty of good OL talent in the middle rounds. Elite LT's tend to come in the first, and that's about it. And not at #32.

Yep.

And for all the people that wanted 20 year old Cesar Ruiz in the first, well, just ask any Saints fan how that's worked out.

The answer is not good...

[mkp785]

I respectfully disagree, because if you have a half a billion dollar investment back there, you kind of need to make some investments in the line to hold up. Andrew Wylie is a liability. Fisher is starting to get a little long on the tooth here, on top of that he's fighting a back injury. Who know what is going to happen to Schwartz. Back injuries is a really crappy situation.

While Rankin, Niang, and LTD are there for next season, it's no guarantee they may be a solution to the problem. I personally would feel better if they would invest one of their picks at the end of R1 or R2, assuming if a O-Lineman player is available worthy of that slot.

Fisher and Schwartz are both FAs soon as well. Fisher is getting like 12 million a year so he's gonna want a major raise I imagine. Wouldn't hurt to grab a T in case he thinks he's worth 20 or more.

[DaneMcCloud]

Gimme one of our 3rd's on C or G, then identify and sign another IOL at the top of Veach's wish list within cap constraints

Not in the mood to be @'ed over it either, its time to invest up front and if you dont like it... thats too damn bad

I'm with you.

The Chiefs will most likely have a couple of 4's and a couple of 5's, so if they took a couple of offensive lineman between the 3rd and 5th, I think they'd be in good shape heading into 2021, especially if the guys can have a "normal" offseason.

[DaneMcCloud]

Fisher and Schwartz are both FAs soon as well. Fisher is getting like 12 million a year so he's gonna want a major raise I imagine. Wouldn't hurt to grab a T in case he thinks he's worth 20 or more.

I can't imagine the Chiefs allowing Eric Fisher to walk.

The guy has been in KC since the beginning of Andy's tenure and he's far better than anyone they could draft at #32.

[mkp785]

Yep.

And for all the people that wanted 20 year old Cesar Ruiz in the first, well, just ask any Saints fan how that's worked out.

The answer is not good...

They cut Warford for him too. Right after he made 3 straight pro bowls.

[mkp785]

I can't imagine the Chiefs allowing Eric Fisher to walk.

The guy has been in KC since the beginning of Andy's tenure and he's far better than anyone they could draft at #32.

I'm fine with keeping him too. I just wonder what he's gonna want. We're getting him at a discount now at 12 million.

[DaneMcCloud]

I'm fine with keeping him too. I just wonder what he's gonna want. We're getting him at a discount now at 12 million.

I'm sure he'll get a raise but I can't imagine the guy jumping ship to another franchise because while he might be able to wrangle more dough than the Chiefs can afford, it's pretty clear that this lockerroom and program is, by far, the best in the NFL.

[Coach]

No offense but that's a terrible argument. There are very few offensive lineman taken in the 1st and 2nd rounds that can start on Day 1 be extremely successful because they're not asked to do the same things in college as they are in the NFL. It's also much easier to find high end skill position talent such as DE, WR, Safety early than it is late in the draft.

The Chiefs have won a minimum of 12 games in the past three years, even with Fisher out for 8 games, LDT out, Schwartz out, 4 freaking Left Guards this year and so on.

Andy know exactly what skillset he wants in a young lineman which is why he's been able to take 6th rounders like Jason Kelce, LDT and Zach Fulton in the 6th and turn them into viable starters at minimum. Reiter was a 7th and so was Allegretti.

None taken. I do see your point of view (and I do agree with a few offensive linemen that can start on Day 1), but there are also a few offensive linemen that do start on Day 1 or Day 2. Cesar Ruiz and Will Hernandez are two that comes off of my head at the moment.

Yes, we have won a minimum of 12 games with a revolving door of O-linemen, but I also feel like this is playing with fire. At some point, it's going to collapse. In the last 5 years, the Chiefs only drafted 3 offensive linemen (Niang - who opted out, Allegretti, and Ehinger - out of the league), and Rankin was from a trade.

I'm just saying, I would like to see a little bit more investment back there, because I'm just tired of seeing my QB getting lit up, either because he's holding on to the ball longer than he should have, or the O-line isn't holding up well at the point of attack (which was pretty frequent as of lately).

Edited to correct Rankin was from a trade, not Fulton.

[AussieChiefsFan]

Draft well and hope LDT returns next year too
And that Schwartz stays healthy

Sent from my Galaxy S10

[RealSNR]

I think Allegretti is a longterm starter at LG. We don't need to replace him.

Fisher's not dead, he's just banged up. Schwartz might be fucked, but we have Niang.

We'll be fine. Just keep bringing dudes in and hope you strike it rich on one of them.

We could definitely stand to spend a draft pick on a C, though. That I wouldn't mind.

[RealSNR]

None taken. I do see your point of view (and I do agree with a few offensive linemen that can start on Day 1), but there are also a few offensive linemen that do start on Day 1 or Day 2. Cesar Ruiz and Will Hernandez are two that comes off of my head at the moment.

Yes, we have won a minimum of 12 games with a revolving door of O-linemen, but I also feel like this is playing with fire. At some point, it's going to collapse. In the last 5 years, the Chiefs only drafted 3 offensive linemen (Niang - who opted out, Allegretti, and Ehinger - out of the league), and Fulton was from a trade.

I'm just saying, I would like to see a little bit more investment back there, because I'm just tired of seeing my QB getting lit up, either because he's holding on to the ball longer than he should have, or the O-line isn't holding up well at the point of attack (which was pretty frequent as of lately).

We drafted Fulton. Are you thinking of Rankin?

[Coach]

We drafted Fulton. Are you thinking of Rankin?

Duh, you're right. Oversight on my part.

My bad.

Edited to fix it. Nice catch.

[Dartgod]

**** you.

Our offensive line has never been particularly polished under Heck. We've always struggled with stunts and twists. Often we don't know what to do when a defense does something new.

Andy Heck has been here the entire time under Reid. Time for him to go.


Not that Andy Reid will change anything though.

No shit, what the hell does Andy Reid know?

[mkp785]

I'm sure he'll get a raise but I can't imagine the guy jumping ship to another franchise because while he might be able to wrangle more dough than the Chiefs can afford, it's pretty clear that this lockerroom and program is, by far, the best in the NFL.

True. He was Andy's 1st pick too and has been here forever. I would think he'll take a reasonable deal. Hopefully less than 20 million. Elway paying 17 a year for a bum like Bolles (though he's playing better this yr) doesn't help my confidence in the market for LTs.

[OKchiefs]

True. He was Andy's 1st pick too and has been here forever. I would think he'll take a reasonable deal. Hopefully less than 20 million. Elway paying 17 a year for a bum like Bolles (though he's playing better this yr) doesn't help my confidence in the market for LTs.

Hate to break it to you, but Bolles has turned into the best LT in the division.

[Mama Hip Rockets]

Get healthy.

Dangit. Meant to do thumbs up on this. Sorry. This is the answer.

[mkp785]

Hate to break it to you, but Bolles has turned into the best LT in the division.

He's playing better like I just said. We'll see if it lasts outside of his contract year where his own GM declined the 5th yr option-to near unanimous approval.

[kcclone]

There really aren’t any fixes this year besides getting Schwartz and Remmers back.

We have guards playing tackle which usually doesn’t end well. We didn’t exactly have a ton of interior talent to start with.

For next year we definitely need to address best available OL in the draft at some point in the first two rounds. Hopefully Niang will be a solid starter for us next year.

[Megatron96]

I kind of think Alegretti's alright.

He's been okay. But let's be real: he's been a back-up all this time for a reason. And if we went back and broke down all his snaps, we'd probably find reasons for that.

That said, I feel like he might eventually develop into a solid guard. But right now, he's a sub, not a real starter.

[Oxford]

I kind of think Alegretti's alright.

When he was drafted they felt he could play well at center. It always looks like PMII has no place to step up in the pocket, I almost think G-C-G is where the weakness is. Rankin is listed as a backup tackle, but when they played him last year they had the opening at LG. I would really like to see some extended playing time for him, maybe if we are way up on ATL, can we go BIG and pound the rock?

[JakeF]

We’ve lost 3 starters and our 6th best OL this week you gigantic mongoloid.

Yeah it’s the coaches fault we’re playing backups. You are seriously one retarder motherfucker
Are you still defending DeMarcus Robinson?

You did the same thing at the beginning of the year when you called me an idiot for saying the Oline was a problem. You said the Oline was fine and I was just being negative. As usual, you're wrong until someone comes along and tells you the correct thing to think.

Now you bail on Robinson and Oline? Pretty soon you will bail on Heck. Dumbass.

[JakeF]

No shit, what the hell does Andy Reid know?Andy knows plenty but he doesn't like to make a bunch of changes. He likes to keep the same players for a long time too even if they aren't very good.

[DaneMcCloud]

None taken. I do see your point of view (and I do agree with a few offensive linemen that can start on Day 1), but there are also a few offensive linemen that do start on Day 1 or Day 2. Cesar Ruiz and Will Hernandez are two that comes off of my head.

Ruiz has been a huge disappointment. Just ask any Saints fan.

And while I think that PFF is complete and utter garbage, Ruiz has a 54.4 rating while Andrew Wylie has a 55.2.

Eric Fisher has a 79.4, so while PFF is garbage, the grades of Wylie, Ruiz and Wylie provides a comparison, which in those terms, reflect reality.

And just think: If the Chiefs had somehow taken Ruiz over CEH, I seriously doubt the Chiefs would be 12-1 at this point in the season.

[Megatron96]

Ruiz has been a huge disappointment. Just ask any Saints fan.

And while I think that PFF is complete and utter garbage, Ruiz has a 54.4 rating while Andrew Wylie has a 55.2.

Eric Fisher has a 79.4, so while PFF is garbage, the grades of Wylie, Ruiz and Wylie provides a comparison, which in those terms, reflect reality.

And just think: If the Chiefs had somehow taken Ruiz over CEH, I seriously doubt the Chiefs would be 12-1 at this point in the season.

Oh God, now we have TWO Wylie's on this team? Kill me now . . .

[Delano]

He's been okay. But let's be real: he's been a back-up all this time for a reason.


Yeah. That's how developmental careers start out. You expect a seventh round project to start in his first few seasons?

[DaneMcCloud]

He's been okay. But let's be real: he's been a back-up all this time for a reason. And if we went back and broke down all his snaps, we'd probably find reasons for that.

That said, I feel like he might eventually develop into a solid guard. But right now, he's a sub, not a real starter.

“All this time”? What does that even mean?

He was a 7th round pick last year. He didn’t have minicamps or Training Camp and was forced into duty when Osemele went down and Remmers was moved from Left Guard to Right Tackle when Schwartz went down.

I think he’s done an excellent job this season, especially considering the circumstances and the fact that he was a 7th.

Andy had LDT sit for a year after taking him in the 6th and he’s been a starter ever since.

[Halfcan]

I thought Fisher and Whylie were going to get Mahomes killed out there. Both had their worst games as Chiefs.

101 had Harlan on there and were praising Whylie because he was playing out of position. Called him one of the Heroes of the Games-lol

Fisher had back troubles this week, so I guess he gets a pass for being burned so badly.

[Jewish Rabbi]

I think the number one way our offensive line can improve is to start blocking defenders!!!

[OKchiefs]

Do we have any hope of Schwartz coming back? He’s rested for 2 months now. If that’s still not enough time for something that doesn’t require surgery then i just don’t know, maybe time to hang it up.

[DaneMcCloud]

I thought Fisher and Whylie were going to get Mahomes killed out there. Both had their worst games as Chiefs.

101 had Harlan on there and were praising Whylie because he was playing out of position. Called him one of the Heroes of the Games-lol

Fisher had back troubles this week, so I guess he gets a pass for being burned so badly.

The Saints have the #2 defense in the NFL with a sturdy defensive line.

Most people saw this game a loss when the season began, and that was with the starting offensive line.

The fact that they pulled this game out, on the road, is testament to the guys and the coaches.

[RealSNR]

I thought Fisher and Whylie were going to get Mahomes killed out there. Both had their worst games as Chiefs.

101 had Harlan on there and were praising Whylie because he was playing out of position. Called him one of the Heroes of the Games-lol

Fisher had back troubles this week, so I guess he gets a pass for being burned so badly.


LOL.

You really don’t remember Fisher’s rookie year?

[Halfcan]

LOL.

You really don’t remember Fisher’s rookie year?

Good point. He was manhandled out there like a little bitch. On the Mahomes fumble- Fisher and Whylie Coyote both whiffed. That could have really hurt Mahomes worse than it did.

[Coach]

Ruiz has been a huge disappointment. Just ask any Saints fan.

And while I think that PFF is complete and utter garbage, Ruiz has a 54.4 rating while Andrew Wylie has a 55.2.

Eric Fisher has a 79.4, so while PFF is garbage, the grades of Wylie, Ruiz and Wylie provides a comparison, which in those terms, reflect reality.

And just think: If the Chiefs had somehow taken Ruiz over CEH, I seriously doubt the Chiefs would be 12-1 at this point in the season.

Ruiz didn't also have the luxury of have minicamps or Training Camp as well, so that probably impacted him too as well. I do agree that he should be better than what he is doing right now, but he is only 21 and a rookie, compared to a 26 year old guy and been in the league for 3 years.

I do however, agree with you that the Chiefs would not be 12-1 if CEH was not here in a pandemic season. If this was any other normal season (without those opt-outs), who knows?

As for the PFF, I do agree with that it's garbage. That being said, my eyes tells me that Wylie is getting beat on some of those pass rushes and does struggle to hold up the point of attack. Of course, not having Schwartz on the right side may have to do with that, but even when Schwartz was in, he was still getting abused.

I know that Pat does have the tendency to bail out of a clean pocket, so some of it is NOT on the O-line, but at some point, I do think he has a little trusting issue with the O-line holding up their end of the bargain.

I just see Wylie as a JAG and I think the Chiefs can improve from there after the conclusion of this season.

[Halfcan]

The Saints have the #2 defense in the NFL with a sturdy defensive line.

Most people saw this game a loss when the season began, and that was with the starting offensive line.

The fact that they pulled this game out, on the road, is testament to the guys and the coaches.

A testament to Mahomes more like- He was pressured, hit or sacked on nearly every drop back. Just glad he got out of the game without injury.

[Delano]

Do we have any hope of Schwartz coming back? He’s rested for 2 months now. If that’s still not enough time for something that doesn’t require surgery then i just don’t know, maybe time to hang it up.


Maybe they give it a shot after the bye, but I have serious doubts. Mitch was an ironman before the injury so I feel like he'd be activated if he could go. Probably don't want to get your first start in the playoffs.

[Megatron96]

“All this time”? What does that even mean?

He was a 7th round pick last year. He didn’t have minicamps or Training Camp and was forced into duty when Osemele went down and Remmers was moved from Left Guard to Right Tackle when Schwartz went down.

I think he’s done an excellent job this season, especially considering the circumstances and the fact that he was a 7th.

Andy had LDT sit for a year after taking him in the 6th and he’s been a starter ever since.

I thought he was drafted in 2018?

Okay, well then ignore what I said. My bad.

[jerryaldini]

If Schwartz gets back for the playoffs then we have the same OL as last year except Allegretti for LDT, which is not a downgrade. If Mitch doesn't get back, Remmers has been ok there, no problem.

If both Remmers and Mitch can't come back, or Fish stays hurt, then and only then is it a big problem.

[Shiver Me Timbers]

A testament to Mahomes more like- He was pressured, hit or sacked on nearly every drop back. Just glad he got out of the game without injury.

Absolutely. Can you imagine what this kid could do with a line that gave him more than a half second.

[Easy 6]

I think the number one way our offensive line can improve is to start blocking defenders!!!

So crazy it just might work!

[Pitt Gorilla]

How did Durant look? He looked good in the highlights I saw, but I had to miss most of the game.

[Halfcan]

Absolutely. Can you imagine what this kid could do with a line that gave him more than a half second.

It should be the top priority of the Offseason. 500 million dollar investment is being protected by a 50 cent O line.

It makes what Mahomes is doing even more of a miracle.

[ChiefsFanatic]

Allegretti is playing well, and I really liked what Wisniewski did at RG.



Keep those two, hope Remmers (or we get a miracle from Schwartz).



I'd also start Kilgore over Reiter.



That's also me being a reactionary fan, though.

I agree that Allegretti has played well, and when Kilgore was at center this year, he seemed to be better than Reiter, even though it's a small sample size.

But, I am so FN sick of watching Wiley watch his man hit or sack Mahomes. It doesn't matter where he plays, he is like a FN turnstile.

I can't remember Mahomes ever talking to an offensive lineman like he did today. I don't remember the player specifically, but it looked like the camera caught him saying something to an O-lineman, ending with "come on, man."

I think we should find the best available offensive lineman, from practice squads, or players sitting at home, and cut Keizer, and give the new lineman a TE number, because a practice squad caliber offensive lineman couldn't be any worse at TE than Keizer is, at blocking or receiving.

I am being a little facetious, but nobody wants to see Mahomes hit like he was today. I think it's a miracle that after getting sandwiched, and taking the crown of the helmet to his right shoulder and chest, that he was not hindered throwing the ball.

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk

[smithandrew051]

I trust Veach in the offseason. He’s tackled every issue that the team has had. This will be no different.

Just getting Niang and possibly Schwartz/LDT back will be a huge help. We’ll have more picks than the last few years, so I don’t doubt that Veach will target a few.

A HEALTHY (and I stress that) line of Fisher, Niang, Allegretti, LDT, Schwartz sounds pretty good right about now. And that would even assume that we just get back the guys that were missing.

Just look at the secondary now compared to 2018. It’s fucking night and day.

[BossChief]

Draft a stud center and right guard

Fisher
Allegreti
Stud
Stud
Niang

If Schwartz can play:

Fisher
Allegreti
Stud draft pick
Niang
Schwartz

If LDT and Schwartz bot return next year

Fisher
Niang
Stud draft pick
LDT
Schwartz

[Halfcan]

I agree that Allegretti has played well, and when Kilgore was at center this year, he seemed to be better than Reiter, even though it's a small sample size.

But, I am so FN sick of watching Wiley watch his man hit or sack Mahomes. It doesn't matter where he plays, he is like a FN turnstile.

I can't remember Mahomes ever talking to an offensive lineman like he did today. I don't remember the player specifically, but it looked like the camera caught him saying something to an O-lineman, ending with "come on, man."

I think we should find the best available offensive lineman, from practice squads, or players sitting at home, and cut Keizer, and give the new lineman a TE number, because a practice squad caliber offensive lineman couldn't be any worse at TE than Keizer is, at blocking or receiving.

I am being a little facetious, but nobody wants to see Mahomes hit like he was today. I think it's a miracle that after getting sandwiched, and taking the crown of the helmet to his right shoulder and chest, that he was not hindered throwing the ball.

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk

Kizer is a shit blocker and can't catch the ball.

[Chief Northman]

Anyone think Osemele gets another look on a one year deal?

[El caliente]

Yeah, as a Saints fan we had high hopes for Ruiz coming into the season, but no training camp, and no preseason games really has hurt his progress. I imagine next season he will be much better, but he is starting this year due to injuries along our line and not because he has outplayed the people ahead of him.

[OKchiefs]

I really don’t understand why anyone views the return of LDT a positive, or his opt out an excuse for the poor line play. LDT at this point is really not significantly better than Wylie, not to mention I have serious doubts of his ability to return after not having played football for well over a year and with likely nowhere near the level of conditioning and training to stay in shape. Not sure of the ramifications on the cap if he retires, but that’s probably the best outcome.

[bobhill]

I really don’t understand why anyone views the return of LDT a positive, or his opt out an excuse for the poor line play. LDT at this point is really not significantly better than Wylie, not to mention I have serious doubts of his ability to return after not having played football for well over a year and with likely nowhere near the level of conditioning and training to stay in shape. Not sure of the ramifications on the cap if he retires, but that’s probably the best outcome.

I kinda hope ldt doesn't return, keep doing the Doctor thing and just oppt out all together

[Chargem]

It should be the top priority of the Offseason. 500 million dollar investment is being protected by a 50 cent O line.

It makes what Mahomes is doing even more of a miracle.

Fisher is the Chiefs 4th biggest cap hit this year.

Schwartz is the 9th biggest cap hit this year.

LDT is the 16th highest paid G in the league.

The Chiefs put money into the line, they just have bad injury/opt out luck right now.

Anyone think Osemele gets another look on a one year deal?

I think/hope so - Either him or Wiz on a 1 year deal, whoever is cheaper?

I really don’t understand why anyone views the return of LDT a positive, or his opt out an excuse for the poor line play. LDT at this point is really not significantly better than Wylie, not to mention I have serious doubts of his ability to return after not having played football for well over a year and with likely nowhere near the level of conditioning and training to stay in shape. Not sure of the ramifications on the cap if he retires, but that’s probably the best outcome.

LDT has multiple full years of play at a much higher level than Wylie has ever shown. 2019 was a down year for LDT, and his play bottomed out at Wylie level play.

I think people are positive about LDT because he WILL be better than Wylie at RG, we just don't know by how much.

[ChiefBlueCFC]

If Schwartz can get healthy -- and that's a huge IF -- then Wylie the Turnstile can be dropped from the front 5. Fisher was clearly not 100% this week; he struggled big time at times.

But the line absolutely needs to be addressed, specifically RG, in the draft.

[scho63]

Meet the newest 5 OL free agents we signed last night......... :D


https://images2.minutemediacdn.com/image/upload/c_fill,g_auto,h_740,w_1100/v1555930795/shape/mentalfloss/sumo20-20yves20picq_6.jpg

[OKchiefs]

So as always I take anything from PFF with a grain of salt, but I have seen some mention this morning per PFF off Mahomes having the most pressures in the league attributed to him. I'm not sure if it's on Mahomes, Reid/Bienemy, or some combination of the two, but if it's clear that the OL can't hold up for long then I struggle to see why they don't add in more slants, screens, etc. to get the ball out quicker. I know, I'm just some idiot on a messageboard and they're the coaches, but shame on them if they get Mahomes get killed behind this line. It's doubtful we face a pass rush that good anytime soon, but all it takes is one hit.

[FloridaMan88]

Re-watching the game there is no way the Chiefs can start Wylie again at right tackle (or anywhere on this offensive line, but certainly not at right tackle).

He was beat literally on every play.

[OKchiefs]

Re-watching the game there is no way the Chiefs can start Wylie again at right tackle (or anywhere on this offensive line, but certainly not at right tackle).

He was beat literally on every play.

He actually held up on the play where Jordan punched him, so that's a positive. Of course, he got beat like a drum on the next drive.

[The Franchise]

Re-watching the game there is no way the Chiefs can start Wylie again at right tackle (or anywhere on this offensive line, but certainly not at right tackle).

He was beat literally on every play.

Dude just isn’t that good. Bench his dumbass and start Wiz at RG. I’d rather watch Durant at RT over Wylie.

[FloridaMan88]

Dude just isn’t that good. Bench his dumbass and start Wiz at RG. I’d rather watch Durant at RT over Wylie.

Durant can't be any worse than Wylie yesterday.

Even when they were putting RB's back to help Wylie it didn't matter.

[Chris Meck]

Re-watching the game there is no way the Chiefs can start Wylie again at right tackle (or anywhere on this offensive line, but certainly not at right tackle).

He was beat literally on every play.

Nobody hates Wylie more than me, I promise you.

That being said, he was not beat on literally every play. That's hyperbole.

He was, however, obviously inadequate, as he always is, at either guard OR tackle.

Would be Durant be better or worse? I don't know. His feet are SO SLOW. But he is massive. Maybe it would take longer for edge rushers to run around him.

[Rexx]

Wylie has been awful all year, not sure why he is still in there.

[Chris Meck]

Wylie has been awful all year, not sure why he is still in there.

because we're down to practice squad guys, free agents off the street, and undrafted free agent rookies.

[FloridaMan88]

Nobody hates Wylie more than me, I promise you.

That being said, he was not beat on literally every play. That's hyperbole.

Yeah he wasn't beaten on the kneel down plays at the end.

Other than that he was beaten on every meaningful play.

[tmax63]

About the only thing the Chiefs can do is play some "middle of the pack" defenses instead of the d's they've faced the last 2 weeks. That and try to get some guys that are hurt healthy enough to play.

[Chris Meck]

Yeah he wasn't beaten on the kneel down plays at the end.

Other than that he was beaten on every meaningful play.

No, that's not true.

Just as a point of example-without even going through (and I watched Wylie specifically on most plays the first half)

The play that Cam Jordan got ejected on, he did not beat Wylie.

On many plays, Mahomes was holding the ball five or six seconds. Those are plays in which nobody "got beat" because that's longer than anyone is expected to hold off the rusher. In fact, I might go so far as to say Wylie for a large portion of the game, was a tick better outside than inside, which I found surprising. Of course, when he got beat, he got beat badly, and almost got Mahomes killed.

Also, there were quite a few plays in which Wylie had his guy handled and Mahomes rolled out right and went outside the block, basically negating the fact that Wylie had his guy in position to be controlled. So those are on Patrick, not on Wylie.

I'm not saying he was good or that we should go with Wylie going forward. He's shitty, and shouldn't be starting on a championship football team.

But saying he got beat on literally every snap is hyperbolic nonsense.

It's simply not true.

[RunKC]

Again guys, you can’t fault Veach and Andy for this weird season. They brought in Osemele, Remmers, Kilgore and also brought Wiz back.

We also drafted Niang, so that’s now 5 OL brought in. Unfortunately we lost LDT and Niang to opt out’s and Schwartz got hurt.

Stop going after Andy Heck bc our 4th starting RT this season isn’t playing well as well as our starting LT that has a hurting back.

There’s nothing any OL coach can do in that situation, so don’t be retarded like JakeF and point fingers without understanding context behind it.

[Megatron96]

Again guys, you can’t fault Veach and Andy for this weird season. They brought in Osemele, Remmers, Kilgore and also brought Wiz back.

We also drafted Niang, so that’s now 5 OL brought in. Unfortunately we lost LDT and Niang to opt out’s and Schwartz got hurt.

Stop going after Andy Heck bc our 4th starting RT this season isn’t playing well as well as our starting LT that has a hurting back.

There’s nothing any OL coach can do in that situation, so don’t be retarded like JakeF and point fingers without understanding context behind it.

:bravo:

[wazu]

Again guys, you can’t fault Veach and Andy for this weird season. They brought in Osemele, Remmers, Kilgore and also brought Wiz back.

We also drafted Niang, so that’s now 5 OL brought in. Unfortunately we lost LDT and Niang to opt out’s and Schwartz got hurt.

Stop going after Andy Heck bc our 4th starting RT this season isn’t playing well as well as our starting LT that has a hurting back.

There’s nothing any OL coach can do in that situation, so don’t be retarded like JakeF and point fingers without understanding context behind it.

I know it's tough, but I'm not interested in excuses when it comes to protecting Mahomes. We've seen enough out of Wylie yet he keeps being rolled out as the answer. Figure out something that works better than that, please.

[ForeverIowan]

If Bienemy leaves for a HC job we have three 3rd rounders, right? Spend all three third rounders on offensive line problem fixed. Niang coming back from his opt out year as well you have an influx of four promising offensive lineman. Cant have Mahomes getting drilled the way he was last night.

[emaw1979]

This season all they can really do is get healthy.

They really need to invest in it in the draft. I wouldn’t be mad if the Chiefs spend all their draft picks on the line.

[smithandrew051]

This season all they can really do is get healthy.

They really need to invest in it in the draft. I wouldn’t be mad if the Chiefs spend all their draft picks on the line.

Any real answer will be found in the offseason. It’s a weird year for sure.

It’s honestly amazing that we have this kind of record in such bizarre circumstances. Every team is battling through something right now, and this appears to be our biggest issue.

Good news is that we’re still plenty capable of winning it all again and fixing it in the offseason. We’re in a great position with Reid, Veach, and Mahomes. At this point, I’ll trust whatever they decide to do.

[DaneMcCloud]

Ruiz didn't also have the luxury of have minicamps or Training Camp as well, so that probably impacted him too as well.

Yeah but Dude, just think: If the Chiefs had taken Ruiz in the first round, they wouldn't have CEH and they most certainly wouldn't be 13-1.

Also, if Ruiz is playing at the same level as Andrew Wylie after being chosen at #32, this forum would have imploded by Week 4.

Guards and centers in the first round are a complete waste of draft capital, especially on a team like the Chiefs. First rounders need to be reserved for elite Skill Level guys - Tight End, Receiver, Safety, Defensive End, Linebacker and yes, even Running Back.

But guard at #32? Or center? Nope.

[DaneMcCloud]

I agree that Allegretti has played well, and when Kilgore was at center this year, he seemed to be better than Reiter, even though it's a small sample size.

But, I am so FN sick of watching Wiley watch his man hit or sack Mahomes. It doesn't matter where he plays, he is like a FN turnstile.

I don't get this, at all.

Wylie wasn't supposed to be a starter at Right Guard. He was forced into duty after LDT opted out of the season. I don't know why anyone would expect a second stringer to perform like a guy that's earning $8 million per year.

Every team has holes.

The fact that the Chiefs are 13-1, with 4 different left guards, 2 different Centers, 4 different Right Tackles and so on, is amazing, especially in 2020.

[ChiTown]

I don't get this, at all.

Wylie wasn't supposed to be a starter at Right Guard. He was forced into duty after LDT opted out of the season. I don't know why anyone would expect a second stringer to perform like a guy that's earning $8 million per year.

Every team has holes.

The fact that the Chiefs are 13-1, with 4 different left guards, 2 different Centers, 4 different Right Tackles and so on, is because Patrick Mahomes is a God.

FYP - and it's true.

[milkshock]

madness if we dont draft OL in the first round.

[DaneMcCloud]

I trust Veach in the offseason. He’s tackled every issue that the team has had. This will be no different.

This offseason wasn't any different.

What was different is that COVID wrecked the roster and available players for ALL 32 teams.

When you're running through 4 left guards and 4 tackles while being forced to start a backup at Right Guard and two different centers, it's not a "Normal" year.

Veach has been signing guys to the practice squad and active roster all year. There's literally nothing more he could have done with the offensive line, especially given that there's just not much available to any NFL team.

[DaneMcCloud]

FYP - and it's true.

Well, and people also need to keep in mind that every single opponent is giving an A++ effort against the Chiefs.

I mean, for Fuck's Sake, the Raiders took the Chiefs to wire TWICE this season, then turn around and shit themselves against the Falcons and the Chargers.

The Chargers pushed the Chiefs to OT in the second game of the season, yet they're currently sitting at 5-9.

The Chiefs, despite all of their injuries and Opt-Outs are still the best team in the NFL and by a wide margin.

Does anything think the Saints get within 7 points at Arrowhead?

[DaneMcCloud]

Wylie has been awful all year, not sure why he is still in there.

Wylie was at Right Tackle against the Saints because the Chiefs didn't want to start an Undrafted Rookie Free Agent against one of the best defensive fronts in the NFL and the #2 Defense overall.

That's why.

[ChiTown]

Well, and people also need to keep in mind that every single opponent is giving an A++ effort against the Chiefs.

I mean, for ****'s Sake, the Raiders took the Chiefs to wire TWICE this season, then turn around and shit themselves against the Falcons and the Chargers.

The Chargers pushed the Chiefs to OT in the second game of the season, yet they're currently sitting at 5-9.

The Chiefs, despite all of their injuries and Opt-Outs are still the best team in the NFL and by a wide margin.

Does anything think the Saints get within 7 points at Arrowhead?

That's what happens when you are King of the Hill. The Chiefs have been up for the challenge every week....even with this patchwork OL

[DaneMcCloud]

I know it's tough, but I'm not interested in excuses when it comes to protecting Mahomes. We've seen enough out of Wylie yet he keeps being rolled out as the answer. Figure out something that works better than that, please.

The Chiefs brought in Wiz but since Schwartz and Remmers were both out with injury, Wylie was forced to start at Right Tackle.

Do you guys even pay attention to who is on the field or read any of the Chiefs related stories posted on Chiefsplanet each day?

[tmax63]

I'm in the draft the "best available fatty" OL or DL next at least for 2 of rds 1-3 of the next draft. The Chiefs really do need a major influx of talent into the o-line because of contracts coming up and the quality towards the bottom end of the depth. A day-1 starter in the IOL and a swing tackle/tackle in waiting or possible replacement for Schwartz. With the cap as it is for next year they won't be able to get anyone better than what they got thru FA most likely.

[DaneMcCloud]

I'm in the draft the "best available fatty" OL or DL next at least for 2 of rds 1-3 of the next draft.

Fuck NO

[ChiTown]

I'm in the draft the "best available fatty" OL or DL next at least for 2 of rds 1-3 of the next draft. The Chiefs really do need a major influx of talent into the o-line because of contracts coming up and the quality towards the bottom end of the depth. A day-1 starter in the IOL and a swing tackle/tackle in waiting or possible replacement for Schwartz. With the cap as it is for next year they won't be able to get anyone better than what they got thru FA most likely.

Nope - Best Available Players, regardless of position.

We get LDT, Niang, Schwartz and potentially Osmele back next year. There's no need to go crazy with draft picks on OL/DL unless the value is there.

[FloridaMan88]

Keep Wisniewski at RG and hopefully Remmers can return next week at RT.

And Schwartz was eligible to return from IR last week so maybe he’ll be ready to return by the end of the regular season or the playoffs.

[Chief Roundup]

Fuck NO

You don't think they should or need to draft a DE in the 1st and then the best OL in the 3rd?
Of course this is all assume that those are the BPA at those picks.
If not then what positions would you like to see drafted in the top 3 picks?

[OKchiefs]

**** NO

But draft another RB in the 1st? Yeah, okay.

Most people don't want an OL in the 1st, but you take it to the complete other end of the spectrum and continue to think relying on 6th/7th round picks and UDFA is enough.

And DL absolutely is a high priority, so saying drafting best available fatty on OL/DL for 2 high picks isn't really a stretch.

1 - DE
2 - WR
3 - OL
3 - DT

If BPA went something along those lines that would be a positive outcome from the draft.

[OKchiefs]

Keep Wisniewski at RG and hopefully Remmers can return next week at RT.

And Schwartz was eligible to return from IR last week so maybe he’ll be ready to return by the end of the regular season or the playoffs.

Reid said he's feeling a little bit better but isn't ready yet, which after 2 months off isn't exactly encouraging. He also said he doesn't know if he will be ready for the postseason. At that point he will have had almost 3 months off.

[tmax63]

If EB leaves they'll have 4 picks in rds 1-3. I don't really care if it's both 3rds or a 2nd and a 3rd or a 1st and 3rd if a steal fell down to them, They need some young cheap bodies to protect PMII for the next decade.

[pugsnotdrugs19]

Reid says he doesn’t know if Schwartz is coming back this year or not.

Damn it. Feel like we’ve got 3 tackles with back injuries to some degree and are just hoping like hell 2 of them hold up in the long run.

[FloridaMan88]

The formula of relying on cheap free agents/lower round or undrafted players for the interior of their offensive line has worked relatively well for the Chiefs (allowing them to invest salary cap resources in other areas)... until this year when LDT/Niang opted out, Schwartz who was the ultimate iron man sustained a lingering injury and then the double back issues with Remmers and Fisher last week.

Not sure if an almost freakish cascade of injuries/opt-outs should warrant a dramatic change in the Chiefs philosophy with the offensive line.

[KChiefs1]

Can people stop bringing up Niang please?

I don’t want that pos on the team.

Dude opts out of playing for the defending Super Bowl champs so he can get out & protest. Fuck him.

That’s not the kinda dude I want protecting Patrick. Hell, Wylie has more heart & determination than that piece of shit.

Any other rookies opt out of the NFL this season? I want nothing to do with that turd.

[Chief Roundup]

It is like you guys don't understand that this was Wylies first time ever in the NFL at playing RT or that this was Wisniewski first time ever playing RG in the NFL or that those two were playing against one of the best front 4 groups in the NFL.
Cam Jordan is one of the best 4-3 DE in the game. Wylie troubled him enough to get the dude to throw a punch and ejected from the game.
Wis had not played an entire game this year. The last game action he seen was placement with the Steelers in the early weeks of the season.
No those guys are not that great but given the entirety of the situation they did ok.

[DaneMcCloud]

But draft another RB in the 1st? Yeah, okay.

Most people don't want an OL in the 1st, but you take it to the complete other end of the spectrum and continue to think relying on 6th/7th round picks and UDFA is enough.


:facepalm:

Yeah, fucking 8 straight winning seasons and a Super Bowl victory clearly isn't enough "proof" for you that this is Andy's M.O.

Good grief.

[OKchiefs]

The formula of relying on cheap free agents/lower round or undrafted players for the interior of their offensive line has worked relatively well for the Chiefs (allowing them to invest salary cap resources in other areas)... until this year when LDT/Niang opted out, Schwartz who was the ultimate iron man sustained a lingering injury and then the double back issues with Remmers and Fisher last week.

Not sure if an almost freakish cascade of injuries/opt-outs should warrant a dramatic change in the Chiefs philosophy with the offensive line.

The problem is Schwartz probably isn't around for much longer, and approaching 30 and a FA after 2021 Eric Fisher's status could also be up in the air depending on how much he wants on his next contract. The formula only worked with elite tackle play, which I'm not sure can be counted for sure going forward. Niang might be a decent replacement for Schwartz, but it's a lot to expect him to replace the best RT in the league without expecting some dropoff. A decline in OT play likely needs to be offset by better IOL play.

Also, at the end of the day a better all around OL would do wonders for the offense. Mahomes can generally win with hero ball, but how nice would it be to just have an above average OL that opens up the run game and allows the offense to flow without constantly needing theatrics from the QB to win.

[Chargem]

I know it's tough, but I'm not interested in excuses when it comes to protecting Mahomes. We've seen enough out of Wylie yet he keeps being rolled out as the answer. Figure out something that works better than that, please.

"Figure out something that works" great idea, why didn't the Chiefs think of that? Some of the posts in this thread seem to be "lets pick up one of them pro-bowlers who doesn't currently have a team, they are everywhere".

Hint: Maybe Wylie is the best they can do in the circumstances, you can't be 10 starters deep on the OL.

This season all they can really do is get healthy.

They really need to invest in it in the draft. I wouldn’t be mad if the Chiefs spend all their draft picks on the line.

You wouldn't be mad if they drafted 8 offensive linemen? Okay.

madness if we dont draft OL in the first round.

Dumb take. Where is this assumption that if you draft a guy in the first he will be even good his first year coming from? It's already been mentioned in this thread Ruiz was taken in the 20s and is about as good as Wylie this year.

You don't think they should or need to draft a DE in the 1st and then the best OL in the 3rd?
Of course this is all assume that those are the BPA at those picks.
If not then what positions would you like to see drafted in the top 3 picks?

You don't get to say "draft OL/DL in the first 3 rounds" and then say "I assume that will be BPA at those picks" - those are two different things.

Reid said he's feeling a little bit better but isn't ready yet, which after 2 months off isn't exactly encouraging. He also said he doesn't know if he will be ready for the postseason. At that point he will have had almost 3 months off.

Wasn't there some whispers this could be career ending? I really hope not.

[Chief Roundup]

You don't get to say "draft OL/DL in the first 3 rounds" and then say "I assume that will be BPA at those picks" - those are two different things.


Sure I do. I was trying to expand into a question to Dane with better break down that the other poster had done.

[Megatron96]

We started the season with about 9 guys signed on the OL. People on CP were unhappy that we had so many OLs on the roster. Andy and Veach did everything they could do for the OL. Stop bitching about it.

[DaneMcCloud]

You don't think they should or need to draft a DE in the 1st and then the best OL in the 3rd?
Of course this is all assume that those are the BPA at those picks.
If not then what positions would you like to see drafted in the top 3 picks?

I already listed DE as a possibility in the first round. Niang was a 4 year starter at Right Tackle in college so if Schwartz retires, I'd imagine that he'll get first dibs on the gig.

People here need to stop acting as if just drafting a guy early solves any and every offensive line problem. If that was the case, what happened with the Chargers 2 years ago when they drafted guards in the 1st and 2nd?

Teams draft offensive lineman late in the first all the time but that doesn't mean their issue is automatically solved. And spending 1st or 2nd round picks on interior offensive lineman is a complete waste of draft capital.

JFC, haven't you people learned this yet? For Fuck's Sake, Pioli took Rodney Hudson (great pick, left after 4 years) and Donald Stephenson (not so great pick) with the 2nd and 3rd picks in the 2011 draft, while the Seahawks took Russell Wilson.

This isn't 1990, people. Skill position players rule.

[OKchiefs]

:facepalm:

Yeah, ****ing 8 straight winning seasons and a Super Bowl victory clearly isn't enough "proof" for you that this is Andy's M.O.

Good grief.

His M.O. was predicated on having elite OT play making up for subpar IOL talent. What happens when the OT play isn't so elite anymore? Schwartz's back issues probably aren't just going away, and I doubt you see the "best RT in the league" Schwartz going forward. Fisher is a FA after 2021, and frankly if he's going to see what guys like Bolles and others are making and requests similar pay he isn't worth it.

[DaneMcCloud]

We started the season with about 9 guys signed on the OL. People on CP were unhappy that we had so many OLs on the roster. Andy and Veach did everything they could do for the OL. Stop bitching about it.

LMAO

So true, so true...

[OKchiefs]

I already listed DE as a possibility in the first round. Niang was a 4 year starter at Right Tackle in college so if Schwartz retires, I'd imagine that he'll get first dibs on the gig.

People here need to stop acting as if just drafting a guy early solves any and every offensive line problem. If that was the case, what happened with the Chargers 2 years ago when they drafted guards in the 1st and 2nd?

Teams draft offensive lineman late in the first all the time but that doesn't mean their issue is automatically solved. And spending 1st or 2nd round picks on interior offensive lineman is a complete waste of draft capital.

JFC, haven't you people learned this yet? For ****'s Sake, Pioli took Rodney Hudson (great pick, left after 4 years) and Donald Stephenson (not so great pick) with the 2nd and 3rd picks in the 2011 draft, while the Seahawks took Russell Wilson.

This isn't 1990, people. Skill position players rule.

Skill position players don't rule if you can't win in the trenches. Again, very few are asking for an OL in the 1st. We likely have an extra pick in rounds 3-5. Spend a 3rd on OL and maybe another 5th or 6th and I think most around here would be more than happy. But continue with the strawman argument that everyone is asking for a guard or center in the 1st.

[Chief Roundup]

I already listed DE as a possibility in the first round. Niang was a 4 year starter at Right Tackle in college so if Schwartz retires, I'd imagine that he'll get first dibs on the gig.

People here need to stop acting as if just drafting a guy early solves any and every offensive line problem. If that was the case, what happened with the Chargers 2 years ago when they drafted guards in the 1st and 2nd?

Teams draft offensive lineman late in the first all the time but that doesn't mean their issue is automatically solved. And spending 1st or 2nd round picks on interior offensive lineman is a complete waste of draft capital.

JFC, haven't you people learned this yet? For Fuck's Sake, Pioli took Rodney Hudson (great pick, left after 4 years) and Donald Stephenson (not so great pick) with the 2nd and 3rd picks in the 2011 draft, while the Seahawks took Russell Wilson.

This isn't 1990, people. Skill position players rule.I hadn't seen where you posted that. I totally agree.

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[Redbled]

I agree that Allegretti has played well, and when Kilgore was at center this year, he seemed to be better than Reiter, even though it's a small sample size.

But, I am so FN sick of watching Wiley watch his man hit or sack Mahomes. It doesn't matter where he plays, he is like a FN turnstile.

I can't remember Mahomes ever talking to an offensive lineman like he did today. I don't remember the player specifically, but it looked like the camera caught him saying something to an O-lineman, ending with "come on, man."

I think we should find the best available offensive lineman, from practice squads, or players sitting at home, and cut Keizer, and give the new lineman a TE number, because a practice squad caliber offensive lineman couldn't be any worse at TE than Keizer is, at blocking or receiving.

I am being a little facetious, but nobody wants to see Mahomes hit like he was today. I think it's a miracle that after getting sandwiched, and taking the crown of the helmet to his right shoulder and chest, that he was not hindered throwing the ball.

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk

I think it was Fisher Pat was talking to. Believe it was after he got sandwiched when both tackles got beat.

[DaneMcCloud]

Skill position players don't rule if you can't win in the trenches. Again, very few are asking for an OL in the 1st. We likely have an extra pick in rounds 3-5. Spend a 3rd on OL and maybe another 5th or 6th and I think most around here would be more than happy. But continue with the strawman argument that everyone is asking for a guard or center in the 1st.

If you've read my posts in this thread, you'd know that I'd be great with taking interior linemen in the 3rd - 5th.

Just not in the first or second.

[Chris Meck]

:facepalm:

Yeah, ****ing 8 straight winning seasons and a Super Bowl victory clearly isn't enough "proof" for you that this is Andy's M.O.

Good grief.

I don't think you can necessarily look at anything past as "Andy's M.O." other than he likes to throw the ball, which wouldn't change being as he has Mahomes.

He's never been here before.

As defending champs, he did something he had never done and drafted a RB at #32. Just as an example.

It's a pretty stocked roster, to be honest; and the cupboard will still be full in 2021.

It does seem clear that the single biggest area of weakness is the offensive line; and while it's largely due to injuries, it's due to BACK INJURIES with 3 30-ish guys that are 300 lbs plus. That's not usually something that gets better.

Niang and LDT if he comes back helps; but we clearly need to get younger, healthier, cheaper, and BETTER quite honestly up front.

So while I don't expect a first round lineman, I do expect a couple of mid-rounders and a Veach special or two reclamation project(s).

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Fisher played 98% of the snaps yesterday with a bad back. Mad props to Fisher

[Megatron96]

Just looking the depth over, we’ve had 13 OL in the team.

Can we stop with the stupid narrative that Andy and Veach haven’t invested in the OL?

[smithandrew051]

IMO the draft priorities are:

1. Pass Rush
2. OL
3. Receivers (this is only below OL, because we’re already very good here)
4. LB

That said, I’m all about drafting BPA (except QB) with need only considered as a tiebreaker. Get the best players. Few teams ever regret targeting positions if they’re consistently getting good players.

[OKchiefs]

Just looking the depth over, we’ve had 13 OL in the team.

Can we stop with the stupid narrative that Andy and Veach haven’t invested in the OL?

How do you define "invest"? Simply having OL on the roster doesn't mean you've invested much at all at the position.

[htismaqe]

How do you define "invest"? Simply having OL on the roster doesn't mean you've invested much at all at the position.

Since Andy Reid arrived in 2013, they've spent 8 picks on the offensive line, including the 1st overall, a 2nd rounder, and a 3rd rounder.

They've also signed 4 offensive linemen this past offseason and 3 more the offseason before.

They've invested quite a bit there, it just hasn't worked.

[htismaqe]

If you've read my posts in this thread, you'd know that I'd be great with taking interior linemen in the 3rd - 5th.

Just not in the first or second.

Exactly.

There's no need to overspend out of panic.

[The Franchise]

We’ve been devastated with injuries and opt outs. We were just fine going into this season. I’d still be looking for a center and a guard in this draft.

[OKchiefs]

Exactly.

There's no need to overspend out of panic.

Several have said spend a 1st on OL, but I'd venture to guess the average poster on here just wants a little more (i.e. 3rd/4th round) as I believe we've agreed on before. Agreed on all fronts that a 1st isn't the best allocation of resources unless we're looking to replace Fisher at any point. Now, if Fisher is going to ask for $20 million a year after 2021 I'm not sure he's worth it and I wouldn't mind seeing a high pick spent on an OT if someone is available.

[htismaqe]

Several have said spend a 1st on OL, but I'd venture to guess the average poster on here just wants a little more (i.e. 3rd/4th round) as I believe we've agreed on before. Agreed on all fronts that a 1st isn't the best allocation of resources unless we're looking to replace Fisher at any point. Now, if Fisher is going to ask for $20 million a year after 2021 I'm not sure he's worth it and I wouldn't mind seeing a high pick spent on an OT if someone is available.

The only issue there is that you're likely developing a LT, even a 1st rounder, because the instant starters are had much earlier in the 1st than we'll be picking for the foreseeable future.

[DaneMcCloud]

I don't think you can necessarily look at anything past as "Andy's M.O." other than he likes to throw the ball, which wouldn't change being as he has Mahomes.

He's never been here before.

He spent mid and late round picks with the Eagles for years, most of which turned out pretty well for him.

John Welbourn was a 4th, Jason Kelce was a 6th, LDT and Fulton were 6th's and so on.

While I believe that it's really difficult to draft a competent Left Tackle outside of the early 1st round, drafting interior players in the 3rd-7th has been his M.O. and it's a smart one, for sure.

[Pitt Gorilla]

Skill position players don't rule if you can't win in the trenches. Again, very few are asking for an OL in the 1st. We likely have an extra pick in rounds 3-5. Spend a 3rd on OL and maybe another 5th or 6th and I think most around here would be more than happy. But continue with the strawman argument that everyone is asking for a guard or center in the 1st.You don't really have to "win" in the "trenches." You simply need to tie, when you're on offense.

[Pitt Gorilla]

Draft a stud center and right guard

Fisher
Allegreti
Stud
Stud
Niang

If Schwartz can play:

Fisher
Allegreti
Stud draft pick
Niang
Schwartz

If LDT and Schwartz bot return next year

Fisher
Niang
Stud draft pick
LDT
SchwartzWow, it's so easy. "Draft a stud." Man, I wish Veach had thought of that.

[FloridaMan88]

Schwartz in the dreaded Eric Berry Memorial “Day to Day”...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Reid says Mitchell Scwartz is feeling better, but he&#39;s not back yet. Says he&#39;s not sure of Schwartz will be back to the playoffs.<br><br>&quot;We&#39;re taking it day by day.&quot;</p>&mdash; Robert &#39;Blue Checkmark&#39; Rimpson (@Rimpsanity) <a href="https://twitter.com/Rimpsanity/status/1341084164246913024?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 21, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[htismaqe]

Wow, it's so easy. "Draft a stud." Man, I wish Veach had thought of that.

Not just one but two. A center AND a RG.

[Riflemen]

I feel like we've proven we have good depth until this week and to be honest Reiter is just not a tackle. We were asking a lot of him against New Orleans DEs. Allegretti, Remmers, and Kilgore have all been solid this year. Wisnewski will get better when he has time to gel. Getting a center would be nice but I don't think it's an early draft need. We are probably going to be looking at WRs with Watkins and Robinson hitting free agency. TE#2 is also a bigger need than center. I'm thinking we take Kaderius Toney, WR, Florida in the first round if he doesn't run too fast at the combine.

[OKchiefs]

The only issue there is that you're likely developing a LT, even a 1st rounder, because the instant starters are had much earlier in the 1st than we'll be picking for the foreseeable future.

i agree, which is why i’m suggesting to draft a LT a year earlier than needed. IMO Fisher should be extended before the 2021 draft if they can reach an agreeable amount or they need to plan on him walking in 2022. Going into 2021 without knowing for sure if he’s the long term option at LT isn’t ideal.

[RealSNR]

I feel like we've proven we have good depth until this week and to be honest Reiter is just not a tackle. We were asking a lot of him against New Orleans DEs. Allegretti, Remmers, and Kilgore have all been solid this year. Wisnewski will get better when he has time to gel. Getting a center would be nice but I don't think it's an early draft need. We are probably going to be looking at WRs with Watkins and Robinson hitting free agency. TE#2 is also a bigger need than center. I'm thinking we take Kaderius Toney, WR, Florida in the first round if he doesn't run too fast at the combine.

...Reiter didn't play tackle.

Is there something about fatties that causes people to confuse names or something? It's happened like 8 times in this thread alone.

[gonefishin53]

Andy invested pick #49 in center Mitch Morse. To say he wouldn't invest pick #32 in a center he believes to be of that quality doesn't make sense. Josh Myers, Ohio St. center, is like a Mitch Morse clone with his size, strength, mobility, agility and play against top quality B1G conference competition the last two years. I see no reason why Andy wouldn't take him at #32 if he's the best player on the Chief's board.

[htismaqe]

Andy invested pick #49 in center Mitch Morse. To say he wouldn't invest pick #32 in a center he believes to be of that quality doesn't make sense. Josh Myers, Ohio St. center, is like a Mitch Morse clone with his size, strength, mobility, agility and play against top quality B1G conference competition the last two years. I see no reason why Andy wouldn't take him at #32 if he's the best player on the Chief's board.

If he's there. Myers is like going in the 20's depending on how things play out.

This is a very deep but not very top-heavy IOL draft. There's likely to be some reaches. Which is why the Chiefs need to stick to their board and not panic.

[tmax63]

People keep bringing up WR because SW and DRob are probably gone. In terms of catches that's the #3 and #5 (I'm guessing) guys on the roster. Hardman and Pringle can pick up that slack or more. I don't that as big of a need as the guys protecting PMII. A mid-round WR who can run routes and catch the ball isn't that hard to find. #1's and #2's are a lot harder to find.

[Megatron96]

Not just one but two. A center AND a RG.

That's all? Well, hell, I thought we were talking about doing something hard. By all means, let's watch Veach just draft two OL studs that will finish the season as All-Pros in their rookie years right now.

[htismaqe]

People keep bringing up WR because SW and DRob are probably gone. In terms of catches that's the #3 and #5 (I'm guessing) guys on the roster. Hardman and Pringle can pick up that slack or more. I don't that as big of a need as the guys protecting PMII. A mid-round WR who can run routes and catch the ball isn't that hard to find. #1's and #2's are a lot harder to find.

High dollar positions should be targets in the 1st round because of the 5th year of control. That's why WR is a potential target, not necessarily because of need.

Add in the fact that we sorely need more DE's and DE is probably the most logical choice for the first round. After that, you're looking at WR, CB, S, and OT as positions that are expensive and need to be drafted vs. brought in via free agency.

[Riflemen]

...Reiter didn't play tackle.

Is there something about fatties that causes people to confuse names or something? It's happened like 8 times in this thread alone.

My bad, I thought he played RT yesterday and Wisnewski played RG.

[Pitt Gorilla]

Andy invested pick #49 in center Mitch Morse. To say he wouldn't invest pick #32 in a center he believes to be of that quality doesn't make sense. Josh Myers, Ohio St. center, is like a Mitch Morse clone with his size, strength, mobility, agility and play against top quality B1G conference competition the last two years. I see no reason why Andy wouldn't take him at #32 if he's the best player on the Chief's board.Just to be clear here: Chief Fan HATED the Morse pick. HATED. I know the FO folks don't care (and they shouldn't), but it's interesting to see Chief Fans floating an idea that would likely result in a return worse than drafting Morse in the second.

[smithandrew051]

We’ve been devastated with injuries and opt outs. We were just fine going into this season. I’d still be looking for a center and a guard in this draft.

Yup. The “INVEST IN THE OL!!!!” crowd is the “VEACH DOENST CARE ABOUT CORNER” crowd with a new bitch.

We’ve invested plenty in the line. We just had absolute shit luck this year.

It happens and great teams overcome the bad luck. To this point, we’ve overcome the obstacles. No team is exempt from this bizarre year.

[Valiant]

Free agents and middle round draft picks and hope we hit on a couple.

[BryanBusby]

Andy invested pick #49 in center Mitch Morse. To say he wouldn't invest pick #32 in a center he believes to be of that quality doesn't make sense. Josh Myers, Ohio St. center, is like a Mitch Morse clone with his size, strength, mobility, agility and play against top quality B1G conference competition the last two years. I see no reason why Andy wouldn't take him at #32 if he's the best player on the Chief's board.
The problem is people just look at whatever Walt has as the top Center in the draft and start to gymnastics themselves into how it's actually the most logical move.

Cesar Ruiz, Bradbury, Forest Lamp. It never stops.

CP sucking off a slow fatty with Trex arms is as classic as a shitty deberg thread.

Just to be clear here: Chief Fan HATED the Morse pick. HATED. I know the FO folks don't care (and they shouldn't), but it's interesting to see Chief Fans floating an idea that would likely result in a return worse than drafting Morse in the second.
Spending a mid 2nd to rent Terri Schiavo was an all time Dorsey greatest hit.

[OKchiefs]

Just to be clear here: Chief Fan HATED the Morse pick. HATED. I know the FO folks don't care (and they shouldn't), but it's interesting to see Chief Fans floating an idea that would likely result in a return worse than drafting Morse in the second.

I personally didn’t care for Morse because he simply wasn’t physically dominant, and after the fact because he was injury prone. Of course I know that’s part of Reid’s philosophy with OL and why Reiter is starting and not Kilgore, so I probably will continue to disagree with the type of OL he takes. Point is, I personally disagreed with the player, not the position.

[O.city]

I personally didn’t care for Morse because he simply wasn’t physically dominant, and after the fact because he was injury prone. Of course I know that’s part of Reid’s philosophy with OL and why Reiter is starting and not Kilgore, so I probably will continue to disagree with the type of OL he takes. Point is, I personally disagreed with the player, not the position.

If you want a physically dominant interior OL, you're gonna have to get one pretty high up in the draft. Those dudes don't grow on trees.

[Pitt Gorilla]

If you want a physically dominant interior OL, you're gonna have to get one pretty high up in the draft. Those dudes don't grow on trees.Good point. Rodney Hudson cost a 2nd rounder.

[Megatron96]

If you want a physically dominant interior OL, you're gonna have to get one pretty high up in the draft. Those dudes don't grow on trees.

According to CP, they do. Veach could easily draft two stud IOLs, but he and Andy haven't, because they are either a) incompetent, or b) are perversely enjoying fucking with half of CP.ROFL

My money is on b. I think Andy and Veach sit around late at night smoking J, and giggle their asses off while reading CP.:p

[Coach]

If you've read my posts in this thread, you'd know that I'd be great with taking interior linemen in the 3rd - 5th.

Just not in the first or second.

If it was high first round, sure I would agree with that we don't need to get a O-line (except for rare situations where there's definitely a Willie Roaf/Jonathan Ogden type of players). And I completely forgot about that 5th year option, so that's on me, and I also need to take that into consideration as well.

Since we are picking first round, it's likely will be in the 30's again, which I would argue that it's a high second (for any other position outside of a O-line for that coveted 5th year option). And the 2nd round would be a high 3rd round. That's all I'm saying is for the 2nd rounder to be a O-lineman, since it can be treated as a high 3rd round pick anyways.

And htismaqe made a point, the Chiefs have made investments in that area by previous draft picks and signing guys, it just hasn't worked. Why is that? Is it because of poor evaluation? Poor coaching? Or the player just didn't project to what they thought he should be?

I just don't want this to be an issue where the Bengals (although their O-line is significantly worse than KC) just had their QB killed and lost for the year because of shitty O-line play.