I think Fisher is coming back

[HemiEd]

It just seems to be lining up where the Chiefs are planning on it to me.

His injury against Buffalo in the AFCCG was sudden and sad.

Bart Verch said he planned on him coming back in August.

Then he is suddenly cut/released.

A complete new OL minus a LT.

Yeah, I know about the draft, but it just seems to be stacking up for Fisher's return to me.

Discuss

[Sassy Squatch]

Nah.

[staylor26]

I wouldn’t say I think it’s going to happen, or that it’s likely, but I do think it’s more of a possibility than people think.

[Deberg_1990]

He’s gone forever. Time to move on

[Why Not?]

I certainly don’t think that’s part of a master plan or anything but it’s possible it could happen.

[Rainbarrel]

Silverfish

[ThyKingdomCome15]

:facepalm:

[Bugeater]

https://i.imgur.com/sktnWBc.gif

[louie aguiar]

https://i.imgur.com/sktnWBc.gif

It’s the gif that keeps on giving

[Bugeater]

It’s the gif that keeps on givingI'm shocked it took that long for it to get posted.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

I honestly think so too. Rankin will be LT for a couple games then Fisher is back. I love me some Fish!!!!

[RealSNR]

We cut him and pay a little dead cap.

Don't we get double-whammied if we sign him now at this point?

[RealSNR]

I honestly think so too. Rankin will be LT for a couple games then Fisher is back. I love me some Fish!!!!

If Rankin will be LT for a couple games, then it's Henne that will be back, not Fisher.

Rankin fucking sucks. I hope he doesn't survive training camp so we never have to worry about him actually entering a goddamn game.

[Fat Elvis]

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d2/fc/f0/d2fcf092a1223a8060639182c5e85616.gif

[HemiEd]

I wouldn’t say I think it’s going to happen, or that it’s likely, but I do think it’s more of a possibility than people think.

One of the more knowledgable football posters on this board, kudos.

[chiefzilla1501]

Want to believe it, but it would take swallowing a lot of pride to get cut and then come back for way less. Not holding my breath. But you could tell fish and schwartz absolutely love Kansas city so who knows.

[Direckshun]

Google, show me evidence that our offseason has been dogshit

[staylor26]

Google, show me evidence that our offseason has been dogshit

:facepalm:

Our offseason has been “dogshit”?

How exactly? What should’ve been done differently?

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Schwartz will gladly love to come back as a Chief. Fisher I’m not too sure

[chiefforlife]

I feel like its an Ace up the sleeve move for Veach.

Probably already had a conversation with Fish about it and see where the off season takes us.

If we dont end up needing him he will likely land somewhere else after injuries happen but the Chiefs have first right of refusal.

Just a gut thought, nothing else.

PS. Based on the love the Chiefs have for Fish and the love he has for the team.

[chiefforlife]

Schwartz will gladly love to come back as a Chief. Fisher I’m not too sure

I could see this happening as well.

Same theory, the Chiefs love Schwartz and Schwartz loves the team.

[Buehler445]

I have no idea where their head is at, but if he's ready by August, I think a 2 year deal with the guarantee up front isn't out of the question. If he can be had cheap a transition year and getting his higher salary off the books is a sage move. I thought they'd do it quickly, but I'm a moron and know nothing, so....

[jjchieffan]

I was thinking that too. I'm guessing that Veach probably told both of them to go out and see what they can get. Maybe even put an offer on the table that's there for the taking of they can't get any better.

[O.city]

He’s not coming back

[Hammock Parties]

About Week 4 a pair of glowing portals will open and Fisher AND Schwartz will step out.

"Brokedicks...assemble."

:D

[Dunerdr]

I feel like people are just talking themselves into this so they dont have a knot in their stomach every time they think about our lack of a starting caliber left tackle. It is possible but id say unlikely if anything. He got cut because he wasnt going to be ready. They have made it obvious its time to get younger and better across the line. bringing back a 31 year old big man with an achilles injury doesn't fit the bill imo.

[Bowser]

About Week 4 a pair of glowing portals will open and Fisher AND Schwartz will step out.

"Brokedicks...assemble."

:D

"Patrick! Patrick, can you read me?

On your left ass cheek"

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

I feel like people are just talking themselves into this so they dont have a knot in their stomach every time they think about our lack of a starting caliber left tackle. It is possible but id say unlikely if anything. He got cut because he wasnt going to be ready. They have made it obvious its time to get younger and better across the line. bringing back a 31 year old big man with an achilles injury doesn't fit the bill imo.

And bringing in Okung who’s 3 years older and has more Injuries does for the bill?

[oldman]

I feel like its an Ace up the sleeve move for Veach.

Probably already had a conversation with Fish about it and see where the off season takes us.

If we dont end up needing him he will likely land somewhere else after injuries happen but the Chiefs have first right of refusal.

Just a gut thought, nothing else.

PS. Based on the love the Chiefs have for Fish and the love he has for the team.

That's kind of the way I see it. I don't think he'll be ready by August, but early to mid-October isn't out.

[Direckshun]

:facepalm:

Our offseason has been “dogshit”?

How exactly? What should’ve been done differently?

We wasted the first three days of FA in suspended animation because our intel was wrong on Trent Williams.

Which was problematic to begin with: our actual offseason plan involves dumping a LT we literally went 26-1 with in order to try to outbid a half dozen other teams on the hottest free agent in the NFL — which we misjudged anyway.

We dropped the largest guard contract in league history for a really great guard. And we entered the offseason with gigantic holes at LT, WR, and DE. And we’re pretty much going to end up there.

It’s hard to imagine the long term ramifications of how dogshit this offseason has been. We cannot resteucture Mahomes, Kelce, or Jones every offseason. And we did it this year for mild returns at best.

And 2022 is going to be extraordinarily rough, as well. We had some tough holes to fill this offseason, and we failed to fill any of them, unless Veach has the best draft of his GM career. 2022 will offer more cap space, and somehow even more holes.

[KChiefs1]

He should be ready by Super Bowl LVI.

[The Franchise]

Who the fuck is playing LT Week one then? Because it isn’t Fisher.

[staylor26]

We wasted the first three days of FA I’m suspended animation because our intel was wrong on Trent Williams.

Which was problematic to begin with: our actual offseason plan involves dumping a LT we literally went 26-1 with in order to try to outbid a half dozen other teams on the hottest free agent in the NFL — which we misjudged anyway.

We dropped the largest guard contract in league history for a really great guard. And we entered the offseason with gigantic holes at LT, WR, and DE. And we’re pretty much going to end up there.

It’s hard to imagine the long term ramifications of how dogshit this offseason has been. We cannot resteucture Mahomes, Kelce, or Jones every offseason. And we did it this year for mild returns at best.

And 2022 is going to be extraordinarily rough, as well. We had some tough holes to fill this offseason, and we failed to fill any of them, unless Veach has the best draft of his GM career. 2022 will offer more cap space, and somehow even more holes.

JFC you’re an idiot.

How do you even manage to breathe?

The Chiefs had no choice in the matter with Fisher. They cut him because they can’t rely on him. The injury and the timing forced their hand. They used that money to get the best G in free agency on a deal that will look like peanuts by the time Nelson gets his extension and the cap explodes. Then they went after the best LT and gave it their best shot.

How the fuck was our “intel” wrong on Williams? Even Williams said he thought he was going to be a Chief at one point. This is revisionist history made up bullshit based on the outcome.

They got significantly better on the interior, they brought back a guy that was above average at RT last year, and they have a 3rd round pick from last year coming in that has legitimate 1st round talent. Aside from LT, the rest of the line is fine. LT was always going to be a question mark whether they didn’t cut Fisher or go after Williams.

They were patient and didn’t panic after missing on Williams, which led to them signing Jarran Reed, which will probably give us the best interior duo in the league defensively.

We also got a VERY cheap above average starting C in Blythe that should help out tremendously in the running game.

The Chiefs essentially have 2 of the top 5 WR’s in the league. The need for a WR is incredibly exaggerated because of the SB loss. If the OL is even above average Kelce and Hill do their thing like they did all season and this isn’t such an overblown need.

Yes, we absolutely need to add young talent at the position, but I’m almost certain they do that in the early rounds where they should be. This team needs to draft and develop WR’s every year. End of story. Free agency was nice when Pat was on a rookie deal. Other than the occasional 1 year deals, that’s over.

The need at DE has also been softened with the signing of Reed. It’s also entirely possible that the Chiefs aren’t done there and will sign Ingram or somebody else.

It couldn’t be more obvious that LT will eventually be addressed, but it also will be aided by the addition of Thuney. If we’re starting a rookie LT, he will be a godsend.

Get a fucking grip dude. Veach is a million times better at this than you’ll ever be.

[Direckshun]

JFC you’re an idiot.

How do you even manage to breathe?

Google, show me the emotional intelligence of a 14 year old mean girl

[staylor26]

Google, show me the emotional intelligence of a 14 year old mean girl

Google, show me guy who’s one of the worst football minds on an internet message board that’s ironically constantly worrying and second guessing arguably the best GM in the NFL

[Direckshun]

Google, show me guy who’s one of the worst football minds on an internet message board that’s ironically constantly worrying and second guessing arguably the best GM in the NFL

Appeals to authority is not only a logical fallacy, it’s also not terribly interesting to me. Your plans still have to make sense. There’s no sense behind entering an offseason with three massive holes and failing (so far) to fill any of them adequately.

God forbid we question the Great Brett Veach, who has been an inconsistent GM for the Chiefs. That mindset simply isn’t interesting to me, but if that’s the “logic” you’re going to fallback on, then just save us both the trouble and copy paste “Veach knows what he’s doing” and save us both the time.

[kcclone]

FA is what it is. Where you can make up ground (or put yourself behind the 8 ball) is through the draft.

2018 was a train wreck.

2019 was solid.

2020 has the makings of being really good.

A good draft class this year is very important IMO.

[staylor26]

Appeals to authority is not only a logical fallacy, it’s also not terribly interesting to me. Your plans still have to make sense. There’s no sense behind entering an offseason with three massive holes and failing (so far) to fill any of them adequately.

God forbid we question the Great Brett Veach, who has been an inconsistent GM for the Chiefs. That mindset simply isn’t interesting to me, but if that’s the “logic” you’re going to fallback on, then just save us both the trouble and copy paste “Veach knows what he’s doing” and save us both the time.

How the fuck is WR a “massive” hole? We essentially have 2 top 5 WR’s. This is why I called you a fucking idiot.

We are no worse off at DE than we were last year. I’d argue that there’s more upside with Danna/Taco than Kpass/Okafor as well. They aren’t done signing guys either. They could just as easily sign a guy like Ingram or draft one early.

Also, why is DE a need? Pass rush. What will Jarran Reed help out tremendously with playing next to Jones and Clark? Pass rush. We have 3 guys capable of double digit sacks. How much better do you think it gets?

The only “massive” hole is at LT, and like I said, it was there regardless of whether the Chiefs didn’t cut Fisher or go after Williams. Both of those aren’t solutions either.

It’s not about appealing to authority. It’s about how cringy it is watching an idiot like you constantly questioning and worrying about the job being done by arguably one of the best in the business.

If you actually made any sense or provided an actual solution when I asked for one, I would’ve respected your argument more, but you didn’t. You couldn’t come off more clueless if you tried in your reasoning of why this offseason was “dogshit” when it’s not even remotely over mind you.

[Direckshun]

How the **** is WR a “massive” hole? We essentially have 2 top 5 WR’s. This is why I called you a ****ing idiot.

We are no worse off at DE than we were last year. I’d argue that there’s more upside with Danna/Taco than Kpass/Okafor as well. They aren’t done signing guys either. They could just as easily sign a guy like Ingram or draft one early.

Also, why is DE a need? Pass rush. What will Jarran Reed help out tremendously with playing next to Jones and Clark? Pass rush. We have 3 guys capable of double digit sacks. How much better do you think it gets?

The only “massive” hole is at LT, and like I said, it was there regardless of whether the Chiefs didn’t cut Fisher or go after Williams. Both of those aren’t solutions either.

It’s not about appealing to authority. It’s about how cringy it is watching an idiot like you constantly questioning and worrying about the job being done by arguably one of the best in the business.

If you actually made any sense or provided an actual solution when I asked for one, I would’ve respected your argument more, but you didn’t. You couldn’t come off more clueless if you tried in your reasoning of why this offseason was “dogshit” when it’s not even remotely over mind you.

1. I assumed you’ve watched the All 22 from the Super Bowl? Because Hill and Kelce were blanketed — the Bucs threw the house at them and dared any other receiver to get open. None did. WR2 is a massive hole.

2. Danna and Taco are not full time DEs. They are not starters. We do not have a 2nd starter on the roster, and Frank Clark is cuttable next year. DE2 is a massive hole.

3. The Chiefs themselves said Fisher was on a timetable to return. I don’t think it’s realistic that Fisher would be set to play Week One, but we don’t need him until January. The luxury of Mahomes means Weeks 1-17 are expendable. Cutting him and selling out to *fail* to land Williams is a loss for this team that they’ve yet to rectify. That’s problematic for most teams, but it’s especially ridiculous for the team with the best QB in the league worth 500m. We are essentially selling out for a 1st round LT — let’s just hope their intel is correct on which teams like Eichenberg. Because we’re going to have to give up more precious resources away to trade up for him.

4. When you say things like “Veach is a better GM than you,” it is an appeal to authority, and therefore the least interesting argument on a football discussion board I can imagine.

Edit: Also, compadre, no person on this forum provides more proposed solutions than I do. I post a hundred mock offseasons a year in DraftPlanet, like them or not. Save your breath in complaining I never offer solutions.

[staylor26]

1. Hill and Kelce were “blanketed” because the OL was absolutely awful and allowed them to consistently drop back 7. Mahomes was running for his life the entire game. If that doesn’t happen, the Chiefs obviously have much more success on offense.

It’s still hilarious to call WR a “massive hole” any way you put it when you essentially have 2 top 5 WR’s. Chiefs fans are so fucking spoiled at this point that people like you could call it a “massive hole”.

2. Danna and Taco are no worse than Okafor and KPass. They absolutely have more upside. Like I said, they aren’t done there and are clearly looking at free agents. Did the Chiefs pass rush not already improve with the addition of Reed? You mean to tell me the loss of Kpass and Okafor offsets adding a guy like Reed to the interior?

3. So your solution at LT was simply to not cut Fisher and not go after Williams. Brilliant. The Chiefs still have huge question marks at LT for the short term and long term. So much better. And it’s not like Fisher can’t be brought back worst case scenario, you know, like the point of this thread. You came in here and said this is proof of a “dogshit” offseason, yet your solution is to not cut Fisher? How’s that not dosgshit? That would cost us one of Reed or Thuney possibly too. So you wanted dogshit+?

4. Avian, it’s not about appealing to authority. It’s not that you dare to question Veach. It’s that you’re clearly clueless trying to do so.

[cdcox]

If he still has gas in the tank someone else will offer him something. A top-10 talent is not going to be resting his Achilles on an ottoman once training camp start if can contribute at anything close to his former level.

[Direckshun]

1. Hill and Kelce were “blanketed” because the OL was absolutely awful and allowed them to consistently drop back 7. Mahomes was running for his life the entire game. If that doesn’t happen, the Chiefs obviously have much more success on offense.

It’s still hilarious to call WR a “massive hole” any way you put it when you essentially have 2 top 5 WR’s. Chiefs fans are so ****ing spoiled at this point that people like you could call it a “massive hole”.

2. Danna and Taco are no worse than Okafor and KPass. They absolutely have more upside. Like I said, they aren’t done there and are clearly looking at free agents. Did the Chiefs pass rush not already improve with the addition of Reed? You mean to tell me the loss of Kpass and Okafor offsets adding a guy like Reed to the interior?

3. So your solution at LT was simply to not cut Fisher and not go after Williams. Brilliant. The Chiefs still have huge question marks at LT for the short term and long term. So much better. And it’s not like Fisher can’t be brought back worst case scenario, you know, like the point of this thread. You came in here and said this is proof of a “dogshit” offseason, yet your solution is to not cut Fisher? How’s that not dosgshit? That would cost us one of Reed or Thuney possibly too. So you wanted dogshit+?

4. Avian, it’s not about appealing to authority. It’s not that you dare to question Veach. It’s that you’re clearly clueless trying to do so.

1. They were blanketed. The OL was clearly a problem, but watch the tape. Two guys can’t beat 4-5 guys reliably, and nobody else was getting open. We don’t win the Super Bowl LIV without Sammy Watkins roasting single coverage all game. We didn’t have that in SB LV.

2. Kpass and Okafor weren’t enough. Really the passrush hasn’t been what we’ve needed it to be the entire time under Veach, except for Clark going nuclear in the 2019 playoffs.

3. My solution was to keep Fish and play a stopgap solution until he returned. That’s what we did in 2019, after all, and we won the Super Bowl when he returned.

4. If you’re not appealing to authority than stop t with the “Veach is a better GM” nonsense and focus on the merit. You’re wasting our time.

[Nickhead]

it's been publicly stated at least three times that it's possible for a fisher return mid season. :thumb:

[Chris Meck]

calling this offseason a disaster on the first of April because you don't understand the plan is stupid.

We've signed two HUGE free agents.

Yes there are still holes. Do you really think Veach and Reid aren't aware?

Silly season on Chiefsplanet.

[RaidersOftheCellar]

Want to believe it, but it would take swallowing a lot of pride to get cut and then come back for way less. Not holding my breath. But you could tell fish and schwartz absolutely love Kansas city so who knows.

You can’t expect to have high demands after a major injury. It’s no guarantee that he ever regains his old form, much less next season. He should be on a short-term prove it deal.

[Dunerdr]

Fuck, Staylor stop entertaining these "The sky is falling" dumbasses. You can lead a horse to water but you cant make it drink.

[HemiEd]

I feel like its an Ace up the sleeve move for Veach.

Probably already had a conversation with Fish about it and see where the off season takes us.

If we dont end up needing him he will likely land somewhere else after injuries happen but the Chiefs have first right of refusal.

Just a gut thought, nothing else.

PS. Based on the love the Chiefs have for Fish and the love he has for the team.

I agree, this is how I see it

[Kman34]

I think mullets are coming back too.. Doesn’t mean I’m right...

[Direckshun]

calling this offseason a disaster on the first of April because you don't understand the plan is stupid.

We've signed two HUGE free agents.

Yes there are still holes. Do you really think Veach and Reid aren't aware?

Silly season on Chiefsplanet.

I actually posted a positive perspective (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=15597297#post15597297) on the Chiefs offseason a few days in. But that positivity was contingent on several things happening that... simply haven't happened.

I know it's en vogue on football websites to say that Super Bowls aren't won in free agency.

But they are. Super Bowls are won in free agency.

We won our Super Bowl by trading for Clark and signing Badger, which pushed us over the top.

The Bucs won theirs by having one of the Top 3 free agency offseasons in NFL history.

Great, Super Bowl caliber NFL seasons almost always follow great offseasons. (Edit: I actually think our offseason in 2020 was outstanding, from free agency, cap management, the draft, and our incredible UDFA haul.)

We've got a ways to go. Because I don't think any of us would have marked down "failing to address three massive roster concerns, as well as several other minor ones" up to this point as anything other than a disappointment.

[Skyy God]

I actually posted a positive perspective (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=15597297#post15597297) on the Chiefs offseason a few days in. But that positivity was contingent on several things happening that... simply haven't happened.

I know it's en vogue on football websites to say that Super Bowls aren't won in free agency.

But they are. Super Bowls are won in free agency.

We won our Super Bowl by trading for Clark and signing Badger, which pushed us over the top.

The Bucs won theirs by having one of the Top 3 free agency offseasons in NFL history.

Great, Super Bowl caliber NFL seasons almost always follow great offseasons. (Edit: I actually think our offseason in 2020 was outstanding, from free agency, cap management, the draft, and our incredible UDFA haul.)

We've got a ways to go. Because I don't think any of us would have marked down "failing to address three massive roster concerns, as well as several other minor ones" up to this point as anything other than a disappointment.

The Bucs won the Super Bowl because Fish tore his Achilles and Britt Reid is a dumbass.

[Chris Meck]

I actually posted a positive perspective (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=15597297#post15597297) on the Chiefs offseason a few days in. But that positivity was contingent on several things happening that... simply haven't happened.

I know it's en vogue on football websites to say that Super Bowls aren't won in free agency.

But they are. Super Bowls are won in free agency.

We won our Super Bowl by trading for Clark and signing Badger, which pushed us over the top.

The Bucs won theirs by having one of the Top 3 free agency offseasons in NFL history.

Great, Super Bowl caliber NFL seasons almost always follow great offseasons. (Edit: I actually think our offseason in 2020 was outstanding, from free agency, cap management, the draft, and our incredible UDFA haul.)

We've got a ways to go. Because I don't think any of us would have marked down "failing to address three massive roster concerns, as well as several other minor ones" up to this point as anything other than a disappointment.

YET. It's April 1st. It's ridiculous to declare this offseason a disaster on APRIL 1ST.

There is still a lot of FA to go, there will be a draft in a few weeks, UDFA after that, June 1st cuts, trades etc., to go.

Thuney, Long, and Blythe improves 60% of our offensive line in a dramatic way. Jarrad Reed makes our front four vastly better.

Judging things a disaster on April 1st is knee-jerk reactionary bullshit. It just is.

[Direckshun]

The Bucs won the Super Bowl because Fish tore his Achilles and Britt Reid is a dumbass.

They won that game as much as we lost it. Come on now. They played very well.

They hooked the GOAT in the offseason, who brought in his goon squad with him. They nailed the draft, too.

[Direckshun]

YET. It's April 1st. It's ridiculous to declare this offseason a disaster on APRIL 1ST.

There is still a lot of FA to go, there will be a draft in a few weeks, UDFA after that, June 1st cuts, trades etc., to go.

Thuney, Long, and Blythe improves 60% of our offensive line in a dramatic way. Jarrad Reed makes our front four vastly better.

Judging things a disaster on April 1st is knee-jerk reactionary bullshit. It just is.

Yeah, "yet." I do think that's a fair qualifier. But at this point, find me a better way to describe an offseason where we have three huge holes, and don't fill any of them in FA.

But I don't think we have much more FA to go, honestly, unless they finally get that Badger extension done. They're going to need 6m for the draft, and 6m for in-season signings, like Veach always likes to have.

Veach needs to have the best draft of his career, rather than the shaky drafts he's had so far. And he's going to have to absolutely destroy UDFA this year, like he did last year.

[Chris Meck]

Yeah, "yet." I do think that's a fair qualifier. But at this point, find me a better way to describe an offseason where we have three huge holes, and don't fill any of them in FA.

The ONE bonafide stud LT available was Williams, and we took a BIG swing.

But there are still lateral moves in FA, and there's still the draft, and there's still the possibility of trades.

We took some swings on WR, but mostly guys went back to their 2020 teams on one year deals rather than come to KC, learn a complicated offense, and be option #3 while trying to get paid next year. I don't know what you're supposed to do about that. And yet, it's April 1.

As for DE, signing Reed improves the pass rush by a LOT, and also allows Jones flexibility to pop outside on early downs, which improves your run defense. And there are still guys out there like Ingram and Clowney, who are better than anything we've had at that end in awhile and there's the draft, and June 1 cuts, and assuming we're just going to stand pat and roll with Charlton and Danna ignores Veach's typically aggressive tendencies entirely.

You've said yourself- Veach getting Mathieu and Clark was HUGE. The 2020 offseason was HUGE. And yet, you're ready to call this offseason a disaster...why? Because we got outbid for Williams? It's literally the only swing and miss so far that would've moved any needle.

*and I have zero doubt we'll get the Honey Badger extension done. He's a guy we want to be here, he wants to be here, it'll get done.

[Fish]

https://media.tenor.com/images/4a72fd821baf37bfeda558945d29ef62/tenor.gif

[Direckshun]

The ONE bonafide stud LT available was Williams, and we took a BIG swing.

But there are still lateral moves in FA, and there's still the draft, and there's still the possibility of trades.

We took some swings on WR, but mostly guys went back to their 2020 teams on one year deals rather than come to KC, learn a complicated offense, and be option #3 while trying to get paid next year. I don't know what you're supposed to do about that. And yet, it's April 1.

As for DE, signing Reed improves the pass rush by a LOT, and also allows Jones flexibility to pop outside on early downs, which improves your run defense. And there are still guys out there like Ingram and Clowney, who are better than anything we've had at that end in awhile and there's the draft, and June 1 cuts, and assuming we're just going to stand pat and roll with Charlton and Danna ignores Veach's typically aggressive tendencies entirely.

You've said yourself- Veach getting Mathieu and Clark was HUGE. The 2020 offseason was HUGE. And yet, you're ready to call this offseason a disaster...why? Because we got outbid for Williams? It's literally the only swing and miss so far that would've moved any needle.

*and I have zero doubt we'll get the Honey Badger extension done. He's a guy we want to be here, he wants to be here, it'll get done.

I have some agreement and mild disagreements with this post, but the DE paragraph is just... not a great look.

You don't solve the DE problem with a DT. I am of the belief you need 8 passrushers and Reed, by my count, gets us to 5.

And I'm not remotely optimistic about bopping Chris Jones out to DE. And I'm not sure why you are. Taking on tackles negates most of Jones' strengths, and he's shown us in 2020 that he has absolutely no idea how to play the run at DE.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Direction is the worst football evaluator on this board. Holy shit, what awful takes. To think he acts like some draft and football expert ROFL Just simply a case of someone not understanding a damn thing about what they are watching

[The Franchise]

I have some agreement and mild disagreements with this post, but the DE paragraph is just... not a great look.

You don't solve the DE problem with a DT. I am of the belief you need 8 passrushers and Reed, by my count, gets us to 5.

And I'm not remotely optimistic about bopping Chris Jones out to DE. And I'm not sure why you are. Taking on tackles negates most of Jones' strengths, and he's shown us in 2020 that he has absolutely no idea how to play the run at DE.

Give me a team that has 8 legitimate pass rushers.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Give me a team that has 8 legitimate pass rushers.

I missed that the first time ROFL wow, what a loon. 8 pass rushers ROFL

[O.city]

I'd agree with him on the DE thing just in that I would like to have another rushing DE so we could play Reed and Jones together in the middle.

[Chris Meck]

I have some agreement and mild disagreements with this post, but the DE paragraph is just... not a great look.

You don't solve the DE problem with a DT. I am of the belief you need 8 passrushers and Reed, by my count, gets us to 5.

And I'm not remotely optimistic about bopping Chris Jones out to DE. And I'm not sure why you are. Taking on tackles negates most of Jones' strengths, and he's shown us in 2020 that he has absolutely no idea how to play the run at DE.

yeah man, I tell you what-if you think we need 8 stud pass rushers you're right, this is a disaster. Just like 31 other teams, because NOBODY has 8 stud pass rushers. Nobody. Nada. You want to talk about a bad look? That's just silly.

Louis Riddick has indicated that The Chiefs intend to be able to utilize Jones outside some. I don't think that means he's your starting DE. Spags likes to move guys around and show different looks. Don't get it twisted.

Danna gave us some quality snaps as a rookie. Charlton gave us some flashes before injury. Do we need to get better? Well yeah. It's APRIL 1ST. What big FA DE signing have we missed out on? Did we not draft one? Oh that's right, the draft is in what, 3 weeks?

The way I see it is this: We've taken 3 swings on difference makers in free agency. We got two of 'em. What the hell do you want?

[Direckshun]

Give me a team that has 8 legitimate pass rushers.

Well, let's start at the ground floor.

Name me 8 players on this team that can rush the passer at all.

Clark
Jones
Reed
Taco
Wharton
Danna

I think including Danna in that list is generous at this point in his career, but I set the bar low here.

[staylor26]

“You need 8 pass rushers”

LMAO ROFL :facepalm:

What a fucking moron.

The offseason is a disaster because the Chiefs still only have 2 top 5 receivers, only 5 pass rushers, and they cut Fisher and went after Williams!

[Chris Meck]

I'd agree with him on the DE thing just in that I would like to have another rushing DE so we could play Reed and Jones together in the middle.

Of course. That's nothing anyone in their right minds would disagree with.

I think we're one plus player at DE away from an absolutely dominant front four.

[Chris Meck]

Well, let's start at the ground floor.

Name me 8 players on this team that can rush the passer at all.

Clark
Jones
Reed
Taco
Wharton
Danna

I think including Danna in that list is generous at this point in his career, but I set the bar low here.

Cool, now do the Bucs.

[O.city]

Of course. That's nothing anyone in their right minds would disagree with.

I think we're one plus player at DE away from an absolutely dominant front four.

I like having a few DE's but those Giants teams that Spags really rolled with had so many dudes up there that were just versatile that could move around.

I like that.

[Direckshun]

yeah man, I tell you what-if you think we need 8 stud pass rushers you're right, this is a disaster. Just like 31 other teams, because NOBODY has 8 stud pass rushers. Nobody. Nada. You want to talk about a bad look? That's just silly.

Louis Riddick has indicated that The Chiefs intend to be able to utilize Jones outside some. I don't think that means he's your starting DE. Spags likes to move guys around and show different looks. Don't get it twisted.

Danna gave us some quality snaps as a rookie. Charlton gave us some flashes before injury. Do we need to get better? Well yeah. It's APRIL 1ST. What big FA DE signing have we missed out on? Did we not draft one? Oh that's right, the draft is in what, 3 weeks?

The way I see it is this: We've taken 3 swings on difference makers in free agency. We got two of 'em. What the hell do you want?

I want our three biggest needs filled.

I'm telling you, Jones was as lost as you can be playing end. His passrush advantages are largely negated against tackles, and he has absolutely no idea how to play the run on the edge. I'm a huge Jones fan but he's just a dude you unleash at the 1 tech and let him ruin things. He makes no sense at edge.

But it may seriously be our best option at this point, somehow. Because unless the team finds capspace for a stopgap LT, we're going to have to commit our 1st round pick, and maybe additional picks in a trade-up, for a rookie LT. Which means you're hunting for a starting DE, at best, in the 2nd round. And this draft, as you probably know, has almost zero DEs ready to start. They're all developmental guys this year, outside of Paye and Phillips.

Anyway, Danna looks like a solid rotational piece and of course I'm a Taco fan.

[The Franchise]

Well, let's start at the ground floor.

Name me 8 players on this team that can rush the passer at all.

Clark
Jones
Reed
Taco
Wharton
Danna

I think including Danna in that list is generous at this point in his career, but I set the bar low here.

No, let’s start with your statement of “we need 8 pass rushers”. Find me a team in the league that meets your requirements.

[Chris Meck]

I want our three biggest needs filled.

I'm telling you, Jones was as lost as you can be playing end. His passrush advantages are largely negated against tackles, and he has absolutely no idea how to play the run on the edge. I'm a huge Jones fan but he's just a dude you unleash at the 1 tech and let him ruin things. He makes no sense at edge.

But it may seriously be our best option at this point, somehow. Because unless the team finds capspace for a stopgap LT, we're going to have to commit our 1st round pick, and maybe additional picks in a trade-up, for a rookie LT. Which means you're hunting for a starting DE, at best, in the 2nd round. And this draft, as you probably know, has almost zero DEs ready to start. They're all developmental guys this year, outside of Paye and Phillips.

Anyway, Danna looks like a solid rotational piece and of course I'm a Taco fan.

IT'S APRIL FUCKING FIRST DUDE.

[Fish]

Meh.

[staylor26]

No, let’s start with your statement of “we need 8 pass rushers”. Find me a team in the league that meets your requirements.

He can’t, which is why he dodged the question.

[Chris Meck]

No, let’s start with your statement of “we need 8 pass rushers”. Find me a team in the league that meets your requirements.

I guess he didn't want to do the Bucs.

How about the #1 defense in football? Do the Rams. Show me their 8.

[RunKC]

Yeah I’m not content with Jones at DE. And I don’t think Veach is either or he wouldn’t have brought in Ingram.

We’re going to draft a DE early. Spags always wants a loaded stable on the DL

[Chris Meck]

Yeah I’m not content with Jones at DE. And I don’t think Veach is either or he wouldn’t have brought in Ingram.

We’re going to draft a DE early. Spags always wants a loaded stable on the DL

NOBODY IS CONTENT. IT'S FUCKING APRIL 1ST.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

EIGHT pass rushers and more than TWO TOP FIVE RECEIVERS Jesus fuck, is your entire football evaluation based of a Madden '12 chise?

Not even I would bitch about that...

[The Franchise]

Find me a team that has 8 pass rushers and I’ll show you a team that sucks against the run.

[Direckshun]

No, let’s start with your statement of “we need 8 pass rushers”. Find me a team in the league that meets your requirements.

I think that's a really good point, I do. But we're not where we need to be, passrush wise.

Not yet, anyway.

[staylor26]

I think that's a really good point, I do. But we're not where we need to be, passrush wise.

Not yet, anyway.

LMAO

[Direckshun]

IT'S APRIL ****ING FIRST DUDE.

Well I can hardly argue with that.

[IowaHawkeyeChief]

The Bucs won the Super Bowl because Fish tore his Achilles and Britt Reid is a dumbass, and the refs called the game differently for each team on defense.

^this^ with an added FYP

[Chris Meck]

Well, let's start at the ground floor.

Name me 8 players on this team that can rush the passer at all.

Clark
Jones
Reed
Taco
Wharton
Danna

I think including Danna in that list is generous at this point in his career, but I set the bar low here.

I'm still waiting for you to show me The Bucs 8 great pass rushers. Or the Rams 8 great pass rushers, surely they have 8 really good ones right? Best defense in football, and by your own count you NEED to have 8 and The Chiefs only have 5, maybe 6.

Or I tell you what, you show me any team, any NFL team at all that has 8.

And let me tell you-don't be coming back here with guys with one sack and say that's evidence, in that case you have to add like Honey Badger and Sneed to our list, which would put us at...8. So keep it to 4-3 DL or 3-4 DL and OLB'ers. Make it straight up. Now show me your teams with 8 that we NEED to be like.

[Direckshun]

I'm still waiting for you to show me The Bucs 8 great pass rushers. Or the Rams 8 great pass rushers, surely they have 8 really good ones right? Best defense in football, and by your own count you NEED to have 8 and The Chiefs only have 5, maybe 6.

Or I tell you what, you show me any team, any NFL team at all that has 8.

And let me tell you-don't be coming back here with guys with one sack and say that's evidence, in that case you have to add like Honey Badger and Sneed to our list, which would put us at...8. So keep it to 4-3 DL or 3-4 DL and OLB'ers. Make it straight up. Now show me your teams with 8 that we NEED to be like.

I think that's a really good point, I do. But we're not where we need to be, passrush wise.

Not yet, anyway.

Go Chiefs.

[The Franchise]

I think that's a really good point, I do. But we're not where we need to be, passrush wise.

Not yet, anyway.

So there isn’t a team that has 8 pass rushers. You’re lobbying for something that NO OTHER TEAM HAS.

[Chris Meck]

Well I can hardly argue with that.

And yet...

[Direckshun]

So there isn’t a team that has 8 pass rushers. You’re lobbying for something that NO OTHER TEAM HAS.

I ... am. Yes.

I'm lobbying first of all, for something almost every team has, which is two starting caliber DEs.

But yes, I'm lobbying for a small army of passrushers across our DL. Because we're going to need one to beat the Bucs in February. And to win several more Super Bowls in Mahomes' career.

[Sassy Squatch]

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/WavyDeliriousCur-max-1mb.gif

[The Franchise]

I ... am. Yes.

I'm lobbying first of all, for something almost every team has, which is two starting caliber DEs.

But yes, I'm lobbying for a small army of passrushers across our DL. Because we're going to need one to beat the Bucs in February. And to win several more Super Bowls in Mahomes' career.

And yet no one here has argued to ignore the DE2 position. No one has argued to ignore the WR2 position. No one has argued to ignore the LT position.

It’s April 1st and we haven’t even finished FA yet.

[Chris Meck]

I ... am. Yes.

I'm lobbying first of all, for something almost every team has, which is two starting caliber DEs.

But yes, I'm lobbying for a small army of passrushers across our DL. Because we're going to need one to beat the Bucs in February. And to win several more Super Bowls in Mahomes' career.

And claiming disaster on April 1st is ridiculous.

What you're saying is illogical, knee-jerk emotional overreacting.

It's April fucking first.

There is ZERO chance the need areas are not addressed before September.

And guess what? No team is totally set at every position with proven top flight talent. That's just not how it works. But what about Brett Veach tells you that he's going to look at gaping holes in the line-up and just shrug his shoulders and go golfing?

You said you think you NEED 8 PASSRUSHERS. Then you can't find me a single team that has 8 PASSRUSHERS. So by your own admission, you're not being logical or arguing in good faith.

[Direckshun]

And yet no one here has argued to ignore the DE2 position.

Yo, dude. C'mon now. It's absolutely been trivialized.

The need at DE has also been softened with the signing of Reed. It’s also entirely possible that the Chiefs aren’t done there and will sign Ingram or somebody else.

We are no worse off at DE than we were last year. I’d argue that there’s more upside with Danna/Taco than Kpass/Okafor as well. They aren’t done signing guys either. They could just as easily sign a guy like Ingram or draft one early.

Also, why is DE a need? Pass rush. What will Jarran Reed help out tremendously with playing next to Jones and Clark? Pass rush. We have 3 guys capable of double digit sacks. How much better do you think it gets?

2. Danna and Taco are no worse than Okafor and KPass. They absolutely have more upside. Like I said, they aren’t done there and are clearly looking at free agents. Did the Chiefs pass rush not already improve with the addition of Reed? You mean to tell me the loss of Kpass and Okafor offsets adding a guy like Reed to the interior?

Reed doesn't solve the problem that we do not have a starter at DE.

I'm saying the current hole at DE2 is a BIG problem. It is a big problem.

No one has argued to ignore the WR2 position. No one has argued to ignore the LT position.

Bro, c'mon. I can do the thing I just did with DE over and over again.

These holes are being trivialized. These holes are massive on the roster and we're three weeks away from having to try to plug them with the draft, somehow -- or more likely, sign street free agents in June.

We shouldn't ignore the fact that it is possible Veach is doing a poor job this offseason. His offseason in 2018 was catastrophic, and we're paying for it now. He is capable of a stinker.

[Direckshun]

There is ZERO chance the need areas are not addressed before September.

The options we have now are worse than the options we had when free agency opened. (Edit: or when we had Fisher on the roster.)

So, yes. We will probably plug rookies or street FAs into LT, DE, and WR. We will probably do that. And we'll win 12 games because Mahomes is Superman. But we're going to face the Bucs in LVI, and get ready.

Because filling those holes in the draft and June is generally not a recipe for Super Bowl success.

[Chris Meck]

Yo, dude. C'mon now. It's absolutely been trivialized.







Reed doesn't solve the problem that we do not have a starter at DE.

I'm saying entering the current hole at DE2 is a BIG problem. It is a big problem.



Bro, c'mon. I can do the thing I just did with DE over and over again.

These holes are being trivialized. These holes are massive on the roster and we're three weeks away from having to try to plug them with the draft, somehow -- or more likely, sign street free agents in June.

We shouldn't ignore the fact that it is possible Veach is doing a poor job this offseason. His offseason in 2018 was catastrophic, and we're paying for it now. He is capable of a stinker.

what part of each post you quoted there is 'trivializing' the positions? They literally each say WE'RE NOT DONE ADDING GUYS YET. You're delusional.

[O.city]

The problem is you can only get what is available to you. I'm a pro trading and wheeling and dealing as anyone, but I don't see alot of teams willing to part with a LT or DE via trade.

And unless you wanna go with one of the free agents left on the market at DE, there's just not alot out there.

[IowaHawkeyeChief]

The options we have now are worse than the options we had when free agency opened. (Edit: or when we had Fisher on the roster.)

So, yes. We will probably plug rookies or street FAs into LT, DE, and WR. We will probably do that. And we'll win 12 games because Mahomes is Superman. But we're going to face the Bucs in LVI, and get ready.

Because filling those holes in the draft and June is generally not a recipe for Super Bowl success.

:rolleyes:

[Direckshun]

what part of each post you quoted there is 'trivializing' the positions? They literally each say WE'RE NOT DONE ADDING GUYS YET. You're delusional.

Then why are the posts arguing with me?

I know we're not done yet. But we are getting further and further tucked behind the 8 ball as time goes on to address those positions.

The draft cannot answer LT, DE, and WR2. Not for 2021. Which means we're going to have to plug at LEAST two of those slots with street FAs, and the options at this point seem either unaffordable or inadequate for taking Brady down in February.

This idea that Veach is in possession of some secret flow chart that will somehow make this roster 2019 2.0 is, I fear, delusional. Our roster is thin, as are our options to flesh it out.

[HemiEd]

They won that game as much as we lost it. Come on now. They played very well.

They hooked the GOAT in the offseason, who brought in his goon squad with him. They nailed the draft, too.

Don't forget the part about the Goat bringing his officials to the SB too.

[Direckshun]

Don't forget the part about the Goat bringing his officials to the SB too.

You're going to give me PTSD.

[Chris Meck]

The options we have now are worse than the options we had when free agency opened. (Edit: or when we had Fisher on the roster.)

So, yes. We will probably plug rookies or street FAs into LT, DE, and WR. We will probably do that. And we'll win 12 games because Mahomes is Superman. But we're going to face the Bucs in LVI, and get ready.

Because filling those holes in the draft and June is generally not a recipe for Super Bowl success.

What options are worse?

For instance, what team has signed Eric Fisher? Nobody, because he's rehabbing a torn achilles. The ONLY clear upgrade available was Williams. There are a few lateral moves available in FA, and guess what? They're still available. AND there's always still a possibility that Fisher returns. There's a ZERO percent chance they don't do SOMETHING to address LT. There's a ZERO percent chance they do NOTHING at DE. There's a ZERO percent chance they don't do SOMETHING at WR.

And filling holes in the draft and June is not a recipe for Super Bowl success? Really? SHOW ME. You really think that signing ALL of the top free agents is the way to build and sustain success? It'd have to be all of them too, because we literally took 2/3 that we went for.

You're arguing bullshit inside circles of more bullshit.

[Hammock Parties]

HE'S BACK!

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">HE&#39;S BACK!<a href="https://t.co/UjIT7bZd13">https://t.co/UjIT7bZd13</a></p>&mdash; Joe Delaney Memorial Highway Project (@ClayWendler) <a href="https://twitter.com/ClayWendler/status/1377646266327433216?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 1, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[The Franchise]

HE'S BACK!

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">HE&#39;S BACK!<a href="https://t.co/UjIT7bZd13">https://t.co/UjIT7bZd13</a></p>&mdash; Joe Delaney Memorial Highway Project (@ClayWendler) <a href="https://twitter.com/ClayWendler/status/1377646266327433216?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 1, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

You’re dumb.

[HemiEd]

HE'S BACK!

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">HE&#39;S BACK!<a href="https://t.co/UjIT7bZd13">https://t.co/UjIT7bZd13</a></p>&mdash; Joe Delaney Memorial Highway Project (@ClayWendler) <a href="https://twitter.com/ClayWendler/status/1377646266327433216?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 1, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

ROFL

[Chris Meck]

Then why are the posts arguing with me?

I know we're not done yet. But we are getting further and further tucked behind the 8 ball as time goes on to address those positions.
.

except that we're really not. The market has not moved on any of our areas of need in over a week, maybe two now.

Unless you wanted to throw a ton of cash to a #3 receiver, (and that's what any FA receiver is that comes to KC-it's part of why the bigger name guys took one year deals and stayed put) then we're absolutely NOT any worse off today than we were two weeks ago when free agency started. Other than Williams, nothing has changed for any player that moves the needle for us.

Okung or Villanueva-still available. Clowney or Ingram-still available.

Just as examples. Still trades possible. Still cap casualties coming. Still a draft on the way, and one we should have an advantage in, with our stable front office, scouting department, and coaching staff all in place.

We haven't LOST OUT on fucking anyone other than Williams.

You've lost your mind.

[Chris Meck]

Then why are the posts arguing with me?

I know we're not done yet. But we are getting further and further tucked behind the 8 ball as time goes on to address those positions.

The draft cannot answer LT, DE, and WR2. Not for 2021. Which means we're going to have to plug at LEAST two of those slots with street FAs, and the options at this point seem either unaffordable or inadequate for taking Brady down in February.

This idea that Veach is in possession of some secret flow chart that will somehow make this roster 2019 2.0 is, I fear, delusional. Our roster is thin, as are our options to flesh it out.

So what you're saying is, Super Bowl teams are built between March 15th and April 1st.

And you can't fill out your roster after that.

that's idiotic.

And Veach absolutely has several irons in the fire and contingency plans galore that he's not telling any of us about because why the fuck would he? You're being totally ridiculous when you've SEEN how aggressive Veach is. You've got 3 years now of watching it. And yet, you really think he's just sitting on his hands while the Titanic is sinking. Which it's not, and he's not, and you're being ridiculous.

[Direckshun]

What options are worse?

For instance, what team has signed Eric Fisher? Nobody, because he's rehabbing a torn achilles. The ONLY clear upgrade available was Williams. There are a few lateral moves available in FA, and guess what? They're still available. AND there's always still a possibility that Fisher returns. There's a ZERO percent chance they don't do SOMETHING to address LT. There's a ZERO percent chance they do NOTHING at DE. There's a ZERO percent chance they don't do SOMETHING at WR.

Disagree. The best option was keeping Fisher on the roster and letting him rehab so he's playable by January. We did a version of that the year we won the Super Bowl. January and February is all that matters. Mahomes alone gets you to 12 wins August through December.

If you've decided that that's unacceptable, Reiff was a Fisher-caliber player available at a fantastic price.

We had more choices then than we do now. And because the available LT options are either inadequate (Villanueva) or too expensive/frail (Okung/Peters), we are marching into a draft where we're likely going to have to draft our starting LT with our 1st, and maybe even trade up for it.

Which takes away our ability to commit that 1st to a DE who can make an impact in 2021, or a WR who can beat man coverage reliably in February, or a further body up our back seven. etc etc

I do agree we're arguing in circles, because there's only so many ways I can say the same thing. Depending on the draft to plug your most important holes for the upcoming season is not the most reliable course of action, nor are hoping the right June cuts fall into your lap for the veteran minimum. But that is exactly where we are.

[Direckshun]

So what you're saying is, Super Bowl teams are built between March 15th and April 1st.

And you can't fill out your roster after that.

Swing and a miss.

[Direckshun]

Chris,

In your mind, and understanding that we are both armchair GMing at this point, how would you plug our roster holes at this time, if we gave you the keys to the Kingdom?

[Chris Meck]

Disagree. The best option was keeping Fisher on the roster and letting him rehab so he's playable by January. We did a version of that the year we won the Super Bowl. January and February is all that matters. Mahomes alone gets you to 12 wins August through December.

If you've decided that that's unacceptable, Reiff was a Fisher-caliber player available at a fantastic price.

We had more choices then than we do now. And because the available LT options are either inadequate (Villanueva) or too expensive/frail (Okung/Peters), we are marching into a draft where we're likely going to have to draft our starting LT with our 1st, and maybe even trade up for it.

Which takes away our ability to commit that 1st to a DE who can make an impact in 2021, or a WR who can beat man coverage reliably in February, or a further body up our back seven. etc etc

I do agree we're arguing in circles, because there's only so many ways I can say the same thing. Depending on the draft to plug your most important holes for the upcoming season is not the most reliable course of action, nor are hoping the right June cuts fall into your lap for the veteran minimum. But that is exactly where we are.

Yeah it's too bad we lost out on Fisher. Oh wait, he's still available.

You keep the saying things, and they're still just as stupid as they were the first time.

[Mecca]

I think it's pretty funny dude just assumed Tampa is going back to the SB.

[Direckshun]

Yeah it's too bad we lost out on Fisher. Oh wait, he's still available.

You keep the saying things, and they're still just as stupid as they were the first time.

He's still available for 31 other teams, too, some of which may be willing to pay him more.

If we don't cut him to begin with, we don't run that risk. But here we are.

[Direckshun]

I think it's pretty funny dude just assumed Tampa is going back to the SB.

LMAO

The same exact roster, and they'll probably bring back Brown at WR, too.

I'll take them over the field in the NFC at this point.

[The Franchise]

Disagree. The best option was keeping Fisher on the roster and letting him rehab so he's playable by January. We did a version of that the year we won the Super Bowl. January and February is all that matters. Mahomes alone gets you to 12 wins August through December.

If you've decided that that's unacceptable, Reiff was a Fisher-caliber player available at a fantastic price.

We had more choices then than we do now. And because the available LT options are either inadequate (Villanueva) or too expensive/frail (Okung/Peters), we are marching into a draft where we're likely going to have to draft our starting LT with our 1st, and maybe even trade up for it.

Which takes away our ability to commit that 1st to a DE who can make an impact in 2021, or a WR who can beat man coverage reliably in February, or a further body up our back seven. etc etc

I do agree we're arguing in circles, because there's only so many ways I can say the same thing. Depending on the draft to plug your most important holes for the upcoming season is not the most reliable course of action, nor are hoping the right June cuts fall into your lap for the veteran minimum. But that is exactly where we are.

Whoa whoa whoa. The best option was to keep Fisher? Uhhhh that doesn’t eliminate the need of a LT if he’s not back until January. You still have to draft someone to replace him during the season.

And for all the talk of “Mahomes gets us 12 wins” that people come up with....then you can’t say that LT is such a dire need in the same paragraph.

[staylor26]

I think it's pretty funny dude just assumed Tampa is going back to the SB.

Yea people act like they couldn’t have easily lost any of those NFC playoff games, including against the WFT.

[Direckshun]

Whoa whoa whoa. The best option was to keep Fisher? Uhhhh that doesn’t eliminate the need of a LT if he’s not back until January. You still have to draft someone to replace him during the season.

And for all the talk of “Mahomes gets us 12 wins” that people come up with....then you can’t say that LT is such a dire need in the same paragraph.

We were able to trot out Cam Erving and survive. We could trot out Niang or Remmers if we had to.

It doesn't matter a ton who we play at LT while Fisher rehabs. All that matters is Fisher being at least 90% by January. He does that, and I take the Chiefs over the field. We're 26-1 with him on the field.

[staylor26]

Whoa whoa whoa. The best option was to keep Fisher? Uhhhh that doesn’t eliminate the need of a LT if he’s not back until January. You still have to draft someone to replace him during the season.

And for all the talk of “Mahomes gets us 12 wins” that people come up with....then you can’t say that LT is such a dire need in the same paragraph.

This is what I’ve been trying to explain to him from the beginning of this discussion.

He somehow thinks not cutting Fisher and going after Williams somehow changes anything at LT.

And he ignores the fact that we can still re-sign Fisher.

To make it extra stupid, he came into this thread saying that it’s proof that our offseason was “dogshit”. How is circling back to Fisher proof that it’s dogshit, but not cutting him makes it all better? It really doesn’t make any sense.

[Direckshun]

This is what I’ve been trying to explain to him from the beginning of this discussion.

He somehow thinks not cutting Fisher and going after Williams somehow changes anything at LT.

And he ignores the fact that we can still re-sign Fisher.

To make it extra stupid, he came into this thread saying that it’s proof that our offseason was “dogshit”. How is circling back to Fisher proof that it’s dogshit, but not cutting him makes it all better? It really doesn’t make any sense.

Cutting Fisher created an additional major hole, when this team is struggling to fill its other additional major holes.

[Mr. Kotter]

I agree. It's at least a distinct possibility. I'm not convinced we are necessarily 100% done with Schwartz either.

[O.city]

The biggest problem is the holes the Chiefs currently have are, outside of the QB, the hardest the fill. LT and DE usually require either a pretty hefty price tag or a high draft pick.

They swung at Williams and missed.

If you kept Fisher, you'd be potentially going into the playoffs with a LT that's coming off an Achilles injury, which as much as some argued against, is one of the toughest injuries to come back from.

So, it's either trade a boat load to go draft a top flight LT, trade a boatload and money for an established LT (think Tunsil), stay at 31 and take a guy, sign a vet and draft someone to sit,.

[The Franchise]

We were able to trot out Cam Erving and survive. We could trot out Niang or Remmers if we had to.

It doesn't matter a ton who we play at LT while Fisher rehabs. All that matters is Fisher being at least 90% by January. He does that, and I take the Chiefs over the field. We're 26-1 with him on the field.

And in your plan....what if he isn’t at 90%?

[Chris Meck]

Chris,

In your mind, and understanding that we are both armchair GMing at this point, how would you plug our roster holes at this time, if we gave you the keys to the Kingdom?

I extend Honey Badger, freeing up some money.

I'd sign Okung to an incentive laden two year deal. If he plays, he gets paid. I'm also in touch with Fisher and his rehab. PLAN B-I'd sign Villanueva to a two year deal we can get out of in one if we want.

I'd sign Ingram to increase pass rush ability at DE. PLAN B-I'd sign Clowney to a reasonable deal. His big money days are over, but he's still a decent complimentary player, great against the run and decent pass rusher. On this line, he'd thrive.

I'd see what comes available at WR, but honestly I don't expect much to happen in FA at that position. Nobody wants to try to parlay #3 targets into a payday. Probably going to have to draft a guy and develop them. At any rate, of the 3 concerns, I place this at #3 behind 1)LT, 2)DE

This frees us up as far as the order we need to look at positions in the draft as we have short term spots filled. We're still going to need to draft and develop a LT, a DE, and a WR. That's just a reality of the NFL, and nobody doesn't have areas they need to address in this way.

[Direckshun]

And in your plan....what if he isn’t at 90%?

I don't accept that as anything but a very remote possibility.

The Chiefs were talking about him being good to go for Week One. I consider that unlikely, but he's almost certainly good to go for January 2022.

[The Franchise]

I don't accept that as anything but a very remote possibility.

The Chiefs were talking about him being good to go for Week One. I consider that unlikely, but he's almost certainly good to go for January 2022.

So hopes and dreams.

If he isn’t at 90% then this team is fucked. That’s assuming that ignoring the LT position until Fisher gets back leads this team to 12 wins. It has just as much of a chance as causing us to go 8-8.

[staylor26]

Cutting Fisher created an additional major hole, when this team is struggling to fill its other additional major holes.

You are so fucking dumb it’s impossible to even argue with you.

You don’t get it. Like at all.

They. Can. Still. Circle. Back. To. Fisher.

Nothing has changed. They still need a day 1 LT either way. Cutting Fisher at least allowed them to go after Williams and sign guys like Thuney and Reed.

[Direckshun]

I extend Honey Badger, freeing up some money.

I'd sign Okung to an incentive laden two year deal. If he plays, he gets paid. I'm also in touch with Fisher and his rehab. PLAN B-I'd sign Villanueva to a two year deal we can get out of in one if we want.

I'd sign Ingram to increase pass rush ability at DE. PLAN B-I'd sign Clowney to a reasonable deal. His big money days are over, but he's still a decent complimentary player, great against the run and decent pass rusher. On this line, he'd thrive.

I'd see what comes available at WR, but honestly I don't expect much to happen in FA at that position. Nobody wants to try to parlay #3 targets into a payday. Probably going to have to draft a guy and develop them. At any rate, of the 3 concerns, I place this at #3 behind 1)LT, 2)DE

This frees us up as far as the order we need to look at positions in the draft as we have short term spots filled. We're still going to need to draft and develop a LT, a DE, and a WR. That's just a reality of the NFL, and nobody doesn't have areas they need to address in this way.

That's a pretty good plan on paper, and one in which I've explicitly endorsed (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=15597297#post15597297). Literally, I mean, down to the players and draft picks.

I do think Ingram walking out on the Chiefs a couple weeks back suggests you're going to have trouble with squaring that circle, financially.

[Direckshun]

So hopes and dreams.

I am in fact hoping that Fisher will be at least 90% by January.

But I think that's reasonable.

I assume you agree with me that Okung would be a good stopgap LT. What are the odds he makes it to January, do you think?

[Chris Meck]

I don't accept that as anything but a very remote possibility.

The Chiefs were talking about him being good to go for Week One. I consider that unlikely, but he's almost certainly good to go for January 2022.

based on what, but your emotional gut reaction?

This is my point exactly.

Your takes on all of these situations are entirely just emotional and not based on any logic at all.

[The Franchise]

I am in fact hoping that Fisher will be at least 90% by January.

But I think that's reasonable.

I assume you agree with me that Okung would be a good stopgap LT. What are the odds he makes it to January, do you think?

60-70% which is why I’m drafting a LT in the first two rounds and getting him ready for Week 8 or after.

[O.city]

Fisher isn't coming back.


Zero chance.

[Chris Meck]

That's a pretty good plan on paper, and one in which I've explicitly endorsed (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=15597297#post15597297). Literally, I mean, down to the players and draft picks.

I do think Ingram walking out on the Chiefs a couple weeks back suggests you're going to have trouble with squaring that circle, financially.

I think he's looking to see if he can get more money.

Will he?

There's a reason these guys are still out there; the money being offered isn't what they thought it would be. And it wasn't a couple of weeks back, it was literally LAST week. This is also my point-you're having emotional reactions that are clouding your judgement.

[Direckshun]

They. Can. Still. Circle. Back. To. Fisher.

Nothing has changed. They still need a day 1 LT either way. Cutting Fisher at least allowed them to go after Williams and sign guys like Thuney and Reed.

First of all, it's likely the Chiefs have told Fisher he's not going to be a Chief, which is why he posted his IG message.

But even aside from that, something has changed. We had exclusive control of him. Now we don't: we have already banked once this offseason that we can outbid all comers for a LT, and it didn't work out. It's not unthinkable that could happen again. 31 other teams have access to him now.

[Direckshun]

based on what, but your emotional gut reaction?

Brett Veach (https://www.ky3.com/2021/03/01/chiefs-expect-mahomes-by-summer-fisher-schwartz-by-fall/).

[Direckshun]

60-70% which is why I’m drafting a LT in the first two rounds and getting him ready for Week 8 or after.

Reasonable.

[Direckshun]

I think he's looking to see if he can get more money.

Will he?

Who knows.

[Chris Meck]

First of all, it's likely the Chiefs have told Fisher he's not going to be a Chief, which is why he posted his IG message.

But even aside from that, something has changed. We had exclusive control of him. Now we don't: we have already banked once this offseason that we can outbid all comers for a LT, and it didn't work out. It's not unthinkable that could happen again. 31 other teams have access to him now.

Bringing Fisher back mid-season is probably plan C. Nobody's going to go into a bidding war for a guy in a cast that may or may not be able to play in 2021.

And as for trusting what Veach has said about it-yeah, he said it and then cut Fisher and Schwartz a couple of days later. He's not going to tip his hand. Why would he?

Plan A for LT is almost certainly to sign a veteran stop-gap for day one and draft a LT somewhere in those first 3 rounds. It's a deep draft for that position, and that's a perfectly reasonable spot to be in for September.

Plan A for DE is almost certainly the same; sign a vet to man it day one, draft a guy with some upside to develop. Also a perfectly reasonable place to be.

Plan A for WR is more than likely going to be a late cap cut and to draft a couple of guys to develop. If we're taking Veach as his word, he said as much in February. That's also not a terrible place to be; we went all of 2020 with mostly Drob/Pringle/Hardman and went 14-1 and won a couple of play-off games that way.

Year two of CEH with an actual camp should get him more involved in the entire offense and utilize his receiving abilities. An actual camp should help Hardman, too.

The vastly improved interior OL is going to pay dividends in multiple facets.

It's April 1st.

I'm curious as to what the plans are, but I'm not worried. Veach has shown he's aggressive and I'm sure things will look fine September first.

[JohnnyHammersticks]

Direction is the worst football evaluator on this board. Holy shit, what awful takes. To think he acts like some draft and football expert ROFL Just simply a case of someone not understanding a damn thing about what they are watching

shhhh....don't spoil it

[O.city]

Bringing Fisher back mid-season is probably plan C. Nobody's going to go into a bidding war for a guy in a cast that may or may not be able to play in 2021.

And as for trusting what Veach has said about it-yeah, he said it and then cut Fisher and Schwartz a couple of days later. He's not going to tip his hand. Why would he?

Plan A for LT is almost certainly to sign a veteran stop-gap for day one and draft a LT somewhere in those first 3 rounds. It's a deep draft for that position, and that's a perfectly reasonable spot to be in for September.

Plan A for DE is almost certainly the same; sign a vet to man it day one, draft a guy with some upside to develop. Also a perfectly reasonable place to be.

Plan A for WR is more than likely going to be a late cap cut and to draft a couple of guys to develop. If we're taking Veach as his word, he said as much in February. That's also not a terrible place to be; we went all of 2020 with mostly Drob/Pringle/Hardman and went 14-1 and won a couple of play-off games that way.

Year two of CEH with an actual camp should get him more involved in the entire offense and utilize his receiving abilities. An actual camp should help Hardman, too.

The vastly improved interior OL is going to pay dividends in multiple facets.

It's April 1st.

I'm curious as to what the plans are, but I'm not worried. Veach has shown he's aggressive and I'm sure things will look fine September first.

It's early. For sure.

But it's not hard to read the tea leaves to see that there aren't really any options left out there atleast ones we know about.

FA for a LT is pretty sparse and the draft puts is in a tough spot to get one.

[htismaqe]

Go Chiefs.

Hey at least you can always fall back on the "homer defense".

Nevermind that you've been presented plenty of information and evidence.

But yeah, they're just being homers. You're the only realist here.

[Chris Meck]

It's early. For sure.

But it's not hard to read the tea leaves to see that there aren't really any options left out there atleast ones we know about.

FA for a LT is pretty sparse and the draft puts is in a tough spot to get one.

So, if I know that, and you know that, we can assume Veach knows that.

We can also assume that the agents for Okung and Villanueva know that as well. Why would they be in a hurry? I'm sure they're shopping around, and they should, and that doesn't mean Veach hasn't been in touch if he's interested. I would imagine he would be; but who knows which and whether?

Veach apparently didn't like Reiff; his deal was reasonable.

I'm just saying assuming there's no plan because it hasn't happened yet on April 1st is silly.

[Direckshun]

Hey at least you can always fall back on the "homer defense".

Nevermind that you've been presented plenty of information and evidence.

But yeah, they're just being homers. You're the only realist here.

I'm not really interested in those labels. I'm most interested in who's making pertinent football arguments.

Logic is not a democracy, however, and it doesn't really matter to me how many people are on whatever sides of whichever argument.

[RealSNR]

LMAO

The same exact roster, and they'll probably bring back Brown at WR, too.

I'll take them over the field in the NFC at this point.


If the Bucs played in the NFC West it’s entirely possible they would finish 3rd or worse.

Something important to learn from our run it back campaign: You’re returning the same team, but everybody else is different. We were still by far the best team in the AFC, but some bad luck at the wrong time derailed the whole thing.

That shit can happen to anybody. And it often does. It’s hard to maintain the familiar over a full season and have it still come out on top over new different and shiny.

The Bucs will be good again. But back in the Super Bowl? No way I’m taking them over the field in the NFC

[Direckshun]

If the Bucs played in the NFC West it’s entirely possible they would finish 3rd or worse.

Something important to learn from our run it back campaign: You’re returning the same team, but everybody else is different. We were still by far the best team in the AFC, but some bad luck at the wrong time derailed the whole thing.

That shit can happen to anybody. And it often does. It’s hard to maintain the familiar over a full season and have it still come out on top over new different and shiny.

The Bucs will be good again. But back in the Super Bowl? No way I’m taking them over the field in the NFC

This is off topic, but is there a team you'd take over them?

Not a team who could beat them, a team you'd legit take over them.

I know it's early, but still. That's Tom Brady with great weapons, protection, and defense.

[RealSNR]

This is off topic, but is there a team you'd take over them?

Not a team who could beat them, a team you'd legit take over them.

I know it's early, but still. That's Tom Brady with great weapons, protection, and defense.


I’d take the Rams over the Bucs if I had to bet.

That plus the randomness of the field is why I don’t think they’ll return to the SB. The Cards or Seahawks are both “hey, if they get hot...” teams. The packers aren’t going away and will continue to challenge. I’ll even extend a puncher’s chance to Ratface Jr. and his merry band of dumbfucks.

Hell, we still don’t know about the Saints. Brees was an albatross to that team after he came back from that injury. I don’t trust Taysom Hill, but you never know about Famous Jameis...

[Pasta Little Brioni]

How can someone watch so much football buy still be absolutely clueless about it. It's amazing.

[RunKC]

We may have no choice. They’re probably going to sign Okung but they absolutely have to have a plan B because that guy is a fatter Sammy Watkins at this point and a project is not seeing the field year 1 unless Andy has no choice.

But Fisher could sign somewhere else in May. That’s the time to look at him

[Fish]

No chance. But if he did, he'd probably play his natural position at RT...

:D :bolt:

[RealSNR]

I'm gonna say it again. It's possible the Chiefs believe the starting LT of the future is already on the team in Niang.

"They'd be foolish to trust such an important position to some guy like that!"

They know more about their own players than anybody else, including sportswriters. He opted out, yes, but he did participate in the online OTAs. And opting out doesn't mean the Chiefs couldn't keep in contact with him.

I'm not predicting it. Just saying that if we come out of the first 3 rounds of the draft without an OT, I'm not going to be worried. Most people will set their hair on fire, but I'll actually be quite optimistic. It means the Chiefs think they've already got the problem solved.

We went on the Silverforeskin ride before we brought back Remmers. It could be the Chiefs went into the offseason saying, "Niang is good. Let's put him in at RT and get a bookend on the other side." When we lost the bidding, we just went back to Remmers and said, "We'll still be fine with Niang at LT."

[Direckshun]

You don't view Fisher/Schwartz to Niang/Remmers to be a massive downgrade?

You saw the same Super Bowl I did. Protecting Mahomes needs to be the highest possible priority.

[The Franchise]

You don't view Fisher/Schwartz to Niang/Remmers to be a massive downgrade?

You saw the same Super Bowl I did. Protecting Mahomes needs to be the highest possible priority.

Schwartz barely played last season and Remmers filled in at RT just fine. So from 2020 to 2021....RT isn’t really a downgrade.

And no one knows what Niang is compared to Fisher at this point.

[The Franchise]

Comparing this line to the Super Bowl is stupid and disingenuous.

Wylie isn’t going to be our RT. Remmers isn’t our LT. And we have an all new interior line.

Fucking Christ.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Fisher is a two time pro bowler at LT and CP continues to shit on him. I swear you people don’t deserve someone like Big Fish who has been an excellent LT protecting Mahomes. I mean Mahomes has a losing record when Fisher isn’t playing

[Chris Meck]

You don't view Fisher/Schwartz to Niang/Remmers to be a massive downgrade?

You saw the same Super Bowl I did. Protecting Mahomes needs to be the highest possible priority.

Well, we LITERALLY don't know.

I mean, we can objectively say that Remmers < a healthy Schwartz.

We literally don't have any idea if Niang < a healthy Fisher. The Chiefs do have an idea. We don't.

We had neither Fisher nor Schwatz in the Super Bowl, which is the whole problem.

I can tell you that Thuney > any lineman at any position we employed in 2020.

I can tell you that a healthy Long > any lineman at any position we employed in 2020 not named Schwartz. Is that what we'll get in 2021? Dunno, but if not, we're DEEP at OG.

[The Franchise]

Fisher is a two time pro bowler at LT and CP continues to shit on him. I swear you people don’t deserve someone like Big Fish who has been an excellent LT protecting Mahomes. I mean Mahomes has a losing record when Fisher isn’t playing

How about you bring something to the discussion or you shut the fuck up. No one here has shit on Fisher, you fucking mouth breather.

[Chris Meck]

Fisher is a two time pro bowler at LT and CP continues to shit on him. I swear you people don’t deserve someone like Big Fish who has been an excellent LT protecting Mahomes. I mean Mahomes has a losing record when Fisher isn’t playing

I don't think anyone's shitting on him.

I think everyone wishes Fisher hadn't gotten hurt, and we weren't scrambling to figure out LT.

The fact remains, he's got a torn achilles to rehab, and was having back problems before that, and missed some games the last two years, and is now over 30. Even if the achilles heals ok, he's still a 320lb. man with back issues. That doesn't usually get better.

[Direckshun]

Schwartz barely played last season and Remmers filled in at RT just fine. So from 2020 to 2021....RT isn’t really a downgrade.

And no one knows what Niang is compared to Fisher at this point.

That's all fine and good, but that's where we're falling short.

Remmers at RT is fine, and maybe Niang is fine.

But even if he's fine, Mahomes deserves better than fine at the tackle position, does he not?

If there is a quarterback in the league that needs better than fine, it's Mahomes.

[staylor26]

That's all fine and good, but that's where we're falling short.

Remmers at RT is fine, and maybe Niang is fine.

But even if he's fine, Mahomes deserves better than fine at the tackle position, does he not?

If there is a quarterback in the league that needs better than fine, it's Mahomes.

Which is why they will certainly invest in a LT early in the draft.

[Direckshun]

Comparing this line to the Super Bowl is stupid and disingenuous.

Wylie isn’t going to be our RT. Remmers isn’t our LT. And we have an all new interior line.

****ing Christ.

Well we currently don't know, because we don't know who the LT, RT, and RG is going to be or how well they're going to play.

I have my own personal opinion that the line will likely be better. But better than bad does not equal good.

Are you confident at any position other than LG? Serious question.

And keep in mind, the stakes are higher for us than anybody else in the league, because of who we have under center.

[O.city]

Maybe Niang is really good at RT?

[Direckshun]

Fisher is a two time pro bowler at LT and CP continues to shit on him. I swear you people don’t deserve someone like Big Fish who has been an excellent LT protecting Mahomes. I mean Mahomes has a losing record when Fisher isn’t playing

26-1 with Fisher the past two years.

96% winning percentage.

If Fisher is on the roster right now, I'd feel a ton better about our chances in February than I do right now.

[Direckshun]

Well, we LITERALLY don't know.

I mean, we can objectively say that Remmers < a healthy Schwartz.

We literally don't have any idea if Niang < a healthy Fisher. The Chiefs do have an idea. We don't.

We had neither Fisher nor Schwatz in the Super Bowl, which is the whole problem.

I can tell you that Thuney > any lineman at any position we employed in 2020.

I can tell you that a healthy Long > any lineman at any position we employed in 2020 not named Schwartz. Is that what we'll get in 2021? Dunno, but if not, we're DEEP at OG.

You're correct, we do not know.

But speaking probabilistically, Niang is probably not going to be a Pro Bowl caliber LT his rookie year. Fisher probably will be, whenever he returns in 2021.

My personal view on the film I've seen since we signed Blythe is that he's on par with Reiter.

And I'm being dead serious when I say that I'm not even sure Long starts Week 1.

[Direckshun]

Maybe Niang is really good at RT?

I personally think Niang is going to be really good there, yes.

[The Franchise]

Well we currently don't know, because we don't know who the LT, RT, and RG is going to be or how well they're going to play.

I have my own personal opinion that the line will likely be better. But better than bad does not equal good.

Are you confident at any position other than LG? Serious question.

And keep in mind, the stakes are higher for us than anybody else in the league, because of who we have under center.

Confident? Yep.

I’m confident in every position except LT right now.

LG is improved.
C is improved because Reiter was the definition of meh. Blythe is average and we don’t need a superstar there.
RG is fine. Long, when healthy is above average. LDT and Wylie are capable backups that can fill in if needed.
RT has depth and an actual competition. Niang, IMO, is a solid RT. If he takes a little bit of time then Remmers can fill in.

And I’ve already said that I would be good with Okung and a LT in the first two rounds to take over mid season if Okung gets hurt.

[Direckshun]

Which is why they will certainly invest in a LT early in the draft.

Well, yeah. They're going to have to. And they're almost certainly going to have to do it in Round 1.

And worse yet, they may be forced to trade up to do it.

[The Franchise]

You're correct, we do not know.

But speaking probabilistically, Niang is probably not going to be a Pro Bowl caliber LT his rookie year. Fisher probably will be, whenever he returns in 2021.

My personal view on the film I've seen since we signed Blythe is that he's on par with Reiter.

And I'm being dead serious when I say that I'm not even sure Long starts Week 1.

You can’t say that Fisher is probably a pro bowl LT when he returns from injury because you don’t know. This is an Achilles for a dude is now in his 30s. For all we know....his career is never the same.

The people hoping that Niang is a LT are at the same place that you are.

[Direckshun]

Confident? Yep.

I’m confident in every position except LT right now.

LG is improved.
C is improved because Reiter was the definition of meh. Blythe is average and we don’t need a superstar there.
RG is fine. Long, when healthy is above average. LDT and Wylie are capable backups that can fill in if needed.
RT has depth and an actual competition. Niang, IMO, is a solid RT. If he takes a little bit of time then Remmers can fill in.

And I’ve already said that I would be good with Okung and a LT in the first two rounds to take over mid season if Okung gets hurt.

I think that's all fair, though I disagree at spots.

[Chris Meck]

26-1 with Fisher the past two years.

96% winning percentage.

If Fisher is on the roster right now, I'd feel a ton better about our chances in February than I do right now.

What good would having Fisher on the roster right now be? He can't play.

He probably won't be ready to play at a 'pro bowl level' until mid-season at the very earliest, and that's quite an optimistic guess at that.

The cool thing about our chances in February is that it's APRIL FUCKING FIRST and it's way, way too early to be puckering our bungholes about what the roster will look like in September when the season starts.

[Fish]

Maybe Niang is really good at RT?

I was thinking that too. That could work out well..

[Direckshun]

You can’t say that Fisher is probably a pro bowl LT when he returns from injury because you don’t know. This is an Achilles for a dude is now in his 30s. For all we know....his career is never the same.

The people hoping that Niang is a LT are at the same place that you are.

The difference is the guy I'm pimping at the spot is 26-1 when he's on the field. So even if you take a step back from that, you're still looking pretty damn good.

Niang is talented and I still believe he's going to be a really good RT but we genuinely do not know what's coming down the pipeline there.

[Direckshun]

What good would having Fisher on the roster right now be? He can't play.

He probably won't be ready to play at a 'pro bowl level' until mid-season at the very earliest, and that's quite an optimistic guess at that.

I've made this argument at least two times by now in this thread.

You don't need him now, and you don't need him mid-season. Those games ultimately don't matter, because Mahomes can win 12 games with even a garbage line.

You need him for January.

[The Franchise]

The difference is the guy I'm pimping at the spot is 26-1 when he's on the field. So even if you take a step back from that, you're still looking pretty damn good.

Niang is talented and I still believe he's going to be a really good RT but we genuinely do not know what's coming down the pipeline there.

If we don’t know....then why the fuck are you calling the FA group a failure?

There was one upgrade in FA and Veach went hard for him. We didn’t get him. Shit happens. Now wait and see what they do at the position.

Veach set out to improve the offensive line and so far, outside of LT, he’s done just that.

[The Franchise]

I've made this argument at least two times by now in this thread.

You don't need him now, and you don't need him mid-season. Those games ultimately don't matter, because Mahomes can win 12 games with even a garbage line.

You need him for January.

Jesus, man.

Either LT is important or it’s not. You can’t say that we’ll be fine with garbage at LT during the regular season and then bitch about the offensive line.

How do you know that a rookie LT won’t be good enough come January? Or an Okung signing won’t be good enough?

[Direckshun]

If we don’t know....then why the **** are you calling the FA group a failure?

There was one upgrade in FA and Veach went hard for him. We didn’t get him. Shit happens. Now wait and see what they do at the position.

Veach set out to improve the offensive line and so far, outside of LT, he’s done just that.

Hey I'm thinking probabilistically just like everybody else.

That's allowed, and I think that's the premise for this entire forum, correct me if I'm wrong.

[Chris Meck]

You're correct, we do not know.

But speaking probabilistically, Niang is probably not going to be a Pro Bowl caliber LT his rookie year. Fisher probably will be, whenever he returns in 2021.

My personal view on the film I've seen since we signed Blythe is that he's on par with Reiter.

And I'm being dead serious when I say that I'm not even sure Long starts Week 1.

Listen, you're going to have to square yourself with the realization that there is no Pro Bowl caliber LT that the Chiefs could possibly sign/draft for 2021. There was ONE available, and he chose to stay put in San Francisco for a Brinks truck full of money.

That was it. ONE. Not Fisher; Not anyone else could you just pencil in as a Pro Bowl caliber LT on day one of 2021. So that was just not going to happen. Expecting Fisher to just pop back into the lineup 8 or 9 months after tearing his achilles and playing at a 'Pro Bowl Level' is absolutely fantasy.

Your personal view on the film you've seen on Blythe being on par with Reiter is horseshit. Reiter fucking sucks. Blythe does not. Mahomes being elusive in the pocket has made Reiter's PFF stats look rosy but the fact of the matter is the guy is not a starting quality center in the NFL. Horrible run blocker, maybe kind of adequate pass blocker. He sucks. Blythe is an upgrade.

And you may not be sure that Long starts week one, but if he's healthy (and I doubt they'd sign him if he wasn't) he's absolutely starting week one and the fact that you don't think so tells me you have no idea whatsoever what you're talking about.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Meck and Franchise...he just doesn't get it. It's like a foreign concept to him.

[The Franchise]

Regarding Reiter: Pretty easy to not give up any sacks when your QB has to bail the pocket after 2 seconds and roll out.

[Chris Meck]

I've made this argument at least two times by now in this thread.

You don't need him now, and you don't need him mid-season. Those games ultimately don't matter, because Mahomes can win 12 games with even a garbage line.

You need him for January.

that's a completely asinine argument. Completely.

[Direckshun]

Jesus, man.

Either LT is important or it’s not. You can’t say that we’ll be fine with garbage at LT during the regular season and then bitch about the offensive line.

How do you know that a rookie LT won’t be good enough come January? Or an Okung signing won’t be good enough?

Oh my goodness.

1. I don't care about the regular season.

2. You can get by with crap talent at OL and still win 12 games, because Mahomes will get you those wins.

3. You need a very good OL to win the Super Bowl.

4. I'm on record arguing for an Okung signing, so I clearly believe he'd be good enough.

5. I don't think many rookie LTs, including Niang, who I've watched my share of film on, so I am talking specifically about him, will be a Super Bowl caliber LT by February.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

that's a completely asinine argument. Completely.

I'm dumbfounded man. Holy he'll was that a bad take he made. Somehow they get worse by the minute.

[Direckshun]

Listen, you're going to have to square yourself with the realization that there is no Pro Bowl caliber LT that the Chiefs could possibly sign/draft for 2021.

I disagree. I would have stuck with Fisher.

But I've already made that case and you've already disagreed with it. I don't know what new ground there is to plow on that conversation.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Oh my goodness.

1. I don't care about the regular season.

2. You can get by with crap talent at OL and still win 12 games, because Mahomes will get you those wins.

3. You need a very good OL to win the Super Bowl.

4. I'm on record arguing for an Okung signing, so I clearly believe he'd be good enough.

5. I don't think many rookie LTs, including Niang, who I've watched my share of film on, so I am talking specifically about him, will be a Super Bowl caliber LT by February.

You are in over your head. Admit you have no clue what you are talking about.

[The Franchise]

Oh my goodness.

1. I don't care about the regular season.

2. You can get by with crap talent at OL and still win 12 games, because Mahomes will get you those wins.

3. You need a very good OL to win the Super Bowl.

4. I'm on record arguing for an Okung signing, so I clearly believe he'd be good enough.

5. I don't think many rookie LTs, including Niang, who I've watched my share of film on, so I am talking specifically about him, will be a Super Bowl caliber LT by February.

And Fisher is your bridge from 2 to 3?

[Direckshun]

And Fisher is your bridge from 2 to 3?

Not by himself. You're going to need several things to work out.

You're going to need Blythe to be an improvement, you're going to need Long or LDT to be strong at RG, and you're going to need to have whoever your RT to play up to expectations.

Assuming you have those things, then replacing your replacement-level LT with Eric Fisher as close to 100% as possible will elevate the line's performance.

[Chris Meck]

Well I guess if you post in really big print your entirely stupid take that flies in the face of all evidence is supposed to carry more weight.

[Chris Meck]

Not by himself. You're going to need several things to work out.

You're going to need Blythe to be an improvement, you're going to need Long or LDT to be strong at RG, and you're going to need to have whoever your RT to play up to expectations.

Assuming you have those things, then replacing your replacement-level LT with Eric Fisher as close to 100% as possible will elevate the line's performance.

If Veach honestly believed that, he never would've cut Eric Fisher.

If Veach didn't believe Blythe was an improvement, he would've re-signed Reiter. If Veach didn't think Long was an improvement, he wouldn't have signed him.

And again, it's April 1st and being in a panic with your panties all in a wad is stupid.

[CasselGotPeedOn]

Regarding Reiter: Pretty easy to not give up any sacks when your QB has to bail the pocket after 2 seconds and roll out.

It's like someone else said, if Alex Smith had been the Qb for the last 3 seasons, Reiter would've given up double digit sacks.

[CasselGotPeedOn]

Remember a year or two ago when Direckshun said we'd have one of the worst secondaries in football, and we ended up having one of the best? Pepperidge Farm remembers.

[BossChief]

Well, let's start at the ground floor.

Name me 8 players on this team that can rush the passer at all.

Clark
Jones
Reed
Taco
Wharton
Danna

I think including Danna in that list is generous at this point in his career, but I set the bar low here.

Tyrann
Fenton
Baker
WGJ

[htismaqe]

Somebody get Direckshun his meds, stat!

[penguinz]

We wasted the first three days of FA in suspended animation because our intel was wrong on Trent Williams.

Which was problematic to begin with: our actual offseason plan involves dumping a LT we literally went 26-1 with in order to try to outbid a half dozen other teams on the hottest free agent in the NFL — which we misjudged anyway.

We dropped the largest guard contract in league history for a really great guard. And we entered the offseason with gigantic holes at LT, WR, and DE. And we’re pretty much going to end up there.

It’s hard to imagine the long term ramifications of how dogshit this offseason has been. We cannot resteucture Mahomes, Kelce, or Jones every offseason. And we did it this year for mild returns at best.

And 2022 is going to be extraordinarily rough, as well. We had some tough holes to fill this offseason, and we failed to fill any of them, unless Veach has the best draft of his GM career. 2022 will offer more cap space, and somehow even more holes.
Literally everything you posted here is incorrect. :rolleyes:

[HemiEd]

If Veach honestly believed that, he never would've cut Eric Fisher.

If Veach didn't believe Blythe was an improvement, he would've re-signed Reiter. If Veach didn't think Long was an improvement, he wouldn't have signed him.

And again, it's April 1st and being in a panic with your panties all in a wad is stupid.
Do you think Veach knows he can get Fisher once the dust settles?

[Baby Lee]

Listen, you're going to have to square yourself with the realization that there is no Pro Bowl caliber LT that the Chiefs could possibly sign/draft for 2021. There was ONE available, and he chose to stay put in San Francisco for a Brinks truck full of money.

That was it. ONE. Not Fisher; Not anyone else could you just pencil in as a Pro Bowl caliber LT on day one of 2021. So that was just not going to happen. Expecting Fisher to just pop back into the lineup 8 or 9 months after tearing his achilles and playing at a 'Pro Bowl Level' is absolutely fantasy.

Your personal view on the film you've seen on Blythe being on par with Reiter is horseshit. Reiter fucking sucks. Blythe does not. Mahomes being elusive in the pocket has made Reiter's PFF stats look rosy but the fact of the matter is the guy is not a starting quality center in the NFL. Horrible run blocker, maybe kind of adequate pass blocker. He sucks. Blythe is an upgrade.

And you may not be sure that Long starts week one, but if he's healthy (and I doubt they'd sign him if he wasn't) he's absolutely starting week one and the fact that you don't think so tells me you have no idea whatsoever what you're talking about.

I think the deeper issue, the one that isn't about this or that decision of the past couple weeks, is a long gnawing that o-line isn't a 'cross that bridge' situation.

We have this legacy as Chiefs fans to heap derision on stockpiling fatties.

But teams don't stockpile fatties because they think the fatties themselves win the game, no matter how bad the rest of the team is. They stockpile because if the fatties fail nobody is good enough to cover the shitpile in the middle of the scrum.

O-line isn't like a movie montage where Captain America assembles the team and mumbles a few words of encouragement and strategy and everyone executes to perfection. It's more like a stew or sourdough starter. You have to monitor and maintain it vigilantly.

[kcbubb]

Don’t overreact. Veach is playing poker here and negotiating strongly at the perfect time. The cap is lower and many if not most teams are already having cap problems. The market for many of these players is lower than in most years. I don’t believe that veach has burned any bridges and has asked for an opportunity to match or beat any deal offered to fisher, just like what San Fran did with silverback, he came back and said sign me or else. And veach is right in this approach. No one is scrambling to sign fisher. As a fan, I sympathize with direckshun, it’s stressful to have this many holes. But lots of free agents are still available. No need to panic. Veach is making the right move and negotiating well by not over paying. And we are in a good position to still sign fisher back if we want for less money than his previous contract. You can’t panic and be a good negotiator. Our line is much better. We have more quality and depth with the moves we’ve made so far assuming we fill LT in free agency.

LT ?
LG thuney
C blythe
RG LDT, Long
RT Niang, Long, Remmers

As for DE and WR, we can address those early the draft and taco has a lot of upside. We need to address DE, WR or CB as priority over LT in the draft and address LT via free agency with a stop gap. We need to win now and addressing LT in the draft is too risky for next year with where we are picking. Get a developmental LT mid to late. Veach can still get all this done. Don’t panic.

[kcbubb]

This approach also allows us to evaluate fishers rehab and not resign him unless he’s showing progress. Keeping him under contract and hoping he gets better was too risky. They made the right move to cut him. And we still have room to sign free agents on cheap one year deals to provide competition to fill holes. Next year the cap will go up and these 1 year signings can hope to cash in and compete for a championship.

[htismaqe]

I think the deeper issue, the one that isn't about this or that decision of the past couple weeks, is a long gnawing that o-line isn't a 'cross that bridge' situation.

We have this legacy as Chiefs fans to heap derision on stockpiling fatties.

But teams don't stockpile fatties because they think the fatties themselves win the game, no matter how bad the rest of the team is. They stockpile because if the fatties fail nobody is good enough to cover the shitpile in the middle of the scrum.

O-line isn't like a movie montage where Captain America assembles the team and mumbles a few words of encouragement and strategy and everyone executes to perfection. It's more like a stew or sourdough starter. You have to monitor and maintain it vigilantly.

No team in the NFL "stockpiles" fatties to the extent this fanbase wants.

Yeah, there's probably bit too little concern over the line right now. But historically, this fanbase has valued RB's and linemen like other teams value QB's and WR's. That's where the "heaps of derision" come from. This fanbase celebrated being also-rans for years, as if a stout defense and strong running game were good enough to win a Super Bowl. The way they played was more important than the results at times.

Thankfully, Mahomes is erasing that slowly but surely.

[htismaqe]

Do you think Veach knows he can get Fisher once the dust settles?

No.

Fisher is free to sign wherever he wants. Some team can pay him more than the Chiefs can.

[HemiEd]

No.

Fisher is free to sign wherever he wants. Some team can pay him more than the Chiefs can.

:thumb: I knew the situation, but was just curious about opinions of those like you that follow this stuff closely.

Sometimes there are rules and then there is the reality.

[HemiEd]

No team in the NFL "stockpiles" fatties to the extent this fanbase wants.

Yeah, there's probably bit too little concern over the line right now. But historically, this fanbase has valued RB's and linemen like other teams value QB's and WR's. That's where the "heaps of derision" come from. This fanbase celebrated being also-rans for years, as if a stout defense and strong running game were good enough to win a Super Bowl. The way they played was more important than the results at times.

Thankfully, Mahomes is erasing that slowly but surely.

Remember the angst around here about the TE situation when Tony G went to Atlanta?

Then Kelce happens. :D

[Baby Lee]

No team in the NFL "stockpiles" fatties to the extent this fanbase wants.

Yeah, there's probably bit too little concern over the line right now. But historically, this fanbase has valued RB's and linemen like other teams value QB's and WR's. That's where the "heaps of derision" come from. This fanbase celebrated being also-rans for years, as if a stout defense and strong running game were good enough to win a Super Bowl. The way they played was more important than the results at times.

Thankfully, Mahomes is erasing that slowly but surely.

Man, critiquing the positions of others seems delightful, . . . if you get to define their positions for them to begin with.

[YontsRBake]

Still really feel like Thuney was signed to play LT.

[BossChief]

Still really feel like Thuney was signed to play LT.

You do know they tried signing a guy to play left tackle, right?

The only way Thuney is playing LT is in a pinch.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Still really feel like Thuney was signed to play LT.

Direction hack your account?

[YontsRBake]

You do know they tried signing a guy to play left tackle, right?

The only way Thuney is playing LT is in a pinch.

In the ideal situation that we would have been able to get Trent, you keep Thuney at guard.

I don't get why we'd put a rookie there though as opposed to moving him out when we know he can play it and it's a significantly more important position than guard.

We know Remmers can't play it. Long probably still can't play it. LDT can't play it.

The plan really to put Niang or a rookie there? Just don't get that when we're in full tilt win-now mode.

[TEX]

In the ideal situation that we would have been able to get Trent, you keep Thuney at guard.

I don't get why we'd put a rookie there though as opposed to moving him out when we know he can play it and it's a significantly more important position than guard.

We know Remmers can't play it. Long probably still can't play it. LDT can't play it.

The plan really to put Niang or a rookie there? Just don't get that when we're in full tilt win-now mode.

They'll get a stop-gap LT while they ease the rookie into the starting lineup, is by bet.

[Chargem]

LMAO

The same exact roster, and they'll probably bring back Brown at WR, too.

I'll take them over the field in the NFC at this point.

I'm seeing +400 on the Buccs to win the NFC, so implied odds of about 20%. If you think the market is that wrong, bet the house on it?

[oldman]

We took at shot at Williams and it didn't work out. All is not lost because of that. I still think the plan is to draft a T in the 1st with a 1-2 year stopgap vet.

[kcbubb]

We took at shot at Williams and it didn't work out. All is not lost because of that. I still think the plan is to draft a T in the 1st with a 1-2 year stopgap vet.

I don’t like a tackle in the first with a stop gap. Get a tackle in the 3rd or 4th and develop him. Too much resources devoted to the position with both a first and a stop gap. A stop gap at this point ain’t gonna be cheap. DE in the 1st, WR in the 2nd and LT in the third would be ideal.

[chiefforlife]

I don’t like a tackle in the first with a stop gap. Get a tackle in the 3rd or 4th and develop him. Too much resources devoted to the position with both a first and a stop gap. A stop gap at this point ain’t gonna be cheap. DE in the 1st, WR in the 2nd and LT in the third would be ideal.

Thats just...Dumb! Like ALL of it.

[Chris Meck]

I don’t like a tackle in the first with a stop gap. Get a tackle in the 3rd or 4th and develop him. Too much resources devoted to the position with both a first and a stop gap. A stop gap at this point ain’t gonna be cheap. DE in the 1st, WR in the 2nd and LT in the third would be ideal.

1) 3rd or 4th round OT prospects probably aren't going to 'develop' into solid starters at LT. This is a deep draft, so it's more possible than most years, but still you'd probably want to address the position earlier than certainly the 4th. My bet is they do so no later than #63.

2) there's no such thing as 'too much resources' on the LT position. It's the second most important spot on the offense, and protecting your $500m QB is paramount. Also, total OL rebuild underway, you don't skimp on the key spot; and you need to address it also to make good use of last year's #1 pick too, while we're at it.

3) The veteran LT's available aren't become MORE expensive as time goes by. It's the exact opposite. Everyone knows this is a deep OT draft class, most teams already have their guy that are contenders, bad teams are willing to grow with one. So your Okung's or Villaneuva's are not going to be expensive. The longer they wait to take a deal, the lower it will be.


My guess is it'll be more like DE, OT, WR.

but any combination is possible depending on how the draft falls.

[kcbubb]

Thats just...Dumb! Like ALL of it.

That’s based on the idea that we need to win now. If we think we have holes now... mercy, if we contend for Super Bowls every year, it’s gonna get more difficult. We need to win now. This is a new era for the chiefs. We’ve got to think differently.

[kcbubb]

1) 3rd or 4th round OT prospects probably aren't going to 'develop' into solid starters at LT. This is a deep draft, so it's more possible than most years, but still you'd probably want to address the position earlier than certainly the 4th. My bet is they do so no later than #63.

2) there's no such thing as 'too much resources' on the LT position. It's the second most important spot on the offense, and protecting your $500m QB is paramount. Also, total OL rebuild underway, you don't skimp on the key spot; and you need to address it also to make good use of last year's #1 pick too, while we're at it.

3) The veteran LT's available aren't become MORE expensive as time goes by. It's the exact opposite. Everyone knows this is a deep OT draft class, most teams already have their guy that are contenders, bad teams are willing to grow with one. So your Okung's or Villaneuva's are not going to be expensive. The longer they wait to take a deal, the lower it will be.


My guess is it'll be more like DE, OT, WR.

but any combination is possible depending on how the draft falls.

I would be ok with that. The point is that we can’t over invest in players that won’t have an immediate impact. We need to win now. High round picks need to contribute. Later round picks can develop.

[kcbubb]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2021/04/19/andy-reid-door-remains-open-for-eric-fisher-mitchell-schwartz-return/

The Chiefs have made big changes to their offensive line this offseason, but they aren’t ruling out the possibility that old faces could be back in Kansas City.

Left tackle Eric Fisher and right tackle Mitchell Schwartz were both released early in the offseason as the Chiefs created salary cap space ahead of free agency. On Monday, Chiefs head coach Andy Reid said that the financial situation dictated those moves and that the team isn’t slamming the door on a possible reunion with either player.

“You run into these cap situations,” Reid said, via Nate Taylor of TheAthletic.com. “Some of these things had to be done. They go out as champs. The door always remains open.”

Fisher tore his Achilles in the AFC title game and Schwartz is recovering from back surgery, so there hasn’t been much activity for either player on the open market. That may change as we get closer to training camp and a return to the Chiefs will remain a possibility until someone else makes the veterans offers they can’t refuse.

[htismaqe]

I wouldn't read too much into it.

What he said exactly was "you run into these cap situations. Some of these things had to be done. They go out as champs. The door always remains open.”

Of course the door is open but they have to have the cap space, and both sides have to want to get back together.

[kcbubb]

Some have said that fisher is pissed from being released and that would indicate that the relationship is poor. This article seems to indicate (at least from the chiefs side) that the relationship is fine and that they are welcome back at more reasonable deals that reflect their age and injury history.

[htismaqe]

Some have said that fisher is pissed from being released and that would indicate that the relationship is poor. This article seems to indicate (at least from the chiefs side) that the relationship is fine and that they are welcome back at more reasonable deals that reflect their age and injury history.

It wasn't an article. Andy talked about it in his press conference today.

But yeah, Andy specifically said that they "did things the right way" and made it sound like all sides - the Chiefs, Fisher, and Schwartz - would be open to a reunion should it come to that.

[Ming the Merciless]

I'm seeing +400 on the Buccs to win the NFC, so implied odds of about 20%. If you think the market is that wrong, bet the house on it?


how is the market "that" wrong? I'm seeing both GB and TB at about 20% each and then the other 60% divided into the rest of the NFC.



I mean....going with TB at 4-1 odds seems like a decent bet and not going "against" the market by any stretch....

[ThyKingdomCome15]

Getting released cost Fisher a lot of money. He's been a pillar on our team for years. I can see why he'd be upset with the release. I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns in August for a much lesser contract.

[kcbubb]

I found this interesting on spotrac... I would think that fishers value would be much lower? $18M sounds crazy high.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs/eric-fisher-12281/market-value/

COMPARABLE PLAYERS

We've selected the following players based on their age, contract status, and statistical production to compare Eric Fisher to.

PLAYER LENGTH VALUE AVG. SALARY AGE WHEN SIGNED
David Bakhtiari 4 $92,000,000 $23,000,000 29
Garett Bolles 4 $68,000,000 $17,000,000 28
Anthony Castonzo 2 $33,000,000 $16,500,000 31
Nate Solder 4 $62,000,000 $15,500,000 29
Averages 3.5 $63,750,000 $18,214,286 29.3


BASE CALCULATED VALUE

After adjusting the above contracts as if signed at Fisher's current age (30), a linear regression is performed, providing us with the following initial value.

LENGTH VALUE AVG. SALARY
4 $73,384,616 $18,346,154


STATISTICAL COMPARISONS

Now we'll compare our variables and Fisher statistically over the two seasons prior to their signing. In this case we're analyzing: Games Played %, Hurries Allowed, Sacks Allowed, Rating

PLAYER GP% HURRIES ALLOWED/GM SACKS ALLOWED/GM RATING
David Bakhtiari 2018-2019, GB 100 1.38 0.19 83.45
Garett Bolles 2018-2019, DEN 100 1.38 0.19 73.4
Anthony Castonzo 2018-2019, IND 84.38 1.63 0.19 78.35
Nate Solder 2016-2017, NYG 96.88 1.87 0.29 79.55
Average 95.32 1.57 0.22 78.69
Eric Fisher 2019-2020 71.88 1.39 0.17 72.2
% Change -24.59% 11.46% 22.73% -8.25%
Median Prime % Change 1.61%
Average Prime % Change 0.34%


CALCULATED MARKET VALUE: ERIC FISHER

After applying our Prime % figures into our base calculated value, we're given two values. The average of these values becomes our current calculated market value.

TERMS AVG. SALARY
3 years, $55,573,023 $18,524,341

[Hoover]

If Fisher is coming back (Which at this point might be best for all involved), then I don't think you need to spend real money on a FA. You let Niang try and hold the fort down while Fisher comes back. Maybe Niang keeps the gig, or eventually moves to RT.


I really don't see a reason why we should freak out about the situation.

[Chiefshrink]

Depends on how the draft works out, FA, Fisher's Rehab, and who blinks first $$ wise IF all the previous options don't work out. A lot of variables for sure right now BUT there is a possibility.

[htismaqe]

If Fisher is coming back (Which at this point might be best for all involved), then I don't think you need to spend real money on a FA. You let Niang try and hold the fort down while Fisher comes back. Maybe Niang keeps the gig, or eventually moves to RT.


I really don't see a reason why we should freak out about the situation.

After hearing Andy talk today, I wouldn't be surprised to see:

1) Fisher and Schwartz move on to other teams or retire.
2) Niang at Left Tackle next season
3) Remmers at Right Tackle next season
4) The Chiefs not drafting a tackle at all in the first 3 rounds.

Andy flat out said he felt like they were okay but that Veach was still working. Basically made it sound like Veach is always trying to upgrade and is just opportunistic. The Williams thing wasn't nearly as much about need as it was about Williams being one of the best at the position.

[OKchiefs]

After hearing Andy talk today, I wouldn't be surprised to see:

1) Fisher and Schwartz move on to other teams or retire.
2) Niang at Left Tackle next season
3) Remmers at Right Tackle next season
4) The Chiefs not drafting a tackle at all in the first 3 rounds.

Andy flat out said he felt like they were okay but that Veach was still working. Basically made it sound like Veach is always trying to upgrade and is just opportunistic. The Williams thing wasn't nearly as much about need as it was about Williams being one of the best at the position.

Reid also said Remmers and Long were options at left tackle. It’s coach speak, nothing more. Their last game played saw Mahomes almost get killed behind the OL, do you honestly think they’ll stand pat with the status quo other than a “rookie” who hasn’t played in 2 years? I’m as critical of Veach as anyone but I have zero doubt he’s going to do something, one way or another.

[T-post Tom]

John Alt sighting in Leawood.

[rabblerouser]

HemiNostradmusEd

[rabblerouser]

Reid also said Remmers and Long were options at left tackle. It’s coach speak, nothing more. Their last game played saw Mahomes almost get killed behind the OL, do you honestly think they’ll stand pat with the status quo other than a “rookie” who hasn’t played in 2 years? I’m as critical of Veach as anyone but I have zero doubt he’s going to do something, one way or another.

There's no way that Veach goes into 2021 without addressing the offensive line further.

If they bring Fish back on a team friendly deal while they groom a long-term replacement, I'm cool with that.

[htismaqe]

Reid also said Remmers and Long were options at left tackle. It’s coach speak, nothing more. Their last game played saw Mahomes almost get killed behind the OL, do you honestly think they’ll stand pat with the status quo other than a “rookie” who hasn’t played in 2 years? I’m as critical of Veach as anyone but I have zero doubt he’s going to do something, one way or another.

Reid said Remmers and Long were options at LT after the fact. He specifically stated that they had aspirations of putting him at LT, and he showed the ability to play the position, prior to opting out. He said three sentences about Niang. He said 3 words about long and Remmers combined.

I'm not being critical of Veach at all. I don't care what they do, they've earned my trust. If they think Niang can do it, I'm good with that.

This idea that they HAVE to draft a tackle is all fan fear bullshit. They'll be fine no matter what they do. They have a good GM, a great coach, and the best QB.

[htismaqe]

There's no way that Veach goes into 2021 without addressing the offensive line further.

If they bring Fish back on a team friendly deal while they groom a long-term replacement, I'm cool with that.

Niang didn't play last year. Neither did LDT. Thuney and Long weren't on the team.

It's entirely conceivable that even if they don't add any more linemen AT ALL, every OL position will have a new player when the season starts.

If the team thinks Niang can play LT, there's absolutely zero reason to second guess them.

[rabblerouser]

Niang didn't play last year. Neither did LDT. Thuney and Long weren't on the team.

It's entirely conceivable that even if they don't add any more linemen AT ALL, every OL position will have a new player when the season starts.

If the team thinks Niang can play LT, there's absolutely zero reason to second guess them.

Absolutely. I liked Rankins at guard, too.

[Chargem]

how is the market "that" wrong? I'm seeing both GB and TB at about 20% each and then the other 60% divided into the rest of the NFC.



I mean....going with TB at 4-1 odds seems like a decent bet and not going "against" the market by any stretch....

I was responding to someone who seemed to think TB were a lock to be in the Superbowl again next year and so the Chiefs had to roster build with beating TB in mind. If you thought the % chance of TB being in the Superbowl next year was 50% or above, you should be putting your life savings on 4-1 odds.

I think that the market is correct, and I think the person I was responding to is a dipshit

[RaidersOftheCellar]

I think they could probably field a better O-line today than what they ran out for the SB. It might even be a pretty solid line. But this year could be their best opportunity to win another SB for awhile. They need to stack the roster as much as possible and have plenty of depth along the O-line. Ideally I’d like to see them grab a tackle in the first few rounds and bring Fisher back.

[htismaqe]

I think they could probably field a better O-line today than what they ran out for the SB. It might even be a pretty solid line. But this year could be their best opportunity to win another SB for awhile. They need to stack the roster as much as possible and have plenty of depth along the O-line. Ideally I’d like to see them grab a tackle in the first few rounds and bring Fisher back.

What makes you say this?

[Chris Meck]

I think they could probably field a better O-line today than what they ran out for the SB. It might even be a pretty solid line. But this year could be their best opportunity to win another SB for awhile. They need to stack the roster as much as possible and have plenty of depth along the O-line. Ideally I’d like to see them grab a tackle in the first few rounds and bring Fisher back.

Why would you say that?

Mahomes, Hill, and Kelce aren't going anywhere. I figure we've got 3 more years of peak play from the trio together.

[RaidersOftheCellar]

Why would you say that?

Mahomes, Hill, and Kelce aren't going anywhere. I figure we've got 3 more years of peak play from the trio together.

I had read that Hill might be gone after next season. Sounded like he's going to the highest bidder.

Mahomes' salary goes up dramatically over the next few years. And aren't some other core players becoming FAs in the next year or two?

I don't follow contract stuff closely, so maybe I'm off. Just seems like this season is the best opportunity for everything to come together.

[penguinz]

I had read that Hill might be gone after next season. Sounded like he's going to the highest bidder.


That is all just offseason, nothing else to talk about, speculation due to him not wanting to extend his current contract.

[Wallcrawler]

When Kelces wheels fall off, if we havent brought in a suitable receiving threat at TE, then you can worry.

Hill is a nice piece to have, but weve played without him before and still lit peoples asses up.

[DaneMcCloud]

I had read that Hill might be gone after next season. Sounded like he's going to the highest bidder

The Chiefs aren't allowing Hill to go anywhere.

Hill will get a contract in the neighborhood of $21-24 million per when his current deal expires.

Even if, for some unknown reason, he refused to sign a deal, they'd just Franchise him year after year, which would be detrimental to his earnings.

[staylor26]

Lol I love when people pretend that the franchise tag doesn’t exist.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

People really think Tyreek is leaving 😂😂

[Rainbarrel]

Mahomes and Hill are must see NFL.